testing

[Guest guest]

Hi Carolyn,

I am pleased to report, I received the tape yesterday in the mail with the

actions to the words. They are great songs. I will let you know how

everything goes. Thank you so much for all the trouble you went to. I know

how even just wrapping something up, with little ones, can be a challenge and

then getting to the post office, as well.

Marcia

Mom to Sara, and Lucas

[Guest guest]

Carolyn: I agree, it's been too quiet here lately!

But, it seems like there's a bunch of birthdays coming

up....maybe we'll get to hear about them?????

Gotta be something going on out there!

I know it's been rather quiet at our house. Not alot

new to report. School is going well. Spring (and the

spring thunderstorms) has sprung, and the weather has

been nice. We just seem to be on " cruise control "

enjoying being outdoors more.

Judi-Mom to Sam & , 3, Identical Twins

--- tonycarolyn <tonycarolyn@...> wrote:

> I don't seem to be getting any messages from the

> list lately.......I hope it's just me and that

> things haven't gone all quiet!!

>

> Carolyn

> Mum To on(8), (6 1/2), Emma (4)ds and

> Nicki (nearly 3)ds

>

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

RE: Testing and the big guys, and a few other thoughts:

Corporations have their own in-house laboratories, and indeed they DO test

every batch of every product they put out the door. It's called the Quality

Assurance and Quality Control part of the corporations. Scores of people

work only on the wording of the testing procedures and keeping records. It

is a tedious and time consuming part of the business.

They also keep a sample of every single batch they make of every item. In

case of law suits, they have these samples ready to put to the tests.

Having worked as a liaison between a biomedical company and the FDA for a few

years, I am very familiar with QA and QC. All of the major players, as well

as many of the smaller companies, follow such rules. It keeps them solvent

in case of customers who see a quick buck to be gained in court.

I do not make lotions, but CP soap. I also keep a QC/QA record of every

batch of soap I make, including lot numbers of raw ingredients, as well as

keeping a sample of every batch of soap I make. Because I do not keep a

record of which batch of soap is sold to whom, I cannot tell where every bar

came from. But I DO have a sample of every single soap I have made. If

required, I could produce a sample of one particular soap every time I made

it. Tedious? yes; time consuming? not so bad; I have it down to a science by

now. But at least I will be able to defend myself should someone file a

claim.

Diane s

Wheaton Soapworks

[Guest guest]

I very much appreciate your advice on the QC/QA

procedures, keeping lot numbers, etc. I had not

thought of doing this, but that is quite wise. I am

not sure how to do it for sea salt I buy at Whole

Foods, but I guess I should keep all receipts, and

keep of log of everything. Gosh, this could be worse

than record keeping for the I.R.S. Sure glad I'm not

selling anything yet!

I do have a friend (PhD. in Zoology, now a

chiropractor) who worked for a major corporation about

20-25 years ago who would not buy any cosmetics from

me (it's probably the most major " door to door "

cosmetics co. in America. Four letters to their name.

Anyway, a few batches tested bad, because they didn't

have enough preservative in them presumably. His boss

told him to shut up and ship them anyway, because they

couldn't throw it all out. And if I recall, it was on

an eye product. Needless to say, he quit shortly

afterward, and I did the same after he told me of this

problem. I would hope that all corporations have

great qc, qa, procedures, etc., but I use to work for

NASA contractors, and not everyone has the high

standards that you have. Some people would rather

hide mistakes, and hope for the best. We only have

the huge mistakes in NASA that ended up in numerous

astronauts losing their lives, as well as the

interplanetary project problems that have occurred

lately to show how well qa/qc can work (it only works

as well as the ethics of the people doing the work,

and then even very ethical people make honest

mistakes). I am glad we had this discussion though,

because I had never thought of doing QC/QA and

documentation to the extent that you do, but now I

will. Take care, Bev

--- MrsSmitch@... wrote:

> From: MrsSmitch@...

>

> RE: Testing and the big guys, and a few other

> thoughts:

>

> Corporations have their own in-house laboratories,

> and indeed they DO test

> every batch of every product they put out the door.

> It's called the Quality

> Assurance and Quality Control part of the

> corporations.

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

This is why I am so interested in the required gov't

regs. I know that QA/QC is far stricter in some

industries than others (food vs. pharmaceuticals, for

example). But I really appreciate the reminders about

our own QA/QC whether we sell or not. If nothing

else, it can help us with our own formulations.

Thanks, Bev (the following reprinted with

permission).

yup, go right ahead

Re: testing

>Would you PLEASE send this to the list, or may I post

>it? I think there is a feeling that every

corporation

>tests every batch, and unless it's required of the

>gov't, not every corp. will do that much testing.

>Thanks, Bev

>

>--- Organix <autumn@...> wrote:

>> Bev:

>>

>> Most companies that I know of (I'm the PT chemist

at

>> All Natural Botanicals)

>> do not test any where near every batch! You would

>> be amazed at how many of

>> the 'bog boys' really don't do any challenge

testing

>> at all! Most will test

>> the first batch, and some will test the first three

>> batches. After that,

>> samples are randomly tested. Maybe every 20-30

>> batches. Like you said, if

>> the formula is the same, and your quality control

is

>> good, it shouldn't

>> change. The biggest source of contamination that I

>> have seen is the water

>> supply!

>>

>> There are a lot of 'little tests that you can do in

>> house, even without a

>> lab. For stability, try freeze-thaw cycles and

>> extended heat periods. You

>> could also introduce your product to the elements

>> outside. Leave the lid

>> off your cream, stick your fingers in it and see

>> what grows. Not

>> scientific, but if you have growing stuff after a

>> few days, you will want to

>> check your preservative system!

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

This is why I am so interested in the required gov't

regs. I know that QA/QC is far stricter in some

industries than others (food vs. pharmaceuticals, for

example). But I really appreciate the reminders about

our own QA/QC whether we sell or not. If nothing

else, it can help us with our own formulations.

Thanks, Bev (the following reprinted with

permission).

yup, go right ahead

Re: testing

>Would you PLEASE send this to the list, or may I post

>it? I think there is a feeling that every

corporation

>tests every batch, and unless it's required of the

>gov't, not every corp. will do that much testing.

>Thanks, Bev

>

>--- Organix <autumn@...> wrote:

>> Bev:

>>

>> Most companies that I know of (I'm the PT chemist

at

>> All Natural Botanicals)

>> do not test any where near every batch! You would

>> be amazed at how many of

>> the 'bog boys' really don't do any challenge

testing

>> at all! Most will test

>> the first batch, and some will test the first three

>> batches. After that,

>> samples are randomly tested. Maybe every 20-30

>> batches. Like you said, if

>> the formula is the same, and your quality control

is

>> good, it shouldn't

>> change. The biggest source of contamination that I

>> have seen is the water

>> supply!

>>

>> There are a lot of 'little tests that you can do in

>> house, even without a

>> lab. For stability, try freeze-thaw cycles and

>> extended heat periods. You

>> could also introduce your product to the elements

>> outside. Leave the lid

>> off your cream, stick your fingers in it and see

>> what grows. Not

>> scientific, but if you have growing stuff after a

>> few days, you will want to

>> check your preservative system!

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Is there a group that sets standards for the

soap/toiletries industry? For example, in the

building industry, one of the most respected groups is

the Southern Building Code, which merged with CABO

(don't know the words that go with this acronym). But

they publish the code (regs) that many builders,

cities, etc. rely on in the construction/inspection

industry. So for example, if someone is having a home

built, the builder uses XXXX, year of this code in

their contract. Unfortunately, some builders are

scammers, and use 1992 code, and not 1998, or 1999

code, so buyers don't always get the best. But I

digress. The main point is this, isn't there any

group that sets standards in this (toiletries)

industry that most choose to abide by, including

QA/QC? Thanks, Bev

--- Organix <autumn@...> wrote:

> From what I understand, QA/QC is part of GMPs.

> The FDA does not regulate GMPs, but does expect the

> manufacturers to adhere to them. The only time they

> will do an audit is if a manufacturer is making

> unallowed claims or if there is a problem. Most

> major insurance companies also require that you

> adhere to GMPs.

>

> Autumn Blum

> Organix Natural Health

> http://organix.net

>

> Message: 2

> Date: Sun, 26 Mar 2000 18:11:09 -0800 (PST)

> From: Bev Hammond <bevhammond4@...>

> Subject: Re: Re: Lab Testing

>

> Do you keep samples of all your input products also,

> or just your output (final) product? Also, does

> anyone know if the QA?QC that toiletry companies do

> is

> required by the FDA, or some other agency, or is it

> done to protect themselves, make a better product,

> etc.

> If anyone knows where these regs. are, I would

> appreciate a note. Thanks, Bev

>

>

>

>

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Good Morning,

I'm testing this morning. I have gotten NO email, which is very unusual.

Just checking to make sure email is working.

S

________________________________________________________________

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[Guest guest]

Hello : I'm still here, but on vacation. Just read the 269 messages that

came while I left for 3 days! Of course that includes the mail from PA's parent

line as well as " official " mail but hey - it was fun to hit the delte button!

Sara

>>> stolzfamily@... - 04/27/0 10:28 AM >>>

Good Morning,

I'm testing this morning. I have gotten NO email, which is very unusual.

Just checking to make sure email is working.

S

________________________________________________________________

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[Guest guest]

You need to get everything ruled out. You need to be asking these questions to a

Dr. that specializes in CFS. The net is great for learning about supplements and

new developments but you need a

solid DX & you can't get that on the web. Has you found a Dr. in your area that

specializes in CFS?

Steve

michelle cervera wrote:

> Does anyone no what othere test I should have ruled out incase this

> could be something else instead of cfs? Why are people getting brain

> lessions this is scaring me?

>

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

> Failed tests, classes skipped, forgotten locker combinations.

> Remember the good 'ol days

> 1/4053/4/_/531724/_/958929107/

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

>

> This list is intended for patients to share personal experiences with each

other, not to give medical advice. If you are interested in any treatment

discussed here, please consult your doctor.

[Guest guest]

I am working with a nauopath but I hear that this

stuff called doxcycline is being used for cfs? dont

think reg docs no much about cfs.

--- Steve <moores@...> wrote:

> You need to get everything ruled out. You need to be

> asking these questions to a Dr. that specializes in

> CFS. The net is great for learning about supplements

> and new developments but you need a

> solid DX & you can't get that on the web. Has you

> found a Dr. in your area that specializes in CFS?

> Steve

>

> michelle cervera wrote:

>

> > Does anyone no what othere test I should have

> ruled out incase this

> > could be something else instead of cfs? Why are

> people getting brain

> > lessions this is scaring me?

> >

> >

>

------------------------------------------------------------------------

> > Failed tests, classes skipped, forgotten locker

> combinations.

> > Remember the good 'ol days

> >

>

1/4053/4/_/531724/_/958929107/

> >

>

------------------------------------------------------------------------

> >

> > This list is intended for patients to share

> personal experiences with each other, not to give

> medical advice. If you are interested in any

> treatment discussed here, please consult your

> doctor.

>

>

>

------------------------------------------------------------------------

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>

------------------------------------------------------------------------

>

> This list is intended for patients to share personal

> experiences with each other, not to give medical

> advice. If you are interested in any treatment

> discussed here, please consult your doctor.

>

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

lessions are very common with CFIDS -- they disappear for those who recover naturally...

- cause is likely coagulation OR oxygen starvation OR viral/bacteria infection in the brain

See Osler's Web OR if you like pictures - the Nightingale book...

The reality of CFIDS is extremely nasty... and I mean nasty -- it is a catastrophic progressive illness that is systemic....

in the UK the estimates is at least 10% death rate directly from CFIDS and at least a 5% suicide rate...

Ken Lassesen 2 @ 2 ft PWC, 2 @ 4ft PWC2 ft PWC: http://www.folkarts.com/idef/4 ft PWC: http://corgi.folkarts.com/Fax: (520) 832-6836 ICQ #: 2122097 (also Netmeeting with Video)

testing

Does anyone no what othere test I should have ruled out incase this could be something else instead of cfs? Why are people getting brain lessions this is scaring me?

[Guest guest]

forget about treatment get a DX first -- not from a regular doctor --but from a

dr. that specializes in CFS. The treatment should follow the DX not . You need

to start from square one. After you

get a dx go back to you Npath if you like but you Npath is not qualified to do

the type of testing that must be done to rule out other conditions that could

explain your fatigue.

good luck

Steve

[Guest guest]

Hi sis,

I noticed yesterday that a message I sent took longer to get posted than one I sent out later, which was posted before the other was!

Also today, Susie and I tried so hard to get messages back and forth with ICQ since our phone program wouldn't let her log on and it took 15 minutes or more to get a message through and couldn't even get a chat opened! We had to give up. Anyone else who uses ICQ having problems with messages and here on the list?

Thanks for any comments :-)

{{{HUGS}}} & God bless, Bonnie

*****************************With God, ALL things are possible.*****************************

[Guest guest]

lori, my prayers to you and tommy!!! i hope the tests procedures go

alright....i too get nervous when they put ashton under....but she has been

under now over fifteen times, so i am used to it......... but i still get

antsy nervous each new time..... hang in there, good luck and take care......

leah

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 11/1/00 8:14:54 AM Eastern Standard Time,

lori02@... writes:

<< endcoscopy and check him for all food allergies and celiac (even though

the blood test came back neg) and doing some biopsies. Has anyones child

ever had these tests? >>

Hey Lori,

Maddie has had 2 endoscopies. Her blood work actually did indicate

celiac and even the day of the test, the GI doc thought he saw flattening of

the villi. However, the biopsy came back negative and instead, the test

showed that she has GERD. She started meds at 2. She got better and was

off them for about a year, then it came back and she's now on reglan and

zantac.

Good luck,

Donna

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 11/2/00 3:17:38 PM Eastern Standard Time,

hsmyangel@... writes:

<< What is GERD? >>

Gastroesophageal reflux disease.

Donna

[Guest guest]

What is GERD?

Loriann

Wife to Dewight

Mom to , 10 years, DS-ASD, ADHD, ODD

And , 16 months and Strong Willed

[Guest guest]

At 10:18 AM 11/2/00 -1000, you wrote:

>What is GERD?

Gastro Esophageal Reflux Disease

FAncy name for permanent heartburn.

[Guest guest]

GERD is gastrointestinal-reflux disease

[Guest guest]

oops, its been a long nite at work,lol gastro esoughgeal reflux disease, its

very common, they have even linked it to asthma, i have been taken 150mg bid

and it has helped greatly with my asthma. shawna.

[Guest guest]

Goodbye, Timbo.

granny

---

" Beautiful that war and all its deeds of carnage must

in time be utterly lost. " -- Walt Whitman

http://www.bspyle.com/granny.html

testing

> Hello ,

>

>

>

> --

> Best regards,

>

> Timbo

>

> Casten ZDC mailto:tcasten@...

> NATCA National Communications Chairman

> NatcaNet Administrator

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

just testing

[Guest guest]

testing

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 4/5/01 4:07:53 PM Central Daylight Time,

rdill@... writes:

>

> Rick ... whose daughter was tested without harm

HI

I think Sara quite enjoyed her testing experience lolol she came home today

asking to bubble, I was like WHAT Blow bubbles...she said no bubble. She then

drew on a piece of paper, little circles, she then she colored them in. I

knew exactly what she meant by her visual cues for me lol

I know some don't like the tests, but I look at it this way, if it makes a

Reg Ed teacher nervous then TEST them lolol I did tell Sara's teacher it will

put some accountability back on the Reg Ed teacher for what they taught Sara

this year. Whether it does or doesn't I will be interested in seeing her

results.

Kathy mom to Sara 9.............Sara enjoys anything the typical kids are

doing....even tests