Guest guest Posted March 15, 2009 Report Share Posted March 15, 2009 actually sadly this is just what I am talking about! this is why some of us are really PISSED OFF. this is why Jefferies MD wrote Safe Uses of Cortisol. this is why there are support groups that advocate what I do and ppl get well. it really is not so complicated when you give your body what it needs. and I have repeatedly posted the sites that will give more info. and that's why I take cortef and iodine and Armour. gracia Gracia, no disrespect, but I belong to a support group with thousands of members, some of whom are nurses and doctors. Many of the people have had horrendous experiences with the afib, no one at all has suggested that it is an adrenal symptom, and it is not easy to treat. It is unpredictable, and can arise from different causes for different reasons. It is unpredicatable and can change into ventricular fibrillation, or other things. The heart can become enlarged, a patient can go into CHF, need valve replacement, catheter ablation, open heart surgery, and many times these procedures have to be done again and again. Please try to see the world for what it is, complicated. Not everything and everyone needs iodine and sex hormones, and not every condition is because of adrenal insufficiencies. Roni <>Just because something isn't seen doesn't mean it's not there<> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.0.237 / Virus Database: 270.11.13/2001 - Release Date: 03/14/09 06:54:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 15, 2009 Report Share Posted March 15, 2009 do you think the internist will know how to treat your adrenals? really! I would love to know! Gracia I was lucky to find cardiologists that 1. listened when I said that I react badly to drugs and wanted to try natural ways 2. worked with me with the natural ways 3. rx'd magnesium right away I've been afib free now since 1/27th, which I realize is not a tremendously long time, but my heart feels stable, I stay away from my triggers (ALL of them) and I'm checked regularly by my cardios. The only issue that remains is the hypo. I'm down to 1 grain of Armour, still have the low TSH, still have hypo symptoms, have an appointment on Thursday with the internist. Roni <>Just because something isn't seen doesn't mean it's not there<> --- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.0.237 / Virus Database: 270.11.13/2001 - Release Date: 03/14/09 06:54:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 15, 2009 Report Share Posted March 15, 2009 , Do you have a source/link for self testing of red blood cell vitamin/mineral deficiencies? Neil wrote: > > > > 2)Get a Red blood cell analysis and cure the vitamin/mineral > deficiencies including ferritin and Vitamin D > > I've off or resisted all medications that doctors foisted on me to > treat my hypothyroidism symptoms and the resulting nutritional > deficiencies. I've instead cured the deficiencies one by one and now I > don't lay awake hearing my pounding, beat-skipping heart and worry it > will stop in my sleep, worry I'm going nuts with anxiety or have > constant fuzzy vision.... ALL symptoms of nutritional deficiency. > > Biggest results for me were from Magnesium... then Iron and Zinc close > behind. > > ________________________________ > From: Roni Molin <matchermaam@... <mailto:matchermaam%40>> > hypothyroidism > <mailto:hypothyroidism%40> > Sent: Saturday, March 14, 2009 8:44:27 PM > Subject: Re: Re: progress maybe? > > When someone has a particular condition, it's common that they blame > other symptoms > on that condition too, without really checking out other things that > could be causing the new symptoms. Several conditons can exist at the > same time, and one is not necessarily the cause for any of the others. > > Roni > <>Just because something > isn't seen doesn't mean it's > not there<> > > > > From: <res075ohverizon (DOT) net> > Subject: Re: progress maybe? > hypothyroidism > Date: Saturday, March 14, 2009, 5:48 PM > > I take 75 mcg Synthroid alone for hypothyroidism. I notice that those > who take Armour seemingly need to also take a ton of other stuff to feel > as well as I do. Iodine several hundred percent of the max RDA, adrenal > treatment, sex hormones and a dozen or so vitamins and minerals plus > other supplements. .. You name it. > > At the same time they will blame any other ailments I have exclusively > upon the lack of Armour or the others myriad items they ingest; all with > no credible support whatsoever. You read the evidence and make up your > own mind. I don't recommend what I take to anyone, as I am not licensed > to prescribe and I do not have the requisite education. > > The number of doses sold of Armour are fewer than 5% of the number of > doses of Synthroid and its equivalents that are sold. While a number of > people report vastly improved quality of life in going from Synthroid to > Armour some report the opposite. In any credible controlled studies the > improvement of going from Synthroid to Armour falls to placebo or > chance. If it works for you, great. On many sites if it doesn't work > for you and you mention the fact you will be booted off the list. Here > you will find all kinds of opinions; and objections are seldom raised > except for blatant rip-offs. > > > . > . > > > > > Posted by: " Lethal Lee " pricklefoot3. au > > <mailto:pricklefoot3. au?Subject=%20Re% 3A%20progress% > 20maybe%3F> > > pricklefoot3 <http://profiles. / pricklefoot3> > > > > > > Sat Mar 14, 2009 12:51 am (PDT) > > > > Hi Roni, > > > > " 1 grain (60 mg) of Armour equals approximately 74 mcg of T4 > > (Synthroid) " http://www.drumlib. com/dp/000016. htm > > <http://www.drumlib. com/dp/000016. htm> > > > > They arrive at that calc this way.... > > > > 1 grain Armour contains 38mcg T4 + 9mcg T3 > > " conventional " wisdom is that 1mcg T3 is 4 times as potent as T4. > > > > So 1 grain is supposedly equivalent to..... > > > > 38mcg T4 + (9mcg T3 x 4) > > 38mcg + 36mcg = 74mcg T4 > > > > I dont think there IS any " equivalency " between Armour & T4 only meds. > > > > Most on T4 meds do badly or never completely feel well. > > So IF you want to continue to feel poorly by all means take an > > " equivalent " amount or Armour. > > > > On the other hand IF you want to feel well then take enough Armour to > > eliminate your symptoms. That seems to be an average of between 3-5 > > grains. > > > > Of course nothing will make you well if you havent addressed other > > contributing factors like Adrenals, mineral & vitamin deficiencies/ > > suboptimal levels, Sex Hormones, possible RT3 issues etc. > > > > Lethal Lee > > ------------ --------- --------- ------ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 15, 2009 Report Share Posted March 15, 2009 why wouldn't you treat the high liver enzymes with a liver detox and take magnesium (and iodine), instead of stopping Armour? hyperthyroidism is quite diffferent than taking too much meds! hyperthyroidism is a screaming need for iodine. Armour often reveals other probs, which then need to be treated. Gracia I went onto the forum associated with " StopTheThyroidMadness.com " when I was taking Armour looking for help because of feeling ill and then the high liver enzymes starting. Here's how it went. me: Anyone else having high liver enzymes after starting Armour. I'm on 3 grains. her: How dare you fear monger here and repeat the terrible rumors that doctors are telling you to believe. ARMOUR saved my life and I would will defend such a wonderful company as forest pharmaceuticals with all my might. They are ethical and fight for us!! (or something like that) me: Ummm, forest pharmaceuticals also makes Lexapro. Google " lawsuit lexapro " . The whole thread disappeared in less than 10 minutes and I was kicked off the board without comment... I kid you not! Never got around to mentioning that I was pissing out my whole skeleton as my calcium was leached from my bones (hadn't found out yet). I am NOT suggesting that Armour caused all these problems. I now know that any hyperthyroid state can cause these problems regardless of what hormone replacement is used AND that hyperthyroidism can be a subtle condition with real consequences. The real problem with the Armour websites are the pushing to take more and more without a care to hidden dangers like elevated liver enzymes and calcium leaching. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.0.237 / Virus Database: 270.11.13/2001 - Release Date: 03/14/09 06:54:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 15, 2009 Report Share Posted March 15, 2009 Support liver, support adrenals just to take Armour is just not going to happen with me. If it is that much stress on my body... I can do without. Right now I feel great. My only remain problem is T4 to T3 conversion when I work out. Well that and my calcium issue which I believe was caused by going hyper. What kills me is that people are told to bring ferritin levels up (often low in thyroid disease) to take Armour... then they give Armour all the credit for making them feel well. Similar improvements happened for me with the curing of nutritional deficiencies and levoxyl. Iodine did nothing for me in terms of how I feel. I'm glad I did get full saturation though. I've seen reversal of mild hypothryoidism with the dosing of iodine so it was worth a try. ________________________________ From: Gracia <circe@...> hypothyroidism Sent: Sunday, March 15, 2009 1:16:49 PM Subject: Re: Re: progress maybe? why wouldn't you treat the high liver enzymes with a liver detox and take magnesium (and iodine), instead of stopping Armour? hyperthyroidism is quite diffferent than taking too much meds! hyperthyroidism is a screaming need for iodine. Armour often reveals other probs, which then need to be treated. Gracia I went onto the forum associated with " StopTheThyroidMadn ess.com " when I was taking Armour looking for help because of feeling ill and then the high liver enzymes starting. Here's how it went. me: Anyone else having high liver enzymes after starting Armour. I'm on 3 grains. her: How dare you fear monger here and repeat the terrible rumors that doctors are telling you to believe. ARMOUR saved my life and I would will defend such a wonderful company as forest pharmaceuticals with all my might. They are ethical and fight for us!! (or something like that) me: Ummm, forest pharmaceuticals also makes Lexapro. Google " lawsuit lexapro " . The whole thread disappeared in less than 10 minutes and I was kicked off the board without comment... I kid you not! Never got around to mentioning that I was pissing out my whole skeleton as my calcium was leached from my bones (hadn't found out yet). I am NOT suggesting that Armour caused all these problems. I now know that any hyperthyroid state can cause these problems regardless of what hormone replacement is used AND that hyperthyroidism can be a subtle condition with real consequences. The real problem with the Armour websites are the pushing to take more and more without a care to hidden dangers like elevated liver enzymes and calcium leaching. ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- - No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.0.237 / Virus Database: 270.11.13/2001 - Release Date: 03/14/09 06:54:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 15, 2009 Report Share Posted March 15, 2009 Its been a couple years since I've ordered online (since getting insurance) and I'm not seeing anything but RBC magnesium testing. I'll continue to look and post a link. Its called by different names like erythrocyte analysis, red blood cell elements, red blood cell analysis. I'll find it. If you find a doctor who will order it for you through doctors data it will cost about $250 if you pay directly. http://doctorsdata.com/test_info.asp?id=7 http://www.drgrisanti.com/RBC.htm ________________________________ From: Neil <neilneil@...> hypothyroidism Sent: Sunday, March 15, 2009 1:01:48 PM Subject: Re: Re: progress maybe? , Do you have a source/link for self testing of red blood cell vitamin/mineral deficiencies? Neil wrote: > > > > 2)Get a Red blood cell analysis and cure the vitamin/mineral > deficiencies including ferritin and Vitamin D > > I've off or resisted all medications that doctors foisted on me to > treat my hypothyroidism symptoms and the resulting nutritional > deficiencies. I've instead cured the deficiencies one by one and now I > don't lay awake hearing my pounding, beat-skipping heart and worry it > will stop in my sleep, worry I'm going nuts with anxiety or have > constant fuzzy vision.... ALL symptoms of nutritional deficiency. > > Biggest results for me were from Magnesium... then Iron and Zinc close > behind. > > ____________ _________ _________ __ > From: Roni Molin <matchermaam <mailto:matchermaam %40. com>> > hypothyroidism > <mailto:hypothyroid ism%40group s.com> > Sent: Saturday, March 14, 2009 8:44:27 PM > Subject: Re: Re: progress maybe? > > When someone has a particular condition, it's common that they blame > other symptoms > on that condition too, without really checking out other things that > could be causing the new symptoms. Several conditons can exist at the > same time, and one is not necessarily the cause for any of the others. > > Roni > <>Just because something > isn't seen doesn't mean it's > not there<> > > > > From: <res075ohverizon (DOT) net> > Subject: Re: progress maybe? > hypothyroidism > Date: Saturday, March 14, 2009, 5:48 PM > > I take 75 mcg Synthroid alone for hypothyroidism. I notice that those > who take Armour seemingly need to also take a ton of other stuff to feel > as well as I do. Iodine several hundred percent of the max RDA, adrenal > treatment, sex hormones and a dozen or so vitamins and minerals plus > other supplements. .. You name it. > > At the same time they will blame any other ailments I have exclusively > upon the lack of Armour or the others myriad items they ingest; all with > no credible support whatsoever. You read the evidence and make up your > own mind. I don't recommend what I take to anyone, as I am not licensed > to prescribe and I do not have the requisite education. > > The number of doses sold of Armour are fewer than 5% of the number of > doses of Synthroid and its equivalents that are sold. While a number of > people report vastly improved quality of life in going from Synthroid to > Armour some report the opposite. In any credible controlled studies the > improvement of going from Synthroid to Armour falls to placebo or > chance. If it works for you, great. On many sites if it doesn't work > for you and you mention the fact you will be booted off the list. Here > you will find all kinds of opinions; and objections are seldom raised > except for blatant rip-offs. > > > . > . > > > > > Posted by: " Lethal Lee " pricklefoot3. au > > <mailto:pricklefoot 3. au?Subject=% 20Re% 3A%20progress% > 20maybe%3F> > > pricklefoot3 <http://profiles. / pricklefoot3> > > > > > > Sat Mar 14, 2009 12:51 am (PDT) > > > > Hi Roni, > > > > " 1 grain (60 mg) of Armour equals approximately 74 mcg of T4 > > (Synthroid) " http://www.drumlib. com/dp/000016. htm > > <http://www.drumlib. com/dp/000016. htm> > > > > They arrive at that calc this way.... > > > > 1 grain Armour contains 38mcg T4 + 9mcg T3 > > " conventional " wisdom is that 1mcg T3 is 4 times as potent as T4. > > > > So 1 grain is supposedly equivalent to..... > > > > 38mcg T4 + (9mcg T3 x 4) > > 38mcg + 36mcg = 74mcg T4 > > > > I dont think there IS any " equivalency " between Armour & T4 only meds. > > > > Most on T4 meds do badly or never completely feel well. > > So IF you want to continue to feel poorly by all means take an > > " equivalent " amount or Armour. > > > > On the other hand IF you want to feel well then take enough Armour to > > eliminate your symptoms. That seems to be an average of between 3-5 > > grains. > > > > Of course nothing will make you well if you havent addressed other > > contributing factors like Adrenals, mineral & vitamin deficiencies/ > > suboptimal levels, Sex Hormones, possible RT3 issues etc. > > > > Lethal Lee > > ------------ --------- --------- ------ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 15, 2009 Report Share Posted March 15, 2009 I take cortef for my fried adrenal glands--they were getting very weak. I could only tolerate 90mg Armour and I was going backwards healthwise. cortef gave me immense relief b/c I was interpreting everything in life as stress. then I got brainfogged so increased Armour to 240mg--all hypo symptoms went away. had I not gotten Armour/cortef I would definately have been considered a cardiac patient, like my mother was. Gracia Right.... you take cortef in order to tolerate Armour. Correct? ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.0.237 / Virus Database: 270.11.13/2001 - Release Date: 03/14/09 06:54:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 15, 2009 Report Share Posted March 15, 2009 Gracia, I have no quarrel with your regimine for yourself. If it works for you that is great and of course you should continue. All I'm saying is that we are not all the same. For example, I react to morphine backwards. It enhances pain in me instead of taking it away. That's just one reaction I have to something others can take with impunity. Please respect me as an intelligent person who knows how my body reacts. I do try things that seem reasonable for me, just not everything that is suggested. It's too bad that you are pissed off when someone tells you something truthful about themselves. Roni <>Just because something isn't seen doesn't mean it's not there<> From: Gracia <circe@...> Subject: Re: Re: progress maybe? hypothyroidism Date: Sunday, March 15, 2009, 12:59 PM  actually sadly this is just what I am talking about!   this is why some of us are really PISSED OFF.   this is why Jefferies MD wrote Safe Uses of Cortisol.   this is why there are support groups that advocate what I do and ppl get well.   it really is not so complicated when you give your body what it needs.   and I have repeatedly posted the sites that will give more info.    and that's why I take cortef and iodine and Armour.  gracia  Gracia, no disrespect, but I belong to a support group with thousands of members, some of whom are nurses and doctors. Many of the people have had horrendous experiences with the afib, no one at all has suggested that it is an adrenal symptom, and it is not easy to treat. It is unpredictable, and can arise from different causes for different reasons. It is unpredicatable and can change into ventricular fibrillation, or other things. The heart can become enlarged, a patient can go into CHF, need valve replacement, catheter ablation, open heart surgery, and many times these procedures have to be done again and again.  Please try to see the world for what it is, complicated. Not everything and everyone needs  iodine and sex hormones, and not every condition is because of adrenal insufficiencies.  Roni  <>Just because something  isn't seen doesn't mean it's  not there<>  ------------------------------------------------------------------------------  No virus found in this incoming message.  Checked by AVG - www.avg.com  Version: 8.0.237 / Virus Database: 270.11.13/2001 - Release Date: 03/14/09 06:54:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 15, 2009 Report Share Posted March 15, 2009 Gracia there are over 6 million people with fibro. If your methods could and would cure them, don't you think that would be a well known fact to millions of them? Don't you think they would have been cured if it works? Don't you think that if they were indeed cured that way that they would be shouting it from the rooftops? That's just not happening. Roni <>Just because something isn't seen doesn't mean it's not there<> From: Gracia <circe@...> Subject: Re: Re: progress maybe? hypothyroidism Date: Sunday, March 15, 2009, 1:01 PM  do you think the internist will know how to treat your adrenals? really! I would love to know!  Gracia  I was lucky to find cardiologists that  1. listened when I said that I react badly to drugs and wanted to try natural ways  2. worked with me with the natural ways  3. rx'd magnesium right away     I've been afib free now since 1/27th, which I realize is not a tremendously long time, but  my heart feels stable, I stay away from my triggers (ALL of them) and I'm checked regularly by my cardios.     The only issue that remains is the hypo. I'm down to 1 grain of Armour, still have the low  TSH, still have hypo symptoms, have an appointment on Thursday with the internist.  Roni  <>Just because something  isn't seen doesn't mean it's  not there<>  ---  ------------------------------------------------------------------------------  No virus found in this incoming message.  Checked by AVG - www.avg.com  Version: 8.0.237 / Virus Database: 270.11.13/2001 - Release Date: 03/14/09 06:54:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2009 Report Share Posted March 16, 2009 Roni- I have Fibro, too and believe me if there was a cure I would have heard about it by now. All of the research that I have seen also points to the fact that there will have to be multiple cures as not every person may respond to a single " cure " . Nancie -- Re: Re: progress maybe? hypothyroidism Date: Sunday, March 15, 2009, 1:01 PM do you think the internist will know how to treat your adrenals? really! I would love to know! Gracia I was lucky to find cardiologists that 1. listened when I said that I react badly to drugs and wanted to try natural ways 2. worked with me with the natural ways 3. rx'd magnesium right away I've been afib free now since 1/27th, which I realize is not a tremendously long time, but my heart feels stable, I stay away from my triggers (ALL of them) and I'm checked regularly by my cardios. The only issue that remains is the hypo. I'm down to 1 grain of Armour, still have the low TSH, still have hypo symptoms, have an appointment on Thursday with the internist. Roni <>Just because something isn't seen doesn't mean it's not there<> --- ---------------------------------------------------------- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.0.237 / Virus Database: 270.11.13/2001 - Release Date: 03/14/09 06:54:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2009 Report Share Posted March 16, 2009 I think you might be missing the point. Armour plus other stuff treats the whole body--it's a more holistic approach. the fact that iodine/iodide did nothing for you suggests you had some cellular resistance to it. that's why I take the ATP cofactors and companion nutrients. but if you are happy with T4 only--OK! I do understand your point that ppl on Armour seem to take a lot of other stuff! but to me that other stuff is helpful. Gracia Support liver, support adrenals just to take Armour is just not going to happen with me. If it is that much stress on my body... I can do without. Right now I feel great. My only remain problem is T4 to T3 conversion when I work out. Well that and my calcium issue which I believe was caused by going hyper. What kills me is that people are told to bring ferritin levels up (often low in thyroid disease) to take Armour... then they give Armour all the credit for making them feel well. Similar improvements happened for me with the curing of nutritional deficiencies and levoxyl. Iodine did nothing for me in terms of how I feel. I'm glad I did get full saturation though. I've seen reversal of mild hypothryoidism with the dosing of iodine so it was worth a try. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2009 Report Share Posted March 16, 2009 that's goofy. I am not pissed off at your belief system. I understand that you believe you do not need cortisol or iodine. that does not mean I will stop saying that Armour/cortef/Iodoral cures fibro! b/c it may help someone else who is open to it. how many docs have mentioned these 3 things to you? you have never tried these things but you are sure that they " don't work " ? yes that deserves a lot of respect. Gracia Gracia, I have no quarrel with your regimine for yourself. If it works for you that is great and of course you should continue. All I'm saying is that we are not all the same. For example, I react to morphine backwards. It enhances pain in me instead of taking it away. That's just one reaction I have to something others can take with impunity. Please respect me as an intelligent person who knows how my body reacts. I do try things that seem reasonable for me, just not everything that is suggested. It's too bad that you are pissed off when someone tells you something truthful about themselves. Roni <>Just because something isn't seen doesn't mean it's not there<> From: Gracia <circe@...> Subject: Re: Re: progress maybe? hypothyroidism Date: Sunday, March 15, 2009, 12:59 PM actually sadly this is just what I am talking about! this is why some of us are really PISSED OFF. this is why Jefferies MD wrote Safe Uses of Cortisol. this is why there are support groups that advocate what I do and ppl get well. it really is not so complicated when you give your body what it needs. and I have repeatedly posted the sites that will give more info. and that's why I take cortef and iodine and Armour. gracia Gracia, no disrespect, but I belong to a support group with thousands of members, some of whom are nurses and doctors. Many of the people have had horrendous experiences with the afib, no one at all has suggested that it is an adrenal symptom, and it is not easy to treat. It is unpredictable, and can arise from different causes for different reasons. It is unpredicatable and can change into ventricular fibrillation, or other things. The heart can become enlarged, a patient can go into CHF, need valve replacement, catheter ablation, open heart surgery, and many times these procedures have to be done again and again. Please try to see the world for what it is, complicated. Not everything and everyone needs iodine and sex hormones, and not every condition is because of adrenal insufficiencies. Roni <>Just because something isn't seen doesn't mean it's not there<> ---------------------------------------------------------- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.0.237 / Virus Database: 270.11.13/2001 - Release Date: 03/14/09 06:54:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2009 Report Share Posted March 16, 2009 I was on iodine (50-100) for 6 months and took the urinalysis 3 times. I reached full saturation as defined by orthoiodosupplementation literature but felt nothing. I'm not saying thats bad or wasn't worth my time. We all need desperately to cure all our deficiencies. I believe it is you that has never taken the iodine urinalysis. Can you imagine if you have a symporter defect and haven't been absorbing all of that iodine you've been taking? Dr. Abrams can give you a work around. You really should test one day. I don't megadose anything without proper testing first. Also don't get me wrong... I would love to take armour for the T3 and convenience of it in one pill. I will probably try again if I don't get the T4/T3 conversion issue worked out. Right now it looks like high cortisol is my issue, thats why I was looking for Skipper on the other board. Horrible that he died so young. ________________________________ From: Gracia <circe@...> hypothyroidism Sent: Monday, March 16, 2009 8:30:27 AM Subject: Re: Re: progress maybe? I think you might be missing the point. Armour plus other stuff treats the whole body--it's a more holistic approach. the fact that iodine/iodide did nothing for you suggests you had some cellular resistance to it. that's why I take the ATP cofactors and companion nutrients. but if you are happy with T4 only--OK! I do understand your point that ppl on Armour seem to take a lot of other stuff! but to me that other stuff is helpful. Gracia Support liver, support adrenals just to take Armour is just not going to happen with me. If it is that much stress on my body... I can do without. Right now I feel great. My only remain problem is T4 to T3 conversion when I work out. Well that and my calcium issue which I believe was caused by going hyper. What kills me is that people are told to bring ferritin levels up (often low in thyroid disease) to take Armour... then they give Armour all the credit for making them feel well. Similar improvements happened for me with the curing of nutritional deficiencies and levoxyl. Iodine did nothing for me in terms of how I feel. I'm glad I did get full saturation though. I've seen reversal of mild hypothryoidism with the dosing of iodine so it was worth a try. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2009 Report Share Posted March 16, 2009 I wonder what they were selling on STTM? I did not know it was a commercial site. Gracia Your experience is exactly why I left that group as well. I am so tired of people trying to sell their products or services on discussion boards and then enforcing their opinion on others. I also like this forum as it is free from all that b.s. --- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.0.237 / Virus Database: 270.11.15/2004 - Release Date: 03/16/09 07:04:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2009 Report Share Posted March 16, 2009 The internet allows for degrees of anonymity with respect to personal speech, something I take advantage off. I haven't had the need to post in a way that would make it difficult for " authorities " to find me, but that can be done quite well also. As to " freedom " , I define that as the right, natural right, do what ever the heck I want with my person or personal property as long as I don't injure another or their property nor defraud them in any way (libertarian). We are a long way from that definition in the USA both in the social and economic arena. A local city took an old retired lady to court for not watering her own lawn enough in the middle of a drought and I got a warning that I hadn't landscaped my yard enough within the " legal " time frame - the daily fines could have taken the house ($7500 USD per day - I took well over 2 years to do what they said should be done in 1 - I didn't get fined but by law we could have been looking at 2.5 million in fines - that's not freedom although I don't think the law has been tested in the courts). We don't think much about eating pork or beef unless some religious bias raise it's irrational head but when I mention that I've eaten horse, that can get even some human carnivores upset. Ground horse meat by the way has very little fat so it doesn't stick together when cooked so it tasted like very low fat hamburger. It was purchased at a local butcher in Quebec Canada. I'll take well marbled red meat over lean any day of the week. Steve wrote: > How little we appreciate our freedoms. In some countries you could be > beheaded for a statement like that... > > > > PS: Yum, yum... > >> Posted by: " Steve " dudescholar4@... >> <mailto:dudescholar4@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20progress%20maybe%3F> >> dudescholar <dudescholar> >> >> >> Sat Mar 14, 2009 10:54 pm (PDT) >> >> >> >> wrote: >>> One person commented to >>> me off list that " ...a number of sacred cows were contentedly >>> sleeping... " there before I came along! [ggg] >> They say, Sacred Cows taste the best! -- Steve - dudescholar4@... Take World's Smallest Political Quiz at http://www.theadvocates.org/quiz.html " If a thousand old beliefs were ruined on our march to truth we must still march on. " --Stopford Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2009 Report Share Posted March 16, 2009 now I am getting a clue! on iodine group is on hypoT! I have many of Skipper's posts still saved. what happened to him I wonder? (( remember that Skipper and I disagreed about the high cortisol issue. boy that is weird that you felt nothing on iodine. that could mean that it never got into your tissues, and you peed out everything. I have always had amazing results with iodine but I am just now experiencing detox symptoms (after one year on 100mg). I think I was severely deficient. I am taking the ATP cofactors and companion nutrients, so I think I am doing all I can do to get the iodine into tissues. I would like to do the testing but I am actually afraid to go without iodine for a few days b4 the test. when I tried to take 12.5mg one day I was really nonfunctional. Gracia I was on iodine (50-100) for 6 months and took the urinalysis 3 times. I reached full saturation as defined by orthoiodosupplementation literature but felt nothing. I'm not saying thats bad or wasn't worth my time. We all need desperately to cure all our deficiencies. I believe it is you that has never taken the iodine urinalysis. Can you imagine if you have a symporter defect and haven't been absorbing all of that iodine you've been taking? Dr. Abrams can give you a work around. You really should test one day. I don't megadose anything without proper testing first. Also don't get me wrong... I would love to take armour for the T3 and convenience of it in one pill. I will probably try again if I don't get the T4/T3 conversion issue worked out. Right now it looks like high cortisol is my issue, thats why I was looking for Skipper on the other board. Horrible that he died so young. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.0.237 / Virus Database: 270.11.15/2004 - Release Date: 03/16/09 07:04:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2009 Report Share Posted March 16, 2009 ??? you are saying that peeps with " extra heart nodes " cannot be allowed to have cortef to support adrenals? gee I never heard that one. can they be allowed to have thyroid meds? gracia Actually some people have one or more _extra_ heart nodes that generate unneeded impulses. I shudder to think that anyone would be giving advice to others who thinks Cortisol would cure such a condition. . . > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.0.237 / Virus Database: 270.11.15/2004 - Release Date: 03/16/09 07:04:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2009 Report Share Posted March 16, 2009 I like this! I will take this to work where my coworkers think exactly the same! Gracia who is just aboout ready to beam up. Yeah; but you're talking about Earth. Gracia lives on a small and very strange planet in a galaxy far, far away! [ggg] There Iodine at 6600% of RDA cures everything. And if iodine doesn't cure it then 166% of the manufacturer's recommended max dose of Armour will cure it. And if Armour doesn't cure it BHRT will cure it. And if BHRT doesn't cure it then sex hormones will cure it. And if sex hormones don't cure it you can drink a quart or two of Guinness and you won't be any healthier but you won't give a $#!t...... This is clearly spelled out by Saint Brownstein in his Holy Scriptures published in " The Original Internist " , and if you follow his advice you will probably live to the ripe old age of three score and 10 on average. If you don't you'll probably [on average] be dead by the time you're 70. [ggggggggggg] . . ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.0.237 / Virus Database: 270.11.15/2004 - Release Date: 03/16/09 07:04:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2009 Report Share Posted March 16, 2009 p.s. BHRT IS sex homrones. Gracia Yeah; but you're talking about Earth. Gracia lives on a small and very strange planet in a galaxy far, far away! [ggg] There Iodine at 6600% of RDA cures everything. And if iodine doesn't cure it then 166% of the manufacturer's recommended max dose of Armour will cure it. And if Armour doesn't cure it BHRT will cure it. And if BHRT doesn't cure it then sex hormones will cure it. And if sex hormones don't cure it you can drink a quart or two of Guinness and you won't be any healthier but you won't give a $#!t...... This is clearly spelled out by Saint Brownstein in his Holy Scriptures published in " The Original Internist " , and if you follow his advice you will probably live to the ripe old age of three score and 10 on average. If you don't you'll probably [on average] be dead by the time you're 70. [ggggggggggg] . . > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.0.237 / Virus Database: 270.11.15/2004 - Release Date: 03/16/09 07:04:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2009 Report Share Posted March 16, 2009 Well said Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry Re: progress maybe? There's quite a difference in receiving or being threatened with a fine [even a massive one] and having all your neighbors toss you to the ground and cut off your head. I'll have to agree that we're far from totally free in the US, and it seems the confines upon what should be acceptable behavior become greater every day. We all have our cultural biases. I was born in rural Mississippi over 68 years ago and raised in a frankly racist and bigoted culture. I won't ever outgrow all of that, but I've come a long way. .. .. > > Posted by: " Steve " dudescholar4@... > <mailto:dudescholar4@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20progress%20maybe%3F> > dudescholar <dudescholar> > > > Mon Mar 16, 2009 3:24 pm (PDT) > > The internet allows for degrees of anonymity with respect to personal > speech, something I take advantage off. I haven't had the need to post > in a way that would make it difficult for " authorities " to find me, but > that can be done quite well also. > > As to " freedom " , I define that as the right, natural right, do what ever > the heck I want with my person or personal property as long as I don't > injure another or their property nor defraud them in any way > (libertarian) > . We are a long way from that definition in the USA both > in the social and economic arena. > > A local city took an old retired lady to court for not watering her own > lawn enough in the middle of a drought and I got a warning that I hadn't > landscaped my yard enough within the " legal " time frame - the daily > fines could have taken the house ($7500 USD per day - I took well over 2 > years to do what they said should be done in 1 - I didn't get fined but > by law we could have been looking at 2.5 million in fines - that's not > freedom although I don't think the law has been tested in the courts). > > We don't think much about eating pork or beef unless some religious bias > raise it's irrational head but when I mention that I've eaten horse, > that can get even some human carnivores upset. Ground horse meat by the > way has very little fat so it doesn't stick together when cooked so it > tasted like very low fat hamburger. It was purchased at a local butcher > in Quebec Canada. I'll take well marbled red meat over lean any day of > the week. > > Steve > > wrote: > > How little we appreciate our freedoms. In some countries you could be > > beheaded for a statement like that... > > > > > > > > PS: Yum, yum... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2009 Report Share Posted March 16, 2009 The more I think of it the more I am convinced that something was up with Skippers heart. He never supplemented magnesium even during Iodine dosing. He said it made him sick. He even said that he took a epsom salt bath once and he became fatigued and was ill for days. That indicates that he more than likely had a potassium deficiency or some serious heart issue. If one is mag deficient for long enough... potassium is lost. " Magnesium deficiency eventually leads to a loss of potassium because of its role in maintaining the enzyme responsible for pumping potassium into the cell. A magnesium deficiency occurring in a pre-existing potassium deficiency increases the potassium loss even more. " http://www.orthomolecular.org/ library/jom/1998/articles/1998-v13n04-p215.shtml He stopped thyroid meds if you remember. That will lower magnesium more. I wish I would have known more then about the magnesium/potassium link and how fatigued potassium deficiency will make you...I would have pushed him harder to take the RBC analysis for magnesium. He sure liked to argue with me. I guess well never know why he died at such an young age. What a tragedy... ________________________________ From: Gracia <circe@...> hypothyroidism Sent: Monday, March 16, 2009 3:49:36 PM Subject: Re: Re: progress maybe? now I am getting a clue! on iodine group is on hypoT! I have many of Skipper's posts still saved. what happened to him I wonder? (( remember that Skipper and I disagreed about the high cortisol issue. boy that is weird that you felt nothing on iodine. that could mean that it never got into your tissues, and you peed out everything. I have always had amazing results with iodine but I am just now experiencing detox symptoms (after one year on 100mg). I think I was severely deficient. I am taking the ATP cofactors and companion nutrients, so I think I am doing all I can do to get the iodine into tissues. I would like to do the testing but I am actually afraid to go without iodine for a few days b4 the test. when I tried to take 12.5mg one day I was really nonfunctional. Gracia I was on iodine (50-100) for 6 months and took the urinalysis 3 times. I reached full saturation as defined by orthoiodosupplement ation literature but felt nothing. I'm not saying thats bad or wasn't worth my time. We all need desperately to cure all our deficiencies. I believe it is you that has never taken the iodine urinalysis. Can you imagine if you have a symporter defect and haven't been absorbing all of that iodine you've been taking? Dr. Abrams can give you a work around. You really should test one day. I don't megadose anything without proper testing first. Also don't get me wrong... I would love to take armour for the T3 and convenience of it in one pill. I will probably try again if I don't get the T4/T3 conversion issue worked out. Right now it looks like high cortisol is my issue, thats why I was looking for Skipper on the other board. Horrible that he died so young. ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- - No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.0.237 / Virus Database: 270.11.15/2004 - Release Date: 03/16/09 07:04:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2009 Report Share Posted March 16, 2009 Everyone has their passion, but trying to get every one else to follow your passion doesn't always work. Roni <>Just because something isn't seen doesn't mean it's not there<> > > From: Gracia <circe@... <mailto:circe%40fairpoint.net>> > Subject: Re: Re: progress maybe? > hypothyroidism > <mailto:hypothyroidism%40> > Date: Saturday, March 14, 2009, 9:32 PM > >   A-fib is an adrenal symptom. fibro is very easy to treat and no one > needs to suffer from it.   >   Gracia > >   I personally don't have an issue with taking more Armour. I have had > to Lower my Armour >   from 2-1/2 grains to 1 grain because the TSH keeps coming up below > range. It was <.01, and I was experiencing atrial fibrillation. I > didn't want to, but finally started lowering my dose. The afib stopped > on January 27th, which is wonderful. However, I feel like crap. I have > fibromyalgia since 1998, but never so bad as now. I hurt all over my > body very badly, and I'm exhausted. I don't do well on medications. I > either react right away or after a few weeks, so I stay away from > medications as much as I can. When I can't take the pain I take 1/2 of > a Soma, which doesn't do more than take the edge off of the pain. A > whole pill messes up my head and makes me feel awful. I'm a senior and > I live alone, and I can't afford to be zonked out on pills. I'm > allergic to narcotics to they're out all together. >  >   People are complicated mechanisms, and a simple admonition to take > more or less of >   something may seem correct if one doesn't know the whole story. >  > >  >   Roni ------------------------------------ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2009 Report Share Posted March 16, 2009 It's a very scary and upsetting thing, and one never knows when an attack will come on, and stress is one of the triggers along with lots of others, some of which are medications. I have to check everything I take before I take it to make sure I won't give myself an attack. Roni <>Just because something isn't seen doesn't mean it's not there<> From: <res075oh@...> Subject: Re: progress maybe? hypothyroidism Date: Monday, March 16, 2009, 3:45 PM Actually some people have one or more _extra_ heart nodes that generate unneeded impulses. I shudder to think that anyone would be giving advice to others who thinks Cortisol would cure such a condition. .. .. > >     Posted by: " Gracia " circe@... >     <mailto:circe@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20progress%20maybe%3F> >      graciabee <graciabee> > > >      Sun Mar 15, 2009 12:59 pm (PDT) > > > actually sadly this is just what I am talking about! this is why some > of us are really PISSED OFF. this is why Jefferies MD wrote Safe Uses > of Cortisol. this is why there are support groups that advocate what I > do and ppl get well. it really is not so complicated when you give > your body what it needs. and I have repeatedly posted the sites that > will give more info. > and that's why I take cortef and iodine and Armour. > gracia > > Gracia, no disrespect, but I belong to a support group with thousands > of members, some of whom are nurses and doctors. Many of the people > have had horrendous experiences with the afib, no one at all has > suggested that it is an adrenal symptom, and it is not easy to treat. > It is unpredictable, and can arise from different causes for different > reasons. It is unpredicatable and can change into ventricular > fibrillation, or other things. The heart can become enlarged, a > patient can go into CHF, need valve replacement, catheter ablation, > open heart surgery, and many times these procedures have to be done > again and again. > Please try to see the world for what it is, complicated. Not > everything and everyone needs > iodine and sex hormones, and not every condition is because of adrenal > insufficiencies. > > Roni ------------------------------------ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2009 Report Share Posted March 16, 2009 Yes afibbers can have thyroid meds, but they have to be VERY carefully controlled, because, as happened with me, my usual dosage of 2-1/2 grains put me time and time again into afib. I have been slowly reducing it as per the doctor, and it has finally stopped. I am now at 1 grain, and no, I don't feel terrific. However, I don't want to risk more afib. I'm sure you understand, since you are concerned about stopping the cortef to take a test. Roni <>Just because something isn't seen doesn't mean it's not there<> From: Gracia <circe@...> Subject: Re: Re: progress maybe? hypothyroidism Date: Monday, March 16, 2009, 3:51 PM  ??? you are saying that peeps with " extra heart nodes " cannot be allowed to have cortef to support adrenals?   gee I never heard that one. can they be allowed to have thyroid meds?  gracia  Actually some people have one or more _extra_ heart nodes that generate  unneeded impulses. I shudder to think that anyone would be giving  advice to others who thinks Cortisol would cure such a condition.   .  .  >  >  ------------------------------------------------------------------------------  No virus found in this incoming message.  Checked by AVG - www.avg.com  Version: 8.0.237 / Virus Database: 270.11.15/2004 - Release Date: 03/16/09 07:04:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2009 Report Share Posted March 16, 2009 The very fact of having a society, any society places restrictions on our behavior and speech. It's just that some are more restrictive than others. Roni <>Just because something isn't seen doesn't mean it's not there<> > > How little we appreciate our freedoms. In some countries you could be > > beheaded for a statement like that... > > > > > > > > PS: Yum, yum... ------------------------------------ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.