nne

[Guest guest]

nne

Wow, that's great that you are a writer. Have you considered going back

to work as a reporter in the Albany area are you just as happy being an

editor? And I also want to say thanks to Terri for all her hard work.

I don't know how you find to do everything you do with the kids, the

soaping and the site. My hat is off to you, girl!!

Ilion

Password ...

I don't have it; could you e-mail it to me at lvjensen@...?

Thanks!!!

I would be GLAD to write something! I love to write!!!! I used to be a

newspaper reporter, and now I'm an editor! :-)

Thanks for all of the work you went to ... we all really appreciate it!

nne in Albany

[Guest guest]

" I do things like Themestream and The Vines "

Hi nne,

Would you give us some of the titles of the articles you wrote at these sites.

I would LOVE to read them! I've been reading articles a lot on these sites

lately, it's such fun!

Take care,

Cheryl

Cattail Pond Herbs, Soaps & Sundries

http://www.angelfire.com/biz/cattailpond

[Guest guest]

nne

I'm glad to hear you got your soaps to where you're happy.

Are you going to do a bunch of different colors for the

wording or do them all the same?

M

To Terri

Hi Terri!

Yep, that's how the molds were originally intended to be used ... in the second picture, I laid the wording part down inside the cloud mold, then poured the blue MP over it. But you have a good idea of bonding the words to the outside of the cloud! That might look neat! I will have to try that -- not sure how that's done, but I can figure out something, I'm sure (just short of using Super Glue! haha, just kidding!). Or packaging them together would be good ... thanks for the good suggestions! :-)

nne (Albany)Our members maphttp://.homestead.com/locations.htmlOur Message Boardhttp://www.voy.com/21568/Special Invite for membershttp://soapwerks.com/martinrectangle.htmAll posts to this list are copyrighted by post author. They may NOT be forwarded, copied, or used in anyway without the permission of the post author with the exception of answering posts to this list. Posts are personal opinions only.

[Guest guest]

nne

I have no idea why it works - I don't question

I just do what I'm told. Some people use witch hazel

for the same thing but I haven't tried it yet. It's

probably less smelly but the alcohol evaporates anyway.

BTW, I haven't even gotten a chance to look over

the interview questions yet. I know one thing, I've

got to scale back on these email lists. I'm on (3)

and it's too much. Wasting too much time. Gotta

go get ready for the tanning booth. We're off to

Florida in (3) weeks and I have to get a base tan or

I'll burn like crazy when I get down to Florida.

M

To , re: soaps and rubbing alcohol

Dear ,

I think I'm going to stick with the same colors for the wording ... the white for the lettering and the pink for the background ... since it's a baby shower and she had a girl, I'm thinking that pink is the way to go. What do you think, though? It would look cute in other colors, too, like pastel colors. (Can I just say that I *love* liquid mica ... I want to get every color under the rainbow now!!!) :-) I did consider making the soaps all different scents, too, but then I figured that baby powder would be pretty good for this event (a classic baby scent!). I bought my fragrance oils from www.cedarvale.net, and I'm really happy with them. (That's where I usually buy my citric acid, too.) The baby powder didn't discolor at all, which was great, and the shipping wasn't that expensive, either! Cedarvale also had a fragrance oil called "Baby's Room," and I'm curious what that one is. I just went with the traditional baby powder FO, though.

So what's in rubbing alcohol that helps make the soap layers stick together? I'm curious.

nne (Albany)Our members maphttp://.homestead.com/locations.htmlOur Message Boardhttp://www.voy.com/21568/Special Invite for membershttp://soapwerks.com/martinrectangle.htmAll posts to this list are copyrighted by post author. They may NOT be forwarded, copied, or used in anyway without the permission of the post author with the exception of answering posts to this list. Posts are personal opinions only.

[Guest guest]

Yes, I am! :-)

Soap tips (from another e-mail list)

Hi guys. This came from another e-mail list that I'm on. Thought I'd pass it

along to you all. Not sure how valid or correct the information is ... but

maybe someone can use something in here. It's about HP soapmaking, I think:

>>http://www.ellensessentials.com/soaptips.htm

Tips and Techniques:

Using Pigments:

Using pigments to color your soap is easy. Pigments color by

dispersement. They are not dyes and are less affected by the cold process

method of soap making. While it is best to use a recipe for a white soap

base, you can still get the color you want if your finished soap is slightly

off-white or " slightly " yellow. A yellow soap base will affect the color

the pigments produce.

The best way to color your soap using pigments is to mix the pigments

with a small amount of warm water. Distilled or filtered water is

recommended. The amount of water used to mix the pigments can be subtracted

from your water/lye mixture of your recipe at the beginning of the soap

making process. For instance, if I am making a 5 pound batch, I use

approximately 1 teaspoon of pigments (amount can be adjusted for darker or

lighter shades) which I mix with about 1 tablespoon of water. At trace, I

take some of the soap from the soap pot and mix it with the pigment and stir

it really well. Then I add the colored soap to the other soap in the pot

and stir those together. The color disperses nicely. Try it!

In case you are having problems mixing your pigment/water solution, try

putting the pigments and water in a small jar, put a lid on it securely and

shake the jar!

Marbleizing Soap:

This is a two color marbling method using a 5 pound batch of soap, but

can be adjusted to a smaller batch or to just one color.

When I make soap, I use 6oz. of water per pound of soap, but it is

possible to use more (up to approximately 8oz. per pound). If I use 6oz of

water, I don't worry about the small amount of extra water I add during the

coloring process. (see below)

If I am going to use an FO, I usually add more water than the 6oz per

pound of soap (helps to keep the soap from seizing). This gives me little

room to add pigments, so If I use more than 6oz. of water per pound I always

subtract it from the recipe, otherwise I don't.

So, when the soap gets to a light trace, I add the scent. Then I get

two containers in which I put approximately 1/4 to 1/2 pound of soap each,

maybe more, maybe less.

Then, I add the pigment water I have mixed beforehand to the containers

of soap. I usually use at least 1/2 ounce of water (one tablespoon) and

about 1/2 teaspoon of pigments in the pigment water solution I add to each

container.

Stir the pigment water solution and the soap in the containers together

well. These will be your colored soap parts. At this point to make things

even, I add a little more water to the base soap that is still in the pot.

(maybe 2 to 3 ounces of water, maybe less.. I try to judge by what it looks

like, but if you want to do the math you can figure it out exactly. A few

extra ounces of water in a 5 pound batch is not going to ruin (in case you

forgot to subtract the water at the beginning).

Again, do worry too much about an ounce or two extra of water,

especially if you only use 6oz of water per pound to begin with. The extra

amount of water will evaporate during the curing stage.

The reason you add the water to the soap in the pot is because you want

the colored soap parts and the base soap to be of the same consistency. (If

one part of the soap is thicker than the other, it is harder to get the

colored soap to blend with the soap in the pot. If they are the same

consistency the will blend or swirl by themselves when you add the colored

soap back into the pot.)

Now, I pour each container of colored soap back into the pot containing

the base soap. (drizzling it around and not pouring it all in one place)

Then I stir once around the pot with a spoon to mangle it. This is optional

and only stir once around the pot and not more or you will mix the colors

together and ruin the marbled effect. Sometimes I do not stir at all at

this point.

Then, I pour the soap into the molds (Rubbermaid drawer liners... one 15

inch Rubbermaid drawer liner holds 1 pound of soap). The marble effect

happens as you pour the soap from the pot into the molds. Sometimes I pour

the first mold only half full and then fill it up later during the pouring.

I might run a spoon through the soap once or twice when it is the mold (a

figure 8 motion makes for a paisley effect).

That's it! Put that soap baby to bed!

I usually trim the surface of the soap off just a fraction and it

reveals the swirl effect better than the soap does fresh out of the mold. My

favorite colors to swirl like this are hydrated chromium green and

ultramarine violet in a white soap base. Pretty snazzy!<<

--nne (Albany)

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All posts to this list are copyrighted by post author. They may NOT be

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[Guest guest]

Ok, I found the molds on ebay. But I don't know how to bid on any of them.

What does that 4hrs left thing mean. And do I just bid a little higher than

the bid that is there? Or do you just bid the price they want and get it

over with. Kathy

[Guest guest]

Well I went through all the molds and found about 10 that I want, but I don't

know how to bid. I tried to register, but that is as far as I can go. Kathy

[Guest guest]

I haven't used AIM in ages. I have no idea what my password is. I am going

to see if I can figure out how to get a new one. Hang on , I am sure it

will take me awhile. Kathy. (Go get a snack, and a good book)

[Guest guest]

I haven't used AIM in ages. I have no idea what my password is. I am going

to see if I can figure out how to get a new one. Hang on , I am sure it

will take me awhile. Kathy. (Go get a snack, and a good book)

[Guest guest]

Hey, Kathy ...

When you're at the main page of an auction and want to bid on the item,

click the button that says " Bid " and has a little fan next to it. That will

bring up a section of the screen that asks you to enter your bid. Type in a

dollar amount, then click " Submit. " It will tell you if you're the high

bidder for the item. Then, just wait until your auction is over to see if

you've won! Hey, are you on AIM? I'm lvjensen61700 if you want to IM me for

more info ...

nne

[Guest guest]

Sorry, nne

I don't have a scanner yet. I have enough problems dealing with the computer. I

sure would like to get one soon, though. I made some beautiful yellow "tulip" soaps

for Mother's Day sales. I would love to show them off to you all. My girlfriend has

a scanner I think. Maybe later on today if I get all the things done I need to, I'll

buzz on up to her house and see if she'll take some pictures with her digital

camera. That's another thing I don't own yet.

M

Thanks, !

Dear ,

>>It's flexible enough that once the soap is hard I just pull the sides and ends away from the soap, turn it over and pressed on the bottom a little and it pops right out.<<

OK, cool. I think that mine might be flexible enough, too, in order to twist it a little to get the soap to pop out. I'm not sure, though, because I haven't tried making soap in it yet. Hopefully it will be easy. I am so excited to make more soap -- I can't wait to get my soaping supplies in the mail!!! :-) One of my friends just requested me to make a bar of gardener's soap for her. I'm really excited about that! I have all of these soap ideas floating about in my head but no soap base to work with yet. :-(

>>I tilted the mold on its side a bit and propped it with something. I pored the first color in an opaque soap base colored pastel green ( about a third of the mold) and dropped my cut up pieces in which were all different pastel colors. After that set up enough to move the mold, I tipped the mold on its other side and did a clear base with yellow and put chunks in that. The third pour I did in opaque base with a pearly yellow mica and more chunks. It came out just beautiful when I cut it. You can see all three different triangle shaped colors and they're not blended together.<<

Wow, that sounds *so* nice!!! How creative to take the mold and tip it to the side!!! I would have never thought of that. Do you have a picture scanned in of this soap? I would love to see it! It bet it's really neat!!! Thanks for your help and suggestions!

nne (Albany) :-)Our members maphttp://.homestead.com/locations.htmlOur Message Boardhttp://www.voy.com/21568/Special Invite for membershttp://soapwerks.com/martinrectangle.htmAll posts to this list are copyrighted by post author. They may NOT be forwarded, copied, or used in anyway without the permission of the post author with the exception of answering posts to this list. Posts are personal opinions only.

[Guest guest]

nne

You know, I'm on your way to Syracuse. If you'd like, you could stop here at my

house and I'll drive the rest of the way to Syracuse if you'd like. Kathy will

also be riding with me so there would be (3) of us. That would give you a break

from driving all that way alone and also save on gas for you. But the best part -

we could all get LOST together!! (hehe) The only thing is, I'm a smoker (bad, I know) so if that

doesn't bother you, you're more than welcome to join us in a "car pool."

M

Ilion

Monoi de Tahiti and other topics ...

Hey, Everyone!>>but I did substitute Monoi de Tahiti, which I really like but can't findanymore.<<Have you ever tried Yves Rocher's Monoi de Tahiti sunscreen, shower gel,lotion, etc.? I have only tried the self-tanning lotion, and it was good. Iknow that you're probably looking for something that you can make yourselfthat has monoi de Tahiti in it, but I just thought I would let you know! :-)So why can't you find it anymore? That's odd. You would think that*somewhere* on the Internet it would exist!I am so excited about our gathering in July. And thank you for yourconsideration of not putting July 14 on the list ... we have a wedding to goto that day ... I really appreciate you thinking about me when you made alist of possible dates. You guys are great! I am so excited about coming. Iam even more excited about meeting you guys! I will definitely fill out myanswers to the polls ... I am definitely coming!!! So what should we bringto this gathering? I love to cook, and I could bring some food if you guyswant. I could even bring our ice cream maker. :-) And yes, is it going to bean all-day thing or an overnight thing or what? Should we bring some of oursoaps? I'm just curious. I can't wait!!!nne (Albany)Our members maphttp://.homestead.com/locations.htmlOur Message Boardhttp://www.voy.com/21568/Special Invite for membershttp://soapwerks.com/martinrectangle.htmAll posts to this list are copyrighted by post author. They may NOT be forwarded, copied, or used in anyway without the permission of the post author with the exception of answering posts to this list. Posts are personal opinions only.

[Guest guest]

M wrote- " The only thing is, I'm a smoker "

Thanks for reminding me of this ! While at my house I'd

appreciate all smokers to use the great outdoors to have a smoke! I

am very sensitive to the smell and we are non-smokers here. I don't

have any problems with it, as long as it's done outside.

Thanks All!

Colleen

Country Meadow Creations

[Guest guest]

nne

That's great that you'll be riding with Kathy and I. You don't have to

keep apologizing about the smoke. I'd like to quit but my doctor said right

now would be the worse time possible for me to try considering what I'm

still going through emotionally regarding my past employer situation and still

being on medication for anxiety and depression. Once I get this all behind

me that's going to be the first thing I think I'm going to try to do. The only

thing I'm worried about is gaining more weight. Two years ago before this

whole mess started I was a size (8) and now I'm a size 12-14 and that has

me even more depressed. They say a lot of it is from the medications and

depression. Hopefully, I can lose it all and get back to where I was. But

the older you get the harder it is to lose weight!! Oh, well.

As the time gets closer to the gathering, we'll touch base in private email

just so we don't bore the other girls with our chit-chat regarding directions

and such. OK?

Have a great HOT day. I have to travel to stown for a doctors

appointment so that eats up a bog chunk of my day. Yuck!!

M

Good morning, all! :-)

Hey, Guys!

How is everyone doing today? Good, I hope! It's going to be 90 degrees here today in Albany. I can't believe it!!! Looks beautiful outside already. I wanted to write you back, , so here goes! :-)

Congratulations to your daughter and her husband on their first wedding anniversary. I'm sure they're so excited. Do they have any special plans for that day? My husband and I, our first anniversary is June 17, and we are going to Montauk/The Hamptons for about a week. We just can't wait. We'll be going there June 12 through June 18. Does anyone have any information about that area or know of any cool Web sites that we can look at? I don't know much about the area at all. It will be so wonderful to get away for a while, just us, and celebrate our anniversary! I'm making a scrapbook of our first year as husband and wife to give to Jeff as an anniversary present. I hope he likes it!

You were talking about baby-proofing your home ... geez, it's unbelievable what children can get into!!! Our cat can even get into cabinets and such, and if a cat can do that, then surely a child could! Scary! I want to make sure that when we have children someday, that we keep my hobby supplies out of their reach (X-acto knives, paints, etc.!). There is *so* much to think about when you have children, I imagine!!!

Well, as far as driving together to Syracuse, that sounds fine with me. Looking forward to it! I would be glad to meet you at your home and then head over from there. I just don't like smoke, and it really bothers me (makes me sneeze, get congested, have a headache, etc., and I have a touch of asthma). Nearly all of my husband's relatives smoke, and it drives me crazy. Sometimes I just have to go outside their house for a while because the smoke makes me nauseous. :-( It's really horrible. Jeff and I don't smoke, and we're so glad!!!

Anyway, hope everyone has a great day, and talk to you later!

nne (Albany)

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Our members maphttp://.homestead.com/locations.htmlOur Message Boardhttp://www.voy.com/21568/Special Invite for membershttp://soapwerks.com/martinrectangle.htmAll posts to this list are copyrighted by post author. They may NOT be forwarded, copied, or used in anyway without the permission of the post author with the exception of answering posts to this list. Posts are personal opinions only.

[Guest guest]

nne

You certainly are in an "apology mode" today, kiddo. I don't think the girls

mind us chatting about the driving thing in our letters. I just figured once we

do start discussing times and directions, if you had questions and we ended

up emailing back and forth, people wouldn't have to be bothered by it, that's

all. And as far as your stationary, it didn't come through garbled on my computer.

Maybe it's only when it's forwarded, for some reason.

M

Doubly sorry ...

I just realized that my last message came through all garbled when replied to it ... I think that's because of the e-mail stationery creatorprogram that I use. I will stop using e-mail stationery from that program sothat it doesn't come through all garbled and weird-looking.Also, sorry for talking about the details of me driving with and Kathyto our get-together on the list ... didn't mean to bore anyone! Sorry forchatting about that on the list!nne (Albany)Our members maphttp://.homestead.com/locations.htmlOur Message Boardhttp://www.voy.com/21568/Special Invite for membershttp://soapwerks.com/martinrectangle.htmAll posts to this list are copyrighted by post author. They may NOT be forwarded, copied, or used in anyway without the permission of the post author with the exception of answering posts to this list. Posts are personal opinions only.

[Guest guest]

On the topic of you selling your things to your girlfriend: Don't forget about

all the proper labeling for everything according to the Gov't guidelines. I

know we mentioned this before. Did you do your homework? Itall can be

very confusing. If you sell anything other than soaps, it's considered as a

cosmetic and EVERYTHING has to be listed in the proper INCA names.

Part of a newsletter I get from a supplier I use posted some of that kind

of info in this week's newsletter. I'll cut out the part that eprtains to

it and forward it to this in a few minutes.

**Oh, that was cute what your husband did in the shower - ouch!!

RE: Kind of excited! Business opportunity!

Hey, !

When you said the marina in the Mohawk River, which one do you mean? We have a marina here in Cohoes, and the Mohawk River goes right by us. Just curious. The oatmeal bars sound great!!!

Oh, funny story -- today in the shower, my husband couldn't find any of his bar soap, so he used some of my apricot facial scrub by mistake as shower gel! hehe :-) He said, "Wow, your shower gel is really abrasive!" And come to find out, he thought it was shower gel. haha. I said, why didn't you use the pink stuff in the large bottle? And he said, "Uh, no thanks!!!" hehe

Talk to you all later,

nne (Albany)Our members maphttp://.homestead.com/locations.htmlOur Message Boardhttp://www.voy.com/21568/Special Invite for membershttp://soapwerks.com/martinrectangle.htmAll posts to this list are copyrighted by post author. They may NOT be forwarded, copied, or used in anyway without the permission of the post author with the exception of answering posts to this list. Posts are personal opinions only.

[Guest guest]

Dear ,

No, I haven't "done my homework." All of the FDA guidelines and INCA stuff are just confusing to me, and I don't know much about it all. So I'll be reading the information that you sent me, that's for sure. Thank you for sending it to me ... it will really be helpful. I definitely want to make sure that I have everything labeled correctly. So far my friend hasn't placed an order with me, and I don't know what she'll be ordering (if she'll just be ordering soaps or what). We'll see.

nne (Albany)

[Guest guest]

Well, aren't you the lucky one. You have a great time and we'll

keep our fingers crossed for good weather for you. Since the group

has been pretty quiet lately, you won't miss too much, I'm sure.

I know I've been real busy with private orders besides trying to get

soaps made for (4) stores. So not too much time for chatter.

Have a good time and we'll talk to you when you get back.

M

Hey, guys!I talk to you all over e-mail on a pretty regular basis every day, so Iwanted to let you know that from Friday, June 8 to Monday, June 18, I willbe using my e-mail account, which is lvjensen61700@.... Feelfree to write me there -- I'll be checking my e-mail periodically. We'll bein Indiana for a friend's wedding this weekend, and then we leave on ourwedding anniversary trip after that. Should be fun!Take care, everyone!nne :-)

[Guest guest]

LEGO HOBBIES?????

Please explain that one.

M

That's one thing that I love about him the most -- he supports my interestsand hobbies. And I support his Star Wars/Star Trek and Lego hobbies! hehe:-)nne

[Guest guest]

,

Jeff (my husband) LOVES Legos. He just put together a model of the X-wing ship in "Star Wars" (the kit costs about $150 in the store). He received that as a gift for being the best man in our friend Drew's wedding this past June. Anyway, he has always loved Legos -- they are a hobby of his. He has a HUGE box of Legos here and at his parents'! hehe :-)

nne

[Guest guest]

Hey, caught you on-line today!!

I've seen huge displays in stores that just amaze me!! I guess

it can get quite addicting, huh? Everybody has something they

get hooked on somewhere in life. I know what mine is (hehe).

Have a great day. Boy, it is a lot cooler out today!

M

RE: nne

,

Jeff (my husband) LOVES Legos. He just put together a model of the X-wing ship in "Star Wars" (the kit costs about $150 in the store). He received that as a gift for being the best man in our friend Drew's wedding this past June. Anyway, he has always loved Legos -- they are a hobby of his. He has a HUGE box of Legos here and at his parents'! hehe :-)

nneOur members maphttp://.homestead.com/locations.htmlOur Message Boardhttp://www.voy.com/21568/Special Invite for membershttp://soapwerks.com/martinrectangle.htmAll posts to this list are copyrighted by post author. They may NOT be forwarded, copied, or used in anyway without the permission of the post author with the exception of answering posts to this list. Posts are personal opinions only.

[Guest guest]

,

>>but she has done them in champagne flutes.<<

Those would be cute favors for a wedding or bridal shower. Wow! Sounds

really nice!

>>But I wait until A C has them on sale and pick them up for

$.25/roll.<<

I didn't realize that A.C. had ribbon so cheap. I'll have to watch out

for those sales!

>>My ribbons are all put on dowel rods hanging on the wall of my workshop

all in view for easy identifying when wrapping.<<

We have a gift wrap organizer that's stored in the back of our closet (we

hardly have any room in our small apartment). I can't wait to have a real

house someday so that I can have an area where I can wrap gifts and do

hobbies and have everything spread out like that, so that I can get to

everything easily!!!

>>I did my oatmeal, milk and honey bars with raspberry topping yesterday<<

Wow, are you sure that you weren't making a cake? hehe :-) Sounds wonderful!

What do you mean by " raspberry topping " ?

nne

[Guest guest]

>>I did my oatmeal, milk and honey bars with raspberry topping yesterday<<Wow, are you sure that you weren't making a cake? hehe :-) Sounds wonderful!What do you mean by "raspberry topping"?

My first pour (about 1/4") is clear glycerin soap colored red and I bought dehydrated raspberry seeds a while back

that I put in. They are very visible in the clear red and then I scent with "raspberry" f/o. The rest of

the bar is part clear glycerin & part goatsmilk soap with oatmeal & honey added and scented with "Oatmeal,

Milk & Honey" f/o.

M

[Guest guest]

I did some candy soaps like that at Christmas time. I have a candy mold that looks like little

peanut butter cups. I did mint chocolate (middle layer of green) and I have f/o called Reese's

Pieces" so I did some that looked like they had a layer of peanut butter inside. I also did an

orange center one. I had them in white candy boxes and you'd swear they were candy. Of course

I had to put a large warning label regarding keeping kids away from them so they wouldn't mistake

them for candy!!

, re: raspberry topping

Dear ,

Wow, your oatmeal, milk, and honey soap bar with raspberry topping sounds wonderful!!! Very scrumptious! That's so creative. I bet it's a great seller! I came up with an idea for a soap bar last night, while I was trying to fall asleep. Wouldn't a chocolate-mint bar be wonderful? I thought of it because my parents' favorite ice cream flavor is mint chocolate chip. You could pour a thin layer of brown-colored soap (scented with chocolate FO) into a regular bar mold, then let it harden, then pour a green-colored soap (scented with peppermint FO) over that (maybe with some small brown chunks embedded, made to look like chocolate), then another layer of chocolate over that -- it would look like an ice cream sandwich cookie, maybe! hehe :-) I don't know, maybe it wouldn't work -- I was just daydreaming!

nne :-)Our members maphttp://.homestead.com/locations.htmlOur Message Boardhttp://www.voy.com/21568/Special Invite for membershttp://soapwerks.com/martinrectangle.htmAll posts to this list are copyrighted by post author. They may NOT be forwarded, copied, or used in anyway without the permission of the post author with the exception of answering posts to this list. Posts are personal opinions only.

[Guest guest]

Thanks, . I had tried ebay to no avail. Then I went in there

again and just put "tennis mold" and (3) came up that were candy

molds. Will consider them, also.

M

Ilion

RE: need help

,Have you tried going to eBay and Auctions and just searching for"tennis soap mold"? I know they have a TON of molds on there ...nneOur members maphttp://.homestead.com/locations.htmlOur Message Boardhttp://www.voy.com/21568/Special Invite for membershttp://soapwerks.com/martinrectangle.htmAll posts to this list are copyrighted by post author. They may NOT be forwarded, copied, or used in anyway without the permission of the post author with the exception of answering posts to this list. Posts are personal opinions only.