weight and transdermals and other stuff

September 13, 2005

Better yet, why the hell hadn't my gyno given me an Crinone????

This just gets more puzzling and I'm getting angrier. When I think

of all the damned procedures I had done to stop my bleeding and

fibroids.

> > > AMEN AND EUREKA, !!!! Seems like the message

> > is

> > > finally getting through!! We do not need to have

> > blood

> > > levels of P that are indicative of what the female

> > > body goes through for sustaining a pregnancy (and

> > that

> > > includes the depressive sedative efffects on the

> > brain

> > > to slow the mother down!!) TARGETED TO UTERINE

> > TISSUE

> > > ONLY is exactly what the wiser medical heads are

> > > advising - that is, those that do not have any

> > > financial interests in compounding pharmacies!

> > (And we

> > > all know the heinous side effects we got with oral

> > > P!!)

> > >

> >

>

> __________________________________

> Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005

> http://mail.yahoo.com

September 13, 2005

Well my gyno kept it a big secret. He wanted me to have the

big " H " .

> > > AMEN AND EUREKA, !!!! Seems like the message

> > is

> > > finally getting through!! We do not need to have

> > blood

> > > levels of P that are indicative of what the female

> > > body goes through for sustaining a pregnancy (and

> > that

> > > includes the depressive sedative efffects on the

> > brain

> > > to slow the mother down!!) TARGETED TO UTERINE

> > TISSUE

> > > ONLY is exactly what the wiser medical heads are

> > > advising - that is, those that do not have any

> > > financial interests in compounding pharmacies!

> > (And we

> > > all know the heinous side effects we got with oral

> > > P!!)

> > >

> >

>

> __________________________________________________

>

September 13, 2005

If you have a uterus and use exogenous, you have to use P. A typical ORAL dose of micronized progesterone is 100 mg daily or 200 mg for 10-12 days/month.

Val

-----Original Message-----From: rhythmicliving [mailto:rhythmicliving ]On Behalf Of Hey my HDL IS LOW ENOUGH!!! Oh boy I didn't know this. So why are our doctors telling us to randomly take 100 mg of P a day!

September 13, 2005

Actually, pretty straightforward!! See the posting

entitled NEWS FLASH.... Also, this is what the studies

all said that Dr. Formby posted on the RL site for

us!!

AND is on the study site as noted, by Dr. Barry Wren,

and is awesome to read:

http://www.mja.com.au/public/issues/182_05_070305/wre10534_fm.html

Actually, Mother Nature really really is not that

baffling after all!! Only when fellows like Dr. Lee

try to come into our kitchen and stir the soup!!LOL

Love, Carolyn

--- wrote:

> It's baffling. Just baffling. Maybe we really

> don't need to go

> that high on P dosing. Maybe we need small amounts.

> You seem to

> be okay using it vaginally?

>

> > Weight gain, increased glucose, irritability,

> bloating, fatigue,

> depression.

> >

> > Val

> >

> > -----Original Message-----

> > From: rhythmicliving

> > [mailto:rhythmicliving ]On Behalf

> Of

> >

> > What problems were you having ? With the

> P?

>

__________________________________________________

September 13, 2005

...YES!!! We DON'T need to go that high; only low

dosing of vaginal P - THAT IS JUST ENOUGH DOSE TO

PROTECT OUR UTERUS - and to NOT go systemic on us with

all those pregnancy levels/side effects of P- is all

we need!

And YES!! When I was doing vaginal, over two years ago

before I got caught in the WP Web....I was doing just

beautifully!! Wonderfully!! I just didn't know what I

had going for me, nor the WHY of why it was working so

well!! I " bought " the Wiley " pitch " of doing peaks

and valleys. Well, sure as hell not for the P!!

And sure as hell not in those suicidal doses for

EITHER the E or the P, for God's sake!!

Much love, Carolyn

--- wrote:

> It's baffling. Just baffling. Maybe we really

> don't need to go

> that high on P dosing. Maybe we need small amounts.

> You seem to

> be okay using it vaginally?

>

> > Weight gain, increased glucose, irritability,

> bloating, fatigue,

> depression.

> >

> > Val

> >

> > -----Original Message-----

> > From: rhythmicliving

> > [mailto:rhythmicliving ]On Behalf

> Of

> >

> > What problems were you having ? With the

> P?

>

__________________________________________________

September 13, 2005

BINGO, VAL....BINGO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:)Carolyn

(and P also increases LDL...not something we want

either!!)

--- Valarie wrote:

> I'm on Day 9 of 100 mg Prometrium used vaginally. I

> have had no problems so

> far.

>

> Another thing, progesterone LOWERS HDL - not

> something we want. The less I

> get systemically, the happier I am.

>

> Val

>

> -----Original Message-----

> From: rhythmicliving

> [mailto:rhythmicliving ]On Behalf Of

>

> It's baffling. Just baffling. Maybe we really

> don't need to go

> that high on P dosing. Maybe we need small amounts.

> You seem to

> be okay using it vaginally?

>

__________________________________________________

September 13, 2005

...this info on HDL and LDL, plus more, was

published in Vliet's book " Screaming.... " and is, I am

sure, available through published peer-reviewed

double-blinded clinical studies.

" Why are our doctors telling us to randomly take 100 P

a day? " If I were to answer that to the full extent

of my 14 year-postmenopausal-experienced fury, I would

be kicked off of the group mail for flaming

obscenities!! LOL

We may just keep it to what we have all experienced -

that a majority of doctors do not care/do not have

time/consciously choose to be not currently

self-educated enough to know any better.

Other than to repeat the mantra of " keeping oneself

educated and informed as a patient is of primary

necessity " over and over and over again.....I will

stop at that, with the greatest of emphasis!!

Love, Carolyn

--- wrote:

> Hey my HDL IS LOW ENOUGH!!! Oh boy I didn't know

> this. So why are

> our doctors telling us to randomly take 100 mg of P

> a day!

>

> > I'm on Day 9 of 100 mg Prometrium used vaginally.

> I have had no

> problems so

> > far.

> >

> > Another thing, progesterone LOWERS HDL - not

> something we want.

> The less I

> > get systemically, the happier I am.

> >

> > Val

> >

> > -----Original Message-----

> > From: rhythmicliving

> > [mailto:rhythmicliving ]On Behalf

> Of

> >

> > It's baffling. Just baffling. Maybe we really

> don't need to go

> > that high on P dosing. Maybe we need small

> amounts. You seem to

> > be okay using it vaginally?

>

__________________________________

Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005

http://mail.yahoo.com

September 13, 2005

I would like to ask that very same question of ALL the

gynos I have gone to in the last 14 years - for God's

Sake!! I had to read about vaginal on my own, and ask

for it!! For fourteen years of being prescribed P in

ALL its crappy forms....I could scream, as I have

ruined my body that I will never quite get back,

starting with the Provera. (And yes, they DID have

vaginal P back then!!)

Best answer? Well, have you ever been sitting in the

waiting room of a doctor's office, and observed the

PHARMACEUTICAL REPS in all their GAP attired GQ glory,

hawking their wares in the hallowed halls of the

clinic. I rest my case.

Love, Carolyn

--- wrote:

> Better yet, why the hell hadn't my gyno given me an

> Crinone????

> This just gets more puzzling and I'm getting

> angrier. When I think

> of all the damned procedures I had done to stop my

> bleeding and

> fibroids.

>

> > > > AMEN AND EUREKA, !!!! Seems like the

> message

> > > is

> > > > finally getting through!! We do not need to

> have

> > > blood

> > > > levels of P that are indicative of what the

> female

> > > > body goes through for sustaining a pregnancy

> (and

> > > that

> > > > includes the depressive sedative efffects on

> the

> > > brain

> > > > to slow the mother down!!) TARGETED TO UTERINE

> > > TISSUE

> > > > ONLY is exactly what the wiser medical heads

> are

> > > > advising - that is, those that do not have any

> > > > financial interests in compounding pharmacies!

> > > (And we

> > > > all know the heinous side effects we got with

> oral

> > > > P!!)

> > > >

> > >

> >

> > __________________________________

> > Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005

> > http://mail.yahoo.com

>

__________________________________

Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005

http://mail.yahoo.com

September 13, 2005

Yeah, ....female castration by the Male Medical

Establishment. Still widely practiced!

Not a lot different, as far as I am concerned, than

the third world practice of slicing off the clitoris.

Only the big " H " earns a lot more money!

Love, Carolyn

--- wrote:

> Well my gyno kept it a big secret. He wanted me to

> have the

> big " H " .

>

> > > > AMEN AND EUREKA, !!!! Seems like the

> message

> > > is

> > > > finally getting through!! We do not need to

> have

> > > blood

> > > > levels of P that are indicative of what the

> female

> > > > body goes through for sustaining a pregnancy

> (and

> > > that

> > > > includes the depressive sedative efffects on

> the

> > > brain

> > > > to slow the mother down!!) TARGETED TO UTERINE

> > > TISSUE

> > > > ONLY is exactly what the wiser medical heads

> are

> > > > advising - that is, those that do not have any

> > > > financial interests in compounding pharmacies!

> > > (And we

> > > > all know the heinous side effects we got with

> oral

> > > > P!!)

> > > >

> > >

> >

> > __________________________________________________

> >

September 13, 2005

Crinone has been around for

> quite some time, as well!! It makes such logical

> sense, I could lay down and cry over the Buddha belly

> I got on the WP P cream over the last two years!!

> And, actually, I just hate to admit this...I WAS on

> the compounded P suppositories BEFORE I went on

> WP....and I was doing just wonderfully!!!

>

What are the other ingredients in Prochieve??? the polycarbomer, or

whatever it is?? the inactive ingrdients in some of the creams became

a real issue for some of us. I had trouble finding info on the

ingredients in the gel. (of course, my surfing was cut short because

my hair dye needed to be washed out - LOL)

September 13, 2005

Gotcha, ! That concern is true. Will get back to

you on that....you would think they would try to use a

physiologically " inert " substance, if anything.

However, I have the product insert, and can go through

that later tonite to find whatever and get back to you

manana!

Also, there is always the custom compounded " bullets "

or the Prometrium. But, they must ALSO have SOMEthing

else in them, just as a base, I would think!!

xoxoxoCarolyn

--- astrodiana wrote:

>

> Crinone has been around for

> > quite some time, as well!! It makes such logical

> > sense, I could lay down and cry over the Buddha

> belly

> > I got on the WP P cream over the last two years!!

> > And, actually, I just hate to admit this...I WAS

> on

> > the compounded P suppositories BEFORE I went on

> > WP....and I was doing just wonderfully!!!

> >

>

> What are the other ingredients in Prochieve??? the

> polycarbomer, or

> whatever it is?? the inactive ingrdients in some of

> the creams became

> a real issue for some of us. I had trouble finding

> info on the

> ingredients in the gel. (of course, my surfing was

> cut short because

> my hair dye needed to be washed out - LOL)

>

__________________________________________________

September 13, 2005

> Gotcha, ! That concern is true. Will get back to

> you on that....you would think they would try to use a

> physiologically " inert " substance, if anything.

> However, I have the product insert, and can go through

> that later tonite to find whatever and get back to you

> manana!

> Also, there is always the custom compounded " bullets "

> or the Prometrium. But, they must ALSO have SOMEthing

> else in them, just as a base, I would think!!

>

> xoxoxoCarolyn

>

I know...I am sold...you have convinced me...but I stil wanna know what

I will be putting in my tonka ;]

My own experinece with P has been good, my most recent

cholesterol/HDL/LDL/triglycerides is excellent...but it makes sense to

at least try it if my endometrium is the main thing I am concerned about

will see my doc on Thursday...so I figured I could ask him for this then

but, honestly - if it is made by a pharmaceutical compay, I am wary.

After all, they injected us with DES to dry up our milk after

childbirth in the 60's, so the fact they use it on pregnant women does

not put me at ease either

September 14, 2005

Val - my doc did prescribe troches and said they were the BEST way

for the body to absorb progesterone. I was the crazy one who

switched to the P cream and that is when all my trouble started.

> If you have a uterus and use exogenous, you have to use P. A

typical ORAL

> dose of micronized progesterone is 100 mg daily or 200 mg for 10-12

> days/month.

>

> Val

> -----Original Message-----

> From: rhythmicliving

> [mailto:rhythmicliving ]On Behalf Of

>

> Hey my HDL IS LOW ENOUGH!!! Oh boy I didn't know this. So why

are

> our doctors telling us to randomly take 100 mg of P a day!

September 14, 2005

...do the troches have a product name, or are they

custom compounded?? And what are the dosages

available? Carolyn

--- wrote:

> Val - my doc did prescribe troches and said they

> were the BEST way

> for the body to absorb progesterone. I was the

> crazy one who

> switched to the P cream and that is when all my

> trouble started.

>

> > If you have a uterus and use exogenous, you have

> to use P. A

> typical ORAL

> > dose of micronized progesterone is 100 mg daily or

> 200 mg for 10-12

> > days/month.

> >

> > Val

> > -----Original Message-----

> > From: rhythmicliving

> > [mailto:rhythmicliving ]On Behalf

> Of

> >

> > Hey my HDL IS LOW ENOUGH!!! Oh boy I didn't

> know this. So why

> are

> > our doctors telling us to randomly take 100 mg

> of P a day!

>

__________________________________

Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005

http://mail.yahoo.com

September 14, 2005

Well I was kind of hoping that the addition of P would bring down my

weight!! Apparently the E is packing on the pounds. Now I wonder

if using the P vaginally will " balance " out the E. Is the vaginal

route ENOUGH?

> > > Weight gain, increased glucose, irritability,

> > bloating, fatigue,

> > depression.

> > >

> > > Val

> > >

> > > -----Original Message-----

> > > From: rhythmicliving

> > > [mailto:rhythmicliving ]On Behalf

> > Of

> > >

> > > What problems were you having ? With the

> > P?

> >

>

> __________________________________________________

>

September 14, 2005

Carolyn -

I just got " Screaming " . Haven't read it yet. I think doctors panic

because of studies on Estrogen and they want us to protect ourselves.

But frankly, it is overkill. But they don't seem to believe us when we

report our symptoms!!!

> ...this info on HDL and LDL, plus more, was

> published in Vliet's book " Screaming.... " and is, I am

> sure, available through published peer-reviewed

> double-blinded clinical studies.

>

> " Why are our doctors telling us to randomly take 100 P

> a day? " If I were to answer that to the full extent

> of my 14 year-postmenopausal-experienced fury, I would

> be kicked off of the group mail for flaming

> obscenities!! LOL

>

September 14, 2005

> Well I was kind of hoping that the addition of P would bring down my

> weight!! Apparently the E is packing on the pounds. Now I wonder

> if using the P vaginally will " balance " out the E. Is the vaginal

> route ENOUGH?

>

I have found that the key to losing weight is bringing the P down to

the smallest amount you can (20-50mg daily...I am talking cream here).

In my mind, it wasn't the P itself that packed on the pounds or the E,

but the high amounts of P (with high E) which screwed with our

cortisol levels and caused sugar/carb cravings, interrupted sleep, hair

loss, acne, extreme fatigue during the day, fluid retention, etc. In

other words, the symptoms I felt on high P caused my adrenals to take a

hit. Previously to using high amounts, P always had the opposite effect

on me.

September 14, 2005

Jeepers, , it SHOULD BE!! I am thinking that if,

as it is said, we women do not need any P anymore

after the big " M " ....AND...that supposedly it is the P

that Mother Nature uses to pack on the pounds to

nurture a pregnancy, NOT the E....then the ratio of

balance should hold true (not including any other

conditions such as P still blocking E from the WP, or

a screwed up thyroid, or a still WP-induced inbalance

of the hormonal system which would be very hard to

ascertain, I should think...)

If my understanding is correct, as Vliet says, it is

NOT the E that is designed to cause weight gain - as

long as we are not taking too much E. As always, the

good docs ever do caution balance! I will have a

personal interest in this, as well....as I have packed

on 40 pounds, in two years, have a voracious appetite

probably incurred through the hormonal messaging of

the P....so I am really counting on being able to lose

that P weight. (Sigh. Of course, I know I will have to

also do exercise more consistently and something like

the Mediterraean Diet, et.al.

I am guessing that the WP, for those of us who were on

those high doses for a long time, have done a pretty

good job of screwing up our metabolisms!!

And that there will be no quick fix - even just

getting off the systemic P and into the vaginal - and

that it will take maybe as long as year - 2years.

Since we only need estradiol...limiting the P to the

vagina/uterus should not be a concern to " balance " it

against the E. A good doc should be able to answer

that, and he would probably say as did Dr. Formby on

the RL site, via the study summaries he condensed for

us, that he advised LOW dosing on both E and P.

Coming off of the WP as we are, that is quite a

number's adjustment for us, I would think. I know it

is for me!!

I will try to remember to ask my new ob/gyn your

question when I see her on Friday. I will be asking

her for E in the transdermal gel (EstraGel)and P in

the vaginal suppository (Prochieve or Crinone).

I hope she is well informed enough to provide a good

answer. If so, I will certainly share that good

question with the group!! xoxoxxoCarolyn

--- wrote:

> Well I was kind of hoping that the addition of P

> would bring down my

> weight!! Apparently the E is packing on the pounds.

> Now I wonder

> if using the P vaginally will " balance " out the E.

> Is the vaginal

> route ENOUGH?

>

> > > > Weight gain, increased glucose, irritability,

> > > bloating, fatigue,

> > > depression.

> > > >

> > > > Val

> > > >

> > > > -----Original Message-----

> > > > From: rhythmicliving

> > > > [mailto:rhythmicliving ]On

> Behalf

> > > Of

> > > >

> > > > What problems were you having ? With

> the

> > > P?

> > >

> >

> > __________________________________________________

> >

September 14, 2005

Yeah, that's for sure, ! They DON'T take our

symptoms seriously (mostly males thinking we are, as

they conclude us to be, a tad bent to be hysterically

predispostioned, and " emotionally fragile of nature "

and need to be 'patronized " . And often the female

doctors are even worse -both from my own experiences

and from others I have heard from!)

And, yeah, on the " estrogen is unsafe " issue:

I can hardly believe the high caliber of doctors who

STILL use the word " estrogen " as a generic term,

whether it is Premarin ( of course, it is the

synthetic conjugated estrogens that are financially

provided for all these WHI-type studies - so no wonder

they produce such destructive results) or anything

else....they got as far as

" estrogen-is-proven-to-be-dangerous-and-I-don't-want-to-be-sued-by-some-crazed-w\

oman-on-HRT " .

In the last 6 months, I have been to an Allina Clinic

GP, a top heart specialistat Abbot Northwestern

Hospital, an orthopaedic surgeon in a well-known

practice, have email consulted with the Director of

Studies at the Cholesterol Center at Jewish Hospital

in Cincinnati,and a top hemotologist/oncologist at our

University of Minnesota. They ALL blasted me for using

any estrogen HRT at all!! I am, needless to say, a

bit tired of such a seeming inability,or lack of

desire, to keep up with current understanding!!

Congratz on getting Vliet's book! I know it is a bit

large....having read through it several times, I now

use it as a medical resource book. So far, I have

found her to be STILL right on, even tho the first

printing was in 1995 (2001 reprinting) and there are

some new things on the horizen, such as the EstraGel

or Estrasorb, and that Crinone is now called

Prochieve, and that bioidenticals are (somewhat) more

in the sights of some doctors. See pages 349-353 for

an absolutely wonderful blow-by-blow description of

what estradiol does for the female body!! (Unlike the

negatives being hssssst at us by most doctors, still!)

Much encouragement to you! Love, Carolyn

--- wrote:

> Carolyn -

>

> I just got " Screaming " . Haven't read it yet. I

> think doctors panic

> because of studies on Estrogen and they want us to

> protect ourselves.

> But frankly, it is overkill. But they don't seem to

> believe us when we

> report our symptoms!!!

>

> > ...this info on HDL and LDL, plus more, was

> > published in Vliet's book " Screaming.... " and is,

> I am

> > sure, available through published peer-reviewed

> > double-blinded clinical studies.

> >

> > " Why are our doctors telling us to randomly take

> 100 P

> > a day? " If I were to answer that to the full

> extent

> > of my 14 year-postmenopausal-experienced fury, I

> would

> > be kicked off of the group mail for flaming

> > obscenities!! LOL

> >

>

__________________________________________________

September 14, 2005

Oh, ! That is just the absolute perfect answer!!

Also exactly what Vliet says in her writings. I

sincerely hope that EVER SINGLE MEMBER reads this

posting of yours. Because it says it all - simply and

directly. Thanks! Carolyn

--- astrodiana wrote:

>

> > Well I was kind of hoping that the addition of P

> would bring down my

> > weight!! Apparently the E is packing on the

> pounds. Now I wonder

> > if using the P vaginally will " balance " out the E.

> Is the vaginal

> > route ENOUGH?

> >

>

> I have found that the key to losing weight is

> bringing the P down to

> the smallest amount you can (20-50mg daily...I am

> talking cream here).

> In my mind, it wasn't the P itself that packed on

> the pounds or the E,

> but the high amounts of P (with high E) which

> screwed with our

> cortisol levels and caused sugar/carb cravings,

> interrupted sleep, hair

> loss, acne, extreme fatigue during the day, fluid

> retention, etc. In

> other words, the symptoms I felt on high P caused my

> adrenals to take a

> hit. Previously to using high amounts, P always had

> the opposite effect

> on me.

>

__________________________________________________

September 14, 2005

Custom compounded. I supposed you can gel them anywhere. Mine were

100 mgs.

> > > If you have a uterus and use exogenous, you have

> > to use P. A

> > typical ORAL

> > > dose of micronized progesterone is 100 mg daily or

> > 200 mg for 10-12

> > > days/month.

> > >

> > > Val

> > > -----Original Message-----

> > > From: rhythmicliving

> > > [mailto:rhythmicliving ]On Behalf

> > Of

> > >

> > > Hey my HDL IS LOW ENOUGH!!! Oh boy I didn't

> > know this. So why

> > are

> > > our doctors telling us to randomly take 100 mg

> > of P a day!

> >

>

> __________________________________

> Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005

> http://mail.yahoo.com

September 14, 2005

...well, at least, if you decide to go vaginal,

you will certainly be adhering to the Basic Rule #1 of

P-HRT....and that is, " USE THE LOWEST DOSE FOR THE

SHORTEST AMOUNT OF TIME TO PRODUCE THE MAXIMUM

POSITIVE RESPONSE AND MINIMUM NEGATIVE RESPONSE "

(sorry to scream!!)

THEREFORE if you want to maintain a menstrual bleed,

you will be taking only 45mg, for only 10 days, and

you will addressing the endometrial protection,

directly and forthrightly, with minimum, if any,

systemic toxic side effects, or blood levels, of P.

Sounds like a deal to me!!! xoxoxCarolyn

--- wrote:

> You seem to be doing well now. I'm still having

> trouble using P. I

> can't take it. In cream OR olive oil. I may have

> to go the vaginal

> route now.

>

> > > Well I was kind of hoping that the addition of P

> would bring

> down my

> > > weight!! Apparently the E is packing on the

> pounds. Now I

> wonder

> > > if using the P vaginally will " balance " out the

> E. Is the

> vaginal

> > > route ENOUGH?

> > >

> >

> > I have found that the key to losing weight is

> bringing the P down

> to

> > the smallest amount you can (20-50mg daily...I am

> talking cream

> here).

> > In my mind, it wasn't the P itself that packed on

> the pounds or

> the E,

> > but the high amounts of P (with high E) which

> screwed with our

> > cortisol levels and caused sugar/carb cravings,

> interrupted sleep,

> hair

> > loss, acne, extreme fatigue during the day, fluid

> retention, etc.

> In

> > other words, the symptoms I felt on high P caused

> my adrenals to

> take a

> > hit. Previously to using high amounts, P always

> had the opposite

> effect

> > on me.

> >

>

__________________________________

Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005

http://mail.yahoo.com

September 14, 2005

Of course, what I am NOT factoring in here is anyresidue that we recovering WPers may have left stillin our systems from the fat-stored P. So, maybe thatis a contributing factor adding to the P effect???Once that P of the WP is finally gone, then maybe wecan be giving the vag-P a more accurate testing!!Love, Carolyn

>>>>>>>>>YES, bout time, the WP P IS a BIG factor........P is still breaking out of many of us, and may for years. That is why some of us are still using more E, and painting our breasts with iodine, yes iodine.......sounds wild but does help:)))

September 14, 2005

I'm on Day 10 of vaginal Prometrium. I'm starting to have P symptoms -

bloating, sore and dry eyes, a little depression, sore joints. It is not as

bad as taking it orally, however. I'm going to go 12 days.

Val

-----Original Message-----

From: rhythmicliving

[mailto:rhythmicliving ]On Behalf Of

I'm still having trouble using P. I

can't take it. In cream OR olive oil. I may have to go the vaginal

route now.

September 14, 2005

...Since excess P produces androgenic activity,

producing testesterone in kidneys as a reaction (Dr.

Formby shared study) and since P also produces effects

on the insulin system (read Vliet)....no surprise.

That is my profile as well! Dear God, I hope it is

still possible to lose the Buddha Belly!! Carolyn

--- wrote:

> WEll my weight is all AROUND my middle. Something

> tells me that

> despite what my tests said, I am insulin resistant!

>

> > >

> >

> > ONLY very recently am I doing well...I feel that I

> am back to

> balance

> > and now the weight is coming off by itself -

> tomorrow I will ask

> the

> > doc for vaginal P...I want now only a small

> amount. Unlike many,

> I do

> > feel progesterone is used elswhere in the

> body....BUT it will go

> > elsewhere anyway - regardless of where you put it.

> Itf it goes

> into the

> > bloodstream it goes everywhere. I am concerned

> it will give me

> > infammation/soreness in my vagina...so if he has

> something more

> > natural, I will do that. I will simply use it at

> bedtime and then

> not

> > worry quite as much about leaking. I like the

> every other day

> routine

> >

>

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weight and transdermals and other stuff

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