Intro

[Guest guest]

Hi Abigail,

I'm from Manila too:-) Glad you're here.

One alternative is homeopathy. I'm sure Sheri can answer any of your

questions regarding it.

How did you learn about this group?

Ella

On 1/10/06, Abigail Reyes <nrsvac@...> wrote:

>

> Hi,

> Just want to introduce myself.

> I'm Abigail from Manila and a mother of a 17 month old girl and I want

> to learn of available alternatives to vaccinating my child.

> I'm pleased to join this group.

>

>

> ---------------------------------

> DSL Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less

>

>

[Guest guest]

Welcome Cea! As you will see, lots of discussions go on here and it

is truly both interesting and amazing. Not to mention shocking at

times and very sad.

I'm Mum to Simone, aged 8 in March 2006 and she's not vaccinated. We

are in Queensland, Australia.

I dont' argue anymore - just refuse to talk to anyone about it if I

know that they do. It causes too much friction and quite frankly I

am fed up with it. However, to find a group (here and the OT4VAX

group) where I know I can and do talk freely with people whom

I KNOW agree with me is truly wonderful. It's been a fantastic

learning experience. I have met some truly wonderful friends on

these lists.

All the best,

www.onegrp.com/?McGrath

>

> Hello everyone,

> Just a quick intro... I'm Cea, mum to Finn (9 months) who is

unvaxed.

> I live in South Wales uk. I've probably had all the standard

arguments

> with health professionals about my decision, some of them have

gotten

> pretty ugly! But my GP (family doctor), whilst he doesn't agree

ith

> me, has been very clear that he respects my decision as Finn's

mother,

> which I'm happy with. Just wish I didn't have to justify myself

all

> the time to other people...

>

> Anyhow, I'm just here to learn really. Pleased to meet you all.

> Cea

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Cea

, mum to unvaccinated Amber here, 2 1/2 yrs. Nice to see some

younger ones comming up now that are all evidentally well!

As time goes on and as you find more support really arguments at you

seem to become more irrelevant as the questions/attitudes others bring

up seem so ignorant really, and few are prepared or able to answer

your legitimate questions satisfactorily....you become the expert in

effect. Well done for being resonsible for finding out about your

little boys health fully. If you're interested in a sideline UK group

for unvaccinating parents, Sue or I can give you the link.

& Amber

In Vaccinations , " ceaquin73 " <ceaquin@h...> wrote:

>

> Hello everyone,

> Just a quick intro... I'm Cea, mum to Finn (9 months) who is

unvaxed.

> I live in South Wales uk. I've probably had all the standard

arguments

> with health professionals about my decision, some of them have

gotten

> pretty ugly! But my GP (family doctor), whilst he doesn't agree ith

> me, has been very clear that he respects my decision as Finn's

mother,

> which I'm happy with. Just wish I didn't have to justify myself all

> the time to other people...

>

> Anyhow, I'm just here to learn really. Pleased to meet you all.

> Cea

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Abigail --

Welcome to the group. I'm , I live in NY. This group has some great

info and I'm sure you'll find it very informative.

Health & blessings,

Project MAHMA -- Moms At Home Making A difference...

and a lot of money!

http://www.ExcitingHealth.CreateMyFuture.com

http://www.Shaklee.net/ExcitingHealth

1-866-312-8064

[Guest guest]

whereabouts in ny? I am in Tonawanda north of Buffalo?

--- P <ExcitingHealth@...> wrote:

> Hi Abigail --

>

> Welcome to the group. I'm , I live in NY.

> This group has some great

> info and I'm sure you'll find it very informative.

>

> Health & blessings,

>

>

> Project MAHMA -- Moms At Home Making A difference...

> and a lot of money!

>

> http://www.ExcitingHealth.CreateMyFuture.com

>

> http://www.Shaklee.net/ExcitingHealth

>

> 1-866-312-8064

>

>

> [Non-text portions of this message have been

> removed]

>

>

" When we give government

the power to make medical decisions

for us, we, in essence, accept that

the state owns our bodies. "

~U.S.Representative Ron , MD

The Nuremberg Code (to which NZ is a signatory) describes Informed Choice as:

- A choice made on the basis of adequate information concerning research and all

available alternatives.

- A choice made without controlling influences such as force, fraud, deceit,

duress, over-reaching or other forms of constraint or coercion.

Does this not apply to us?

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Hi Abigail --

I'm in Mahopac -- it's a small town just west of Danbury, CT. So what kind

of winter are you having up there -- so far it hasn't been to bad down here

-- it was in the 50's today -- downright spring like. :-)

Health & blessings,

Project MAHMA -- Moms At Home Making A difference...

and a lot of money!

http://www.ExcitingHealth.CreateMyFuture.com

http://www.Shaklee.net/ExcitingHealth

1-866-312-8064

[Guest guest]

Hi All,

Thank you for the warm welcome!! I have been starting to learn a lot already

from this group and i've only been here a few days! Thanks for the open sharing.

, we dont have winter here at all. Its 23-30 C here. Blessing to you too.

Ella, actually you were my link here, I saw your post in sp and was very

interested so i joined up. Its very interesting here.

Abigail

---------------------------------

Photos

Got holiday prints? See all the ways to get quality prints in your hands ASAP.

[Guest guest]

>

>Hi

> My name is , I have two young boys, Ayden 3 years and Seamus 4

months.

> I learned of this group from the Weston Price group I am on.

> We do not vaccinate as of yet. I can honestly say we may never

vaccinate, but my mind remains open to advancements made toward better

preservation methods.

Hi ,

Welcome

You will get lots of info and support here.

Mercury, the preservative, IS NOT the only danger with vaccines.

1. Mercury has NOT totally been removed from vaccines

A. Those that say mercury-free, private testing has shown there is still

mercury

B. Many still have a trace of mercury

C. And many have full amounts of mercury - many flu vax (adult & children)

DT, tD, etc.

2. Mercury is NOT the only problem with vaccine

And that is what was covered all of class 1A............................

make a list

Contamination with mycoplasma and bacteria

Contamination with monkey viruses

Contamination with RNA, DNA

Aluminum and other adjuvants

The new preservative replacing mercury in some vaccines - 2PE

Other additives in vaccines - vary according to the vaccine - msg,

formaldyhyde, antibiotics, phenol, sorbitol, gelatin and more

The antigen itself and how it effects the immune system

The whole theory is in error - stimulation of antibodies does not give

immunity - antibodies do not mean immunity - the are signs of exposure, but

one small aspect of the immune system

No long term research

No comparison in research with placebo group - only another vaccinated group

Ignoring post marketing data of reactions, injury and death

No individualization - one size fits all

No screening for immune problems and allergies

Children and adults have reacted with injury and death after MMR which

never had mercury in it

That's a start.

>v I would like to travel with my children out of country in the future, I

wonder if any of you who have not vaccinated are able to do this??>

You can travel anywhere in the world without vaccines being required

(except a few places in Africa and S. America that require Yellow Fever vax

(very few countries and probably a way of getting out of that one even -

its a bad vax too) They will lead you to believe they are required

elsewhere by they are NOT.

> I actually have an opportunity to voyage on a cruise this spring from

Florida, to Half Moon Cay, to Grand Cayman, to Cozumel, Mexico and back. I

am contemplating going with my baby who will be 7 months by then. My

hesitation is the fact that I do not vaccinate and do not want to just for

this trip. I will not go if it comes down to that. My thoughts on going

are that I just won't get off the boat, if that makes any sense. I would

appreciate any input from you all about this subject, things to consider etc.

>

Sounds wonderful. You will not have any problem about vaccination.

> I would also like to add I used to work with disabled children,

including but not limited to ADD, ADHD, autism, CP, MS etc. prior to

starting my own family. I have some experience with the care and treatment

of special needs children, which I believe is what fueled my decision to

not vaccinate, as well as just the compelling research indicating the

dangers thereof.

>

> I look forward to learning and sharing on this forum.

> Bless

> V

Thanks for sharing that. Glad you became aware.

Ask questions!

Welcome

Sheri

listowner

>

--------------------------------------------------------

Sheri Nakken, R.N., MA, Hahnemannian Homeopath

Vaccination Information & Choice Network, Nevada City CA & Wales UK

$$ Donations to help in the work - accepted by Paypal account

vaccineinfo@... voicemail US 530-740-0561

(go to http://www.paypal.com) or by mail

Vaccines - http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/vaccine.htm

Vaccine Dangers On-Line course - http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/vaccineclass.htm

Homeopathy On-Line course - http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/homeo.htm

ANY INFO OBTAINED HERE NOT TO BE CONSTRUED AS MEDICAL

OR LEGAL ADVICE. THE DECISION TO VACCINATE IS YOURS AND YOURS ALONE.

******

" Just look at us. Everything is backwards; everything is upside down.

Doctors destroy health, lawyers destroy justice, universities destroy

knowledge, governments destroy freedom, the major media destroy information

and religions destroy spirituality " .... Ellner

[Guest guest]

Welcome, Kim!

intro

> Hello,

> My name is Kim and I have 1 son, Elijah, that turned 2 in Oct. We do

> not vaccinate, still breastfeed (hoping to do self led weaning, not

> looking like anytime soon...), cosleep and generally do all the other

> ap practices. I am hoping to gain some good info from this site and

> looking forward to getting to know some of you.

> Thanks,

> Kim

> NC

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Welcome Ming2sy and your husband

I'm Derik and live in California USA and I'm 48 years old with SMA adult

onset. I'm one of the few that are close in age to your husband. Whats your

husbands name? Theres alot of loving and supportive people in this group. Like

your

husband I've recently had to be retired from the regular work force and regain

my sense of values as far as adjustments to my productivity. Sure is hard

asking for help but its a humbling thats inevitable. I'm a handicapped speller

too. j/k Two things have been helping me alot. One I don't over do it with

exertion and I'm able to function well moderately. But if I over do it just

alittle. It takes me a good five days to recover from one incident. Leaving me

falling down all over the place in those five days. The second thing thats

helped me

lately and its simular to the first. Is to know when to stop and eat my

humble pie. Its far better for me to stop early than it is trying to regain my

strength after a fall that in most cases breaks a bone. (Knock on wood), " its a

saying " I havent broken a bone for almost two years. Tea Tree oil heals my

wounds

on knee caps, elbows and shoulders without stiff scabs forming making bending

joints painful. Well theres a couple of helpful hints and I'm sure your

husband has devised many ways to do many of his prior tasks. He is very blessed

to

have such loving friends, family and wife. Praying helps alot. And I have also

found great success by just loving people and life as best I can. Even

sarcastic gratitude is better than depression for me. Loving creates an energy

within me that heals and strengthens. When calmity and distress befall me. I

seem

to weaken quickly and effects my nerves in a bad way. Thanks for sharing your

husband with us..................... Derik

[Guest guest]

Hi Lana --

Welcome to the group. I'm . I live in NY with my DH and 2 great kids

- both partially vaxed, and I help individuals and families overcome health

challenges from a nutritional approach.

I look forward to getting to know you.

Health & blessings,

Project MAHMA -- Moms At Home Making A difference...

and a lot of money!

http://www.ExcitingHealth.CreateMyFuture.com

http://www.ThisIsYourShot.biz

http://www.Shaklee.net/ExcitingHealth

1-866-312-8064

[Guest guest]

Welcome to the group. A good tip I can give you is start a journal. And set some realistic goals. Not just about weight BUT i would imagine staying home so much there are things you would like to do. Maybe go to a mall. Maybe a movie. Facing your fears may help your esteem. Do you live alone? Maybe sit down with family and come up with some goals. I totally understand fears. I hate driving in the winter. welcome.

NH... Mom to Abby Liz 10/94 Anne 7/99

[Guest guest]

Good for you ... that is the way to go! TeraseeSuzi YeahRite <diabet60@...> wrote: I am , from Arkansas. On December 1 2005 I weighed 423 pounds.I have Type 2 Diabetes, due to my weight.Today I weighed 395 Pounds.I use a diet software to record my foods, and I have found it helps me. It gives me grades for how I eat each day. A++ to Failing. And suggest what I should get less or more of. And it guides me. Showing my progress on charts. Its just the little push I needed to stay motivated. My Blood sugar was dangerously high the fist of December. And today it is normal. As if I have no diabetes at all. Due to it being controlled by what I eat. I do not need insulin or anything

of that sort any more.This isn't going to be easy. I probably weigh more than anyone else here in this group. Hard to say. But hiding from the truth and ignoring it is why I look like this. I am 6' tall. And 395 pounds. I suffer from anxiety, social phobia and haven't left my home in 10 years other than to see a doctor twice.The diet software helped me to set a realist goal of where I want to be in 6 month. And in one year. I was never realistic before about dieting. I went on Optifast when Oprah did and lost over 100 pounds in 3 months. Eating nothing solid. Just drinking three shakes each day. Of course the weight came back then some when Optifast ended. I was faithful and loyal to the program, and fasted totally for that three months. Even with my very abusive, non supportive husband having me go out to eat with him, me sitting there drinking water with a little lemon in it, while

he pigged out. He would order take out and such at home. Bring home candy and such that he never brought home before. He isn't a candy eater. Etc... I cannot believe I went through all that, only to gain it all back and more. I am so angry at myself!! I didn't have diabetes then. I wasn't this fat then. Diabetes is serious! Its one of the top killers, and I don't want to die. I don't want to be lonely and sad in a loveless marriage any more. And I don't want to just exist, I want to live. And I want to become someone that can be loved, hugged, and so on. Not a public punching bag taking teasing, stares and cruel jokes.December 1, 2005 was the beginning of a new life for me. And for the first time, I am going to put me first, and I'm going to keep telling myself.. I deserve better. I have always lived for the other person, and I didn't matter.

Thanks for listening.Hugs (bett) One Day Ata Time, Terasee

Autos. Looking for a sweet ride? Get pricing, reviews, more on new and used cars.

[Guest guest]

Welcome , congrats on the weight lost so far! It's great you found a software program that you like. It's great that you're off insulin. Do you work out at home? I'm sorry that you have it so rough at home. It's so much easier when you have support - but we'll be here for you. Good luck - you do deserve it!Suzi YeahRite <diabet60@...> wrote: I am , from Arkansas. On December 1 2005 I weighed 423 pounds.I have Type 2 Diabetes, due to my weight.Today I weighed 395 Pounds.I use a diet software to record my foods, and I have found it helps me. It gives me grades for how I eat each day. A++ to Failing. And suggest what I should get less or more of. And it guides me. Showing my progress on charts. Its just the little push I needed to stay

motivated. My Blood sugar was dangerously high the fist of December. And today it is normal. As if I have no diabetes at all. Due to it being controlled by what I eat. I do not need insulin or anything of that sort any more. This isn't going to be easy. I probably weigh more than anyone else here in this group. Hard to say. But hiding from the truth and ignoring it is why I look like this. I am 6' tall. And 395 pounds. I suffer from anxiety, social phobia and haven't left my home in 10 years other than to see a doctor twice. The diet software helped me to set a realist goal of where I want to be in 6 month. And in one year. I was never realistic before about dieting. I went on Optifast when Oprah did and lost over 100 pounds in 3 months. Eating nothing solid. Just drinking three shakes each day. Of course the weight came back then some when Optifast ended. I was faithful and

loyal to the program, and fasted totally for that three months. Even with my very abusive, non supportive husband having me go out to eat with him, me sitting there drinking water with a little lemon in it, while he pigged out. He would order take out and such at home. Bring home candy and such that he never brought home before. He isn't a candy eater. Etc... I cannot believe I went through all that, only to gain it all back and more. I am so angry at myself!! I didn't have diabetes then. I wasn't this fat then. Diabetes is serious! Its one of the top killers, and I don't want to die. I don't want to be lonely and sad in a loveless marriage any more. And I don't want to just exist, I want to live. And I want to become someone that can be loved, hugged, and so on. Not a public punching bag taking teasing, stares and cruel jokes. December 1, 2005 was the beginning of

a new life for me. And for the first time, I am going to put me first, and I'm going to keep telling myself.. I deserve better. I have always lived for the other person, and I didn't matter. Thanks for listening.Hugs (bett) Live, Love, Laugh

[Guest guest]

>I use a diet software to record my foods, and I have found it helps me.

I'm a bit behind so maybe someone else asked, but what software do you use?

>My Blood sugar was dangerously high the fist of December. And today it is

normal. As if I have no diabetes at all. Due to it being controlled by

what I eat. I do not need insulin or anything of that sort any more.

See how powerful food can be?!

Do you belong to any diabetes lists? We have links to 2 on our Links page

that are specifically for the large-sized person, one a group, Diabetic

Friends

Diabetic-Friends2/

and the other a regular listserv type

http://users.telerama.com/~moose/fa-diab.html

> I probably weigh more than anyone else here in this group.

Nope. You're not.

>I am 6' tall.

A *really* big gal! I feel sorry for the child you once were, probably being

teased right and left for everything!

> I suffer from anxiety,

social phobia and haven't left my home in 10 years other than to see a

doctor twice.

You've got to get yourself out of the house, girl! I know it's going to be

hard - I had agoraphobia and panic attacks soon after my son was born 22

years ago and it took a while to get over them, and now and then I find

myself wanting to isolate even now, but I force myself to leave the house at

least one a day, even if it's only to walk to the corner and back. Ask your

doc about counselling, maybe someone who can come to your house once a week

to start, if your insurance covers it. If not, I'm sure there are plenty of

mailing lists composed of others like yourself. Even one of the Overeaters

Anonymous sites has a mailing list for shut in's, as well as on-line

meetings. http://www.therecoverygroup.org/

>Optifast when Oprah did and lost over 100 pounds in 3 months.

Eating nothing solid. Just drinking three shakes each day. Of course the

weight came back then some when Optifast ended.

Yep. That's what happens with all weight loss programs, which is why you

have to make *permanent* lifestyle changes, not just chosing a new fad diet

to follow. People can lose weight on *any* diet out there, even the weird

ones, but if it's not something you can safely follow for the rest of your

life, you're just spitting in the wind, as the old saying goes. Temporary

changes just mean temporary weight loss. Return to your old habits and the

weight returns, beinging friends along with it.

> Even with my very

abusive, non supportive husband having me go out to eat with him, me sitting

there drinking water with a little lemon in it, while he pigged out. He

would order take out and such at home. Bring home candy and such that he

never brought home before. He isn't a candy eater. Etc...

Even the best of husbands will do that. Many will openly sabotage your

dieting plans, like yours, eating all those yummy foods in front of you,

while others do it more subtly, like tell you you're perfect at the weight

you're at, tell you how wonderful you look, and try to talk you out of

following yet another weight loss diet that they know you're only going to

drop as soon as you get bored with it. I'm married 28 years to a great guy,

but every time I mention a weight loss plan again he starts in with those

lines.

>> I cannot

believe I went through all that, only to gain it all back and more.

Your body always wants to return to its set point. It's why humans have

survived all these years. Those with the most fat are most fertile. Of

course, nowadays we rarely have famines in industrialized countries, and

society prefers thin, not fat, women, so we all have to fight our genetic

inheritance to get down to an acceptable weight.

>I am so angry at myself!!

Don't be. You couldn't help it. If you stayed on that liquid protein much

longer you could have done your kidneys permanent harm and still regained

the weight because your metabolism slowed as it adjusted to the lower

caloric intake, so you might have started *gaining* on those few hundred

calories a day you were getting.

> I wasn't this fat then.

Dieting makes people fat. It's been proven in scientific studies time and

time again. Dieting slows our metabolism, so when we start eating the same

amount as we did *before* we restricted our calories our bodies, that now

need *less* fuel (calories) to run, just pop all the extras in storage

(fat), just in case it's needed in the future, in case fuel is restricted

(famine or diet) again. Every time you " go off " a diet, expect to regain

everything you lost and around 20% *more*.

This is why you *can't* go off a restricted food plan, why we need to make

*permanent* lifestyle changes in our food and exercise habits. Otherwise we

just keep repeating the same cycle over and over, getting fatter with each

diet we come off of.

>December 1, 2005 was the beginning of a new life for me. And for the first

time, I am going to put me first, and I'm going to keep telling myself.. I

deserve better.

You sure do! Congratulations on taking the first step. Now keep following

that with another, and another. One baby step at a time, one day at a time,

as someone else just wrote earlier today.

Sue in NJ

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 1/30/2006 4:24:52 A.M. Central Standard Time, diabet60@... writes:

I am , from Arkansas. On December 1 2005 I weighed 423 pounds.I have Type 2 Diabetes, due to my weight.Today I weighed 395 Pounds.

Welcome to the group . I am pretty new here too and no hun you are not the biggest here. I am 500 plus pounds and only 5'4. We both have a long road ahead of us but as everyone says take baby steps and you will get there. I have not left my house either in months and months but I so want to. I have my first grandbaby coming any day now and I am going to miss it. But I am using that to insprire me to keep going so I don't miss other things in her life. Not sure what diet plan you are using. There are a lot of different kinds for different people here. I am doing weight watchers. One of my first goals is to be able to leave the house or at least leave my bed where I spend my whole day. Please don't forget you have us if you need someone.

Hugs, Legina

[Guest guest]

Hi , my name is . I live in Missouri. I too have type 2 diabetes. I just found out about it this last September. I don't have to take insulin or anything like that either. But finding out that I had diabetes really got my butt in gear about losing weight. In September I weighed in at 340. I am only 4'11. Today I weigh in at 304.1. I just had my blood tested again at the doctor's in December and they said my blood sugar was normal. I was excited to hear that. I don't want to die either, and that is why I started trying to lose weight in September. I have been on many diets in the past. From Slim Fast to weight watchers, etc... Well, any way one year I lost around 70 pounds doing the Slim Fast diet. Then I stopped doing the diet and I gained all of it back plus a lot more. Now I am just eating the way that the Diabetic Clinic taught me to eat and I am exercising and that is how I am losing the weight now. I am trying to drink more water too. I buy water bottles. I can't seem to get my water in if I don't have the bottles. I hate the water that comes out of my tap here. Also with water bottles I can really see how much water I am really drinking. I don't know if I am drinking enough, but I am trying. I try for five water bottles a day. Man, do I ever have to go the bathroom a lot. I can't imagine trying to drink more. I have a hard time getting the five bottles in. I hope that is enough. I used to not drink water at all, so I think I am doing good that way. You talked about it being a new life for you. That is how I am feeling about mine too. I have to eat this way the rest of my life. I was told that once a diabetic always a diabetic no matter what the blood test show. I slip up every now and then, but I try and get back on track as soon as I can. This is going to be a life long thing and I am ready for it now. Before I was doing diets and then they would end and I would gain back any weight I had lost. Since I have to eat this way the rest of my life there is no quitting a diet. So hopefully I won't gain back all the weight I lose. Well, just wanted to introduce myself to you. It is nice to meet you By the way I too suffer from anxiety and social phobias. I also have depression that I have to take meds for and I have schizoaffective disorder. Other then that I am normal. LOL! I try to be as normal as I can be. Most of the time I am doing good as long as I stay on my meds. The times I have the most problems though is when I get stressed. I have to be very careful not to let myself get very stressed, which is a hard thing to do. I get nervous about what I say to people even on line, but I am trying to over come that. Well, nice to meet you and hope that you like this group and stick around. The people here are really friendly. 340/304.1/135

[Guest guest]

hi laura my name is kim and i just joined this group i feel the way you feel about food since i went to the dr. its not a diet its a lifetime of change kimberly

[Guest guest]

dear legina congratulations on the granchild i'm sure she will be a great inspression or he whatever the case may be kimberly

[Guest guest]

Hi Kim, glad you joined the group It sure does help to have others for support that go through the same things as you do doesn't it? 340/304.1/135 Re: Introhi laura my name is kim and i just joined this group i feel the way you feel about food since i went to the dr. its not a diet its a lifetime of change kimberly

[Guest guest]

Welcome, Kela. You will learn a LOT on this group.

Exemptions information can be found in many places online. What state's

form are you looking for? Sheri's exemption page can be found at

http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/exemptions.htm There is a list by state of

where to get the forms.

I have an interesting spreadsheet, if you are interested email me

privately. It's not 'pretty' yet-my toddler doesn't let me have much

time working on it-but it uses the US CDC's 'accepted/published' rates

of vaccine adverse events (as listed on the Vaccine Information

Statements) and compares them to the incidence and complication rates. I

have it broken down by disease. Now, you could say that incidence is

lower b/c of vaccines (that is probably what you are being taught in

school, if it is even mentioned or questioned at all).but Sheri has lots

of information on her site and elsewhere that really indicate otherwise.

There is a lot of information out there, some of it anecdotal and a lot

of it evidence based but would never make it past the mainstream journal

publisher's marketing staff. It can be confusing at times, but with

time to wade through it I am sure that you'll find what you need to come

to your decision.

Welcome to the group!

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

, 17mos

See him at <http://www.tabulas.com/~wanderings/gallery/51140/>

http://www.tabulas.com/~wanderings/gallery/51140/

[Guest guest]

Thanks for the welcome. I have found tons of information about how to

get the exemptions in the different states but what I have not found

is, which vaccines are " required by law " and which are only

recommended. Since I am still in school, my husband and I have not

decided where we ultimately want to settle yet so I am kind of looking

for information from most states on the east coast. I would love the

information you have from the CDC. The more I know the better I can

make informed decisions.

" Thode " <tracythode@...> wrote:

> Now, you could say that incidence is

> lower b/c of vaccines (that is probably what you are being taught in

> school, if it is even mentioned or questioned at all).but Sheri has

> lots of information on her site and elsewhere that really indicate

> otherwise.

You would be very suprised as to what we learn in the medical school

where I attend. I do not go to a US medical school so things are done

in a very different way. We spent nearly an entire semster looking at

infection patterns of disease and how different events impacts

morbidity and mortality rate. In nearly all cases(the ones we studied

anyway) where a vaccine has been introduced during an " epidemic " there

was a sharp increase in the morbidity/mortality directly after mass

vaccinations schemes and then it decreasing after that. We spent a

great deal of time in debate about the effectiveness of vaccines in

general and the protocals set up for administration in the US, UK and

Canada. The basic concenses that were reached were: 1) If the immune

system and vaccines works in the manner that is taught to us then

a)there should be no vaccine given before 6 months of age (or six

months after cessation of breast feeding) vaccines should only be

given once, never boostered and c) titers give you no information

about immune status, only if there has been recent exposure. 2)The

government and pharmaceutical companies have way too much of a

conflict of interest and apparently not enough knowledge or common

sense to know/admit that they are, at best requiring/recommending

treatment that is completely unnecessary and a waste of money and at

worst severely damaging to its population. 3)Physician have moved away

from the mission and oath they agreed to when become doctors. Doctors

are no longer able to make treatment decision with their patients

based on their best judgement. Laws enacted by the govenment, coverage

limitations and requirements by the insurance companies and patients

demanding drugs and treatment based on TV commercials, not wanting to

pay out of pocket for a more appropriate treatment and wanting

immeadiate results without making any lifestyle modifications.

There many MDs to be, that I attend school with, who do not vaccinate

themselves or their own children (this BTW is very difficult to

maintain when you are in medical school or working in a hospital

because if a patient comes in with one of the diseases you have

refused vaccination on you are required to stay off work until the

" outbreak " has cleared). The problem comes when we start to practice

we are bound by the law and " community standards " in the state in

which we practice. Based on these, if a doctor was to openly/actively

discourage a patient from getting an immunization and they become ill

with that disease that doctor is liable. If a doctor does not have a

patient sign a waiver saying they refuse immunization and they get ill

the doctor is liable. In many states informed concent for vaccines

has been disolved by health departments for fear of people not getting

vaccinated if they know what can really go wrong. It is quite the

catch 22.

Sorry for the ramble.

Kela

[Guest guest]

Hi Kela --

Welcome to the group. I'm . I live in NY with my DH and 2 great kids

-- both partially vaxed. You'll learn a lot here -- great info. And I look

forward to getting to know you.

Health & blessings,

Project MAHMA -- Moms At Home Making A difference...

and a lot of money!

http://www.ExcitingHealth.CreateMyFuture.com

http://www.ThisIsYourShot.biz

http://www.Shaklee.net/ExcitingHealth

1-866-312-8064

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 2/1/06 2:08:17 PM Eastern Standard Time,

kelahamilton@... writes:

> The more I read the

> more determined I became that never again would myself or my animals be

> subjected to the horrors of repeated vaccination.

But how can you avoid the rabies vaccine for your dog, is there a waiver for

that too that I'm unaware of?

> I am having a more difficult time coming to the decision to

> never vaccinate my children. Each vaccine will be given individually (no

> multi-disease vaccines) and from single dose vials that do not contain any

> preservative and they will be given atleast 3 months apart.

I didn't know such a thing even existed, vaccines without preservatives???

How do you find those and be sure that they're preservative free?

[Guest guest]

Hi !

So glad to have you in our group (and to finally know that you're with us)!

What an interesting story you have. And how inspiring to know that there are

people out there that are utilizing their professional capacity to enlighten

people about NT. And how funny that you are learning from your patients as

well! Of course, we can all learn something from each other...

Kathy