Guest guest Posted June 16, 2010 Report Share Posted June 16, 2010 Zed, am I misunderstanding you or are you citing studies that state that too much iodine-based contrast agent can cause hyperthyroidism? That is chemically a very different formulation from the iodine referred to by most here. ~WOn Wed, Jun 16, 2010 at 4:44 PM, zedtava <zedtava@...> wrote: Here is the same reply I just sent to Iodine Induced Hyperthyroidism is called the Jod-Basedow Phenomenon. Here are some links, including definitions, case studies and journal articles. Sorry if some are not full links. http://medical-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Jod-Basedow+phenomenon http://jnm.snmjournals.org/cgi/reprint/38/11/1816 http://www.annalsoflongtermcare.com/attachments/5483.pdf http://grande.nal.usda.gov/ibids/index.php?mode2=detail & origin=ibids_references & therow=606803 http://www.liebertonline.com/doi/abs/10.1089/thy.1998.8.83 http://whqlibdoc.who.int/monograph/WHO_MONO_44_(p385).pdf http://www.bmj.com/cgi/pdf_extract/3/5984/630 http://linkinghub.elsevier.com/retrieve/pii/S0140673677900617 It supposedly is the opposite of the Wolff Chaikoff effect. -Zed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 16, 2010 Report Share Posted June 16, 2010 There are different types of iodinated contrast media substances. One of the many is Iodized oil, used often in iodine deficient populations. Typically it is injected, but it can also be taken orally. I believe that there are other sources that mention forms of iodine other than contrast media. -Zed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 16, 2010 Report Share Posted June 16, 2010 Just as the Wolf-Chaikoff effect has been debunked, probably the Jod-Basedow will be also. Zed, you seem to be saying that all sources are equal, but what we're saying is that the anti-iodine point of view has been debunked, and the pro-iodine point of view is the cutting edge, newly (once again) revealed truth. Your sources adhere to the anti-iodine mainstream, our sources are the cutting edge. So you saying we haven't read the right sources to be properly informed is just not the case. We're all familiar with the anti-iodine literature. What we are practicing and exploring here is the cutting edge. -- At 03:44 PM 6/16/2010, you wrote: >Here is the same reply I just sent to > > >Iodine Induced Hyperthyroidism is called the Jod-Basedow Phenomenon. > >Here are some links, including definitions, case studies and journal >articles. Sorry if some are not full links. > >http://medical-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Jod-Basedow+phenomenon > >http://jnm.snmjournals.org/cgi/reprint/38/11/1816 > >http://www.annalsoflongtermcare.com/attachments/5483.pdf > >http://grande.nal.usda.gov/ibids/index.php?mode2=detail & origin=ibids_references\ & therow=606803 > >http://www.liebertonline.com/doi/abs/10.1089/thy.1998.8.83 > >http://whqlibdoc.who.int/monograph/WHO_MONO_44_(p385).pdf > >http://www.bmj.com/cgi/pdf_extract/3/5984/630 > >http://linkinghub.elsevier.com/retrieve/pii/S0140673677900617 > > > >It supposedly is the opposite of the Wolff Chaikoff effect. > >-Zed ~~~ There is no way to peace; peace is the way ~~~~ --A.J. Muste Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 16, 2010 Report Share Posted June 16, 2010 I asked Dr. Brownstein tonight about the Jod-Basedow effect. He said it would apply if the patient has and autonomous functioning nodule. Re: Re: URGENT - for Just as the Wolf-Chaikoff effect has been debunked, probably the Jod-Basedow will be also. Zed, you seem to be saying that all sources are equal, but what we're saying is that the anti-iodine point of view has been debunked, and the pro-iodine point of view is the cutting edge, newly (once again) revealed truth. Your sources adhere to the anti-iodine mainstream, our sources are the cutting edge. So you saying we haven't read the right sources to be properly informed is just not the case.We're all familiar with the anti-iodine literature. What we are practicing and exploring here is the cutting edge.--At 03:44 PM 6/16/2010, you wrote:>Here is the same reply I just sent to >>>Iodine Induced Hyperthyroidism is called the Jod-Basedow Phenomenon.>>Here are some links, including definitions, case studies and journal >articles. Sorry if some are not full links.>>http://medical-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Jod-Basedow+phenomenon>>http://jnm.snmjournals.org/cgi/reprint/38/11/1816>>http://www.annalsoflongtermcare.com/attachments/5483.pdf>>http://grande.nal.usda.gov/ibids/index.php?mode2=detail & origin=ibids_references & therow=606803>>http://www.liebertonline.com/doi/abs/10.1089/thy.1998.8.83>>http://whqlibdoc.who.int/monograph/WHO_MONO_44_(p385).pdf>>http://www.bmj.com/cgi/pdf_extract/3/5984/630>>http://linkinghub.elsevier.com/retrieve/pii/S0140673677900617>>>>It supposedly is the opposite of the Wolff Chaikoff effect.>>-Zed~~~ There is no way to peace; peace is the way ~~~~--A.J. Muste Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 16, 2010 Report Share Posted June 16, 2010 Funny you say mention OTC.....I was shocked when I found out that you can now get fish oil with a prescription...it's called LOVAZA! If you go on the website there is a whole section explaining why LOVAZA is different than fishoil supplements....and all it really says is that it is more concentrated and the FDA doesn't regulate supplements....hmmmm..... And why not....because the FDA only " regulates " *cough* what Big Pharm creates.... It is sooo disgustingly obvious..... I know this is a forum for iodine....however, if you check out this link to the page that explains why LOVAZA is different then supplements I feel it will drive home the point that we need to not just find research but evaluate the research....see who is conducting the research....and how that research is conducted and analysed... http://www.lovaza.com/benefits-of-lovaza/prescription.html And here is another example where Merck paid Elsevier to put out a fake medical journal..... http://www.the-scientist.com/blog/display/55671/ > > The research Dr. Brownstein has is from outside sources. He is careful to make sure that he is scientific. I am here to tell you that yes - Dr. Abraham and Dr. Brownstein think similarly but Dr. Flechas does stray from the pack. He does not mimic their logic on many things. When I heard him speak at the Iodine conference in 2007 I was surprised to hear a few comments he had because like you - I believed they were three peas in a pod. That is not the case. Dr. Brownstein writes a lot about personal experience but that does not mean that its foundation is not rooted in research other than clinical observation. > > Of course traditional medicine had its issues - blood letting, etc for example. But Big Pharma has taken over and when you start digging into the politics of the truth that has been suppressed because of it and even the people who have lost their lives because they stood up for what they believed then you will see how wrong our medical system today. Follow the money trail. Iodine cannot be patented so therefore it isn't going to be promoted. They tried to patent it by creating Iogen (2 or 3 mgs tablet don't remember exactly) that failed clinical trials and now is marketed OTC as a way to stave off breast cancer. *cough* It's also $30 / bottle for these small tablets. What a rip off. But I digress. > > > You never answered my question and I asked it twice. The article you referenced - did you read it or just think the title would support your stance? Reading it gives a much different picture. Where's the beef? (so to speak) > > > > > Re: URGENT - for > > > > What makes you think that you are right and I am wrong? People thought they were right when they claimed the world was square. Just curious. > > You can say that 1000000mg is not a high dose. And no, I do not think that the RDA is the right amount, it is way too low. > > As far as the comment on traditional medicine. Traditional medicine is full of good and bad, just like current practices. > > I too have piles of iodine research. It is all sitting on my desk. I'm sure, like you, that once you feel like you are on to something, a paper will pop up that show the exact opposite results. > > How much of the research on high iodine dosing is from Brownstein himself? Or Abraham or Flechas? Practically the same group of minds working together. > > No, I have not read that article. I should request it. I just did a search on google scholar and it popped up. I honestly don't have time to go through all my articles and pick out specific ones that show exactly what you want to see. If people are interested they can do it themselves. > > Try and respect others opinions. I work hard to discover new things, just like you . > > -Zed > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 17, 2010 Report Share Posted June 17, 2010 , where have I stated that I am anti-iodine? I am not main stream, and a lot of what I bring up comes from testing people myself. I think a lot of people come to this site looking for information because they run into a problem with iodine supplementation. All I have done is make an effort to provide links to literature in which similar results have occurred. I don't think that you can say " we're all educated, " because based off what people post here, many are not. That is why they joined in the first place. You are welcome to believe what you want. A good scientist/researcher will look at both sides and come up with an intelligent rebuttal instead of simply claiming the opposite party is wrong. Remember, this is science. What is proven and trusted one day, no matter how sure everyone is at the time, can be debunked the next. The debunker could end up debunked too. The world is always changing, entropy at its finest. -Zed > >Here is the same reply I just sent to > > > > > >Iodine Induced Hyperthyroidism is called the Jod-Basedow Phenomenon. > > > >Here are some links, including definitions, case studies and journal > >articles. Sorry if some are not full links. > > > >http://medical-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Jod-Basedow+phenomenon > > > >http://jnm.snmjournals.org/cgi/reprint/38/11/1816 > > > >http://www.annalsoflongtermcare.com/attachments/5483.pdf > > > >http://grande.nal.usda.gov/ibids/index.php?mode2=detail & origin=ibids_references\ & therow=606803 > > > >http://www.liebertonline.com/doi/abs/10.1089/thy.1998.8.83 > > > >http://whqlibdoc.who.int/monograph/WHO_MONO_44_(p385).pdf > > > >http://www.bmj.com/cgi/pdf_extract/3/5984/630 > > > >http://linkinghub.elsevier.com/retrieve/pii/S0140673677900617 > > > > > > > >It supposedly is the opposite of the Wolff Chaikoff effect. > > > >-Zed > > ~~~ There is no way to peace; peace is the way ~~~~ > --A.J. Muste > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 17, 2010 Report Share Posted June 17, 2010 Ok, so I was speculating about Jod-Basedow. Can you clarify what you said about what circumstances would create it? I don't understand " patient has and autonomous functioning nodule " . Thank you. -- >I asked Dr. Brownstein tonight about the Jod-Basedow effect. He said it >would apply if the patient has and autonomous functioning nodule. > > > > > > Re: Re: URGENT - for > > > >Just as the Wolf-Chaikoff effect has been debunked, probably the >Jod-Basedow will be also. Zed, you seem to be saying that all sources are >equal, but what we're saying is that the anti-iodine point of view has been >debunked, and the pro-iodine point of view is the cutting edge, newly (once >again) revealed truth. Your sources adhere to the anti-iodine mainstream, >our sources are the cutting edge. So you saying we haven't read the right >sources to be properly informed is just not the case. > >We're all familiar with the anti-iodine literature. What we are practicing >and exploring here is the cutting edge. > >-- ~~~ There is no way to peace; peace is the way ~~~~ --A.J. Muste Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 17, 2010 Report Share Posted June 17, 2010 This explains it a bit http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3551148 From what I understand they are nodules not controlled by the normal TSH feedback mechanism and "have a mind of their own" so to speak. Steph Re: Re: URGENT - for >>>>Just as the Wolf-Chaikoff effect has been debunked, probably the>Jod-Basedow will be also. Zed, you seem to be saying that all sources are>equal, but what we're saying is that the anti-iodine point of view has been>debunked, and the pro-iodine point of view is the cutting edge, newly (once>again) revealed truth. Your sources adhere to the anti-iodine mainstream,>our sources are the cutting edge. So you saying we haven't read the right>sources to be properly informed is just not the case.>>We're all familiar with the anti-iodine literature. What we are practicing>and exploring here is the cutting edge.>>--~~~ There is no way to peace; peace is the way ~~~~--A.J. Muste Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 17, 2010 Report Share Posted June 17, 2010 Thanks. I sure wouldn't want to undergo that treatment regime. So what then do we tell people who ask if iodine supplementation can ever result in hyperthyroidism? -- At 01:47 PM 6/17/2010, you wrote: >This explains it a bit ><http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3551148>http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/\ 3551148 > From what I understand they are nodules not controlled by the normal TSH >feedback mechanism and " have a mind of their own " so to speak. > >Steph > > > Re: Re: URGENT - for > > > >Ok, so I was speculating about Jod-Basedow. Can you clarify what you said >about what circumstances would create it? I don't understand " patient has >and autonomous functioning nodule " . Thank you. -- > > >I asked Dr. Brownstein tonight about the Jod-Basedow effect. He said it > >would apply if the patient has and autonomous functioning nodule. > > > > ~~~ There is no way to peace; peace is the way ~~~~ --A.J. Muste Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 17, 2010 Report Share Posted June 17, 2010 Not in the majority of individuals. If you have been diagnosed with an autonomous thyroid nodule then you need to seek medical help for this condition. I believe this is where L-Carnatine and Lithium would be helpful. Re: Re: URGENT - for >>>>Ok, so I was speculating about Jod-Basedow. Can you clarify what you said>about what circumstances would create it? I don't understand "patient has>and autonomous functioning nodule". Thank you. -->> >I asked Dr. Brownstein tonight about the Jod-Basedow effect. He said it> >would apply if the patient has and autonomous functioning nodule.> >> >~~~ There is no way to peace; peace is the way ~~~~--A.J. Muste Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 17, 2010 Report Share Posted June 17, 2010 Ok, thanks, am filing this. At 04:22 PM 6/17/2010, you wrote: >Not in the majority of individuals. If you have been diagnosed with an >autonomous thyroid nodule then you need to seek medical help for this >condition. I believe this is where L-Carnatine and Lithium would be helpful. > > > > > Re: Re: URGENT - for > > > > > > > >Ok, so I was speculating about Jod-Basedow. Can you clarify what you said > >about what circumstances would create it? I don't understand " patient has > >and autonomous functioning nodule " . Thank you. -- > > > > >I asked Dr. Brownstein tonight about the Jod-Basedow effect. He said it > > >would apply if the patient has and autonomous functioning nodule. > > > > > > > >~~~ There is no way to peace; peace is the way ~~~~ >--A.J. Muste > > > > > >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >Version: 9.0.829 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2943 - Release Date: 06/17/10 >01:35:00 > ~~~ There is no way to peace; peace is the way ~~~~ --A.J. Muste Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 18, 2010 Report Share Posted June 18, 2010 Hi Zed,You are wrong. This is not just science. This is our lives. I come to this group to read about the iodine protocol and how to better integrate iodine into my life to promote better health.I cannot speak for anyone else here, but I have learned that when I am researching information presented, the first thing I look for is who funded the study? Where does the information come from? The "scientific method" of testing often fails to take into account that minerals, nutrients, vitamins, and other things found in foods are not isolated, but are only parts of whole foods. Using that method, iodine would be tested by itself and would be found to have limited value. But iodine also needs unrefined sea salt, selenium, and vitamin C to work its best.Let's illustrate it another way. Suppose you wanted to test a football quarterback to see if he is any good. as a quarterback. So, you put him out on the field against an opposing team to see what he's made of. However, he has no team to protect him at all, no running backs, no receivers, no tight ends, just himself. How well do you think he would do?In this way, the scientific method has already stacked the deck against the natural supplement it seeks to test.I trust and her research. I know that it is thorough and painstaking. Because is not just a researcher or scientist. is living the adventure, as are we all.linda bastidaFrom: Zed <zedtava@...>Subject: Re: URGENT - for iodine Date: Thursday, June 17, 2010, 10:11 AM , where have I stated that I am anti-iodine? I am not main stream, and a lot of what I bring up comes from testing people myself. I think a lot of people come to this site looking for information because they run into a problem with iodine supplementation. All I have done is make an effort to provide links to literature in which similar results have occurred. I don't think that you can say "we're all educated," because based off what people post here, many are not. That is why they joined in the first place. You are welcome to believe what you want. A good scientist/researcher will look at both sides and come up with an intelligent rebuttal instead of simply claiming the opposite party is wrong. Remember, this is science. What is proven and trusted one day, no matter how sure everyone is at the time, can be debunked the next. The debunker could end up debunked too. The world is always changing, entropy at its finest. -Zed > >Here is the same reply I just sent to > > > > > >Iodine Induced Hyperthyroidism is called the Jod-Basedow Phenomenon. > > > >Here are some links, including definitions, case studies and journal > >articles. Sorry if some are not full links. > > > >http://medical-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Jod-Basedow+phenomenon > > > >http://jnm.snmjournals.org/cgi/reprint/38/11/1816 > > > >http://www.annalsoflongtermcare.com/attachments/5483.pdf > > > >http://grande.nal.usda.gov/ibids/index.php?mode2=detail & origin=ibids_references & therow=606803 > > > >http://www.liebertonline.com/doi/abs/10.1089/thy.1998.8.83 > > > >http://whqlibdoc.who.int/monograph/WHO_MONO_44_(p385).pdf > > > >http://www.bmj.com/cgi/pdf_extract/3/5984/630 > > > >http://linkinghub.elsevier.com/retrieve/pii/S0140673677900617 > > > > > > > >It supposedly is the opposite of the Wolff Chaikoff effect. > > > >-Zed > > ~~~ There is no way to peace; peace is the way ~~~~ > --A.J. Muste > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 18, 2010 Report Share Posted June 18, 2010 Very well said ! From: Zed <zedtava (DOT) com>Subject: Re: URGENT - for iodinegroups (DOT) comDate: Thursday, June 17, 2010, 10:11 AM , where have I stated that I am anti-iodine? I am not main stream, and a lot of what I bring up comes from testing people myself. I think a lot of people come to this site looking for information because they run into a problem with iodine supplementation. All I have done is make an effort to provide links to literature in which similar results have occurred. I don't think that you can say "we're all educated," because based off what people post here, many are not. That is why they joined in the first place. You are welcome to believe what you want. A good scientist/researche r will look at both sides and come up with an intelligent rebuttal instead of simply claiming the opposite party is wrong. Remember, this is science. What is proven and trusted one day, no matter how sure everyone is at the time, can be debunked the next. The debunker could end up debunked too. The world is always changing, entropy at its finest. -Zed> >Here is the same reply I just sent to > >> >> >Iodine Induced Hyperthyroidism is called the Jod-Basedow Phenomenon.> >> >Here are some links, including definitions, case studies and journal > >articles. Sorry if some are not full links.> >> >http://medical- dictionary. thefreedictionar y.com/Jod- Basedow+phenomen on> >> >http://jnm.snmjourn als.org/cgi/ reprint/38/ 11/1816> >> >http://www.annalsof longtermcare. com/attachments/ 5483.pdf> >> >http://grande. nal.usda. gov/ibids/ index.php? mode2=detail & origin=ibids_ references & therow=606803> >> >http://www.lieberto nline.com/ doi/abs/10. 1089/thy. 1998.8.83> >> >http://whqlibdoc. who.int/monograp h/WHO_MONO_ 44_(p385).pdf> >> >http://www.bmj. com/cgi/pdf_ extract/3/ 5984/630> >> >http://linkinghub. elsevier. com/retrieve/ pii/S01406736779 00617> >> >> >> >It supposedly is the opposite of the Wolff Chaikoff effect.> >> >-Zed> > ~~~ There is no way to peace; peace is the way ~~~~> --A.J. Muste> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 18, 2010 Report Share Posted June 18, 2010 I'm confused. How am I wrong? Are you claiming that you are right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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