Help

September 14, 2004

I don't have any experience chelating children, but from what I've

seen even mercury poisoned adults would not fare well on such a

protocol. 250mg is quite a bit all at once, and the three times a

day dosing schedule leads to fluctuating blood levels which is not

desirable.

Most people here - and most adults who are chelating themselves -

choose to use smaller doses at more frequent intervals (every 3 or 4

hours) with a break of at least as many days off the meds as on.

I'd encourage you to spend some time browsing the messages in this

group, and especially the 'ANDY INDEX' at:

http://home.earthlink.net/~moriam/

> I am new to this group but am familiar with many of the

participants

> through other groups.

> I am in the middle of a predicatment.

> I have a 7 year old autie, non verbal, GFCF, Dr , Dr Cave.

>

> We are chelating. It is not going well. The first challenge (approx

> 5 weeks ago) brought crying, not eating. The first 3 days on (3

> times a day 250mg of DMSA brought severe constipation, screaming-

> writhing-crying for hours at a time, no eating. Last weekend, we

> did round two, some crying, some eating, some pooping. Dr Cave

says

> stay the course.

> We started a new school and Ry, the happiest kid on the planet, is

> crying every day. I love the school and really want it to work

out.

> I think the hysterical crying is related to the chelation.

> Any suggestions? Please. Anything before I have a nervous breakdown.

> He is also on Valtrex, Provigil, Everyday, Coromega, Co Enzyme B,

> Amino Acids, Zinc, B shots, Juice Plus, Clonodine for sleeping.

September 14, 2004

Sounds like gut bugs and more gut bugs. Has he ever been tested for

clostridia? We didn't have it until chelating began. Possibly yeast

too. Can he swallow pills? If so, try some garlic pills or uva ursi

(not sure of the dose). Otherwise, you can cut open garlic cloves

and rub it on the bottom of his feet.

You can have an organic acid test run from Dr. Cave to confirm the

bugs.

Libby

> > I am new to this group but am familiar with many of the

> participants

> > through other groups.

> > I am in the middle of a predicatment.

> > I have a 7 year old autie, non verbal, GFCF, Dr , Dr Cave.

> >

> > We are chelating. It is not going well. The first challenge

(approx

> > 5 weeks ago) brought crying, not eating. The first 3 days on (3

> > times a day 250mg of DMSA brought severe constipation, screaming-

> > writhing-crying for hours at a time, no eating. Last weekend, we

> > did round two, some crying, some eating, some pooping. Dr Cave

> says

> > stay the course.

> > We started a new school and Ry, the happiest kid on the planet,

is

> > crying every day. I love the school and really want it to work

> out.

> > I think the hysterical crying is related to the chelation.

> > Any suggestions? Please. Anything before I have a nervous

breakdown.

> > He is also on Valtrex, Provigil, Everyday, Coromega, Co Enzyme B,

> > Amino Acids, Zinc, B shots, Juice Plus, Clonodine for sleeping.

September 14, 2004

I'd suspect discomfort from constipation. I've seen this happen with several

kids when starting chelation. I wouldn't do another round until this bout of

constipation clears since you don't want the metals being backed up in his

colon and being reabsorbed. Liquid magnesium and aloe vera juice are great at

getting things moving. There are also homeopathic detox remedies for the colon

that could help.

Another thing to consider is that sometimes either low zinc or too much zinc

can lead to emotionality -- sudden increase in tantrumming, upsets, etc. Zinc

is one of the minerals you have to carefully balance.

Gaylen

September 15, 2004

> We are chelating. It is not going well. The first challenge (approx

> 5 weeks ago) brought crying, not eating. The first 3 days on (3

> times a day 250mg of DMSA brought severe constipation, screaming-

> writhing-crying for hours at a time, no eating. Last weekend, we

> did round two, some crying, some eating, some pooping. Dr Cave says

> stay the course.

I would severely drop the dose, and treat for yeast

http://www.danasview.net/yeast.htm

Dana

September 15, 2004

I do not see some essentials for chelation in your list such as

magnesium, vit E, vit C, milk thistle etc... The Kirkman's everyday

has some but it might not be sufficient.

And I agree with the others, the DMSA dose is extremely high...

> I think the hysterical crying is related to the chelation.

> Any suggestions? Please. Anything before I have a nervous breakdown.

> He is also on Valtrex, Provigil, Everyday, Coromega, Co Enzyme B,

> Amino Acids, Zinc, B shots, Juice Plus, Clonodine for sleeping.

September 17, 2004

> I am new to this group but am familiar with many of the participants

> through other groups.

> I am in the middle of a predicatment.

> I have a 7 year old autie, non verbal, GFCF, Dr , Dr Cave.

>

> We are chelating. It is not going well.

That's because you are doing it wrong.

4 hour administration at 1/2 mg per pound versus 8 hour administration

at higher levels makes all the difference in the world. There is a

poll in the group polls section on this subject.

> The first challenge (approx

> 5 weeks ago) brought crying, not eating. The first 3 days on (3

> times a day 250mg of DMSA

If you've ever talked to an adult who did this about how it felt you

would never dream of inflicting it on a child.

> brought severe constipation, screaming-

> writhing-crying for hours at a time, no eating. Last weekend, we

> did round two, some crying, some eating, some pooping. Dr Cave says

> stay the course.

She is wrong.

She tells many patients she will discharge them if they do the 4 hour

protocol, so they lie to her so as to continue receiving services, and

apparently she actually believes that the improvements she sees in the

kids doing the 4 hour protocol (whose parents don't tell her) are due

to the 8 hour protocol she prescribes.

Many physicians are quite naive about how the power imbalance in the

doctor-patient relationship influences communcations and can become

very confused about what is happening as a result.

> We started a new school and Ry, the happiest kid on the planet, is

> crying every day. I love the school and really want it to work out.

Well, then you had better start chelating properly.

> I think the hysterical crying is related to the chelation.

> Any suggestions?

Switch to the 4 hour protocol which is what works.

> Please. Anything before I have a nervous breakdown.

> He is also on Valtrex, Provigil, Everyday, Coromega, Co Enzyme B,

> Amino Acids, Zinc, B shots, Juice Plus, Clonodine for sleeping.

Some C 3 or 4 times a day will help.

Skip the B shots unless they are very clearly helping, the adverrse

reaction to that is angry agitated aggression, which is close enough to

what you are saying to make me wonder. It can take several months to

clear if you keep slamming in the B-12 while it is getting worse, too.

Andy . . . . . . .. . . . . .

September 17, 2004

Hi,

I'm sure you've probably done this and it might be simplying the problem

(sorry) but have you had his hearing checked? Might want to start there and

then, if all is OK, look into other problems. Just a thought.

Sherry

anatopper <anatopper@...> wrote:

Hello

My son just turned 3 and he started preschool. He has never been a good

listener. For

example if we tell him to sit because I'm going to put on his shoes he ignores

me. If the

teacher asks him to sit down in a circle he does not listen and he refuses and

goes about

doing his own thing. He is in a regular preschool and they are experiencing

problems with

this. I don't know whether we are not discplining enough or it has to do with

speech

delay/DSI. Does anyone else have this problem?

September 17, 2004

I have to 2nd the idea of checking into auditory processing issues. It

doesn't mean that there's anything wrong with his hearing, it means that

he hears things differently than you or I do. My son has verbal

dyspraxia, as well as auditory processing issues. We did a modified

version of FastForWORD with him this summer (it was just 1 hour/day, 4

days/week). I have to say that the difference over the summer was quite

wonderful. It's not fixed yet, but it's a HUGE improvement. We've

always had exactly the same problems - we can be right up next to him

yelling in his ear and get NO reaction. He was always just so focused

on whatever task he was working on at the time that he simply didn't

notice us at all. He has to focus that hard on one and exclude

everything else or everything becomes a big mush in his head.

It's hard to get a dx of auditory processing problems at 3 years old.

It's hard to even get an official dx for my son at 4.5. BUT it's worth

looking into.

Good luck.

Ruiz

www.YourBusyBee.com

Professional Design & Virtual Assistant Services

" Virtually Everywhere "

Discovery Toys Educational Consultant

http://www.ybbtoys.com

Founder / Artistic Director

Lyric Opera of Los Angeles

" Bringing Lost Operatic Gems Back to the Stage "

www.LyricOperaLA.org

323.262.0569

September 19, 2004

Does anybody know where I could find information on

sensory learning or listening therapy/ I want to try

this with my son.

Thanks, Cheryl

--- jmcl4hs <jmcl4hs@...> wrote:

> If he did have auditory processing the competing

> noises might be

> getting in the way of his " listening " and it might

> appear he isn't

> listening and then of course to the teachers he

> would appear as to

> not be listening and/or ignoring them and being

> defiant. Some of

> the suggestions given to children who have auditory

> processing are

> to make sure the child knows you are speaking to

> them, slow down

> one's talking to the child, give the child breaks,

> can't expect the

> child to last as long as other children with

> attention since they

> are working harder with the " noises " . Just wanted

> to add this in

> here to the post that mentioned maybe he could have

> auditory

> processing. That is a thought. He is very young to

> be tested but

> the listening programs would probably be something

> he could try.

> They start out with even a child listening for one

> minute and then

> adding to the time as the child progresses. We

> haven't started

> this, but am also thinking about doing one of the

> listening

> programs. There are a lot to choose from.

September 19, 2004

Hi Cheryl,

Below are some very recent archives on listening therapy you may

have missed (Or did you just want to hear Grape Jams again?! Sample

from the Vital Links " Grape Jams " CD

http://registration.vitallinks.net/MP3/AikenDrum.mp3 )

From: " kiddietalk " <kiddietalk@...

Date: Thu Mar 6, 2003 9:19 pm

Subject: Re: Listening Program

Hi !

There are a number of " listening therapies " out there -most based on

Tomatis -that all fall under the umbrella term for a type of

auditory treatment. We used a program called 'Therapeutic

Listening " from Vital Links with Tanner and loved it since it

appeared to help -and like the ProEFA was a pretty quick change and

fairly inexpensive. Here is an overview of some of the programs

from the company that had the program my son Tanner used -Vital

Links http://www.vitallinks.net/auditory.html

I believe you were kind of new to the group at the time and were at

the CHERAB meeting

http://www.cherab.org/news/meetings/eventsjune2001.html

when Dorinne S. , MA, CCC-A, FAAA behind the Center

http://www.thedaviscenter.com

presented their " listening program " I know that the Center is

one of the places for this type of therapy that my Co-Author

developmental pediatrician Dr. Marilyn Agin refers to. These types

of programs where you go to a clinic for the therapy sessions can be

a bit pricey (of course well worth it if they help) I have found

personally that there are other ways of doing the listening therapy

programs at home while working with professionals -which is what we

did with Tanner.

Many times OTs have provided auditory therapies such as this -I

believe it was mainly for those with some type of sensory

integration dysfunction DSI. Even though my son Tanner had DSI -it

was not for the DSI -and it was not an OT that recommended the

listening therapy for Tanner. Tanner's SLP when we lived in NJ -

Ortega CCC-SLP (who was highly recommended to me by Dr.

Agin when Tanner was first diagnosed with apraxia) was very

innovative in treating Tanner's apraxia with a " whole body "

approach -which is why Dr. Agin loves her so much. Too many SLPs

concentrate only on the mouth and facial area -some SLPs are more

aware that speech problems can relate to issues in other parts of

the body -and the brain responds to multiple stimuli. Many

educators are fully aware of the benefits of treating children with

LDs with a multi sensory approach

http://www.ldonline.org/ld_indepth/reading/mssl_methods.html

-not all SLPs are yet.

Tanner's therapist tried the therapeutic listening for

Tanner to help stop some dysfluency he developed when he started

talking based on the theory that it would help with the right-left

brain activity.

My experience makes me recommend auditory therapies as part of the

treatment for our children with multisensory communication

impairments. I believe a multi -sensory approach will be proven to

be most effective for our children down the road -I just don't

believe in waiting, and was thrilled to have an open minded SLP like

working with Tanner.

Anecdotally -Tanner would have trouble speaking clear and getting

his words out -and then within a minute of putting the headphones on

his words would come clear and smooth -not sure why but since it

appeared to help we used it. He had a waist band to wear so he

could wear his CD player around when playing, during therapy -etc.

The only activities we were told not to let him do while wearing the

headphones were watching TV or playing on the computer. Tanner

doesn't use the therapeutic listening program much anymore, however

his speech is also much better now, and he's older and is more aware

of " what's cool " (at 6 and a half can you believe it?!!)

I just want all of you to know you will probably not read the above

anywhere else since this is not what the program is intended for. It

was just a theory of 's -but it worked amazingly well for

Tanner! was trained by Vital Links so I was able to order

the special headphones which had the " right " and " left " ear marked -

and the " correct " CDs for Tanner from Vital Links

http://www.vitalsounds.com/ You can not order from this company

without the training code of the professional that took the course.

Supposedly using the wrong CDs can be harmful somehow. (any OTs

want to explain the danger of listening to the wrong CDs?)

Here are some cut and pastes from the various websites out there

from a quick search at google. No bad reflection on the many that I

left out -like I said there are tons of them -just do a quick search

at http://www.google.com and you'll see!

" The Listening Program is comprised of psychoacoustically refined

soundtracks. Specially selected, re-arranged, re-recorded classical

music (featuring Mozart) and nature sounds have been processed in

post-production with sophisticated sonic technologies. The Listening

Program respectfully builds on the theories and clinical research of

Dr. Alfred Tomatis, and other sound pioneers. Developed by an

interdisciplinary team of educational, therapeutic, medical, music

and sound professionals, The Listening Program helps to train the

ear and brain to perceive a full spectrum of sound without

distortion... "

http://www.advancedbrain.com/tlp_intro.html

" The therapeutic use of music to stimulate brain processing has long

been scientifically supported. Since Dr. Alfred Tomatis pioneered

the therapeutic application of sounds to treat specific symptoms and

behaviors, there has been a veritable explosion in the types of

auditory interventions available, most of which are based on Dr.

Tomatis' early work.

We have therapists trained in Samonas Sound Therapy, Integrated

Listening Programs, and Listening Fitness Programs and can assist

parents in making an informed decision about which program best

meets the needs of their child. Listening programs are offered as

stand alone programs in conjunction with regular Sensory integration

sessions here at the clinic... "

http://music.nt4kids.com/ <http://music.nt4kids.com/>

" Therapeutic Listening uses sound stimulation in combination with

sensory integrative techniques. Strategies that are emphasized

include vestibular, postural and movement strategies. This treatment

technique involves listening to specifically modulated and filtered

music on compact discs through headphones... "

http://www.childrenstherapycorner.com/article/article1.html

" This program is not a miracle cure. It is a tool used by

specifically trained Occupational or Physical Therapist, that when

combined with other therapy treatment approaches, can have a

significant impact on the client's functional abilities... "

http://www.helpingyourchild.com/therapeuticlistening.html

Stuttering after apraxics start speaking as well as some info on

therapeutic listening.

/message/7318

Listening Therapeutic Programs

/message/6066

Goals for Stuttering/Dysfluency and apraxia

/message/19701

article by Sheila Frick, OTR, founder of both Vital

Links and Therapeutic Resources which I believe comprehensively

explains the various types of listening therapies

An Overview of Auditory Interventions

Tue 3-20-2001

Sheila M. Frick OTR/L

The therapeutic use of music has a long history. Since the mid-

1900's when Alfred Tomatis began his work with the application of

sound to treat specific symptoms and behaviors, there has been a

veritable explosion in the types of auditory interventions

available. As the effectiveness of sound as a treatment modality

continues to achieve credibility, the rapid growth of this field of

therapy will likely gain even more momentum. While the growth of

auditory tools is both promising and exciting, it can be challenging

for the therapist and parent to choose the most potentially

effective therapeutic strategy for a specific child.

The following provides an overview of auditory intervention methods

in common practice in the United States. There are several

distinctions between Sound therapy programs. Some programs are

clinic-based, some home based, some Provide only passive input

unless used in conjunction with other forms of therapy, other

programs inherently contain an active component. Interventions

usually require a training or certification for practitioners beyond

their already established professional background. Parents should be

careful to note a practitioner's professional background and

advanced training.

The Tomatis Method

Alfred Tomatis, MID, a French Ear, Nose and Throat specialist, was

the first practitioner to develop an approach for treating listening

difficulties. Tomatis originally defined the role of the ear as

the 'integrator' because the ear was significant in structuring

organization at all levels of the nervous system. He recognized the

close relationship between the auditory and vestbular systems and

the importance of both as integrators of the nervous system. He

connected listening to the development of receptive and expressive

language, learning, motor control and motivation. Through his

clinical work with opera singers and factory workers, Tomatis

recognized that the voice can only produce what the ear can hear, a

principle now known as the " Tomatis effect " . His study of the ear

led to the conviction that, beyond hearing, the auditory system and

vestibular system work together to detect and analyze movement. He

described the function of the vestibular portion as picking up and

discriminating the larger movements of the body, which we can see

and feel. Similarly, the auditory system registers and regulates the

finer movements of sound waves, which pass through the air and are

funneled into the ear.

In the 1950's Tomatis developed a listening technique to 're-educate

the ear' based upon the following four principles:

Motivational and emotional needs begin with listening.

Listening plays a fundamental role in language.

Through it's close connection with the vestibular system, the

auditory system relates self to self, to others, and to the universe

The brain needs sound energy to enable the thinking process and

integration

Tomatis developed the first auditory training or listening training

device, the electronic ear. This device uses progressively filtered

sound, specifically those sounds rich in high frequencies (i.e.

classical music, the mother's voice, Gregorian chants) to effect

change. Tomatis was the first to recognize the importance of high

frequency audition. He spoke of high frequency sound as charging the

brain. The Tomatis method of auditory training is a chnic-based

program, requiring the use of specialized equipment and the

expertise of a practitioner trained in the Tomatis approach.

Auditory Integration: Berard Method

Most of the clinically based auditory training techniques are based

on the early work of Tomatis, including that of Guy Berard, MID, a

French medical doctor who studied and worked with Tomatis.

Berard felt that the original protocol of Tomatis was too lengthy

and developed a different method of filtering sound. This technique,

which uses filtered popular music in which sound frequencies are

electronically modulated at random intervals for random periods of

time, is called Auditory Integration Training (AIT). Berard believes

that hypersensitive hearing causes auditory processing problems.

Berard and his technique gained worldwide recognition in 1990 with

the publication of bel Stehli's biographical account of her

daughter Georgie. The Sound of a Miracle describes how Georgie,

diagnosed with severe autism, greatly benefited from a course of 20

AIT treatments with Berard. AIT is a clinic based program;

implementation relies upon the use of the Audiokinetron, a device

developed by Berard for filtering music and upon a practitioner with

specialized training.

Both the Tomatis and Berard programs are delivered by specific

machines using earphones. With the advent of new technology, similar

altered music has become available on compact disc. The discs do not

replace either the Tomatis Method or the Berard Method. The compact

discs do provide a less intense way to access both the auditory and

vestibular systems to impact neural function and integration and are

easily available to clinicians in a variety of practice arenas.

(www.autism.org/ait2.html).

The Samonas Method

The SAMONAS method is another listening approach, which has combined

some of the ideas of Tomatis with advances in both technology and

physics. Ingo Steinbach, a German sound engineer with a broad

background in music, physics, and electronics developed this method.

All of the recordings used in Steinbach's work are based on the

SONAS (System of Optimal Natural Structure) principle, which make it

possible to maintain the valuable elements and Structure of natural

sounds throughout the entire process of recording, processing and

reproduction. The choice of music is based on the principles of

music therapy. Most selections are classical music and some include

nature sounds.

Steinbach wanted his recordings to be as realistic and as spatially

expansive as the sounds one hears in the concert hall. He realized

that sound reflects the space in which it is recorded, and that

choosing the space for recording was a critical factor in the

quality of the recording. He also paid particular attention to the

music used and the instrumentation. He uses only natural

instruments, which produce tones rich in harmonics. Additionally,

Steinbach believes that sound carries intention and that the

musician's state of mind is reflected in his/her work. For this

reason, he only records when he feels that the musicians are playing

with a sense of joy. Steinbach also developed a special device

called the envelope shape modulator which enhances the upper

frequency range of the music, thereby 'spectrally activating' the

recordings, The higher frequencies provide information about

directional distances of sounds as well as other detailed

information about the sound source. In addition to the spectral

activation, there are also brief passages on the CDs with intensive

filtering so that almost nothing but the overtones are heard.

Listening to these 'high extension' passages theoretically trains

the ear to pay attention to the upper ranges in the sound spectrum.

The higher tones are the parts of the sound spectrum that captivate

attention and hold interest. These recordings are identified as

SAMONAS, which stands for Spectrally Activated Music of Optimal

Natural Structure.

Steinbach creates several different levels of compact disc with

varying intensities of spectral activation and filtering. The less

intense compact discs are available to therapists with an

understanding of the implication of filtered sound. These lower

level CDs can be incorporated into entry-level practices in the use

of modulated sound such as Therapeutic Listening™ (see below).

The more intense compact discs require a longer more intensive

training period which provides the therapist with more advanced

information regarding sound and training in more sophisticated

pieces of equipment used in SAMONAS Sound Therapy. To use the

title " trained in Samonas " a therapist must complete a five day

training course; a year of practical experience and then present

documented case studies for peer review. Those who are looking for a

therapist with appropriate qualifications may use the therapist

database that will be available Beginning February 2000 on the web

at: www.Samonas.com

Therapeutic Listening™

Therapeutic Listening™ is a term used to describe combined use of a

number of electronically altered compact discs in a prescribed

manner, but with equipment that can be used in many environments.

Sheila Frick, OTR designed this program. Therapeutic Listening TM

implies that the listening programs are individualized to each

client and are suited for application in home and school settings.

Maximum effectiveness in treatment outcomes is promoted by daily

use. The use Of Modulated and filtered music in conjunction with

sensory integrative Occupational therapy techniques seems to

increase the effectiveness of both treatment modalities. There is

commonly a decrease in the time necessary to meet treatment goals in

the areas of: modulation, balance and movement perception; an

increase in exploration of the environment, sense of physical

competence, and drive to challenge one's practice and sequencing

abilities; and improved social competence and language abilities.

Therapeutic Listening ™ programs can be carried out at home, school

or in the clinic with ongoing support from a therapist who is

trained in their application. A typical program may be in place for

two to six months for initial gains; however, many individuals

continue past this time frame or find several of the compact discs

useful as part of an ongoing sensory diet. Currently, EASe,

and 'entry level SAMONAS' CDs fall under this use. With the rapid

growth of sound therapy, it is likely that other products will also

be included in the future.

Listening Fitness

Another home listening program, the Listening Fitness program, is

just being introduced in the United States and Canada. This program

provides listening training using sound stimulation. It is designed

by Madaule who worked closely with Dr. Tomatis and has used the

Tomatis method for over 30 years. While the Listening Fitness

program shares some similarities with the Tomatis Method, it differs

substantially in assessment procedures, audio equipment, and focus

and is not regarded as being equivalent. It can be a useful part of

a home treatment regimen where the goal is to help an individual to

develop and improve both receptive and expressive listening. Like

the other listening techniques, Listening Fitness includes a passive

phase of intervention. Unlike the other auditory based home

programs, Listening Fitness provides an active component or

the 'expressive phase'. This is where one gains control over voice

and body through voice exercises (humming, singing, reading in a

microphone). The total program lasts about 10 weeks With usually 1

hour of listening a day and a short interruption between the 2

phases. Close monitoring and coaching are provided throughout the

program.

Listening Fitness Instructors are carefully screened and trained,

and are supervised for I year by a highly qualified training team of

consultants from the Listening Centre in Toronto. Founded over 20

years ago by director Madaule, the author Of When Listening

Comes Alive, the Listening Centre is a leader in the field of

listening. Currently the Listening Fitness program is being used

with children with listening and learning difficulties. At this

point in time it is not being used with individuals with a medical

or neurological diagnosis Such as Autism ADD, or other neurological

disorders.

" A clinician trained I in Several different forms of auditory

intervention I on might reflect less specific bias in

methodology. . . "

Interactive Metronome

Recent clinical studies are indicating that another auditory based

intervention which is quite different from all of the above

listening techniques may also be effective with individuals who

experience difficulties with motor planning and sequencing.

Interactive Metronome is based on the premis that neural timing

difficulties underlie difficulties with learning, cognitive and

social skill and interfere with praxis. Occupational therapists have

understood that motor planning and sequencing are key facets in the

development Of functional skills. They have traditionally addressed

these difficulties with sensory integrative techniques.

A new PC-based interactive version of the traditional music

metronome is now being introduced as a viable tool for individuals

with a broad variety of challenges. From existing studies and

clinical reports, the most promising areas Of use include treatment

for persons with difficulties in motor planning and sequencing,

rhythmicity and timing, primary motor control, language and speech,

learning and cognition and social development and communication.

Stanley 1. Greenspan, MD, a psychiatrist and clinical professor of

psychiatry at the Washington University Medical School, is

(lie Director of Research for the Scientific Advisory Board of the

Interactive Metronome. He states that " the ability to plan and

sequence action emerges early in the first year of life. It is

essential for adaptive motor delopment and language development. " He

goes on to state that " it is essential for complex social behavior

involving a number of sequential steps, such as sharing toys,

complex greeting patterns, or simply playing with others. " In a

letter to parents of children with special needs. Greenspan states

that " the soon to be published research using this tool strongly

indicates new hope that the new method may enable children to

improve underly processing abilities for motor planning and

sequencing, strengthening their most fundamental learning

capabilities. "

A program utilizing the Interactive Metronome entails 15 hours of

treatment. The typical training schedule is 3 times a week. In the

Studies, treatment protocols of less than 3 times a week were not

known to be as effective. More detailed review of current research

can be found at the site: www.interactivemetronome.com

Summary

Given the volume of information available on auditory interventions

a parent has a formidable task in selecting the clinician and type

of program most suitable for a child's specific needs. Each of the

forms of auditory intervention available has something to offer and

each has points of applicability. A clinician trained in several

different forms of auditory intervention might reflect less specific

bias in methodology and be helpful in guiding the parents through

the method of training or the proper sequencing of treatments that

will be most beneficial.

For more detailed information on Therapeutic Listening TM Auditory

Integration Training, Samonas Listening Fitness and Interactive

Metronome, contact Vital Links at 608-270-5424. See pg. 18 for

course dates.

Sensory Integration Quarterly Spring/Summer 2000 Published by

sensory Integration International

References

Frick, S. (2000) Listening with the Whole body. Madison, Wl. Vital

Sounds, Inc. (In Press)

Madaule, P. (1994) when listening comes alive. Norval, Ontario

Canada. Moulin Publishing.

Steinbach, 1. (1997). SAMONAS sound Therapy. Fakenham, England. The

Whole Idea.

Tomatis, A. (1 996) The ear and lan- guage. Norval, Ontario, Canada.

Moulin Publishing.

http://www.vitallinks.net/parentinfo.shtml

=====

September 29, 2004

This is exactly the kind of situation your health plan doctor is good

with.

Andy . . . . . . .

> The school just called and said my son was just sting by a bee on the eye lid?

He or I have never been stung before. What do I do? What pain medicine should

I give him??? Please let me know ASAP because he is on his way home from school

now.....TIA. Carla

>

September 29, 2004

Unfortunately I'm a little late here, but for future use, meat tenderizer is

an antivenom for bee stings. Aslo, never pull the stinger out, scrape it out

with a credit card, or fingernail if long enough. If you don't have meat

tenderizer....it's papaya enzyme, so if you have some enzymes with papaya,

there ya go.

Now, ice it.

[ ] help

>

> The school just called and said my son was just sting by a bee on the eye

> lid? He or I have never been stung before. What do I do? What pain

> medicine should I give him??? Please let me know ASAP because he is on his

> way home from school now.....TIA. Carla

>

October 14, 2004

Hi and welcome back to the group!! I am not in your area but hopefully

someone in your area will chime in. How is Jassica doing?

Angie and Jenna

Help

>

> Hi, My name is Yi-Fan. I joined this group two years ago with my

> daughter . She had the Star helmet and graudated. I told

> myself that I will not let that happen again. Since I had my second

> daughter Olivia, I was very careful of repositoning and tummy time.

> But unfortunally, she still needs the helmet. God help me We

> have just moved to a new place. I am looking for anyone who had the

> helmet done in the Fort /Loveland, CO area. Anyone who can

> suggest a good Orth.

>

> Thank you

>

> yifan

>

> For more plagio info

October 14, 2004

Hi Yifan,

Welcome back to the group. I looked in our helmet database and this

is what I found for Ohio.

I hope you find it helpful.

Ohio

Danmar Cranial Helmet*

Orthotic & Prosthetic Specialties, Inc.,

20650 Lakeland Blvd.;

Euclid, OH 44119

Tom Heckman

(216) 531-2773, (216) 531-5376

http://www.danmarproducts.com

Passive helmet

--------------------------------------

Starband*, Starlight*, Clarren*

Cole Orthotic and Prosthetic Center (Starscanner Facility),

723 Ave. Bldg F;

Toledo, OH 43612

Dan Cole

(419) 476-4248, coleopc@...

http://www.coleopc.com

http://www.orthomerica.com

Starband and Starlight - Active;

Clarren - Passive

---------------------------------------------------------

DOCband*

Straight Ahead Pediatric Physical Therapy, LLC,

Hillcrest Medical Bldg,

781 Beta Dr. Suite C;

Mayfield Village (Cleveland), OH 44143

Lepp, Karmel-Ross

(440) 460-0923, (440) 460-1767

http://www.cranialtech.com

Our group members that have used this place:

dmsnoopy@...

amybland42@...

littleheiny@...

Active

>

> Hi, My name is Yi-Fan. I joined this group two years ago with my

> daughter . She had the Star helmet and graudated. I told

> myself that I will not let that happen again. Since I had my

second

> daughter Olivia, I was very careful of repositoning and tummy

time.

> But unfortunally, she still needs the helmet. God help me We

> have just moved to a new place. I am looking for anyone who had

the

> helmet done in the Fort /Loveland, CO area. Anyone who can

> suggest a good Orth.

>

> Thank you

>

> yifan

October 15, 2004

I'm so sorry to hear that you have to go thru this again. Luckily

you were aware of it and know that it is easily and quickly corrected.

There are 2 facilities located in Colorado, please see our DATABASE.

I'm not sure exactly where you are in Colorado so perhaps check some

adjoining states as well. Good luck and please let us know if you

have any other questions. We are here to get you thru this again. :-)

Sue

Colin F., 1

STARband grad

>

> Hi, My name is Yi-Fan. I joined this group two years ago with my

> daughter . She had the Star helmet and graudated. I told

> myself that I will not let that happen again. Since I had my

second

> daughter Olivia, I was very careful of repositoning and tummy

time.

> But unfortunally, she still needs the helmet. God help me We

> have just moved to a new place. I am looking for anyone who had

the

> helmet done in the Fort /Loveland, CO area. Anyone who can

> suggest a good Orth.

>

> Thank you

>

> yifan

October 15, 2004

Yifan,

Ignore my last post to you. It was late and I was tired. I thought I

read OH in your post not CO. Sorry!

>

> I'm so sorry to hear that you have to go thru this again. Luckily

> you were aware of it and know that it is easily and quickly

corrected.

>

> There are 2 facilities located in Colorado, please see our

DATABASE.

> I'm not sure exactly where you are in Colorado so perhaps check

some

> adjoining states as well. Good luck and please let us know if you

> have any other questions. We are here to get you thru this again. :-

)

>

> Sue

> Colin F., 1

> STARband grad

>

> --- In Plagiocephaly , " yifan_fu " <yifanfu@h...>

wrote:

> >

> > Hi, My name is Yi-Fan. I joined this group two years ago with my

> > daughter . She had the Star helmet and graudated. I told

> > myself that I will not let that happen again. Since I had my

> second

> > daughter Olivia, I was very careful of repositoning and tummy

> time.

> > But unfortunally, she still needs the helmet. God help me We

> > have just moved to a new place. I am looking for anyone who had

> the

> > helmet done in the Fort /Loveland, CO area. Anyone who

can

> > suggest a good Orth.

> >

> > Thank you

> >

> > yifan

October 15, 2004

Yifan,

Welcome back to the group. You're not the first one. I'm beginning to think some kids are predispositioned to plagio. Maybe they have softer heads??? Sorry I can't help you with CO but I'll be here when you need to vent

mom to na

DOC Grad 2/04

Tort Resolved

SCyifan_fu <yifanfu@...> wrote:

Hi, My name is Yi-Fan. I joined this group two years ago with my daughter . She had the Star helmet and graudated. I told myself that I will not let that happen again. Since I had my second daughter Olivia, I was very careful of repositoning and tummy time. But unfortunally, she still needs the helmet. God help me We have just moved to a new place. I am looking for anyone who had the helmet done in the Fort /Loveland, CO area. Anyone who can suggest a good Orth.Thank youyifanFor more plagio info

December 7, 2004

Don't use ALA if he has any mercury amalgam dental fillings. Also, look at the

supplement ingredient lists to see what they use as fillers. He may be reacting

to the fillers.

S

<tt>

Hi, once again my son is bonkers after adding cystiene and ala to his

supplement routine. It's most likely not gut bugs as this behavior has

happened

before with adding cystiene, glutahione or nac to his diet (and checked for

bugs).

Behaviors go away with the cessation of supplements. Since his tests

indicate these supplements are needed, I was wondering if I'm missing a

precursor

supplement which would aid in his body utilizing the gsh or cystiene/nac. I

kinda remember something from the Washington DAN about mb-12 being needed

for glutathione production (or something to that effect, have to find my

notes).

Does anyone know ?

Thanks

December 7, 2004

Make sure you gave him cofactors that support the cystiene.

Also you could try giving him the NAC at night only for awhile

to see if he is good on it. This worked for me. After taking NAC for

about 3 months at night I can take it in the daytime.

I don't understand why.

Liz D.

> [Original Message]

> From: <Lake260@...>

> <abmd >; <chelatingkids2 >;

< >

> Date: 12/7/2004 1:25:42 PM

> Subject: [ ] help

>

> Hi, once again my son is bonkers after adding cystiene and ala to his

> supplement routine. It's most likely not gut bugs as this behavior has

happened

> before with adding cystiene, glutahione or nac to his diet (and checked

for

> bugs).

> Behaviors go away with the cessation of supplements. Since his tests

> indicate these supplements are needed, I was wondering if I'm missing a

precursor

> supplement which would aid in his body utilizing the gsh or

cystiene/nac. I

> kinda remember something from the Washington DAN about mb-12 being

needed

> for glutathione production (or something to that effect, have to find my

notes).

> Does anyone know ?

> Thanks

December 7, 2004

When you say that you've added ALA to his supplement routine do you really mean

(a) that you have begun to use ALA on a safe chelation protocol or ( that you

have added ALA along with the usual supplements?

If the answer is " b " you should discontinue using ALA as a supplement.

[ ] help

Hi, once again my son is bonkers after adding cystiene and ala to his

supplement routine. It's most likely not gut bugs as this behavior has

happened

before with adding cystiene, glutahione or nac to his diet (and checked for

bugs).

Behaviors go away with the cessation of supplements. Since his tests

indicate these supplements are needed, I was wondering if I'm missing a

precursor

supplement which would aid in his body utilizing the gsh or cystiene/nac. I

kinda remember something from the Washington DAN about mb-12 being needed

for glutathione production (or something to that effect, have to find my

notes).

Does anyone know ?

Thanks

February 16, 2005

well there are two camps in the theory of Bacterial causes of Auto Immune

Diseases....... The Lumper and the Splitter..... The lumpers tend to treat

all causes with minocin type of drugs whereas the splitter wants to treat

each potential causative agent with a specific type of ATB. Flagyl is in the

splitter series and most of the tiem will make one puke their toenails up.

I found this site and group back in 98 via the net search.... the splitter

group seems to come from a group called AFTA..... Arthritis foundation trust

of America

mike

rheumatic Help

>

> Hi all.

>

> I've been trying to get a prescription for Metronidazole for my joint

> pains now for a couple months. I've been to two gp's and two

> rheumatologists. I have had a battery of blood tests done which show no

> abnormalities, xrays which also are normal, and a total body bone scan

> which is normal as well. I have no diagnosis and no answers, but I do have

> daily pain in my joints and redness on my skin for the past 7 to 8 months

> now with no improvement and it's actually spread to include more joints.

>

> I understand most of you are probably on Minocin but I've come across

> information on Metronidazole which suggests to me a logical first course

> before trying Minocin because it's far shorter term therapy and I'll know

> sooner if it works or not. Anyway can anyone send me a list of doctors in

> my area that have experience with anitbiotics for joint pains. I'm close

> to Toronto, Ontario, Canada.

>

> Does anyone else here have normal blood tests and x-rays etc but still

> experience pain? Having no lab tests confirming how I feel is making

> things extra difficult for me to get any type of medication. All I've been

> offered is tylenol and anti inflammatories. What should I do? I'm giving

> serious consideration to ordering my meds overseas where I won't need a

> prescription but I'd prefer not to do that if possible. Any suggestions?

>

June 1, 2005

,

I think reading " the Late Talker " by Marilyn Agin will

give you great insight to getting the help you need.

It is recommended that aside from the public school

testing your child that you obtain reports from your

own medical professionals. " You may want to find a

developmental pediatrician and/or child neurologist

who recognizes and understands the nature of the

various communication disorders and neurological soft

signs that may accompany them. Have the doctor write

a repot recommendign the TYPE and Frequency of therapy

required for your child. THIS IS THE MOST POWERFUL

AMMUNITION THAT YOU CAN MUSTER, ESPECIALLY IF YOUR

CHILD HAS A NEUROLOGICAL DISRODER AND NOT A DELAY. "

Combined with your other reports from the SLP's that

are diagnosing Apraxia, this can be hard to ignore

from the district.

ALSO, not all speech therapists are experienced enough

to treat children with apraxia. IF YOU CHILD NEEDS

SOMEONE WITH PARTICULAR EXPERTISE, YOU HAVE THE RIGHT

TO INSIST THAT THE SCHOOL BRING A SPECIALIST IN TO

WORK AND TRAIN THE SCHOOL'S SLP, AT THE SCHOOL'S

EXPENSE.

Children with more serious speech disorders, such as

apraxia do not improve with group therapy since they

require intense 1:1 therapy sessions.

What is a VE specialist? What is his or her

qualifications? Your son needs a certified

speech-language pathologist to address his apraxia.

One who is experienced in PROMPT therapy, oral-motor

therapy, etc. Otherwise, traditional therapy is a

waste of time. They must provide you with an

experience SLP for his Apraxia. MUST MUST MUST. You

may even need a special education lawyer to bring with

you to the meeting. Extra support is important. When

is your next meeting?

--- <MrsHuggies@...> wrote:

> My 3 yo son has been diagnosed with apraxia by two

> separate SLP's. He

> started receiving EI at 18 months. He was just

> beginning to make some

> progress when he turned 3 and over to the school

> system we went. They have

> two different programs available. One is called the

> SLI (severe language

> impaired) taught by an SLP 3 full days a week. The

> other is called the VE

> (varying exceptionalities) and is taught by a VE

> teacher. Even before they

> met my child it seemed as if they were pushing the

> VE class. I should

> mention that I am a teacher myself so am familiar

> with the system to some

> extent but I teach high school and it's quite

> different at that level. At

> any rate, they said they would need to do their own

> psychological testing on

> him and stupid me let dad take him off for that.

> They called me to say that

> he scored 2 points above mentally impaired (IQ of

> 71) and therefore he would

> not qualify for the SLI program because it would not

> meet all of his needs.

> They even scored him low on gross motor and this kid

> was pulling up cruising

> around furniture at 5 mo and walking at 9...climbs,

> jumps shoots baskets,

> etc. My husband said that there was nothing he was

> asked to do in the gross

> motor area that he couldn't do and all the questions

> asked of him were yes.

> So I know this score is low and therefore don't have

> a lot of trust in the

> whole thing. This was the second psych eval we had

> done...the first we paid

> out of pocket for (and are still paying for) to rule

> out autism...that one

> said he did not have autism but did have PDD-NOS...I

> have since read the

> criteria for PDD-NOS and do not beleive he has that

> at all. So every

> evaluation is saying something different. Well it

> turns out that the psych

> eval the school did had a large verbal component to

> it. We have the IEP

> meeting next week and I could really use some help.

> I have called everybody

> I can call and even had his pediatrician write a

> letter saying that in his

> opinion my child had a diagnosis of verbal apraxia

> and is otherwise

> cognitively developing normally. He also said

> specifically that he should be

> placed in the SLI program taught by an SLP and that

> placement in the VE

> could be detrimental to him long term. The school

> said that didn't matter

> because that wasn't his area of expertise. His ped

> is sending us to a

> developmental ped but again it will be out of pocket

> and I am scared to even

> go and get trodded through a bunch more non-valid

> tests...does anyone have

> experience with a developmental ped...is it worth

> the expense (they say 400

> just for the first visit and then will there be

> hours of testing?) I also

> have multiple copies of his SLP evaluations that say

> verbal apraxia is the

> problem, not cognitive impairment...his SLP even

> called them to tell them

> she did not think he was mentally impaired and she

> told me " they are not

> going to budge " . I have since learned that the most

> valid assessment tool

> is something called the Leiter-R...anyone know about

> that? I have called

> independent psychs and found out that there is not

> one in our county that

> gives that test. I was going to request it at our

> iep meeting but if nobody

> gives it, then what? Is there another cognitive

> assessment test that is

> specifically for non-verbal children? All I wanted

> was to have my son in a

> sing-songy structured language enriched program

> taught by an SLP to

> supplement the private speech therapy we are

> providing through our insurance

> and instead I have gotten more problems to add to my

> child. I just feel so

> strongly about where he needs to be placed. I

> truly am coming to the

> conclusion that the school system cannot help us and

> we are looking at

> outside programs to pay for privately. But

> nevertheless, there will come a

> time when we will have to utilize the school system.

> Anybody got any

> advice...had a similar battle? Thank you so much in

> advance for any

> suggestions you could give.

>

> - mom to Hunter

June 2, 2005

,

oh my God !! Your story sounds alot like mine, my son has an array of

diagnosis, but some of them are just plain wrong, so now Im sitting here

wondering,

when I think it has just been that his epilepsy was not diagnosed until this

january, which going undiagnosed for so long could have its own efffects,

and it is definitely a global apraxia on top of it. So I have been looking for

the same thing as you, I just requested my son be reevaluated at school with

a non-verbal assessment, they said they would use the WISC IV, but in my

research, I cant really tell if this is a nonverbal or not, Ive posted on here

but no one seemed to respond so I dont know what my next step will be. Im not

really sure if having him take the intelligence test again will be a mistake

or not? I dont think so but im not sure !! Anyway, I feel for you, and I can

definitely can see where you are coming from !!! Im in that same position

myself, I would love to share my whole sorted story but I gotta get the kids up

and out to school.

Michele

June 2, 2005

The WISC 4 is mostly verbal in my experience.

Lorraine

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