Statins linked to diabetes

January 24, 2012

You convinced me, Dr. Grim. I am decreasing metformin to 1500 mg a day and we will see. I am sure no doctors will approve that. Not even worth to ask them. they already told me, that DM and PA are two independent deceases. Natalia From: Clarence Grim <lowerbp2@...> hyperaldosteronism Sent: Monday, January 23, 2012 3:34 PM Subject: Re: Re: Statins linked to diabetes

Ah but they must not be aware of the recent reports of increased risk of heart attack and stroke when too strick control is pushed.I would be happy at her age with a value of <7.0The issue is what would it be if she DASHed and stopped metformin but that is for her and her Dr. to work out. Over 80 the goal is even higher. Say up to 8.Clarence E. Grim, BS, MS, MD

Specializing in Primary Aldosteronism, Difficult High Blood Pressure and recent evolutionary forces on high blood pressure in populations today.On Jan 23, 2012, at 02:33 PM, Natalia Kamneva <natalia_kamneva@...> wrote:

I agree. Natalia From: <jclark24p@...> hyperaldosteronism Sent: Monday, January 16, 2012 7:35 PM Subject: Re: Statins linked to diabetes

I am surprised with this recommendation. With HbA1C=6.4 and on 2000mg of Metformin my doctor would not consider DM cured! She looks for it to be between 6.0 and 6.5.

Natalia reported 3 readings last year so she has just recently got down to the high end of acceptable!

HEMOGLOBIN A1C 6.8% 6.4% 6.4%

REFERENCE RANGE 0.0-5.6 0.0-5.6 0.0-5.6

- 65 yo super ob., fastidious male - 12mm X 13mm rt. a.adnoma with previous rt. flank pain. Treating with DASH. Stats w/o meds = BP 175/90 HR 59 BS 125. D/C Spironolactone 12/20/2011 due to adverse SX.

Other Issues/Opportunities: OSA w Bi-Pap settings 13/19, DM2, Gynecomastia, MDD and PTSD.

Meds: Duloxetine hcl 80 MG, Metoprolol Tartrate 200 MG, 81mg aspirin and Metformin 2000MG. Started washing Spironolactone 12/20/11 to prepare for AVS.

> >

> >>

> >> >Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication

> >>

> >> Did you see any studies on that or it's just your experience and intuition, Max?

> >>

> >> I am very curious because I always suspected that the large dosage different HTN medications caused my diabetes. I like you started Metformin about 10 years being on HTN medications. No family history of diabetes, and I even didn't have marginally numbers. My experience with Metformin is different. Even if I take 2000 mg, my appetite is the same :-)

> >>

> >> Natalia

> >> From: StudyCircle <studycircle@...>

> >> hyperaldosteronism

> >> Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 6:08 PM

> >> Subject: RE: Re: Statins linked to diabetes

> >>

> >> Hi ,

> >>

> >> I am not sure about the details on this research but I suspect definition of diabetic these days is GLUCF>7.0 mmol/L = 126 mg/dL . Assuming that she starts statins now she perhaps get to 16 in some 5 years and 126 is not so bad because with some Metformin it can be overcome and another 5 years to level that she might need insulin...something like this...so it's good idea to see what level of diabetics disorder and in how many years one get to such level.

> >>

> >> Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication...of course my GLUCF was always marginally high but I was not taking Metformin...and I suspect Metformin reduced my appetite considerably because I am finding myself unable to finish a half plate of food that until last year I could easily finish ! not bad...

> >>

> >> So basically I assume becoming diabetic is gradual and not as bad as HTN if it is taken care medically, i.e., not allowing glaucoma or cataract ...etc.

> >>

> >> Max.

> >>

> >> |Thanks Max, a very timely message for my wife. Her Card just insisted she be

> >> |on statins and I asked her if he did a family HX. He didn't but if he had he

> >> |would have found her Dad died at 84, her Mom at 93 and her Grandmother at

> >> |97. She is the youngest of 8 and 7 are still living, one brother died of colon

> >> |cancer. Of course maybe he just wants to make sure she doesn't die from

> >> |heart attack, it'll be listed as complications due to DM! I printed it and

> >> |suggested she discuss it with him!

> >> |

> >> |....

> >> |

> >>

> >

>

January 24, 2012

I have the same determination :-) Sorry. Natalia From: Bingham <jlkbbk2003@...> hyperaldosteronism Sent: Monday, January 23, 2012 6:38 PM Subject: Re: Re: Statins linked to diabetes

Yeah but he determined there's no heaven so he's in now hurry to get anywhere.

From: Natalia Kamneva <natalia_kamneva@...>Subject: Re: Re: Statins linked to diabetes"hyperaldosteronism " <hyperaldosteronism >Date: Monday, January 23, 2012, 6:33 PM

Maybe I worry too much, it's true. But who knows how many years? Hawking was told he had a fewer than 15 and it was 50 years ago :-)

Natalia

From: StudyCircle <studycircle@...>hyperaldosteronism Sent: Tuesday, January 17, 2012 3:47 PMSubject: RE: Re: Statins linked to diabetes

You look too much worried about future. I only have 15 years to live and who cares if I need to add insulin to my daily dose or not. J

Max.

Oh, oh, oh! I was on all of them. I am still taking Micardis.

Can we expect that DM normalizes after awhile when we are off all BP medications or the process is irreversible? What do you think?

Many thanks,

Natalia

January 25, 2012

I even don't know what to do now :-) Natalia From: <jclark24p@...> hyperaldosteronism Sent: Tuesday, January 24, 2012 7:45 PM Subject: Re: Statins linked to diabetes

Natalia I again tried to find any indication of a HbA1C goal higher than 7.0, some use <7.0 and most use <6.5. I have also not seen anything talking about it being age dependent. I have searched Pubmed and the ADA site and find nothing so I again ask if anyone has info to substantiate it. With it being an average over approx. a 3month period my mathemit

> >> >

> >> >>

> >> >> >Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication

> >> >>

> >> >> Did you see any studies on that or it's just your experience and intuition, Max?

> >> >>

> >> >> I am very curious because I always suspected that the large dosage different HTN medications caused my diabetes. I like you started Metformin about 10 years being on HTN medications. No family history of diabetes, and I even didn't have marginally numbers. My experience with Metformin is different. Even if I take 2000 mg, my appetite is the same :-)

> >> >>

> >> >> Natalia

> >> >> From: StudyCircle <studycircle@>

> >> >> hyperaldosteronism

> >> >> Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 6:08 PM

> >> >> Subject: RE: Re: Statins linked to diabetes

> >> >>

> >> >> Hi ,

> >> >>

> >> >> I am not sure about the details on this research but I suspect definition of diabetic these days is GLUCF>7.0 mmol/L = 126 mg/dL . Assuming that she starts statins now she perhaps get to 16 in some 5 years and 126 is not so bad because with some Metformin it can be overcome and another 5 years to level that she might need insulin...something like this...so it's good idea to see what level of diabetics disorder and in how many years one get to such level.

> >> >>

> >> >> Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication...of course my GLUCF was always marginally high but I was not taking Metformin...and I suspect Metformin reduced my appetite considerably because I am finding myself unable to finish a half plate of food that until last year I could easily finish ! not bad...

> >> >>

> >> >> So basically I assume becoming diabetic is gradual and not as bad as HTN if it is taken care medically, i.e., not allowing glaucoma or cataract ...etc.

> >> >>

> >> >> Max.

> >> >>

> >> >> |Thanks Max, a very timely message for my wife. Her Card just insisted she be

> >> >> |on statins and I asked her if he did a family HX. He didn't but if he had he

> >> >> |would have found her Dad died at 84, her Mom at 93 and her Grandmother at

> >> >> |97. She is the youngest of 8 and 7 are still living, one brother died of colon

> >> >> |cancer. Of course maybe he just wants to make sure she doesn't die from

> >> >> |heart attack, it'll be listed as complications due to DM! I printed it and

> >> >> |suggested she discuss it with him!

> >> >> |

> >> >> |....

> >> >> |

> >> >>

> >> >

> >>

> >

>

January 25, 2012

I even don't know what to do now :-) Natalia From: <jclark24p@...> hyperaldosteronism Sent: Tuesday, January 24, 2012 7:45 PM Subject: Re: Statins linked to diabetes

Natalia I again tried to find any indication of a HbA1C goal higher than 7.0, some use <7.0 and most use <6.5. I have also not seen anything talking about it being age dependent. I have searched Pubmed and the ADA site and find nothing so I again ask if anyone has info to substantiate it. With it being an average over approx. a 3month period my mathemit

> >> >

> >> >>

> >> >> >Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication

> >> >>

> >> >> Did you see any studies on that or it's just your experience and intuition, Max?

> >> >>

> >> >> I am very curious because I always suspected that the large dosage different HTN medications caused my diabetes. I like you started Metformin about 10 years being on HTN medications. No family history of diabetes, and I even didn't have marginally numbers. My experience with Metformin is different. Even if I take 2000 mg, my appetite is the same :-)

> >> >>

> >> >> Natalia

> >> >> From: StudyCircle <studycircle@>

> >> >> hyperaldosteronism

> >> >> Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 6:08 PM

> >> >> Subject: RE: Re: Statins linked to diabetes

> >> >>

> >> >> Hi ,

> >> >>

> >> >> I am not sure about the details on this research but I suspect definition of diabetic these days is GLUCF>7.0 mmol/L = 126 mg/dL . Assuming that she starts statins now she perhaps get to 16 in some 5 years and 126 is not so bad because with some Metformin it can be overcome and another 5 years to level that she might need insulin...something like this...so it's good idea to see what level of diabetics disorder and in how many years one get to such level.

> >> >>

> >> >> Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication...of course my GLUCF was always marginally high but I was not taking Metformin...and I suspect Metformin reduced my appetite considerably because I am finding myself unable to finish a half plate of food that until last year I could easily finish ! not bad...

> >> >>

> >> >> So basically I assume becoming diabetic is gradual and not as bad as HTN if it is taken care medically, i.e., not allowing glaucoma or cataract ...etc.

> >> >>

> >> >> Max.

> >> >>

> >> >> |Thanks Max, a very timely message for my wife. Her Card just insisted she be

> >> >> |on statins and I asked her if he did a family HX. He didn't but if he had he

> >> >> |would have found her Dad died at 84, her Mom at 93 and her Grandmother at

> >> >> |97. She is the youngest of 8 and 7 are still living, one brother died of colon

> >> >> |cancer. Of course maybe he just wants to make sure she doesn't die from

> >> >> |heart attack, it'll be listed as complications due to DM! I printed it and

> >> >> |suggested she discuss it with him!

> >> >> |

> >> >> |....

> >> >> |

> >> >>

> >> >

> >>

> >

>

January 25, 2012

Natalia, that message got away from me and I didn't know I even sent it. The

point I was trying to make is HbA1C is an average over 3 months and as such it

is sometimes higher and sometimes lower. Adverse effects usually build over

time and I would prefer to be closer to the middle than riding at the top!

(This is not like many/most tests that are an indictor of what something is at

that point-in-time.)

Also, I would discuss this " trial of one " with my local doctors even if I knew

they wouldn't approve. This is their speciality and they follow it every day.

I don't pretend to be an expert but it is best to understand all sides of the

issue before you start self-medicating! (Then they will know what to write on

the chart when they are standing at the foot of your bed and suggesting they now

have to remove a body part!)

The doctors that follow me are real happy that mine runs 6.3 - 6.4 and I'm not

that much younger than you!

> > >> >

> > >> >>

> > >> >> >Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to start

Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication

> > >> >>

> > >> >> Did you see any studies on that or it's just your experience and

intuition, Max?

> > >> >>

> > >> >> I am very curious because I always suspected that the large dosage

different HTN medications caused my diabetes. I like you started Metformin about

10 years being on HTN medications. No family history of diabetes, and I even

didn't have marginally numbers. My experience with Metformin is different. Even

if I take 2000 mg, my appetite is the same :-)

> > >> >>

> > >> >> Natalia

> > >> >> From: StudyCircle <studycircle@>

> > >> >> hyperaldosteronism

> > >> >> Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 6:08 PM

> > >> >> Subject: RE: Re: Statins linked to diabetes

> > >> >>

> > >> >> Hi ,

> > >> >>

> > >> >> I am not sure about the details on this research but I suspect

definition of diabetic these days is GLUCF>7.0 mmol/L = 126 mg/dL . Assuming

that she starts statins now she perhaps get to 16 in some 5 years and 126 is not

so bad because with some Metformin it can be overcome and another 5 years to

level that she might need insulin...something like this...so it's good idea to

see what level of diabetics disorder and in how many years one get to such

level.

> > >> >>

> > >> >> Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to start

Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication...of course my GLUCF was always

marginally high but I was not taking Metformin...and I suspect Metformin

reduced my appetite considerably because I am finding myself unable to finish a

half plate of food that until last year I could easily finish ! not bad...

> > >> >>

> > >> >> So basically I assume becoming diabetic is gradual and not as bad as

HTN if it is taken care medically, i.e., not allowing glaucoma or cataract

....etc.

> > >> >>

> > >> >> Max.

> > >> >>

> > >> >> |Thanks Max, a very timely message for my wife. Her Card just insisted

she be

> > >> >> |on statins and I asked her if he did a family HX. He didn't but if he

had he

> > >> >> |would have found her Dad died at 84, her Mom at 93 and her

Grandmother at

> > >> >> |97. She is the youngest of 8 and 7 are still living, one brother died

of colon

> > >> >> |cancer. Of course maybe he just wants to make sure she doesn't die

from

> > >> >> |heart attack, it'll be listed as complications due to DM! I printed

it and

> > >> >> |suggested she discuss it with him!

> > >> >> |

> > >> >> |....

> > >> >> |

> > >> >>

> > >> >

> > >>

> > >

> >

>

January 25, 2012

Thank you . Coming back to 2000 :-) Natalia From: <jclark24p@...> hyperaldosteronism Sent: Wednesday, January 25, 2012 6:10 PM Subject: Re: Statins linked to diabetes

Natalia, that message got away from me and I didn't know I even sent it. The point I was trying to make is HbA1C is an average over 3 months and as such it is sometimes higher and sometimes lower. Adverse effects usually build over time and I would prefer to be closer to the middle than riding at the top! (This is not like many/most tests that are an indictor of what something is at that point-in-time.)

Also, I would discuss this "trial of one" with my local doctors even if I knew they wouldn't approve. This is their speciality and they follow it every day. I don't pretend to be an expert but it is best to understand all sides of the issue before you start self-medicating! (Then they will know what to write on the chart when they are standing at the foot of your bed and suggesting they now have to remove a body part!)

The doctors that follow me are real happy that mine runs 6.3 - 6.4 and I'm not that much younger than you!

> > >> >

> > >> >>

> > >> >> >Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication

> > >> >>

> > >> >> Did you see any studies on that or it's just your experience and intuition, Max?

> > >> >>

> > >> >> I am very curious because I always suspected that the large dosage different HTN medications caused my diabetes. I like you started Metformin about 10 years being on HTN medications. No family history of diabetes, and I even didn't have marginally numbers. My experience with Metformin is different. Even if I take 2000 mg, my appetite is the same :-)

> > >> >>

> > >> >> Natalia

> > >> >> From: StudyCircle <studycircle@>

> > >> >> hyperaldosteronism

> > >> >> Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 6:08 PM

> > >> >> Subject: RE: Re: Statins linked to diabetes

> > >> >>

> > >> >> Hi ,

> > >> >>

> > >> >> I am not sure about the details on this research but I suspect definition of diabetic these days is GLUCF>7.0 mmol/L = 126 mg/dL . Assuming that she starts statins now she perhaps get to 16 in some 5 years and 126 is not so bad because with some Metformin it can be overcome and another 5 years to level that she might need insulin...something like this...so it's good idea to see what level of diabetics disorder and in how many years one get to such level.

> > >> >>

> > >> >> Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication...of course my GLUCF was always marginally high but I was not taking Metformin...and I suspect Metformin reduced my appetite considerably because I am finding myself unable to finish a half plate of food that until last year I could easily finish ! not bad...

> > >> >>

> > >> >> So basically I assume becoming diabetic is gradual and not as bad as HTN if it is taken care medically, i.e., not allowing glaucoma or cataract ...etc.

> > >> >>

> > >> >> Max.

> > >> >>

> > >> >> |Thanks Max, a very timely message for my wife. Her Card just insisted she be

> > >> >> |on statins and I asked her if he did a family HX. He didn't but if he had he

> > >> >> |would have found her Dad died at 84, her Mom at 93 and her Grandmother at

> > >> >> |97. She is the youngest of 8 and 7 are still living, one brother died of colon

> > >> >> |cancer. Of course maybe he just wants to make sure she doesn't die from

> > >> >> |heart attack, it'll be listed as complications due to DM! I printed it and

> > >> >> |suggested she discuss it with him!

> > >> >> |

> > >> >> |....

> > >> >> |

> > >> >>

> > >> >

> > >>

> > >

> >

>

January 25, 2012

No in many Pas the DM is caused by the PA. FIX THE PA and the DM GOES AWAY. May your pressure be low!CE Grim MS, MDSpecializing in DifficultHypertensionOn Jan 25, 2012, at 15:31, Natalia Kamneva <natalia_kamneva@...> wrote:

I even don't know what to do now :-) Natalia From: <jclark24p@...> hyperaldosteronism Sent: Tuesday, January 24, 2012 7:45 PM Subject: Re: Statins linked to diabetes

Natalia I again tried to find any indication of a HbA1C goal higher than 7.0, some use <7.0 and most use <6.5. I have also not seen anything talking about it being age dependent. I have searched Pubmed and the ADA site and find nothing so I again ask if anyone has info to substantiate it. With it being an average over approx. a 3month period my mathemit

> >> >

> >> >>

> >> >> >Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication

> >> >>

> >> >> Did you see any studies on that or it's just your experience and intuition, Max?

> >> >>

> >> >> I am very curious because I always suspected that the large dosage different HTN medications caused my diabetes. I like you started Metformin about 10 years being on HTN medications. No family history of diabetes, and I even didn't have marginally numbers. My experience with Metformin is different. Even if I take 2000 mg, my appetite is the same :-)

> >> >>

> >> >> Natalia

> >> >> From: StudyCircle <studycircle@>

> >> >> hyperaldosteronism

> >> >> Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 6:08 PM

> >> >> Subject: RE: Re: Statins linked to diabetes

> >> >>

> >> >> Hi ,

> >> >>

> >> >> I am not sure about the details on this research but I suspect definition of diabetic these days is GLUCF>7.0 mmol/L = 126 mg/dL . Assuming that she starts statins now she perhaps get to 16 in some 5 years and 126 is not so bad because with some Metformin it can be overcome and another 5 years to level that she might need insulin...something like this...so it's good idea to see what level of diabetics disorder and in how many years one get to such level.

> >> >>

> >> >> Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication...of course my GLUCF was always marginally high but I was not taking Metformin...and I suspect Metformin reduced my appetite considerably because I am finding myself unable to finish a half plate of food that until last year I could easily finish ! not bad...

> >> >>

> >> >> So basically I assume becoming diabetic is gradual and not as bad as HTN if it is taken care medically, i.e., not allowing glaucoma or cataract ...etc.

> >> >>

> >> >> Max.

> >> >>

> >> >> |Thanks Max, a very timely message for my wife. Her Card just insisted she be

> >> >> |on statins and I asked her if he did a family HX. He didn't but if he had he

> >> >> |would have found her Dad died at 84, her Mom at 93 and her Grandmother at

> >> >> |97. She is the youngest of 8 and 7 are still living, one brother died of colon

> >> >> |cancer. Of course maybe he just wants to make sure she doesn't die from

> >> >> |heart attack, it'll be listed as complications due to DM! I printed it and

> >> >> |suggested she discuss it with him!

> >> >> |

> >> >> |....

> >> >> |

> >> >>

> >> >

> >>

> >

>

January 26, 2012

As A1C goal for people w/o DM is in the 5 range are you saying the reading will

go down if she lowers Metformin when she gets PA under control? I found the

opposite to be true, in fact I had to double Metformin from 1000 to 2000.

> > > >> >

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> >Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to start

Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> Did you see any studies on that or it's just your experience and

intuition, Max?

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> I am very curious because I always suspected that the large dosage

different HTN medications caused my diabetes. I like you started Metformin about

10 years being on HTN medications. No family history of diabetes, and I even

didn't have marginally numbers. My experience with Metformin is different. Even

if I take 2000 mg, my appetite is the same :-)

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> Natalia

> > > >> >> From: StudyCircle <studycircle@>

> > > >> >> hyperaldosteronism

> > > >> >> Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 6:08 PM

> > > >> >> Subject: RE: Re: Statins linked to diabetes

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> Hi ,

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> I am not sure about the details on this research but I suspect

definition of diabetic these days is GLUCF>7.0 mmol/L = 126 mg/dL . Assuming

that she starts statins now she perhaps get to 16 in some 5 years and 126 is not

so bad because with some Metformin it can be overcome and another 5 years to

level that she might need insulin...something like this...so it's good idea to

see what level of diabetics disorder and in how many years one get to such

level.

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to start

Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication...of course my GLUCF was always

marginally high but I was not taking Metformin...and I suspect Metformin reduced

my appetite considerably because I am finding myself unable to finish a half

plate of food that until last year I could easily finish ! not bad...

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> So basically I assume becoming diabetic is gradual and not as bad as

HTN if it is taken care medically, i.e., not allowing glaucoma or cataract

....etc.

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> Max.

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> |Thanks Max, a very timely message for my wife. Her Card just

insisted she be

> > > >> >> |on statins and I asked her if he did a family HX. He didn't but if

he had he

> > > >> >> |would have found her Dad died at 84, her Mom at 93 and her

Grandmother at

> > > >> >> |97. She is the youngest of 8 and 7 are still living, one brother

died of colon

> > > >> >> |cancer. Of course maybe he just wants to make sure she doesn't die

from

> > > >> >> |heart attack, it'll be listed as complications due to DM! I printed

it and

> > > >> >> |suggested she discuss it with him!

> > > >> >> |

> > > >> >> |....

> > > >> >> |

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >

> > > >>

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

January 26, 2012

The A1c goal is Not 5 that I am aware of. Is your BMI LESS THAN 25 yet? May your pressure be low!CE Grim MS, MDSpecializing in DifficultHypertensionOn Jan 26, 2012, at 5:25, <jclark24p@...> wrote:

As A1C goal for people w/o DM is in the 5 range are you saying the reading will go down if she lowers Metformin when she gets PA under control? I found the opposite to be true, in fact I had to double Metformin from 1000 to 2000.

> > > >> >

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> >Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> Did you see any studies on that or it's just your experience and intuition, Max?

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> I am very curious because I always suspected that the large dosage different HTN medications caused my diabetes. I like you started Metformin about 10 years being on HTN medications. No family history of diabetes, and I even didn't have marginally numbers. My experience with Metformin is different. Even if I take 2000 mg, my appetite is the same :-)

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> Natalia

> > > >> >> From: StudyCircle <studycircle@>

> > > >> >> hyperaldosteronism

> > > >> >> Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 6:08 PM

> > > >> >> Subject: RE: Re: Statins linked to diabetes

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> Hi ,

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> I am not sure about the details on this research but I suspect definition of diabetic these days is GLUCF>7.0 mmol/L = 126 mg/dL . Assuming that she starts statins now she perhaps get to 16 in some 5 years and 126 is not so bad because with some Metformin it can be overcome and another 5 years to level that she might need insulin...something like this...so it's good idea to see what level of diabetics disorder and in how many years one get to such level.

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication...of course my GLUCF was always marginally high but I was not taking Metformin...and I suspect Metformin reduced my appetite considerably because I am finding myself unable to finish a half plate of food that until last year I could easily finish ! not bad...

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> So basically I assume becoming diabetic is gradual and not as bad as HTN if it is taken care medically, i.e., not allowing glaucoma or cataract ...etc.

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> Max.

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> |Thanks Max, a very timely message for my wife. Her Card just insisted she be

> > > >> >> |on statins and I asked her if he did a family HX. He didn't but if he had he

> > > >> >> |would have found her Dad died at 84, her Mom at 93 and her Grandmother at

> > > >> >> |97. She is the youngest of 8 and 7 are still living, one brother died of colon

> > > >> >> |cancer. Of course maybe he just wants to make sure she doesn't die from

> > > >> >> |heart attack, it'll be listed as complications due to DM! I printed it and

> > > >> >> |suggested she discuss it with him!

> > > >> >> |

> > > >> >> |....

> > > >> >> |

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >

> > > >>

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

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January 26, 2012

> No in many Pas the DM is caused by the PA. 1. Is the PA considered fixed, when I am on 87.5 mg of epler and Dashing? What do you considered as a fixed PA?2. What is the indicator, that the DM goes away? HbA1C is going to be better? Morning every day's glucose is better with the same dosage of metformin? 3. If I decrease the dosage of metformin, what effect to these numbers should I expect? Your guess is that the less metformnin, the better glucose intolerance should be? Thank you, Natalia From: Clarence Grim <lowerbp2@...> "hyperaldosteronism " <hyperaldosteronism > Sent: Thursday, January 26, 2012 1:04 AM Subject: Re: Re: Statins linked to diabetes

No in many Pas the DM is caused by the PA. FIX THE PA and the DM GOES AWAY. May your pressure be low!CE Grim MS, MDSpecializing in DifficultHypertensionOn Jan 25, 2012, at 15:31, Natalia Kamneva <natalia_kamneva@...> wrote:

I even don't know what to do now :-) Natalia From: <jclark24p@...> hyperaldosteronism Sent: Tuesday, January 24, 2012 7:45

PM Subject: Re: Statins linked to diabetes

Natalia I again tried to find any indication of a HbA1C goal higher than 7.0, some use <7.0 and most use <6.5. I have also not seen anything talking about it being age dependent. I have searched Pubmed and the ADA site and find nothing so I again ask if anyone has info to substantiate it. With it being an average over approx. a 3month period my mathemit

>

> Â

> >I agree.

> >

> >Natalia

> >

> >________________________________

January 26, 2012

Me too. Natalia Kamneva 67 Russian F with 2 cm left adrenal adenoma, still not diagnosed with PA; diabetic; on 100 mg eplerenone, 80 mg Micardis, 2000 mg metformin, 60 mg Dexilant and 2 mg Lorazepam; Dashing; still have some occasional problems with BP, K and Na; on private consultation with Dr Grim. From: <jclark24p@...> hyperaldosteronism Sent:

Thursday, January 26, 2012 7:25 AM Subject: Re: Statins linked to diabetes

As A1C goal for people w/o DM is in the 5 range are you saying the reading will go down if she lowers Metformin when she gets PA under control? I found the opposite to be true, in fact I had to double Metformin from 1000 to 2000.

> > > >> >

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> >Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> Did you see any studies on that or it's just your experience and intuition, Max?

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> I am very curious because I always suspected that the large dosage different HTN medications caused my diabetes. I like you started Metformin about 10 years being on HTN medications. No family history of diabetes, and I even didn't have marginally numbers. My experience with Metformin is different. Even if I take 2000 mg, my appetite is the same :-)

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> Natalia

> > > >> >> From: StudyCircle <studycircle@>

> > > >> >> hyperaldosteronism

> > > >> >> Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 6:08 PM

> > > >> >> Subject: RE: Re: Statins linked to diabetes

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> Hi ,

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> I am not sure about the details on this research but I suspect definition of diabetic these days is GLUCF>7.0 mmol/L = 126 mg/dL . Assuming that she starts statins now she perhaps get to 16 in some 5 years and 126 is not so bad because with some Metformin it can be overcome and another 5 years to level that she might need insulin...something like this...so it's good idea to see what level of diabetics disorder and in how many years one get to such level.

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication...of course my GLUCF was always marginally high but I was not taking Metformin...and I suspect Metformin reduced my appetite considerably because I am finding myself unable to finish a half plate of food that until last year I could easily finish ! not bad...

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> So basically I assume becoming diabetic is gradual and not as bad as HTN if it is taken care medically, i.e., not allowing glaucoma or cataract ...etc.

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> Max.

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> |Thanks Max, a very timely message for my wife. Her Card just insisted she be

> > > >> >> |on statins and I asked her if he did a family HX. He didn't but if he had he

> > > >> >> |would have found her Dad died at 84, her Mom at 93 and her Grandmother at

> > > >> >> |97. She is the youngest of 8 and 7 are still living, one brother died of colon

> > > >> >> |cancer. Of course maybe he just wants to make sure she doesn't die from

> > > >> >> |heart attack, it'll be listed as complications due to DM! I printed it and

> > > >> >> |suggested she discuss it with him!

> > > >> >> |

> > > >> >> |....

> > > >> >> |

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >

> > > >>

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

January 26, 2012

Mine is 26.4. I try my best! Natalia From: Clarence Grim <lowerbp2@...> "hyperaldosteronism " <hyperaldosteronism > Sent: Thursday, January 26, 2012 9:34 AM Subject: Re: Re: Statins linked to diabetes

The A1c goal is Not 5 that I am aware of. Is your BMI LESS THAN 25 yet? May your pressure be low!CE Grim MS, MDSpecializing in DifficultHypertensionOn Jan 26, 2012, at 5:25, <jclark24p@...> wrote:

As A1C goal for people w/o DM is in the 5 range are you saying the reading will go down if she lowers Metformin when she gets PA under control? I found the opposite to be true, in fact I had to double Metformin from 1000 to 2000.

> > > >> >

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> >Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> Did you see any studies on that or it's just your experience and intuition, Max?

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> I am very curious because I always suspected that the large dosage different HTN medications caused my diabetes. I like you started Metformin about 10 years being on HTN medications. No family history of diabetes, and I even didn't have marginally numbers. My experience with Metformin is different. Even if I take 2000 mg, my appetite is the same :-)

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> Natalia

> > > >> >> From: StudyCircle <studycircle@>

> > > >> >> hyperaldosteronism

> > > >> >> Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 6:08 PM

> > > >> >> Subject: RE: Re: Statins linked to diabetes

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> Hi ,

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> I am not sure about the details on this research but I suspect definition of diabetic these days is GLUCF>7.0 mmol/L = 126 mg/dL . Assuming that she starts statins now she perhaps get to 16 in some 5 years and 126 is not so bad because with some Metformin it can be overcome and another 5 years to level that she might need insulin...something like this...so it's good idea to see what level of diabetics disorder and in how many years one get to such level.

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication...of course my GLUCF was always marginally high but I was not taking Metformin...and I suspect Metformin reduced my appetite considerably because I am finding myself unable to finish a half plate of food that until last year I could easily finish ! not bad...

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> So basically I assume becoming diabetic is gradual and not as bad as HTN if it is taken care medically, i.e., not allowing glaucoma or cataract ...etc.

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> Max.

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >> |Thanks Max, a very timely message for my wife. Her Card just insisted she be

> > > >> >> |on statins and I asked her if he did a family HX. He didn't but if he had he

> > > >> >> |would have found her Dad died at 84, her Mom at 93 and her Grandmother at

> > > >> >> |97. She is the youngest of 8 and 7 are still living, one brother died of colon

> > > >> >> |cancer. Of course maybe he just wants to make sure she doesn't die from

> > > >> >> |heart attack, it'll be listed as complications due to DM! I printed it and

> > > >> >> |suggested she discuss it with him!

> > > >> >> |

> > > >> >> |....

> > > >> >> |

> > > >> >>

> > > >> >

> > > >>

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

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January 26, 2012

First, I fail to understand what my BMI HAS TO DO WITH NATLIA'S HbA1C! Let me

ask you what you would respond if I said " Yes, I reduced it by 27+ (that's BMI

not pounds) in ~10months! " Since Iyou brought it up, why did I gain 15 lbs in 2

weeks after I stopped Spiro. Don't go with any crap about eating habits, I can

see and feel many signs of conjestion and fluid retention!

Now to HbA1C. Let me start by asking what is yours? I based my comments on

being DXed w/T2DM w/i the last couple of years and being trained and educated.

The VA has a fulltime Nurse and Nutrition Specilist and I participated in many

small group sessions. When you suggested that 6.4 after being 6.8 six months

prior indicated DM had resolved and she could try cutting back Metformin it

simply didn' t sound right. (BTW, she and I are on the same dose and my HbA1C

runs 6.3, although she is much older, maybe even 4 years!)

With this info from the ADA, I didn't care if you didn't agree with me!

" Question

What type of damage does high blood glucose do to my body?

Answer

Over time, high blood glucose levels can damage both blood vessels and nerves in

your body. This can result in poor blood flow to your hands and feet in addition

to your legs, arms, and vital organs. Poor blood flow to these areas increases

your risk of infections, heart problems, stroke, blindness, foot or leg

amputation, and kidney disease. In addition, you can either lose the feeling in

your feet or have increased pain in your feet and legs. Damage to your feet can

occur from mild injuries, and you may not know it. Finally, damage to blood

vessels and nerves can lead to sexual problems that are difficult to treat. For

all these reasons, you should make a major effort to avoid high blood glucose

levels in your body. "

Now, I was kind of busy trying to set up an AVS today so I didn't have time to

look up an actual policy but you can probably find it on Pubmed. I did check

the range in my labs: " NEW A1C low=4 high=6 " " OLD A1C low is blank high=8 "

When I tried to get mine under 6 my DM team explained that was for non-DM PTNs

and they wanted me between 6.0 and 6.5 or less than 140 on daily stick tests.

- 65 yo super ob., fastidious male - 12mm X 13mm rt. a.adnoma with

previous rt. flank pain. Treating with DASH. Stats w/o meds = BP 175/90 HR 59

BS 125. D/C Spironolactone 12/20/2011 due to adverse SX.

Other Issues/Opportunities: OSA w Bi-Pap settings 13/19, DM2, Gynecomastia, MDD

and PTSD.

Meds: Duloxetine hcl 80 MG, Metoprolol Tartrate 200 MG, 81mg aspirin and

Metformin 2000MG. Started washing Spironolactone 12/20/11 to prepare for AVS.

> > > > > >> >

> > > > > >> >>

> > > > > >> >> >Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to

start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication

> > > > > >> >>

> > > > > >> >> Did you see any studies on that or it's just your experience and

intuition, Max?

> > > > > >> >>

> > > > > >> >> I am very curious because I always suspected that the large

dosage different HTN medications caused my diabetes. I like you started

Metformin about 10 years being on HTN medications. No family history of

diabetes, and I even didn't have marginally numbers. My experience with

Metformin is different. Even if I take 2000 mg, my appetite is the same :-)

> > > > > >> >>

> > > > > >> >> Natalia

> > > > > >> >> From: StudyCircle <studycircle@>

> > > > > >> >> hyperaldosteronism

> > > > > >> >> Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 6:08 PM

> > > > > >> >> Subject: RE: Re: Statins linked to diabetes

> > > > > >> >>

> > > > > >> >> Hi ,

> > > > > >> >>

> > > > > >> >> I am not sure about the details on this research but I suspect

definition of diabetic these days is GLUCF>7.0 mmol/L = 126 mg/dL . Assuming

that she starts statins now she perhaps get to 16 in some 5 years and 126 is not

so bad because with some Metformin it can be overcome and another 5 years to

level that she might need insulin...something like this...so it's good idea to

see what level of diabetics disorder and in how many years one get to such

level.

> > > > > >> >>

> > > > > >> >> Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to start

Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication...of course my GLUCF was always

marginally high but I was not taking Metformin...and I suspect Metformin reduced

my appetite considerably because I am finding myself unable to finish a half

plate of food that until last year I could easily finish ! not bad...

> > > > > >> >>

> > > > > >> >> So basically I assume becoming diabetic is gradual and not as

bad as HTN if it is taken care medically, i.e., not allowing glaucoma or

cataract ...etc.

> > > > > >> >>

> > > > > >> >> Max.

> > > > > >> >>

> > > > > >> >> |Thanks Max, a very timely message for my wife. Her Card just

insisted she be

> > > > > >> >> |on statins and I asked her if he did a family HX. He didn't but

if he had he

> > > > > >> >> |would have found her Dad died at 84, her Mom at 93 and her

Grandmother at

> > > > > >> >> |97. She is the youngest of 8 and 7 are still living, one

brother died of colon

> > > > > >> >> |cancer. Of course maybe he just wants to make sure she doesn't

die from

> > > > > >> >> |heart attack, it'll be listed as complications due to DM! I

printed it and

> > > > > >> >> |suggested she discuss it with him!

> > > > > >> >> |

> > > > > >> >> |....

> > > > > >> >> |

> > > > > >> >>

> > > > > >> >

> > > > > >>

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

> > Reply to sender | Reply to group | Reply via web post | Start a New Topic

> > Messages in this topic (30)

> > RECENT ACTIVITY: New Members 6 New Files 1

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> > Switch to:

>

January 26, 2012

This response is beyond rude. It is patronizing. Better look in the mirror. You ego is showing.

Barbara

RE: Re: Statins linked to diabetes> > > > > >> >> > > > > > >> >> > > > > > >> >> Hi ,> > > > > >> >> > > > > > >> >> I am not sure about the details on this research but I suspect definition of diabetic these days is GLUCF>7.0 mmol/L = 126 mg/dL . Assuming that she starts statins now she perhaps get to 16 in some 5 years and 126 is not so bad because with some Metformin it can be overcome and another 5 years to level that she might need insulin...something like this...so it's good idea to see what level of diabetics disorder and in how many years one get to such level.> > > > > >> >> > > > > > >> >> Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication...of course my GLUCF was always marginally high but I was not taking Metformin...and I suspect Metformin reduced my appetite considerably because I am finding myself unable to finish a half plate of food that until last year I could easily finish ! not bad...> > > > > >> >> > > > > > >> >> So basically I assume becoming diabetic is gradual and not as bad as HTN if it is taken care medically, i.e., not allowing glaucoma or cataract ...etc.> > > > > >> >> > > > > > >> >> Max.> > > > > >> >> > > > > > >> >> |Thanks Max, a very timely message for my wife. Her Card just insisted she be> > > > > >> >> |on statins and I asked her if he did a family HX. He didn't but if he had he> > > > > >> >> |would have found her Dad died at 84, her Mom at 93 and her Grandmother at> > > > > >> >> |97. She is the youngest of 8 and 7 are still living, one brother died of colon> > > > > >> >> |cancer. Of course maybe he just wants to make sure she doesn't die from> > > > > >> >> |heart attack, it'll be listed as complications due to DM! I printed it and> > > > > >> >> |suggested she discuss it with him!> > > > > >> >> |> > > > > >> >> |....> > > > > >> >> |> > > > > >> >> > > > > > >> >> > > > > > >> >> > > > > > >> >> > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> >> > > > > >>> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > >> > > > > > Reply to sender | Reply to group | Reply via web post | Start a New Topic> > Messages in this topic (30)> > RECENT ACTIVITY: New Members 6 New Files 1> > Visit Your Group> > Switch to:>

January 26, 2012

Thank-You for your opionion and I am glad it came across exactly as intended!

Hopefully you read the whole thread or atleast back to where I tried to point

out " Best Practice " in the treatment of DM. Since I don't see a thumbnail, I

don't know your story, I only ask what you know about T2DM? My response is

exactly on target according to current SOP. Review it! And then tell me what

my BMI has to do with her HbA1C since that evolved into the discussion of

acceptable HbA1C in T2DM. In fact if you read the whole post you will find I

provided the answer to Dr. Grim's misinformation when I quoted my lab ranges: " I

did check the range in my labs: " NEW A1C low=4 high=6 " " OLD A1C low is blank

high=8 " . See, He was going by the old range!

Rest assured, my response would have been very different but for these 7 words:

" Is your BMI LESS THAN 25 yet? " (You do know what ALL CAPS means don't you?)

- 65 yo super ob., fastidious male - 12mm X 13mm rt. a.adnoma with

previous rt. flank pain. Treating with DASH. Stats w/o meds = BP 175/90 HR 59

BS 125. D/C Spironolactone 12/20/2011 due to adverse SX.

Other Issues/Opportunities: OSA w Bi-Pap settings 13/19, DM2, Gynecomastia, MDD

and PTSD.

Meds: Duloxetine hcl 80 MG, Metoprolol Tartrate 200 MG, 81mg aspirin and

Metformin 2000MG. Started washing Spironolactone 12/20/11 to prepare for AVS.

> > > > > > >> >

> > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > >> >> >Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to

start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication

> > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > >> >> Did you see any studies on that or it's just your experience

and intuition, Max?

> > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > >> >> I am very curious because I always suspected that the large

dosage different HTN medications caused my diabetes. I like you started

Metformin about 10 years being on HTN medications. No family history of

diabetes, and I even didn't have marginally numbers. My experience with

Metformin is different. Even if I take 2000 mg, my appetite is the same :-)

> > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > >> >> Natalia

> > > > > > >> >> From: StudyCircle <studycircle@>

> > > > > > >> >> To:

hyperaldosteronism <mailto:hyperaldosteronism%40>

> > > > > > >> >> Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 6:08 PM

> > > > > > >> >> Subject: RE: Re: Statins linked to

diabetes

> > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > >> >> Hi ,

> > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > >> >> I am not sure about the details on this research but I

suspect definition of diabetic these days is GLUCF>7.0 mmol/L = 126 mg/dL .

Assuming that she starts statins now she perhaps get to 16 in some 5 years and

126 is not so bad because with some Metformin it can be overcome and another 5

years to level that she might need insulin...something like this...so it's good

idea to see what level of diabetics disorder and in how many years one get to

such level.

> > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > >> >> Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to

start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication...of course my GLUCF was

always marginally high but I was not taking Metformin...and I suspect Metformin

reduced my appetite considerably because I am finding myself unable to finish a

half plate of food that until last year I could easily finish ! not bad...

> > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > >> >> So basically I assume becoming diabetic is gradual and not

as bad as HTN if it is taken care medically, i.e., not allowing glaucoma or

cataract ...etc.

> > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > >> >> Max.

> > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > >> >> |Thanks Max, a very timely message for my wife. Her Card

just insisted she be

> > > > > > >> >> |on statins and I asked her if he did a family HX. He didn't

but if he had he

> > > > > > >> >> |would have found her Dad died at 84, her Mom at 93 and her

Grandmother at

> > > > > > >> >> |97. She is the youngest of 8 and 7 are still living, one

brother died of colon

> > > > > > >> >> |cancer. Of course maybe he just wants to make sure she

doesn't die from

> > > > > > >> >> |heart attack, it'll be listed as complications due to DM! I

printed it and

> > > > > > >> >> |suggested she discuss it with him!

> > > > > > >> >> |

> > > > > > >> >> |....

> > > > > > >> >> |

> > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > >> >

> > > > > > >>

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > Reply to sender | Reply to group | Reply via web post | Start a New

Topic

> > > Messages in this topic (30)

> > > RECENT ACTIVITY: New Members 6 New Files 1

> > > Visit Your Group

> > > Switch to:

> >

>

January 26, 2012

For crying out loud . This has nothing to do with the information. Didn't your mama ever tell you that you can attract more bees with honey than vinegar. Probably due to the acidity. Jus' sayin'.

Barb

RE: Re: Statins linked to diabetes> > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > >> >> Hi ,> > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > >> >> I am not sure about the details on this research but I suspect definition of diabetic these days is GLUCF>7.0 mmol/L = 126 mg/dL . Assuming that she starts statins now she perhaps get to 16 in some 5 years and 126 is not so bad because with some Metformin it can be overcome and another 5 years to level that she might need insulin...something like this...so it's good idea to see what level of diabetics disorder and in how many years one get to such level.> > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > >> >> Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication...of course my GLUCF was always marginally high but I was not taking Metformin...and I suspect Metformin reduced my appetite considerably because I am finding myself unable to finish a half plate of food that until last year I could easily finish ! not bad...> > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > >> >> So basically I assume becoming diabetic is gradual and not as bad as HTN if it is taken care medically, i.e., not allowing glaucoma or cataract ...etc.> > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > >> >> Max.> > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > >> >> |Thanks Max, a very timely message for my wife. Her Card just insisted she be> > > > > > >> >> |on statins and I asked her if he did a family HX. He didn't but if he had he> > > > > > >> >> |would have found her Dad died at 84, her Mom at 93 and her Grandmother at> > > > > > >> >> |97. She is the youngest of 8 and 7 are still living, one brother died of colon> > > > > > >> >> |cancer. Of course maybe he just wants to make sure she doesn't die from> > > > > > >> >> |heart attack, it'll be listed as complications due to DM! I printed it and> > > > > > >> >> |suggested she discuss it with him!> > > > > > >> >> |> > > > > > >> >> |....> > > > > > >> >> |> > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > >>> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > > Reply to sender | Reply to group | Reply via web post | Start a New Topic> > > Messages in this topic (30)> > > RECENT ACTIVITY: New Members 6 New Files 1> > > Visit Your Group> > > Switch to:> >>

January 26, 2012

The main thing I remember my Mother teaching me is: " Opinions are like noses,

everybody has one! "

As for bees, I have no interest in attracting them because both of my sons are

allergic to them! In fact I almost lost my second son when he was about 10 to

them! Got to the ER w/minutes to spare!

I only use vinegar so I don't have to use medicated chicken food! How were your

poisoned eggs this morning? Mine were all natural! (A capfull of vinegar in

their water now and then prevents a prasite from attaching to their intestines

because the acid burns their legs off!)

So you have determined that responding to " slamming the fat old man " has nothing

to do with the information, a position I obviously agree with, but if you take a

shot at me I was trained to shoot back! (Not by mother but by a famous Uncle!)

> > > > > > > >> >

> > > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > > >> >> >Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had

to start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication

> > > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > > >> >> Did you see any studies on that or it's just your

experience and intuition, Max?

> > > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > > >> >> I am very curious because I always suspected that the

large dosage different HTN medications caused my diabetes. I like you started

Metformin about 10 years being on HTN medications. No family history of

diabetes, and I even didn't have marginally numbers. My experience with

Metformin is different. Even if I take 2000 mg, my appetite is the same :-)

> > > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > > >> >> Natalia

> > > > > > > >> >> From: StudyCircle <studycircle@>

> > > > > > > >> >> To:

hyperaldosteronism <mailto:hyperaldosteronism%40><\

mailto:hyperaldosteronism%40>

> > > > > > > >> >> Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 6:08 PM

> > > > > > > >> >> Subject: RE: Re: Statins linked to

diabetes

> > > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > > >> >> Hi ,

> > > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > > >> >> I am not sure about the details on this research but I

suspect definition of diabetic these days is GLUCF>7.0 mmol/L = 126 mg/dL .

Assuming that she starts statins now she perhaps get to 16 in some 5 years and

126 is not so bad because with some Metformin it can be overcome and another 5

years to level that she might need insulin...something like this...so it's good

idea to see what level of diabetics disorder and in how many years one get to

such level.

> > > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > > >> >> Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to

start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication...of course my GLUCF was

always marginally high but I was not taking Metformin...and I suspect Metformin

reduced my appetite considerably because I am finding myself unable to finish a

half plate of food that until last year I could easily finish ! not bad...

> > > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > > >> >> So basically I assume becoming diabetic is gradual and not

as bad as HTN if it is taken care medically, i.e., not allowing glaucoma or

cataract ...etc.

> > > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > > >> >> Max.

> > > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > > >> >> |Thanks Max, a very timely message for my wife. Her Card

just insisted she be

> > > > > > > >> >> |on statins and I asked her if he did a family HX. He

didn't but if he had he

> > > > > > > >> >> |would have found her Dad died at 84, her Mom at 93 and

her Grandmother at

> > > > > > > >> >> |97. She is the youngest of 8 and 7 are still living, one

brother died of colon

> > > > > > > >> >> |cancer. Of course maybe he just wants to make sure she

doesn't die from

> > > > > > > >> >> |heart attack, it'll be listed as complications due to DM!

I printed it and

> > > > > > > >> >> |suggested she discuss it with him!

> > > > > > > >> >> |

> > > > > > > >> >> |....

> > > > > > > >> >> |

> > > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > > >> >

> > > > > > > >>

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > > Reply to sender | Reply to group | Reply via web post | Start a New

Topic

> > > > Messages in this topic (30)

> > > > RECENT ACTIVITY: New Members 6 New Files 1

> > > > Visit Your Group

> > > > Switch to:

> > >

> >

>

January 26, 2012

An avenger by nature and heritage. Somebody shoots for no apparent reason, like you, I shoot back. I would hope somebody would call me on my crap as well. Fire away.

Jus' sayin'

Barb

RE: Re: Statins linked to diabetes> > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> Hi ,> > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> I am not sure about the details on this research but I suspect definition of diabetic these days is GLUCF>7.0 mmol/L = 126 mg/dL . Assuming that she starts statins now she perhaps get to 16 in some 5 years and 126 is not so bad because with some Metformin it can be overcome and another 5 years to level that she might need insulin...something like this...so it's good idea to see what level of diabetics disorder and in how many years one get to such level.> > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication...of course my GLUCF was always marginally high but I was not taking Metformin...and I suspect Metformin reduced my appetite considerably because I am finding myself unable to finish a half plate of food that until last year I could easily finish ! not bad...> > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> So basically I assume becoming diabetic is gradual and not as bad as HTN if it is taken care medically, i.e., not allowing glaucoma or cataract ...etc.> > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> Max.> > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> |Thanks Max, a very timely message for my wife. Her Card just insisted she be> > > > > > > >> >> |on statins and I asked her if he did a family HX. He didn't but if he had he> > > > > > > >> >> |would have found her Dad died at 84, her Mom at 93 and her Grandmother at> > > > > > > >> >> |97. She is the youngest of 8 and 7 are still living, one brother died of colon> > > > > > > >> >> |cancer. Of course maybe he just wants to make sure she doesn't die from> > > > > > > >> >> |heart attack, it'll be listed as complications due to DM! I printed it and> > > > > > > >> >> |suggested she discuss it with him!> > > > > > > >> >> |> > > > > > > >> >> |....> > > > > > > >> >> |> > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Reply to sender | Reply to group | Reply via web post | Start a New Topic> > > > Messages in this topic (30)> > > > RECENT ACTIVITY: New Members 6 New Files 1> > > > Visit Your Group> > > > Switch to:> > >> >>

January 27, 2012

And BTW we all have nostrils, but not everyone has noses. Some lose theirs for various reasons

From: Barb Tatro <rainbowdayz@...>Subject: Re: Re: Statins linked to diabeteshyperaldosteronism Date: Thursday, January 26, 2012, 11:07 PM

An avenger by nature and heritage. Somebody shoots for no apparent reason, like you, I shoot back. I would hope somebody would call me on my crap as well. Fire away.

Jus' sayin'

Barb

RE: Re: Statins linked to diabetes> > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> Hi ,> > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> I am not sure about the details on this research but I suspect definition of diabetic these days is GLUCF>7.0 mmol/L = 126 mg/dL . Assuming that she starts statins now she perhaps get to 16 in some 5 years and 126 is not so bad because with some Metformin it can be overcome and another 5 years to level that she might need insulin...something like this...so it's good idea to see what level of diabetics disorder and in how many years one get to such

level.> > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication...of course my GLUCF was always marginally high but I was not taking Metformin...and I suspect Metformin reduced my appetite considerably because I am finding myself unable to finish a half plate of food that until last year I could easily finish ! not bad...> > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> So basically I assume becoming diabetic is gradual and not as bad as HTN if it is taken care medically, i.e., not allowing glaucoma or cataract ...etc.> > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> Max.> > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > >

> >> >> |Thanks Max, a very timely message for my wife. Her Card just insisted she be> > > > > > > >> >> |on statins and I asked her if he did a family HX. He didn't but if he had he> > > > > > > >> >> |would have found her Dad died at 84, her Mom at 93 and her Grandmother at> > > > > > > >> >> |97. She is the youngest of 8 and 7 are still living, one brother died of colon> > > > > > > >> >> |cancer. Of course maybe he just wants to make sure she doesn't die from> > > > > > > >> >> |heart attack, it'll be listed as complications due to DM! I printed it and> > > > > > > >> >> |suggested she discuss it with him!> > > > > > > >> >> |> > > > > > > >>

>> |....> > > > > > > >> >> |> > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > >> > > > >

> > > > > > > Reply to sender | Reply to group | Reply via web post | Start a New Topic> > > > Messages in this topic (30)> > > > RECENT ACTIVITY: New Members 6 New Files 1> > > > Visit Your Group> > > > Switch to:> > >> >>

January 27, 2012

Barb, I need to take a raincheck on that because my wife's brother in law died

yesterday and I may need to take her to her sister's. 60 miles in an ice storm

- looking forward to it!

I do have a couple of issues and will discuss when I have time. I restrained

myself because I didn't see how it applied to the treatment of PA! Thanks for

turning me loose!

- 65 yo super ob., fastidious male - 12mm X 13mm rt. a.adnoma with

previous rt. flank pain. Treating with DASH. Stats w/o meds = BP 175/90 HR 59

BS 125. D/C Spironolactone 12/20/2011 due to adverse SX.

Other Issues/Opportunities: OSA w Bi-Pap settings 13/19, DM2, Gynecomastia, MDD

and PTSD.

Meds: Duloxetine hcl 80 MG, Metoprolol Tartrate 200 MG, 81mg aspirin and

Metformin 2000MG. Started washing Spironolactone 12/20/11 to prepare for AVS.

> > > > > > > > >> >

> > > > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > > > >> >> >Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had

to start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication

> > > > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > > > >> >> Did you see any studies on that or it's just your

experience and intuition, Max?

> > > > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > > > >> >> I am very curious because I always suspected that the

large dosage different HTN medications caused my diabetes. I like you started

Metformin about 10 years being on HTN medications. No family history of

diabetes, and I even didn't have marginally numbers. My experience with

Metformin is different. Even if I take 2000 mg, my appetite is the same :-)

> > > > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > > > >> >> Natalia

> > > > > > > > >> >> From: StudyCircle <studycircle@>

> > > > > > > > >> >> To:

hyperaldosteronism <mailto:hyperaldosteronism%40><\

mailto:hyperaldosteronism%40><mailto:hyperaldosteronism%40gr\

oups.com>

> > > > > > > > >> >> Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 6:08 PM

> > > > > > > > >> >> Subject: RE: Re: Statins linked to

diabetes

> > > > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > > > >> >> Hi ,

> > > > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > > > >> >> I am not sure about the details on this research but I

suspect definition of diabetic these days is GLUCF>7.0 mmol/L = 126 mg/dL .

Assuming that she starts statins now she perhaps get to 16 in some 5 years and

126 is not so bad because with some Metformin it can be overcome and another 5

years to level that she might need insulin...something like this...so it's good

idea to see what level of diabetics disorder and in how many years one get to

such level.

> > > > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > > > >> >> Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had

to start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication...of course my GLUCF

was always marginally high but I was not taking Metformin...and I suspect

Metformin reduced my appetite considerably because I am finding myself unable to

finish a half plate of food that until last year I could easily finish ! not

bad...

> > > > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > > > >> >> So basically I assume becoming diabetic is gradual and

not as bad as HTN if it is taken care medically, i.e., not allowing glaucoma or

cataract ...etc.

> > > > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > > > >> >> Max.

> > > > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > > > >> >> |Thanks Max, a very timely message for my wife. Her Card

just insisted she be

> > > > > > > > >> >> |on statins and I asked her if he did a family HX. He

didn't but if he had he

> > > > > > > > >> >> |would have found her Dad died at 84, her Mom at 93 and

her Grandmother at

> > > > > > > > >> >> |97. She is the youngest of 8 and 7 are still living,

one brother died of colon

> > > > > > > > >> >> |cancer. Of course maybe he just wants to make sure she

doesn't die from

> > > > > > > > >> >> |heart attack, it'll be listed as complications due to

DM! I printed it and

> > > > > > > > >> >> |suggested she discuss it with him!

> > > > > > > > >> >> |

> > > > > > > > >> >> |....

> > > > > > > > >> >> |

> > > > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > > > >> >

> > > > > > > > >>

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Reply to sender | Reply to group | Reply via web post | Start a New

Topic

> > > > > Messages in this topic (30)

> > > > > RECENT ACTIVITY: New Members 6 New Files 1

> > > > > Visit Your Group

> > > > > Switch to:

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

January 27, 2012

Are you setting me up? Are you trying to get me to " catch Hell " for correcting

another in the medical profession? What the heck, Momma didn't raise no

chicken!

By definition: " nos·tril [nóstr & #601;l]

(plural nos·trils)

n

breathing hole in nose: either of the two openings at the end of the nose of a

person or animal

rights reserved.

With that said I say it is impossible to have a nostril without a nose unless

that is what they call the hole in your throat after a tracheotomy!

BTW, I usually use another part of the anatomy but I don't what you have if you

have a Colostomy bag! (I also have a goal to not offend anyone for 24 hrs!!)

;<) (I reversed my nose so you could count my nostrils!)

> > > > > > > > >> >

> > > > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > > > >> >> >Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had

to start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication

> > > > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > > > >> >> Did you see any studies on that or it's just your

experience and intuition, Max?

> > > > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > > > >> >> I am very curious because I always suspected that the

large dosage different HTN medications caused my diabetes. I like you started

Metformin about 10 years being on HTN medications. No family history of

diabetes, and I even didn't have marginally numbers. My experience with

Metformin is different. Even if I take 2000 mg, my appetite is the same :-)

> > > > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > > > >> >> Natalia

> > > > > > > > >> >> From: StudyCircle <studycircle@>

> > > > > > > > >> >> To:

hyperaldosteronism <mailto:hyperaldosteronism%40><\

mailto:hyperaldosteronism%40>

> > > > > > > > >> >> Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 6:08 PM

> > > > > > > > >> >> Subject: RE: Re: Statins linked to

diabetes

> > > > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > > > >> >> Hi ,

> > > > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > > > >> >> I am not sure about the details on this research but I

suspect definition of diabetic these days is GLUCF>7.0 mmol/L = 126 mg/dL .

Assuming that she starts statins now she perhaps get to 16 in some 5 years and

126 is not so bad because with some Metformin it can be overcome and another 5

years to level that she might need insulin...something like this...so it's good

idea to see what level of diabetics disorder and in how many years one get to

such level.

> > > > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > > > >> >> Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to

start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication...of course my GLUCF was

always marginally high but I was not taking Metformin...and I suspect Metformin

reduced my appetite considerably because I am finding myself unable to finish a

half plate of food that until last year I could easily finish ! not bad...

> > > > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > > > >> >> So basically I assume becoming diabetic is gradual and not

as bad as HTN if it is taken care medically, i.e., not allowing glaucoma or

cataract ...etc.

> > > > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > > > >> >> Max.

> > > > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > > > >> >> |Thanks Max, a very timely message for my wife. Her Card

just insisted she be

> > > > > > > > >> >> |on statins and I asked her if he did a family HX. He

didn't but if he had he

> > > > > > > > >> >> |would have found her Dad died at 84, her Mom at 93 and

her Grandmother at

> > > > > > > > >> >> |97. She is the youngest of 8 and 7 are still living, one

brother died of colon

> > > > > > > > >> >> |cancer. Of course maybe he just wants to make sure she

doesn't die from

> > > > > > > > >> >> |heart attack, it'll be listed as complications due to DM!

I printed it and

> > > > > > > > >> >> |suggested she discuss it with him!

> > > > > > > > >> >> |

> > > > > > > > >> >> |....

> > > > > > > > >> >> |

> > > > > > > > >> >>

> > > > > > > > >> >

> > > > > > > > >>

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Reply to sender | Reply to group | Reply via web post | Start a New

Topic

> > > > > Messages in this topic (30)

> > > > > RECENT ACTIVITY: New Members 6 New Files 1

> > > > > Visit Your Group

> > > > > Switch to:

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

January 27, 2012

, I am only 2 years older, not 4 :-) Is it a brain fog or insult ?:-)Natalia From: <jclark24p@...> hyperaldosteronism Sent: Thursday, January 26, 2012 6:23 PM Subject: Re: Statins linked to diabetes

First, I fail to understand what my BMI HAS TO DO WITH NATLIA'S HbA1C! Let me ask you what you would respond if I said "Yes, I reduced it by 27+ (that's BMI not pounds) in ~10months!" Since Iyou brought it up, why did I gain 15 lbs in 2 weeks after I stopped Spiro. Don't go with any crap about eating habits, I can see and feel many signs of conjestion and fluid retention!

Now to HbA1C. Let me start by asking what is yours? I based my comments on being DXed w/T2DM w/i the last couple of years and being trained and educated. The VA has a fulltime Nurse and Nutrition Specilist and I participated in many small group sessions. When you suggested that 6.4 after being 6.8 six months prior indicated DM had resolved and she could try cutting back Metformin it simply didn' t sound right. (BTW, she and I are on the same dose and my HbA1C runs 6.3, although she is much older, maybe even 4 years!)

With this info from the ADA, I didn't care if you didn't agree with me!

"Question

What type of damage does high blood glucose do to my body?

Answer

Over time, high blood glucose levels can damage both blood vessels and nerves in your body. This can result in poor blood flow to your hands and feet in addition to your legs, arms, and vital organs. Poor blood flow to these areas increases your risk of infections, heart problems, stroke, blindness, foot or leg amputation, and kidney disease. In addition, you can either lose the feeling in your feet or have increased pain in your feet and legs. Damage to your feet can occur from mild injuries, and you may not know it. Finally, damage to blood vessels and nerves can lead to sexual problems that are difficult to treat. For all these reasons, you should make a major effort to avoid high blood glucose levels in your body."

Now, I was kind of busy trying to set up an AVS today so I didn't have time to look up an actual policy but you can probably find it on Pubmed. I did check the range in my labs: "NEW A1C low=4 high=6" "OLD A1C low is blank high=8" When I tried to get mine under 6 my DM team explained that was for non-DM PTNs and they wanted me between 6.0 and 6.5 or less than 140 on daily stick tests.

- 65 yo super ob., fastidious male - 12mm X 13mm rt. a.adnoma with previous rt. flank pain. Treating with DASH. Stats w/o meds = BP 175/90 HR 59 BS 125. D/C Spironolactone 12/20/2011 due to adverse SX.

Other Issues/Opportunities: OSA w Bi-Pap settings 13/19, DM2, Gynecomastia, MDD and PTSD.

Meds: Duloxetine hcl 80 MG, Metoprolol Tartrate 200 MG, 81mg aspirin and Metformin 2000MG. Started washing Spironolactone 12/20/11 to prepare for AVS.

> > > > > >> >

> > > > > >> >>

> > > > > >> >> >Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication

> > > > > >> >>

> > > > > >> >> Did you see any studies on that or it's just your experience and intuition, Max?

> > > > > >> >>

> > > > > >> >> I am very curious because I always suspected that the large dosage different HTN medications caused my diabetes. I like you started Metformin about 10 years being on HTN medications. No family history of diabetes, and I even didn't have marginally numbers. My experience with Metformin is different. Even if I take 2000 mg, my appetite is the same :-)

> > > > > >> >>

> > > > > >> >> Natalia

> > > > > >> >> From: StudyCircle <studycircle@>

> > > > > >> >> hyperaldosteronism

> > > > > >> >> Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 6:08 PM

> > > > > >> >> Subject: RE: Re: Statins linked to diabetes

> > > > > >> >>

> > > > > >> >> Hi ,

> > > > > >> >>

> > > > > >> >> I am not sure about the details on this research but I suspect definition of diabetic these days is GLUCF>7.0 mmol/L = 126 mg/dL . Assuming that she starts statins now she perhaps get to 16 in some 5 years and 126 is not so bad because with some Metformin it can be overcome and another 5 years to level that she might need insulin...something like this...so it's good idea to see what level of diabetics disorder and in how many years one get to such level.

> > > > > >> >>

> > > > > >> >> Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication...of course my GLUCF was always marginally high but I was not taking Metformin...and I suspect Metformin reduced my appetite considerably because I am finding myself unable to finish a half plate of food that until last year I could easily finish ! not bad...

> > > > > >> >>

> > > > > >> >> So basically I assume becoming diabetic is gradual and not as bad as HTN if it is taken care medically, i.e., not allowing glaucoma or cataract ...etc.

> > > > > >> >>

> > > > > >> >> Max.

> > > > > >> >>

> > > > > >> >> |Thanks Max, a very timely message for my wife. Her Card just insisted she be

> > > > > >> >> |on statins and I asked her if he did a family HX. He didn't but if he had he

> > > > > >> >> |would have found her Dad died at 84, her Mom at 93 and her Grandmother at

> > > > > >> >> |97. She is the youngest of 8 and 7 are still living, one brother died of colon

> > > > > >> >> |cancer. Of course maybe he just wants to make sure she doesn't die from

> > > > > >> >> |heart attack, it'll be listed as complications due to DM! I printed it and

> > > > > >> >> |suggested she discuss it with him!

> > > > > >> >> |

> > > > > >> >> |....

> > > > > >> >> |

> > > > > >> >>

> > > > > >> >

> > > > > >>

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

> > Reply to sender | Reply to group | Reply via web post | Start a New Topic

> > Messages in this topic (30)

> > RECENT ACTIVITY: New Members 6 New Files 1

> > Visit Your Group

> > Switch to:

>

January 28, 2012

The 15 lbs were likely salt and water. When we do metabolic balance studies this would mean that if you were on the same Na intake every day there would be less in the urine until your pressure rises enough to get rid of the retained salt this is called an aldo escape. Unless you were drinking heavy water. CE Grim MD On Jan 26, 2012, at 4:23 PM, wrote: First, I fail to understand what my BMI HAS TO DO WITH NATLIA'S HbA1C! Let me ask you what you would respond if I said "Yes, I reduced it by 27+ (that's BMI not pounds) in ~10months!" Since Iyou brought it up, why did I gain 15 lbs in 2 weeks after I stopped Spiro. Don't go with any crap about eating habits, I can see and feel many signs of conjestion and fluid retention! Now to HbA1C. Let me start by asking what is yours? I based my comments on being DXed w/T2DM w/i the last couple of years and being trained and educated. The VA has a fulltime Nurse and Nutrition Specilist and I participated in many small group sessions. When you suggested that 6.4 after being 6.8 six months prior indicated DM had resolved and she could try cutting back Metformin it simply didn' t sound right. (BTW, she and I are on the same dose and my HbA1C runs 6.3, although she is much older, maybe even 4 years!) With this info from the ADA, I didn't care if you didn't agree with me! "Question What type of damage does high blood glucose do to my body? Answer Over time, high blood glucose levels can damage both blood vessels and nerves in your body. This can result in poor blood flow to your hands and feet in addition to your legs, arms, and vital organs. Poor blood flow to these areas increases your risk of infections, heart problems, stroke, blindness, foot or leg amputation, and kidney disease. In addition, you can either lose the feeling in your feet or have increased pain in your feet and legs. Damage to your feet can occur from mild injuries, and you may not know it. Finally, damage to blood vessels and nerves can lead to sexual problems that are difficult to treat. For all these reasons, you should make a major effort to avoid high blood glucose levels in your body." Now, I was kind of busy trying to set up an AVS today so I didn't have time to look up an actual policy but you can probably find it on Pubmed. I did check the range in my labs: "NEW A1C low=4 high=6" "OLD A1C low is blank high=8" When I tried to get mine under 6 my DM team explained that was for non-DM PTNs and they wanted me between 6.0 and 6.5 or less than 140 on daily stick tests. - 65 yo super ob., fastidious male - 12mm X 13mm rt. a.adnoma with previous rt. flank pain. Treating with DASH. Stats w/o meds = BP 175/90 HR 59 BS 125. D/C Spironolactone 12/20/2011 due to adverse SX. Other Issues/Opportunities: OSA w Bi-Pap settings 13/19, DM2, Gynecomastia, MDD and PTSD. Meds: Duloxetine hcl 80 MG, Metoprolol Tartrate 200 MG, 81mg aspirin and Metformin 2000MG. Started washing Spironolactone 12/20/11 to prepare for AVS. > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > >> >> > > > > > >> >> >Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication > > > > > >> >> > > > > > >> >> Did you see any studies on that or it's just your experience and intuition, Max? > > > > > >> >> > > > > > >> >> I am very curious because I always suspected that the large dosage different HTN medications caused my diabetes. I like you started Metformin about 10 years being on HTN medications. No family history of diabetes, and I even didn't have marginally numbers. My experience with Metformin is different. Even if I take 2000 mg, my appetite is the same :-) > > > > > >> >> > > > > > >> >> Natalia > > > > > >> >> From: StudyCircle <studycircle@> > > > > > >> >> hyperaldosteronism > > > > > >> >> Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 6:08 PM > > > > > >> >> Subject: RE: Re: Statins linked to diabetes > > > > > >> >> > > > > > >> >> > > > > > >> >> Hi , > > > > > >> >> > > > > > >> >> I am not sure about the details on this research but I suspect definition of diabetic these days is GLUCF>7.0 mmol/L = 126 mg/dL . Assuming that she starts statins now she perhaps get to 16 in some 5 years and 126 is not so bad because with some Metformin it can be overcome and another 5 years to level that she might need insulin...something like this...so it's good idea to see what level of diabetics disorder and in how many years one get to such level. > > > > > >> >> > > > > > >> >> Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication...of course my GLUCF was always marginally high but I was not taking Metformin...and I suspect Metformin reduced my appetite considerably because I am finding myself unable to finish a half plate of food that until last year I could easily finish ! not bad... > > > > > >> >> > > > > > >> >> So basically I assume becoming diabetic is gradual and not as bad as HTN if it is taken care medically, i.e., not allowing glaucoma or cataract ...etc. > > > > > >> >> > > > > > >> >> Max. > > > > > >> >> > > > > > >> >> |Thanks Max, a very timely message for my wife. Her Card just insisted she be > > > > > >> >> |on statins and I asked her if he did a family HX. He didn't but if he had he > > > > > >> >> |would have found her Dad died at 84, her Mom at 93 and her Grandmother at > > > > > >> >> |97. She is the youngest of 8 and 7 are still living, one brother died of colon > > > > > >> >> |cancer. Of course maybe he just wants to make sure she doesn't die from > > > > > >> >> |heart attack, it'll be listed as complications due to DM! I printed it and > > > > > >> >> |suggested she discuss it with him! > > > > > >> >> | > > > > > >> >> |.... > > > > > >> >> | > > > > > >> >> > > > > > >> >> > > > > > >> >> > > > > > >> >> > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Reply to sender | Reply to group | Reply via web post | Start a New Topic > > Messages in this topic (30) > > RECENT ACTIVITY: New Members 6 New Files 1 > > Visit Your Group > > Switch to: >

January 28, 2012

The BMI issue has to do with the regression, relief from or cure of DM. If one can get their BMI below 25 then many will no longer "have" DM. Some DM will go away before that BMI is reached. Everyone is different. So the ultimate way to test if your DM is due to overfeeding you genome is to reduce the BMI till the HbA1c becomes normal. This may well occur before 25 is reached. CE Grim MD On Jan 26, 2012, at 8:57 PM, wrote: The main thing I remember my Mother teaching me is: "Opinions are like noses, everybody has one!" As for bees, I have no interest in attracting them because both of my sons are allergic to them! In fact I almost lost my second son when he was about 10 to them! Got to the ER w/minutes to spare! I only use vinegar so I don't have to use medicated chicken food! How were your poisoned eggs this morning? Mine were all natural! (A capfull of vinegar in their water now and then prevents a prasite from attaching to their intestines because the acid burns their legs off!) So you have determined that responding to "slamming the fat old man" has nothing to do with the information, a position I obviously agree with, but if you take a shot at me I was trained to shoot back! (Not by mother but by a famous Uncle!) > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> >Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication > > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> Did you see any studies on that or it's just your experience and intuition, Max? > > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> I am very curious because I always suspected that the large dosage different HTN medications caused my diabetes. I like you started Metformin about 10 years being on HTN medications. No family history of diabetes, and I even didn't have marginally numbers. My experience with Metformin is different. Even if I take 2000 mg, my appetite is the same :-) > > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> Natalia > > > > > > > >> >> From: StudyCircle <studycircle@> > > > > > > > >> >> hyperaldosteronism <mailto:hyperaldosteronism%40><mailto:hyperaldosteronism%40> > > > > > > > >> >> Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 6:08 PM > > > > > > > >> >> Subject: RE: Re: Statins linked to diabetes > > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> Hi , > > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> I am not sure about the details on this research but I suspect definition of diabetic these days is GLUCF>7.0 mmol/L = 126 mg/dL . Assuming that she starts statins now she perhaps get to 16 in some 5 years and 126 is not so bad because with some Metformin it can be overcome and another 5 years to level that she might need insulin...something like this...so it's good idea to see what level of diabetics disorder and in how many years one get to such level. > > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication...of course my GLUCF was always marginally high but I was not taking Metformin...and I suspect Metformin reduced my appetite considerably because I am finding myself unable to finish a half plate of food that until last year I could easily finish ! not bad... > > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> So basically I assume becoming diabetic is gradual and not as bad as HTN if it is taken care medically, i.e., not allowing glaucoma or cataract ...etc. > > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> Max. > > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> |Thanks Max, a very timely message for my wife. Her Card just insisted she be > > > > > > > >> >> |on statins and I asked her if he did a family HX. He didn't but if he had he > > > > > > > >> >> |would have found her Dad died at 84, her Mom at 93 and her Grandmother at > > > > > > > >> >> |97. She is the youngest of 8 and 7 are still living, one brother died of colon > > > > > > > >> >> |cancer. Of course maybe he just wants to make sure she doesn't die from > > > > > > > >> >> |heart attack, it'll be listed as complications due to DM! I printed it and > > > > > > > >> >> |suggested she discuss it with him! > > > > > > > >> >> | > > > > > > > >> >> |.... > > > > > > > >> >> | > > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Reply to sender | Reply to group | Reply via web post | Start a New Topic > > > > Messages in this topic (30) > > > > RECENT ACTIVITY: New Members 6 New Files 1 > > > > Visit Your Group > > > > Switch to: > > > > > >

January 28, 2012

Might or might not. Only way to tell is to step it down and then recheck HbA1c in 3 months. Or if you do BS then check that. If K a lot better than when 1st Dxed then can prob step down. On Jan 23, 2012, at 11:52 AM, Natalia Kamneva wrote: But 6.4 is with 2000 mg metformin. If I stepped down metformin, would my diabetes became worse? Natalia From: Clarence Grim <lowerbp2@...> "hyperaldosteronism " <hyperaldosteronism > Sent: Monday, January 16, 2012 3:43 PM Subject: Re: Re: Statins linked to diabetes So no diabetes now? Consider stepping down DM MEDS if any. May your pressure be low!CE Grim MS, MDSpecializing in DifficultHypertensionOn Jan 16, 2012, at 11:54, Natalia Kamneva <natalia_kamneva@...> wrote: BMI is 26.5; Last Hb1C is 6.4. Thank you, Natalia From: Clarence Grim <lowerbp2@...> hyperaldosteronism Cc: Clarence Grim <lowerbp2@...> Sent: Saturday, January 14, 2012 3:06 AM Subject: Re: Re: Statins linked to diabetes Unless your BMI is â‰¤25 they your DM is mostly caused by eating too much.What was your HbA1c. I forgot.CE Grim MDOn Jan 12, 2012, at 1:08 PM, Natalia Kamneva wrote: >Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medicationDid you see any studies on that or it's just your experience and intuition, Max?I am very curious because I always suspected that the large dosage different HTN medications caused my diabetes. I like you started Metformin about 10 years being on HTN medications. No family history of diabetes, and I even didn't have marginally numbers. My experience with Metformin is different. Even if I take 2000 mg, my appetite is the same :-) Natalia From: StudyCircle <studycircle@...> hyperaldosteronism Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 6:08 PM Subject: RE: Re: Statins linked to diabetes Hi , I am not sure about the details on this research but I suspect definition of diabetic these days is GLUCF>7.0 mmol/L = 126 mg/dL . Assuming that she starts statins now she perhaps get to 16 in some 5 years and 126 is not so bad because with some Metformin it can be overcome and another 5 years to level that she might need insulin...something like this...so it's good idea to see what level of diabetics disorder and in how many years one get to such level. Using HTN medication also is causing diabetes and I had to start Metformin after about 10 years on HTN medication...of course my GLUCF was always marginally high but I was not taking Metformin...and I suspect Metformin reduced my appetite considerably because I am finding myself unable to finish a half plate of food that until last year I could easily finish ! not bad... So basically I assume becoming diabetic is gradual and not as bad as HTN if it is taken care medically, i.e., not allowing glaucoma or cataract ...etc. Max. |Thanks Max, a very timely message for my wife. Her Card just insisted she be |on statins and I asked her if he did a family HX. He didn't but if he had he |would have found her Dad died at 84, her Mom at 93 and her Grandmother at |97. She is the youngest of 8 and 7 are still living, one brother died of colon |cancer. Of course maybe he just wants to make sure she doesn't die from |heart attack, it'll be listed as complications due to DM! I printed it and |suggested she discuss it with him! | |.... |

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