Re: Wagers for AS shuting down??

July 4, 2007

Jesus, Hank. You sure are full of yourself - your a legend in your

own mind (to borrow a phrase).

By the way, nice political stump speech, however, you failed to

answer my question on how to adequately test vaccines.

Let's try one more time, shall we?

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > As one who was never involved in NAAR or AS, I

think what

> she

> > > > said was

> > > > > > > > not arrogant or mean-spirited. What I took she was

saying

> is

> > > > there

> > > > > > > > hasn't been enough progress and if those who have

been

> using the

> > > > > > > > research money in a certain direction can't change

course,

> then

> > > > let

> > > > > > > > someone else. IMO, her statement wasn't toward

people, it

> was

> > > > toward

> > > > > > > > answers. She even came back & said it wasn't her

intent.

> Saying

> > > > > > > > answers need to be found isn't to me arrogant.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I totally understand what your saying that grant

money

> often has

> > > > > > > > stipulations attached and genetic does have a

place. But,

> only a

> > > > part

> > > > > > > > of the place. As I've said before, no more than 33%

> genetic, at

> > > > least

> > > > > > > > 33% environmental, and 33% behavioral, then you'll

have a

> good

> > > > > > > > blending of how to help the kids.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Debi

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

> ----------------------------------------------------------\

> ------

> > Luggage? GPS? Comic books?

> > Check out fitting gifts for grads at Search.

> >

>

July 4, 2007

OK but to be fair I don't say I don't believe a connection exists as if

my mind is made up. I just don't know if the connection causes autism.

However, I am open to all possibilities.

Marty

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > As one who was never involved in NAAR or AS, I

> think

> > > > > what

> > > > > > she

> > > > > > > > > said was

> > > > > > > > > > > > > not arrogant or mean-spirited. What I took she

> was

> > > > > saying

> > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > there

> > > > > > > > > > > > > hasn't been enough progress and if those who

> have

> > > been

> > > > > > using the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > research money in a certain direction can't

> change

> > > > > course,

> > > > > > then

> > > > > > > > > let

> > > > > > > > > > > > > someone else. IMO, her statement wasn't toward

> > > people,

> > > > > it

> > > > > > was

> > > > > > > > > toward

> > > > > > > > > > > > > answers. She even came back & said it wasn't

her

> > > > intent.

> > > > > > Saying

> > > > > > > > > > > > > answers need to be found isn't to me arrogant.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > I totally understand what your saying that

grant

> > > money

> > > > > > often has

> > > > > > > > > > > > > stipulations attached and genetic does have a

> place.

> > > > > But,

> > > > > > only a

> > > > > > > > > part

> > > > > > > > > > > > > of the place. As I've said before, no more

than

> 33%

> > > > > > genetic, at

> > > > > > > > > least

> > > > > > > > > > > > > 33% environmental, and 33% behavioral, then

> you'll

> > > > have

> > > > > a

> > > > > > good

> > > > > > > > > > > > > blending of how to help the kids.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Debi

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------\

> > > > > > ------

> > > > > > > Luggage? GPS? Comic books?

> > > > > > > Check out fitting gifts for grads at Search.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

July 4, 2007

Yes, you are correct ... " so true " . Now, I could ponder whether

there is an unspoken message in there from you. However, it is the

4th after all and a beautiful day at that so time is of the essence.

Instead, I will just say this.

If you are one of those people who is open-minded to the idea that

vaccines can do damage to developing immune systems but you are

holding back from a view of certainty. Then by all means... carry

on. Keep up to date with the latest studies, etc. Wonderful. Be my

guest. If, on the other hand, you are one of the nitwits who are

(for reasons unknown) doing your best to muddy the waters and

condemning those who know what a disgrace this mess is (many of us

here), then by all means... Go pound sand.

Have a nice day!

Harm , " martinx2us " <martyx2@...> wrote:

>

> So true!!

>

> Marty

>

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > As one who was never involved in NAAR or AS, I think

what

> > she

> > > > > > said was

> > > > > > > > not arrogant or mean-spirited. What I took she was

saying

> > is

> > > there

> > > > > > > > hasn't been enough progress and if those who have been

> > using

> > > the

> > > > > > > > research money in a certain direction can't change

course,

> > > then

> > > > > > let

> > > > > > > > someone else. IMO, her statement wasn't toward

people, it

> > was

> > > > > > toward

> > > > > > > > answers. She even came back & said it wasn't her

intent.

> > > Saying

> > > > > > > > answers need to be found isn't to me arrogant.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I totally understand what your saying that grant money

> > often

> > > has

> > > > > > > > stipulations attached and genetic does have a place.

But,

> > only

> > > a

> > > > > > part

> > > > > > > > of the place. As I've said before, no more than 33%

> > genetic,

> > > at

> > > > > > least

> > > > > > > > 33% environmental, and 33% behavioral, then you'll

have a

> > good

> > > > > > > > blending of how to help the kids.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Debi

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

_________________________________________________________________

> > > > http://liveearth.msn.com

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

July 4, 2007

I'd love to see a research project on the Autism Mercury group to see

how many people have tried Andy Cutler's protocol, how many rounds of

chelation they did, what drugs they used and what symptoms improved

or not. You wouldn't need to be a scientist, just a good record

keeper/statistician.

> > > > >

> > > > > If Bob and Suzanne had any integrity they would walk

> > away from

> > > > > AS and expose the group for what it really is. Oh, but the

> > $$$$$$$$

> > > > > seems to get in the way. Maybe they are taking their

chances

> > with the

> > > > > bouncer at the Pearly Gates.

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

July 4, 2007

Geez... the nuts are out today. Helena, what's your answer? What do

YOU think we should do to adequately test vaccines? Do you think it

is a good idea to simply start forcing them on unsuspecting parents

and their babies? Was it/is it a good idea to inject babies with the

Hep B vaccine in their first days of life? How about a flu shot

during pregnancy? Good idea, Batty?

Feel free to go pound sand too (if applicable).

Get me out.........

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > As one who was never involved in NAAR or AS, I

> think what

> > she

> > > > > said was

> > > > > > > > > not arrogant or mean-spirited. What I took she

was

> saying

> > is

> > > > > there

> > > > > > > > > hasn't been enough progress and if those who have

> been

> > using the

> > > > > > > > > research money in a certain direction can't

change

> course,

> > then

> > > > > let

> > > > > > > > > someone else. IMO, her statement wasn't toward

> people, it

> > was

> > > > > toward

> > > > > > > > > answers. She even came back & said it wasn't her

> intent.

> > Saying

> > > > > > > > > answers need to be found isn't to me arrogant.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I totally understand what your saying that grant

> money

> > often has

> > > > > > > > > stipulations attached and genetic does have a

> place. But,

> > only a

> > > > > part

> > > > > > > > > of the place. As I've said before, no more than

33%

> > genetic, at

> > > > > least

> > > > > > > > > 33% environmental, and 33% behavioral, then

you'll

> have a

> > good

> > > > > > > > > blending of how to help the kids.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Debi

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > ----------------------------------------------------------\

> > ------

> > > Luggage? GPS? Comic books?

> > > Check out fitting gifts for grads at Search.

> > >

> >

>

July 4, 2007

Harry, you questions are very legitimate. Why not write to Andy Shih at AS and ask for that information. I would think that as a public charity you should be entitled to such. I know for a fact that when Andy was at NAAR that type of information was kept in a spreadsheet.

It might also be interesting for someone to stop by the NYC office to read their board minutes, I believe those are open for public inspection.

Marty

>> > >> > If we collectively as Parents of Autistic Children present to AS a > legitimate project and follow the grant >submission process and protocol and the > funds are then denied then I will join in on railing against AS >as a shill and > a front for evil forces.> >> > Chris> > > > I'm just wondering if there is a mechanism for looking at the > studies/proposals that Autism Speaks has denied funding for? I would guess they get a fair > number of grant requests that they deem unworthy. Do we know of any? What > areas of study have they already rejected? Maybe if we knew the answers to these > questions, and a few others I can't think of right now, we could save the > time and effort of submitting a grant to a predetermined outcome. > > I would rather donate to an independent study anyway. > > Harry H.> > > > > ************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.>

July 4, 2007

In case anyone needs it.

Andy Shih, Vice President of Scientific AffairsPhone: (646) 367-5336 E-mail: ashih@...> >> >> > >> > > If we collectively as Parents of Autistic Children present to AS a> > legitimate project and follow the grant >submission process and> protocol and the> > funds are then denied then I will join in on railing against AS >as a> shill and> > a front for evil forces.> > >> > > Chris> >> >> >> > I'm just wondering if there is a mechanism for looking at the> > studies/proposals that Autism Speaks has denied funding for? I would> guess they get a fair> > number of grant requests that they deem unworthy. Do we know of any?> What> > areas of study have they already rejected? Maybe if we knew the> answers to these> > questions, and a few others I can't think of right now, we could save> the> > time and effort of submitting a grant to a predetermined outcome.> >> > I would rather donate to an independent study anyway.> >> > Harry H.> >> >> >> >> > ************************************** See what's free at> http://www.aol.com.> >>

July 4, 2007

I completely concur with you, Henry.

When you have one of the world's leading mercury researchers (Dr.

Boyd Haley) on our side, someone who has nothing to gain and

everything to lose by publicly speaking out about the connection

between thimerosal, it just seems like a no brainer.

And there are so many other respected researchers whose work supports

a link (Dr. Deth, Dr. Jill , Dr. Burbacher...I could go on and

on). There is just so much evidence.

Notice who is publicly stating there is no link....people like

Offit and Gerberding. Many letters I read on the subject on

the other side are written by AAP doctors, those who receive research

money from vaccine manufacturers, etc., and those who just have not

read the evidence. Many of those who know the truth have been lead

to believe that they are actually saving children by participating in

the cover up by being convinced that parents won't vaccinate should

the truth be known publicly.

I think denial is a very powerful thing, let's face it, the truth is

harsh. It was so hard for me to think I allowed this to happen to my

precious child; so hard to learn that my trusted pediatrician did not

know what was best; so disturbing to know that his professional

organization is outright lying to him; so painful to realize how much

we've lost. It has really rocked my world. I suspect that some

people can't handle that; it's so much easier to believe that their

child's autism was a genetic fluke of some sort.

And then there's the recovered/recovering kids, including my child

who are excreting mercury and heavy metals after treatment....

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > As one who was never involved in NAAR or

AS, I

> think

> > > > > what

> > > > > > she

> > > > > > > > > said was

> > > > > > > > > > > > > not arrogant or mean-spirited. What I

took she

> was

> > > > > saying

> > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > there

> > > > > > > > > > > > > hasn't been enough progress and if those

who

> have

> > > been

> > > > > > using the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > research money in a certain direction

can't

> change

> > > > > course,

> > > > > > then

> > > > > > > > > let

> > > > > > > > > > > > > someone else. IMO, her statement wasn't

toward

> > > people,

> > > > > it

> > > > > > was

> > > > > > > > > toward

> > > > > > > > > > > > > answers. She even came back & said it

wasn't her

> > > > intent.

> > > > > > Saying

> > > > > > > > > > > > > answers need to be found isn't to me

arrogant.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > I totally understand what your saying

that grant

> > > money

> > > > > > often has

> > > > > > > > > > > > > stipulations attached and genetic does

have a

> place.

> > > > > But,

> > > > > > only a

> > > > > > > > > part

> > > > > > > > > > > > > of the place. As I've said before, no

more than

> 33%

> > > > > > genetic, at

> > > > > > > > > least

> > > > > > > > > > > > > 33% environmental, and 33% behavioral,

then

> you'll

> > > > have

> > > > > a

> > > > > > good

> > > > > > > > > > > > > blending of how to help the kids.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Debi

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------

--\

> > > > > > ------

> > > > > > > Luggage? GPS? Comic books?

> > > > > > > Check out fitting gifts for grads at Search.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

July 4, 2007

In order to be taken seriously beyond our walls this would need to be

done with the scientific/medical community as well not as an

antedotal record keeping, and most certainly if we wanted AS to fund

it, which is what and I were talking about.

Would Andy Cutler be interested in forming a grant request to obtain

funds to due such a research project?

I am going to start researching the protocol for applying to AS for

research grant funds, so if we can come to some concensus on projects

this group is interested in we will know how to go after the money to

fund it.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > If Bob and Suzanne had any integrity they would

walk

> > > away from

> > > > > > AS and expose the group for what it really is. Oh, but

the

> > > $$$$$$$$

> > > > > > seems to get in the way. Maybe they are taking their

> chances

> > > with the

> > > > > > bouncer at the Pearly Gates.

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

July 4, 2007

Marty

the email address got cut off - is it ashih@... ?

> > >

> > > >

> > > > If we collectively as Parents of Autistic Children present to

AS a

> > > legitimate project and follow the grant >submission process and

> > protocol and the

> > > funds are then denied then I will join in on railing against AS

>as

> a

> > shill and

> > > a front for evil forces.

> > > >

> > > > Chris

> > >

> > > I'm just wondering if there is a mechanism for looking at the

> > > studies/proposals that Autism Speaks has denied funding for? I

would

> > guess they get a fair

> > > number of grant requests that they deem unworthy. Do we know of

any?

> > What

> > > areas of study have they already rejected? Maybe if we knew the

> > answers to these

> > > questions, and a few others I can't think of right now, we could

> save

> > the

> > > time and effort of submitting a grant to a predetermined

outcome.

> > >

> > > I would rather donate to an independent study anyway.

> > >

> > > Harry H.

> > >

> > > ************************************** See what's free at

> > http://www.aol.com.

> > >

> >

>

July 4, 2007

Sorry about that it is @.org ashih@... .

Let us know what he says or if he bothers to respond. I have other addresses if you don't get what you are looking for.

Marty

> > > >> > > >> > > > >> > > > > If we collectively as Parents of Autistic Children present to > AS a> > > > legitimate project and follow the grant >submission process and> > > protocol and the> > > > funds are then denied then I will join in on railing against AS > >as> > a> > > shill and> > > > a front for evil forces.> > > > >> > > > > Chris> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > > I'm just wondering if there is a mechanism for looking at the> > > > studies/proposals that Autism Speaks has denied funding for? I > would> > > guess they get a fair> > > > number of grant requests that they deem unworthy. Do we know of > any?> > > What> > > > areas of study have they already rejected? Maybe if we knew the> > > answers to these> > > > questions, and a few others I can't think of right now, we could> > save> > > the> > > > time and effort of submitting a grant to a predetermined > outcome.> > > >> > > > I would rather donate to an independent study anyway.> > > >> > > > Harry H.> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > > ************************************** See what's free at> > > http://www.aol.com.> > > >> > >> >>

July 4, 2007

The funny thing is -- if you ask them why they don't fund any kind of

biomed research (biomed meaning chelation/mercury toxicity and the

like) they have a standard canned answer --

" We really want to, but we haven't gotten any good proposals. "

It would be nice if they made ALL OF THE PROPOSALS PUBLIC so we can

see if they're lying. My guess is that they are.

I've been hearing that excuse since I started doing the walks some 8

odd years ago. Surely in the last 8 years someone would have proposed

research that meets their Princeton ego standards??

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > As one who was never involved in NAAR or AS, I think

> what

> > she

> > > > > said was

> > > > > > > > > not arrogant or mean-spirited. What I took she was

> saying

> > is

> > > > > there

> > > > > > > > > hasn't been enough progress and if those who have been

> > using the

> > > > > > > > > research money in a certain direction can't change

> course,

> > then

> > > > > let

> > > > > > > > > someone else. IMO, her statement wasn't toward people,

> it

> > was

> > > > > toward

> > > > > > > > > answers. She even came back & said it wasn't her intent.

> > Saying

> > > > > > > > > answers need to be found isn't to me arrogant.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I totally understand what your saying that grant money

> > often has

> > > > > > > > > stipulations attached and genetic does have a place.

> But,

> > only a

> > > > > part

> > > > > > > > > of the place. As I've said before, no more than 33%

> > genetic, at

> > > > > least

> > > > > > > > > 33% environmental, and 33% behavioral, then you'll have

> a

> > good

> > > > > > > > > blending of how to help the kids.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Debi

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > ----------------------------------------------------------\

> > ------

> > > Luggage? GPS? Comic books?

> > > Check out fitting gifts for grads at Search.

> > >

> >

>

> ---------------------------------

> Luggage? GPS? Comic books?

> Check out fitting gifts for grads at Search.

>

July 4, 2007

Hey Marty:

I sometimes feel like you're defending and cheerleading for AS as

well. I think the problem is that you're still in the " Surely they

can't be....... " stage.

I got past that stage. Come over to the dark side.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > As one who was never involved in NAAR or AS, I think

> > what

> > > she

> > > > > > said was

> > > > > > > > > > not arrogant or mean-spirited. What I took she was

> > saying

> > > is

> > > > > > there

> > > > > > > > > > hasn't been enough progress and if those who have been

> > > using the

> > > > > > > > > > research money in a certain direction can't change

> > course,

> > > then

> > > > > > let

> > > > > > > > > > someone else. IMO, her statement wasn't toward people,

> > it

> > > was

> > > > > > toward

> > > > > > > > > > answers. She even came back & said it wasn't her

> intent.

> > > Saying

> > > > > > > > > > answers need to be found isn't to me arrogant.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > I totally understand what your saying that grant money

> > > often has

> > > > > > > > > > stipulations attached and genetic does have a place.

> > But,

> > > only a

> > > > > > part

> > > > > > > > > > of the place. As I've said before, no more than 33%

> > > genetic, at

> > > > > > least

> > > > > > > > > > 33% environmental, and 33% behavioral, then you'll

> have

> > a

> > > good

> > > > > > > > > > blending of how to help the kids.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Debi

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > ----------------------------------------------------------\

> > > ------

> > > > Luggage? GPS? Comic books?

> > > > Check out fitting gifts for grads at Search.

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

July 4, 2007

: You're right, Marty is among AS's biggest defenders and cheerleaders. He talks out of both sides of his mouth. autismlink <cindy@...> wrote: Hey Marty:I sometimes feel like you're defending and cheerleading for AS aswell. I think the problem is that you're still in the "Surely theycan't be......." stage.I got past that stage. Come over to the dark side.> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > As one who was never involved in NAAR or AS, I think> > what> > > she> > > > > > said was> > > > > > > > > > not arrogant or mean-spirited. What I took she was> > saying> > > is>

> > > > > there> > > > > > > > > > hasn't been enough progress and if those who have been> > > using the> > > > > > > > > > research money in a certain direction can't change> > course,> > > then> > > > > > let> > > > > > > > > > someone else. IMO, her statement wasn't toward people,> > it> > > was> > > > > > toward> > > > > > > > > > answers. She even came back & said it wasn't her> intent.> > > Saying> > > > > > > > > > answers need to be found isn't to me arrogant.> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > I totally understand what your saying that grant money> > > often has> >

> > > > > > > > stipulations attached and genetic does have a place.> > But,> > > only a> > > > > > part> > > > > > > > > > of the place. As I've said before, no more than 33%> > > genetic, at> > > > > > least> > > > > > > > > > 33% environmental, and 33% behavioral, then you'll> have> > a> > > good> > > > > > > > > > blending of how to help the kids.> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > Debi> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > >

>> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > ----------------------------------------------------------\> > > ------> > > > Luggage? GPS? Comic books?> > > > Check out fitting gifts for grads at Search.> > > >> > >> >>

Building a website is a piece of cake. Small Business gives you all the tools to get online.

July 4, 2007

Not sure why the e-mail address it keesp getting cut off. Go to http://www.autismspeaks.org/contact/index.php

and get it off the list.

Marty

> > > > >> > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > If we collectively as Parents of Autistic Children present to> > AS a> > > > > legitimate project and follow the grant >submission process and> > > > protocol and the> > > > > funds are then denied then I will join in on railing against AS> > >as> > > a> > > > shill and> > > > > a front for evil forces.> > > > > >> > > > > > Chris> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > > I'm just wondering if there is a mechanism for looking at the> > > > > studies/proposals that Autism Speaks has denied funding for? I> > would> > > > guess they get a fair> > > > > number of grant requests that they deem unworthy. Do we know of> > any?> > > > What> > > > > areas of study have they already rejected? Maybe if we knew the> > > > answers to these> > > > > questions, and a few others I can't think of right now, we could> > > save> > > > the> > > > > time and effort of submitting a grant to a predetermined> > outcome.> > > > >> > > > > I would rather donate to an independent study anyway.> > > > >> > > > > Harry H.> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > > ************************************** See what's free at> > > > http://www.aol.com.> > > > >> > > >> > >> >>

July 4, 2007

When I was with NAAR we use dot get copies on CD of all grant proposals.

I cannot recall anything submitted in the realm of what is being

discussed today and is needed.

Now you can take as a defending NAAR or AS or consider the truth in what

is being said and take it for what is is worth. That being said, I

would still pursue seeing what came in this year to AS.

Marty

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > As one who was never involved in NAAR or AS, I think

> > what

> > > she

> > > > > > said was

> > > > > > > > > > not arrogant or mean-spirited. What I took she was

> > saying

> > > is

> > > > > > there

> > > > > > > > > > hasn't been enough progress and if those who have

been

> > > using the

> > > > > > > > > > research money in a certain direction can't change

> > course,

> > > then

> > > > > > let

> > > > > > > > > > someone else. IMO, her statement wasn't toward

people,

> > it

> > > was

> > > > > > toward

> > > > > > > > > > answers. She even came back & said it wasn't her

intent.

> > > Saying

> > > > > > > > > > answers need to be found isn't to me arrogant.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > I totally understand what your saying that grant

money

> > > often has

> > > > > > > > > > stipulations attached and genetic does have a place.

> > But,

> > > only a

> > > > > > part

> > > > > > > > > > of the place. As I've said before, no more than 33%

> > > genetic, at

> > > > > > least

> > > > > > > > > > 33% environmental, and 33% behavioral, then you'll

have

> > a

> > > good

> > > > > > > > > > blending of how to help the kids.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Debi

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > ----------------------------------------------------------\

> > > ------

> > > > Luggage? GPS? Comic books?

> > > > Check out fitting gifts for grads at Search.

> > > >

> > >

> >

> > ---------------------------------

> > Luggage? GPS? Comic books?

> > Check out fitting gifts for grads at Search.

> >

>

July 4, 2007

it always seems that individuals like you who hide their true

identity are so insightful. Where would everyone be without your

wonderful contributions?

Marty

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > As one who was never involved in NAAR or AS, I

think

> > > what

> > > > she

> > > > > > > said was

> > > > > > > > > > > not arrogant or mean-spirited. What I took she was

> > > saying

> > > > is

> > > > > > > there

> > > > > > > > > > > hasn't been enough progress and if those who have

been

> > > > using the

> > > > > > > > > > > research money in a certain direction can't change

> > > course,

> > > > then

> > > > > > > let

> > > > > > > > > > > someone else. IMO, her statement wasn't toward

people,

> > > it

> > > > was

> > > > > > > toward

> > > > > > > > > > > answers. She even came back & said it wasn't her

> > intent.

> > > > Saying

> > > > > > > > > > > answers need to be found isn't to me arrogant.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > I totally understand what your saying that grant

money

> > > > often has

> > > > > > > > > > > stipulations attached and genetic does have a

place.

> > > But,

> > > > only a

> > > > > > > part

> > > > > > > > > > > of the place. As I've said before, no more than

33%

> > > > genetic, at

> > > > > > > least

> > > > > > > > > > > 33% environmental, and 33% behavioral, then you'll

> > have

> > > a

> > > > good

> > > > > > > > > > > blending of how to help the kids.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Debi

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > ----------------------------------------------------------\

> > > > ------

> > > > > Luggage? GPS? Comic books?

> > > > > Check out fitting gifts for grads at Search.

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

> ---------------------------------

> Building a website is a piece of cake.

> Small Business gives you all the tools to get online.

>

July 5, 2007

Andy Cutler would be perfect.

Re: Wagers for AS shuting down??

In order to be taken seriously beyond our walls this would need to be done with the scientific/medical community as well not as an antedotal record keeping, and most certainly if we wanted AS to fund it, which is what and I were talking about.Would Andy Cutler be interested in forming a grant request to obtain funds to due such a research project?I am going to start researching the protocol for applying to AS for research grant funds, so if we can come to some concensus on projects this group is interested in we will know how to go after the money to fund it.> > > > > >> > > > > > If Bob and Suzanne had any integrity they would walk > > > away from> > > > > > AS and expose the group for what it really is. Oh, but the > > > $$$$$$$$> > > > > > seems to get in the way. Maybe they are taking their > chances > > > with the> > > > > > bouncer at the Pearly Gates. > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > >> >>

July 5, 2007

If this helps, most of the forms and information related to grants are on the following link.

http://www.autismspeaks.org/science/research/grants_program.php

Funding Your Research

On February 1, 2007, Autism Speaks and Cure Autism Now (CAN) completed their merger, uniting the nation's two leading autism advocacy organizations and their cutting-edge programs for research, treatment, and family services.To view Letter of Intent and Grant Application deadlines and/or apply for a grant online, click here. For information about our sponsored research, click here. One of our goals at Autism Speaks/Cure Autism Now is to identify and support promising research with the hope that results from these efforts will produce significant findings that will be reported in peer-reviewed journals. We also hope that grants we fund will lead to additional research support from government or other funding agencies. Since 1997, the organizations combined have committed over $89 million to fund over 737 research projects and fellowships. The investment in these research grants alone has been leveraged into nearly $153 million in NIH and other funding for the continuation of these scientific studies. We are committed to supporting all potential avenues of autism research and invite researchers to submit grant proposals covering a wide spectrum of ideas. Our funding mechanisms offer a variety of programs, most starting when the Requests for Applications (RFAs) for various programs are published. Before submitting an application for research support, an applicant must review the applicable RFA for all submission criteria. All proposals are carefully reviewed by our distinguished Scientific Advisory Board along with guest reviewers when additional areas of expertise are required.Autism Speaks Grant Review Process Research grants funded by Autism Speaks are peer-reviewed by a group of highly esteemed scientists and clinicians known as the Scientific Advisory Board (SAB). In addition to SAB members, proposals are sometimes reviewed by outside experts called ad-hoc reviewers. This is done to ensure that each proposal can be thoroughly and carefully reviewed by the appropriate experts in the field of study. All conflicts of interest by SAB members or ad hoc reviewers must be revealed prior to the panel review meeting held to evaluate and discuss all proposals. Conflicts of interest include, but are not limited to, employment at the same sponsoring institution and collaboration of recent or current research projects. During discussions of the scientific merit of the application, anyone with a conflict of interest is not permitted to participate in the discussion of the proposal, and asked to leave the room. All scientific discussion and evaluation of the funding proposal is conducted in the absence of reviewers who have declared a conflict of interest. The SAB and outside review panel is responsible for evaluating the scientific quality and merit of grant applications submitted to Autism Speaks. The SAB operates using the standard guidelines for scoring grant applications. All SAB recommendations are then reviewed by the Autism Speaks Scientific Advisory Committee (SAC), a group of scientific and medical experts who direct policies and research for Autism Speaks. Seven of the thirteen members of the SAC are parents of children with autism. All recommendations made by the SAC to Autism Speaks Board of Directors are based on scientific merit (as evaluated by the review panel), budgetary considerations and discussions of relevancy and priority. Final approval is required by the Autism Speaks Board of Directors before funding may occur. Availability of Funding for Autism Research Awards and Fellowships All proposals must be submitted online via this site. Through its various user-friendly features, applicants and corresponding host institutions can also monitor the status of their applications and interact with the Autism Speaks grant administration staff. For more details and instructions, please see the links below, as well as the Research and Fellowship Awards FAQ and Online Grant Administration System Help. Research Announcements:

Basic-Clinical Research 2007-2008 Cycle 1 (PDF)

Basic-Clinical Research 2007-2008 Cycle 2 (PDF)

Innovative Technology Award (PDF)

Opportunity and Bridge (PDF)

Pilot Study 2007-2008 Cycle 1 (PDF)

PiIot Study 2007-2008 Cycle 2 (PDF)

Research Award: Augmentation and Bridge (PDF)

Research Award: Physician's Investigator/Beg. Autism Research (PDF)

Fellowships Announcements:

Fellowship Award: Pre and Post Doctoral Mentor-based Fellowships (PDF)

Requirements and guidelines for the letter of intent and full proposal will be available when you log in to the GRANTS ADMINISTRATION SYSTEM. APPLY ONLINE. Electronic submissions are mandatory using the Grants site (http://grants.autismspeaks.org/research/login.asp).No paper or e-mailed applications will be accepted for upload. For any related inquiries, please contact us at:Autism Speaks, Princeton OfficeAttn: B. Kravitz, MA ParalegalAutism Speaks Grants Administration1060 State Road - 2nd floorPrinceton, NJ 08540grantadmin@...Phone: 609-228-7310, ext 7323Fax: 609-430-9163E-mail: grantadmin@...If you are an investigator interested in receiving news and updates about Autism Speaks funding opportunities, simply enter your information in our Investigator Registry and we will keep you informed via e-mail alerts and other mailings. Thank you for your interest in the Autism Speaks Research and Fellowship Awards. New Autism Speaks Travel Award AvailableInvestigators engaged in autism research or training can apply to Autism Speaks for an award to support travel to an approved professional meeting principally for the purpose of presenting original research results. Travel awards will be made primarily on the basis of need. Click here to review application criteria (PDF). New Autism Treatment Network 'Request for Applications' Announced Cure Autism Now and Autism Speaks are now requesting applications for participation in the Autism Treatment Network. The ATN is a network of treatment and research centers dedicated to improving medical care for children and adolescents with autism. The request solicits letters of intent for the Centers for Research and Treatment component of the ATN. To view the RFA, click here (PDF). To learn more about the ATN, visit the Autism Treatment Network website.

> > > > > > >> > > > > > > If Bob and Suzanne had any integrity they would > walk > > > > away from> > > > > > > AS and expose the group for what it really is. Oh, but > the > > > > $$$$$$$$> > > > > > > seems to get in the way. Maybe they are taking their > > chances > > > > with the> > > > > > > bouncer at the Pearly Gates. > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > >> >>

July 5, 2007

- I have this feeling about some local parents' involvement with the genetics research/autism agencies. They cannot extricate themselves from an organization that they had financial donorship recognition from. This is not a reflection of Marty. This is probably just human nature to remain attached to what you believed in your heart was right, gave time and $, then learned something is amiss.I am still trying to pry some people's fingers from the ledge. The fall is not far and it will only hurt for a second......... all of this being relative of course.Roxautismlink <cindy@...> wrote: Hey Marty: I sometimes feel like you're defending and cheerleading for AS as well. I think the problem is that you're still in the "Surely they can't be......." stage. I got past that stage. Come over to the dark side. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As one who was never involved in NAAR or AS, I think > > what > > > she > > > > > > said was > > > > > > > > > > not arrogant or mean-spirited. What I took she was > > saying > > > is > > > > > > there > > > > > > > > > > hasn't been enough progress and if those who have been > >

> using the > > > > > > > > > > research money in a certain direction can't change > > course, > > > then > > > > > > let > > > > > > > > > > someone else. IMO, her statement wasn't toward people, > > it > > > was > > > > > > toward > > > > > > > > > > answers. She even came back & said it wasn't her > intent. > > > Saying > > > > > > > > > > answers need to be found isn't to me arrogant. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I totally understand what your saying that grant money > > > often has > > > > > > > > > > stipulations attached and genetic does have a place. > > But, > > > only

a > > > > > > part > > > > > > > > > > of the place. As I've said before, no more than 33% > > > genetic, at > > > > > > least > > > > > > > > > > 33% environmental, and 33% behavioral, then you'll > have > > a > > > good > > > > > > > > > > blending of how to help the kids. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Debi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> ----------------------------------------------------------\ > > > ------ > > > > Luggage? GPS? Comic books? > > > > Check out fitting gifts for grads at Search. > > > > > > > > > >

Be a better Heartthrob. Get better relationship answers from someone who knows. Answers - Check it out.

July 5, 2007

Marty,

I sent Dr. Shih a polite request for a list of the research proposals not being funded. I will be surprised if I hear anything back. One never knows.

Since you have an established working relationship with him maybe you can intercede and get the information for the group.

I did notice that AS funded 52 proposals out of over 265 grant submissions. If we can get the list of rejects, there might be something in there that NAA, Safeminds, or ARI might want to spend a little money on. It's worth a shot.

In the meantime, on a personal note, I read your postings with great interest. It appears you have quite the background in the greater autism community. You seem more involved and aware than someone who prefers to sit on the fence, so to speak.

I quote you..."I live in the camp in which one is neither convinced nor unconvinced of any connection between vaccines and autism. While I neither defend nor advocate any position except to explore all possibilities I am often criticized by individuals who believe there is such a connection."

I would suspect that with your background, it is well past the time you should be convinced or unconvinced.

I certainly won't criticize you, I'll just pass along a friendly reminder. "When you straddle the fence, you run the risk of loosing your balance and falling off, and getting your balls ripped off". (A paraphrased quote from my old Drill Sergeant (?) at Ft. Leonard Wood, MO. 1967.)

Harry H.

See what's free at AOL.com.

July 5, 2007

Harry if you don't hear back let me know and I will try to follow-up

with other contacts I have.

I got a laugh out of your quite, perhaps the spikes in the fence hav

etoo good a grip on me.

You say " I would suspect that with your background, it is well past the

time you should be convinced or unconvinced. " I wish it were that

easy for me. As you may be aware I speak to many individuals on both

sides of the fence. Perhaps that is another problem. TMI Too much

information both good and bad. All I can say is that whenever I move

off the fence I will be honest and tell all where I fall. Hopefully in

one piece if the spikes on the fence let go!!

Marty

>

> Marty,

>

> I sent Dr. Shih a polite request for a list of the research proposals

not

> being funded. I will be surprised if I hear anything back. One never

knows.

>

> Since you have an established working relationship with him maybe you

can

> intercede and get the information for the group.

>

> I did notice that AS funded 52 proposals out of over 265 grant

submissions.

> If we can get the list of rejects, there might be something in there

that

> NAA, Safeminds, or ARI might want to spend a little money on. It's

worth a shot.

>

> In the meantime, on a personal note, I read your postings with great

> interest. It appears you have quite the background in the greater

autism community.

> You seem more involved and aware than someone who prefers to sit on

the

> fence, so to speak.

>

> I quote you... " I live in the camp in which one is neither convinced

nor

> unconvinced of any connection between vaccines and autism. While I

neither defend

> nor advocate any position except to explore all possibilities I am

often

> criticized by individuals who believe there is such a connection. "

>

> I would suspect that with your background, it is well past the time

you

> should be convinced or unconvinced.

>

> I certainly won't criticize you, I'll just pass along a friendly

reminder.

> " When you straddle the fence, you run the risk of loosing your balance

and

> falling off, and getting your balls ripped off " . (A paraphrased quote

from my

> old Drill Sergeant (?) at Ft. Leonard Wood, MO. 1967.)

>

> Harry H.

>

> ************************************** See what's free at

http://www.aol.com.

>

July 5, 2007

Remove mercury amalgams then treat Homeopathically, do natural chelation-eggs, cilantro tinc, chlorella, apple pectin. Since all of this is natural it takes a longer time than medical chelators

This way needs a professional Homeopath to get correct results.

There is a specific timing and protocol to follow. Remedies are used for the symptoms that pop up during clearing. Not a simple process. takes time..4 to 5 years. Well worth it. ng

Re: Wagers for AS shuting down??

I am very interested in that. Is there any information you can sharerelative to OCD and removal of mercury.ThanksMarty> > > > >> > > > > As one who was never involved in NAAR or AS, I think what shesaid> > was> > > > > not arrogant or mean-spirited. What I took she was saying isthere> > > > > hasn't been enough progress and if those who have been usingthe> > > > > research money in a certain direction can't change course,then> > let> > > > > someone else. IMO, her statement wasn't toward people, it was> > toward> > > > > answers. She even came back & said it wasn't her intent.Saying> > > > > answers need to be found isn't to me arrogant.> > > > >> > > > > I totally understand what your saying that grant money oftenhas> > > > > stipulations attached and genetic does have a place. But, onlya> > part> > > > > of the place. As I've said before, no more than 33% genetic,at> > least> > > > > 33% environmental, and 33% behavioral, then you'll have a good> > > > > blending of how to help the kids.> > > > >> > > > > Debi> > > > >> > > >> > >> >>

July 5, 2007

Yes...but...

It would be a fantastic read and something to hand out to interested people, kind of a SAMEASDAT publication. It's How the Soviets got underground info around when OFFICIAL channels were blocked to certain thoughts. ng

Re: Wagers for AS shuting down??

In order to be taken seriously beyond our walls this would need to be done with the scientific/medical community as well not as an antedotal record keeping, and most certainly if we wanted AS to fund it, which is what and I were talking about.Would Andy Cutler be interested in forming a grant request to obtain funds to due such a research project?I am going to start researching the protocol for applying to AS for research grant funds, so if we can come to some concensus on projects this group is interested in we will know how to go after the money to fund it.> > > > > >> > > > > > If Bob and Suzanne had any integrity they would walk > > > away from> > > > > > AS and expose the group for what it really is. Oh, but the > > > $$$$$$$$> > > > > > seems to get in the way. Maybe they are taking their > chances > > > with the> > > > > > bouncer at the Pearly Gates. > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > >> >>

July 5, 2007

,

Youre exactly right....I know for a fact that there is a certain

NJ State funded council, The Governors Council on Autism, that says

they never get any " good proposals " in regards to environmental

research....and this isnt just for research into vaccines......but

they have and they still dont fund it. I sat on the council for TAAP

one year and Ray Gallup had in the past for a few years, and nothing.

The proposals they receive are not made public until they agree to

fund them.....I could possibly be overstepping here since I am

talking about RFP's that I saw that were never made public but there

is one autism researcher at UMDNJ, Dr Jim Oleske, who has done

research similar to Andy Wakefield, that has tried to get funding

into environmental research, specifically autoimmune response to

environmental triggers and hes been shot down on more than one

occasion.....this is a world reknowned pediatric immunologist who

researched AIDS for years who has been shunned because he overstepped

the boundaries and went into a realm of scientific research that

pharmafia doesnt want anyone with clout to overstep.

Ellen

, " autismlink " <cindy@...> wrote:

>

> The funny thing is -- if you ask them why they don't fund any kind

of

> biomed research (biomed meaning chelation/mercury toxicity and the

> like) they have a standard canned answer --

>

> " We really want to, but we haven't gotten any good proposals. "

>

> It would be nice if they made ALL OF THE PROPOSALS PUBLIC so we can

> see if they're lying. My guess is that they are.

>

> I've been hearing that excuse since I started doing the walks some 8

> odd years ago. Surely in the last 8 years someone would have

proposed

> research that meets their Princeton ego standards??

>

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > As one who was never involved in NAAR or AS, I

think

> > what

> > > she

> > > > > > said was

> > > > > > > > > > not arrogant or mean-spirited. What I took she was

> > saying

> > > is

> > > > > > there

> > > > > > > > > > hasn't been enough progress and if those who have

been

> > > using the

> > > > > > > > > > research money in a certain direction can't change

> > course,

> > > then

> > > > > > let

> > > > > > > > > > someone else. IMO, her statement wasn't toward

people,

> > it

> > > was

> > > > > > toward

> > > > > > > > > > answers. She even came back & said it wasn't her

intent.

> > > Saying

> > > > > > > > > > answers need to be found isn't to me arrogant.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > I totally understand what your saying that grant

money

> > > often has

> > > > > > > > > > stipulations attached and genetic does have a

place.

> > But,

> > > only a

> > > > > > part

> > > > > > > > > > of the place. As I've said before, no more than

33%

> > > genetic, at

> > > > > > least

> > > > > > > > > > 33% environmental, and 33% behavioral, then

you'll have

> > a

> > > good

> > > > > > > > > > blending of how to help the kids.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Debi

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > ----------------------------------------------------------\

> > > ------

> > > > Luggage? GPS? Comic books?

> > > > Check out fitting gifts for grads at Search.

> > > >

> > >

> >

> > ---------------------------------

> > Luggage? GPS? Comic books?

> > Check out fitting gifts for grads at Search.

> >

>

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Re: Wagers for AS shuting down??

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