What to do?

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 5/4/2004 9:45:13 AM Central Standard Time,

Nettie619@... writes:

> When i told her I could go she said thanks

> that will make it so much easier and you can carry her pullup! Ahh-- so now

> the

> truth came out ,,, the pullups weigh 1 oz? Well after listening to a

> conversation several times how kids are excluded from trips due to behavior

> issues I

> was astounded,, 2 were excluded yesturday and they plan to exclude another

> when

> we visit the new middle school these kids will attend the next year

Jeannette,

This sounds so very familiar.  Zack has been potty trained for years and

never had an accident at school until last year.  He started with a constipation

problem, and doesn't always make it.  His aide, was a big " germ freak " and any

time he had dirt under his nails (he was a 10 year old boy!), she would drag

him to the nurse, and make her call me insisting it was poop.  Even the nurse,

knew it wasn't. 

So, the fifth grade trip, was to spend a weekend at a camping reserve.  We

are not campers, anyway, and I knew Zack would probably not like not being able

to play Nintendo.  But, the inclusion staff worked with me and we came up with

a plan.  UNTIL, Zack had another accident.  I had sent wipes, pull ups, a

change of clothes and everything they requested to clean him up.  Instead the

called for me to bring him home.  Seems his teacher, refused to let the para

help

him.  I was not home, or I would have given them what for.  They called my

husband at working, forcing him to take time off, and he went to get Zack.  I

marched Zack back to school and had words with the principal.  Poor man, knew

nothing about it.  I also called Special Ed.  I was told by the para that the

teacher had said she would not allow Zack on the camping trip, if he was going

to continue with this " Behavior " .  For goodness sake, we were seeing a doctor. 

It was a medical problem, not a behavior!  The district told me that we could

force them to take Zack, but by then, I just wanted him away from the " germ

freak " para and the " Hitler " teacher. 

The teacher was reprimanded for sending Zack home, but of course, I am not

allowed to know what was actually done.  He had never missed a field trip

before, or since.  And he did get to spend the days when his class was camping,

visiting the 6th grade class.  Made for a nice transition.  But, I will always

resent this teacher for how she treated Zack.  All year, she accused him of

things.  He said a four syllable swear word.  Good!  According to his IEP and

his

speech therapist, he couldn't, at that time, say four intelligible syllables

together.  So she was mistaken or we are looking at a miracle here!

Next year, my younger son, with autism, will be in that grade.  I have

already requested that we stay as far away from that teacher as possible.  It is

absolutely sickening, the way she sees Zack in the hall and gushes over him.  He

will not talk to her.  He speaks to all his other ex-teachers, but not to

her.  He just looks at the floor.  Can't tell me something didn't go on there!

Guess, I didn't give you much advice.  If you daughter has a para, she should

be carrying the pull up.  Or it should be in your daughter's purse or

backpack.  I know the nurse calls me many times to get Zack when he is not

really

sick.  But, if you don't go, you tend to look like the uncaring mom, who doesn't

love her child. I tried to file a discrimination lawsuit last year, but no one

wanted to touch it.  I needed multiple instances, and it was close to the end

of the year, like now, and they kept saying, " Just ride it out " .  When you do

's IEP for next year, maybe you could bring some of these issues up and

sort out some ideas.  Zack's extra clothes are kept at the nurses office.  The

rest room there is private, so if anything happens, Zack can change without

the worry of others coming in.  I have made friends with the school nurse and

this year's para, so they know when Zack is faking and when he is really sick. 

Hopefully, you can set something like this up at your school. 

Good luck!

Sue - mom to Zack, 11, DS, 2 ASDs, VSD, Bad Mitral Valve; Matt, 10, 's

Anamoly, Cataracts, Glaucoma, PDD, PFO, hearing loss; , (4/20/96 -

12/31/00), DS, g-tube, TOF; Sami, born 11/16/2002, sensory dysfunction and

possible

autism, the most spoiled princess

DisLabeled Writing - finally updated about 's death and Sami's adoption

's Memorial Page

's Candle Shrine    

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 5/4/2004 12:09:02 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Nettie619

writes:

Indiana

BTW - what you are describing is a violation of the ADA

Contact your state and describe the situation - and find out your child's

rights under state law.

Have you contacted the Director of SPecial Education for your school district

yet? Start there. If you don't get immediate results, file a complaint with

your state.

- Becky

Indiana

Division of Exceptional Learners (Indiana)

Department of Education

Room 229

State House

Indianapolis, IN 46204

Phone: (317) 232-0570

Toll-Free: (877) 851-4106

Fax: (317) 232-0589

TTY: (317) 232-0570

Email: rmarra@...

Website: http://ideanet.doe.state.in.us/exceptional/

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 5/4/04 1:48:54 PM Central Daylight Time,

writes:

> Well after listening to a

> conversation several times how kids are excluded from trips due to behavior

> issues I

> was astounded,, 2 were excluded yesturday and they plan to exclude another

> when

> we visit the new middle school these kids will attend the next year. I am

> thinking I need to file a discrimination suit due to enabling our kids to

> attend

> events due to possible behavior issues.And several other issues , They have

> sent my daughter home on several days due to so called soiling of pants-- or

>

> illness,, but when I pick her up no soiled clothes are sent home and I take

> her to

> dr and she says nothing is wrong with . Can anyone suggest who I call to

>

> start this process? Or how to obtain information on our kids rights? I sure

> need help on this one.. Thanks Jeanette mom to 11 with ds

>

>

>

Jeanette,

I would focus on the issues with unless you know the other parents and

they also want to join the fight. Not that I want to discourage anyone for

advocating for all kids but because the other parents may have decided that it

is

appropriate to not include their child at this time.

My son's schools have always been wonderful about including him (except for

one oversight quickly corrected). But, afterafter years of experience we found

that they just weren't good activities for him. Walking and hiking at nature

centers is one of those activities.

also wouldn't do well with a group trip to a future school. He needs a

personal plan for transitions.

I don't know the details of what is happening with your school but just

wanted to share why my son would be excluded through no bad actions of the

school

district.

Karyn

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 5/4/04 1:48:54 PM Central Daylight Time,

writes:

>

> Guess, I didn't give you much advice. If you daughter has a para, she

> should

> be carrying the pull up. Or it should be in your daughter's purse or

> backpack. I know the nurse calls me many times to get Zack when he is not

> really

> sick. But, if you don't go, you tend to look like the uncaring mom, who

> doesn't

> love her child. I tried to file a discrimination lawsuit last year, but no

> one

> wanted to touch it. I needed multiple instances, and it was close to the

> end

> of the year, like now, and they kept saying, " Just ride it out " . When you

> do

> 's IEP for next year, maybe you could bring some of these issues up and

> sort out some ideas. Zack's extra clothes are kept at the nurses office.

> The

> rest room there is private, so if anything happens, Zack can change without

> the worry of others coming in. I have made friends with the school nurse

> and

> this year's para, so they know when Zack is faking and when he is really

> sick.

> Hopefully, you can set something like this up at your school.

>

> Good luck!

>

> Sue - mom to Zack, 11, DS, 2 ASDs, VSD, Bad Mitral Valve; Matt, 10, 's

> Anamoly, Cataracts, Glaucoma, PDD, PFO, hearing loss; , (4/20/96 -

> 12/31/00), DS, g-tube, TOF; Sami, born 11/16/2002, sensory dysfunction and

> possible

> autism, the most spoiled princess

>

>

I am a terrible parent. LOL!!! I have been known to pick up a sick child and

take them back to school after a few hours saying he got home and magically

became well. Just like when you take a child to the dr. and their symptoms are

gone.

I've never directly said that the child wasn't acting sick but staff quickly

learned that the child would be back soon.

The same with changing my son after an accident. He has had some where he

really needed a shower and school has called me. Of course I run him home and

shower him and he goes right back to school. I wouldn't want to reinforce having

accidents is my reasoning with the school.

I am fortunate though and overall have a good school district.

Karyn

[Guest guest]

> ... or will not be going through the phase that she is ...

LOL, I'm sorry Bill, but you always manage to make me laugh!!! I

can't help answer the question as I have no idea. And it was

perfectly okay for you to post the question here.

Colleen

Country Meadow Creations

http://www.countrymeadowcreations.com

[Guest guest]

HI Bill,

There has been some evidence that Rosemary Essential oil is effective at

helping thinning hair. What I have seen is to mix it with a carrier oil

(olive, jojoba, etc) and massage it into the scalp each night.

The information about poly 80 that was posted also seems to be true and

promising.

It is likely that both ingredients act as vasodilators, increasing bloodflow

to the follicles, but that is just an educated guess.

HTH

in RI

----Original Message Follows----

From: Soap Supplies <bill@...>

Reply-

Subject: What to do?

Date: Tue, 28 Sep 2004 16:52:28 -0600

I hope it's not out of line to post the question I received below, but I do

get quite a few like these, and since I'm not doctor or will not be going

through the phase that she is, I don't really know how to answer these or

where to point them too. Any suggestions?

Bill

I am searching for some information. I had heard at one time, that jojoba

oil is an excellent nutrient for hair to help maintain hair growth and

health. I am wondering what the real story is on trying to maintain healthy

hair during menopause using any of the natural oils on the market. My hair

is thinning and I am trying to keep it healthy and prevent loss. Any

suggestions?

Thank you,

bill@...

www.soapmaking-soapsupplies.com

www.handcraftedinamerica.org

[Guest guest]

Thanks for the info folks. I passed along.

Bill

* There has been some evidence that Rosemary Essential oil is effective at

* helping thinning hair. What I have seen is to mix it with a carrier oil

* (olive, jojoba, etc) and massage it into the scalp each night.

*

* The information about poly 80 that was posted also seems to be true and

* promising.

*

bill@...

www.soapmaking-soapsupplies.com

www.handcraftedinamerica.org

[Guest guest]

,

I think it is interesting that quite a few on this list kids are having the

OCD come back. I wonder if the holidays are triggering some of this? I don't

know, but I am feeling the same with my son.

I found many times with my son that when we get out of the house he does do

better and kind of get his mind off of it, unless he is in full force OCD.

So maybe it would help to get out some, at least give it a try and see.

This summer when my son was at his worse with fear of storms, getting out of

the house was a nightmare and I learned to just take a deep breath and stay

in, even though it was making me very depressed. Its hard to know with this.

I am struggling to figure out what my sons is coming back also. I have

noticed the last couple of weeks that he is stressing about everything. I am

trying to stay very calm and just stop and smell the roses with him, stop

and give him a hug at times, etc.

Good luck!

_____

From:

[mailto: ] On Behalf Of

Sent: Monday, November 13, 2006 10:59 AM

Subject: What to do?

I'm not sure how to handle this. I definitely see that something is up with

Ben, 7yr, he is tired, wants to lay around, is starting to talk about ocd

coming back. He says he feels a little sad about it, scared, and mad. I

suggested that we stop the house stuff for the day, (Mon is my cleaning day

and schooly stuff in the pm) and go out for some fun, Busch Gardens, the

zoo, science museum. He really didn't want to. He says he is sleepy and

wants to stay home. He stayed home much of the weekend with dh while I

worked. They played some, but more gameboy, tv and computer time than I

would have wanted. I do have lots to do today, so I'm tempted to let him

relax for my own purpose. He is watching old Disney Christmas movies. I'm

feeling stressed and worried too. And our house needs cleaning. Should I:

a. get him up and head out for a day of fun (blowing off house stuff)

b. let him relax and do what I have to do

he didn't seem opposed to doing something, but he didn't seemed thrilled,

inertia maybe.

What would you do? We homeschool so he is always home. I also feel upset,

and that song from that youtube video is playing in my head whenever I think

of ocd coming back. Maybe I need a day out too. Mostly venting, but looking

for suggestions. Should I kind of force the issue and head out, or stay home

and cocoon. Thanks for listening.

J

Also, my questions about ocd's return seem to be upseting him, but I feel

like I need to know what is going on. Should I push it and make him talk or

let him be. I'm being very gentle, and kind of vague about it. But, I feel

like if I dont' get a early handle on it, it could come on fast and we will

be blindsided. But, I dont' want to force the issue and make it worse.

UGH!!!!

[Guest guest]

tough call - probably get up and out - but if somethings brewing - it

will come anyway???

is he on omega/inositol??? I only ask because dd's main issues

clothing and bathroom stuff are there - but she's the happy little

girl I knew - of course illness passed,she's been prayed over

everything - but something worked - it's nice to see her - maybe it

would help - i try to tell her to share any new things too - but I

keep it light and airy hoping she'll open up if something arises -

good luck

eileen

Quoting <lauraj2@...>:

> I'm not sure how to handle this. I definitely see that something is

> up with Ben, 7yr, he is tired, wants to lay around, is starting to

> talk about ocd coming back. He says he feels a little sad about it,

> scared, and mad. I suggested that we stop the house stuff for the

> day, (Mon is my cleaning day and schooly stuff in the pm) and go out

> for some fun, Busch Gardens, the zoo, science museum. He really

> didn't want to. He says he is sleepy and wants to stay home. He

> stayed home much of the weekend with dh while I worked. They played

> some, but more gameboy, tv and computer time than I would have

> wanted. I do have lots to do today, so I'm tempted to let him relax

> for my own purpose. He is watching old Disney Christmas movies.

> I'm feeling stressed and worried too. And our house needs cleaning.

> Should I:

> a. get him up and head out for a day of fun (blowing off house stuff)

> b. let him relax and do what I have to do

>

> he didn't seem opposed to doing something, but he didn't seemed

> thrilled, inertia maybe.

> What would you do? We homeschool so he is always home. I also feel

> upset, and that song from that youtube video is playing in my head

> whenever I think of ocd coming back. Maybe I need a day out too.

> Mostly venting, but looking for suggestions. Should I kind of force

> the issue and head out, or stay home and cocoon. Thanks for listening.

> J

> Also, my questions about ocd's return seem to be upseting him, but I

> feel like I need to know what is going on. Should I push it and

> make him talk or let him be. I'm being very gentle, and kind of

> vague about it. But, I feel like if I dont' get a early handle on

> it, it could come on fast and we will be blindsided. But, I dont'

> want to force the issue and make it worse. UGH!!!!

>

>

[Guest guest]

I would let him relax and do what you have to do. You need to take

care of yourself if you are going to be able to take care of your

child. Good luck, Patty

>

> I'm not sure how to handle this. I definitely see that something

is up with Ben, 7yr, he is tired, wants to lay around, is starting to

talk about ocd coming back. He says he feels a little sad about it,

scared, and mad. I suggested that we stop the house stuff for the

day, (Mon is my cleaning day and schooly stuff in the pm) and go out

for some fun, Busch Gardens, the zoo, science museum. He really

didn't want to. He says he is sleepy and wants to stay home. He

stayed home much of the weekend with dh while I worked. They played

some, but more gameboy, tv and computer time than I would have

wanted. I do have lots to do today, so I'm tempted to let him relax

for my own purpose. He is watching old Disney Christmas movies. I'm

feeling stressed and worried too. And our house needs cleaning.

Should I:

> a. get him up and head out for a day of fun (blowing off house

stuff)

> b. let him relax and do what I have to do

>

> he didn't seem opposed to doing something, but he didn't seemed

thrilled, inertia maybe.

> What would you do? We homeschool so he is always home. I also feel

upset, and that song from that youtube video is playing in my head

whenever I think of ocd coming back. Maybe I need a day out too.

Mostly venting, but looking for suggestions. Should I kind of force

the issue and head out, or stay home and cocoon. Thanks for listening.

> J

> Also, my questions about ocd's return seem to be upseting him, but

I feel like I need to know what is going on. Should I push it and

make him talk or let him be. I'm being very gentle, and kind of vague

about it. But, I feel like if I dont' get a early handle on it, it

could come on fast and we will be blindsided. But, I dont' want to

force the issue and make it worse. UGH!!!!

>

>

[Guest guest]

, I can see your dilemma .... I wonder if you could have Ben write down

three things he'd like to do (other than stay home today) and write down your

ideas, all on separate strips of paper, and then have him choose one at random?

I find that having a choice " forced " at random often brings up strong arguments

for or against the one chosen and the ones not chosen. You might get some

better involvement from him that way, and find out what he *really* wants to do.

Of course, you have to be willing to do what he wants if he picks one of his

own! I am all in favor of getting him out of the house, breaking the routine if

he can cope with broken routines LOL. On a different note, I can totally

sympathize with you about trying to talk to him about OCD. My daughter can get

really belligerent when I bring it up, saying " Talking about it only makes it

WORSE! " (her capitals, not mine ;-)

Good luck today!

M.

<lauraj2@...> wrote:

I'm not sure how to handle this. I definitely see that something is up

with Ben, 7yr, he is tired, wants to lay around, is starting to talk about ocd

coming back. He says he feels a little sad about it, scared, and mad. I

suggested that we stop the house stuff for the day, (Mon is my cleaning day and

schooly stuff in the pm) and go out for some fun, Busch Gardens, the zoo,

science museum. He really didn't want to. He says he is sleepy and wants to stay

home. He stayed home much of the weekend with dh while I worked. They played

some, but more gameboy, tv and computer time than I would have wanted. I do have

lots to do today, so I'm tempted to let him relax for my own purpose. He is

watching old Disney Christmas movies. I'm feeling stressed and worried too. And

our house needs cleaning. Should I:

a. get him up and head out for a day of fun (blowing off house stuff)

b. let him relax and do what I have to do

he didn't seem opposed to doing something, but he didn't seemed thrilled,

inertia maybe.

What would you do? We homeschool so he is always home. I also feel upset, and

that song from that youtube video is playing in my head whenever I think of ocd

coming back. Maybe I need a day out too. Mostly venting, but looking for

suggestions. Should I kind of force the issue and head out, or stay home and

cocoon. Thanks for listening.

J

Also, my questions about ocd's return seem to be upseting him, but I feel like I

need to know what is going on. Should I push it and make him talk or let him be.

I'm being very gentle, and kind of vague about it. But, I feel like if I dont'

get a early handle on it, it could come on fast and we will be blindsided. But,

I dont' want to force the issue and make it worse. UGH!!!!

[Guest guest]

I'm going to start the inositol and omega if/when this comes back. He may be

fighting a cold or something, so I'm nto sure. What is the dosage to begin

with? He is about 50 lbs and 7.5.

J

Re: What to do?

tough call - probably get up and out - but if somethings brewing - it

will come anyway???

is he on omega/inositol??? I only ask because dd's main issues

clothing and bathroom stuff are there - but she's the happy little

girl I knew - of course illness passed,she's been prayed over

everything - but something worked - it's nice to see her - maybe it

would help - i try to tell her to share any new things too - but I

keep it light and airy hoping she'll open up if something arises -

good luck

eileen

Quoting <lauraj2@...>:

> I'm not sure how to handle this. I definitely see that something is

> up with Ben, 7yr, he is tired, wants to lay around, is starting to

> talk about ocd coming back. He says he feels a little sad about it,

> scared, and mad. I suggested that we stop the house stuff for the

> day, (Mon is my cleaning day and schooly stuff in the pm) and go out

> for some fun, Busch Gardens, the zoo, science museum. He really

> didn't want to. He says he is sleepy and wants to stay home. He

> stayed home much of the weekend with dh while I worked. They played

> some, but more gameboy, tv and computer time than I would have

> wanted. I do have lots to do today, so I'm tempted to let him relax

> for my own purpose. He is watching old Disney Christmas movies.

> I'm feeling stressed and worried too. And our house needs cleaning.

> Should I:

> a. get him up and head out for a day of fun (blowing off house stuff)

> b. let him relax and do what I have to do

>

> he didn't seem opposed to doing something, but he didn't seemed

> thrilled, inertia maybe.

> What would you do? We homeschool so he is always home. I also feel

> upset, and that song from that youtube video is playing in my head

> whenever I think of ocd coming back. Maybe I need a day out too.

> Mostly venting, but looking for suggestions. Should I kind of force

> the issue and head out, or stay home and cocoon. Thanks for listening.

> J

> Also, my questions about ocd's return seem to be upseting him, but I

> feel like I need to know what is going on. Should I push it and

> make him talk or let him be. I'm being very gentle, and kind of

> vague about it. But, I feel like if I dont' get a early handle on

> it, it could come on fast and we will be blindsided. But, I dont'

> want to force the issue and make it worse. UGH!!!!

>

>

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 11/13/2006 12:17:56 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,

lauraj2@... writes:

I'm feeling stressed and worried too. And our house needs cleaning. Should

I:

a. get him up and head out for a day of fun (blowing off house stuff)

b. let him relax and do what I have to do

he didn't seem opposed to doing something, but he didn't seemed thrilled,

inertia maybe.

....

Sounds like a perfect lazy afternoon for both mom & son to me. You could

turn it into an adventure & build a sheet tent in the family room, make popcorn

& watch a movie together... or something like that. A favorite board game

for 2 people.... there are things that you can do together without going out

somewhere. A picnic lunch on the floor during movie time.

Don't worry - your house will still need cleaning tomorrow :-)

LT

[Guest guest]

dd is just about the same I'm doing1 coromega packet and 1/8 tsp

inositol can be a lot more i think - but I'm not messing with

whatever's working - took 3 weeks or so to see change and it did come

after i added the inositol plus she was not sick anymore etc so i'm

not sure but i'd start both asap since he seems so low - worth a try -

good luck

eileen

Quoting <lauraj2@...>:

> I'm going to start the inositol and omega if/when this comes back.

> He may be fighting a cold or something, so I'm nto sure. What is

> the dosage to begin with? He is about 50 lbs and 7.5.

> J

> Re: What to do?

>

>

> tough call - probably get up and out - but if somethings brewing - it

> will come anyway???

> is he on omega/inositol??? I only ask because dd's main issues

> clothing and bathroom stuff are there - but she's the happy little

> girl I knew - of course illness passed,she's been prayed over

> everything - but something worked - it's nice to see her - maybe it

> would help - i try to tell her to share any new things too - but I

> keep it light and airy hoping she'll open up if something arises -

> good luck

> eileen

>

> Quoting <lauraj2@...>:

>

> > I'm not sure how to handle this. I definitely see that something is

> > up with Ben, 7yr, he is tired, wants to lay around, is starting to

> > talk about ocd coming back. He says he feels a little sad about it,

> > scared, and mad. I suggested that we stop the house stuff for the

> > day, (Mon is my cleaning day and schooly stuff in the pm) and go out

> > for some fun, Busch Gardens, the zoo, science museum. He really

> > didn't want to. He says he is sleepy and wants to stay home. He

> > stayed home much of the weekend with dh while I worked. They played

> > some, but more gameboy, tv and computer time than I would have

> > wanted. I do have lots to do today, so I'm tempted to let him relax

> > for my own purpose. He is watching old Disney Christmas movies.

> > I'm feeling stressed and worried too. And our house needs cleaning.

> > Should I:

> > a. get him up and head out for a day of fun (blowing off house stuff)

> > b. let him relax and do what I have to do

> >

> > he didn't seem opposed to doing something, but he didn't seemed

> > thrilled, inertia maybe.

> > What would you do? We homeschool so he is always home. I also feel

> > upset, and that song from that youtube video is playing in my head

> > whenever I think of ocd coming back. Maybe I need a day out too.

> > Mostly venting, but looking for suggestions. Should I kind of force

> > the issue and head out, or stay home and cocoon. Thanks for listening.

> > J

> > Also, my questions about ocd's return seem to be upseting him, but I

> > feel like I need to know what is going on. Should I push it and

> > make him talk or let him be. I'm being very gentle, and kind of

> > vague about it. But, I feel like if I dont' get a early handle on

> > it, it could come on fast and we will be blindsided. But, I dont'

> > want to force the issue and make it worse. UGH!!!!

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

When the flight attendent on an aircraft gives emergency instructions

they always say to put on your oxygen mask first and then help the

person or persons next to you.

If you have not taken care of yourself then how can you help anyone else?

>

>

> In a message dated 11/13/2006 12:17:56 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,

> lauraj2@... writes:

>

> I'm feeling stressed and worried too. And our house needs cleaning.

Should

> I:

> a. get him up and head out for a day of fun (blowing off house stuff)

> b. let him relax and do what I have to do

>

> he didn't seem opposed to doing something, but he didn't seemed

thrilled,

> inertia maybe.

>

>

>

> ....

>

> Sounds like a perfect lazy afternoon for both mom & son to me. You

could

> turn it into an adventure & build a sheet tent in the family room,

make popcorn

> & watch a movie together... or something like that. A favorite

board game

> for 2 people.... there are things that you can do together without

going out

> somewhere. A picnic lunch on the floor during movie time.

>

> Don't worry - your house will still need cleaning tomorrow :-)

> LT

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I often give a copy of Sheri Tennpenney's DVD and Randall Neustadter's The

Vaccine Guide as a Welcome to the World gift and just say you may want to

read/watch about each vaccination before you give it to your child, so that

you are aware of both sides of the story. Works for some. Others just put

them away and there is not much you can do then.

C

_____

From: Vaccinations [mailto:Vaccinations ] On

Behalf Of jjlevi2@...

Sent: Sunday, December 10, 2006 8:17 PM

Vaccinations

Subject: what to do?

My best friend is giving birth in one month and I spoke to her about

vaccinations and their dangers and she says, " i wouldnt want to know

that I was responsible for any disease that could happen to my

child. " Also her husband would not be supportive at all to not vax.

She would per se believe in the dangers of vaccinating but she is

still too brainwashed---How do I convince her or how can I show her

at least some research, whats the best way to show her without being

too strong about it...?Or should I just leave it alone and just let

her decide? I feel bad just letting her decide bc she is ignorant to

the dangers...

any advice is appreciated.

Thanks

Jessi

[Guest guest]

The information is out there for them to decide,and it would not be right if you

tried to push them either way.You would not want her pushing you to vaccinate

would you? Best bet is to say: I know you will be vaccinating so I wanted to

give you these things just in case you did not know about them:

VAERS form that you can fill out if your child has a reaction.

Information on the national vaccine injury compensation program if you ever

have to file a claim for injury or death,but don't expect anything since most

families are turned away in the first round.Be sure to keep a detail copy of

medical records from pregnancy to present.

If you really want to be nice give a pacakge insert for each vaccine,and

remind them that it clearly states in the insert that vaccines will not provide

a 100% protection,sooooo that means she needs to know about the VPDs as well. A

Janet Zand book might be a good gift.

Smart Medicine for a Healthier Child

---------------------------------

Any questions? Get answers on any topic at Answers. Try it now.

[Guest guest]

At 03:40 AM 12/11/2006 -0800, you wrote:

>The information is out there for them to decide,and it would not be right

if you tried to push them either way.You would not want her pushing you to

vaccinate would you? Best bet is to say: I know you will be vaccinating so

I wanted to give you these things just in case you did not know about them:

>

> VAERS form that you can fill out if your child has a reaction.

>

> Information on the national vaccine injury compensation program if you

ever have to file a claim for injury or death,but don't expect anything

since most families are turned away in the first round.Be sure to keep a

detail copy of medical records from pregnancy to present.

>

> If you really want to be nice give a pacakge insert for each vaccine,and

remind them that it clearly states in the insert that vaccines will not

provide a 100% protection,sooooo that means she needs to know about the

VPDs as well. A Janet Zand book might be a good gift.

>Smart Medicine for a Healthier Child

good advice

Also I would encourage all not to use the term/acronym VPD as the diseases

are not vaccine preventable (vaccine preventable disease - VPD). Vaccines

do not give immunity. They inject and cause a chronic case of illness -

sometimes subtle at first and sometimes not. When we are ill with a deep

disease such as that we cannot get an acute disease - such as measles. Its

not that you are immune to measles from the vaccine, it is because you have

a chronic case of measles injected into you and therefore cannot get an

acute case

Sheri

>>

--------------------------------------------------------

Sheri Nakken, R.N., MA, Hahnemannian Homeopath

Vaccination Information & Choice Network, Nevada City CA & Wales UK

$$ Donations to help in the work - accepted by Paypal account

earthmysteriestours@... voicemail US 530-740-0561

(go to http://www.paypal.com) or by mail

Vaccines - http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/vaccine.htm

Vaccine Dangers On-Line course - http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/vaccineclass.htm

Reality of the Diseases & Treatment -

http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/vaccineclass.htm

Homeopathy On-Line course - http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/homeo.htm

[Guest guest]

>

Sheri,

How would this apply to " new " vaccines that use only part of the

genetic components of a virus/disease? I have a very nice neighbor with

a doctorate in immunology, of all things (when I found this out, I

nearly flipped), and she was pretty receptive to my concerns about

vaccines, but she did say you wouldn't be able to get the disease if

only part of the virus is in the vaccine. That made sense to me; how

would that work? thanks, Angie T. (since there's a new Angie on this

list now)

p.s. she's not using her doctorate (it was combo immunology and

something else. She said she was disillusioned by the fact that the

pharma companies just want to make money; didn't give her the " helping

humankind " angle she wanted -- interesting)

> Vaccines

> do not give immunity. They inject and cause a chronic case of illness -

> sometimes subtle at first and sometimes not. When we are ill with a

> deep

> disease such as that we cannot get an acute disease - such as measles.

> Its

> not that you are immune to measles from the vaccine, it is because you

> have

> a chronic case of measles injected into you and therefore cannot get an

> acute case

> Sheri

[Guest guest]

At 02:09 PM 12/11/2006 -0500, you wrote:

>>

>Sheri,

>

>How would this apply to " new " vaccines that use only part of the

>genetic components of a virus/disease? I have a very nice neighbor with

>a doctorate in immunology, of all things (when I found this out, I

>nearly flipped), and she was pretty receptive to my concerns about

>vaccines, but she did say you wouldn't be able to get the disease if

>only part of the virus is in the vaccine. That made sense to me; how

>would that work? thanks, Angie T. (since there's a new Angie on this

>list now)

>

>p.s. she's not using her doctorate (it was combo immunology and

>something else. She said she was disillusioned by the fact that the

>pharma companies just want to make money; didn't give her the " helping

>humankind " angle she wanted -- interesting)

>

No vaccines give immunity

They measure immunity by antibody levels

Antibodies are only one part of the immune system. The rest has not be

stimulated as it would be in a disease

A disease comes in by nose/mouth usually (ie childhood diseases). That is

where the first part of the immune system is stimulated.

That is bypassed.

I'll send an article and a summary of antibodies not meaning immunity, even

though they like to think they do

And all we have been told about so-called viruses is highly suspect as much

research funding and vaccines and drugs depends on their existence and what

they say they mean. I don't know if we'll ever get the truth about a

virus. I tend to think they are there doing a job that is positive

Sheri

>

>> Vaccines

>> do not give immunity. They inject and cause a chronic case of illness -

>> sometimes subtle at first and sometimes not. When we are ill with a

>> deep

>> disease such as that we cannot get an acute disease - such as measles.

>> Its

>> not that you are immune to measles from the vaccine, it is because you

>> have

>> a chronic case of measles injected into you and therefore cannot get an

>> acute case

>> Sheri

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Sheri,

I think you misunderstood my question. I wasn't talking about their

ability to give immunity. I was talking about the theory that vaccines

actually cause a chronic case of the disease. My friend acceded that

theoretically that was possible with vaccines that use the whole virus,

but that newer vaccines (didn't specify which) use only a fragment of

the code, I suppose enough to stimulate antibodies. I was wondering

what you thought about the ability of fragments only to cause the

actual disease. -Angie T.

On Monday, December 11, 2006, at 03:10 PM, Sheri Nakken wrote:

> At 02:09 PM 12/11/2006 -0500, you wrote:

> >>

> >Sheri,

> >

> >How would this apply to " new " vaccines that use only part of the

> >genetic components of a virus/disease? I have a very nice neighbor

> with

> >a doctorate in immunology, of all things (when I found this out, I

> >nearly flipped), and she was pretty receptive to my concerns about

> >vaccines, but she did say you wouldn't be able to get the disease if

> >only part of the virus is in the vaccine. That made sense to me; how

> >would that work? thanks, Angie T. (since there's a new Angie on this

> >list now)

> >

> >p.s. she's not using her doctorate (it was combo immunology and

> >something else. She said she was disillusioned by the fact that the

> >pharma companies just want to make money; didn't give her the " helping

> >humankind " angle she wanted -- interesting)

> >

>

> No vaccines give immunity

> They measure immunity by antibody levels

> Antibodies are only one part of the immune system. The rest has not be

> stimulated as it would be in a disease

> A disease comes in by nose/mouth usually (ie childhood diseases). That

> is

> where the first part of the immune system is stimulated.

> That is bypassed.

>

> I'll send an article and a summary of antibodies not meaning immunity,

> even

> though they like to think they do

> And all we have been told about so-called viruses is highly suspect as

> much

> research funding and vaccines and drugs depends on their existence and

> what

> they say they mean. I don't know if we'll ever get the truth about a

> virus. I tend to think they are there doing a job that is positive

> Sheri

>

> >

> >> Vaccines

> >> do not give immunity. They inject and cause a chronic case of

> illness -

> >> sometimes subtle at first and sometimes not. When we are ill with a

> >> deep

> >> disease such as that we cannot get an acute disease - such as

> measles.

> >> Its

> >> not that you are immune to measles from the vaccine, it is because

> you

> >> have

> >> a chronic case of measles injected into you and therefore cannot

> get an

> >> acute case

> >> Sheri

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

> No vaccines give immunity

> They measure immunity by antibody levels

> Antibodies are only one part of the immune system. The rest has not be

> stimulated as it would be in a disease

> A disease comes in by nose/mouth usually (ie childhood diseases).

That is

> where the first part of the immune system is stimulated.

> That is bypassed.

>

> I'll send an article and a summary of antibodies not meaning

immunity, even

> though they like to think they do

> And all we have been told about so-called viruses is highly suspect

as much

> research funding and vaccines and drugs depends on their existence

and what

> they say they mean. I don't know if we'll ever get the truth about a

> virus. I tend to think they are there doing a job that is positive

> Sheri

I wholeheartedly agreee with this and it always astonishes me that so

many of the so called scientists who are supposed to be so intelligent

don't seem to understand this.

It really took me a complete U turn in the way I thought about health

to understand this and once you do, you change your ways forever and

understand that NO VACCINE protects you from any disease and that only

your strong immune system can do this and help you recover if you do

get ill. I am glad that you are repeating this again and again, Sheri,

it is sooo important.

Ingrid

[Guest guest]

Hi, Kathleen - welcome!

We'll all do our best to offer thoughts and suggestions yo help you

identify what the stall is about.

First, I'd like to suggest that you take a look at the document in the

the files here, called " Band Eating Rules... " It's a document I wrote

several years ago and regularly update, that covers all the basic band

needs re food choices, nutrition, eating techniques, basic band rules,

saome of the Band safety issues, and much more basic info. I tried to

make it pretty complete, so it could be printed out if people chose. If

anyone has problems with printing, just email me directly at

MoonshadowRN@,com, and I'll send you a copy.

Go over the things in there, and see if anything strikes you as

something you might not have known.

Then, take a look at another document by Dr. Jessie Ahroni, a Nurse

Pactitioner/Band Practitioner in Searrle - called " How to tell if you

are perfectly Adjusted. " She makes many good points, but the document

includes a lot of other materials, that makes it a bit confusing, imo.

So , What I feel is a good fill is one that meets these criteria most

of the time (like about 80%) :

1. allows 1200-1500 cal a day, plus 1-2 small snacks

2. Allows all needed fluids to get in -about 100 oz a day or so, but

never less than about 80 0z or so.

3. allows good solid protein at least 2 times a day, including regular

red meats which are the most imot source of IRON.

4. You are never dependent on soft foods or liquids to get calories and

nutition in.

5. After a good Bandster meal of protein, veggies, and a few biyes of a

starch or grain, you are satisfied for 3-4 hrs.

You are able to meet the daily (on average) protein needs, fiber needs,

calcium needs.

6. You rarely have any trouble eating - no pb's no barfing, no pain, no

reflux.

7. You are losing an average of 1-2 # week, on average over a month's

time.

See what you think. From what you have said, you're eating more than

this, are not satisfied, and are not losing. That means, if all else is

ok, that you don't have a good fill yet.

It takes most people 3-5 monthly fills to get to a good level. the

first fill is often given at abvout 6 weeks, and then more monthyl , if

not ehnough and weight loss in not close to average. But fills must

never be given faster than people can change and adjust their eating.

Uf theya re having ANY troublr, no more fill uhntil the problem is

resolved. " Rsolving " might include an UNFILL to allow more learning

about eating, nutrition, food choices, etc.

Your exercise sounds VERY good, so let's leave that where it is.

Another question to ask is, how are your clothes fitting? Are you

seeing your body shrink? When we are doing such good exercsie, we are

builfing up some good and essential muscle, and this weights more than

the fat it is replacing. But, still, we should be averaging about 1-2 #

a week loss, over time. It's normal to have regular stalls of 1-2-3

weeks occasionally, but more stall time warrants an eval of what is

going on.

that's all for now. leet us know what you think after reviewing this

stuff.

What band do you have, and how much fill? The exact amy never matters,

but this is an added clue for us. What was your start wt, if you're

comfortable sharing that? (Pesonally to me only is fine, if you like.

Sandy R

(.

>

> I was banded nearly 6 months ago, 1/9/07 and have lost only 19 lbs

> since that date. Eleven of those lbs were in the two weeks after

> surgery. I've had two fills, and have pretty good restriction. I am

> doing only a fair amount of exercise, but am doing at least three to

> six hours per week.

> But the scale doesn't move. I'm still eating too much. (duh)

> I am consuming around 1500 to 2200 calories per day. I am eating

> enough protein and don't eat soft foods.

> Any words of advice? How do I cut back?

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks, Sandy, for the info. I have read the " bandster rules "

and " perfectly adjusted " docs before and find them of good help.

More info on me: Was banded by Dr. Kuri/Tijuana, with the Inamed

9.75cm band. First fill 0.8 cc, second fill now up to 1.6 cc,

cumulative. The fluoroscope at both fills showed lots of restriction-

they had to take some out each time. I feel lots of restriction and pb

at least 3 times a week since the last fill, June 6. Can eat most

things, but I don't eat bread or pasta, and very little rice. I drink

at least 60-80 oz. of water each day. Have had no complications.

Height: 5'11 " . Age: 51. Weight: 260/241/160. Any more thoughts or

advice on how to accelerate my weight loss? I just can't seem to lose.

[Guest guest]

I would guess at this point it would be less calories? If you are working out a

lot and not eating soft foods, you are definitely on the right track. The less

we take in and the more we burn off is the only way to lose.

God bless,

dawn in fairfax, va

Kathleen <kdmodesto55@...> wrote:

I was banded nearly 6 months ago, 1/9/07 and have lost only 19 lbs

since that date. Eleven of those lbs were in the two weeks after

surgery. I've had two fills, and have pretty good restriction. I am

doing only a fair amount of exercise, but am doing at least three to

six hours per week.

But the scale doesn't move. I'm still eating too much. (duh)

I am consuming around 1500 to 2200 calories per day. I am eating

enough protein and don't eat soft foods.

Any words of advice? How do I cut back?

God bless,

dawn in fairfax, va

DOB 10/09/2004

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