New Member

[Guest guest]

Welcome Celeste )!!!!!

Glad you found us and are enjoying Tae-Bo )!!!!!!!

Sandie, Tae and Bo )!!!!!!!!

--- celistina@... wrote:

> Hello all, my name is Celeste

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

> > What is your name? 

> >

Welcome )!!!!!!!

I've been doing Tae-Bo for 2 years and have lost 75-80

pounds. Still a few inches/pounds here and there to

lose. Good luck on your journey and you'll do well

)!!!!!!!

Sandie, Tae and Bo )!!!!!!!

=====

" Believe. Believe in yourself. Believe in the one who believes in you. All

things are possible to she who believes. Blessings on your courage. "

--from " Hold That Thought " by Ban Breathnach

" I was always looking outside myself for strength and confidence, but it comes

from within. It is there all the time. "

--------- Freud

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

> > What is your name? 

> >

Welcome )!!!!!!!

I've been doing Tae-Bo for 2 years and have lost 75-80

pounds. Still a few inches/pounds here and there to

lose. Good luck on your journey and you'll do well

)!!!!!!!

Sandie, Tae and Bo )!!!!!!!

=====

" Believe. Believe in yourself. Believe in the one who believes in you. All

things are possible to she who believes. Blessings on your courage. "

--from " Hold That Thought " by Ban Breathnach

" I was always looking outside myself for strength and confidence, but it comes

from within. It is there all the time. "

--------- Freud

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

>Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2001 11:39:47 -0800 (PST)

> > > What is your name? 

> > >

Welcome ! I've only been doing Taebo about 5 months now. For me, I've

noticed many inner changes as well as outer changes. I was an exercise

addict up until a few years ago and then got so burnt out I quit exercising

at all for 2 years. Taebo is the only thing that got me motivated enough to

workout again. The neat thing about Taebo is that it helped me grow inside

and I've been able to keep that little excericse addict inside me under

control and actually listen to my body if I need a day of rest, etc. I'm

much more positive and upbeat about things. I know this sounds corny, but I

really feel like I was given a new chance and a new outlook on life. I have

carpal tunnel syndrom and neck problems (daily headaches, etc.) and I had

become very unhappy and negative...but those days are gone..thanks to

and Taebo!!!!

Colleen, who went until just now without any meds today! YIPPEEEEEEE!!!!

_________________________________________________________________

Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 3/19/01 6:46:35 PM !!!First Boot!!!, Agaw12577@...

writes:

<<

> Tell us a bit about your family (spouse, kids, pets, etc.):  My dh, Ren'e,

is a Software Engineer and a skydiver ; we have two wonderful kid, Evan (3)

and Logan (1); one golden retriever, Sunny.

> >>

,

I am SO jealous! I want to take up skydiving but I can't seem to get my

husband interested in it AND I want a Golden Retriever so bad! We have three

cats right now, but since we move around, we have decided no more pets till

after we are out of the military. Our cats hate traveling and I fear being

stationed in Japan. I love Goldens so much and am a strong supporter of the

Gold Ribbon Rescue Program. Where do you live? Can I visit you and your dog???

Who loves ALL animals but is partial to cats and Goldens

[Guest guest]

--- galofgop@... wrote:

Where do you live? Can I visit you and your dog???

>

> Who loves ALL animals but is partial to cats and

> Goldens

>

,

I don't have a Golden Retriever, but I have a very

loveable Italian Greyhound. I live in Southern

land if you want to stop by to play with him.

Kerri

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Welcome to you, Jean-Francois.

Hope we could be of some help for you, and thank you for your offer of help.

This can be very precious, particularly when we (at least, I, as it happened

to me several times these last 2 months) have a medical text to translate

which is inserted into a market research document. In such a case, till now,

I systematically reminded the client that I refused any liability for the

marketing terms. As he is a very cool (and polite :-) man, he was used to

answer " don't worry, my true problem is the medical terminology. " But,

maybe, from now, I might look less stupid about marketing issues :-))

Do enjoy the list.

Take care, and have a nice week-end if you are lucky enough to have a free

one !

GUILLIAUMET - France

Moderator of the Medical_Translation mailing-list for professionals

http://cgtradmed-com.ifrance.com

cgtradmed@...

cgtradmed@...

cgtradmed@...

+33 (0)4 75 90 96 85

----- Message d'origine -----

De : " Jean-Francois Crevecoeur "

À : <medical_translation >

Envoyé : vendredi 13 décembre 2002 16:36

Objet : New member

Hello all,

My name is Jean-François Crèvecoeur, and I am a En > Fr translator in

Brussels, Belgium.

I am not a medical translator, I have absolutely no competence in that

field.

I am a marketing, commercial and legal translator, but from time to time I

must translate a market research questionnaire about

pharmaceutical/medical products.

But if anytime I can help you for any other purpose, like marketing etc., I

am at your disposition.

Kind regards,

Jean-François Crèvecoeur

URL: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/medical_translation

In case of any problem with this list, you can reach the moderator at

cgtradmed@..., or at cgtradmed@...

To unsubscribe, please send an *empty* message to

medical_translation-UNSUBSCRIBE

[Guest guest]

I really relate to some of the recent posts

on social anxiety and worries over posting to message boards, which

is probably why it's taken a gentle push from Edith for me to pluck

up courage to say hi here :-)

Hi ,

I lurked here for a while before I felt safe enough to post. I decided that I

wasn't going to get better unless I dealt with some things. The only way I

could do that was by posting.

I am still afraid sometimes, but I keep pushing on toward the light.

Hania

[Guest guest]

>

> Hi ,

> I lurked here for a while before I felt safe enough to post. I

decided that I wasn't going to get better unless I dealt with some

things. The only way I could do that was by posting.

> I am still afraid sometimes, but I keep pushing on toward the

light.

> Hania

>

Hi Hania

it's really surprised me how scared I get about posting. Sorry

you've found that too. if it helps with dealing with things, working

at overcoming the fear has to be worth the effort.

A

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

No problem. We'll be glad to help if we can. Just post a question and

you're sure to get answers.

Is the person with BPD your mother or your father?

- Edith

Moderator

" K. Hall " wrote:

>

> Hello:

>

> My name is Jame sand I am a new member. I couold use any help

> getting to know how this works.

>

> I hope to make contact with individuals as soon as posssible.

>

>

..

[Guest guest]

Hello Edith:

I appreciate your reply to my mail. The person with BPD is my mother. My

full sister and my half sister also have BPD. My half brother and I are very

much effected by this. Of course, I am writing on my behalf and wanted to

convey a complete picture of the family dynamic.

By posting a question, could you please explain how I do this. I am not only

new to this group, but to yahoo also. I am not sure how to start to approach

this, but I am sure that I could use some form of support group. Possibly,

you could send me on the right path.

-

In a message dated 1/7/2003 5:58:34 AM Eastern Standard Time,

wondrrkid@... writes:

> Hi ,

>

> No problem. We'll be glad to help if we can. Just post a question and

> you're sure to get answers.

> Is the person with BPD your mother or your father?

>

> - Edith

> Moderator

>

> " K. Hall " wrote:

> >

> > Hello:

> >

> > My name is Jame sand I am a new member. I couold use any help

> > getting to know how this works.

> >

> > I hope to make contact with individuals as soon as posssible.

> >

> >

> .

>

> To get off the list, send a blank message to

> ModOasis-unsubscribe . Send questions & amp; concerns to

> ModOasis-owner . & quot;Stop Walking on Eggshells, & quot; a

> primer for non-BPs can be ordered via 1-888-35-SHELL (). For

> the table of contents, see http://www.BPDCentral.com

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hello and thanks.

Any hint as to how to approach this forum properly and not be out of bounds

would always be appreciated.

Do I just post questions to the group as a whole? Can I ask or tell how I

feel? I am not only new to this group, but to yahoo as well.

I have always wondered if there were others who went through what I did and

still do. I hope I can learn to use this forum properly and not only

benefit, but be of some help to others who I am sure suffer as I have and do.

Much Thanks,

[Guest guest]

Thanks Ilene:

I am now enlightened about the phrase nada. It is so funny that it describes

how I have always felt. I am 43 with a BPD mother age 75.

I will post as soon as I learn what is appropriate and what is not. Is it OK

to contact individuals directly in this group, or is that a no no in every

case.

Thanks much for your welcome and introduction.

[Guest guest]

Hi and welcome :-)

A

> Hello:

>

> My name is Jame sand I am a new member. I couold use any help

> getting to know how this works.

>

> I hope to make contact with individuals as soon as posssible.

>

[Guest guest]

Hi . Welcome. I haven't been on this list very long, but as long the

guidelines are followed, which are posted by Edith, share anything pertinent

to Borderline Personality Disorder and any personal experience that you

want. I don't post too often, but it is good to hear all the stories and

know I am not alone in dealing with all this. Jen

New member

> Hello:

>

> My name is Jame sand I am a new member. I couold use any help

> getting to know how this works.

>

> I hope to make contact with individuals as soon as posssible.

>

>

>

>

> To get off the list, send a blank message to

ModOasis-unsubscribe . Send questions & amp; concerns to

ModOasis-owner . & quot;Stop Walking on Eggshells, & quot; a

primer for non-BPs can be ordered via 1-888-35-SHELL (). For the

table of contents, see http://www.BPDCentral.com

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Welcome , let us know how we can help! I'm a 44 yo woman with a BP

mother, who's 89 . I discovered BPD about 2 yrs ago , when a new

therapist enlightened me. I've had a lot of twisted thinking patterns

to correct and I'm still working on stuff. You can't change the BP, I

discovered, but you can change the damage they've done to you. Post

away! PS. we call mothers nadas a lot here because they are " not a "

mother or " nothing " in Spanish.

Ilene

K. Hall wrote:

> Hello:

>

> My name is Jame sand I am a new member. I couold use any help

> getting to know how this works.

>

> I hope to make contact with individuals as soon as posssible.

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

As you have surely noticed by now us guys are the minority here.

Nevertheless, I have found this to be a very welcoming place.

I think you don't need to worry too much about posting what is

appropriate. Just review the guidelines, and then write what comes

to your mind. So far I have seen that this group is mature enough to

gently pull us back on topic if we wander off.

I too was the " evil " child, because I questioned my parents'

perfection. I am the oldest. My mother had such impossible

requirements for me that nobody could have fulfilled them, no matter

how hard they tried, so being the black sheep came naturally. The

alternative would have been not to exist at all.

Welcome to the group, and I am glad to see more guys here.

- Dan

[Guest guest]

, generally it's better to stay within this group, because early on

there can be a tendency to repeat habits we've learned like splitting

etc. By posting to the group you get a very big barrel of replies to

validate you. Often we see different things, because we've had

different experiences....sort of the more bang for your buck idea!

There are lots of books that get recommended so get ready to read. for

example we all start with SWOE (Stop walking on eggshells) and then go

to " UTMB - Understanding the Bordeline Mother " . also I recommend

" Codependent No More " , " Toxic Parents " , " Emotional Abuse " , and

" Boundaries " (one by Cloud and Townsend is christian and the other by A.

isn't . both are excellent but not quite the same.) Sounds

like you've got a lot of processing to do. The best way is to post and

post...many times one of us can see something you can't because we

aren't emotionally involved in your family like we are in ours and most

nadas tend to be a lot alike. I understand now how Edith can see where

we are on our journeys...she's gotten thru the tunnel and is on top of

the mountain watching the rest of us climb. It's not easy changing

patterns and values taught to us by our FOO(families of origin), but it

is well worth doing!

Ilene

jkhtrip@... wrote:

> Thanks Ilene:

>

> I am now enlightened about the phrase nada. It is so funny that it

> describes

> how I have always felt. I am 43 with a BPD mother age 75.

>

> I will post as soon as I learn what is appropriate and what is not.

> Is it OK

> to contact individuals directly in this group, or is that a no no in

> every

> case.

>

> Thanks much for your welcome and introduction.

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

, generally it's better to stay within this group, because early on

there can be a tendency to repeat habits we've learned like splitting

etc. By posting to the group you get a very big barrel of replies to

validate you. Often we see different things, because we've had

different experiences....sort of the more bang for your buck idea!

There are lots of books that get recommended so get ready to read. for

example we all start with SWOE (Stop walking on eggshells) and then go

to " UTMB - Understanding the Bordeline Mother " . also I recommend

" Codependent No More " , " Toxic Parents " , " Emotional Abuse " , and

" Boundaries " (one by Cloud and Townsend is christian and the other by A.

isn't . both are excellent but not quite the same.) Sounds

like you've got a lot of processing to do. The best way is to post and

post...many times one of us can see something you can't because we

aren't emotionally involved in your family like we are in ours and most

nadas tend to be a lot alike. I understand now how Edith can see where

we are on our journeys...she's gotten thru the tunnel and is on top of

the mountain watching the rest of us climb. It's not easy changing

patterns and values taught to us by our FOO(families of origin), but it

is well worth doing!

Ilene

jkhtrip@... wrote:

> Thanks Ilene:

>

> I am now enlightened about the phrase nada. It is so funny that it

> describes

> how I have always felt. I am 43 with a BPD mother age 75.

>

> I will post as soon as I learn what is appropriate and what is not.

> Is it OK

> to contact individuals directly in this group, or is that a no no in

> every

> case.

>

> Thanks much for your welcome and introduction.

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

randerdk wrote:

> Hey List,

>

> Well, mostly I guess I will sit back and listen for a while. My mom

> has borderline personality disorder, and right now, well the games

> are overwhelming. I am hurt and angry as living hell.

The anger is good but the emotional hurt can be very painful.

> I havent heard

> from her since we had a big fight on the phone where I held her

> responsible for a whole bunch of lies she had told me.

Hmmm, OK. I'll run some stuff by you...

BPs come in different flavors. Some are high-functioning, some are

low-functioning. They're all spread out along a continuum between the

two extremes. And, they have an assortment of any five or more of the 9

diagnostic DSM criteria. BPs are mentally ill. They don't use real-world

logic. And, because we KOs (Kids Of BPs) have no background in " normal " ,

we have nothing normal to compare their behavior with. KOs are in an

unchosen relationship with their nada/fada (BP mother or BP father). In

other words, we didn't ask for a parent with a mental disorder but

that's what we got.

To continue. BPs use rationalization (ie, they tell lies), projection

(they blame others), denial, and splitting as (unconscious) ego defense

mechanisms. The ego defenses are automatically triggered whenever a BP

is confronted. BPs have a very tiny and/or fragmented ego. And, when

they're on the defensive (to protect their ego) the defense mechanisms

happen automatically -- and they don't operate based on real-world

logic. BPs can also be manipulative, and they lack empathy, etc etc. But

the defense mechanisms " just happen " . Ofttimes the BP will say later

that they don't remember what happened when chaos happened. This can be

true because some of them dissociate (for example, while raging).

The lies are nada's (ego protective) rationalizations. And, when

confronted, that must have brought out her denial, projection, and/or

splitting (into all good or all bad). This isn't the easiest stuff in

the world to learn about. I hope you have a copy of SWOE.

> Anyways, it is all quite hurtful these days,

Yes, but she's not necessarily using real-world logic and she may not

mean what she says. Plus, you've not yet learned to not take her stuff

personally. This is hard for KOs to understand because the KO's pain is

real and they believe their BP parent is being honest and truthful.

> and I just dont know

> what to do no more.

But you ended up here and that's good.

> I know if I cut contact with her then the suicide

> threats etc, etc will go totally bananas.

Yes, and that's an ace card that she holds. She planted that 'hook' in

you early in your life and she knows that she can control your behavior

(ie, she knows that you'll feel FOG (Fear, Obligation, and/or Guilt))

when she yanks on that hook. Nadas (BP mothers) lack empathy so they

don't know how bad it hurts their KO when they do stuff like that. They

can read us (our reactions) like a book so the idea is to learn to not

react -- like it says in the post on Control Freaks that I posted

earlier. If the KO doesn't show a reaction, then it takes the air out of

their nada's balloon. Plus there's lots other stuff we can share with

you.

> So far I have satisfied

> myself with the very far physical distance there is between us, and

> just handled her for visits and phone calls. But by now I am frankly

> also so angry that I am about to the place where I dont care about

> her suicide threats and bad health any more. She has done it to

> herself with the last 20 years of heavy drinking.

BPs are often substance abusers. But, actually, everyone is responsible

for their own behavior -- even nadas. When they do FOG stuff its really

hard on a KO. We can offer validation and support here. You'll learn

about boundaries (ie, limits). And you'll learn that it gets gets worse

before it gets better if/when you start setting limits. You're at the

point now where you're trying to decide what to do about setting limits.

> Ahh well.. I will sit back and listen for a while. Maybe some other

> folks here on the list have found ways of dealing that I have yet to

> see.

A-OK Malene. I'm glad you finally found us. Fix yourself a cup of hot

chocolate and cozy up in one of our comfy chairs and post when ever you

want. The best way to get answers around here is to ask questions but

sometimes its hard to figure out what questions to ask.

I've pasted our vocabulary list at the end of this post. See below.

- Edith

Moderator/Facilitator/Gal Friday: WelcomeToOz Family of NonBP Lists

<<

++ WelcomeToOz Guidelines : Section 8 / Abbreviations ++

ABBREVIATIONS: The WTO lists have abbreviations and their own

vernacular. Words commonly used include:

BP: person in your life who has BPD or whom YOU THINK has BPD traits.

BPD: Borderline Personality Disorder.

BPSO: BP Significant Other. XBPSO=Ex BPSO (this has many variations).

DBT: Dialectic Behavioral Therapy, a cognitive-behavioral therapy

that has been successful in the treatment of BPD. Also see 'Therapies'

at www.BPDCentral.com website.

DEAR: Communication technique used to set limits and ask for things.

See at www.BPDCentral.com (press 'Library').

Defense Mechanisms: projection, denial, splitting, and rationalization.

Distortion campaign: a deliberate attempt by someone to smear your

name because they have split you as all bad. They feel justified and

may tell lies or truly believe their distortions. May or may not

involve the law.

DSM-IV: Diagnostic and Statistical Manual, edition 4, published by the

American Psychiatric Association. Used for diagnostic and insurance

purposes.

Fada: Used by some of the NonBP adult children of BPDs on the Oasis

lists to refer to their BP father who was not-a-father in the true

sense of the word.

Fleas: Unhealthy behavioral reactions learned while living with a BP.

FOG: Fear, Obligation and Guilt, which make you susceptible to

emotional blackmail.

FOO: Family Of Origin (includes one's original mother, father, and

other children).

HF: High functioning.

Hoovered: after the vacuum cleaner, to be sucked back into the

relationship for another ride on the BPD rollercoaster.

Intermittent reinforcement: when good outcomes happen on an

unpredictable schedule, thereby reinforcing (ie, rewarding) behavior.

Examples: when the BP sometimes acts 'normal', when you sometimes

don't observe limits (this is rewarding to the BP).

KO: Kid Of [a BP].

L & L: The booklet titled " Love and Loathing " .

Lasagna therapy: A type of therapy whereby lasagna is dumped over the

head of a BP who constantly criticizes the way one eats--so much so

one won't eat with the family anymore. Salad dumping in the lap is an

adjunct part of this therapy. Currently under double-blind test trials

at several prestigious universities. <wink>

LF: Low functioning.

Light Bulb Effect: the realization that you're not crazy and BPD may

explain the other person's behavior.

LOL: Laughing Out Loud.

Me2: " Me too " . Like, that happened to me, too.

Mirroring: Not absorbing the BP's projections and reflecting them back

to the BP.

Nada: Used by some of the NonBP adult offspring of BPDs on the 'Oasis'

lists to refer to their BP mother who was not-a-mother in the true

sense of the word.

NPD: Narcissistic Personality Disorder.

NonBP: Person who is affected by someone else's BPD -- eg, you and

your family.

OCD: Obsessive Compulsive Disorder.

Oz: the " Twilight Zone " feeling of not knowing what is real because of

the BP's distortions.

PAS: Parental Alienation Syndrome: When a parent deliberately and

repeatedly makes the other parent the " bad guy " and the child believes

the accusations (such as " Daddy doesn't love you. " ) A form of child

abuse.

Projection: When a person denies certain feelings by attributing them

to someone else.

PUVAS and DEAR: Communication techniques you can download at the

www.BPDCentral.com library. DEAR is about setting personal limits and

PUVAS is about ONE of the communication techniques you can use to

communicate with BPs. Other techniques in SWOE are defusing and

walking away.

Rationalization: Good-sounding reasons but not necessarily truthful.

ROFL: Rolling on the floor laughing.

SKids: Step kids.

SO: Significant Other.

Splitting: Black and white thinking, practiced by both Nons and BPs.

Sponging: Absorbing the BP's projections and bad feelings. (See

" mirroring " )

STB-ex: Soon-to-be ex [husband, wife, or SO]

SWOE: The book " Stop Walking on Eggshells. "

SWOEW: The workbook to SWOE.

Trigger: not a horse, but something that takes a person back to an

earlier trauma. They respond to the current situation and also relive

the past one. For example, a BP's criticism about your clothes

triggers you because your father did the same thing.

UBM: Book titled " Understanding The Borderline Mother " .

>>

[Guest guest]

randerdk wrote:

> Hey List,

>

> Well, mostly I guess I will sit back and listen for a while. My mom

> has borderline personality disorder, and right now, well the games

> are overwhelming. I am hurt and angry as living hell.

The anger is good but the emotional hurt can be very painful.

> I havent heard

> from her since we had a big fight on the phone where I held her

> responsible for a whole bunch of lies she had told me.

Hmmm, OK. I'll run some stuff by you...

BPs come in different flavors. Some are high-functioning, some are

low-functioning. They're all spread out along a continuum between the

two extremes. And, they have an assortment of any five or more of the 9

diagnostic DSM criteria. BPs are mentally ill. They don't use real-world

logic. And, because we KOs (Kids Of BPs) have no background in " normal " ,

we have nothing normal to compare their behavior with. KOs are in an

unchosen relationship with their nada/fada (BP mother or BP father). In

other words, we didn't ask for a parent with a mental disorder but

that's what we got.

To continue. BPs use rationalization (ie, they tell lies), projection

(they blame others), denial, and splitting as (unconscious) ego defense

mechanisms. The ego defenses are automatically triggered whenever a BP

is confronted. BPs have a very tiny and/or fragmented ego. And, when

they're on the defensive (to protect their ego) the defense mechanisms

happen automatically -- and they don't operate based on real-world

logic. BPs can also be manipulative, and they lack empathy, etc etc. But

the defense mechanisms " just happen " . Ofttimes the BP will say later

that they don't remember what happened when chaos happened. This can be

true because some of them dissociate (for example, while raging).

The lies are nada's (ego protective) rationalizations. And, when

confronted, that must have brought out her denial, projection, and/or

splitting (into all good or all bad). This isn't the easiest stuff in

the world to learn about. I hope you have a copy of SWOE.

> Anyways, it is all quite hurtful these days,

Yes, but she's not necessarily using real-world logic and she may not

mean what she says. Plus, you've not yet learned to not take her stuff

personally. This is hard for KOs to understand because the KO's pain is

real and they believe their BP parent is being honest and truthful.

> and I just dont know

> what to do no more.

But you ended up here and that's good.

> I know if I cut contact with her then the suicide

> threats etc, etc will go totally bananas.

Yes, and that's an ace card that she holds. She planted that 'hook' in

you early in your life and she knows that she can control your behavior

(ie, she knows that you'll feel FOG (Fear, Obligation, and/or Guilt))

when she yanks on that hook. Nadas (BP mothers) lack empathy so they

don't know how bad it hurts their KO when they do stuff like that. They

can read us (our reactions) like a book so the idea is to learn to not

react -- like it says in the post on Control Freaks that I posted

earlier. If the KO doesn't show a reaction, then it takes the air out of

their nada's balloon. Plus there's lots other stuff we can share with

you.

> So far I have satisfied

> myself with the very far physical distance there is between us, and

> just handled her for visits and phone calls. But by now I am frankly

> also so angry that I am about to the place where I dont care about

> her suicide threats and bad health any more. She has done it to

> herself with the last 20 years of heavy drinking.

BPs are often substance abusers. But, actually, everyone is responsible

for their own behavior -- even nadas. When they do FOG stuff its really

hard on a KO. We can offer validation and support here. You'll learn

about boundaries (ie, limits). And you'll learn that it gets gets worse

before it gets better if/when you start setting limits. You're at the

point now where you're trying to decide what to do about setting limits.

> Ahh well.. I will sit back and listen for a while. Maybe some other

> folks here on the list have found ways of dealing that I have yet to

> see.

A-OK Malene. I'm glad you finally found us. Fix yourself a cup of hot

chocolate and cozy up in one of our comfy chairs and post when ever you

want. The best way to get answers around here is to ask questions but

sometimes its hard to figure out what questions to ask.

I've pasted our vocabulary list at the end of this post. See below.

- Edith

Moderator/Facilitator/Gal Friday: WelcomeToOz Family of NonBP Lists

<<

++ WelcomeToOz Guidelines : Section 8 / Abbreviations ++

ABBREVIATIONS: The WTO lists have abbreviations and their own

vernacular. Words commonly used include:

BP: person in your life who has BPD or whom YOU THINK has BPD traits.

BPD: Borderline Personality Disorder.

BPSO: BP Significant Other. XBPSO=Ex BPSO (this has many variations).

DBT: Dialectic Behavioral Therapy, a cognitive-behavioral therapy

that has been successful in the treatment of BPD. Also see 'Therapies'

at www.BPDCentral.com website.

DEAR: Communication technique used to set limits and ask for things.

See at www.BPDCentral.com (press 'Library').

Defense Mechanisms: projection, denial, splitting, and rationalization.

Distortion campaign: a deliberate attempt by someone to smear your

name because they have split you as all bad. They feel justified and

may tell lies or truly believe their distortions. May or may not

involve the law.

DSM-IV: Diagnostic and Statistical Manual, edition 4, published by the

American Psychiatric Association. Used for diagnostic and insurance

purposes.

Fada: Used by some of the NonBP adult children of BPDs on the Oasis

lists to refer to their BP father who was not-a-father in the true

sense of the word.

Fleas: Unhealthy behavioral reactions learned while living with a BP.

FOG: Fear, Obligation and Guilt, which make you susceptible to

emotional blackmail.

FOO: Family Of Origin (includes one's original mother, father, and

other children).

HF: High functioning.

Hoovered: after the vacuum cleaner, to be sucked back into the

relationship for another ride on the BPD rollercoaster.

Intermittent reinforcement: when good outcomes happen on an

unpredictable schedule, thereby reinforcing (ie, rewarding) behavior.

Examples: when the BP sometimes acts 'normal', when you sometimes

don't observe limits (this is rewarding to the BP).

KO: Kid Of [a BP].

L & L: The booklet titled " Love and Loathing " .

Lasagna therapy: A type of therapy whereby lasagna is dumped over the

head of a BP who constantly criticizes the way one eats--so much so

one won't eat with the family anymore. Salad dumping in the lap is an

adjunct part of this therapy. Currently under double-blind test trials

at several prestigious universities. <wink>

LF: Low functioning.

Light Bulb Effect: the realization that you're not crazy and BPD may

explain the other person's behavior.

LOL: Laughing Out Loud.

Me2: " Me too " . Like, that happened to me, too.

Mirroring: Not absorbing the BP's projections and reflecting them back

to the BP.

Nada: Used by some of the NonBP adult offspring of BPDs on the 'Oasis'

lists to refer to their BP mother who was not-a-mother in the true

sense of the word.

NPD: Narcissistic Personality Disorder.

NonBP: Person who is affected by someone else's BPD -- eg, you and

your family.

OCD: Obsessive Compulsive Disorder.

Oz: the " Twilight Zone " feeling of not knowing what is real because of

the BP's distortions.

PAS: Parental Alienation Syndrome: When a parent deliberately and

repeatedly makes the other parent the " bad guy " and the child believes

the accusations (such as " Daddy doesn't love you. " ) A form of child

abuse.

Projection: When a person denies certain feelings by attributing them

to someone else.

PUVAS and DEAR: Communication techniques you can download at the

www.BPDCentral.com library. DEAR is about setting personal limits and

PUVAS is about ONE of the communication techniques you can use to

communicate with BPs. Other techniques in SWOE are defusing and

walking away.

Rationalization: Good-sounding reasons but not necessarily truthful.

ROFL: Rolling on the floor laughing.

SKids: Step kids.

SO: Significant Other.

Splitting: Black and white thinking, practiced by both Nons and BPs.

Sponging: Absorbing the BP's projections and bad feelings. (See

" mirroring " )

STB-ex: Soon-to-be ex [husband, wife, or SO]

SWOE: The book " Stop Walking on Eggshells. "

SWOEW: The workbook to SWOE.

Trigger: not a horse, but something that takes a person back to an

earlier trauma. They respond to the current situation and also relive

the past one. For example, a BP's criticism about your clothes

triggers you because your father did the same thing.

UBM: Book titled " Understanding The Borderline Mother " .

>>

[Guest guest]

Thanks Malene,

Some days I think I could almost try it, but then just as quickly I

remember nada's shrinks and discount it. It's like I need therapy to

get a therapist (lol). Maybe if I could find one who specialized in

BPD, or even a group therapy setting. I dunno.

> In a message dated 3/10/03 10:35:43 AM Pacific Standard Time,

> sherby2k@y... writes:

>

> Hey ,

>

> I just wanted to tell you that I was once in a long term

relationship with

> someone whom i had hired to help me, but who ended up abusing me

terribly. It

> was horrifically difficult to hire a therapist after that

experience, but I

> found someone very patient, and kind, who was able to help me

through that

> fear.

>

> It has been a good experience to get some real help.

>

> warm regards

> Malene

>

>

> > and as I doubt I'll ever go to a therapist (my BPD

> > mom used therapists - she'd find one, convince him/her that she

was a

> > victim of an abusive family, and then troop us all in to be

> > confronted by him/her. While cerebrally I know that therapists

can be

> > useful, at a deeper level I don't think I can ever go to one),

this

> > list is pretty much my only support group. I'm glad I found it.

> >

> >

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Malene,

I know all about the suicide threats. Lived with them all my life. Was FOGged

(Fear, Obligation, and Guilt) in by them forever. But I'm learning. She can

still get to me though. She called with her waify voice and I stayed on the

phone for an hour out of guilt.

Welcome, I hope you can get out of this place what I have. Validation and a

sense of sanity.

New Member

Hey List,

Well, mostly I guess I will sit back and listen for a while. My mom

has borderline personality disorder, and right now, well the games

are overwhelming. I am hurt and angry as living hell. I havent heard

from her since we had a big fight on the phone where I held her

responsible for a whole bunch of lies she had told me.

Anyways, it is all quite hurtful these days, and I just dont know

what to do no more. I know if I cut contact with her then the suicide

threats etc, etc will go totally bananas. So far I have satisfied

myself with the very far physical distance there is between us, and

just handled her for visits and phone calls. But by now I am frankly

also so angry that I am about to the place where I dont care about

her suicide threats and bad health any more. She has done it to

herself with the last 20 years of heavy drinking.

Ahh well.. I will sit back and listen for a while. Maybe some other

folks here no the list have found ways of dealing that I have yet to

see.

Thanks,

Malene

[Guest guest]

sherby2k wrote:

> Thanks for that glossary, Edith, very helpful - I think you forgot

> one, though:

>

> Jaw-Dropping Revelation: " You mean there's a NAME for that???? "

Ah yes, the " lightbulb effect " . I think that one is in Randi's SWOE.

> My own personal Jaw-Dropping Revelations:

>

> BPD

> Distortion Campaign

> PAS (Parental Alienation Syndrome)

> Projection

> Splitting

You're getting there. We know a lot more now compared to when I had my

light-bulb experience seven years ago. BPD first appeared in the DSM in

1980, Kreisman's I Hate You - Don't Leave Me was published in 1989, and

then SWOE was published in 1998. I studied psychology in the 60's and

there were no answers about personality disorders then. And there's

still lots to learn even now.

> I found out about BPD (wow, do they know my mom???) a week ago,

> joined this list two days after that, and pretty much ever since then

> I've been stunned at finding out that there are other people who have

> been through some of the same stuff as I have. I have both of those

> books on order, and as I doubt I'll ever go to a therapist (my BPD

> mom used therapists - she'd find one, convince him/her that she was a

> victim of an abusive family, and then troop us all in to be

> confronted by him/her. While cerebrally I know that therapists can be

> useful, at a deeper level I don't think I can ever go to one), this

> list is pretty much my only support group. I'm glad I found it.

And we're glad you're here. I never went to a therapist. I learned

something from every KO that ever posted to the Oasis lists over the

years. It is only now that therapists are getting the special training

that's necessary in order to help BPs and their family members. I'll

post some info about therapy/therapists later, in another post.

Speaking of SWOE, I'll post a part of Larry J Siever's Forward, from p

viii of SWOE, that kinda sums up some of the BPD stuff:

" ... when we see the adult BP, we see an individual who has learned a

variety of " techniques " to manage their own self-esteem and emotional

swings by trying to control the behaviors of those they depend on and

wanting to stay near them. They have difficulty seeing how their

controlling behaviors are destructive to their relationshps because they

know no other alternative. The crucial point that the authors emphasize

again and again, particularly in the later stages of the book, is the

need for the BP to take responsibility for their behavior and for the

non-BP to also take responsibility for their role in the relationship.

Whatever has transpired before for both parties, it is only by taking on

responsibility for these behaviors as an adult that the possibility of

true change can occur... "

Edith here.

We KOs were in an unchosen (rather than chosen) relationship with our

nada/fada so our problems in certain aspects are different and unique.

But, the words I want to point out that are significant in the above

paragraph, are the words control and controlling. In controlling their

KOs, nadas and fadas tended to over-control. And that's why I thought

the post the other day re Control Freaks was important. It, like SWOE

and UBM, bears reading and re-reading. The only book that was written

specifically for KOs so far is Ann Lawson's Understanding The

Borderline Mother (UBM, 2000). And the books on Boundaries, Toxic

Parents, Co-dependence, The Dance of Anger, & etc can all help. There's

a listing of books in the Reference section of SWOE and also on the BPD

Central website at:

http://www.bpdcentral.com/books/more_books.shtml

We KOs proceed one tiny step at a time along the healing path. Lots of

KOs are numbed out emotionally when they first join this list and part

of the healing process for them is to get in touch with their feelings.

- Edith

Moderator/Facilitator /

WelcomeToOz Family of NonBP Email Support Groups

..

[Guest guest]

Welcome Pat! My nickname is Melt and I am in my thirtieth year of

diagnoses. I do well most of the time and look forward to getting to

know you better.

Happy Holidays,

>

> Hi,

> I am new to your web site, though I've had Stills for over 20

> years now.