Re: Formula

[Guest guest]

Yes, there's obviously not *too* much information or support when formula isvehemently defended even on a breastfeeding list. And money is not themotivation here.... so what is?S.

I don't think that anyone here defended formula in the least. People defended *the people* who had chosen to formula feed in the past, which is a huge difference. Even if I don't agree with someone's decision, I don't see any point in telling them they were wrong to have made it if there is nothing they can do about it now.

If they could do something about it, certainly, but there is nothing that can come of criticizing those who *chose* (past tense) to formula feed other than hurt feelings on both sides.

I embarass my familar and friends by trying to convince those who still can be swayed, (including any pregnant woman I see on the street), but people who have already made the decision I leave alone.

Lynn

[Guest guest]

Yes, there's obviously not *too* much information or support when formula isvehemently defended even on a breastfeeding list. And money is not themotivation here.... so what is?S.

I don't think that anyone here defended formula in the least. People defended *the people* who had chosen to formula feed in the past, which is a huge difference. Even if I don't agree with someone's decision, I don't see any point in telling them they were wrong to have made it if there is nothing they can do about it now.

If they could do something about it, certainly, but there is nothing that can come of criticizing those who *chose* (past tense) to formula feed other than hurt feelings on both sides.

I embarass my familar and friends by trying to convince those who still can be swayed, (including any pregnant woman I see on the street), but people who have already made the decision I leave alone.

Lynn

[Guest guest]

Yes, there's obviously not *too* much information or support when formula isvehemently defended even on a breastfeeding list. And money is not themotivation here.... so what is?S.

I don't think that anyone here defended formula in the least. People defended *the people* who had chosen to formula feed in the past, which is a huge difference. Even if I don't agree with someone's decision, I don't see any point in telling them they were wrong to have made it if there is nothing they can do about it now.

If they could do something about it, certainly, but there is nothing that can come of criticizing those who *chose* (past tense) to formula feed other than hurt feelings on both sides.

I embarass my familar and friends by trying to convince those who still can be swayed, (including any pregnant woman I see on the street), but people who have already made the decision I leave alone.

Lynn

[Guest guest]

Can I get an AMEN?!! I really find it hard to believe that on a

*Breastfeeding* support list, we would have to defend our opinions about

formula.

I am in total agreement with and the comment that " I wish that women

who formula feed their children would stop saying how they made an informed

choice, and that their children turned out " just fine, " because in the end,

they really aren't. "

We are not just fine. As a generation we are among the un-healthiest ever.

And the " my kid, blah blah blah " , is simply selective hearing and anecdotes.

*Statistically* formula fed babies/children/people are not as healthy as

those who were breastfed.

I fed my first 2 children formula...yes I did. But I would NEVER say that it

was an informed choice. I had no support, no knowledge, had never heard of

LLL, the only pump I had ever seen was a cylinder within a cylinder manual

pump, knew no one who had breastfed, and was just plain ignorant about the

differences between breastmilk and ABM. My first child got BrMilk for 3

weeks and my 2nd child for 6 weeks. At which time I weaned cold turkey to

return to work.

I think it is laughable to ask, " is this the formula companies fault? " Of

course it is. Big money goes into those doctors' pockets. Having a problem?

Supplement. Low weight gain? Supplement. Large weight gain? Supplement. Ad

nauseum. Is there true support for BF moms? Only if they know where to look.

When my DD was about a year old, I attended a mom's night out and my DD was

the only one still being breastfed. The stories were truly scary. And the

things that moms were doing, under the advice of their peds, even scarier.

Jenn

-----Original Message-----

From: Shelby

<<I find

that even today, mother's don't know of the dangers of formula or don't have

the support for breastfeeding.>>

Yes, there's obviously not *too* much information or support when formula is

vehemently defended even on a breastfeeding list. And money is not the

motivation here.... so what is?

S.

[Guest guest]

> I would also like to give my opinion on this, it has really made me upset.

I

> have five children my first two I did not breastfeed (w/third I already

gave

> the story of trying/failing so she wasn't either) with the first two I

didnt

> even think of it as an option, I just didnt, when the nurses asked me how

I

> was going to feed them I said bottle. And they ARE fine.. they are never

> sick( I don't concider a cold a year,or a stomach virus sick) no

allergies,

> asthma, they aren't over weight, they have no emotional problems,all my

> children play in sports, they ARE healthy, happy and VERY BRILLIANT

CHILDREN

And yes, there breastfed siblings

> are just as smart, not sickly or obese or have any emotional problems, but

I

> feel it is from my parenting them, keeping them healthy and teaching them,

Rhonda,

I agree with you completely--parenting is a key. My mother ff three of us.

One has a milk allergy--moderate to severe--with ADD--their is a family

history to back this up. We are all above average intellectually, healthy,

active, etc. Our parents are very close to us and we to them. I believe

that my parents parented us in a manner much like AP which didn't exist (as

a term) when we were children. Today I parent like my partents did--with

the addition that I chose to breastfeed.

Amy Lynn

mother to 1-25-98 and 2-10-00

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/5/00 4:04:14 PM Central Daylight Time, jmowatt@...

writes:

<< I think it is laughable to ask, " is this the formula companies fault? " Of

course it is. Big money goes into those doctors' pockets. Having a problem?

Supplement. Low weight gain? Supplement. Large weight gain? Supplement. Ad

nauseum. Is there true support for BF moms? Only if they know where to look.

>>

OK Now tell me just what are you supposed to do if your baby is not gaining

enough weight on breastmilk alone??? I *just* came from the Lactation Center

and Then the Peds office, My daughter has not gained ANY weight in a month,

the LC sent me upstairs to my ped office, They are having me supplement with

formula after 2 feedings a day while I try to boost my milk supply by pumping

after each feeding, along with a few other things to try to keep her at the

breast longer, the supplementing is only temporary, my ped and I are both

dedicated to make sure this does not end our nursing. What would You have me

do? let my baby continue to not gain?? Let her starve because I am apparently

not producing enough, obviously I need to booost my milk supply, but in the

meantime?? I joined this list for breastfeeding support and now I feel like I

am being flamed for using formula too. Maybe I just don't belong here,

I breastfeed yes, that was my decision....but who am I to tell someone else

*they* are wrong to not breastfeed, I said it before and I'll say it again.

We expect people to respect our choice to breastfeed, we should do the same

for those who do not. Yes we should *encourage* women to BF, but not condem

them for not making the same choice we did.

-Llanda

Mommy to 4/4/2000

" I am in shape. Round is a shape. "

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/5/00 4:04:14 PM Central Daylight Time, jmowatt@...

writes:

<< I think it is laughable to ask, " is this the formula companies fault? " Of

course it is. Big money goes into those doctors' pockets. Having a problem?

Supplement. Low weight gain? Supplement. Large weight gain? Supplement. Ad

nauseum. Is there true support for BF moms? Only if they know where to look.

>>

OK Now tell me just what are you supposed to do if your baby is not gaining

enough weight on breastmilk alone??? I *just* came from the Lactation Center

and Then the Peds office, My daughter has not gained ANY weight in a month,

the LC sent me upstairs to my ped office, They are having me supplement with

formula after 2 feedings a day while I try to boost my milk supply by pumping

after each feeding, along with a few other things to try to keep her at the

breast longer, the supplementing is only temporary, my ped and I are both

dedicated to make sure this does not end our nursing. What would You have me

do? let my baby continue to not gain?? Let her starve because I am apparently

not producing enough, obviously I need to booost my milk supply, but in the

meantime?? I joined this list for breastfeeding support and now I feel like I

am being flamed for using formula too. Maybe I just don't belong here,

I breastfeed yes, that was my decision....but who am I to tell someone else

*they* are wrong to not breastfeed, I said it before and I'll say it again.

We expect people to respect our choice to breastfeed, we should do the same

for those who do not. Yes we should *encourage* women to BF, but not condem

them for not making the same choice we did.

-Llanda

Mommy to 4/4/2000

" I am in shape. Round is a shape. "

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/5/00 4:04:14 PM Central Daylight Time, jmowatt@...

writes:

<< I think it is laughable to ask, " is this the formula companies fault? " Of

course it is. Big money goes into those doctors' pockets. Having a problem?

Supplement. Low weight gain? Supplement. Large weight gain? Supplement. Ad

nauseum. Is there true support for BF moms? Only if they know where to look.

>>

OK Now tell me just what are you supposed to do if your baby is not gaining

enough weight on breastmilk alone??? I *just* came from the Lactation Center

and Then the Peds office, My daughter has not gained ANY weight in a month,

the LC sent me upstairs to my ped office, They are having me supplement with

formula after 2 feedings a day while I try to boost my milk supply by pumping

after each feeding, along with a few other things to try to keep her at the

breast longer, the supplementing is only temporary, my ped and I are both

dedicated to make sure this does not end our nursing. What would You have me

do? let my baby continue to not gain?? Let her starve because I am apparently

not producing enough, obviously I need to booost my milk supply, but in the

meantime?? I joined this list for breastfeeding support and now I feel like I

am being flamed for using formula too. Maybe I just don't belong here,

I breastfeed yes, that was my decision....but who am I to tell someone else

*they* are wrong to not breastfeed, I said it before and I'll say it again.

We expect people to respect our choice to breastfeed, we should do the same

for those who do not. Yes we should *encourage* women to BF, but not condem

them for not making the same choice we did.

-Llanda

Mommy to 4/4/2000

" I am in shape. Round is a shape. "

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/5/00 2:04:09 PM Pacific Daylight Time, jmowatt@...

writes:

<< And the " my kid, blah blah blah " , is simply selective hearing and

anecdotes.

*Statistically* formula fed babies/children/people are not as healthy as

those who were breastfed. >>

SO to all of you who have children that you have FF and now have children

that you breastfeed, because you are now so informed of the total and

complete EVIL that formula is, do you tell your FF children that you are

sorry every single day that they will NEVER be smarter, healthier, or happier

individuals and that there BFsiblings will always be superior to them, that

they should just give up right now because there mother was a complete idiot

for not breastfeeding them, so why even try in life because after all.....

you werent breastfed.

Rhonda

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/5/00 2:04:09 PM Pacific Daylight Time, jmowatt@...

writes:

<< And the " my kid, blah blah blah " , is simply selective hearing and

anecdotes.

*Statistically* formula fed babies/children/people are not as healthy as

those who were breastfed. >>

SO to all of you who have children that you have FF and now have children

that you breastfeed, because you are now so informed of the total and

complete EVIL that formula is, do you tell your FF children that you are

sorry every single day that they will NEVER be smarter, healthier, or happier

individuals and that there BFsiblings will always be superior to them, that

they should just give up right now because there mother was a complete idiot

for not breastfeeding them, so why even try in life because after all.....

you werent breastfed.

Rhonda

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/5/00 2:04:09 PM Pacific Daylight Time, jmowatt@...

writes:

<< And the " my kid, blah blah blah " , is simply selective hearing and

anecdotes.

*Statistically* formula fed babies/children/people are not as healthy as

those who were breastfed. >>

SO to all of you who have children that you have FF and now have children

that you breastfeed, because you are now so informed of the total and

complete EVIL that formula is, do you tell your FF children that you are

sorry every single day that they will NEVER be smarter, healthier, or happier

individuals and that there BFsiblings will always be superior to them, that

they should just give up right now because there mother was a complete idiot

for not breastfeeding them, so why even try in life because after all.....

you werent breastfed.

Rhonda

[Guest guest]

>, I disagree with your statement that says children who receive

>formula aren't " just fine " In most cases they are fine.

What do you mean by " just fine " ? Here's the list of risks in the American

Academy of Pediatricians of not feeding an infant human milk: diarrhea,

lower respiratory infection (such as RSV and rotavirus), ear infections

(otitis media), Influenza type b (bacteremia), bacterial meningitis, food

poisoning (botulism)

urinary tract infection, necrotizing enterocolitis (portions of the bowel

tract die), intestinal perforation

sudden infant death syndrome, insulin-dependent diabetes mellitus, Crohn's

disease ( O'Rourke, of Poltergeist, died from this at age 9!),

ulcerative colitis, lymphoma (childhood cancer), leukemia, allergic

diseases (studied children for 17 years!), liver diseases, celiac disease,

other chronic digestive diseases, decreased cognitive development...

My SIL chose to formula feed her son, and he's had frequent ear infections,

RSV, UTIs, and has some undiagnosed digestive disorder as well. I can't

help but wonder if his illness symptoms would be lessened if he were given

breast milk... even from a donor!

>Her mother who had breastfed my mom and sister discouraged her from

>breastfeeding because she blamed her large breasts as the result of

>breastfeeding.

Unfortunately, your mother was a victim of misinformation. I'm sure you

know that breast size is determined by heredity, not by

breastfeeding. Most women complain that their breasts decrease in size

once they wean.

In addition to the risks to a child not fed human milk, women who don't

breastfeed place themselves in unnecessary risk. This is what is listed in

the AAP's statement for risks to women who do not breastfeed: more

postpartum bleeding, slower uterine involution, higher menstrual blood loss

over the months after delivery, slower return to prepregnant weight,

quicker resumption of ovulation and decreased child spacing, decreased bone

remineralization postpartum, with increase risk for hip fractures in the

postmenopausal period, and increased risk of ovarian cancer and

premenopausal breast cancer.

> All six of us are healthy well adjusted adults. None of us have ever been

>in the hospital except to deliver our own babies and none of us suffer from

> " emotional " issues.

But what about when you hit your post-menopausal age? For most of women,

this is in our 40s! Our choices about breastfeeding will impact us

then!! There are even studies that suggest that our daughters who we

breastfed will have a reduced risk for breast cancer and uterine cancers,

even if they never breastfeed.

>I am choosing to breastfeed my daughter because I think it is the best for

>her but I don't " condemn " those who choose to give their children formula.

I don't condemn women who choose not to breastfeed either. Silently, I

wish they knew the choice they were really making, though.

>Most babies who have formula grow up to be healthy individuals.

I think the jury is still out on this. When was formula really made

available to the public? I know that in the early 70s, regulations were

lifted from formula manufacturers to sell their products DIRECTLY to

mothers, instead of having to go through pediatricians. Mead

(Enfamil) & Ross Labs (Similac) claim on their websites that they began

producing a powdered formula in the late 20s, but history reminds us that

the economical disaster in the 30s led to a boom of breastfeeding

families. Ross Labs claims that in 1964, they introduced the

pre-sterilized, pre-filled bottles of formula to hospitals.

History also reminds us that during the late 50s and early 60s, products

that were " scientific " were favored over old-fashioned items.

I think we're just now seeing how this national experiment pans out.

[Guest guest]

>, I disagree with your statement that says children who receive

>formula aren't " just fine " In most cases they are fine.

What do you mean by " just fine " ? Here's the list of risks in the American

Academy of Pediatricians of not feeding an infant human milk: diarrhea,

lower respiratory infection (such as RSV and rotavirus), ear infections

(otitis media), Influenza type b (bacteremia), bacterial meningitis, food

poisoning (botulism)

urinary tract infection, necrotizing enterocolitis (portions of the bowel

tract die), intestinal perforation

sudden infant death syndrome, insulin-dependent diabetes mellitus, Crohn's

disease ( O'Rourke, of Poltergeist, died from this at age 9!),

ulcerative colitis, lymphoma (childhood cancer), leukemia, allergic

diseases (studied children for 17 years!), liver diseases, celiac disease,

other chronic digestive diseases, decreased cognitive development...

My SIL chose to formula feed her son, and he's had frequent ear infections,

RSV, UTIs, and has some undiagnosed digestive disorder as well. I can't

help but wonder if his illness symptoms would be lessened if he were given

breast milk... even from a donor!

>Her mother who had breastfed my mom and sister discouraged her from

>breastfeeding because she blamed her large breasts as the result of

>breastfeeding.

Unfortunately, your mother was a victim of misinformation. I'm sure you

know that breast size is determined by heredity, not by

breastfeeding. Most women complain that their breasts decrease in size

once they wean.

In addition to the risks to a child not fed human milk, women who don't

breastfeed place themselves in unnecessary risk. This is what is listed in

the AAP's statement for risks to women who do not breastfeed: more

postpartum bleeding, slower uterine involution, higher menstrual blood loss

over the months after delivery, slower return to prepregnant weight,

quicker resumption of ovulation and decreased child spacing, decreased bone

remineralization postpartum, with increase risk for hip fractures in the

postmenopausal period, and increased risk of ovarian cancer and

premenopausal breast cancer.

> All six of us are healthy well adjusted adults. None of us have ever been

>in the hospital except to deliver our own babies and none of us suffer from

> " emotional " issues.

But what about when you hit your post-menopausal age? For most of women,

this is in our 40s! Our choices about breastfeeding will impact us

then!! There are even studies that suggest that our daughters who we

breastfed will have a reduced risk for breast cancer and uterine cancers,

even if they never breastfeed.

>I am choosing to breastfeed my daughter because I think it is the best for

>her but I don't " condemn " those who choose to give their children formula.

I don't condemn women who choose not to breastfeed either. Silently, I

wish they knew the choice they were really making, though.

>Most babies who have formula grow up to be healthy individuals.

I think the jury is still out on this. When was formula really made

available to the public? I know that in the early 70s, regulations were

lifted from formula manufacturers to sell their products DIRECTLY to

mothers, instead of having to go through pediatricians. Mead

(Enfamil) & Ross Labs (Similac) claim on their websites that they began

producing a powdered formula in the late 20s, but history reminds us that

the economical disaster in the 30s led to a boom of breastfeeding

families. Ross Labs claims that in 1964, they introduced the

pre-sterilized, pre-filled bottles of formula to hospitals.

History also reminds us that during the late 50s and early 60s, products

that were " scientific " were favored over old-fashioned items.

I think we're just now seeing how this national experiment pans out.

[Guest guest]

>, I disagree with your statement that says children who receive

>formula aren't " just fine " In most cases they are fine.

What do you mean by " just fine " ? Here's the list of risks in the American

Academy of Pediatricians of not feeding an infant human milk: diarrhea,

lower respiratory infection (such as RSV and rotavirus), ear infections

(otitis media), Influenza type b (bacteremia), bacterial meningitis, food

poisoning (botulism)

urinary tract infection, necrotizing enterocolitis (portions of the bowel

tract die), intestinal perforation

sudden infant death syndrome, insulin-dependent diabetes mellitus, Crohn's

disease ( O'Rourke, of Poltergeist, died from this at age 9!),

ulcerative colitis, lymphoma (childhood cancer), leukemia, allergic

diseases (studied children for 17 years!), liver diseases, celiac disease,

other chronic digestive diseases, decreased cognitive development...

My SIL chose to formula feed her son, and he's had frequent ear infections,

RSV, UTIs, and has some undiagnosed digestive disorder as well. I can't

help but wonder if his illness symptoms would be lessened if he were given

breast milk... even from a donor!

>Her mother who had breastfed my mom and sister discouraged her from

>breastfeeding because she blamed her large breasts as the result of

>breastfeeding.

Unfortunately, your mother was a victim of misinformation. I'm sure you

know that breast size is determined by heredity, not by

breastfeeding. Most women complain that their breasts decrease in size

once they wean.

In addition to the risks to a child not fed human milk, women who don't

breastfeed place themselves in unnecessary risk. This is what is listed in

the AAP's statement for risks to women who do not breastfeed: more

postpartum bleeding, slower uterine involution, higher menstrual blood loss

over the months after delivery, slower return to prepregnant weight,

quicker resumption of ovulation and decreased child spacing, decreased bone

remineralization postpartum, with increase risk for hip fractures in the

postmenopausal period, and increased risk of ovarian cancer and

premenopausal breast cancer.

> All six of us are healthy well adjusted adults. None of us have ever been

>in the hospital except to deliver our own babies and none of us suffer from

> " emotional " issues.

But what about when you hit your post-menopausal age? For most of women,

this is in our 40s! Our choices about breastfeeding will impact us

then!! There are even studies that suggest that our daughters who we

breastfed will have a reduced risk for breast cancer and uterine cancers,

even if they never breastfeed.

>I am choosing to breastfeed my daughter because I think it is the best for

>her but I don't " condemn " those who choose to give their children formula.

I don't condemn women who choose not to breastfeed either. Silently, I

wish they knew the choice they were really making, though.

>Most babies who have formula grow up to be healthy individuals.

I think the jury is still out on this. When was formula really made

available to the public? I know that in the early 70s, regulations were

lifted from formula manufacturers to sell their products DIRECTLY to

mothers, instead of having to go through pediatricians. Mead

(Enfamil) & Ross Labs (Similac) claim on their websites that they began

producing a powdered formula in the late 20s, but history reminds us that

the economical disaster in the 30s led to a boom of breastfeeding

families. Ross Labs claims that in 1964, they introduced the

pre-sterilized, pre-filled bottles of formula to hospitals.

History also reminds us that during the late 50s and early 60s, products

that were " scientific " were favored over old-fashioned items.

I think we're just now seeing how this national experiment pans out.

[Guest guest]

>Crohn's disease ( O'Rourke, of Poltergeist, died from this at age 9!)

Just surfed to a webpage that said she died at age 12... Still, to think

that breastfeeding could protect a child from having this disease, even 12

years later... Why risk it?

[Guest guest]

>Crohn's disease ( O'Rourke, of Poltergeist, died from this at age 9!)

Just surfed to a webpage that said she died at age 12... Still, to think

that breastfeeding could protect a child from having this disease, even 12

years later... Why risk it?

[Guest guest]

>Can I get an AMEN?!! I really find it hard to believe that on a

>*Breastfeeding* support list, we would have to defend our opinions about

>formula.

Thanks Jenn! I was beginning to wonder if I had moved so far towards

" radical " that I couldn't see " mainstream " anymore.

[Guest guest]

>Can I get an AMEN?!! I really find it hard to believe that on a

>*Breastfeeding* support list, we would have to defend our opinions about

>formula.

Thanks Jenn! I was beginning to wonder if I had moved so far towards

" radical " that I couldn't see " mainstream " anymore.

[Guest guest]

>Can I get an AMEN?!! I really find it hard to believe that on a

>*Breastfeeding* support list, we would have to defend our opinions about

>formula.

Thanks Jenn! I was beginning to wonder if I had moved so far towards

" radical " that I couldn't see " mainstream " anymore.

[Guest guest]

> >

> Sorry about the misinterpretation Blithe.

> Joan

That's ok, I'm not the best at expressing myself .

Blithe

[Guest guest]

> >

> Sorry about the misinterpretation Blithe.

> Joan

That's ok, I'm not the best at expressing myself .

Blithe

[Guest guest]

> >

> Sorry about the misinterpretation Blithe.

> Joan

That's ok, I'm not the best at expressing myself .

Blithe

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 09/05/2000 7:26:25 PM Pacific Daylight Time,

snarr@... writes:

<< Of course I do not tell him

he cannot be as good as the three I have breastfed >>

this is nonsense.. Come on, are we all to believe that he cannot be as GOOD

just because of the method used to feed him?? my oldest is one of the

smartest kids in our family.. and he was on formula most of his first year..

This discussion is starting to annoy me, and I think its getting to the point

where many peoples feelings are going to get hurt.. we should all support

each other, love each other, and give each other a big hug, just for being

mommies and giving birth..

Christi

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 09/05/2000 7:26:25 PM Pacific Daylight Time,

snarr@... writes:

<< Of course I do not tell him

he cannot be as good as the three I have breastfed >>

this is nonsense.. Come on, are we all to believe that he cannot be as GOOD

just because of the method used to feed him?? my oldest is one of the

smartest kids in our family.. and he was on formula most of his first year..

This discussion is starting to annoy me, and I think its getting to the point

where many peoples feelings are going to get hurt.. we should all support

each other, love each other, and give each other a big hug, just for being

mommies and giving birth..

Christi

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 09/05/2000 7:26:25 PM Pacific Daylight Time,

snarr@... writes:

<< Of course I do not tell him

he cannot be as good as the three I have breastfed >>

this is nonsense.. Come on, are we all to believe that he cannot be as GOOD

just because of the method used to feed him?? my oldest is one of the

smartest kids in our family.. and he was on formula most of his first year..

This discussion is starting to annoy me, and I think its getting to the point

where many peoples feelings are going to get hurt.. we should all support

each other, love each other, and give each other a big hug, just for being

mommies and giving birth..

Christi