Re: how to lower estrodiol

[Guest guest]

Actually no Matt, but his web site looks impressive, very complete, and

his prices extremely reasonable.

I have seen Dr. M in California twice (I live outside Los Angeles), but

the drive is 5 hours each way. Dr. M. has helped me a lot, but the drive

and paying for lodging is a bit much. I am transferring my care to this

guy...

http://www.mitznerfamilymedicine.com/AbouttheDoctor.asp

I have seen a couple of comments from guys that have seen him, and he is

" only " a two hour drive for me...I only have to take one day off work

rather than two.

If you want a guaranteed doctor that will help you, see Dr. .

Otherwise there is always the chance you will be visiting many doctors,

paying lots of money, taking many months...and still have nothing to

show for it. Good hormone doctors that treat you to optimal hormones

(not just " in range " like all the other doctors) are very rare. It's

worth it to drive.

Neil

matttaylor99 wrote:

>

> NEIL, have you had good service from this guy?

>

>

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I have very high estrodiol, low testosterone

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > started on testosterone cream, but the arimidex sent me into a

> > > > > > > nasty depression.

> > > > > > > I was on 1 mg 2x a week

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > any other way to lower estrodiol other then arimidex?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > update

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I have had a resurgence of severe depression, the AD meds have

> > > > > > pooped out. I am in poor shape at the moment.

> > > > > > I have not done any HRT for a 6 weeks or more after

> > > > > > I crashed, the bodylogicmd doctor had me on T3, arimedex and

> > > > > > testosterone cream, . The t3 amount of 3o mcg was to much, she

> > > > > > knew I was taking 225 mcg for synthroid for hypothyroid, so when

> > > > > > I introduced that much t3 without cutting back on the

> synthroid it

> > > > > > made for a problem possibly.

> > > > > > Also the 1mg of arimidex 2x a week was a little much I gather.

> > > > > > I hired another endocrinologists and he suggested stopping all

> > > > > > hrt, then retesting my hormones to get a baseline to see where I

> > > > > > stand. I got the results today

> > > > > >

> > > > > > testosterone serum total 305 range 400 to 1200

> > > > > > free testosterone 1.6 range 1.5 to 3.2

> > > > > > free testosterone s 49 range 52 to280

> > > > > > prolactin 7.8 range 3-18

> > > > > > estrodiol .61 range .8 to 3.5

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Wierd about estrodiol, it used to be way way high

> > > > > >

> > > > > > thyroid

> > > > > > t4 free 1,27 range .61-1.76

> > > > > > fsh 3.2 range 1.4-18.1

> > > > > > tsh 1.161 range .350 to 5.5

> > > > > > t3 104 range 85-205

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I am hoping to start on a alcohol based testosterone cream, doc

> > > > > > seems kind of reluctant, but these numbers are not very good and

> > > > > > should support the cream

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I got a b 12 shot today and will do that regularly

> > > > > > hoping the testosterone cream will help with the depression

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Co-Moderator " Don't believe anything you hear and only half

> of what

> > > > > you see. "

> > > > > > Phil

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Androgel is good if it gets through your skin. & nbsp; But to say come back in 3

months this guy is not up on starting one on this. & nbsp; First your levels are

at 305 so lets say the gel getts you up to 505 then your brain sees the and

stops sending the LH message to your testis to make the 305 T level you have

before you started androgel. & nbsp; Now you only left with a level of 205 lower

then you started at. & nbsp; In the insert when I was on this is says to test is 2

weeks. & nbsp; Most men that start on gels feel better in the first 2 weeks then

fall back this is why. & nbsp; So if you feel better then fall back call him and

tell him he think your not on enough. & nbsp; If he is good he will have you back

in for labs. & nbsp; I have seen men end up lower then they started going on gels

because the Dr. said see you in 2 or 3 months.

& nbsp;

Also if you have a thyroid problem this might not work well do to thicker skin

where the gels don't get through your skin. & nbsp; All the more reasion to check

this in 2 weeks.

Co-Moderator & amp;quot;Don & amp;#39;t believe anything you hear and only half of

what you see. & amp;quot;

Phil

From: matttaylor99 & lt;matttaylor99@... & gt;

Subject: Re: how to lower estrodiol

Date: Friday, May 30, 2008, 10:01 AM

HERE WE go again, my endo called and said my testosterone is

borderline low [ 305] , 400 to 1200 being the range. He prescibed

the pump style androgel cream and said come in in 3 months for a

check up!!!!

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; I have very high estrodiol, low testosterone

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; started on testosterone cream, but the arimidex sent me

into a

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; nasty depression.

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; I was on 1 mg 2x a week

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; any other way to lower estrodiol other then arimidex?

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; update

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; I have had a resurgence of severe depression, the AD meds

have

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; pooped out. I am in poor shape at the moment.

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; I have not done any HRT for a 6 weeks or more after

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; I crashed, the bodylogicmd doctor had me on T3, arimedex and

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; testosterone cream, . The t3 amount of 3o mcg was to much,

she

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; knew I was taking 225 mcg for synthroid for hypothyroid, so

when

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; I introduced that much t3 without cutting back on the

synthroid it

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; made for a problem possibly.

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; Also the 1mg of arimidex 2x a week was a little much I

gather.

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; I hired another endocrinologists and he suggested stopping

all

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; hrt, then retesting my hormones to get a baseline to see

where I

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; stand. I got the results today

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; testosterone serum total 305 range 400 to 1200

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; free testosterone 1.6 range 1.5 to 3.2

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; free testosterone s 49 range 52 to280

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; prolactin 7.8 range 3-18

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; estrodiol .61 range .8 to 3.5

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; Wierd about estrodiol, it used to be way way high

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; thyroid

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; t4 free 1,27 range .61-1.76

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; fsh 3.2 range 1.4-18.1

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; tsh 1.161 range .350 to 5.5

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; t3 104 range 85-205

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; I am hoping to start on a alcohol based testosterone cream,

doc

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; seems kind of reluctant, but these numbers are not very good

and

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; should support the cream

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; I got a b 12 shot today and will do that regularly

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; hoping the testosterone cream will help with the depression

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; Co-Moderator " Don't believe anything you hear and only half

of

what

& gt; & gt; & gt; you see. "

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; Phil

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

[Guest guest]

That was me here is a link to his site.

http://definitivepsychiatry.com/services/services.html

Co-Moderator & amp;quot;Don & amp;#39;t believe anything you hear and only half of

what you see. & amp;quot;

Phil

From: matttaylor99 & lt;matttaylor99@... & gt;

Subject: Re: how to lower estrodiol

Date: Friday, May 30, 2008, 10:34 AM

I read some where here or online about a doctor that thinks

depression is linked to hormones, what doctor is that, one of you

all mentioned it would change psiachyatry

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; I have very high estrodiol, low testosterone

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; started on testosterone cream, but the arimidex sent me

into a

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; nasty depression.

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; I was on 1 mg 2x a week

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; any other way to lower estrodiol other then arimidex?

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; update

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; I have had a resurgence of severe depression, the AD meds

have

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; pooped out. I am in poor shape at the moment.

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; I have not done any HRT for a 6 weeks or more after

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; I crashed, the bodylogicmd doctor had me on T3, arimedex and

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; testosterone cream, . The t3 amount of 3o mcg was to much,

she

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; knew I was taking 225 mcg for synthroid for hypothyroid, so

when

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; I introduced that much t3 without cutting back on the

synthroid it

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; made for a problem possibly.

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; Also the 1mg of arimidex 2x a week was a little much I

gather.

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; I hired another endocrinologists and he suggested stopping

all

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; hrt, then retesting my hormones to get a baseline to see

where I

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; stand. I got the results today

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; testosterone serum total 305 range 400 to 1200

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; free testosterone 1.6 range 1.5 to 3.2

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; free testosterone s 49 range 52 to280

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; prolactin 7.8 range 3-18

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; estrodiol .61 range .8 to 3.5

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; Wierd about estrodiol, it used to be way way high

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; thyroid

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; t4 free 1,27 range .61-1.76

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; fsh 3.2 range 1.4-18.1

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; tsh 1.161 range .350 to 5.5

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; t3 104 range 85-205

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; I am hoping to start on a alcohol based testosterone cream,

doc

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; seems kind of reluctant, but these numbers are not very good

and

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; should support the cream

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; I got a b 12 shot today and will do that regularly

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; hoping the testosterone cream will help with the depression

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; Co-Moderator " Don't believe anything you hear and only half

of

what

& gt; & gt; & gt; you see. "

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt; Phil

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

& gt; & gt; & gt; & gt;

[Guest guest]

On Fri, 30 May 2008 14:42:45 -0000, you wrote:

>CAN ONE OF YOU GUYS FIND THE LINK TO THE DOC THE LINK DEPRESSION AND

> HORMONE ISSUES? PLEASE

http://tinyurl.com/4fm7z2

[Guest guest]

---

starting on androgel today, hope it works out

In , retrogrouch@... wrote:

>

> On Fri, 30 May 2008 14:42:45 -0000, you wrote:

>

> >CAN ONE OF YOU GUYS FIND THE LINK TO THE DOC THE LINK DEPRESSION AND

> > HORMONE ISSUES? PLEASE

>

>

> http://tinyurl.com/4fm7z2

>

[Guest guest]

Just try and get retested in 2 weeks to be sure your on enough and it's

working. & nbsp; You can go lower then you base levels if you skin does not let a

lower dose in. & nbsp; Some feel real good in about 12 days this is because the

gel is adding to your base levels. & nbsp; But in some men your brain will see

this and stop sending the LH message to there testis and all they are left with

is what the gel is doing. & nbsp; So if you feel better then fall back and your

Dr. told you to come back in months don't wait call him.

Co-Moderator & amp;quot;Don & amp;#39;t believe anything you hear and only half of

what you see. & amp;quot;

Phil

& gt;

& gt; & gt;CAN ONE OF YOU GUYS FIND THE LINK TO THE DOC THE LINK DEPRESSION AND

& gt; & gt; HORMONE ISSUES? PLEASE

& gt;

& gt;

& gt; http://tinyurl. com/4fm7z2

& gt;

[Guest guest]

starting on estrogel today, hope this works out

>

> >CAN ONE OF YOU GUYS FIND THE LINK TO THE DOC THE LINK DEPRESSION AND

> > HORMONE ISSUES? PLEASE

>

>

> http://tinyurl.com/4fm7z2

>

[Guest guest]

--- I read my testis may stop working, if so, what do I do, raise

the dosage of cream? those creams only work so well, they are not

like shots. I do not want shots, to many peaks and valleys.

2 weeks to soon for testing, in the links below, it takes months to

benifit from cream

read about the creams here

http://www.t-nation.com/tmagnum/readTopic.do?id=1057802

http://www.t-nation.com/tmagnum/readTopic.do?id=1778062

In , philip georgian <pmgamer18@...> wrote:

>

> Just try and get retested in 2 weeks to be sure your on enough and

it's working. & nbsp; You can go lower then you base levels if you skin

does not let a lower dose in. & nbsp; Some feel real good in about 12

days this is because the gel is adding to your base levels. & nbsp; But

in some men your brain will see this and stop sending the LH message

to there testis and all they are left with is what the gel is

doing. & nbsp; So if you feel better then fall back and your Dr. told

you to come back in months don't wait call him.

>

> Co-Moderator & amp;quot;Don & amp;#39;t believe anything you hear and

only half of what you see. & amp;quot;

> Phil

>

>

> & gt;

> & gt; & gt;CAN ONE OF YOU GUYS FIND THE LINK TO THE DOC THE LINK

DEPRESSION AND

> & gt; & gt; HORMONE ISSUES? PLEASE

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt; http://tinyurl. com/4fm7z2

> & gt;

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

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>

[Guest guest]

Matt it would help is you cut and pasted what you want use to read give us a

link to a thread is hard to tell what you want us to read. & nbsp; Your not on a

Compounded Cream you said you started on Androgel and this is to me the best

form of TRT and everyone just starting should try Androgle a Gel first.

& nbsp;

All I am saying is if your levels are at say 300 you start at a low dose of

Androgel 5 grams = to a 50 mg. shot of testosterone. & nbsp; What can happen is

your brain will see the extra T in your blood any amount it sees it slows down

sending the LH message to your testis to make T. & nbsp; So lets say the 5g

androgel gets you up to 500 and your going to feel better when this

happens. & nbsp; But now your brain will see this and slow down your LH message so

now all you have for a level of T is what the Gel is doing. & nbsp; So you can end

up at 200 100 points less then you started. & nbsp; So you feel good in about 12

days then your LH message slows down and you fall back and feel worse then you

started.

& nbsp;

So if your Dr. gave you the Gel and say he tells you come in and retest in 2 or

3 months your going to suffer feeling worse then you started for this long of a

time. & nbsp; Most men will stop taking it and not give it a chance to work. & nbsp;

& nbsp;

It states in the insert for the gel the last time I read it to retest in 2 weeks

and adjust the dose if your levels did not come up. & nbsp; Men don't have this

problem with Shots because the starting dose at most Dr.'s is & nbsp; a 100mgs =

to 10 grams of Gel.

& nbsp;

Some men don't do well on 5 grams the gel does not get through the skin as easy

as others. & nbsp; & nbsp; So why suffer get it tested I am not saying your going on

gels is bad just trying to give you a heads up. & nbsp; Yes it takes time to feel

your best on any kind of TRT. & nbsp; But I am talking about the level and this

dose & nbsp;not take a long time to go up.

& nbsp;

How TRT works is you want to get your Total and Free T levels up into the upper

1/3 of you labs range then go from there as you start to recover on the

TRT. & nbsp; What I mean by this is as you are leveled at a good level your body

starts to undo the damage done by being low for so long. & nbsp; This is a slow

process for some taking anywhere from 6 months to a year. & nbsp; So first you

need to get to a good level then go by how you feel some need to be near the top

of the range others do good at 1/3 of the top of the range.

& nbsp;

I see this happen all the time maybe some of the guys that this happened to will

post back to you.

Co-Moderator & amp;quot;Don & amp;#39;t believe anything you hear and only half of

what you see. & amp;quot;

Phil

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt; & amp;gt;CAN ONE OF YOU GUYS FIND THE LINK TO THE DOC THE LINK

DEPRESSION AND

& gt; & amp;gt; & amp;gt; HORMONE ISSUES? PLEASE

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt; http://tinyurl. com/4fm7z2

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

[Guest guest]

Phlip, I have heard others say the same thing about checking levels

in a few weeks instead of months. Doctor agreed to check me in a few

weeks... I will wait three weeks to get retested.

I am hypothyroid, so there is a higher chance I will not

absorb well.

Yes I was on a compound cream before, I left that doctor because

she had me on a high dose of arimidex, and a hi dose ot t3 and a had

a bad reaction.

So Philip, if indeed my brain tells my testis to stop working,

I wil simply be able to raise my dose of adrogel from 5 to a higher

level as need based on the tests? btw what is nbsp mean?

MY new doc has my on a low dose of t3, but reduced my synthoid

slightly to accommodate the t3

> & gt; & amp;gt;

> & gt; & amp;gt; & amp;gt;CAN ONE OF YOU GUYS FIND THE LINK TO THE DOC

THE LINK

> DEPRESSION AND

> & gt; & amp;gt; & amp;gt; HORMONE ISSUES? PLEASE

> & gt; & amp;gt;

> & gt; & amp;gt;

> & gt; & amp;gt; http://tinyurl. com/4fm7z2

> & gt; & amp;gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

[Guest guest]

this is what I wanted you to read

Some do not absorb well. Those who are hypothyroid are famous for

that. Low thyroid can mean low energy and weight gain.

Some absorb good in the start, then the skin changes from the effects

of the T (gets better) and that for some means the end of absorption.

TDs also lead to more T-->E aromatization than injections. For some

the E increases, the increased E suppresses the HPTA and the natural T

production fails. If the TD was absorbed well, then the HPTA would be

completely shut down.

You doctor is a jerk, a steroid phobic republican or misinformed. I

don't know what is worse. He was not going to do anything right. You

may need to go out of town.

Ask the local pharmacies what doctors are prescribing testosterone

ethanate or cypionate. Explain that you have T levels down through the

floor and are seeking a doctor who will deal with your situation. You

could show them your lab results!

Many guys struggle to get proper care. It is sad. Some get the

testosterone and can't get their doctors to prescribe

arimidex/anastrozole to control E2 levels. Many of those are driven to

underground supplies. You need to get your E2 levels checked. Do not

test for total estrogen. The LabCorp serum E2 (0-53) works well. You

may be very high. You will feel best with E2 in the low twenties.

Test for total T, free T, TSH, free T3, free T4, PSA.

If all of that is working right, you may not want to have shrinking

testes.

Do you know anyone who has a Sam's Club business membership? You can

get a sub card under theirs. The primary card holder will never see

what you purchase. 10ml 200mg/ml test cypionate s costs $42.50,

10,000iu HCG APP costs $16.25, 50iu insulin syringes are $12.42 per

100 at Sam's or Walmart.

You can inject T cyp with an insulin syringe into the vastus

lateralis. Injecting every week or every two weeks is completely

wrong, even though that is mainstream practice. That creates T spikes

that lead to E spikes and increased SHBG that reduces your %FT. I

inject 28mg EOD. My HCG is 250iu SC EOD.

Elevated E is a main feature of metabolic disorder, the E reduces LH

and that means less T. I think that all men in that state would profit

from arimidex. Metabolic disorder is also pre-diabetes. Your CBC will

cover that. Some might test for fasting insulin.

You can get your own lab work done via LEF.org, for about 1/2 of what

the doctors and clinics will bill for. The 'male panel' will do the

TT, FT, E2. Add thyroid labs to that.

A trial dose of hCG is 1mg/week. At $9/mg that gets costly. There are

non-drug sources of anastrozole that many turn to, even if they have a

prescription. With your weight, you might want to scale up the 1mg/wk

by your weight against a 160lb reference. Depending on your E2 lab

results, you may need more again. I would not exceed 2mg/wk.

Do not get onto injected T without the anastrozole. That would make

your E2 worse! If you get lab work and have a cooperative doctor, you

could take some anastrozole for relief before you get on T. You should

still push to get onto the AI (aromatase inhibitor) from the very

start and front load with 1mg/day for 2 or three days then start you

dosing after that. The non-drug anastrozole comes in a liquid, 1mg/ml

(60 ml $50.00), which allows for good dosing options other that

breaking up a tiny expensive pill.

Get the script for arimidex, and take the prescribed amount with the

liquid. Do not tell the doctor about what you are doing. Follow his

changes based on blood work. Then you can make changes later based on

the lab work yourself. You doctor will not understand dosing changes

of .4mg/wk as he thinks your are using pills. Your doctor does not

want to know about this.

With the elevated E2 that you probably have, you might have some

female fat deposition patterns and perhaps some degree of

gynecomastia. If any signs of gyno, all the more info to present to a

doctor in support of the AI. TRT without AI would then make things

real bad.

You need to learn all about this stuff, because chances are your

doctor will not explain things.

Go to that other doc and get good copies of ALL OF your lab results.

Always obtain good copies and never loose them. Have them in hand when

you see another doctor. Have an androgel prescription label to

document what you have been taking.

Tell the doc that TD test has been useless, your lab results will

substantiate that, and ask to be put on 100mg test cyp per week, 250iu

HCG EOD [i can supply research material to support that], and arimidex

to get E2 under control with a target level in the lower 20's - the E2

levels of a young lean male. You need all three items to get optimal

results. Without the AI, I would expect quite poor results.

If you take 100mg test cyp per week, you are under control of how you

do that. Injecting EOD or twice a week will be better for you. You do

not need to inject into the gluts with 1.5 " needles!

> & gt; & amp;gt;

> & gt; & amp;gt; & amp;gt;CAN ONE OF YOU GUYS FIND THE LINK TO THE DOC

THE LINK

> DEPRESSION AND

> & gt; & amp;gt; & amp;gt; HORMONE ISSUES? PLEASE

> & gt; & amp;gt;

> & gt; & amp;gt;

> & gt; & amp;gt; http://tinyurl. com/4fm7z2

> & gt; & amp;gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt;

[Guest guest]

Ok most of it is what I told you if I were you I would call your Dr. and tell

him how your feeling.

Co-Moderator & amp;quot;Don & amp;#39;t believe anything you hear and only half of

what you see. & amp;quot;

Phil

From: matttaylor99 & lt;matttaylor99@... & gt;

Subject: Re: how to lower estrodiol

Date: Wednesday, June 4, 2008, 10:11 AM

this is what I wanted you to read

Some do not absorb well. Those who are hypothyroid are famous for

that. Low thyroid can mean low energy and weight gain.

Some absorb good in the start, then the skin changes from the effects

of the T (gets better) and that for some means the end of absorption.

TDs also lead to more T-- & gt;E aromatization than injections. For some

the E increases, the increased E suppresses the HPTA and the natural T

production fails. If the TD was absorbed well, then the HPTA would be

completely shut down.

You doctor is a jerk, a steroid phobic republican or misinformed. I

don't know what is worse. He was not going to do anything right. You

may need to go out of town.

Ask the local pharmacies what doctors are prescribing testosterone

ethanate or cypionate. Explain that you have T levels down through the

floor and are seeking a doctor who will deal with your situation. You

could show them your lab results!

Many guys struggle to get proper care. It is sad. Some get the

testosterone and can't get their doctors to prescribe

arimidex/anastrozol e to control E2 levels. Many of those are driven to

underground supplies. You need to get your E2 levels checked. Do not

test for total estrogen. The LabCorp serum E2 (0-53) works well. You

may be very high. You will feel best with E2 in the low twenties.

Test for total T, free T, TSH, free T3, free T4, PSA.

If all of that is working right, you may not want to have shrinking

testes.

Do you know anyone who has a Sam's Club business membership? You can

get a sub card under theirs. The primary card holder will never see

what you purchase. 10ml 200mg/ml test cypionate s costs $42.50,

10,000iu HCG APP costs $16.25, 50iu insulin syringes are $12.42 per

100 at Sam's or Walmart.

You can inject T cyp with an insulin syringe into the vastus

lateralis. Injecting every week or every two weeks is completely

wrong, even though that is mainstream practice. That creates T spikes

that lead to E spikes and increased SHBG that reduces your %FT. I

inject 28mg EOD. My HCG is 250iu SC EOD.

Elevated E is a main feature of metabolic disorder, the E reduces LH

and that means less T. I think that all men in that state would profit

from arimidex. Metabolic disorder is also pre-diabetes. Your CBC will

cover that. Some might test for fasting insulin.

You can get your own lab work done via LEF.org, for about 1/2 of what

the doctors and clinics will bill for. The 'male panel' will do the

TT, FT, E2. Add thyroid labs to that.

A trial dose of hCG is 1mg/week. At $9/mg that gets costly. There are

non-drug sources of anastrozole that many turn to, even if they have a

prescription. With your weight, you might want to scale up the 1mg/wk

by your weight against a 160lb reference. Depending on your E2 lab

results, you may need more again. I would not exceed 2mg/wk.

Do not get onto injected T without the anastrozole. That would make

your E2 worse! If you get lab work and have a cooperative doctor, you

could take some anastrozole for relief before you get on T. You should

still push to get onto the AI (aromatase inhibitor) from the very

start and front load with 1mg/day for 2 or three days then start you

dosing after that. The non-drug anastrozole comes in a liquid, 1mg/ml

(60 ml $50.00), which allows for good dosing options other that

breaking up a tiny expensive pill.

Get the script for arimidex, and take the prescribed amount with the

liquid. Do not tell the doctor about what you are doing. Follow his

changes based on blood work. Then you can make changes later based on

the lab work yourself. You doctor will not understand dosing changes

of .4mg/wk as he thinks your are using pills. Your doctor does not

want to know about this.

With the elevated E2 that you probably have, you might have some

female fat deposition patterns and perhaps some degree of

gynecomastia. If any signs of gyno, all the more info to present to a

doctor in support of the AI. TRT without AI would then make things

real bad.

You need to learn all about this stuff, because chances are your

doctor will not explain things.

Go to that other doc and get good copies of ALL OF your lab results.

Always obtain good copies and never loose them. Have them in hand when

you see another doctor. Have an androgel prescription label to

document what you have been taking.

Tell the doc that TD test has been useless, your lab results will

substantiate that, and ask to be put on 100mg test cyp per week, 250iu

HCG EOD [i can supply research material to support that], and arimidex

to get E2 under control with a target level in the lower 20's - the E2

levels of a young lean male. You need all three items to get optimal

results. Without the AI, I would expect quite poor results.

If you take 100mg test cyp per week, you are under control of how you

do that. Injecting EOD or twice a week will be better for you. You do

not need to inject into the gluts with 1.5 " needles!

& gt; & amp;gt; & amp;amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt; & amp;amp;gt; & amp;amp;gt;CAN ONE OF YOU GUYS FIND THE LINK TO THE

DOC

THE LINK

& gt; DEPRESSION AND

& gt; & amp;gt; & amp;amp;gt; & amp;amp;gt; HORMONE ISSUES? PLEASE

& gt; & amp;gt; & amp;amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt; & amp;amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt; & amp;amp;gt; http://tinyurl. com/4fm7z2

& gt; & amp;gt; & amp;amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

[Guest guest]

I am hypopituitary so my brain does not send the messages to my adrenls to make

cortisol or to my thyroid to make enough hormone.

& nbsp;

I don't like Synthroid my wife was on it for yrs never felt good long before I

found out I was hypopituitary she after 15 yrs on Synthroid found an Dr. that

was not an Endo he put her on Armour and wow for the first time in 15 yrs she

now feels good.

& nbsp;

When the gels come out I was put on them because my levels were not good on

creams. & nbsp; Now that we know my thyroid is low this is why the creams and gels

did not get my levels high enough. & nbsp; For some reasion people with thyroid

problems have a thicker skin and the creams and gels don't get through.

Co-Moderator & amp;quot;Don & amp;#39;t believe anything you hear and only half of

what you see. & amp;quot;

Phil

From: matttaylor99 & lt;matttaylor99@... & gt;

Subject: Re: how to lower estrodiol

Date: Wednesday, June 4, 2008, 9:50 AM

Phlip, I have heard others say the same thing about checking levels

in a few weeks instead of months. Doctor agreed to check me in a few

weeks... I will wait three weeks to get retested.

I am hypothyroid, so there is a higher chance I will not

absorb well.

Yes I was on a compound cream before, I left that doctor because

she had me on a high dose of arimidex, and a hi dose ot t3 and a had

a bad reaction.

So Philip, if indeed my brain tells my testis to stop working,

I wil simply be able to raise my dose of adrogel from 5 to a higher

level as need based on the tests? btw what is nbsp mean?

MY new doc has my on a low dose of t3, but reduced my synthoid

slightly to accommodate the t3

& gt; & amp;gt; & amp;amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt; & amp;amp;gt; & amp;amp;gt;CAN ONE OF YOU GUYS FIND THE LINK TO THE

DOC

THE LINK

& gt; DEPRESSION AND

& gt; & amp;gt; & amp;amp;gt; & amp;amp;gt; HORMONE ISSUES? PLEASE

& gt; & amp;gt; & amp;amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt; & amp;amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt; & amp;amp;gt; http://tinyurl. com/4fm7z2

& gt; & amp;gt; & amp;amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

[Guest guest]

I feel like a million bucks, depression totally gone!!!!!!!!!!!

> >

> > >CAN ONE OF YOU GUYS FIND THE LINK TO THE DOC THE LINK DEPRESSION AND

> > > HORMONE ISSUES? PLEASE

> >

> >

> > http://tinyurl.com/4fm7z2

> >

>

[Guest guest]

I few like my depression is totally gone!!!!!!

> & gt;

> & gt; & gt;CAN ONE OF YOU GUYS FIND THE LINK TO THE DOC THE LINK

DEPRESSION AND

> & gt; & gt; HORMONE ISSUES? PLEASE

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt; http://tinyurl. com/4fm7z2

> & gt;

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[Guest guest]

Here my complete history

45year old male, hypothytoid since age 13, gynecomastia[puffy nipples]

since age 13 yrs. 6'7'' 290. lift weights and use elipitical machine

with little results. High BF with fat around thr middle.

Put on AD meds 3 yrs ago for a bad depression spell. Still on AD

meds.

6 months ago decided to check my hormones after reading

possible link of hormones to gynecomastia and depression. Hired a

company from the web called bodylogicmd.com.

here is me

http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b7cf11b3127ccec2e9033a2ffa00000016100FcOGbl\

s4Yg9vPhQ

first blood results from 12/07' prior to any hrt

cortisol morning 17.6 high range 3.7-9.5 ng/ml

cortisol noon 6.0 high range 1.2-3.0

cortisol eve 2.3 high range .6-1.9

DHEAS saliva 13.2 ok range 2-23

free T4 1.5 ok range .7-2.5

freeT3 2.4 low range 2.5-6.5

TSH 2,0 OK

ESRODIOL 81 HIGH RANGE 12-56 Pg/ML

testosterone 357 low range 400-1200

SHBG 36

RATIO T/SHDG .3 LOW range .7-1.0

psa 1.7 ok

lh 6.1 ok

started me on meds below 1/ 21/o8

T3 tablets 30 mcg daily Cytomil

Arimidex 1mg tab 2x a week

testosterone cream [ compounded] 20 mgs/ml strength, apply 1 ml

dail 6x week

DR WILSons adrenal suppliments, and fish oil tabs

doing ok till about 5 weeks into HRT, I had a bad reaction

in the middle of the night, itchy, sweaty, burning skin, SEVERE

SUICIDAL depression return, hot flashes, stopped all of the HRT,

took about 6 days and I started to feel better. In the mean time went

to my primary doc, told him about my HRT treatment from another

doc, he did blood tests.

blood results 3/19/ 08, 5 or so weeks into HRT, then 6

days off

FREE T 474 RANGE 241- 827 NG./ML

T4 1.30 .61-1.76

TSH .359 .350-5.50

CORTISOL 17.9 3'1-22.4

FREE TESTOSTERONE 12.4 RANGE 6.8-21.5 PG/ML

stayed off HRT, hired a new Endo doc, he said stay off HRT 4

weeks and retested blood work

4 weeks off any HRT, results

TestosteronE SERUM 305 NG/ML RANGE 350-1030

Free T 1.6 '' 1.5-3.2

free t 49 ng/ml range 52-280

shbg 43 range 20-60

prolactin 7.8 ok

ESTRODIOL .61 RANGE .8-3.5

** note how my estrodiol was low, i was very hiGH estrodiol prior

to HRT

2 weeks ago my new endo doc started my on 5 mcg of T3

Cytomil, but dropped my synthroid med from 225 to 200 mcg said the

t3 is potent so need to lower the synthoid as we add T3.

I got a B12 shot on my own 2 weeks ago

Started androgel 4 pumps a day 5 days ago.

Now feeling great , no depression at all. Plan on getting blood

tested in another week or so, MY FEAR is my natural testosterone will

stop, my T levels will drop and I will feel like SH...t

My goal is to taper off the AD meds, get gynecomastia

operation for VERY puffy nipples, get hormones under control, loose

fat and get a better build. thanks for looking Matt

> & gt; & gt;

> & gt; & gt; & gt;CAN ONE OF YOU GUYS FIND THE LINK TO THE DOC THE LINK

DEPRESSION AND

> & gt; & gt; & gt; HORMONE ISSUES? PLEASE

> & gt; & gt;

> & gt; & gt;

> & gt; & gt; http://tinyurl. com/4fm7z2

> & gt; & gt;

> & gt;

>

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[Guest guest]

> & gt; & gt;

> & gt; & gt; & gt;CAN ONE OF YOU GUYS FIND THE LINK TO THE DOC THE LINK

DEPRESSION AND

> & gt; & gt; & gt; HORMONE ISSUES? PLEASE

> & gt; & gt;

> & gt; & gt;

> & gt; & gt; http://tinyurl. com/4fm7z2

> & gt; & gt;

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[Guest guest]

hormone history synopses

45year old male, hypothytoid since age 13, gynecomastia[puffy nipples]

since age 13 yrs. 6'7'' 290. lift weights and use elipitical machine

with little results. High BF with fat around thr middle.

Put on AD meds 3 yrs ago for a bad depression spell. Still on AD meds.

6 months ago decided to check my hormones after reading possible link

of hormones to gynecomastia and depression. Hired a company from the

web called bodylogicmd.com.

here is me

http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b7cf11b3127ccec2e9033a2ffa00000016100FcOGbl\

s4Yg9vPhQ

first blood results from 12/07' prior to any hrt

cortisol morning 17.6 high range 3.7-9.5 ng/ml

cortisol noon 6.0 high range 1.2-3.0

cortisol eve 2.3 high range .6-1.9

DHEAS saliva 13.2 ok range 2-23

free T4 1.5 ok range .7-2.5

freeT3 2.4 low range 2.5-6.5

TSH 2,0 OK

ESRODIOL 81 HIGH RANGE 12-56 Pg/ML

testosterone 357 low range 400-1200

SHBG 36

RATIO T/SHDG .3 LOW range .7-1.0

psa 1.7 ok

lh 6.1 ok

started me on meds below 1/ 21/o8

T3 tablets 30 mcg daily Cytomil

Arimidex 1mg tab 2x a week

testosterone cream [ compounded] 20 mgs/ml strength, apply 1 ml dail

6x week

DR WILSons adrenal suppliments, and fish oil tabs

doing ok till about 5 weeks into HRT, I had a bad reaction in the

middle of the night, itchy, sweaty, burning skin, SEVERE SUICIDAL

depression return, hot flashes, stopped all of the HRT, took about 6

days and I started to feel better. In the mean time went to my primary

doc, told him about my HRT treatment from another doc, he did blood tests.

blood results 3/19/ 08, 5 or so weeks into HRT, then 6 days off

FREE T 474 RANGE 241- 827 NG./ML

T4 1.30 .61-1.76

TSH .359 .350-5.50

CORTISOL 17.9 3'1-22.4

FREE TESTOSTERONE 12.4 RANGE 6.8-21.5 PG/ML

stayed off HRT, hired a new Endo doc, he said stay off HRT 4 weeks and

retested blood work

4 weeks off any HRT, results

TestosteronE SERUM 305 NG/ML RANGE 350-1030

Free T 1.6 '' 1.5-3.2

free t 49 ng/ml range 52-280

shbg 43 range 20-60

prolactin 7.8 ok

ESTRODIOL .61 RANGE .8-3.5

** note how my estrodiol was low, i was very hiGH estrodiol prior to HRT

2 weeks ago my new endo doc started my on 5 mcg of T3 Cytomil, but

dropped my synthroid med from 225 to 200 mcg said the t3 is potent so

need to lower the synthoid as we add T3.

I got a B12 shot on my own 2 weeks ago

Started androgel 4 pumps a day 5 days ago.

Now feeling great , no depression at all. Plan on getting blood tested

in another week or so, MY FEAR is my natural testosterone will stop,

my T levels will drop and I will feel like SH...t

My goal is to taper off the AD meds, get gynecomastia operation for

VERY puffy nipples, get hormones under control, loose fat and get a

better build. thanks for looking Matt

> & gt; & gt;

> & gt; & gt; & gt;CAN ONE OF YOU GUYS FIND THE LINK TO THE DOC THE LINK

DEPRESSION AND

> & gt; & gt; & gt; HORMONE ISSUES? PLEASE

> & gt; & gt;

> & gt; & gt;

> & gt; & gt; http://tinyurl. com/4fm7z2

> & gt; & gt;

> & gt;

>

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[Guest guest]

Matt one thing I seen in your Cortisol lebs is your at about stage 3 or 4 for

Adreanl Fatigue. & nbsp; If this test is real old I would keep an eye on this in

time you will fall low. & nbsp; Here is a link on the stages.

http://www.chronicfatigue.org/ASI%201%20.html

Here is a link about Adrenal Fatigue.

http://www.lammd.com/A3R_brief_in_doc_format/adrenal_fatigue.cfm

A lot of people that are on Synthroid end up like this because it's might not be

the thyroid med for them and there adrenals are over working try to help keep

your thyroid up. & nbsp; You would do good to test this again and go on Armour it

has all the T's in it and you don't need to do synthroid with T3. & nbsp; The web

is full of bad stroies about people not doing good on synthroid and seeing

Endo's and Dr's that will not use it yet it was the only med out there yrs

ago. & nbsp; & nbsp; And it worked good but the Drug Co.'s come make it or make

money from it. & nbsp; So they push Synthriod on you with your Dr. & nbsp; Here are

2 sites that will open your eyes.

http://personal.lig.bellsouth.net/w/u/wurmstei/

& nbsp;

http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/

& nbsp;

Here is a FAQ's on Adrenals and if your Cortisol levels do go down your Thyroid

meds will build up in your blood and not get carried into your cells. & nbsp; So

you can start feeling worse.

http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/adrenal-info/faq/

& nbsp;

I do hope you keep doing better and if your levels fall add more gel this is

what we do. & nbsp; I can't say you will not need TRT don't know why your

low. & nbsp; Some of us never figure out why but I can't and don't think you will

do good without it.

Co-Moderator & amp;quot;Don & amp;#39;t believe anything you hear and only half of

what you see. & amp;quot;

Phil

From: matttaylor99 & lt;matttaylor99@... & gt;

Subject: Re: how to lower estrodiol

Date: Friday, June 6, 2008, 6:01 AM

Here my complete history

45year old male, hypothytoid since age 13, gynecomastia[ puffy nipples]

since age 13 yrs. 6'7'' 290. lift weights and use elipitical machine

with little results. High BF with fat around thr middle.

Put on AD meds 3 yrs ago for a bad depression spell. Still on AD

meds.

6 months ago decided to check my hormones after reading

possible link of hormones to gynecomastia and depression. Hired a

company from the web called bodylogicmd. com.

here is me

http://im1.shutterf ly.com/procserv/ 47b7cf11b3127cce c2e9033a2ffa0000

0016100FcOGbls4Y g9vPhQ

first blood results from 12/07' prior to any hrt

cortisol morning 17.6 high range 3.7-9.5 ng/ml

cortisol noon 6.0 high range 1.2-3.0

cortisol eve 2.3 high range .6-1.9

DHEAS saliva 13.2 ok range 2-23

free T4 1.5 ok range .7-2.5

freeT3 2.4 low range 2.5-6.5

TSH 2,0 OK

ESRODIOL 81 HIGH RANGE 12-56 Pg/ML

testosterone 357 low range 400-1200

SHBG 36

RATIO T/SHDG .3 LOW range .7-1.0

psa 1.7 ok

lh 6.1 ok

started me on meds below 1/ 21/o8

T3 tablets 30 mcg daily Cytomil

Arimidex 1mg tab 2x a week

testosterone cream [ compounded] 20 mgs/ml strength, apply 1 ml

dail 6x week

DR WILSons adrenal suppliments, and fish oil tabs

doing ok till about 5 weeks into HRT, I had a bad reaction

in the middle of the night, itchy, sweaty, burning skin, SEVERE

SUICIDAL depression return, hot flashes, stopped all of the HRT,

took about 6 days and I started to feel better. In the mean time went

to my primary doc, told him about my HRT treatment from another

doc, he did blood tests.

blood results 3/19/ 08, 5 or so weeks into HRT, then 6

days off

FREE T 474 RANGE 241- 827 NG./ML

T4 1.30 .61-1.76

TSH .359 .350-5.50

CORTISOL 17.9 3'1-22.4

FREE TESTOSTERONE 12.4 RANGE 6.8-21.5 PG/ML

stayed off HRT, hired a new Endo doc, he said stay off HRT 4

weeks and retested blood work

4 weeks off any HRT, results

TestosteronE SERUM 305 NG/ML RANGE 350-1030

Free T 1.6 '' 1.5-3.2

free t 49 ng/ml range 52-280

shbg 43 range 20-60

prolactin 7.8 ok

ESTRODIOL .61 RANGE .8-3.5

** note how my estrodiol was low, i was very hiGH estrodiol prior

to HRT

2 weeks ago my new endo doc started my on 5 mcg of T3

Cytomil, but dropped my synthroid med from 225 to 200 mcg said the

t3 is potent so need to lower the synthoid as we add T3.

I got a B12 shot on my own 2 weeks ago

Started androgel 4 pumps a day 5 days ago.

Now feeling great , no depression at all. Plan on getting blood

tested in another week or so, MY FEAR is my natural testosterone will

stop, my T levels will drop and I will feel like SH...t

My goal is to taper off the AD meds, get gynecomastia

operation for VERY puffy nipples, get hormones under control, loose

fat and get a better build. thanks for looking Matt

& gt; & amp;gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt; & amp;gt; & amp;gt;CAN ONE OF YOU GUYS FIND THE LINK TO THE DOC THE

LINK

DEPRESSION AND

& gt; & amp;gt; & amp;gt; & amp;gt; HORMONE ISSUES? PLEASE

& gt; & amp;gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt; & amp;gt; http://tinyurl. com/4fm7z2

& gt; & amp;gt; & amp;gt;

& gt; & amp;gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

& gt;

[Guest guest]

I have been on Androgel for two weeks, felt great for 10 days and

now starting to feel poorly again. Wonder if my own T is cutting back?

Get tested tommorrow for T levels, I MAY increase my use of T

gel after the test to see if I feel better?

Other sight say the gel sucks and I should go the the T cyp

shats? thoughts?

I had 350 T levels [ 400-1200 range] and 81 Estrodiol levels

[10-50 range] prior to Testosterone therapy,. My guess is my E2

is risen too.

> & gt;

> & gt; & gt;CAN ONE OF YOU GUYS FIND THE LINK TO THE DOC THE LINK

DEPRESSION AND

> & gt; & gt; HORMONE ISSUES? PLEASE

> & gt;

> & gt;

> & gt; http://tinyurl. com/4fm7z2

> & gt;

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Well don't listen to them most men do dam good on Androgel I wish I did. If

your test is not in the upper 1/3 of your labs range for Total and Free T this

up the dose of gel with your Dr. Do test Estradiol and keep this below 40 pg/ml

best for most at 20.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: matttaylor99 <matttaylor99@...>

> Subject: Re: how to lower estrodiol

>

> Date: Tuesday, June 17, 2008, 3:33 PM

> I have been on Androgel for two weeks, felt great for 10

> days and

> now starting to feel poorly again. Wonder if my own T

> is cutting back?

> Get tested tommorrow for T levels, I MAY increase my

> use of T

> gel after the test to see if I feel better?

>

> Other sight say the gel sucks and I should go the

> the T cyp

> shats? thoughts?

>

> I had 350 T levels [ 400-1200 range] and 81 Estrodiol

> levels

> [10-50 range] prior to Testosterone therapy,. My guess

> is my E2

> is risen too.

>

>

>

>

>

> > & gt;

> > & gt; & gt;CAN ONE OF YOU GUYS FIND THE LINK TO

> THE DOC THE LINK

> DEPRESSION AND

> > & gt; & gt; HORMONE ISSUES? PLEASE

> > & gt;

> > & gt;

> > & gt; http://tinyurl. com/4fm7z2

> > & gt;

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

---

DR with all things male wants you to buy RX from him and the

prices are high.I and insurance wont pay for rx from him

Where can I locate dr marianco, google produced nothing on his practice

In , philip georgian <pmgamer18@...> wrote:

>

> Dr. M is in CA. and Dr. is in MI. witch is close to you. Both

are dam good Dr.'s.

> Dr. is more about hormones Dr. M is more about Psychiatry yet

feels most mental problems are do to bad hormones. His new book will

change the Psychiatry works. Both only need to see you once and will

treat you by Email.

>

> You can reach Dr. at www.allthingsmale.com

> and

> You can reach Dr. M at this link.

> http://definitivepsychiatry.com/services/services.html

>

>

> matttaylor99 <matttaylor99@...> wrote:

> ''f you have no

> luck getting this Dr. to give you Depo testosterone shots starting at

> 100mgs a

> week then you need to find a good Dr. DO Dr.'s are some of the best

> where do you

> live.''

>

> I am confused Philip, do I want dr john from ALLTHINGS male or do

> I want dr M? whoever that is, what is DO DRs. as you stated above?

>

>

> > > > >

> > > > > I have very high estrodiol, low testosterone

> > > > >

> > > > > started on testosterone cream, but the arimidex sent me into a

> > > > > nasty depression.

> > > > > I was on 1 mg 2x a week

> > > > >

> > > > > any other way to lower estrodiol other then arimidex?

> > > >

> > > > update

> > > >

> > > > I have had a resurgence of severe depression, the AD meds have

> > > > pooped out. I am in poor shape at the moment.

> > > > I have not done any HRT for a 6 weeks or more after

> > > > I crashed, the bodylogicmd doctor had me on T3, arimedex and

> > > > testosterone cream, . The t3 amount of 3o mcg was to much, she

> > > > knew I was taking 225 mcg for synthroid for hypothyroid, so when

> > > > I introduced that much t3 without cutting back on the synthroid it

> > > > made for a problem possibly.

> > > > Also the 1mg of arimidex 2x a week was a little much I gather.

> > > > I hired another endocrinologists and he suggested stopping all

> > > > hrt, then retesting my hormones to get a baseline to see where I

> > > > stand. I got the results today

> > > >

> > > > testosterone serum total 305 range 400 to 1200

> > > > free testosterone 1.6 range 1.5 to 3.2

> > > > free testosterone s 49 range 52 to280

> > > > prolactin 7.8 range 3-18

> > > > estrodiol .61 range .8 to 3.5

> > > >

> > > > Wierd about estrodiol, it used to be way way high

> > > >

> > > > thyroid

> > > > t4 free 1,27 range .61-1.76

> > > > fsh 3.2 range 1.4-18.1

> > > > tsh 1.161 range .350 to 5.5

> > > > t3 104 range 85-205

> > > >

> > > > I am hoping to start on a alcohol based testosterone cream, doc

> > > > seems kind of reluctant, but these numbers are not very good and

> > > > should support the cream

> > > >

> > > > I got a b 12 shot today and will do that regularly

> > > > hoping the testosterone cream will help with the depression

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Co-Moderator " Don't believe anything you hear and only half of

what

> > > you see. "

> > > > Phil

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

[Guest guest]

Dr. sells RX's but it is not required that you buy from him he does this as

to help men from out of town. I don't see how you see his price is more. Just

ask for a script. Dr. M is in the DATA base under Physicians.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> > ''f you have no

> > luck getting this Dr. to give you Depo testosterone

> shots starting at

> > 100mgs a

> > week then you need to find a good Dr. DO Dr.'s are

> some of the best

> > where do you

> > live.''

> >

> > I am confused Philip, do I want dr john from ALLTHINGS

> male or do

> > I want dr M? whoever that is, what is DO DRs. as you

> stated above?

> >

> >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I have very high estrodiol, low

> testosterone

> > > > > >

> > > > > > started on testosterone cream, but

> the arimidex sent me into a

> > > > > > nasty depression.

> > > > > > I was on 1 mg 2x a week

> > > > > >

> > > > > > any other way to lower estrodiol

> other then arimidex?

> > > > >

> > > > > update

> > > > >

> > > > > I have had a resurgence of severe

> depression, the AD meds have

> > > > > pooped out. I am in poor shape at the

> moment.

> > > > > I have not done any HRT for a 6 weeks

> or more after

> > > > > I crashed, the bodylogicmd doctor had

> me on T3, arimedex and

> > > > > testosterone cream, . The t3 amount of

> 3o mcg was to much, she

> > > > > knew I was taking 225 mcg for synthroid

> for hypothyroid, so when

> > > > > I introduced that much t3 without

> cutting back on the synthroid it

> > > > > made for a problem possibly.

> > > > > Also the 1mg of arimidex 2x a week was

> a little much I gather.

> > > > > I hired another endocrinologists and he

> suggested stopping all

> > > > > hrt, then retesting my hormones to get

> a baseline to see where I

> > > > > stand. I got the results today

> > > > >

> > > > > testosterone serum total 305 range 400

> to 1200

> > > > > free testosterone 1.6 range 1.5 to 3.2

> > > > > free testosterone s 49 range 52 to280

> > > > > prolactin 7.8 range 3-18

> > > > > estrodiol .61 range .8 to 3.5

> > > > >

> > > > > Wierd about estrodiol, it used to be

> way way high

> > > > >

> > > > > thyroid

> > > > > t4 free 1,27 range .61-1.76

> > > > > fsh 3.2 range 1.4-18.1

> > > > > tsh 1.161 range .350 to 5.5

> > > > > t3 104 range 85-205

> > > > >

> > > > > I am hoping to start on a alcohol based

> testosterone cream, doc

> > > > > seems kind of reluctant, but these

> numbers are not very good and

> > > > > should support the cream

> > > > >

> > > > > I got a b 12 shot today and will do

> that regularly

> > > > > hoping the testosterone cream will help

> with the depression

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Co-Moderator " Don't believe

> anything you hear and only half of

> what

> > > > you see. "

> > > > > Phil

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have

> been removed]

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Co-Moderator " Don't believe

> anything you hear and only half of what

> > > you see. "

> > > > Phil

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> removed]

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Co-Moderator " Don't believe anything you

> hear and only half of what

> > you see. "

> > > Phil

> > >

> > >

> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> removed]

> > >

> >

> > f you have no

> > luck getting this Dr. to give you Depo testosterone

> shots starting at

> > 100mgs a

> > week then you need to find a good Dr. DO Dr.'s are

> some of the best

> > where do you

> > live.

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Co-Moderator " Don't believe anything you hear

> and only half of what

> you see. "

> > Phil

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

On Tue, 17 Jun 2008 19:33:10 -0000, you wrote:

>

> I have been on Androgel for two weeks, felt great for 10 days and

> now starting to feel poorly again. Wonder if my own T is cutting back?

> Get tested tommorrow for T levels, I MAY increase my use of T

>gel after the test to see if I feel better?

>

> Other sight say the gel sucks and I should go the the T cyp

>shats? thoughts?

>

> I had 350 T levels [ 400-1200 range] and 81 Estrodiol levels

>[10-50 range] prior to Testosterone therapy,. My guess is my E2

>is risen too.

I would guess E2 is climbing.

81 is already pretty high.

It may be they could have boosted your T levels to acceptable levels

by simply getting your E2 levels down. Many people get a 200 to 300

point boost in T levels when getting E2 down.

You certainly need E2 management.

[Guest guest]

Matt or anyone,

I am looking for a short term E conversion inhibitor before I get a Rx

for arim. There is mention of a DIM product below. What is this? Does

anyone else have a suggestion? Chrysin works?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I have very high estrodiol, low

> > testosterone

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > started on testosterone cream, but

> > the arimidex sent me into a

> > > > > > > nasty depression.

> > > > > > > I was on 1 mg 2x a week

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > any other way to lower estrodiol

> > other then arimidex?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > update

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I have had a resurgence of severe

> > depression, the AD meds have

> > > > > > pooped out. I am in poor shape at the

> > moment.

> > > > > > I have not done any HRT for a 6 weeks

> > or more after

> > > > > > I crashed, the bodylogicmd doctor had

> > me on T3, arimedex and

> > > > > > testosterone cream, . The t3 amount of

> > 3o mcg was to much, she

> > > > > > knew I was taking 225 mcg for synthroid

> > for hypothyroid, so when

> > > > > > I introduced that much t3 without

> > cutting back on the synthroid it

> > > > > > made for a problem possibly.

> > > > > > Also the 1mg of arimidex 2x a week was

> > a little much I gather.

> > > > > > I hired another endocrinologists and he

> > suggested stopping all

> > > > > > hrt, then retesting my hormones to get

> > a baseline to see where I

> > > > > > stand. I got the results today

> > > > > >

> > > > > > testosterone serum total 305 range 400

> > to 1200

> > > > > > free testosterone 1.6 range 1.5 to 3.2

> > > > > > free testosterone s 49 range 52 to280

> > > > > > prolactin 7.8 range 3-18

> > > > > > estrodiol .61 range .8 to 3.5

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Wierd about estrodiol, it used to be

> > way way high

> > > > > >

> > > > > > thyroid

> > > > > > t4 free 1,27 range .61-1.76

> > > > > > fsh 3.2 range 1.4-18.1

> > > > > > tsh 1.161 range .350 to 5.5

> > > > > > t3 104 range 85-205

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I am hoping to start on a alcohol based

> > testosterone cream, doc

> > > > > > seems kind of reluctant, but these

> > numbers are not very good and

> > > > > > should support the cream

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I got a b 12 shot today and will do

> > that regularly

> > > > > > hoping the testosterone cream will help

> > with the depression

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Co-Moderator " Don't believe

> > anything you hear and only half of

> > what

> > > > > you see. "

> > > > > > Phil

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have

> > been removed]

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Co-Moderator " Don't believe

> > anything you hear and only half of what

> > > > you see. "

> > > > > Phil

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Co-Moderator " Don't believe anything you

> > hear and only half of what

> > > you see. "

> > > > Phil

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> > > >

> > >

> > > f you have no

> > > luck getting this Dr. to give you Depo testosterone

> > shots starting at

> > > 100mgs a

> > > week then you need to find a good Dr. DO Dr.'s are

> > some of the best

> > > where do you

> > > live.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Co-Moderator " Don't believe anything you hear

> > and only half of what

> > you see. "

> > > Phil

> > >

> > >

> > >