Re: New to group - weight gain on CO

[Guest guest]

Sorry for skipping, Elaine; I connected that a ketogenic diet of 500 calories

carries the same concern below about low IGF-1 growth factor that fasting does.

I think intermittant fasting is probably a growth factor increaser. Intermittent

I think refers to periods during a day; Brad King allows an undenatured whey or

protein breakfast to maintain IGF-1 higher until lunch time, so actually fasting

had been accomplished but the growth factor release was " extended " depending on

how the fast is ended.

all good,

Duncan

> >

> > Dee, I sent in another one this AM too ..point is a 500 calorie diet is

known and often used to induce ketosis.

> >

> > Fasting is bad and I don't support it; among other things it reduces IGF-1,

the most important direct growth factor you need to recover with.

> >

> > " Fasting inhibits growth hormone receptor production. Fasting also reduces

production of IGF Binding Proteins ...Hypoglycemia or low insulin levels can

reduce IGF Binding Proteins other than IGFBP3. This can reduce the half-life of

IGF-1, lowering blood levels. Stress (either internal or external) increases

norepinephrine signaling (the primary stress signal) and/or histamine signaling

(another stress signal). These can increase inflammatory cytokine production

which decrease IGF-1. "

> >

> > Diverticulitis and dysbiosis are stressors.

> >

> > all good,

> >

> > Duncan

> >

[Guest guest]

I went back to find Dee's original paragraph of misinformation on the

appropriate use of keto sticks.

Testing with keto sticks in the morning and well after meals is a better

indicator of whether one is actually in ketosis; choosing the highest readings

in the day only proves you can burn fat.

So we started a discussion on it and I'm glad we put the misinformation to bed.

Here's the passage below:

all good,

Duncan

>

> Hi Liz,

>

> The goal is to be at the high end but morning may not be the best indicator.

Also, I would wait until the week is up to give your body more time to change

over to fat burning mode. Just stick to the diet and you'll be fine. I also

wouldn't check more than once a day. Choose the time of day when it seems to be

the highest as the reading can also be influenced by other things.

[Guest guest]

Well Duncan, if you want to review history we can go all the way back to the

beginning of this thread where I suggested the ketogenic diet to liz and you

replied:

#37478

" Liz, the ketogenic diet is only 500 calories; essentially real caloric

restriction. People who won't do that kind of restriction can increase ketones

readily with MCT oil. "

Trouble is Duncan, Liz wasn't interested in merely increasing ketones - she was

interested in LOSING WEIGHT. And hopefully, you have since learned that most

ketogenic diets do not restrict calories to 500 and that you do not lose weight

by simply taking MCT oil without also adjusting the diet - primarily by

restricting carbs. So I'm glad we put YOUR paragraph of misinformation to bed as

well.

Dee

>

> I went back to find Dee's original paragraph of misinformation on the

appropriate use of keto sticks.

>

> Testing with keto sticks in the morning and well after meals is a better

indicator of whether one is actually in ketosis; choosing the highest readings

in the day only proves you can burn fat.

>

> So we started a discussion on it and I'm glad we put the misinformation to

bed.

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Dee; with reference to losing weight, caloric restriction is indeed key, and

we agree on that part of my post. I

I also pointed out MCT oil increases ketones but You extrapolated that to some

weight loss argument that contradicts my view of caloric restriction being key.

MCT oil with carbs won't drop one's weight by virtue of producing ketones, is

the gist of MY posts, one I repeated three times.

You supported your own personal " ketogenic " diet by saying ketones show up so

you must be in ketosis, and I pointed out that if you eat MCT and coconut oil

you would indeed show ketones regardless of whether you were in ketosis. Even if

you also eat carbs.

I'm glad Chuck got it. His summary is shorter than mine.

I supported the 500 calorie diet with research and doctors' papers on it; their

summaries are longer than mine.

You might contend less caloric restriction may also put one in ketosis, and

though that may be true for some, you're saying to go ahead and take the reading

at it's highest point, which is dead wrong if you're eating fat, especially MCT.

I think I understood two days worth of dialogue and reading pretty good, sorry

you didn't get it. Maybe a hit of MCT oil will help.

all good,

Duncan

> >

> > I went back to find Dee's original paragraph of misinformation on the

appropriate use of keto sticks.

> >

> > Testing with keto sticks in the morning and well after meals is a better

indicator of whether one is actually in ketosis; choosing the highest readings

in the day only proves you can burn fat.

> >

> > So we started a discussion on it and I'm glad we put the misinformation to

bed.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Enough already.

Humility is a gift that few have, and it can't be forced so if it isn't there in

those you have to deal with, don't waste your time arguing w/ someone. Don't

*expect* humility from others and you'll save yourself lots of frustration.

Knowledge, when combined with true humility and grace, is the best formula for

being able to serve others and lead them to better health in my opinion -- let's

all pray for those gifts so we can be the best kind of role models/sharers of

wisdom and information! (trust me, i'm not at all saying that I have this

down...I have my own argumentative side, but have to remind myself to back off

sometimes, and admit when i'm wrong or made a mistake in my words, etc.).

Peace,

Liz

> > >

> > > I went back to find Dee's original paragraph of misinformation on the

appropriate use of keto sticks.

> > >

> > > Testing with keto sticks in the morning and well after meals is a better

indicator of whether one is actually in ketosis; choosing the highest readings

in the day only proves you can burn fat.

> > >

> > > So we started a discussion on it and I'm glad we put the misinformation to

bed.

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Val - how high a dose did you take? I'm considering buying some of this to try

w/ my Dad. Was the product from Wellness in capsules? We have to open his pills

to mix w/ food so tablets don't work.

thanks,

Liz

p.s. do you have a link to the podcast by Byron s?

> > >

> > > Hi, I just started taking about 2-3 TBS CO per day 6 weeks ago after

getting my dad on it for memory issues. It hans't helped much w/ his memory, but

now we've found that his memory problems are likely related to long term use of

Neurontin for nerve pain, so trying to decrease that and we're seeing

improvement in his memory. Still continueing the CO for him though, since he

also has cancer and just needs all the help he can get (and extra calories).

> > >

> > > However, I have gained about 8 lbs since starting on this, and I need to

lose about 30! I take hydrocortisone for adrenal burnout (25mg) and also Armour

thyroid (90mg) for hypothyroid. I was hoping the CO would jumpstart my

metabolism and help me burn calories better, but it just seems to have slowed

down even more.

> > >

> > > Should I stop using the CO? I love the stuff, it tastes great and I want

it for the health benefits as well. Would it solve the problem if I lower carbs

and overall calories? Or is the weight gain just perhaps a problem with MY body

and coconut oil?

> > >

> > > thanks for any advice,

> > > Liz

> > >

> >

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Liz,

No sorry i dont have the link, i think you can only get the link from maybe the

week before and I heard this podcast a couple of months ago.

I remember taking 3 capsules 3 x day (thats a high dose) - it was the Calcium

AEP from Wellness Resources & it was in capsules.

I reduced the dose when the nerve pain lessened. 

You could always try e-mailing customer service on the site & if you sign up to

their newsletter/podcast, you can avail of asking some questions for the next

upcoming podcast - he puts one out a week I think.

It worked for me, but I have also tried many other things that worked for other

people & been disappointed.

But no harm in trying out one bottle & see how it goes.

Val

________________________________

From: lizz7711 <lizz7711@...>

Coconut Oil

Sent: Saturday, 24 September 2011, 16:34

Subject: Re: New to group - weight gain on CO

 

Val - how high a dose did you take? I'm considering buying some of this to try

w/ my Dad. Was the product from Wellness in capsules? We have to open his pills

to mix w/ food so tablets don't work.

thanks,

Liz

p.s. do you have a link to the podcast by Byron s?

> > >

> > > Hi, I just started taking about 2-3 TBS CO per day 6 weeks ago after

getting my dad on it for memory issues. It hans't helped much w/ his memory, but

now we've found that his memory problems are likely related to long term use of

Neurontin for nerve pain, so trying to decrease that and we're seeing

improvement in his memory. Still continueing the CO for him though, since he

also has cancer and just needs all the help he can get (and extra calories).

> > >

> > > However, I have gained about 8 lbs since starting on this, and I need to

lose about 30! I take hydrocortisone for adrenal burnout (25mg) and also Armour

thyroid (90mg) for hypothyroid. I was hoping the CO would jumpstart my

metabolism and help me burn calories better, but it just seems to have slowed

down even more.

> > >

> > > Should I stop using the CO? I love the stuff, it tastes great and I want

it for the health benefits as well. Would it solve the problem if I lower carbs

and overall calories? Or is the weight gain just perhaps a problem with MY body

and coconut oil?

> > >

> > > thanks for any advice,

> > > Liz

> > >

> >

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks Val, I'll check to see if I can find that podcast by emailing them. My

Dad is already taking so many supplements, it's hard to think how to add in this

kind of dose of capsules...but like you said, it's worth a try. I know w/ nerve

pain it's so random what works for various people, no rhyme or reason to it at

all unfortunately.

I do appreciate the info!

Liz

> > > >

> > > > Hi, I just started taking about 2-3 TBS CO per day 6 weeks ago after

getting my dad on it for memory issues. It hans't helped much w/ his memory, but

now we've found that his memory problems are likely related to long term use of

Neurontin for nerve pain, so trying to decrease that and we're seeing

improvement in his memory. Still continueing the CO for him though, since he

also has cancer and just needs all the help he can get (and extra calories).

> > > >

> > > > However, I have gained about 8 lbs since starting on this, and I need to

lose about 30! I take hydrocortisone for adrenal burnout (25mg) and also Armour

thyroid (90mg) for hypothyroid. I was hoping the CO would jumpstart my

metabolism and help me burn calories better, but it just seems to have slowed

down even more.

> > > >

> > > > Should I stop using the CO? I love the stuff, it tastes great and I

want it for the health benefits as well. Would it solve the problem if I lower

carbs and overall calories? Or is the weight gain just perhaps a problem with MY

body and coconut oil?

> > > >

> > > > thanks for any advice,

> > > > Liz

> > > >

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Finally got the inulin! I believe it's 1 tsp 3x per day, right? Today I had

1/2 teaspoon earlier and will now have my second 1/2 tsp and call it a

day...just to be sure how I react and work up to 3 tsp per day. Are there any

side effects or reactions I should be aware of that I could experience? I mixed

it w/ yogurt (goat)...is it good to take w/ probiotics or separate from them ?

thanks!

Liz

> >

> > Hi Duncan,

> >

> > thanks so much for all the information, I will look up all the links you

provided. For my dad, i've heard that whey is good, but had not gotten around to

checking into it further, so I will do so now...he is eating well but just does

not gain weight.

> >

> > Starting yesterday, i'm going on a mostly vegetarian low carb diet, and also

doing a 2 week colon cleanse. I'm determined to kickstart my thyroid and

adrenals to work again...have already had all mercury taken out of my mouth, but

still need to do DMSA chelation since I think heavy metals is a key factor

behind the gut issues and also yeast etc. (did I mention I have celiac disease

too?) I will check into inulin and MCT oil. I take probiotics but only

sporadically. For now, i'm cutting out the coc. oil except for cooking.

> >

> > appreciate the tips from you and from Chuck! Any tips on how my dad can get

rid of that nerve pain?

> >

> > thanks!

> > Liz

> >

>