Re: Middle School...what is your take on this?

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 2/3/2002 9:37:49 AM Central Standard Time, blat@...

writes:

> On one hand, I really resent the parents

> who do not teach their children the value of education or respect for

> those in authority. They blame the school for every thing that goes

> wrong for their kids and demand the school provide individual tutoring

> when the kid could have learned on the first try if he had only been

> taught to listen and follow directions. Sometimes I think we are

> throwing good money after bad when it comes to remedial programs. Until

> the parents teach their kids to value academics, remediation won't help

> much.

>

Hi

You may want to check out (online) some of the behaviors exhibited by kids

who struggle or have LD labels.......some are which you named. So yes

tutoring is beneficial and Im also betting it's not the parents fault.

Kathy mom to Sara 10

Check out some behaviors exhibited at

<A HREF= " http://www.ldonline.org/ " >LD OnLine: Learning Disabilities Information

& Resources</A>

In addition, the American Psychiatric Association (APA) maintains ADD can be

defined by the behaviors it causes. They include, for example, the following:

Fidgeting with hands or feet or squirming in their seat (adolescents with ADD

may appear restless);

Difficulty remaining seated when required to do so;

Difficulty sustaining attention and waiting for a turn in tasks, games or

group situations;

Blurting out answers to questions before the questions have been completed;

Difficulty following through on instructions and in organizing tasks;

Shifting from one unfinished activity to another

Failing to give close attention to details and avoiding careless mistakes

Losing things necessary for tasks or activities; and

Difficulty in listening to others without being distracted or interrupting.

You may be interested in the Digest of Education Statistics at.....

<A

HREF= " http://www.ldonline.org/ld_indepth/general_info/statistics.html " >Learning

Disabilities</A>

Very intersting, Think about how many kids receive services and which child

is missed, just might be the kids you are talking about.

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 2/3/2002 10:59:19 AM Eastern Standard Time, blat@...

writes:

> Oh, Cheryl, please be careful about making judgments like this!

Bev, I am speaking about my children's teachers in elementary school ...

and I was there in the school volunteering, getting teachers from the lounge

etc. When I spoke with them about eating with the kids one day a week, they

told me they would not give up their lunch time to do that. Now, granted,

they did not tell me they used that time to do anything other than eat their

lunch with the teachers, so it is possible they had other things to do. But

I was only talking of one day a week, not every day!

Cheryl in VA

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 2/3/2002 12:13:19 PM Eastern Standard Time,

jbocci55@... writes:

> Show me a job where a person gets not only one or two 15 minute breaks in

> their day in addition to the 30-60 minute lunch hour. This is non-existent

> for teachers for teachers in my neck of the woods!

>

Our teachers in elementary school have spare time (no kids) when their

class goes to PE and lunch everyday, goes to music, art, and the library once

a week. They work on site in the building for 6 1/2 hours a day. There are

times when they come for PTA meetings or stay late for IEP meetings, plus

some staff development ( on days when kids are not in school.)

Is that different from your schedule?

Cheryl in VA

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 2/3/2002 1:34:21 PM Eastern Standard Time, Huie@...

writes:

> . It is great, and both teachers have told me they wouldn't give it up.

> They can kind of relax and talk with their students and get to know them

> on a different level, and the students get a glimpse of the teacher's life

> and learn that she is more than a teacher, and to 's surprise, that

> teachers don't live at the school, they have families, and homes etc..

>

> Kind of reminds you of when we were in school and our teachers did the

same, eh!

One thing Stefanie's 5th grade teacher did that was so neat, for one of

their monthly reading assignments, where all the kids read the stories they

have written to guests and classmates, we had a formal tea, linen, china and

all!! The kids LOVED it!! ;-)

Cheryl in VA

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 2/3/2002 2:30:07 PM Eastern Standard Time,

cindysue@... writes:

> Yes, to eat with them every once in awhile would probably be rewarding for

> the kids and enlightening for the teacher.

Yep, my point exactly. And the teacher can keep the lunchroom monitor off

their back for one day! ;-)

Cheryl in VA, who can still remember some of the lectures we got in 7th

grade as a result of what our teacher heard us talking about at lunch!! ;-)

[Guest guest]

Re the basketball game: I kind of like the idea--if it's done properly.

The teacher should work with the coach to make sure the players are

prepped for their roles. They should be told that they are signing

their autographs as a service project for other students to teach them

the kind of things that go on a big league games. They should also be

taught how to interact with people who have disabilities, and hold

short conversations with the students from SpEd as they sign autographs

for them.

Done the right way, this could be a real benefit to the players, too.

Bev

[Guest guest]

BTW, we had a sped teacher here that makes her students bring thank you gifts to

give to the regular ed students when they are allowed to ride on the same bus to

a field trip to the same location. What do you guys think of that?

I'd pitch a fit over that one!!

Speaking of neglectful parents, how many parents don't take their NDA kids to

games because this is not an activity they (the family) enjoys? Some families

are into racing, reading, seeing family on weekends, being involved in church

activities, etc. I think families have a right to do what they enjoy and not be

labeled a bad parent if they aren't involved in school athletics. There are

parents though who do not do ANYTHING with their kids...those kids are in need

of more socialization, etc.

[Guest guest]

My gut reaction is with when it comes to parents who try to use

the schools for freebabysitting. Then I consider the alternatives.

The school I work in has a really diverse population: mid-level

military officers, college professors, lots of IT professionals,

teachers, many families with foster kids, many families who have

recently left the inner city. On one hand, I really resent the parents

who do not teach their children the value of education or respect for

those in authority. They blame the school for every thing that goes

wrong for their kids and demand the school provide individual tutoring

when the kid could have learned on the first try if he had only been

taught to listen and follow directions. Sometimes I think we are

throwing good money after bad when it comes to remedial programs. Until

the parents teach their kids to value academics, remediation won't help

much.

On the other hand, some of the families are having a really hard time

and cannot provide adequate after-school supervision. If we want our

society to work, we have to try to meet kids' needs, in spite of what we

think of the parents. I'd rather see kids in after-school activities

than roaming the streets in gangs, which has been happening in my

school. (Thank goodness, not in my kids' schools!)

For my own kids, I mostly want academics, but for some of the others,

I don't resent my tax dollars going to recreation because it will give

them and us a better future.

I may have gone off on a tangent here, but at least it's therapeutic

to vent about these issues sometimes.

Bev

[Guest guest]

That's aberrated!

Bev

wildwards@... wrote:

> BTW, we had a sped teacher here that makes her students bring thank

> you gifts

> to give to the regular ed students when they are allowed to ride on

> the same

> bus to a field trip to the same location. What do you guys think of that?

>

> Cheryl in VA

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

That's disgusting.

Re: Middle School...what is your take on this?

> That's aberrated!

> Bev

> wildwards@... wrote:

>

> > BTW, we had a sped teacher here that makes her students bring thank

> > you gifts

> > to give to the regular ed students when they are allowed to ride on

> > the same

> > bus to a field trip to the same location. What do you guys think of

that?

> >

> > Cheryl in VA

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

BTW My frame of reference here is severe and profound, autistic,

severely emotionally disturbed (who can be a danger to themselves and

others)--ie the kids for whom least restrictive environment is mostly

self-contained.

Bev

WEBMOM wrote:

> Re the basketball game: I kind of like the idea--if it's done properly.

> The teacher should work with the coach to make sure the players are

> prepped for their roles. They should be told that they are signing

> their autographs as a service project for other students to teach them

> the kind of things that go on a big league games. They should also be

> taught how to interact with people who have disabilities, and hold

> short conversations with the students from SpEd as they sign autographs

> for them.

> Done the right way, this could be a real benefit to the players, too.

> Bev

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 2/3/02 7:50:59 AM Pacific Standard Time, blat@...

writes:

> BTW My frame of reference here is severe and profound, autistic,

> severely emotionally disturbed (who can be a danger to themselves and

> others)--ie the kids for whom least restrictive environment is mostly

> self-contained.

> Bev

>

Bev,

I was thinking about this thread and how different some children are. I have

been thinking in regards to my son who is more capable than some but quite a

handful compared to others.

I managed a group home for several years serving mostly the kids that you

are talking about. In reflection I wish the schools (and I in advocating) had

done somethings quite differently. I now know that if a child is going to be

taught to tolerate different environments it should be done one place at a

time. I wish I had worked with the school on taking the students to one place

repeatedly and once the child could function there work on generalizing it to

another place and so on.

I also wish that school had spent more time in the familiar school

environment working on augmentative communication techniques and devices and

finding ways to make communication a possibility for these kids.

In retrospect I really feel that the kids that I worked with got little out

of their trips into the community from the school because the trips were

treated as field trips rather than a therapeutic or teaching a reasonable

goal.

Just my opinion,

Karyn

[Guest guest]

Oh, Cheryl, please be careful about making judgments like this! There

could be things going on in their classrooms or in their lives that make

that time in the teachers' lounge a necessity. They may be better

teachers because they spend these few minutes away from their students.

(And I do mean few minutes--by the time they take care of other

professional obligations, many of our teachers can only spend 12-15

minutes in the " lounge " at lunch time!)

Bev, parent, child advocate, school librarian, teacher advocate

wildwards@... wrote:

>

> Unfortunately, they are unwilling to give up their time in the teachers

> lounge.

> Cheryl in VA

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 2/3/2002 8:37:30 AM US Mountain Standard Time,

blat@... writes:

> I really resent the parents

> who do not teach their children the value of education or respect for

> those in authority.

Oh, this conerns me. How do you know that the parents haven't taught their

children these things? How do you know that there aren't some underlying

issues that make the child APPEAR to not have respect for authority or make

it harder for that child to learn?

I feel that children all have different ways that they learn and it is up to

the teacher to figure out how best to motivate each child. " If a child is

not learning the way we teach him, then we need to change the way we are

teaching. " I don't think that is the exact quote, but it's close enough.

Several of my children have different learning styles. I would love to have

had a teacher reach out and really TRY to know my children and what motivates

him and make a difference. But, it didn't happen here, and for that reason

one child didn't graduate and I am home schooling another.

I feel that I, as a parent, have taught my children well. What they choose

to do with it is theirs. I also feel that teachers choose their profession

knowing that it is a " heart " job, not alot of pay, alot of responsibility,

but wonderful paybacks if the effort is made. And I will be a VERY

supportive parent if I see the teachers making an effort, and I will be a

STRONG advocate if the need arises.

[Guest guest]

The teachers in our school district have no planning time except for when the

kids go out for 40 minutes for specials. They must go to recess with the

kids and walk them back and forth to specials, lunch, and recess. Everything

is very regimented and I've witnessed how little time they have to grab a

quick bite to eat. I feel they are entitled to this.........and the idea of

a special treat to eat lunch with their class would be something nice they

could do once in awhile. I won't even get into the special ed teachers

because they get NO planning time during the regular school day....it's all

done on their own time.

Jackie

[Guest guest]

Lunch monitors are a paid position in our school district. Not a fun job, I

might add. I was on a sub list and did it twice........NEVER AGAIN!

Cafeterias are zoos, if you haven't been in one for awhile.

Jackie

[Guest guest]

I was dicussing this thread with my three children at the dinner table

tonight and they were overwhelmingly NOT in favor of their teachers eating

lunch with them!!! LOL!

Jackie

[Guest guest]

How big of a school are you talking about? Our school houses K-5 and they

separate the caf into 2 sections. 1-3rd on one side and 4-5th on the other.

They have to shuttle at last count, about 1600 kids through in less than two

hours. Teachers must be prompt in dropping them off and picking them up

because each is allowed 30 minutes for lunch. Like I said

before.........it's a zoo.

Jackie

[Guest guest]

I encouraged elementary school teachers to eat lunch one day a week with their

students and communicate with them in a relaxed manner during a " free " time in

school. I always did when my kids were in school and I was amazed at what the

other kids told me about what was going on in their lives at the time!!

Unfortunately, they are unwilling to give up their time in the teachers lounge.

Cheryl in VA

Cheryl

Our teachers here eat lunch every day with their students. The sped teacher has

several EC students, so she ends up sitting next to them. 's teacher and

's gened teacher sit by different students each day and encourage

appropriate conversation with all the students around. It is great, and both

teachers have told me they wouldn't give it up. They can kind of relax and talk

with their students and get to know them on a different level, and the students

get a glimpse of the teacher's life and learn that she is more than a teacher,

and to 's surprise, that teachers don't live at the school, they have

families, and homes etc..

Sharon

Mom to (10, DS) and (6)

Re: Middle School...what is your take on this?

In a message dated 2/3/2002 1:22:05 AM Eastern Standard Time, JB66111@...

writes:

> Also, when i take my class to the park, I get to see them as different

> people, outside the classroom and that is very helpful as a teacher. We

> usually go to the movies one time also at the end of the year.

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 2/3/02 8:29:01 AM Canada Central Standard Time,

wildwards@... writes:

>

> BTW, we had a sped teacher here that makes her students bring thank you

> gifts

> to give to the regular ed students when they are allowed to ride on the

> same

> bus to a field trip to the same location. What do you guys think of that?

>

> Cheryl in VA

>

>

Ohhhhhhhhhh...... No Cheryl I wouldn't agree with giving a thank you gift

for getting to ride the bus. Big deal it's just as much my kids bus as it is

the other kids bus!! I didn't even give a thought of saying thank you to

mary's classmates when she went on the 3day, 2 night over night field trip

last year. Just figured it was as much her right as theirs. LOL Her sped

teacher did stay in the same room as and 3 other girls tho. But they

seemed to think it was pretty cool. (she's young....which probably helped).

This years field trip is a trip to St. and the state capital. The sped

teacher asked if we would feel comfortable with going without an aide.

Hmmm, this takes some thought. hehe. It may be done if the 6th grade

teachers are ok with it to. I did say that they could let security know she

was with them so if she did go and do her own thing they'd know where she

belonged. But I'm still not sure about this. (yeah I'm having problems

letting go. sorry but she doesn't talk much at all so that makes it kinda

scary)

Joy

[Guest guest]

> BTW, we had a sped teacher here that makes her students bring thank you

gifts to give to the regular ed students when they are allowed to ride on

the same bus to a field trip to the same location. What do you guys think of

that?

>

> I'd pitch a fit over that one!!

I would pitch a fit also.....absolutely no way would I let do that.

> Speaking of neglectful parents, how many parents don't take their NDA

kids to games because this is not an activity they (the family) enjoys?

Some families are into racing, reading, seeing family on weekends, being

involved in church activities, etc. I think families have a right to do

what they enjoy and not be labeled a bad parent if they aren't involved in

school athletics. There are parents though who do not do ANYTHING with

their kids...those kids are in need of more socialization, etc.

>

>

>

I couldn't agree more . School athletics are not the be all, end all

of life, although many people think they are. I think the more important

thing is just what you stated, to be active and happy doing what the family

enjoys, not following what society states is " the " thing to do.

Sharon

Mom to (10, DS) and (6)

Re: Middle School...what is your take on this?

>

>

[Guest guest]

> Ooooh a note to those who's teachers are not present/teaching during

Music,

> Art and PE, check out where your teacher is during that time....many hang

out

> in the teachers lounge. Sara's reg ed teacher is busy working with the

sped

> teacher on mods for the day at the time others don't

>

> Kathy mom to Sara 10....who peeks in the lounge time to time lolol and

> teachers DON'T go to the cafeteria for lunch

>

The time spent in music, PE, art, etc. is called special areas for the

students in our school. For the teachers it is called their planning

period. All of the teachers always eat lunch with their students, so this

in the one time of day they are away from their students. Although, they do

take turns watching each other's classes at recess. These planning times

are supposed to be used in the classroom, doing paperwork, lesson plans and

meeting with parents. I can't answer for all the teachers at our school,

but I know for a fact and 's teachers both use the planning

periods for work in the classroom. I volunteer at the school at various

times during the week, and I have never not seen them in their rooms

working. I also love to talk, so I have to resist the impulse to just " drop

in " and talk their whole planning period away....so far I have succeeded!

Sharon

Mom to (10, DS) and (6)

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 2/3/2002 4:50:48 PM Eastern Standard Time, Huie@...

writes:

> . Who is the lunch room monitor?

Ours are hired part time employees, with the PE assistants coming in and

doing duty also during the lunch time. My children's elementary school had

700 students.

Their high school has 2,000!

Cheryl in VA

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 2/3/02 12:04:40 PM Canada Central Standard Time,

b4alltoday@... writes:

> Funding is sooooo bad in TN that field trips have been limited to one a

> year,

>

Kathy,

My kids never went on more then one field trip a year. Some years they did

include a play or a music event (usually put on by the college in Roch) but

the whole elem. goes to those, and the kids usually have to pay a small fee,

no one is refused the opportunity to go if they can't pay the fee tho.

For class field trips it is one per grade. So I guess for my school

funding has sucked for hmmm, ever since I was in school 'cause the only field

trip I remember doing was the 6th grade trip to the capital, so I guess

things have improved slightly. LOL

Joy

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 2/3/2002 6:15:02 PM Eastern Standard Time,

jbocci55@... writes:

> Cafeterias are zoos, if you haven't been in one for awhile.

>

I often wonder if they would be this bad if more adults were there! ;-)

Tell me, what kind of lunch room behavior mods have your kids undergone? We

used to have a new method every year. Sticks in a can, three sticks at your

table and the whole class was on silence for the rest of the week! Colored

cups, red, green and yellow. Red cup meant silence for the table. And then

we got a stoplight that was sensored for sound .... I HATED THAT!!

Cheryl in VA