glutathione

[Guest guest]

Stania, there was a doctor that had come to live in the US from Russia and had

this illness. She had been taking ATP there for years and said it was the

only thing she found helped her. It wasn't available here when she first got

here and had to make trips back once a year, but then it became available.

Gail

[Guest guest]

Hello,

ATP enables glutathion to penetrate the cells, so I think it is necessary.

Stania

-----Pùvodní zpráva-----

Od: ne Kieffer <theocean@...>

Komu: onelist <onelist>

Datum: 29. bøezna 1999 20:49

Pøedmìt: Glutathione

>From: ne Kieffer <theocean@...>

>

>Hello,

>

>I am going to ask my doctor tomorrow to prescribe Glutathione

>injections. Does anyone know if I have to also put the ATP in the

>injection? I really just need the Glutathione don't I? Or does the ATP

>help the gluathione work better or something? I have heard that ATP

>makes some people's heart race and I want to avoid that. JL

>

>------------------------------------------------------------------------

>Have you visited our new web site?

>

>Onelist: Helping to create Internet communities

>------------------------------------------------------------------------

>This list is intended for patients to share personal experiences with each

other, not to give medical advice. If you are interested in any treatment

discussed here, please consult your doctor.

>

[Guest guest]

Hi--I am not sure if the ATP has any effect.....but my

new doctor put me on a Kutapressin Complex (which I

just wrote about) and it has Glutathione in it, without

any ATP. So, obviously, it isnt needed.

I am going to try to ask him about this next week.

--Michele U.

--- ne Kieffer <theocean@...> wrote:

> From: ne Kieffer <theocean@...>

>

> Hello,

>

> I am going to ask my doctor tomorrow to prescribe

> Glutathione

> injections. Does anyone know if I have to also put

> the ATP in the

> injection? I really just need the Glutathione don't

> I? Or does the ATP

> help the gluathione work better or something? I

have

> heard that ATP

> makes some people's heart race and I want to avoid

> that. JL

>

>

------------------------------------------------------------------------

> Have you visited our new web site?

>

> Onelist: Helping to create Internet communities

>

------------------------------------------------------------------------

> This list is intended for patients to share personal

> experiences with each other, not to give medical

> advice. If you are interested in any treatment

> discussed here, please consult your doctor.

>

_________________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

At 05:19 PM 07/27/1999 +0200, you wrote:

>From: janel@... (JANEL)

>

>I wanted to have my glutathione levels tested, to see if I was deficient and

>might therefore benefit from Immunocal. Right. So, I ask my doctor (who,

>BTW, looked totally blankly at me, as if I had asked him to undress or

>smthng!). As he tends to be fairly docile, he ordered the test (after

>ringing up a couple of labs who also seemed just as non-plus as he was). I

>just got the results and I am very surprised by what it says:

>

>Glutathione S-Tranferase Alpha : 1.61mcg/ml Ref value: inf 7.5mcg/ml

>

>Is this right? Do you think they have tested what needs to be tested? I

>doubt it, but I don't really understand this. Any idea, anyone? I thought

>less was not good, and here they seem to say more than 7.5 is when it is

>considered abnormal!!!>>Nelly very puzzled

===

nelly, since the original might have been in french, i doubt i can answer

this accurately. however, reference often means AVERAGE, and if average

is 7.5 then your 1.6 is VERY VERY VERY LOW WHICH FITS WITH PAUL CHENEY.

so your test may be correct, and you may be very deficient. at which

point, il faut prendre IMMUNOCAL maintenant., you should take immunocal NOW.

if you can get cheney's tape and have it work on a european vcr, it is

worth watching his tape, well worth the amount charged and more.

nancy mcfadden

[Guest guest]

I agree that we need vitamins. But no where have I read that you need

vitamin a, c, e, and selenium or it doesn't work. These are all

vitamins that work well with gluathione and actually it is gluathione's

job to recharge these vitamins so they can work over and over again.

When a vitamin gets a hold of a free radical its next step is to hand

it over to gluathione. It is then gluathione's job to rid the body of

it, and recharge that vitamin. They need each other to do a full job. I

for one don't take all those supplements all the time and for along

time I only addressed glutathione and I have for the first time in my

life been healthy for 2.5 years.

If you have info proving this I would love to read it.

Thanks

Debbie

" john a allan " <jalla-@...> wrote:

original article:cures for cancer/?start=2597

> Glutathione seems like the next favorite magic bullet, but remember

that it must be taken with vitamins a, c, e and selenium for it to have

it's synergistic and desired effect. No point having the petrol and no

engine to put it in.

>

[Guest guest]

Debbie,

perhaps I should have been a little more explicit, I did not mean to

indicate that glutathione would have no effect without a,c,e and selenium,

but I should add now, that glutathione-peroxidase is a selenium containing

enzyme so deficiency in one (one would think) would lead to a deficiency in

the other. Various studies, I seem to recall, have indicated a similar

deficiency in vitamins a, c and e when the same deficiency includes

selenium, for instance the 5 year study in Linxian in China of over 30000

adults that found a 13 % decrease in cancer death rates among those given e,

and selenium and also vitamin a. That study concluded that antioxidents

protect eachother from damage. A similar study in '93 demonstrated a 50%

(or there abouts) improvement in tumour regression over a controlled group

who were not given high doses of vitamin a. Studies done here in Australia

on asbestosis also used high Vitamin a in the battle against mesothelioma.

I think if you can get hold of the CARET (US carotene and retinol efficacy

trial) of around 1996, you will see various references to the synergistic

actions of selenium vitamins a, c, and e and the enzyme glutathione

peroxidase. I dont have the other studies at hand any more as I was only

studying the subject back in '97 when Donna had a four week prognosis and as

you may understand, most of my filing at that time left a little to be

desired, still, now that she seems to be better, I have more time to file

correctly, so I shall let you know if I turn anything else up.

By the way, the other studies I refer to are Nutrition intervention in

Linxian China, WJ Blot et al - J Natl Cancer inst. 1993 and lung cancer with

high dose vitamin a, July 1993 (Pastorino U)

Hope this all helps.

J.A.

Re: glutathione

>

>I agree that we need vitamins. But no where have I read that you need

>vitamin a, c, e, and selenium or it doesn't work. These are all

>vitamins that work well with gluathione and actually it is gluathione's

>job to recharge these vitamins so they can work over and over again.

>When a vitamin gets a hold of a free radical its next step is to hand

>it over to gluathione. It is then gluathione's job to rid the body of

>it, and recharge that vitamin. They need each other to do a full job. I

>for one don't take all those supplements all the time and for along

>time I only addressed glutathione and I have for the first time in my

>life been healthy for 2.5 years.

>

>If you have info proving this I would love to read it.

>Thanks

>Debbie

>

> " john a allan " <jalla-@...> wrote:

>original article:cures for cancer/?start=2597

>> Glutathione seems like the next favorite magic bullet, but remember

>that it must be taken with vitamins a, c, e and selenium for it to have

>it's synergistic and desired effect. No point having the petrol and no

>engine to put it in.

>>

>

>

>------------------------------------------------------------------------

>Visit http://cures for cancer.evangelist.net for cancer info or to unsubscribe

>

>

[Guest guest]

Excellent article, thank you. I think this proves a definite need for

both. I have taken vitamins for a better part of my life, but I always

felt there was a little more to the picture. Vitamin's have been

credited for along time, but glutathione has been missing in the

equation as far as making sure it works through proper nutrition. I am

glad to see we can have it all. Thanks for straightening me out on

this. We take vitamin's a,c,e and selenium because we have to make sure

we are not missing it from our diets. But when we were created all

nutrition came from food. There was no supplementation. Man screwed up

somewhere along the line and now we are finally able to get it all

natural.

Debbie

" john a allan " <jalla-@...> wrote:

original article:cures for cancer/?start=2608

> Debbie,

> perhaps I should have been a little more explicit, I did not mean to

> indicate that glutathione would have no effect without a,c,e and

selenium,

> but I should add now, that glutathione-peroxidase is a selenium

containing

> enzyme so deficiency in one (one would think) would lead to a

deficiency in

> the other. Various studies, I seem to recall, have indicated a

similar

> deficiency in vitamins a, c and e when the same deficiency includes

> selenium, for instance the 5 year study in Linxian in China of over

30000

> adults that found a 13 % decrease in cancer death rates among those

given e,

> and selenium and also vitamin a. That study concluded that

antioxidents

> protect eachother from damage. A similar study in '93 demonstrated a

50%

> (or there abouts) improvement in tumour regression over a controlled

group

> who were not given high doses of vitamin a. Studies done here in

Australia

> on asbestosis also used high Vitamin a in the battle against

mesothelioma.

> I think if you can get hold of the CARET (US carotene and retinol

efficacy

> trial) of around 1996, you will see various references to the

synergistic

> actions of selenium vitamins a, c, and e and the enzyme glutathione

> peroxidase. I dont have the other studies at hand any more as I was

only

> studying the subject back in '97 when Donna had a four week prognosis

and as

> you may understand, most of my filing at that time left a little to be

> desired, still, now that she seems to be better, I have more time to

file

> correctly, so I shall let you know if I turn anything else up.

> By the way, the other studies I refer to are Nutrition intervention in

> Linxian China, WJ Blot et al - J Natl Cancer inst. 1993 and lung

cancer with

> high dose vitamin a, July 1993 (Pastorino U)

> Hope this all helps.

> J.A.

> Re: glutathione

>

>

> >

> >I agree that we need vitamins. But no where have I read that you need

> >vitamin a, c, e, and selenium or it doesn't work. These are all

> >vitamins that work well with gluathione and actually it is

gluathione's

> >job to recharge these vitamins so they can work over and over again.

> >When a vitamin gets a hold of a free radical its next step is to hand

> >it over to gluathione. It is then gluathione's job to rid the body of

> >it, and recharge that vitamin. They need each other to do a full

job. I

> >for one don't take all those supplements all the time and for along

> >time I only addressed glutathione and I have for the first time in my

> >life been healthy for 2.5 years.

> >

> >If you have info proving this I would love to read it.

> >Thanks

> >Debbie

> >

> > " john a allan " <jalla-@...> wrote:

> >original article:cures for cancer/?start=2597

> >> Glutathione seems like the next favorite magic bullet, but remember

> >that it must be taken with vitamins a, c, e and selenium for it to

have

> >it's synergistic and desired effect. No point having the petrol and

no

> >engine to put it in.

> >>

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Hi Kay!

It was my impression that glutathione easily passes into cells. In fact,

alternative medical practitioners argued in the past that glutathione levels

did not increase following supplementation because the glutathione was

absorbed immediately by the cells. Inside the cell glutathione is rapidly

transformed into numerous glutathione containing enzymes. One enzyme,

glutathione peroxidase, is required in the metabolic pathway of thyroid

hormones.

I have not studied the voluminous glutathione literature in several

years. More recent research may have revealed new findings.

Glutathione chelates heavy metals out of the body. L-cysteine is a

precursor to, and the rate limiting amino acid used in the synthesis of

glutathione. N-acetyl-cysteine is used to treat mercury poisoning on the

assumption that more glutathione will help chelate the mercury. The last I

checked the literature, one study found serum levels of glutathione rose for

two hours after oral ingestion of N-acetyl-cysteine and then declined to

former levels.

Have the makers of Immuplus, etc. published results of glutathione levels

following ingestion of their products?

About three thousand papers are published on glutathione each year and

about the same number of papers are published about cysteine. Many

describe the amazing things that glutathione and cysteine do to keep us

healthy. I remain skeptical about the claims of superior efficacy of these

products in the absence of published data. The fact that there are thousands

of researchers studying glutathione but none (with the exception of the

makers of the high priced supplements) are working with the glutathione

products. Several daily doses of N-acetyl-cysteine would cost a fraction

what Immuplus, etc. costs and may give the same benefit.

Perhaps somebody has evidence to the contrary.

Bonnes

New York City

Bonnes

> I have two fields of questions for you all.

> #1- Have any of you tried Glutathione/ATP shots? Please note that this is

[Guest guest]

Several daily doses of N-acetyl-cysteine would cost a fraction

>what Immuplus, etc. costs and may give the same benefit.

Perhaps somebody has evidence to the contrary.

>

If you read the immunocal or imuplus.com sites they talk about some fo the

problems with NAC that I have heard from a doctor as well. It can be toxic.

Plus, it is much more processes and de-natured than these whey powders.

>

>

>> I have two fields of questions for you all.

>> #1- Have any of you tried Glutathione/ATP shots? Please note that this is

>

>>This list is intended for patients to share personal experiences with each

other, not to give medical advice. If you are interested in any treatment

discussed here, please consult your doctor.

>

>

[Guest guest]

Bill

I am going to quote from a book you can purchase called The Ultimate

GSH(glutathione)Handbook by Dr. Jimmy Gutman. This is what he has to

say about orally ingesting glutathione.

ORAL GLUTATIONE

Why not just eat GSH? After all, it is freely available in fresh

fruits, vegetables and meats. It is also commercially available in pill

form or powder from a variety of chemical companies. Unfortunatlely,

pre-manufactured GSH is not very helpful to the body. A small amount of

reduced protein-bound GSH may make it into the blood stream, but it

cannot pass through most cell walls and therefore cannot effectively

raise intracellular GSH levels. Researchers have demonstrated oral

GSH's poor bioavailability, especially in the liver where it is most

needed. FLAGG and his team at Emory University in Atlanta even point to

a possible decrease in blood GSH after oral ingestion of GSH-containing

foods. To put it in medical terms, oral GSH has negligible effect on

immunologic parameters.

Reference

FLAGG EW, COATES RJ, ELEY JW ET AL.

Dietary glutathione intake in humans and the relationship between

intake and plasma total glutathione level. Nutr Cancer 21:33-46, 1994

Also point in case, glutathione is not the actual problem, the problem

is, is that three amino acids make up glutathione, glutamate, glycine

and cysteine. Glutamate and glycine are abundent in most people's diet.

Finding cysteine in a form that is non toxic and can go intracellular

has always been the problem, until Dr. Bounous discovered Immunocal.

And within Immunocal he found the precursors for glutathione, something

called cystine. Two cysteine molecules joined by a bond and able to

enter the cell on the protein. Once inside the cell the bond disolves

leaving the much needed cysteine and now glutathione is complete and

can do its job.

Debbie

angusstea-@... wrote:

original article:cures for cancer/?start=4745

> concerning the debate over whey and immunocal, i recently purchased a

bottle

> of molybdenum/glutathione complex at a local health food store for

about

> $20.00. each tab contanis120mcg molybdnenum, 50 mg glutathione, and

2.25 mg

> vitamin b-2.

>

> directions are 1 to 3 tabs daily, taken sub-lingually.

>

> the product is called " CHEM-DEFENSE " , and is manufactured by SOURCE

> NATURALS, INC SCOTTS VALLEY, CA 95066.

>

> i assume it is availabel widely, and without pryamid profits built in

>

> is this not or is this the same glutathione?/

>

> bill

[Guest guest]

Wondering about all this talk about...... whatever.

I rarely take anything outside of it's wholefood form. RARELY. And

that's a personal thing for me. I believe that God has given us food for

healing and that we have ignored it, entirely, searching for the magic bullet.

Interestingly, I have heard NO discussion on foods that contain

glutathione, cysteine, etc.... so, I'm going to share again.

Glutathione is produced in the liver. It also finds itself in the lungs

and in the intestinal tract. According to Balch, MD., it is needed

for carbohydrate digestion. And AGAIN, according to Balch, pg. 39,

Prescription for Nutritional Healing, revised and expanded edition(1997),

" it is better to supply the body with the raw materials it uses to make

this compound " . So, to answer directly whether to purchase glutathione as

a supplement from Walmart, no, it would be a waste of money.

What is the best way?

In order for the BODY TO MAKE glutathione, it needs, cysteine(n-acetyl form

is recommended by Balch), glutamic acid, and glycine.

Interestingly, cysteine is a sulphur containing amino acid, which would

lead ME (because I'm looking for these things in nature and foods) to find

sulphur containing foods. Sulphur is known as the beauty mineral, and

works with other B vitamins. Those of you who are ALREADY B vitamin

deficient should supplement if you'd like anything from your diet to be

utilized. Sulphur is essential for protein absorbtion, and must be

balanced with phosphorous for proper digestion.

Finding foods high in sulphur also means that the proper phosphorous will

be present. Not so when you look at the supplements on the shelf.

Foods high in sulphur are cabbage (oh boy, I could talk your ear off about

eating cabbage daily, esp about the bacteria that you get in your colon

from it, that is sooooooooo important), cauliflower, horseradish, brussel

sprouts, celery, eggs, dried beans, nuts, onions, garlic, alfalfa, kelp,

mullein, barberry....... get the picture? IT'S ALL THOSE THINGS THAT YOU

HAVEN " T EATTEN IN WEEKS.

Ok, maybe some have eatten them.

People with diabetes need to be careful about using supplemental cysteine

according to Balch, because it it capable of inactivating insulin. Some

people with rare kidney disorders also should be cautious about using

cysteine supplementally as it can cause a form of kidney stones.

Also cysteine is toxic in doses over 1000mg a day.

No one will tell you, EVER, to supplement on a regular basis with amino

acids, EVER. In fact, all supplementation with amino acids should be done

in a full complex array. If you must supplement with amino acids, 2 months

is the max, then go off for at least another 2 months....this according to

Balch.

Additionally, it's useless to take amino acids without B-6 or vitamin C.

Best time to take them are in the am, or between meals.

And according to Balch, the very best way to get them in your diet is

through brown rice bran.

Whatever the case, we need to understand what CAUSES THESE problems in our

diets is ultimately an EXCESS of protein in our diets which is stressing

our livers and kidneys. In 9 out of 10 people, just about EVERYONE that I

see, they all have kidney and liver stress. I always start there, first,

and they get the same relief I'm reading about on this list, from using a

simple liver and kidney tea that I sell for $6, and it lasts them a month.

If all those big protein eatters would also supplement with a full mineral

complex, colloidal, or otherwise, it would relieve a LOT of these problems

too. Simple magnesium supplementation " cures " lots of these problems too.

Later, if I get a chance, I'll talk more about liver and kidney issues, and

their role in cleaning the blood. The key to life is clean blood.

Always be well,

At 09:06 PM 12/19/99 -0800, you wrote:

>Bill

>I am going to quote from a book you can purchase called The Ultimate

>GSH(glutathione)Handbook by Dr. Jimmy Gutman. This is what he has to

>say about orally ingesting glutathione.

>

>ORAL GLUTATIONE

>Why not just eat GSH? After all, it is freely available in fresh

>fruits, vegetables and meats. It is also commercially available in pill

>form or powder from a variety of chemical companies. Unfortunatlely,

>pre-manufactured GSH is not very helpful to the body. A small amount of

>reduced protein-bound GSH may make it into the blood stream, but it

>cannot pass through most cell walls and therefore cannot effectively

>raise intracellular GSH levels. Researchers have demonstrated oral

>GSH's poor bioavailability, especially in the liver where it is most

>needed. FLAGG and his team at Emory University in Atlanta even point to

>a possible decrease in blood GSH after oral ingestion of GSH-containing

>foods. To put it in medical terms, oral GSH has negligible effect on

>immunologic parameters.

>

>Reference

>FLAGG EW, COATES RJ, ELEY JW ET AL.

>Dietary glutathione intake in humans and the relationship between

>intake and plasma total glutathione level. Nutr Cancer 21:33-46, 1994

>

>Also point in case, glutathione is not the actual problem, the problem

>is, is that three amino acids make up glutathione, glutamate, glycine

>and cysteine. Glutamate and glycine are abundent in most people's diet.

>Finding cysteine in a form that is non toxic and can go intracellular

>has always been the problem, until Dr. Bounous discovered Immunocal.

>And within Immunocal he found the precursors for glutathione, something

>called cystine. Two cysteine molecules joined by a bond and able to

>enter the cell on the protein. Once inside the cell the bond disolves

>leaving the much needed cysteine and now glutathione is complete and

>can do its job.

>Debbie

>

>

>

>angusstea-@... wrote:

>original article:cures for cancer/?start=4745

>> concerning the debate over whey and immunocal, i recently purchased a

>bottle

>> of molybdenum/glutathione complex at a local health food store for

>about

>> $20.00. each tab contanis120mcg molybdnenum, 50 mg glutathione, and

>2.25 mg

>> vitamin b-2.

>>

>> directions are 1 to 3 tabs daily, taken sub-lingually.

>>

>> the product is called " CHEM-DEFENSE " , and is manufactured by SOURCE

>> NATURALS, INC SCOTTS VALLEY, CA 95066.

>>

>> i assume it is availabel widely, and without pryamid profits built in

>>

>> is this not or is this the same glutathione?/

>>

>> bill

>

>

>------------------------------------------------------------------------

>Visit http://cures for cancer.evangelist.net for cancer info or to unsubscribe

>

>------------------------------------------------------------------------

>eGroups.com Home: cures for cancer/

> - Simplifying group communications

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Glutathione is a protein in most of our cells, pretty much all of them.

We are not deficient in glutathione. That is one of the reasons why

supplementing with oral glutathione does not work. Also the fact that

it does not enter the cell where it is needed makes it not a good

supplement.

Dr. Bach from his latest book the super antioxidants says:

" Glutathione cannot be absorbed by the body intact. It must be

manufactured in the cell itself. We can't even find a way for

glutathione to move from cell to cell. Many people have thrown money

away taking glutathione supplements that their body cannot use In order

to raise glutathione levels, we must give the body the components that

it needs to synthesize its own glutathione. Glycine and glutamic acid

seem to be readily available, but the limiting factor in the body's

production of glutathione is the availability of cysteine.

The problem complicated by two factors. First, cysteine is an amino

acid that is rarely found in foods. Second, taking cysteine directly is

toxic. However, the compound CYSTINE can be taken effectively and it

occurs in milk whey. Chemically, cystine is two molecules of the amino

acid cysteine held together by a disulfide bond. When the cysteine

passes into the cell, the bond breaks, leaving the cysteine intack

inside the cell and ready to bond with the other elements to produce

glutathione. A whey protein compound, Immunocal, has been developed

that simulates the protein in human milk and delivers effective

quantities of cysteine. It is not a drug; it is a food supplement

derived from cow's milk in the protiens it delivers. Vitamin C alos

helps to keep glutathione levels up, but can't synthesize more

glutathione, as cysteine can. "

" Remember, glutathione cannot be absorbed by the body intact. It must

be broken down to cysteine first, then rebuilt by the cell. "

Glutathione is necessary to the cells, because it is their

detoxification and antioxidant. Without this working properly it cannot

defend the cells from going bad. The liver has the most amount of any

organ when it comes to glutathione, but it is everywhere and needed to

protect all of our cells.

I have been on Immunocal for almost three years, and I have had no bad

side effects. I have had nothing but good success. For the first time

in my life I enjoy good health, I no longer have an eating problem and

I don't get sick. Man for along time has taken glutathione supplements

and cystein as well as NAC and all may have there place. But I do know

that they do not help the glutathione in your cells, and this is what

it the most important in protecting your cells. It is something we are

born with, but must maintain by feeding it the necesarry tools for it

to work. Before Immunocal this was not possible. Good research helps to

trully understand how important a role glutathione plays in your

wellness, and your sickness. God gave us this uniques system to protect

us and it is up to us to give it the nurishment needed for it to work.

Debbie

[Guest guest]

glutathione must be produced within the body ......

external ingested glutathione does not work.

AngusSteak@... wrote:

>

> concerning the debate over whey and immunocal, i recently purchased a bottle

> of molybdenum/glutathione complex at a local health food store for about

> $20.00. each tab contanis120mcg molybdnenum, 50 mg glutathione, and 2.25 mg

> vitamin b-2.

>

> directions are 1 to 3 tabs daily, taken sub-lingually.

>

> the product is called " CHEM-DEFENSE " , and is manufactured by SOURCE

> NATURALS, INC SCOTTS VALLEY, CA 95066.

>

> i assume it is availabel widely, and without pryamid profits built in

>

> is this not or is this the same glutathione?/

>

> bill

>

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

> Visit http://cures for cancer.evangelist.net for cancer info or to unsubscribe

>

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

> -- Talk to your group with your own voice!

> -- VoiceChatPage?listName=cures for cancer & m=1

[Guest guest]

Hey how do I get some of that Liver tea ??

Love

Lloyd Seawright

Webster wrote:

> Wondering about all this talk about...... whatever.

>

> I rarely take anything outside of it's wholefood form. RARELY. And

> that's a personal thing for me. I believe that God has given us food for

> healing and that we have ignored it, entirely, searching for the magic bullet.

>

> Interestingly, I have heard NO discussion on foods that contain

> glutathione, cysteine, etc.... so, I'm going to share again.

>

> Glutathione is produced in the liver. It also finds itself in the lungs

> and in the intestinal tract. According to Balch, MD., it is needed

> for carbohydrate digestion. And AGAIN, according to Balch, pg. 39,

> Prescription for Nutritional Healing, revised and expanded edition(1997),

> " it is better to supply the body with the raw materials it uses to make

> this compound " . So, to answer directly whether to purchase glutathione as

> a supplement from Walmart, no, it would be a waste of money.

>

> What is the best way?

>

> In order for the BODY TO MAKE glutathione, it needs, cysteine(n-acetyl form

> is recommended by Balch), glutamic acid, and glycine.

>

> Interestingly, cysteine is a sulphur containing amino acid, which would

> lead ME (because I'm looking for these things in nature and foods) to find

> sulphur containing foods. Sulphur is known as the beauty mineral, and

> works with other B vitamins. Those of you who are ALREADY B vitamin

> deficient should supplement if you'd like anything from your diet to be

> utilized. Sulphur is essential for protein absorbtion, and must be

> balanced with phosphorous for proper digestion.

>

> Finding foods high in sulphur also means that the proper phosphorous will

> be present. Not so when you look at the supplements on the shelf.

>

> Foods high in sulphur are cabbage (oh boy, I could talk your ear off about

> eating cabbage daily, esp about the bacteria that you get in your colon

> from it, that is sooooooooo important), cauliflower, horseradish, brussel

> sprouts, celery, eggs, dried beans, nuts, onions, garlic, alfalfa, kelp,

> mullein, barberry....... get the picture? IT'S ALL THOSE THINGS THAT YOU

> HAVEN " T EATTEN IN WEEKS.

>

> Ok, maybe some have eatten them.

>

> People with diabetes need to be careful about using supplemental cysteine

> according to Balch, because it it capable of inactivating insulin. Some

> people with rare kidney disorders also should be cautious about using

> cysteine supplementally as it can cause a form of kidney stones.

>

> Also cysteine is toxic in doses over 1000mg a day.

>

> No one will tell you, EVER, to supplement on a regular basis with amino

> acids, EVER. In fact, all supplementation with amino acids should be done

> in a full complex array. If you must supplement with amino acids, 2 months

> is the max, then go off for at least another 2 months....this according to

> Balch.

>

> Additionally, it's useless to take amino acids without B-6 or vitamin C.

> Best time to take them are in the am, or between meals.

>

> And according to Balch, the very best way to get them in your diet is

> through brown rice bran.

>

> Whatever the case, we need to understand what CAUSES THESE problems in our

> diets is ultimately an EXCESS of protein in our diets which is stressing

> our livers and kidneys. In 9 out of 10 people, just about EVERYONE that I

> see, they all have kidney and liver stress. I always start there, first,

> and they get the same relief I'm reading about on this list, from using a

> simple liver and kidney tea that I sell for $6, and it lasts them a month.

>

> If all those big protein eatters would also supplement with a full mineral

> complex, colloidal, or otherwise, it would relieve a LOT of these problems

> too. Simple magnesium supplementation " cures " lots of these problems too.

>

> Later, if I get a chance, I'll talk more about liver and kidney issues, and

> their role in cleaning the blood. The key to life is clean blood.

>

> Always be well,

>

>

> At 09:06 PM 12/19/99 -0800, you wrote:

> >Bill

> >I am going to quote from a book you can purchase called The Ultimate

> >GSH(glutathione)Handbook by Dr. Jimmy Gutman. This is what he has to

> >say about orally ingesting glutathione.

> >

> >ORAL GLUTATIONE

> >Why not just eat GSH? After all, it is freely available in fresh

> >fruits, vegetables and meats. It is also commercially available in pill

> >form or powder from a variety of chemical companies. Unfortunatlely,

> >pre-manufactured GSH is not very helpful to the body. A small amount of

> >reduced protein-bound GSH may make it into the blood stream, but it

> >cannot pass through most cell walls and therefore cannot effectively

> >raise intracellular GSH levels. Researchers have demonstrated oral

> >GSH's poor bioavailability, especially in the liver where it is most

> >needed. FLAGG and his team at Emory University in Atlanta even point to

> >a possible decrease in blood GSH after oral ingestion of GSH-containing

> >foods. To put it in medical terms, oral GSH has negligible effect on

> >immunologic parameters.

> >

> >Reference

> >FLAGG EW, COATES RJ, ELEY JW ET AL.

> >Dietary glutathione intake in humans and the relationship between

> >intake and plasma total glutathione level. Nutr Cancer 21:33-46, 1994

> >

> >Also point in case, glutathione is not the actual problem, the problem

> >is, is that three amino acids make up glutathione, glutamate, glycine

> >and cysteine. Glutamate and glycine are abundent in most people's diet.

> >Finding cysteine in a form that is non toxic and can go intracellular

> >has always been the problem, until Dr. Bounous discovered Immunocal.

> >And within Immunocal he found the precursors for glutathione, something

> >called cystine. Two cysteine molecules joined by a bond and able to

> >enter the cell on the protein. Once inside the cell the bond disolves

> >leaving the much needed cysteine and now glutathione is complete and

> >can do its job.

> >Debbie

> >

> >

> >

> >angusstea-@... wrote:

> >original article:cures for cancer/?start=4745

> >> concerning the debate over whey and immunocal, i recently purchased a

> >bottle

> >> of molybdenum/glutathione complex at a local health food store for

> >about

> >> $20.00. each tab contanis120mcg molybdnenum, 50 mg glutathione, and

> >2.25 mg

> >> vitamin b-2.

> >>

> >> directions are 1 to 3 tabs daily, taken sub-lingually.

> >>

> >> the product is called " CHEM-DEFENSE " , and is manufactured by SOURCE

> >> NATURALS, INC SCOTTS VALLEY, CA 95066.

> >>

> >> i assume it is availabel widely, and without pryamid profits built in

> >>

> >> is this not or is this the same glutathione?/

> >>

> >> bill

> >

> >

> >------------------------------------------------------------------------

> >Visit http://cures for cancer.evangelist.net for cancer info or to unsubscribe

> >

> >------------------------------------------------------------------------

> >eGroups.com Home: cures for cancer/

> > - Simplifying group communications

> >

> >

> >

>

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

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>

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

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[Guest guest]

Send me $6 for the bulk, and $9 for the bagged tea, plus $3.20 in mailing

charges.

That's at COST, btw, so I'm not making a thing on the tea.

Mail to:

PO Box 503

Cambridge, NY 12816

Always be well,

At 02:40 AM 12/28/99 -0600, you wrote:

>Hey how do I get some of that Liver tea ??

>

>Love

>

>Lloyd Seawright

>

> Webster wrote:

>

>> Wondering about all this talk about...... whatever.

>>

>> I rarely take anything outside of it's wholefood form. RARELY. And

>> that's a personal thing for me. I believe that God has given us food for

>> healing and that we have ignored it, entirely, searching for the magic

bullet.

>>

>> Interestingly, I have heard NO discussion on foods that contain

>> glutathione, cysteine, etc.... so, I'm going to share again.

>>

>> Glutathione is produced in the liver. It also finds itself in the lungs

>> and in the intestinal tract. According to Balch, MD., it is needed

>> for carbohydrate digestion. And AGAIN, according to Balch, pg. 39,

>> Prescription for Nutritional Healing, revised and expanded edition(1997),

>> " it is better to supply the body with the raw materials it uses to make

>> this compound " . So, to answer directly whether to purchase glutathione as

>> a supplement from Walmart, no, it would be a waste of money.

>>

>> What is the best way?

>>

>> In order for the BODY TO MAKE glutathione, it needs, cysteine(n-acetyl form

>> is recommended by Balch), glutamic acid, and glycine.

>>

>> Interestingly, cysteine is a sulphur containing amino acid, which would

>> lead ME (because I'm looking for these things in nature and foods) to find

>> sulphur containing foods. Sulphur is known as the beauty mineral, and

>> works with other B vitamins. Those of you who are ALREADY B vitamin

>> deficient should supplement if you'd like anything from your diet to be

>> utilized. Sulphur is essential for protein absorbtion, and must be

>> balanced with phosphorous for proper digestion.

>>

>> Finding foods high in sulphur also means that the proper phosphorous will

>> be present. Not so when you look at the supplements on the shelf.

>>

>> Foods high in sulphur are cabbage (oh boy, I could talk your ear off about

>> eating cabbage daily, esp about the bacteria that you get in your colon

>> from it, that is sooooooooo important), cauliflower, horseradish, brussel

>> sprouts, celery, eggs, dried beans, nuts, onions, garlic, alfalfa, kelp,

>> mullein, barberry....... get the picture? IT'S ALL THOSE THINGS THAT YOU

>> HAVEN " T EATTEN IN WEEKS.

>>

>> Ok, maybe some have eatten them.

>>

>> People with diabetes need to be careful about using supplemental cysteine

>> according to Balch, because it it capable of inactivating insulin. Some

>> people with rare kidney disorders also should be cautious about using

>> cysteine supplementally as it can cause a form of kidney stones.

>>

>> Also cysteine is toxic in doses over 1000mg a day.

>>

>> No one will tell you, EVER, to supplement on a regular basis with amino

>> acids, EVER. In fact, all supplementation with amino acids should be done

>> in a full complex array. If you must supplement with amino acids, 2 months

>> is the max, then go off for at least another 2 months....this according to

>> Balch.

>>

>> Additionally, it's useless to take amino acids without B-6 or vitamin C.

>> Best time to take them are in the am, or between meals.

>>

>> And according to Balch, the very best way to get them in your diet is

>> through brown rice bran.

>>

>> Whatever the case, we need to understand what CAUSES THESE problems in our

>> diets is ultimately an EXCESS of protein in our diets which is stressing

>> our livers and kidneys. In 9 out of 10 people, just about EVERYONE that I

>> see, they all have kidney and liver stress. I always start there, first,

>> and they get the same relief I'm reading about on this list, from using a

>> simple liver and kidney tea that I sell for $6, and it lasts them a month.

>>

>> If all those big protein eatters would also supplement with a full mineral

>> complex, colloidal, or otherwise, it would relieve a LOT of these problems

>> too. Simple magnesium supplementation " cures " lots of these problems too.

>>

>> Later, if I get a chance, I'll talk more about liver and kidney issues, and

>> their role in cleaning the blood. The key to life is clean blood.

>>

>> Always be well,

>>

>>

>> At 09:06 PM 12/19/99 -0800, you wrote:

>> >Bill

>> >I am going to quote from a book you can purchase called The Ultimate

>> >GSH(glutathione)Handbook by Dr. Jimmy Gutman. This is what he has to

>> >say about orally ingesting glutathione.

>> >

>> >ORAL GLUTATIONE

>> >Why not just eat GSH? After all, it is freely available in fresh

>> >fruits, vegetables and meats. It is also commercially available in pill

>> >form or powder from a variety of chemical companies. Unfortunatlely,

>> >pre-manufactured GSH is not very helpful to the body. A small amount of

>> >reduced protein-bound GSH may make it into the blood stream, but it

>> >cannot pass through most cell walls and therefore cannot effectively

>> >raise intracellular GSH levels. Researchers have demonstrated oral

>> >GSH's poor bioavailability, especially in the liver where it is most

>> >needed. FLAGG and his team at Emory University in Atlanta even point to

>> >a possible decrease in blood GSH after oral ingestion of GSH-containing

>> >foods. To put it in medical terms, oral GSH has negligible effect on

>> >immunologic parameters.

>> >

>> >Reference

>> >FLAGG EW, COATES RJ, ELEY JW ET AL.

>> >Dietary glutathione intake in humans and the relationship between

>> >intake and plasma total glutathione level. Nutr Cancer 21:33-46, 1994

>> >

>> >Also point in case, glutathione is not the actual problem, the problem

>> >is, is that three amino acids make up glutathione, glutamate, glycine

>> >and cysteine. Glutamate and glycine are abundent in most people's diet.

>> >Finding cysteine in a form that is non toxic and can go intracellular

>> >has always been the problem, until Dr. Bounous discovered Immunocal.

>> >And within Immunocal he found the precursors for glutathione, something

>> >called cystine. Two cysteine molecules joined by a bond and able to

>> >enter the cell on the protein. Once inside the cell the bond disolves

>> >leaving the much needed cysteine and now glutathione is complete and

>> >can do its job.

>> >Debbie

>> >

>> >

>> >

>> >angusstea-@... wrote:

>> >original article:cures for cancer/?start=4745

>> >> concerning the debate over whey and immunocal, i recently purchased a

>> >bottle

>> >> of molybdenum/glutathione complex at a local health food store for

>> >about

>> >> $20.00. each tab contanis120mcg molybdnenum, 50 mg glutathione, and

>> >2.25 mg

>> >> vitamin b-2.

>> >>

>> >> directions are 1 to 3 tabs daily, taken sub-lingually.

>> >>

>> >> the product is called " CHEM-DEFENSE " , and is manufactured by SOURCE

>> >> NATURALS, INC SCOTTS VALLEY, CA 95066.

>> >>

>> >> i assume it is availabel widely, and without pryamid profits built in

>> >>

>> >> is this not or is this the same glutathione?/

>> >>

>> >> bill

>> >

>> >

>> >------------------------------------------------------------------------

>> >Visit http://cures for cancer.evangelist.net for cancer info or to unsubscribe

>> >

>> >------------------------------------------------------------------------

>> >eGroups.com Home: cures for cancer/

>> > - Simplifying group communications

>> >

>> >

>> >

>>

>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

>> Visit http://cures for cancer.evangelist.net for cancer info or to unsubscribe

>>

>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

>> Want to send money instantly to anyone, anywhere, anytime?

>> You can today at X.com - and we'll give you $20 to try it! Sign

>> up today at X.com. It's quick, free, & there's no obligation!

>> 1/332/5/_/378/_/945700549

>>

>> -- 20 megs of disk space in your group's Document Vault

>> -- docvault/cures for cancer/?m=1

>

>

>

>

>------------------------------------------------------------------------

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>

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 1/4/00 7:11:07 PM Eastern Standard Time,

onelist writes:

> >From: " Hess " <krhess@...>

>

>

> >Competition for glutathione precursors between the immune system and the

> >skeletal muscle: pathogenesis of chronic fatigue syndrome.

>

>

> My question is, what should I do about this? How much

> N-acetyl-l-cysteine should one of us take? I do getabout 425 mg of it

spread

> out through the day in my nutritional supplements and I take 200 mg of

> glutathione orally, half in the am, half w/ dinner. I find that without the

> glutathione supplements (ran out for a week once) that I am really dragging

> my tail at times.

>

> -Theresa

I a going to start taking large amounts of glutamine, a precursor to

glutathione.

My understanding is that glutathione isn't absorbed in the cells very well.

Dave

at Seaquake has 250 grams of glutamine (bulk) for $15 (for members). He said

it doesn't taste bad and therefore doesn't have to be encapsulated.

Mike

[Guest guest]

Does anyone know when this will be available?

steve

Al Melillo wrote:

> Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain)

> Encoding: quoted-printable

[Guest guest]

> Hi all,

> The May-June issue of Intelliscope, a newsletter from

smartbasics.com says about an Isoflavone in Soy that Genistein has

been shown to increase glutathione peroxidase & reductase.

> In Alan Cocchetto's article on HHV-6 in the National Forum,

Genistein was also mentioned as having antiviral activity on HHV-6.

> Al

So where does one get soy genistein?

Jackie

[Guest guest]

Source Natural make it. You can buy it at www.vitaminshoppe.com amongst

orther places.

Regards,

Re: Glutathione

>

> So where does one get soy genistein?

>

> Jackie

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Jackie,

Try any mailorder vitamin dealer like vitaminshoppe.com, type in

genistein in the search window when you get there. I think a company called

Source Naturals makes Genistein.

Al

Re: Glutathione

>

> > Hi all,

> > The May-June issue of Intelliscope, a newsletter from

> smartbasics.com says about an Isoflavone in Soy that Genistein has

> been shown to increase glutathione peroxidase & reductase.

> > In Alan Cocchetto's article on HHV-6 in the National Forum,

> Genistein was also mentioned as having antiviral activity on HHV-6.

> > Al

>

> So where does one get soy genistein?

>

> Jackie

>

>

>

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

> Failed tests, classes skipped, forgotten locker combinations.

> Remember the good 'ol days

> 1/4053/4/_/531724/_/959721014/

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

>

> This list is intended for patients to share personal experiences with each

other, not to give medical advice. If you are interested in any treatment

discussed here, please consult your doctor.

>

>

[Guest guest]

I believe L-glutathione is given to help with candida type problems, or

maybe this is L-glutamine? Maybe you are having herxing from die off of

something else.

Either of these are not the same as whey protein. You can not directly

take glutathione and have your body use it as glutathione. You have to

take undenatured whey protein, which your body can convert to glutathione.

There are some other brands that have the right undenatured whey

protein; LEF 379, Imuplus, etc. But ImmunePro turns out to be the cheaper

for the amount of potency. I would get it and just start with a very

small amount at first.

" the hub " <thehub@...>

08/22/00 07:57 AM

Please respond to

<egroups>

cc:

Subject: glutathione

Months ago a Dr. recommended I take glutathione for CFS, I didn't know

anything about ImmunePro yet, so picked up what was available at a local

health food store.

After I read up on glutathione, I thought I might as well start with what

I

already had and then move on to ImmunePro later ( I also thought that

because ImmunePro was stronger, it might be better for me to start of

slowly). I wondered if the brand I had would work at all, but I found

that

I've been herxing quite a bit, so it clearly is doing something. I've

been

very very fluey with swollen glands, muscle pain and weakness etc.

Are there any comments on using a different brand? I've been using one by

Organika called L-glutathione " Reduced " (don't know what they mean by

reduced). I've been taking one 50 mg capsule per day for 3 weeks now and

became very ill, so will back off.

Vee

This list is intended for patients to share personal experiences with each

other, not to give medical advice. If you are interested in any treatment

discussed here, please consult your doctor.

[Guest guest]

Very little oral glutathione gets into the cell where you need it. You would

be much better off with one of the whey products.

[Guest guest]

Phil,

Regarding the biochemistry changes, you'd have to talk to Dr. Cheney which

is impossible if your not already a patient and $480/hr. if you are. I do

know a few facts. 1. Whey-protein products increase " functional "

glutathione levels (not " actual " levels). I recommend Imuplus (later you

can experiment with Immunepro if you wish) to start, 4 packets/day for 30

days if you can tolerate it, if not gradually work up to it - if you can

tolerate the initial hi-loading dose your functional glutathione levels will

return to normal in 30 days, otherwise it may take 6 months or more. 2.

Most CFS patients (100's of Dr. Cheney's patients) experience a significant

improvement in their condition by taking this supplement. It has widespread

benefits. It is beneficial if you have mycoplasma, HHV6, or any type of

infection and seems to help people in many different CFS subsets (i.e.

coagulation problems, mycoplasma, HHV6, etc.). This supplement combined

with hydroxycobalamin IM injections 10 mg/day, products to reduce GI

permeability (Perm-A-Vite, probiotics), Vit. C 2 gms/day, 2000 i.u.s Vit. E,

antioxidant and proanthrocyanadins (grape seed extract, rutin, quercitin,

green tea or gt extract, etc) and Somatomed have improved my condition

enormously during the past year. I was a basket-case at one point. Now I

work 30+ hours a week and can put in a couple of back to back 40+ hr.

workweeks if necessary. Finally, it is unlikely you are ever going to

recover from this illness taking any single supplement or medication. Dr.

Cheney believes that treatment is only successful if you attack the illness

from several different angles AT THE SAME TIME. Steve Bullock

glutathione

>

> Steve

>

> Will we notice any difference when our glutathione levels are restored?

> What would this mean in terms of our body chemistry changing?

> Phil

>

>

> > -------------------------------------------------------------------->

> >

> > Laurel,

> >

> > The fact that your breaking out means it's relasing toxins from your

body.

> > If you can only handle one packet/day, so be it. You'll just have to

wait a

> > long time for your functional glutathione levels to return to normal. 4

> > packets gets you there in a month; two packets takes about 6 months. I

> > don't know if 1 packet a day alone would ever get you there but

eventually

>

> This list is intended for patients to share personal experiences with each

other, not to give medical advice. If you are interested in any treatment

discussed here, please consult your doctor.

>

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/20/2000 2:01:12 PM Pacific Daylight Time,

bullocks@... writes:

<< This supplement (Steve was talking about Imuplus) combined

Vit. C 2 gms/day,

I thought I remembered from reading postings on this list, that vitamin C

in excess of 1500 mg. (1.5 gm) could be a problem for the whey protein's

effectiveness. I personally discontinued a product w/1000 mg. of C in it

because I felt it was decreasing the effect of the whey protein.

[Guest guest]

Doubt this is true. Dr. Cheney recommended I take 2 gms of c a day at the

same time as whey protein (not with it but on same day). Steve Bullock

Re: glutathione

>

> In a message dated 9/20/2000 2:01:12 PM Pacific Daylight Time,

> bullocks@... writes:

>

> << This supplement (Steve was talking about Imuplus) combined

> Vit. C 2 gms/day,

> I thought I remembered from reading postings on this list, that vitamin

C

> in excess of 1500 mg. (1.5 gm) could be a problem for the whey protein's

> effectiveness. I personally discontinued a product w/1000 mg. of C in it

> because I felt it was decreasing the effect of the whey protein.

>

> This list is intended for patients to share personal experiences with each

other, not to give medical advice. If you are interested in any treatment

discussed here, please consult your doctor.

>