Re: bleed control

[Guest guest]

This is a great one but, You need to make sure it is the newest styal. The old

one had a thin strip of webbing that passed through the windless. when you

twisted it, the webbing would brake under a lot of pressure. I have a video on

my web site under the C3 program files. www,NH-TEMS.com I am a firm believer

of practicing how you would really do it. In my TCCC and OEMS class we had to

place a TQ on each extremity with on hand and 2 hands and stop blood flow. The

instructor would come over a check a radial or pedal pulse. There has been a

lot of concern about TQ's in civilian world and useing it as a last resort. A TQ

can be on for 120 min. without tissue dammage. This cam right from DR. Haggman

at his OEMS class.

shawn

Larry Torrey <ltorrey@...> wrote:

The C.A.T. - Combat Application Tourniquet™ - is currently popular

among many of the US forces.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/library/news/2006/06/mil-060622-arnews03.\

htm

http://www.medgadget.com/archives/2005/03/army_develops_i.html

LT

Wilf Mackie wrote:

> Tom et all:

>

> A friend of mine is making a new product, " Kroon " well improved at least

over the old style " T " .

> It is called SOF Tactical Tourniquet http://www.zulunine.com/ or

http://www.dropzonetactical.com/ I hope these links work.

>

> The impudis to make a better " mousetrap " came from a story of a Canuckistanian

Medic that got " blowd up " with a roadside IED.

> He had to improvise very quickly with standard battle dressing while he was

" treating himself " (a member of PPCLI) .

>

> As the types of mechanism(s) of injuries change with the times, the potential

for difficult to control exsanginating haemorrhage also affects the oilpatch and

woodland firefighters and the forestry industry. I carry one of these for

degloving injuries and chainsaw 'oops " and entrapped MVC patients, it certianly

beats " manually holding direct pressure " when the hose monkeys are extricating.

>

> Also would like to wish ALL a Peaceful Holiday Season.

> No matter what you may call the " Great Spirit " may he/she watch over my

friends.

>

> cheers

>

> Wilf

>

>

> Re: bleed control

>

>

> .

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks for the info LT I appreciat it. I only said that because I'm in the

navy and I was sent to OEMS on orders.

HM2 Buxton

Larry Torrey <ltorrey@...> wrote:

,

Please be careful here. While OEMS is a good program, but it's not

" the US military live tissue lab " . It is only one of several programs

out there that does what it does.

LT

Buxton wrote:

> TQ's have been a first line of care for combat casualty care in the field.

OEMS (operational and emergency medical skills course) which is the US military

live tissue lab. They teach a mneumonic- MARCH= Major bleeding is first, then

airway, respirations, circulation and head inj./ hypothermia. I have a site

dedicated to this type of medicine www.NH-TEMS.com

>

> shawn

>

> thomas greaber <tom5255@...> wrote:

> On the subject of tourniquets, I remenber in the dark ages when I was first

> trained that they were essentialy a no no. but in light of recent reports

> and a rumored study which I have not been able to confirm ,I am willing to

> bet they will make a big come back in training. The story running around

> Iraq and Afghanl land as well as a couple of news reports I read and saw,

> " currently 90 % " of the battle fataliies in both countries were due to blood

> loss from extremies. If this true and personnel expereince points in the

> direction a tourniquet is the way to go

>

> Cheers

>

> Tom G

>

>> From: ltorrey@...

>> Reply-

>>

>> Subject: Re: bleed control

>> Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2006 08:47:40 -0500

>>

>> Hi Nigel,

>>

>> Quik Clot certainly has gained a lot of attention, hasn't it?

>>

>> I recall when it first hit the market it was in powder form. Recently

>> I've seen it in a more granulated form, I'm told to reduce the chance

>> of it being blown around in the medic's face and other unwanted

>> areas. I have heard about impregnated pads but have not seen them.

>> As for the exothermic reaction - I used the stuff several weeks ago in

>> a class, and it will still boil small amounts of water. Pretty hot

>> stuff!

>>

>> As for 'all US forces' carrying it, no. How many units are using it

>> will likely never be known as a medic's inventory can and often does

>> vary from unit-to-unit. Even within the same service there is

>> variance; one Army infantry unit, for instance, will carry certain

>> medical materials that another may not. Hell, I know some spec ops

>> units that are still jumping in with MAST pants in their ruck, while

>> the rest of the world has mostly left these things in storage. Quik

>> Clot is controversial enough that there is a great deal of variance.

>>

>> While I cannot speak to the entire US forces, I know that - generally

>> speaking - US Air Force PJs and Navy SEALs do not carry it. I am

>> involved in their ongoing training and have not met one in the past 8-

>> 9 years that says it's in his unit's stock. I have heard that Navy

>> Corpsmen used it quite a bit, and the Army far less so. I have also

>> seen the company's advertising claims on their website, and in some

>> respects it is simply not accurate.

>>

>> As for tourniquets, the push for the past several years has been to

>> use them far more liberally than in the past. This comes from, I

>> believe, the CCC course and the data related in it from Viet Nam about

>> the number of lost lives due to uncontrolled bleeding.

>>

>> Best,

>> Larry

>>

>> bleed control

>>

>>

>>> Hi All.

>>>

>>> A couple of years ago I did a lot of research into Quick Clot, and

>>> the message was that it was being over-hyped. Reports of it

>>> blowing in eyes, and cooking tissues etc, led to it being I think

>>> banned by US Spec Ops, although still issued to general forces.

>>> New advertising states that it is now a lot less exothermic and

>>> comes in pads to stop it blowing around, and is now issued to ALL

>>> US forces. Is this correct?

>>>

>>> Also I have seen several references to the 'new US tourniquet

>>> guidelines' As I teach in the UK, where TQs are frowned upon

>>> outside military use, can anyone direct me to where I can find

>>> details and supporting research of these new guidelines please.

>>>

>>>

>>> Have a peaceful Christmas, even if you don't celebrate it.

>>>

>>> Nigel Smee

>>> Mediact Ltd.

>>> UK

>

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[Guest guest]

In a message dated 12/21/2006 10:19:13 P.M. Central Standard Time,

james.crosby@... writes:

DRABCDE

Can you tell us non AUS based guys what the DR is? ABCDE is easy but the DR

has this CIV stumped.

LNM

Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET

FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI

Freelance Consultant/Trainer/Author/Journalist/Fire Protection Consultant

LNMolino@...

979-412-0890 (Cell Phone)

979-361-4636 (Home Phone)

979-690-7559 (IFW/TFW/FSS Office)

979-690-7562 (IFW/TFW/FSS Fax)

" A Texan with a Jersey Attitude "

" Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds

discuss people " Eleanor Roosevelt - US diplomat & reformer (1884 - 1962)

The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the

author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or

organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with unless

I

specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only for

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stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials

retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by the

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[Guest guest]

In a message dated 12/25/2006 3:11:08 A.M. Central Standard Time,

lisamitch50@... writes:

D anger

R esponse

Ah I see very nice, in Camden New jersey in the mid to late 1980's we were

known as the murder capitol of the US based on the murder rate per capita, we

often joked and not so jokingly said we performed WABC's as in Weapons check

etc.

Thanks.

LNM

Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET

FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI

Freelance Consultant/Trainer/Author/Journalist/Fire Protection Consultant

LNMolino@...

979-412-0890 (Cell Phone)

979-361-4636 (Home Phone)

979-690-7559 (IFW/TFW/FSS Office)

979-690-7562 (IFW/TFW/FSS Fax)

" A Texan with a Jersey Attitude "

" Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds

discuss people " Eleanor Roosevelt - US diplomat & reformer (1884 - 1962)

The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the

author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or

organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with unless

I

specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only for

its

stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials

retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by the

original author.

[Guest guest]

This is correct D for Danger and R for Response

Danger to

1. Yourself

2. Bystanders or helpers

3. The casualty/ patient

It is also supposed to be in the order given above, note the patient last.

It's not worth becoming a patient or having bystanders becoming patients

increasing your workload. So basically the scene recon and safety should

identify all dangers and these have to be dealt with to a state where you

are reasonably happy depending on the circumstances and sometimes risk is

part of our job.

To deal with the danger you basically do 2 things,

Remove the patient from the danger, or remove the danger from the patient.

Response - basically you are just trying to assess the response of the

patient, i.e. their LOC , that is GCS or to AVPU , response to verbal,

shake and shout, or painful stimuli or whatever system of assessing LOC you

are accustomed to.

Hope that helps

Wayne Havenaar

_____

From:

[mailto: ] On Behalf Of

Sent: Monday, 25 December 2006 8:11 PM

Subject: Re: bleed control

D anger

R esponse

lnmolinoaol (DOT) <mailto:lnmolino%40aol.com> com wrote:

In a message dated 12/21/2006 10:19:13 P.M. Central Standard Time,

james.crosby@ <mailto:james.crosby%40bhpbilliton.com> bhpbilliton.com

writes:

DRABCDE

Can you tell us non AUS based guys what the DR is? ABCDE is easy but the DR

has this CIV stumped.

LNM

Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET

FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI

Freelance Consultant/Trainer/Author/Journalist/Fire Protection Consultant

LNMolinoaol (DOT) <mailto:LNMolino%40aol.com> com

979-412-0890 (Cell Phone)

979-361-4636 (Home Phone)

979-690-7559 (IFW/TFW/FSS Office)

979-690-7562 (IFW/TFW/FSS Fax)

" A Texan with a Jersey Attitude "

" Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds

discuss people " Eleanor Roosevelt - US diplomat & reformer (1884 - 1962)

The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the

author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or

organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with

unless I

specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only

for its

stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials

retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by

the

original author.

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

No doubt I think they remove the Danger part for the army guys given the

location where this is expected to be used. And they also hope thier medics are

competent enough to move past basic first aid principles :-) I think mainly

DRABC has good practice in teaching IFA/OFA/SMET etc but for advanced stuff I

think the medic should be already well along those lines anyways.

Still working for BHP hey?

Regards,

Mick

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[Guest guest]

have a good new year all, and a safe one