Re: Exercise and Heart Disease

[Guest guest]

Obviously they don't give them proper physicals.

I have to wonder about symptoms - no chest pains? - no shortness of breath? - no hypertension?

Regards.

[ ] Exercise and Heart Disease

Hi folks:So much for the idea that exercise helps prevent heart disease:http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,168601,00.htmlRodney.

[Guest guest]

Obviously they don't give them proper physicals.

I have to wonder about symptoms - no chest pains? - no shortness of breath? - no hypertension?

Regards.

[ ] Exercise and Heart Disease

Hi folks:So much for the idea that exercise helps prevent heart disease:http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,168601,00.htmlRodney.

[Guest guest]

You wondered if adipose tissue is an organ?

Biochim Biophys Acta. 2005 May 30;1740(2):287-92. Epub 2004 Dec 8.

Fatty acids and expression of adipokines.Drevon CA.Department of Nutrition, Institute of Basic Medical Sciences, University of Oslo, Oslo, Norway. c.a.drevon@...Adipose tissue has been recognised as the quantitatively most important energy store of the human body for many years, in addition to its functions as mechanical and thermic insulator. In mammals, the adipose organ is localised in several depots including white as well as brown adipose tissues. The largest depots are found subcutaneously and in the abdominal region. Several secretory proteins are synthesised in adipose tissue including leptin, resistin, adiponectin, tumor necrosis factor (TNFalpha), angiotensinogen, adipsin, acylation-stimulating protein, retinol-binding protein (RBP), interleukin (IL)-1b, IL-6, IL-8, IL-10, plasminogen activator inhibitor-1 (PAI-1), fasting-induced adipose factor, fibrinogen-angiopoietin-related protein, metallothionein, tissue factor (TF), complement C3, fibronectin, haptoglobin, entactin/nidogen, collagen VI alpha 3, pigment epithelium-derived factor (PEDF), hippocampal cholinergic neurostimulating peptide (HCNP), neutrophil gelatinase-associated lipocalin (NGAL) and adiponutrin. Fatty acids may influence the expression of adipokines like leptin, resistin or adiponectin directly by interaction with transcription factors, or indirectly via unknown mechanisms possibly linked to fatty acid oxidation, synthesis or storage. Because fatty acids are the main components of adipose tissue, it is of essential interest to clarify the biological effects of different types of fatty acids on the expression of relevant adipokines. PMID: 15949695

Regards.

[ ] Exercise and Heart Disease

Hi folks:So much for the idea that exercise helps prevent heart disease:http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,168601,00.htmlRodney.

[Guest guest]

You wondered if adipose tissue is an organ?

Biochim Biophys Acta. 2005 May 30;1740(2):287-92. Epub 2004 Dec 8.

Fatty acids and expression of adipokines.Drevon CA.Department of Nutrition, Institute of Basic Medical Sciences, University of Oslo, Oslo, Norway. c.a.drevon@...Adipose tissue has been recognised as the quantitatively most important energy store of the human body for many years, in addition to its functions as mechanical and thermic insulator. In mammals, the adipose organ is localised in several depots including white as well as brown adipose tissues. The largest depots are found subcutaneously and in the abdominal region. Several secretory proteins are synthesised in adipose tissue including leptin, resistin, adiponectin, tumor necrosis factor (TNFalpha), angiotensinogen, adipsin, acylation-stimulating protein, retinol-binding protein (RBP), interleukin (IL)-1b, IL-6, IL-8, IL-10, plasminogen activator inhibitor-1 (PAI-1), fasting-induced adipose factor, fibrinogen-angiopoietin-related protein, metallothionein, tissue factor (TF), complement C3, fibronectin, haptoglobin, entactin/nidogen, collagen VI alpha 3, pigment epithelium-derived factor (PEDF), hippocampal cholinergic neurostimulating peptide (HCNP), neutrophil gelatinase-associated lipocalin (NGAL) and adiponutrin. Fatty acids may influence the expression of adipokines like leptin, resistin or adiponectin directly by interaction with transcription factors, or indirectly via unknown mechanisms possibly linked to fatty acid oxidation, synthesis or storage. Because fatty acids are the main components of adipose tissue, it is of essential interest to clarify the biological effects of different types of fatty acids on the expression of relevant adipokines. PMID: 15949695

Regards.

[ ] Exercise and Heart Disease

Hi folks:So much for the idea that exercise helps prevent heart disease:http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,168601,00.htmlRodney.

[Guest guest]

Hi JW:

My recollection is that Clinton also was a regular exerciser. And he

had no overt symptoms until he was 90% occluded. (And since

presidents undergo regular exhaustive medical tests, presumably no

medically detectible signs either, at least while he was president).

I was first exposed to this phenomenon when, in the late 1960s, a

politician promoted as a likely future prime minister of Canada died

on the tennis court. All the obituaries remarked on what a great

athlete he had always been.

How many one mouse anecdotals does it take to make a *valid*

point? ; ^ )))

Of course this is the point Dr. Henry was making in 'The

Exercise Myth' ............... that " fitness has absolutely

nothing to do with health " .

Rodney.

--- In , " jwwright " <jwwright@e...>

wrote:

> Obviously they don't give them proper physicals.

>

> I have to wonder about symptoms - no chest pains? - no shortness of

breath? - no hypertension?

>

> Regards.

> [ ] Exercise and Heart Disease

>

>

> Hi folks:

>

> So much for the idea that exercise helps prevent heart disease:

>

> http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,168601,00.html

>

> Rodney.

[Guest guest]

Hi JW:

My recollection is that Clinton also was a regular exerciser. And he

had no overt symptoms until he was 90% occluded. (And since

presidents undergo regular exhaustive medical tests, presumably no

medically detectible signs either, at least while he was president).

I was first exposed to this phenomenon when, in the late 1960s, a

politician promoted as a likely future prime minister of Canada died

on the tennis court. All the obituaries remarked on what a great

athlete he had always been.

How many one mouse anecdotals does it take to make a *valid*

point? ; ^ )))

Of course this is the point Dr. Henry was making in 'The

Exercise Myth' ............... that " fitness has absolutely

nothing to do with health " .

Rodney.

--- In , " jwwright " <jwwright@e...>

wrote:

> Obviously they don't give them proper physicals.

>

> I have to wonder about symptoms - no chest pains? - no shortness of

breath? - no hypertension?

>

> Regards.

> [ ] Exercise and Heart Disease

>

>

> Hi folks:

>

> So much for the idea that exercise helps prevent heart disease:

>

> http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,168601,00.html

>

> Rodney.

[Guest guest]

Rodney,

Some heart disease is genetically caused. I had a marathon-running

friend who ate very healthily who died of a heart attack. His dad died

at an early age from a heart attack, too. Their bodies were

genetically predisposed to create cholesterol. My friend's doctor

told his wife that he wouldn't have lasted as long as he did if he

hadn't exercised so much, because exercise increased the diameter of

his lumens.

As for the football player, I don't think exercise can overcome the

deleterious effects of obesity, unless the subject is trying to eat

better and lose weight at the same time.

Diane

--- In , " Rodney " <perspect1111@y...>

wrote:

> Hi folks:

>

> So much for the idea that exercise helps prevent heart disease:

>

> http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,168601,00.html

>

> Rodney.

[Guest guest]

Rodney,

Some heart disease is genetically caused. I had a marathon-running

friend who ate very healthily who died of a heart attack. His dad died

at an early age from a heart attack, too. Their bodies were

genetically predisposed to create cholesterol. My friend's doctor

told his wife that he wouldn't have lasted as long as he did if he

hadn't exercised so much, because exercise increased the diameter of

his lumens.

As for the football player, I don't think exercise can overcome the

deleterious effects of obesity, unless the subject is trying to eat

better and lose weight at the same time.

Diane

--- In , " Rodney " <perspect1111@y...>

wrote:

> Hi folks:

>

> So much for the idea that exercise helps prevent heart disease:

>

> http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,168601,00.html

>

> Rodney.

[Guest guest]

On the other hand . . . it seems pretty clear that steady aerobic exercise helps to at least develop collateral circulation to some extent around the blockages in the main cardiac arteries, improving the likelihood of one's surviving a blockage/infarction, and the small HDL increases associated with exercise, while nothing close to those associated with CR, probably at least help an exerciser to swim somewhat against whatever current of crap she or he is throwing down her or his gullet.

What usually happens, in my observation, though, is that the great exercisers become enamored of the greater amounts of food they can thus consume without obvious aesthetic penalty, which then sets them up for the inner rot--especially if their habitual additional calorie burning becomes constrained by injury (which will likely not impede their consumption to a commensurate extent).

Maco [ ] Re: Exercise and Heart Disease Hi JW:My recollection is that Clinton also was a regular exerciser. And he had no overt symptoms until he was 90% occluded. (And since presidents undergo regular exhaustive medical tests, presumably no medically detectible signs either, at least while he was president).I was first exposed to this phenomenon when, in the late 1960s, a politician promoted as a likely future prime minister of Canada died on the tennis court. All the obituaries remarked on what a great athlete he had always been.How many one mouse anecdotals does it take to make a *valid* point? ; ^ )))Of course this is the point Dr. Henry was making in 'The Exercise Myth' ............... that "fitness has absolutely nothing to do with health".Rodney.> Obviously they don't give them proper physicals.> > I have to wonder about symptoms - no chest pains? - no shortness of breath? - no hypertension?> > Regards.> [ ] Exercise and Heart Disease> > > Hi folks:> > So much for the idea that exercise helps prevent heart disease:> > http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,168601,00.html> > Rodney.

[Guest guest]

On the other hand . . . it seems pretty clear that steady aerobic exercise helps to at least develop collateral circulation to some extent around the blockages in the main cardiac arteries, improving the likelihood of one's surviving a blockage/infarction, and the small HDL increases associated with exercise, while nothing close to those associated with CR, probably at least help an exerciser to swim somewhat against whatever current of crap she or he is throwing down her or his gullet.

What usually happens, in my observation, though, is that the great exercisers become enamored of the greater amounts of food they can thus consume without obvious aesthetic penalty, which then sets them up for the inner rot--especially if their habitual additional calorie burning becomes constrained by injury (which will likely not impede their consumption to a commensurate extent).

Maco [ ] Re: Exercise and Heart Disease Hi JW:My recollection is that Clinton also was a regular exerciser. And he had no overt symptoms until he was 90% occluded. (And since presidents undergo regular exhaustive medical tests, presumably no medically detectible signs either, at least while he was president).I was first exposed to this phenomenon when, in the late 1960s, a politician promoted as a likely future prime minister of Canada died on the tennis court. All the obituaries remarked on what a great athlete he had always been.How many one mouse anecdotals does it take to make a *valid* point? ; ^ )))Of course this is the point Dr. Henry was making in 'The Exercise Myth' ............... that "fitness has absolutely nothing to do with health".Rodney.> Obviously they don't give them proper physicals.> > I have to wonder about symptoms - no chest pains? - no shortness of breath? - no hypertension?> > Regards.> [ ] Exercise and Heart Disease> > > Hi folks:> > So much for the idea that exercise helps prevent heart disease:> > http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,168601,00.html> > Rodney.

[Guest guest]

Hi Diane:

So if exercise cannot overcome genes; cannot overcome a bad diet;

cannot overcome obesity; .......................

Rodney.

> > Hi folks:

> >

> > So much for the idea that exercise helps prevent heart disease:

> >

> > http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,168601,00.html

> >

> > Rodney.

[Guest guest]

I agree.

I think "fitness" is outliving those "athletes".

Now I'm pondering why adipose is so hard to get rid of. Maybe the related to that fat accumulated in arteries only mine is in adipose, fortunately. I have had stress tests. They're not that hard.

Today I switched to walking outside in the heat, even though pollen season is here.

I think there may be a seasonal accumulation of fat for winter. Anyway, I see adipose as a ANS (automatic nervous system) regulates adipose tissue metabolism.

Regards.

[ ] Exercise and Heart Disease> > > Hi folks:> > So much for the idea that exercise helps prevent heart disease:> > http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,168601,00.html> > Rodney.

[Guest guest]

I agree.

I think "fitness" is outliving those "athletes".

Now I'm pondering why adipose is so hard to get rid of. Maybe the related to that fat accumulated in arteries only mine is in adipose, fortunately. I have had stress tests. They're not that hard.

Today I switched to walking outside in the heat, even though pollen season is here.

I think there may be a seasonal accumulation of fat for winter. Anyway, I see adipose as a ANS (automatic nervous system) regulates adipose tissue metabolism.

Regards.

[ ] Exercise and Heart Disease> > > Hi folks:> > So much for the idea that exercise helps prevent heart disease:> > http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,168601,00.html> > Rodney.

[Guest guest]

Hi Diane:

So if exercise cannot overcome genes; cannot overcome a bad diet;

cannot overcome obesity; .......................

Rodney.

> > Hi folks:

> >

> > So much for the idea that exercise helps prevent heart disease:

> >

> > http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,168601,00.html

> >

> > Rodney.

[Guest guest]

Of course, we don't know much about the reasons why people die of heart attacks - I just don't want to die from doing something stupid.

A little aerobic makes sense - keeps the heart exercised. How much - that's another story.

Regards.

[ ] Re: Exercise and Heart Disease

Rodney,Some heart disease is genetically caused. I had a marathon-runningfriend who ate very healthily who died of a heart attack. His dad diedat an early age from a heart attack, too. Their bodies weregenetically predisposed to create cholesterol. My friend's doctortold his wife that he wouldn't have lasted as long as he did if hehadn't exercised so much, because exercise increased the diameter ofhis lumens.As for the football player, I don't think exercise can overcome thedeleterious effects of obesity, unless the subject is trying to eatbetter and lose weight at the same time. Diane--- In , "Rodney" <perspect1111@y...>wrote:> Hi folks:> > So much for the idea that exercise helps prevent heart disease:> > http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,168601,00.html> > Rodney.

[Guest guest]

Of course, we don't know much about the reasons why people die of heart attacks - I just don't want to die from doing something stupid.

A little aerobic makes sense - keeps the heart exercised. How much - that's another story.

Regards.

[ ] Re: Exercise and Heart Disease

Rodney,Some heart disease is genetically caused. I had a marathon-runningfriend who ate very healthily who died of a heart attack. His dad diedat an early age from a heart attack, too. Their bodies weregenetically predisposed to create cholesterol. My friend's doctortold his wife that he wouldn't have lasted as long as he did if hehadn't exercised so much, because exercise increased the diameter ofhis lumens.As for the football player, I don't think exercise can overcome thedeleterious effects of obesity, unless the subject is trying to eatbetter and lose weight at the same time. Diane--- In , "Rodney" <perspect1111@y...>wrote:> Hi folks:> > So much for the idea that exercise helps prevent heart disease:> > http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,168601,00.html> > Rodney.

[Guest guest]

--- In , " Rodney " <perspect1111@y...>

wrote:

> Hi Diane:

>

> So if exercise cannot overcome genes; cannot overcome a bad diet;

> cannot overcome obesity; .......................

>

> Rodney.

>

I think exercise did overcome his genetic predisposition to getting

clogged arteries, at least for awhile. And he had an excellent diet,

very low fat and very low calorie. He was 6'4 " and ate less than I

did (I'm 13 " inches shorter), so in essence he was doing CR, although

he didn't know it at the time. CR didn't help him either.

[Guest guest]

--- In , " Rodney " <perspect1111@y...>

wrote:

> Hi Diane:

>

> So if exercise cannot overcome genes; cannot overcome a bad diet;

> cannot overcome obesity; .......................

>

> Rodney.

>

I think exercise did overcome his genetic predisposition to getting

clogged arteries, at least for awhile. And he had an excellent diet,

very low fat and very low calorie. He was 6'4 " and ate less than I

did (I'm 13 " inches shorter), so in essence he was doing CR, although

he didn't know it at the time. CR didn't help him either.

[Guest guest]

Hi Diane:

Well let me spell it out. If it cannot help with bad genes then

there is no point in exercising for that reason. If it cannot

overcome a poor diet, then there is no reason to exercise for that

reason. If it cannot reverse the effects of obesity then there is no

reason to exercise for that reason.

And if you do not have bad genes, do eat properly and are not obese,

then yer don't need to exercise either. Doesn't that just about

cover it?

: ^ )))

Rodney.

> > Hi Diane:

> >

> > So if exercise cannot overcome genes; cannot overcome a bad diet;

> > cannot overcome obesity; .......................

> >

> > Rodney.

> >

>

>

> I think exercise did overcome his genetic predisposition to getting

> clogged arteries, at least for awhile. And he had an excellent

diet,

> very low fat and very low calorie. He was 6'4 " and ate less than I

> did (I'm 13 " inches shorter), so in essence he was doing CR,

although

> he didn't know it at the time. CR didn't help him either.

[Guest guest]

Hi Diane:

Well let me spell it out. If it cannot help with bad genes then

there is no point in exercising for that reason. If it cannot

overcome a poor diet, then there is no reason to exercise for that

reason. If it cannot reverse the effects of obesity then there is no

reason to exercise for that reason.

And if you do not have bad genes, do eat properly and are not obese,

then yer don't need to exercise either. Doesn't that just about

cover it?

: ^ )))

Rodney.

> > Hi Diane:

> >

> > So if exercise cannot overcome genes; cannot overcome a bad diet;

> > cannot overcome obesity; .......................

> >

> > Rodney.

> >

>

>

> I think exercise did overcome his genetic predisposition to getting

> clogged arteries, at least for awhile. And he had an excellent

diet,

> very low fat and very low calorie. He was 6'4 " and ate less than I

> did (I'm 13 " inches shorter), so in essence he was doing CR,

although

> he didn't know it at the time. CR didn't help him either.

[Guest guest]

" Exercise " will: enlarge your heart lumens, improve endothelial

function, increase microcirculation, improve lipid profile, reduce

large artery stiffness, reduce pulse pressure, increase skeletal mass

and strength, increase thickness of joint surface articular cartilage,

increase muscle & tendon thickness and strength, improve coordination

and balance, reduce disability...

" Exercise " is NOT a panacea for any and all your lifestyle

indiscretions. Exercise will probably not completely overcome the

mounting physical damage from a lifestyle that creates a 310+ lb human

being.

Those who wish to place their bet solely on their CRON, I say to you

you'd better be right with your nutritional and caloric choices!

Personally, I'm will hedge my bet and do BOTH. Appropriate exercise

will likely not kill me, but it just might provide additional survival

edge to help overcome any dietary miscues.

> > > Hi Diane:

> > >

> > > So if exercise cannot overcome genes; cannot overcome a bad diet;

> > > cannot overcome obesity; .......................

> > >

> > > Rodney.

> > >

> >

> >

> > I think exercise did overcome his genetic predisposition to getting

> > clogged arteries, at least for awhile. And he had an excellent

> diet,

> > very low fat and very low calorie. He was 6'4 " and ate less than I

> > did (I'm 13 " inches shorter), so in essence he was doing CR,

> although

> > he didn't know it at the time. CR didn't help him either.

[Guest guest]

" Exercise " will: enlarge your heart lumens, improve endothelial

function, increase microcirculation, improve lipid profile, reduce

large artery stiffness, reduce pulse pressure, increase skeletal mass

and strength, increase thickness of joint surface articular cartilage,

increase muscle & tendon thickness and strength, improve coordination

and balance, reduce disability...

" Exercise " is NOT a panacea for any and all your lifestyle

indiscretions. Exercise will probably not completely overcome the

mounting physical damage from a lifestyle that creates a 310+ lb human

being.

Those who wish to place their bet solely on their CRON, I say to you

you'd better be right with your nutritional and caloric choices!

Personally, I'm will hedge my bet and do BOTH. Appropriate exercise

will likely not kill me, but it just might provide additional survival

edge to help overcome any dietary miscues.

> > > Hi Diane:

> > >

> > > So if exercise cannot overcome genes; cannot overcome a bad diet;

> > > cannot overcome obesity; .......................

> > >

> > > Rodney.

> > >

> >

> >

> > I think exercise did overcome his genetic predisposition to getting

> > clogged arteries, at least for awhile. And he had an excellent

> diet,

> > very low fat and very low calorie. He was 6'4 " and ate less than I

> > did (I'm 13 " inches shorter), so in essence he was doing CR,

> although

> > he didn't know it at the time. CR didn't help him either.

[Guest guest]

I would say that those who " overdo " either or both, could harm their health. We've heard from anorexic and severly underweight individuals on this board and their health problems. Also our files indicate that a BMI under 18 can lead to shorter, not longer life. And excessive exercise will not only NOT lengthen life, it could shorten it (if you agree with the free radical theory). I myself have noticed that exercisers/athletes often seem to be not only victims of heart disease but cancer and other illnesses (besides Lance Armstrong, other athletes both famous and who I have personally known) . Remember Lou Gehrig and the disease named after him? All anecdotal to be sure, but as Rod says how many anecdotes do you need before you start wondering.......

My husband used to run a marathon a month in his youth. That went on many 6 or 8 years or so. Now he can't walk more than a mile without getting leg pain. I can't prove they're related, but it sure makes me wonder.

Personally I try to do some yaga everyday (as recommended by Ornish), walk an extra mile a day, and do a bit of strength training.

Moderation seems to be the best avenue.

on 9/6/2005 8:49 PM, drsusanforshey at drsusanforshey@... wrote:

Those who wish to place their bet solely on their CRON, I say to you

you'd better be right with your nutritional and caloric choices!

Personally, I'm will hedge my bet and do BOTH. Appropriate exercise

will likely not kill me, but it just might provide additional survival

edge to help overcome any dietary miscues.

[Guest guest]

I would say that those who " overdo " either or both, could harm their health. We've heard from anorexic and severly underweight individuals on this board and their health problems. Also our files indicate that a BMI under 18 can lead to shorter, not longer life. And excessive exercise will not only NOT lengthen life, it could shorten it (if you agree with the free radical theory). I myself have noticed that exercisers/athletes often seem to be not only victims of heart disease but cancer and other illnesses (besides Lance Armstrong, other athletes both famous and who I have personally known) . Remember Lou Gehrig and the disease named after him? All anecdotal to be sure, but as Rod says how many anecdotes do you need before you start wondering.......

My husband used to run a marathon a month in his youth. That went on many 6 or 8 years or so. Now he can't walk more than a mile without getting leg pain. I can't prove they're related, but it sure makes me wonder.

Personally I try to do some yaga everyday (as recommended by Ornish), walk an extra mile a day, and do a bit of strength training.

Moderation seems to be the best avenue.

on 9/6/2005 8:49 PM, drsusanforshey at drsusanforshey@... wrote:

Those who wish to place their bet solely on their CRON, I say to you

you'd better be right with your nutritional and caloric choices!

Personally, I'm will hedge my bet and do BOTH. Appropriate exercise

will likely not kill me, but it just might provide additional survival

edge to help overcome any dietary miscues.

[Guest guest]

I'm not sure what this has to do with CR but exercise or activity level is the important third factor in energy balance. If you hold

energy intake constant, increased activity will reduce BMI which for many people is probably more healthy. If you hold BMI constant,

increased activity requires increased food intake. Depending upon your food choices this could improve your chances of getting adequate

nutrition or conversely expose you to more toxins. This duality may explain the lack of clear correlation between increased exercise/activity

and improved health when not controlled for nutrition.

I have been running on and off for 30 years and I don't claim any unique wisdom from that experience. I feel pretty comfortable with my

observation that running at 150# is less stressful to my joints etc than my former 200#+.

JR

-----Original Message-----From: [mailto: ]On Behalf Of Francesca SkeltonSent: Tuesday, September 06, 2005 8:13 PM Subject: Re: [ ] Re: Exercise and Heart Disease

I would say that those who "overdo" either or both, could harm their health. We've heard from anorexic and severly underweight individuals on this board and their health problems. Also our files indicate that a BMI under 18 can lead to shorter, not longer life. And excessive exercise will not only NOT lengthen life, it could shorten it (if you agree with the free radical theory). I myself have noticed that exercisers/athletes often seem to be not only victims of heart disease but cancer and other illnesses (besides Lance Armstrong, other athletes both famous and who I have personally known) . Remember Lou Gehrig and the disease named after him? All anecdotal to be sure, but as Rod says how many anecdotes do you need before you start wondering.......My husband used to run a marathon a month in his youth. That went on many 6 or 8 years or so. Now he can't walk more than a mile without getting leg pain. I can't prove they're related, but it sure makes me wonder.Personally I try to do some yaga everyday (as recommended by Ornish), walk an extra mile a day, and do a bit of strength training. Moderation seems to be the best avenue. on 9/6/2005 8:49 PM, drsusanforshey at drsusanforshey@... wrote:

Those who wish to place their bet solely on their CRON, I say to youyou'd better be right with your nutritional and caloric choices!Personally, I'm will hedge my bet and do BOTH. Appropriate exercisewill likely not kill me, but it just might provide additional survivaledge to help overcome any dietary miscues.