Re: Dillon

April 14, 2003

Re: Dillon

> I thought you had said that the other syndrome PDAS didn't

> really sound like him after all?

No. I've always said this sounded EXACTLY like him. It's on the ASD spectrum

but is quite a bit different. In fact, Shattock on the SJU list said

PDAS would fit Dillon -- but it's a UK diagnosis and not used in the US. Ped

said schizoid personality disorder -- that doesn't sound like Dillon at all.

Here's what Shattock said about Dillon and PDAS:

" The diagnosis is used in the UK but not that extensively. It is applicable

to a subgroup of people within the PDD spectrum but it is not autism. I was

heavily involved (in a voluntary way) in running a school a few years back.

There was one particular girl who was " Autistic " but just did not fit the

mould. She was very bright and very funny but gave us more problems than all

the others put together. She could tell lies as easily as blink. It was not

until I attended a lecture on PDA that I realised that she was virtually

describing Miss X.

Of course, it is impossible to diagnose over the internet and I am not

competent to diagnose in any case but, well, it could fit. "

> Do the problems he's having on the bus and in the lunchroom sound like

> things that could have been misinterpretations of the sort a spectrum

person

> might make?

I don't know. Hell, I don't even know if he's telling the truth most of the

time.

Thanks, Sue.

April 14, 2003

> I think I just tended to take whatever anyone was talking about one step

> further. does that, now, too. Like if some kid (Ben) went to Disney

> world, will say he'd been there too, AND met Walt Disney and had free

> whatever the whole time. And I think that at that moment he truly

believes

> it's true, simply because he's thought of it.

Hmmmmmmmm...

That's a lot to think about.

Sissi

April 14, 2003

> I think I just tended to take whatever anyone was talking about one step

> further. does that, now, too. Like if some kid (Ben) went to Disney

> world, will say he'd been there too, AND met Walt Disney and had free

> whatever the whole time. And I think that at that moment he truly

believes

> it's true, simply because he's thought of it.

Hmmmmmmmm...

That's a lot to think about.

Sissi

April 14, 2003

> I think I just tended to take whatever anyone was talking about one step

> further. does that, now, too. Like if some kid (Ben) went to Disney

> world, will say he'd been there too, AND met Walt Disney and had free

> whatever the whole time. And I think that at that moment he truly

believes

> it's true, simply because he's thought of it.

Hmmmmmmmm...

That's a lot to think about.

Sissi

April 14, 2003

> and they seem to believe it--mainly because they

> can't separate reality from fantasy?

Classic symptom of PDAS. Also -- Boone can't distinguish reality from

fiction -- violent cartoons, for instance.

Sissi

April 14, 2003

> and they seem to believe it--mainly because they

> can't separate reality from fantasy?

Classic symptom of PDAS. Also -- Boone can't distinguish reality from

fiction -- violent cartoons, for instance.

Sissi

April 14, 2003

Sissi,

I read some of Dillion's site about his illness. What an amazing and scary

story! You must be one strong lady!!

Warm Regards

& ASD 11/25/00 in Maine

Dillon

I finally talked to the psychologist Dillon has been seeing. This is the one

our ped referred us to originally, then said he probably wouldn't be much help

with Dillon since he usually deals with conduct problems.

He said Dillon's intelligence level is high, but he didn't give me an IQ or

anything like that.

Dillon is suffering from moderate depression. Partly from his illness, partly

from the adjustments he's had to make because of the illness and problems with

the other kids in the family.

He said depression affects kids differently. They don't usually hole up in

their rooms like adults. It's usually manifested in conduct, agitation and

apathy.

Dillon directs a lot of self-derogatory statements towards himself, which he

said is from depression. The mood fluctuations are also caused by depression.

He recommends Zoloft, which can be prescribed by his ped, but that he should

be monitored very closely because of hypersensitivity to medications

(vasculitis).

He has recommended a referral to neuropsychologist (Dr. , actually -- we

already have an appointment with him on Wednesday). He said their were some

" mild neurological signs " and asked if I had ever heard of Asperger's Syndrome.

Dillon is currently suspended from riding the school bus for three days

(starting today). This is his second bus suspension.

This morning I got a call from the vice principal informing me that he begins

in school suspension starting tomorrow for yet another minor infraction in the

lunch room.

This was the third call from this guy within a period of seven days.

I thought Aspies were notoriously honest? Which brings me back to a question I

had some time ago -- Pathological Demand Avoidance Syndrome. Or could it be that

Dillon just has plain old gifted child syndrome?

Just so you'll know that the news about Dillon isn't all bad -- On Friday

night, Dillon and a played for 300 boy scouts and their parents at a huge

boy scout meet:

http://www.geocities.com/flaremusic/camposborne.htm

Also, his renal labs have remained normal for a full year (normal for Dillon

anyway +1 proteinuria/+3 hematuria). NS (nephrotic syndrome) is officially in

remission.

Sissi " my kids are killing me " Garvey

Kids' Page

http://www.isoa.net/~nitetrax/original.htm

Boone's Art Page

http://www.isoa.net/~nitetrax/bart.htm

Dillon's Music Page

http://www.geocities.com/flaremusic

" If it doesn't spin, it's broke. "

Boone Garvey (not a direct quote -- more like an attitude)

April 14, 2003

Sissi,

I read some of Dillion's site about his illness. What an amazing and scary

story! You must be one strong lady!!

Warm Regards

& ASD 11/25/00 in Maine

Dillon

I finally talked to the psychologist Dillon has been seeing. This is the one

our ped referred us to originally, then said he probably wouldn't be much help

with Dillon since he usually deals with conduct problems.

He said Dillon's intelligence level is high, but he didn't give me an IQ or

anything like that.

Dillon is suffering from moderate depression. Partly from his illness, partly

from the adjustments he's had to make because of the illness and problems with

the other kids in the family.

He said depression affects kids differently. They don't usually hole up in

their rooms like adults. It's usually manifested in conduct, agitation and

apathy.

Dillon directs a lot of self-derogatory statements towards himself, which he

said is from depression. The mood fluctuations are also caused by depression.

He recommends Zoloft, which can be prescribed by his ped, but that he should

be monitored very closely because of hypersensitivity to medications

(vasculitis).

He has recommended a referral to neuropsychologist (Dr. , actually -- we

already have an appointment with him on Wednesday). He said their were some

" mild neurological signs " and asked if I had ever heard of Asperger's Syndrome.

Dillon is currently suspended from riding the school bus for three days

(starting today). This is his second bus suspension.

This morning I got a call from the vice principal informing me that he begins

in school suspension starting tomorrow for yet another minor infraction in the

lunch room.

This was the third call from this guy within a period of seven days.

I thought Aspies were notoriously honest? Which brings me back to a question I

had some time ago -- Pathological Demand Avoidance Syndrome. Or could it be that

Dillon just has plain old gifted child syndrome?

Just so you'll know that the news about Dillon isn't all bad -- On Friday

night, Dillon and a played for 300 boy scouts and their parents at a huge

boy scout meet:

http://www.geocities.com/flaremusic/camposborne.htm

Also, his renal labs have remained normal for a full year (normal for Dillon

anyway +1 proteinuria/+3 hematuria). NS (nephrotic syndrome) is officially in

remission.

Sissi " my kids are killing me " Garvey

Kids' Page

http://www.isoa.net/~nitetrax/original.htm

Boone's Art Page

http://www.isoa.net/~nitetrax/bart.htm

Dillon's Music Page

http://www.geocities.com/flaremusic

" If it doesn't spin, it's broke. "

Boone Garvey (not a direct quote -- more like an attitude)

April 14, 2003

> > and they seem to believe it--mainly because they

> > can't separate reality from fantasy?

>

> Classic symptom of PDAS. Also -- Boone can't distinguish reality from

> fiction -- violent cartoons, for instance.

>

Just to muddy the waters even more, Putter's psychologist says that this is

pretty typical of Asperger's also. That is why Enrique can completely

immobilize himself with some weird rule or idea; he cannot figure out what

is real.

Hard to tell the truth when you do not know the reality.

Salli

April 14, 2003

> > and they seem to believe it--mainly because they

> > can't separate reality from fantasy?

>

> Classic symptom of PDAS. Also -- Boone can't distinguish reality from

> fiction -- violent cartoons, for instance.

>

Just to muddy the waters even more, Putter's psychologist says that this is

pretty typical of Asperger's also. That is why Enrique can completely

immobilize himself with some weird rule or idea; he cannot figure out what

is real.

Hard to tell the truth when you do not know the reality.

Salli

April 14, 2003

Hey Sissi, I finally checked out Dillon's music. That stuff rocks! Is he

actually playing that guitar?!?! Good lord you have some talent going on in

your family!

(SAHM in GA)

MSN elizabethloht@...

n 33, mo, no formal dx

Phoebe, 9 wks

Dillon

> I finally talked to the psychologist Dillon has been seeing. This is the

one our ped referred us to originally, then said he probably wouldn't be

much help with Dillon since he usually deals with conduct problems.

>

> He said Dillon's intelligence level is high, but he didn't give me an IQ

or anything like that.

>

> Dillon is suffering from moderate depression. Partly from his illness,

partly from the adjustments he's had to make because of the illness and

problems with the other kids in the family.

>

> He said depression affects kids differently. They don't usually hole up in

their rooms like adults. It's usually manifested in conduct, agitation and

apathy.

>

> Dillon directs a lot of self-derogatory statements towards himself, which

he said is from depression. The mood fluctuations are also caused by

depression.

>

> He recommends Zoloft, which can be prescribed by his ped, but that he

should be monitored very closely because of hypersensitivity to medications

(vasculitis).

>

> He has recommended a referral to neuropsychologist (Dr. , actually --

we already have an appointment with him on Wednesday). He said their were

some " mild neurological signs " and asked if I had ever heard of Asperger's

Syndrome.

>

> Dillon is currently suspended from riding the school bus for three days

(starting today). This is his second bus suspension.

>

> This morning I got a call from the vice principal informing me that he

begins in school suspension starting tomorrow for yet another minor

infraction in the lunch room.

>

> This was the third call from this guy within a period of seven days.

>

> I thought Aspies were notoriously honest? Which brings me back to a

question I had some time ago -- Pathological Demand Avoidance Syndrome. Or

could it be that Dillon just has plain old gifted child syndrome?

>

> Just so you'll know that the news about Dillon isn't all bad -- On Friday

night, Dillon and a played for 300 boy scouts and their parents at a

huge boy scout meet:

> http://www.geocities.com/flaremusic/camposborne.htm

>

> Also, his renal labs have remained normal for a full year (normal for

Dillon anyway +1 proteinuria/+3 hematuria). NS (nephrotic syndrome) is

officially in remission.

>

> Sissi " my kids are killing me " Garvey

>

> Kids' Page

> http://www.isoa.net/~nitetrax/original.htm

> Boone's Art Page

> http://www.isoa.net/~nitetrax/bart.htm

> Dillon's Music Page

> http://www.geocities.com/flaremusic

>

> " If it doesn't spin, it's broke. "

> Boone Garvey (not a direct quote -- more like an attitude)

>

April 14, 2003

Hey Sissi, I finally checked out Dillon's music. That stuff rocks! Is he

actually playing that guitar?!?! Good lord you have some talent going on in

your family!

(SAHM in GA)

MSN elizabethloht@...

n 33, mo, no formal dx

Phoebe, 9 wks

Dillon

> I finally talked to the psychologist Dillon has been seeing. This is the

one our ped referred us to originally, then said he probably wouldn't be

much help with Dillon since he usually deals with conduct problems.

>

> He said Dillon's intelligence level is high, but he didn't give me an IQ

or anything like that.

>

> Dillon is suffering from moderate depression. Partly from his illness,

partly from the adjustments he's had to make because of the illness and

problems with the other kids in the family.

>

> He said depression affects kids differently. They don't usually hole up in

their rooms like adults. It's usually manifested in conduct, agitation and

apathy.

>

> Dillon directs a lot of self-derogatory statements towards himself, which

he said is from depression. The mood fluctuations are also caused by

depression.

>

> He recommends Zoloft, which can be prescribed by his ped, but that he

should be monitored very closely because of hypersensitivity to medications

(vasculitis).

>

> He has recommended a referral to neuropsychologist (Dr. , actually --

we already have an appointment with him on Wednesday). He said their were

some " mild neurological signs " and asked if I had ever heard of Asperger's

Syndrome.

>

> Dillon is currently suspended from riding the school bus for three days

(starting today). This is his second bus suspension.

>

> This morning I got a call from the vice principal informing me that he

begins in school suspension starting tomorrow for yet another minor

infraction in the lunch room.

>

> This was the third call from this guy within a period of seven days.

>

> I thought Aspies were notoriously honest? Which brings me back to a

question I had some time ago -- Pathological Demand Avoidance Syndrome. Or

could it be that Dillon just has plain old gifted child syndrome?

>

> Just so you'll know that the news about Dillon isn't all bad -- On Friday

night, Dillon and a played for 300 boy scouts and their parents at a

huge boy scout meet:

> http://www.geocities.com/flaremusic/camposborne.htm

>

> Also, his renal labs have remained normal for a full year (normal for

Dillon anyway +1 proteinuria/+3 hematuria). NS (nephrotic syndrome) is

officially in remission.

>

> Sissi " my kids are killing me " Garvey

>

> Kids' Page

> http://www.isoa.net/~nitetrax/original.htm

> Boone's Art Page

> http://www.isoa.net/~nitetrax/bart.htm

> Dillon's Music Page

> http://www.geocities.com/flaremusic

>

> " If it doesn't spin, it's broke. "

> Boone Garvey (not a direct quote -- more like an attitude)

>

April 14, 2003

> Hey Sissi, I finally checked out Dillon's music. That stuff rocks! Is he

> actually playing that guitar?!?!

Yes, that's him. Pretty amazing, isn't it?

Good lord you have some talent going on in

> your family!

Strange kids with strange talents. I guess it's kind of a trade-off.

Sissi

April 14, 2003

You know one thing that I have discovered about Savannah? When she does lie

it is so obvious it isn't funny. It is like she can't come up with anything

convincing and is practicing to see if she can do it. It is like she is

trying to do something other kids do and can't quite get it.

Georga

Re: Dillon

> > If he just comes home and does not TELL you what the problem is, that's

> > pretty different than actually telling a different story all together.

> > Which one does he do?

>

> He tells WHOPPERS! Remember the bus story?

>

> Turns in old homework with the date changed.

>

> Sometimes he just makes up crazy stories for no apparent reason.

>

> And of course, NOTHING is ever HIS fault.

>

> Sissi

>

April 14, 2003

> He has recommended a referral to neuropsychologist (Dr. , actually --

we already have an appointment with him on Wednesday). He said their were

some " mild neurological signs " and asked if I had ever heard of Asperger's

Syndrome.

>

WOW!

> I thought Aspies were notoriously honest? Which brings me back to a

question I had some time ago -- Pathological Demand Avoidance Syndrome. >

I think aspies are bluntly honest; I don't think that means they don't

practice convenient omission of details or facts.

If he just comes home and does not TELL you what the problem is, that's

pretty different than actually telling a different story all together.

Which one does he do?

> Also, his renal labs have remained normal for a full year (normal for

Dillon anyway +1 proteinuria/+3 hematuria). NS (nephrotic syndrome) is

officially in remission.

>

That's FANTASTIC!!!!!

Jacquie

April 14, 2003

> He has recommended a referral to neuropsychologist (Dr. , actually --

we already have an appointment with him on Wednesday). He said their were

some " mild neurological signs " and asked if I had ever heard of Asperger's

Syndrome.

>

WOW!

> I thought Aspies were notoriously honest? Which brings me back to a

question I had some time ago -- Pathological Demand Avoidance Syndrome. >

I think aspies are bluntly honest; I don't think that means they don't

practice convenient omission of details or facts.

If he just comes home and does not TELL you what the problem is, that's

pretty different than actually telling a different story all together.

Which one does he do?

> Also, his renal labs have remained normal for a full year (normal for

Dillon anyway +1 proteinuria/+3 hematuria). NS (nephrotic syndrome) is

officially in remission.

>

That's FANTASTIC!!!!!

Jacquie

April 14, 2003

> He has recommended a referral to neuropsychologist (Dr. , actually --

we already have an appointment with him on Wednesday). He said their were

some " mild neurological signs " and asked if I had ever heard of Asperger's

Syndrome.

>

WOW!

> I thought Aspies were notoriously honest? Which brings me back to a

question I had some time ago -- Pathological Demand Avoidance Syndrome. >

I think aspies are bluntly honest; I don't think that means they don't

practice convenient omission of details or facts.

If he just comes home and does not TELL you what the problem is, that's

pretty different than actually telling a different story all together.

Which one does he do?

> Also, his renal labs have remained normal for a full year (normal for

Dillon anyway +1 proteinuria/+3 hematuria). NS (nephrotic syndrome) is

officially in remission.

>

That's FANTASTIC!!!!!

Jacquie

April 14, 2003

> Most of us would have known the rules without being told. But he didn't.

>

Yup, I can understand that. I think aspies don't have an innate

understanding of rules that fall under the heading of " unspoken

moral/ethical code " .

Perfectly happy to abide by them, IF we know what they are...but since it

all changes so much from situation to situation, we are pretty much

incapable of generalizing those rules out to everything else.

This doesn't exactly fit the discussion, but it just popped into mind as

something similar...or maybe it DOES... when I had my first job at 15, I

asked my boss for new year's day off to go skiing. He said no, EVERYONE had

to work that day. So then later I found out that he'd given the day off to

another part timer. So if he gave it to HER, then he DIDN'T need everyone

to work. So I knew he wouldn't give the day off to me; he'd already said

no. So I got my friend's mother to call me in sick, and I went skiing.

Due to a truly labrythine chain of events, my deception was discovered. I

was fired. I was surprised. Still am, actually, since he said he needed

everyone and then turned around and gave the day off to someone, showing he

DIDN'T need everyone...

ANYWAY, my point I'm not getting to is that at subsequent jobs I didn't do

THAT again, but I did call in sick for OTHER REASONS, and did some other

stupid stuff -- just not that stupid thing again.

Lou won't embezzle again. But he will STILL not have any idea what the

rules are!

Jacquie

April 14, 2003

> He tells WHOPPERS! Remember the bus story?

>

> Turns in old homework with the date changed.

>

> Sometimes he just makes up crazy stories for no apparent reason.

Those ARE devious. I used to make up stories for no apparent reason, too.

Reduced several neighborhood kids to tears with them. My mom took me to the

doctor, who pronounced me 'imaginative'. But I don't remember ever having

fun making them up; I remember delivering them as if they were fact and then

watching dispassionately as kids lost their minds. (the stories usually

revolved around something these kids coveted)

Several moms called mine to pronounce I was never to play with their kids

again. I don't remember caring about that much. (my mom remembers it as me

utterly " not giving a shit " .)

I think I just tended to take whatever anyone was talking about one step

further. does that, now, too. Like if some kid (Ben) went to Disney

world, will say he'd been there too, AND met Walt Disney and had free

whatever the whole time. And I think that at that moment he truly believes

it's true, simply because he's thought of it.

Jacquie

April 14, 2003

>

> Dillon is suffering from moderate depression. Partly from his

illness, partly from the adjustments he's had to make because of the

illness and problems with the other kids in the family.

>

> He said depression affects kids differently. They don't usually

hole up in their rooms like adults. It's usually manifested in

conduct, agitation and apathy.

>

> Dillon directs a lot of self-derogatory statements towards himself,

which he said is from depression. The mood fluctuations are also

caused by depression.

> He has recommended a referral to neuropsychologist (Dr. ,

actually -- we already have an appointment with him on Wednesday). He

said their were some " mild neurological signs " and asked if I had

ever heard of Asperger's Syndrome.

>

Sissi, This sort of confirms some of the thoughts you have been

having doesn't it?

>

> I thought Aspies were notoriously honest? Which brings me back to a

question I had some time ago -- Pathological Demand Avoidance

Syndrome. Or could it be that Dillon just has plain old gifted child

syndrome?

I just read a book about an Asperger boy who lied all of the time,

but mostly to make himself appear more " normal. " He claims to be the

Biology teacher's asst. when he is actually flunking the class. He

claims to have a paid internship, when he is actually a free intern

in a video production company and only makes it there a few weeks

before being asked to leave. I think AS kids are particularly

vulnerable to this once they reach an age where they realize that

they are different. This could account for some of the depression,

too. AS kids sometimes have a large gap between verbal and non-

verbal IQ's that makes the intermediate grades become tougher and

tougher. They seem to do okay in primary grades, but become

overwhelmed in intermediate grades. Could that be why he is

depressed, too?

I loved this book I read: Finding Ben by Barbara La Salle. It was

gut-wrenchingly sad, but also very uplifting when they finally

realize what is up with Ben in adulthood. Prior to that, he and his

parents went thru absolute hell tryng to determine what was wrong.

Mom wrote the book and it is very well-written. I cried buckets, but

I loved it just the same. It gave picture of the absolute worst it

could get, and then helped you see how he and his mother had to stop

trying to fix him and love him for himself. Maybe a message we all

need to read. I, for one, spend way too much time bitching about

what drives me crazy about Brandt instead of being grateful for all

of the wonderful qualities he does have. It was a good book to

read. Leggs

>

April 14, 2003