RE: clinic director rates

[Guest guest]

Mike,

Good point.

I know the APTA has guidelines for responsibilities of a clinical director

and I fail to see how anyone other that a PT could properly apply them and

ultimately have this level of responsibility. I think if some internet

efficient person digs those out of the APTA site we could conclusively

answer this question. I did a quick peek and could not do this. I have them

printed and filed somewhere though.

Joe Ruzich, PT

clinic director rates

Would anyone be willing to share with me their rates (either privately or to

the group) for an outpatient clinic director. The particular person we are

looking at is a P.T.A. who has 15+ years experience as a P.T.A., with 5-7 of

those years in management. It is a small clinic with approximately 6

employees. Would pay be the same as a P.T. director? I appreciate any

responses. Thanks!

Zandex Health Care

[Guest guest]

Mike,

Good point.

I know the APTA has guidelines for responsibilities of a clinical director

and I fail to see how anyone other that a PT could properly apply them and

ultimately have this level of responsibility. I think if some internet

efficient person digs those out of the APTA site we could conclusively

answer this question. I did a quick peek and could not do this. I have them

printed and filed somewhere though.

Joe Ruzich, PT

clinic director rates

Would anyone be willing to share with me their rates (either privately or to

the group) for an outpatient clinic director. The particular person we are

looking at is a P.T.A. who has 15+ years experience as a P.T.A., with 5-7 of

those years in management. It is a small clinic with approximately 6

employees. Would pay be the same as a P.T. director? I appreciate any

responses. Thanks!

Zandex Health Care

[Guest guest]

Mike,

Good point.

I know the APTA has guidelines for responsibilities of a clinical director

and I fail to see how anyone other that a PT could properly apply them and

ultimately have this level of responsibility. I think if some internet

efficient person digs those out of the APTA site we could conclusively

answer this question. I did a quick peek and could not do this. I have them

printed and filed somewhere though.

Joe Ruzich, PT

clinic director rates

Would anyone be willing to share with me their rates (either privately or to

the group) for an outpatient clinic director. The particular person we are

looking at is a P.T.A. who has 15+ years experience as a P.T.A., with 5-7 of

those years in management. It is a small clinic with approximately 6

employees. Would pay be the same as a P.T. director? I appreciate any

responses. Thanks!

Zandex Health Care

[Guest guest]

;

Why do I wonder whether you are an ATC? I would only add this; it has often

been said that the only thing more difficult than managing people, is

managing professional people.

Ken Mailly, PT

Mailly & Inglett Consulting, LLC

Tel. 973 692-0033

Fax 973 633-9557

68 Seneca Trail

Wayne, NJ, 07470

www.NJPTAid.biz

Bridging the Gap!

RE: clinic director rates

Are you kidding me? It is a management position which is completely

independent of treatment and legal considerations. In fact, you will find a

high percentage of sports medicine clinics are managed by certified athletic

trainers. Their experiences gained through training room management and

constantly interacting with physicians makes them much more qualified in

management and leadership roles than most PT's.

Keating

--------- clinic director rates

>

> Would anyone be willing to share with me their rates (either privately or

to

> the group) for an outpatient clinic director. The particular person we are

> looking at is a P.T.A. who has 15+ years experience as a P.T.A., with 5-7

of

> those years in management. It is a small clinic with approximately 6

> employees. Would pay be the same as a P.T. director? I appreciate any

> responses. Thanks!

>

>

> Zandex Health Care

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

;

Why do I wonder whether you are an ATC? I would only add this; it has often

been said that the only thing more difficult than managing people, is

managing professional people.

Ken Mailly, PT

Mailly & Inglett Consulting, LLC

Tel. 973 692-0033

Fax 973 633-9557

68 Seneca Trail

Wayne, NJ, 07470

www.NJPTAid.biz

Bridging the Gap!

RE: clinic director rates

Are you kidding me? It is a management position which is completely

independent of treatment and legal considerations. In fact, you will find a

high percentage of sports medicine clinics are managed by certified athletic

trainers. Their experiences gained through training room management and

constantly interacting with physicians makes them much more qualified in

management and leadership roles than most PT's.

Keating

--------- clinic director rates

>

> Would anyone be willing to share with me their rates (either privately or

to

> the group) for an outpatient clinic director. The particular person we are

> looking at is a P.T.A. who has 15+ years experience as a P.T.A., with 5-7

of

> those years in management. It is a small clinic with approximately 6

> employees. Would pay be the same as a P.T. director? I appreciate any

> responses. Thanks!

>

>

> Zandex Health Care

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

;

Why do I wonder whether you are an ATC? I would only add this; it has often

been said that the only thing more difficult than managing people, is

managing professional people.

Ken Mailly, PT

Mailly & Inglett Consulting, LLC

Tel. 973 692-0033

Fax 973 633-9557

68 Seneca Trail

Wayne, NJ, 07470

www.NJPTAid.biz

Bridging the Gap!

RE: clinic director rates

Are you kidding me? It is a management position which is completely

independent of treatment and legal considerations. In fact, you will find a

high percentage of sports medicine clinics are managed by certified athletic

trainers. Their experiences gained through training room management and

constantly interacting with physicians makes them much more qualified in

management and leadership roles than most PT's.

Keating

--------- clinic director rates

>

> Would anyone be willing to share with me their rates (either privately or

to

> the group) for an outpatient clinic director. The particular person we are

> looking at is a P.T.A. who has 15+ years experience as a P.T.A., with 5-7

of

> those years in management. It is a small clinic with approximately 6

> employees. Would pay be the same as a P.T. director? I appreciate any

> responses. Thanks!

>

>

> Zandex Health Care

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

According to California regulations, PTA's are limited in director

roles.

Reference from www.ptb.ca.gov/leadership.pdf state:

Consumer Affairs State of California

Department of Physical Therapist Assistants Serving in Leadership Roles

Can a physical therapist assistant serve in duel administrative and

clinical roles?

The position of the Physical Therapy Board of California regarding a

physical therapist assistant serving in a leadership role was prompted

by an inquiry that identified positions such as " team leaders " and

" district managers " as individuals who are licensed as physical

therapist assistants... Specific questions presented for consideration

by the Board were:

The physical therapist assistant in a leadership role for the clinical

staff that includes a physical therapist may not personally perform any

patient related service as a physical therapist assistant in the same

practice. Business and Professions Code section 2655© defines the

essential relationship between the supervising physical therapist and

the supervised physical therapist assistant and mandates that the

supervising physical therapist shall be responsible for the extent,

kind, and quality of services provided by the physical therapist

assistant. Section 1398.44 of the Board's regulations (Title 16 CCR)

implements this statutory mandate by enumerating extensive supervisory

duties of the physical therapist. Under these statutory and regulatory

provisions it is the supervising physical therapist that must direct and

supervise the physical therapy assistant. The physical therapist

assistant who is supervised by the physical therapist cannot " clinically

lead " . Finally, the Board must add that, pursuant to the provisions of

section 2660 of the Business and Professions Code, a physical therapist

or a physical therapist assistant who fails to comply with the statutes

or regulations administered by the Board is subject to revocation or

suspension of the physical therapist's or the physical therapist

assistant's authorization to practice.

Jespersen MSPT, ATC

Supervisor Rehab: Danville & Rossmoor

(925)831-1414 & (925)988-7595

clinic director rates

Would anyone be willing to share with me their rates (either privately

or to

the group) for an outpatient clinic director. The particular person we

are

looking at is a P.T.A. who has 15+ years experience as a P.T.A., with

5-7 of

those years in management. It is a small clinic with approximately 6

employees. Would pay be the same as a P.T. director? I appreciate any

responses. Thanks!

Zandex Health Care

[Guest guest]

According to California regulations, PTA's are limited in director

roles.

Reference from www.ptb.ca.gov/leadership.pdf state:

Consumer Affairs State of California

Department of Physical Therapist Assistants Serving in Leadership Roles

Can a physical therapist assistant serve in duel administrative and

clinical roles?

The position of the Physical Therapy Board of California regarding a

physical therapist assistant serving in a leadership role was prompted

by an inquiry that identified positions such as " team leaders " and

" district managers " as individuals who are licensed as physical

therapist assistants... Specific questions presented for consideration

by the Board were:

The physical therapist assistant in a leadership role for the clinical

staff that includes a physical therapist may not personally perform any

patient related service as a physical therapist assistant in the same

practice. Business and Professions Code section 2655© defines the

essential relationship between the supervising physical therapist and

the supervised physical therapist assistant and mandates that the

supervising physical therapist shall be responsible for the extent,

kind, and quality of services provided by the physical therapist

assistant. Section 1398.44 of the Board's regulations (Title 16 CCR)

implements this statutory mandate by enumerating extensive supervisory

duties of the physical therapist. Under these statutory and regulatory

provisions it is the supervising physical therapist that must direct and

supervise the physical therapy assistant. The physical therapist

assistant who is supervised by the physical therapist cannot " clinically

lead " . Finally, the Board must add that, pursuant to the provisions of

section 2660 of the Business and Professions Code, a physical therapist

or a physical therapist assistant who fails to comply with the statutes

or regulations administered by the Board is subject to revocation or

suspension of the physical therapist's or the physical therapist

assistant's authorization to practice.

Jespersen MSPT, ATC

Supervisor Rehab: Danville & Rossmoor

(925)831-1414 & (925)988-7595

clinic director rates

Would anyone be willing to share with me their rates (either privately

or to

the group) for an outpatient clinic director. The particular person we

are

looking at is a P.T.A. who has 15+ years experience as a P.T.A., with

5-7 of

those years in management. It is a small clinic with approximately 6

employees. Would pay be the same as a P.T. director? I appreciate any

responses. Thanks!

Zandex Health Care

[Guest guest]

Hi everyone,

First I am in agreement that the best choice should be the best manager;

however, having worked under various managers from different fields, I have

always found that the best manager for a physical therapy clinic (not

necessarily a rehab clinic with multi-specialties) is a PT who is a good

manager. Just my 15 year experience.

There is also another concern about a PTA as manager. As evidenced by this

discussion, the PTA manager will have the additional responsibility of

winning the confidence of PT staff that most likely will be against having a

PTA in a management role. Talk about a large barrier. It would make me

think twice about hiring a PTA into this role unless I was absolutely sure

that they could handle that barrier and have a plan to remove that barrier.

Tom Howell, P.T., M.P.T.

Howell Physical Therapy

Eagle, ID

howellpt@...

clinic director rates

Would anyone be willing to share with me their rates (either privately or to

the group) for an outpatient clinic director. The particular person we are

looking at is a P.T.A. who has 15+ years experience as a P.T.A., with 5-7 of

those years in management. It is a small clinic with approximately 6

employees. Would pay be the same as a P.T. director? I appreciate any

responses. Thanks!

Zandex Health Care

[Guest guest]

Hi everyone,

First I am in agreement that the best choice should be the best manager;

however, having worked under various managers from different fields, I have

always found that the best manager for a physical therapy clinic (not

necessarily a rehab clinic with multi-specialties) is a PT who is a good

manager. Just my 15 year experience.

There is also another concern about a PTA as manager. As evidenced by this

discussion, the PTA manager will have the additional responsibility of

winning the confidence of PT staff that most likely will be against having a

PTA in a management role. Talk about a large barrier. It would make me

think twice about hiring a PTA into this role unless I was absolutely sure

that they could handle that barrier and have a plan to remove that barrier.

Tom Howell, P.T., M.P.T.

Howell Physical Therapy

Eagle, ID

howellpt@...

clinic director rates

Would anyone be willing to share with me their rates (either privately or to

the group) for an outpatient clinic director. The particular person we are

looking at is a P.T.A. who has 15+ years experience as a P.T.A., with 5-7 of

those years in management. It is a small clinic with approximately 6

employees. Would pay be the same as a P.T. director? I appreciate any

responses. Thanks!

Zandex Health Care

[Guest guest]

Hi everyone,

First I am in agreement that the best choice should be the best manager;

however, having worked under various managers from different fields, I have

always found that the best manager for a physical therapy clinic (not

necessarily a rehab clinic with multi-specialties) is a PT who is a good

manager. Just my 15 year experience.

There is also another concern about a PTA as manager. As evidenced by this

discussion, the PTA manager will have the additional responsibility of

winning the confidence of PT staff that most likely will be against having a

PTA in a management role. Talk about a large barrier. It would make me

think twice about hiring a PTA into this role unless I was absolutely sure

that they could handle that barrier and have a plan to remove that barrier.

Tom Howell, P.T., M.P.T.

Howell Physical Therapy

Eagle, ID

howellpt@...

clinic director rates

Would anyone be willing to share with me their rates (either privately or to

the group) for an outpatient clinic director. The particular person we are

looking at is a P.T.A. who has 15+ years experience as a P.T.A., with 5-7 of

those years in management. It is a small clinic with approximately 6

employees. Would pay be the same as a P.T. director? I appreciate any

responses. Thanks!

Zandex Health Care

[Guest guest]

Mike,

No offense taken here, other than your opinion that ATC's are better

managers than PT's (paraphrased). I think this kicked off some good

discussion and again I for one am not offended. We all have a right to our

opinions and to defend them as we see fit, I guess that is what forums are

for?

clinic director rates

Would anyone be willing to share with me their rates (either privately or to

the group) for an outpatient clinic director. The particular person we are

looking at is a P.T.A. who has 15+ years experience as a P.T.A., with 5-7 of

those years in management. It is a small clinic with approximately 6

employees. Would pay be the same as a P.T. director? I appreciate any

responses. Thanks!

Zandex Health Care

[Guest guest]

Mike,

No offense taken here, other than your opinion that ATC's are better

managers than PT's (paraphrased). I think this kicked off some good

discussion and again I for one am not offended. We all have a right to our

opinions and to defend them as we see fit, I guess that is what forums are

for?

clinic director rates

Would anyone be willing to share with me their rates (either privately or to

the group) for an outpatient clinic director. The particular person we are

looking at is a P.T.A. who has 15+ years experience as a P.T.A., with 5-7 of

those years in management. It is a small clinic with approximately 6

employees. Would pay be the same as a P.T. director? I appreciate any

responses. Thanks!

Zandex Health Care

[Guest guest]

Jolene,

I do feel that an OT, SLP or RN may not be appropriate to supervise PT's for

the same reasons as stated against the PTA argument.

Joe Ruzich, PT

Re: clinic director rates

Why would u hire a PTA as clinical director and do u have a PT on premises?

As a PT I would feel very uncomfortable working with an assistant as the

director.

[Guest guest]

Jolene,

I do feel that an OT, SLP or RN may not be appropriate to supervise PT's for

the same reasons as stated against the PTA argument.

Joe Ruzich, PT

Re: clinic director rates

Why would u hire a PTA as clinical director and do u have a PT on premises?

As a PT I would feel very uncomfortable working with an assistant as the

director.

[Guest guest]

Jolene,

I do feel that an OT, SLP or RN may not be appropriate to supervise PT's for

the same reasons as stated against the PTA argument.

Joe Ruzich, PT

Re: clinic director rates

Why would u hire a PTA as clinical director and do u have a PT on premises?

As a PT I would feel very uncomfortable working with an assistant as the

director.

[Guest guest]

Just a quick point of clarification, in regards to the ATC comment, that was

another Mike, not me! I agree that this has generated a good discussion/debate.

Mike Hampton, PT

Outpatient Therapy Manager

St. ph Hospital

clinic director rates

Would anyone be willing to share with me their rates (either privately or to

the group) for an outpatient clinic director. The particular person we are

looking at is a P.T.A. who has 15+ years experience as a P.T.A., with 5-7 of

those years in management. It is a small clinic with approximately 6

employees. Would pay be the same as a P.T. director? I appreciate any

responses. Thanks!

Zandex Health Care

[Guest guest]

Just a quick point of clarification, in regards to the ATC comment, that was

another Mike, not me! I agree that this has generated a good discussion/debate.

Mike Hampton, PT

Outpatient Therapy Manager

St. ph Hospital

clinic director rates

Would anyone be willing to share with me their rates (either privately or to

the group) for an outpatient clinic director. The particular person we are

looking at is a P.T.A. who has 15+ years experience as a P.T.A., with 5-7 of

those years in management. It is a small clinic with approximately 6

employees. Would pay be the same as a P.T. director? I appreciate any

responses. Thanks!

Zandex Health Care

[Guest guest]

Just a quick point of clarification, in regards to the ATC comment, that was

another Mike, not me! I agree that this has generated a good discussion/debate.

Mike Hampton, PT

Outpatient Therapy Manager

St. ph Hospital

clinic director rates

Would anyone be willing to share with me their rates (either privately or to

the group) for an outpatient clinic director. The particular person we are

looking at is a P.T.A. who has 15+ years experience as a P.T.A., with 5-7 of

those years in management. It is a small clinic with approximately 6

employees. Would pay be the same as a P.T. director? I appreciate any

responses. Thanks!

Zandex Health Care

[Guest guest]

, manager rates vary wildly. In a Colorado rural SNF a PTA clinic

supervisor or manager could be anywhere from 45-60K depending on

experience, and management skills. Maybe more if they are a good

negotiator and bring an extraordinary skillset to the table. As for

PTAs managing a saff of PTs, OTs and STs, It is extremely short

sighted to suggest only a PT can understand and manage PTs. I have

been doing this long enough to know that some of my most effective

people have been PTAs and ATCs. If they have the desire and skills to

be managers, it would be foolish to hold them back. Get the right

people on the bus and put them in the right seats.

Darrell Messersmith

Director of Physical Medicine

Platte Valley Medical Center

>

> Would anyone be willing to share with me their rates (either

privately or to the group) for an outpatient clinic director. The

particular person we are looking at is a P.T.A. who has 15+ years

experience as a P.T.A., with 5-7 of those years in management. It is

a small clinic with approximately 6 employees. Would pay be the same

as a P.T. director? I appreciate any responses. Thanks!

>

>

> Zandex Health Care

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

, manager rates vary wildly. In a Colorado rural SNF a PTA clinic

supervisor or manager could be anywhere from 45-60K depending on

experience, and management skills. Maybe more if they are a good

negotiator and bring an extraordinary skillset to the table. As for

PTAs managing a saff of PTs, OTs and STs, It is extremely short

sighted to suggest only a PT can understand and manage PTs. I have

been doing this long enough to know that some of my most effective

people have been PTAs and ATCs. If they have the desire and skills to

be managers, it would be foolish to hold them back. Get the right

people on the bus and put them in the right seats.

Darrell Messersmith

Director of Physical Medicine

Platte Valley Medical Center

>

> Would anyone be willing to share with me their rates (either

privately or to the group) for an outpatient clinic director. The

particular person we are looking at is a P.T.A. who has 15+ years

experience as a P.T.A., with 5-7 of those years in management. It is

a small clinic with approximately 6 employees. Would pay be the same

as a P.T. director? I appreciate any responses. Thanks!

>

>

> Zandex Health Care

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

, manager rates vary wildly. In a Colorado rural SNF a PTA clinic

supervisor or manager could be anywhere from 45-60K depending on

experience, and management skills. Maybe more if they are a good

negotiator and bring an extraordinary skillset to the table. As for

PTAs managing a saff of PTs, OTs and STs, It is extremely short

sighted to suggest only a PT can understand and manage PTs. I have

been doing this long enough to know that some of my most effective

people have been PTAs and ATCs. If they have the desire and skills to

be managers, it would be foolish to hold them back. Get the right

people on the bus and put them in the right seats.

Darrell Messersmith

Director of Physical Medicine

Platte Valley Medical Center

>

> Would anyone be willing to share with me their rates (either

privately or to the group) for an outpatient clinic director. The

particular person we are looking at is a P.T.A. who has 15+ years

experience as a P.T.A., with 5-7 of those years in management. It is

a small clinic with approximately 6 employees. Would pay be the same

as a P.T. director? I appreciate any responses. Thanks!

>

>

> Zandex Health Care

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Don't knock it until you've tried it. HealthSouth had a O.P. V.P. who was a

P.T.A. In there hey-day this guy was one of the head cheeses. He knew his

stuff and people respected him. Further, my former business partner is a

P.T.A. He is Strain CounterStrain certified and probably knows more about

Orthopedics than most P.T.s I know. Don't be afraid to hire a clinical

director who is a P.T.A. He or she might have a better business management

acumen than most P.T.s.

Re: clinic director rates

> Why would u hire a PTA as clinical director and do u have a PT on

premises?

> As a PT I would feel very uncomfortable working with an assistant as the

> director.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Don't knock it until you've tried it. HealthSouth had a O.P. V.P. who was a

P.T.A. In there hey-day this guy was one of the head cheeses. He knew his

stuff and people respected him. Further, my former business partner is a

P.T.A. He is Strain CounterStrain certified and probably knows more about

Orthopedics than most P.T.s I know. Don't be afraid to hire a clinical

director who is a P.T.A. He or she might have a better business management

acumen than most P.T.s.

Re: clinic director rates

> Why would u hire a PTA as clinical director and do u have a PT on

premises?

> As a PT I would feel very uncomfortable working with an assistant as the

> director.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Don't knock it until you've tried it. HealthSouth had a O.P. V.P. who was a

P.T.A. In there hey-day this guy was one of the head cheeses. He knew his

stuff and people respected him. Further, my former business partner is a

P.T.A. He is Strain CounterStrain certified and probably knows more about

Orthopedics than most P.T.s I know. Don't be afraid to hire a clinical

director who is a P.T.A. He or she might have a better business management

acumen than most P.T.s.

Re: clinic director rates

> Why would u hire a PTA as clinical director and do u have a PT on

premises?

> As a PT I would feel very uncomfortable working with an assistant as the

> director.

>

>

>