Hello there, y'all

[Guest guest]

,

You wrote:

> Just because levothyroxine is " the third most prescribed drug " it doesn't

> mean that it is in the majority of cases superior to T3 and T4 meds. It

> simply

> means that doctors are for some reason given incentive to prescribe it more

> (such as receiving gifts, money, etc.).

Think numbers. Out of the tens of MILLIONS of people on synthetic T4,

how many do you think would be complaining if it was failing to work as

miserably as claimed on this list?

Consider too all the clinical trials for which only a tiny percentage

have reported any problems at all. Most of those studies were conducted

by pharmaceutical companies hoping to show that THEIR brand was at least

equal, if not superior, to the other brands of synthetic T4. The big

objection to Boots' tactics was that they attempted to suppress the fact

that other brands of synthetic T4 were equally effective to Synthroid.

In none of these trials, do you find hordes of people complaining of

untreated symptoms. There is a tiny fraction. They are there, but a very

small minority.

Chuck

[Guest guest]

Chuck_

Yes I understand the numbers of how many people are on T4-only meds. And I

think that LOTS of people are complaining ... I complained to my endo. and all

she said is " well, it isn't because of your thyroid " and that is MANY people's

experience as well. And those studies that you are talking about were

conducted by PHARMACEUTICAL COMPANIES trying to prove something. When you first

start

out on T4-only meds, sure you feel a bit better ... did all of these people

try T4/T3 meds and compare the two treatments? I highly doubt it.

,

You wrote:

> Just because levothyroxine is " the third most prescribed drug " it doesn't

> mean that it is in the majority of cases superior to T3 and T4 meds. It

> simply

> means that doctors are for some reason given incentive to prescribe it more

> (such as receiving gifts, money, etc.).

Think numbers. Out of the tens of MILLIONS of people on synthetic T4,

how many do you think would be complaining if it was failing to work as

miserably as claimed on this list?

Consider too all the clinical trials for which only a tiny percentage

have reported any problems at all. Most of those studies were conducted

by pharmaceutical companies hoping to show that THEIR brand was at least

equal, if not superior, to the other brands of synthetic T4. The big

objection to Boots' tactics was that they attempted to suppress the fact

that other brands of synthetic T4 were equally effective to Synthroid.

In none of these trials, do you find hordes of people complaining of

untreated symptoms. There is a tiny fraction. They are there, but a very

small minority.

Chuck

************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.

[Guest guest]

Dear you wrote: Chuck-

Just because levothyroxine is " the third most prescribed drug " it doesn't

mean that it is in the majority of cases superior to T3 and T4 meds. It simply

means that doctors are for some reason given incentive to prescribe it more

(such as receiving gifts, money, etc.).

Dear ,

That's one interpretation. Some others are that Synthyroid never did go

through FDA testing and was grandfathered into the current drug system. Another

is

that the " research lab " which puts out the articles on Synthroid is a

subsidiary of the company which makes Synthryoid, making it next to impossible

for

anything other than what the parent company wants to be published. Doctors and

others on this list think those publications are gospel, instead of the

propaganda they really are.

I always seem to see parallels to these situations in my everyday life. My

Toastmaster's group had a visitation by our area Governor a week ago. At the

meeting (which is 7:00 p.m. to 9:00 p.m) she (dressed in sweats which were

soiled

all down the front, from what looked like eating a sloppy joe) announced that

we were to register our club's officers on line by the end of that day, and

we wouldn't be officially installed until she installed us. We've never had any

Governor ever install the officers in the five years I've been attending and

the officers are elected twice a year. I asked her, " How did you get to be my

Governor? I don't remember voting for any Governor. " To which she answered, " I

was appointed this areas Governor, by the higher ups " . I asked her how she

got her appointment, to which she answered, " They knew me already because they

are current members of my Toastmaster's club " . So it seems, a professional

speaking group with international clubs has been subject to blatant cronyism. We

told her, if she wanted us to submit our officers, she would need to inform us

with at least two weeks notice. Her response was " Your club won't qualify for

any ribbons this session then " . My club is the oldest club in my town, our

banner was so cluttered with those darn ribbons that we decided long ago, just

to

store the things and hang a clean banner.... LOL I love my Toastmaster's

club! We all had a great chuckle over the threat.

************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.

[Guest guest]

[snip]

>

> Think numbers. Out of the tens of MILLIONS of people on synthetic T4,

> how many do you think would be complaining if it was failing to work

as

> miserably as claimed on this list?

Tens of millions? Oh that's just tragic. And on t4? Ugh, that makes me

cry. But on the bright side, someone's making a whole passle of cash

off of all that...

If one complains but is not heard by their doctor, does that not count?

I've only been on these thyroid discussion groups for about 4 years,

but I have yet to hear of the majority of members doing well on T4.

Quite the opposite, in fact.

Sam :-o

[Guest guest]

-

Thanks for the e-mail :-)

Dear you wrote: Chuck-

Just because levothyroxine is " the third most prescribed drug " it doesn't

mean that it is in the majority of cases superior to T3 and T4 meds. It

simply

means that doctors are for some reason given incentive to prescribe it more

(such as receiving gifts, money, etc.).

Dear ,

That's one interpretation. Some others are that Synthyroid never did go

through FDA testing and was grandfathered into the current drug system.

Another is

that the " research lab " which puts out the articles on Synthroid is a

subsidiary of the company which makes Synthryoid, making it next to

impossible for

anything other than what the parent company wants to be published. Doctors

and

others on this list think those publications are gospel, instead of the

propaganda they really are.

I always seem to see parallels to these situations in my everyday life. My

Toastmaster'Toastmaster'<WBR>s group had a visitation by our area Governor a

meeting (which is 7:00 p.m. to 9:00 p.m) she (dressed in sweats which were

soiled

all down the front, from what looked like eating a sloppy joe) announced that

we were to register our club's officers on line by the end of that day, and

we wouldn't be officially installed until she installed us. We've never had

any

Governor ever install the officers in the five years I've been attending and

the officers are elected twice a year. I asked her, " How did you get to be my

Governor? I don't remember voting for any Governor. " To which she answered,

" I

was appointed this areas Governor, by the higher ups " . I asked her how she

got her appointment, to which she answered, " They knew me already because

they

are current members of my Toastmaster'are current members of my Toastmaster

speaking group with international clubs has been subject to blatant cronyism.

We

told her, if she wanted us to submit our officers, she would need to inform

us

with at least two weeks notice. Her response was " Your club won't qualify for

any ribbons this session then " . My club is the oldest club in my town, our

banner was so cluttered with those darn ribbons that we decided long ago,

just to

store the things and hang a clean banner.... LOL I love my Toastmaster'st

club! We all had a great chuckle over the threat.

******************************************<WBR>*********<W_http://www.aol.http

_ (http://www.aol.com./)

[Guest guest]

Your statement is correct. However, you seem to have overlooked Chuck's

statement that the pharmaceutical companies were often attempting to

prove that their product was superior to, or at least as effective as

Synthroid. And after spending untold thousands or millions of dollars

on development and tests they failed.

> And those studies that you are talking about were

> conducted by PHARMACEUTICAL COMPANIES trying to prove something.

[Guest guest]

Sam, is it not obvious that lists such as this would tend to be self

selecting for people who are in that fraction of the population who does

not respond well to the first thing their doctor is likely to prescribe?

I personally take only Synthroid and AFAIK have no problems. But that

is probably irrelevant, as I had no symptoms other than elevated TSH

without taking Synthroid.

PS: Sorry, no gold coins yet! [ggg]

> I've only been on these thyroid discussion groups for about 4 years,

> but I have yet to hear of the majority of members doing well on T4.

> Quite the opposite, in fact.

>

> Sam :-o

[Guest guest]

-

Actually I didn't overlook that, but thanks for your input.

Your statement is correct. However, you seem to have overlooked Chuck's

statement that the pharmaceutical companies were often attempting to

prove that their product was superior to, or at least as effective as

Synthroid. And after spending untold thousands or millions of dollars

on development and tests they failed.

> And those studies that you are talking about were

> conducted by PHARMACEUTICAL COMPANIES trying to prove something.

************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.

[Guest guest]

Gracia-

I totally agree with what you just said. Perhaps a bit of proof of this is

how many people end up joining this list who say things like " I wasted half my

life because of taking Synthroid " , " I wasted 7 years taking T4-only

medications " , etc.

I think you are assuming that all the peeps on $inthroid/not on these lists

are happy with their treatment. I don't think this is true.

Gracia

Sam, is it not obvious that lists such as this would tend to be self

selecting for people who are in that fraction of the population who does

not respond well to the first thing their doctor is likely to prescribe?

I personally take only Synthroid and AFAIK have no problems. But that

is probably irrelevant, as I had no symptoms other than elevated TSH

without taking Synthroid.

PS: Sorry, no gold coins yet! [ggg]

> I've only been on these thyroid discussion groups for about 4 years,

> but I have yet to hear of the majority of members doing well on T4.

> Quite the opposite, in fact.

>

> Sam :-o

[Guest guest]

Chuck-

Okay, okay, okay in regards to studies having a prliminary thing and then

going on to independent contractors I totally believe you, you're right. You're

right, I'm wrong, you're big, I'm small (just a saying :-) It's a good thing

that they do that. However, I believe that because thyroid care is still so

terrible, reference ranges are still changing, and many many other reasons, I

believe that these studies are not quite " right-on " . I also believe that

$ynthroid is so popular because of reasons we have all discussed A LOT lately

($$$

incentive for MD's). Maybe we could all do something to inspire a remarkable

T4-T3 study and then we'd have some closure here in groups :-) Thanks for

your input Chuck!

,

You wrote:

>

> ... And those studies that you are talking about were

> conducted by PHARMACEUTICAL COMPANIES trying to prove something...

That is just not correct. Companies only perform their own studies as a

preliminary step to _justify_ larger clinical trials required to prove a

medication safe and effective or to determine diagnostic and treatment

parameters. The larger studies to which I refer are FUNDED, at least in

part, by pharmaceutical companies, but they are CONDUCTED by independent

contractors, often hundreds of private practices and clinics, under

federal supervision according to strict protocols. At most, employees of

the company coordinate activities or compile reports from those actually

conducting the study.

Not that improprieties do not occur. They certainly do, but when it

happens, the result is a scandal, an exception. The biggest single

incident involving Synthroid, happened when Boots Pharmaceuticals tried

to suppress evidence that showed other brands to be as equally effective

as Synthroid. However, the obvious underlying fact in this and other

studies was that synthetic T4 from many manufacturers was found to be

quite effective for all but a tiny percentage of the population treated.

Chuck

************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.

[Guest guest]

It seems as though we just did, at least a bit :-)

No; I don't assume everyone on Synthroid and not here is happy. I do

assume that they are happy enough that they have not been sufficiently

motivated to find their way here. I further assume that if a large

percentage of all Synthroid users were to suddenly become unhappy we

would soon see a great influx of them here.

>

> Re: Hello there, y'all

>

<_http://groups.http://grohttp://groups.<Whttp://groupshttp://grouhttp://groups.\

<Whttp://groups.<Whttp://groups.<Whttp://groups.<Whttp://groups.<Whttp://g

roups.<Whttp://groups.<Whttp://groups.<Whttp://grouh_

(hypothyroidism/message/29266;_ylc=X3oDMTJxdmIyMTR\

jBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdyc

ElkAzE0NTY2NARncnBzcElkAzE3MDkyNTEwODIEbXNnSWQDMjkyNjYEc2VjA2Rtc2cEc2xrA3Ztc2c

Ec3RpbWUDMTE4MzczOTQ2Mg--) >

>

>

>

> Posted by: " Gracia " _mailto:circe%40gwi.net_ (mailto:circe@...)

> <mailto:_mailto:circe%40gwi.net_ (mailto:circe@...)

?Subject=%20Re%?Subject=%2?Subject=%2?Subject=>

> graciabee <_http://profiles.http://prohttp://pr_

(graciabee) >

>

>

> Fri Jul 6, 2007 8:54 am (PST)

>

>

> I think you are assuming that all the peeps on $inthroid/not on these

> lists are happy with their treatment. I don't think this is true.

> Gracia

>

> Sam, is it not obvious that lists such as this would tend to be self

> selecting for people who are in that fraction of the population who does

> not respond well to the first thing their doctor is likely to prescribe?

>

> I personally take only Synthroid and AFAIK have no problems. But that

> is probably irrelevant, as I had no symptoms other than elevated TSH

> without taking Synthroid.

>

>

>

> PS: Sorry, no gold coins yet! [ggg]

>

> > I've only been on these thyroid discussion groups for about 4 years,

> > but I have yet to hear of the majority of members doing well on T4.

> > Quite the opposite, in fact.

> >

> > Sam :-o

************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.

[Guest guest]

Oh my, I wonder exactly who they've been surveying. I betcha they'd

get an earful if they ran a survey in the internet thyroid groups.

WooooEEEEE! Yes, discussion groups absolutely do attract those whoa

re having problems with it all...tens of thousands...Ei Yi Yi PHEW!

Well, I was wondering why you are here, but it's likely for the same

reason I am here, and many others are here. For support, to offer

helpful advice, and for maybe a little entertainment, or for a

variety of other reasons. And altho I don't agree with some of the

things you say, and you don't agree with some of the things I say, I

actually enjoy the discussions. I do like this group a bit more than

the one I bailed from because of the discussions.

Sam

(thyroid-less, Iodized, and Armour-ized)

k9gang@...

http://www.optimox.com/pics/Iodine/opt_Research_I.shtml

http://www.optimox.com/pics/Iodine/IOD-09/IOD_09.htm

http://www.optimox.com/pics/Iodine/IOD-02/IOD_02.htm

http://www.laurapower.com/iodinedeficiency.htm

http://www.vrp.com/art/1860.asp

http://www.quackcenter.com/ideficiency.html

http://www.lewrockwell.com/miller/miller20.html

http://www.iodine4health.com

http://www.jcrows.com/iodine.html

http://www.optimox.com/pics/Iodine/loadTest.htm

http://www.breastcancerchoices.org/loading.html

http://www.helpmythyroid.com/IOD4.htm

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0FDL/is_1_13/ai_n17212623

http://www.altsupportthyroid.org/dt.php

http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com

http://www.bellaonline.com/articles/art40118.asp

http://www.type2hypothyroidism.com/Type1VsType2.html

BHRT

http://www.medaus.com/p/Three-Rules-for-Using-BHRT___200,965.html

http://www.thecompounder.com/saliva-vs-serum.pdf

> >

> > If one complains but is not heard by their doctor, does that not

count?

> >

>

> An important component of clinical studies is the survey of patient

> satisfaction, where they ask whether the symptoms are gone, whether

they

> suffer any side effects, and whether the physician was cooperative

and

> got the full story.

>

> Again, discussion lists tend to attract people who have problems

with

> what they were prescribed and are looking for help and good

> alternatives. They self select and very preferentially. The vast

> majority of hypoT people have better things to do. God only knows

why I

> am here.

>

> Chuck

>

[Guest guest]

,

with all due respect, how do you know that you couldn't feel 100

times better on armour than on T4? And what in the world is AFAIK (a

fake?)?

>

> Sam, is it not obvious that lists such as this would tend to be self

> selecting for people who are in that fraction of the population who

does

> not respond well to the first thing their doctor is likely to prescribe?

>

> I personally take only Synthroid and AFAIK have no problems. But that

> is probably irrelevant, as I had no symptoms other than elevated TSH

> without taking Synthroid.

>

>

>

> PS: Sorry, no gold coins yet! [ggg]

>

> > I've only been on these thyroid discussion groups for about 4 years,

> > but I have yet to hear of the majority of members doing well on T4.

> > Quite the opposite, in fact.

> >

> > Sam :-o

>

[Guest guest]

It took me a while to figure out what that meant as well.

A few years ago I finally figured out, after an interesting discussion

with an Englishman who hunted with falcons and sighthounds in the

middle east, that AFAIK means " as far as I know " ...

By the way, I have Basenjis and Greyhounds.

Sam :-D

>

> ,

> with all due respect, how do you know that you couldn't feel 100

> times better on armour than on T4? And what in the world is AFAIK (a

> fake?)?

[Guest guest]

Sam,

You wrote:

>

> Oh my, I wonder exactly who they've been surveying....

They survey the volunteer subjects of the clinical trials, some of whom

got placebos or much lower doses. That is one of the joys of

volunteering. You get " free " medication which may or may not have a hope

of working, and then you get to fill out forms about it.

When you consider the total number of hypoTs being treated, the fraction

for whom T4 did not work well in trials through the years would still be

expected to be a whole lot of people, many more than are on these

discussion lists. IIRC, we are up to 2,300 something on this list alone.

I quite agree that the system encourages playing the odds, and doctors

don't treat the exceptions very well, either in the research performed

or the clinical setting. OTOH, high dose iodine is sufficiently unusual,

and counter to the literature on its toxicity and risks, that I would be

reluctant to recommend it to everyone just because it seems to work for you.

Chuck

[Guest guest]

No; I don't assume everyone on Synthroid and not here is happy. I do

assume that they are happy enough that they have not been sufficiently

motivated to find their way here. I further assume that if a large

percentage of all Synthroid users were to suddenly become unhappy we

would soon see a great influx of them here.

>

> Re: Hello there, y'all

>

<hypothyroidism/message/29266;_ylc=X3oDMTJxdmIyMTR\

jBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzE0NTY2NARncnBzcElkAzE3MDkyNTEwODIEbXNnSWQDMjkyNjYEc2V\

jA2Rtc2cEc2xrA3Ztc2cEc3RpbWUDMTE4MzczOTQ2Mg-->

>

>

>

> Posted by: " Gracia " circe@...

> <mailto:circe@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20Hello%20there%2C%20y%27all>

> graciabee <graciabee>

>

>

> Fri Jul 6, 2007 8:54 am (PST)

>

>

> I think you are assuming that all the peeps on $inthroid/not on these

> lists are happy with their treatment. I don't think this is true.

> Gracia

>

> Sam, is it not obvious that lists such as this would tend to be self

> selecting for people who are in that fraction of the population who does

> not respond well to the first thing their doctor is likely to prescribe?

>

> I personally take only Synthroid and AFAIK have no problems. But that

> is probably irrelevant, as I had no symptoms other than elevated TSH

> without taking Synthroid.

>

>

>

> PS: Sorry, no gold coins yet! [ggg]

>

> > I've only been on these thyroid discussion groups for about 4 years,

> > but I have yet to hear of the majority of members doing well on T4.

> > Quite the opposite, in fact.

> >

> > Sam :-o

[Guest guest]

,

You wrote:

>

>

> ... these studies are not quite " right-on " ...

No one study is ever perfect.

> ...Maybe we could all do something to inspire a

> remarkable T4-T3 study and then we'd have some closure here in groups :-)

Which studies get done is decided mostly by peer review.

However, there have been a number of recent studies on just this

question. One of the results is that T3 still doesn't do much for the

vast majority that don't need it, and, one that really surprised me, is

that total T4 is more important for emotional health, for feeling

" well, " than FT3.

The only recent study I know about on iodine is the Symbollon study on

breast pain.

Chuck

[Guest guest]

I have to tell you, that these so called funded

clinical studies are not all that they are cracked up

to be. My son worked for a company and read documents

that told about the fact that when people did not do

well on their trial, they were eliminated from the

trial. Many years ago I briefly worked for one of the

big tobacco companies, and read documents that told

about people getting sick from cigarettes, and these

documents were shredded.

Statistics don't lie, people do.

Roni

--- Chuck B <gumboyaya@...> wrote:

> ,

>

> You wrote:

> >

> > ... And those studies that you are talking about

> were

> > conducted by PHARMACEUTICAL COMPANIES trying to

> prove something....

>

> That is just not correct. Companies only perform

> their own studies as a

> preliminary step to _justify_ larger clinical trials

> required to prove a

> medication safe and effective or to determine

> diagnostic and treatment

> parameters. The larger studies to which I refer are

> FUNDED, at least in

> part, by pharmaceutical companies, but they are

> CONDUCTED by independent

> contractors, often hundreds of private practices and

> clinics, under

> federal supervision according to strict protocols.

> At most, employees of

> the company coordinate activities or compile reports

> from those actually

> conducting the study.

>

> Not that improprieties do not occur. They certainly

> do, but when it

> happens, the result is a scandal, an exception. The

> biggest single

> incident involving Synthroid, happened when Boots

> Pharmaceuticals tried

> to suppress evidence that showed other brands to be

> as equally effective

> as Synthroid. However, the obvious underlying fact

> in this and other

> studies was that synthetic T4 from many

> manufacturers was found to be

> quite effective for all but a tiny percentage of the

> population treated.

>

> Chuck

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I think there is yet another element. There are some

people who are on Synthroid, and don't feel well, but

haven't a clue that it's because of improper or

insuffiecient medication. They are told all kinds of

other things, they need ssris, they need sleep

medication, they need pain medication, etc. Not

everyone is medically educated, (through school or

self) and would have no idea that they should be doing

something else, that there are groups like this, that

their medication is wrong, or that their doctor is

incompetent etc. The only reason I knew that the

Synthroid was causing me problems, and not something

else is because I was on a T3,T4 combo med before I

was put on Synthroid.

Roni

--- bear339@... wrote:

> Gracia-

> I totally agree with what you just said. Perhaps a

> bit of proof of this is

> how many people end up joining this list who say

> things like " I wasted half my

> life because of taking Synthroid " , " I wasted 7 years

> taking T4-only

> medications " , etc.

>

>

>

> I think you are assuming that all the peeps on

> $inthroid/not on these lists

> are happy with their treatment. I don't think this

> is true.

> Gracia

>

> Sam, is it not obvious that lists such as this would

> tend to be self

> selecting for people who are in that fraction of the

> population who does

> not respond well to the first thing their doctor is

> likely to prescribe?

>

> I personally take only Synthroid and AFAIK have no

> problems. But that

> is probably irrelevant, as I had no symptoms other

> than elevated TSH

> without taking Synthroid.

>

>

>

> PS: Sorry, no gold coins yet! [ggg]

>

> > I've only been on these thyroid discussion groups

> for about 4 years,

> > but I have yet to hear of the majority of members

> doing well on T4.

> > Quite the opposite, in fact.

> >

> > Sam :-o

>

> [Non-text portions of this message have been

> removed]

>

>

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[Guest guest]

You probably love the abuse! [ggg]

>

> Re: Hello there, y'all

>

<hypothyroidism/message/29273;_ylc=X3oDMTJxYzZyaDd\

lBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzE0NTY2NARncnBzcElkAzE3MDkyNTEwODIEbXNnSWQDMjkyNzMEc2V\

jA2Rtc2cEc2xrA3Ztc2cEc3RpbWUDMTE4Mzc1NTA0Mw-->

>

>

>

> Posted by: " Chuck B " gumboyaya@...

> <mailto:gumboyaya@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20Hello%20there%2C%20y%27all>

> gumbo482001 <gumbo482001>

>

>

> Fri Jul 6, 2007 9:32 am (PST)

>

> Sam,

>

> You wrote:

> >

> > If one complains but is not heard by their doctor, does that not count?

> >

>

> An important component of clinical studies is the survey of patient

> satisfaction, where they ask whether the symptoms are gone, whether they

> suffer any side effects, and whether the physician was cooperative and

> got the full story.

>

> Again, discussion lists tend to attract people who have problems with

> what they were prescribed and are looking for help and good

> alternatives. They self select and very preferentially. The vast

> majority of hypoT people have better things to do. God only knows why I

> am here.

>

> Chuck

[Guest guest]

AFAIK = As Far As I Know.

I have no symptoms of illness whatsoever. Well, maybe hay fever. I

could stand to lose 10 or 20 pounds of belly [at 187]; but then I went

out tonight and ate two plates of shrimp and four ribs, one plate of

watermelon, and one large bowl of chocolate ice cream with peanuts and

chocolate syrup. Oh, also two egg rolls, onions and peppers, and broccoli.

I'll probably have another snack before I go to bed. I'm 66 years old.

I do take several pills [besides Synthroid], including baby aspirin and

Melatonin. Lipitor for Cholesterol [now at 171], verapamil, and Allegra

for allergies. I take them all, including the Synthroid, at one time,

and don't worry about any interaction; either with food or each other.

It would have to have more kick than cocaine to make me feel much better.

Why am I here? I must like abuse too! [ggg] Actually, when I have a

health concern I try to learn a lot about it, and this site seems a good

place. Of course it's a wheat/chafe thing...

>

> Re: Hello there, y'all

>

<hypothyroidism/message/29287;_ylc=X3oDMTJxYzBkcnE\

xBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzE0NTY2NARncnBzcElkAzE3MDkyNTEwODIEbXNnSWQDMjkyODcEc2V\

jA2Rtc2cEc2xrA3Ztc2cEc3RpbWUDMTE4Mzc1NTA0Mw-->

>

>

>

> Posted by: " sweetenloe1 " sweetnwright@...

>

<mailto:sweetnwright@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20Hello%20there%2C%20y%27all>

> sweetenloe1 <sweetenloe1>

>

>

> Fri Jul 6, 2007 1:02 pm (PST)

>

> ,

> with all due respect, how do you know that you couldn't feel 100

> times better on armour than on T4? And what in the world is AFAIK (a

> fake?)?

>

>

> >

> > Sam, is it not obvious that lists such as this would tend to be self

> > selecting for people who are in that fraction of the population who

> does

> > not respond well to the first thing their doctor is likely to prescribe?

> >

> > I personally take only Synthroid and AFAIK have no problems. But that

> > is probably irrelevant, as I had no symptoms other than elevated TSH

> > without taking Synthroid.

> >

> >

> >

> > PS: Sorry, no gold coins yet! [ggg]

> >

> > > I've only been on these thyroid discussion groups for about 4 years,

> > > but I have yet to hear of the majority of members doing well on T4.

> > > Quite the opposite, in fact.

> > >

> > > Sam :-o

[Guest guest]

Anyway, I see I have an error in my reply. I believe in fact the other

producers of " generic " Synthroid were in fact able to prove equal

efficacy with Synthroid in many cases.

>

> Re: Hello there, y'all

>

<hypothyroidism/message/29296;_ylc=X3oDMTJxYW1uaWg\

zBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzE0NTY2NARncnBzcElkAzE3MDkyNTEwODIEbXNnSWQDMjkyOTYEc2V\

jA2Rtc2cEc2xrA3Ztc2cEc3RpbWUDMTE4Mzc1NTA0Mw-->

>

>

>

> Posted by: " bear339@... " bear339@...

>

<mailto:bear339@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20Hello%20there%2C%20y%27all>

> ebradi3951 <ebradi3951>

>

>

> Fri Jul 6, 2007 1:44 pm (PST)

>

>

>

> -

> Actually I didn't overlook that, but thanks for your input.

>

> Your statement is correct. However, you seem to have overlooked Chuck's

> statement that the pharmaceutical companies were often attempting to

> prove that their product was superior to, or at least as effective as

> Synthroid. And after spending untold thousands or millions of dollars

> on development and tests they failed.

>

> > And those studies that you are talking about were

> > conducted by PHARMACEUTICAL COMPANIES trying to prove something.

>

>

[Guest guest]

,

You say you don't have any symptoms, but from your own

words, it seems to me that you do.

You have gained weight, obviously have food cravings,

taking Melatonin (I think to sleep), asperin for your

heart (hopefully preventive, but asperin also is

anti-inflamatory),take Lipitor for high cholesterol (I

hope you got all the numbers, not just the total)

Allegra for allergies, and Verapamil for arrythmia and

high blood pressure. These can all be symptoms of

hypothyroidism.

That is a pretty good illustration of the fact that

lots of people don't really know what is wrong with

them, unless their doctor actually tells them. They

really do teach this stuff in med school, so why are

the doctors not putting all this together and treating

us properly?

Roni

--- <res075oh@...> wrote:

> AFAIK = As Far As I Know.

>

> I have no symptoms of illness whatsoever. Well,

> maybe hay fever. I

> could stand to lose 10 or 20 pounds of belly [at

> 187]; but then I went

> out tonight and ate two plates of shrimp and four

> ribs, one plate of

> watermelon, and one large bowl of chocolate ice

> cream with peanuts and

> chocolate syrup. Oh, also two egg rolls, onions and

> peppers, and broccoli.

>

> I'll probably have another snack before I go to bed.

> I'm 66 years old.

> I do take several pills [besides Synthroid],

> including baby aspirin and

> Melatonin. Lipitor for Cholesterol [now at 171],

> verapamil, and Allegra

> for allergies. I take them all, including the

> Synthroid, at one time,

> and don't worry about any interaction; either with

> food or each other.

>

> It would have to have more kick than cocaine to make

> me feel much better.

>

> Why am I here? I must like abuse too! [ggg]

> Actually, when I have a

> health concern I try to learn a lot about it, and

> this site seems a good

> place. Of course it's a wheat/chafe thing...

>

>

>

> >

> > Re: Hello there, y'all

> >

>

<hypothyroidism/message/29287;_ylc=X3oDMTJxYzBkcnE\

xBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzE0NTY2NARncnBzcElkAzE3MDkyNTEwODIEbXNnSWQDMjkyODcEc2V\

jA2Rtc2cEc2xrA3Ztc2cEc3RpbWUDMTE4Mzc1NTA0Mw-->

> >

> >

> >

> > Posted by: " sweetenloe1 "

> sweetnwright@...

> >

>

<mailto:sweetnwright@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20Hello%20there%2C%20y%27all>

> > sweetenloe1

> <sweetenloe1>

> >

> >

> > Fri Jul 6, 2007 1:02 pm (PST)

> >

> > ,

> > with all due respect, how do you know that you

> couldn't feel 100

> > times better on armour than on T4? And what in the

> world is AFAIK (a

> > fake?)?

> >

> >

> > >

> > > Sam, is it not obvious that lists such as this

> would tend to be self

> > > selecting for people who are in that fraction of

> the population who

> > does

> > > not respond well to the first thing their doctor

> is likely to prescribe?

> > >

> > > I personally take only Synthroid and AFAIK have

> no problems. But that

> > > is probably irrelevant, as I had no symptoms

> other than elevated TSH

> > > without taking Synthroid.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > PS: Sorry, no gold coins yet! [ggg]

> > >

> > > > I've only been on these thyroid discussion

> groups for about 4 years,

> > > > but I have yet to hear of the majority of

> members doing well on T4.

> > > > Quite the opposite, in fact.

> > > >

> > > > Sam :-o

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Sam, you may have mentioned this before but how much Synthroid did doctors

have you on? And I'd be interested in seeing those pictures of how you looked on

each medication lol, you sound really cool :-)

Oh well let me tell you what Armour did for me then... How about

going from el slug-o-rama and half dead (no, MOSTLY dead), to wowee

hubba buba? More kick than cocaine? Well, I've never done cocaine,

but I'm betting it's a close 2nd at the very least.

Seriously, I can eat A-N-Y-T-H-I-Seriously, I can eat A-N-Y-T-H-I-

weight gain whatsoever. I have pep, energy, and wahoo-ness. I feel

like a kid. Oh wait, I feel like I'm a 16yr old (including the

libido). I am 55 freakin years old and I can run circles around most

30 and 40yr olds. I look 36! I can chase a man, catch him, and cut

him loose exhausted. Oh baby, you have no idea how AWESOME it is to

feel healthy and alive. I ALMOST DIED FROM BEING ON SYNTHROID AND

HAVING NO THYROID GLAND. But, I now have my life back. I have a 2nd

chance AT my life and I absolutely do owe it to Armour Thyroid (with

the later addition of full BHRT - E2, P, Te).

I felt this awesome before my healthy thyroid was destroyed. I was

getting CARDED at age 38! And then that idiot murdered my thyroid

gland and I was being mistaken for a 70+ year old...

I got my first tattoo (large, covering my left upper arm) last

October (a flaming phoenix because I saved my own life), and my 2nd

tattoo (large, from the bottom of first tattoo to mid forearm) the

first of March. I ride a motorcycle (94 XV535 Virago). I look totally

HOT in leather chaps. Remember, I'm a 55 year old grandmother, but

I'm now also a hot and dangerous beauty queen. heh heh heh

, if you email me private, I'll send you pictures of me before

RAI, after RAI on synthroid, and then when healthy. Get ready for

your eyes to bug out of their sockets, pop out, and roll on the floor

and explode. I am at k9gang at openaccess.org sorry, no nudie

pictures...but they are way hot if you ask my boyfriend... <grinning>

In case you hadn't figured, I'm VERY pro Armour Thyroid, and VERY

anti $ynthCrap, but that's just based on my experiences with both.

Sam :-D

> > >

> > > Sam, is it not obvious that lists such as this would tend to be

self

> > > selecting for people who are in that fraction of the population

who

> > does

> > > not respond well to the first thing their doctor is likely to

prescribe?

> > >

> > > I personally take only Synthroid and AFAIK have no problems.

But that

> > > is probably irrelevant, as I had no symptoms other than

elevated TSH

> > > without taking Synthroid.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > PS: Sorry, no gold coins yet! [ggg]

> > >

> > > > I've only been on these thyroid discussion groups for about 4

years,

> > > > but I have yet to hear of the majority of members doing well

on T4.

> > > > Quite the opposite, in fact.

> > > >

> > > > Sam :-o

************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.

[Guest guest]

That is precisely my story. I didn't know there was anything but what

my doc gave me. I thought he would do the best thing for me. He swnt

me to therepy for my knee pain, gave me depression meds, told me to

eat lean meats because of my cholesterol. You summed it up, people

don't know any better.

>

> > Gracia-

> > I totally agree with what you just said. Perhaps a

> > bit of proof of this is

> > how many people end up joining this list who say

> > things like " I wasted half my

> > life because of taking Synthroid " , " I wasted 7 years

> > taking T4-only

> > medications " , etc.

> >

> >

> >

> > I think you are assuming that all the peeps on

> > $inthroid/not on these lists

> > are happy with their treatment. I don't think this

> > is true.

> > Gracia

> >

> > Sam, is it not obvious that lists such as this would

> > tend to be self

> > selecting for people who are in that fraction of the

> > population who does

> > not respond well to the first thing their doctor is

> > likely to prescribe?

> >

> > I personally take only Synthroid and AFAIK have no

> > problems. But that

> > is probably irrelevant, as I had no symptoms other

> > than elevated TSH

> > without taking Synthroid.

> >

> >

> >

> > PS: Sorry, no gold coins yet! [ggg]

> >

> > > I've only been on these thyroid discussion groups

> > for about 4 years,

> > > but I have yet to hear of the majority of members

> > doing well on T4.

> > > Quite the opposite, in fact.

> > >

> > > Sam :-o

> >

> > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> >

> >

> > _Messages in this topic _

> >

>

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>

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