New to the list

May 29, 2000

Glen,

Welome aboard. A good number of the list members are current offshore

medics, mainly US or UK based. The website has a host of info on the

various roles http://www.remotemedics.co.uk If you need anything, please

drop either Ian Sharpe (ian@...) or myself Ross Boardman

a note (ross@... ) and we will try and help.

All the best,

Ross

Editor

Remote Support Medics Online

http://www.remotemedics.co.uk

A site for medics administered by medics.

[] New to the list

> Hello. I am new and thought I would drop a note and say howdy.

>

> My name is Glen . I am a Paramedic in Grainger County, TN. I

have

> only been a Medic since December.... So I guess I am still a rookie! :-)

I

> was a EMT in rural counties for about 3 years prior to attending medic

> school. I also have worked in dispatch for about 2 years. Currently I

work

> 3 other counties part time..... Not easy to survive :-)

>

> The reason I have subscribed to this list is that I currently have a

job

> oppurtunity working with Acadian EMS on a Oil Rig. I would like info from

> medics who have been there and can tell me a little more about the

business,

> and the company. I expect that I will accept the position by the 1st of

> June..... Any clues on where I should move??? :-)

>

> Glen ---

>

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

> Was the salesman clueless? Productopia has the answers.

> 1/4633/6/_/688696/_/959611401/

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

>

June 7, 2000

Re: New to the list

HI Glen,

Wow, so many question so little space, here goes,

Conditions are fairly reasonalble, usually, some of the bigger platforms are positively nice, We have our own quaters, a small surgury etc etc.

Food is done by the catering department and in most places its pretty cool, though there are expceptions.

Weather is dependant on where you are and what you are on, ie warmer in the Gulf of Mexico than the North Sea, more of a concern if you are onboard a ship rather than a platform,

I usually work a 12 hour shift followed by the next 12 on call usually for a month at a time then I go home and have a month off.

Take a look at the website www.remotemedics.co.uk the introduction and job descriptions should give you a feel for what its like.

Time off, I do ambulance attachments to keep my skills up and am also a volunteer on an all weather rescue boat.

Hurricancs are not usually a problem except for the Gulf of Mexico, we keep an eye on the weather and evac if necessary.

Thats about it really, any other questions give me a shout or post them to the list, there are loads of offshore medics out there

all the best

Ian Sharpe

il address has changed to **** ** Sportcat@... as of 3/28/2000** *Also have a "New" Area Code "865" Or "Vol"*

Just remember...if the world didn't suck, we'd all fall off!

June 14, 2000

,

I am sure you will get many other replies but I wanted to get my quick 2

cents worth in. You are not required to take ONLY EAS products to be part of

a challenge!!!! The only rule there is NO EPHEDRINE! Do a challenge girl!

June 15, 2000

you are allowed to take other supplements that aren't EAS when entering the

contest, there is no rule about that. Anyway good luck to you!

-Dan

June 15, 2000

-

Welcome : Yes rules have changed since last year--soooo you

and your hubby prepare to enter the challenge. Rules and Reg is

online now so check out BFL site and enter. Glad to have you with us.

" Taz "

-- In bodyforlifeegroups, jcn@f... wrote:

> Hi everyone,

>

> My name is and am new to this list. My husband and I are

> following the Body For Life Workout, and for meals we are eating

> frequently, lower glycemic foods, plenty of protein and no refined

> foods. I do consume Myoplex, and my husband does, too, and he

takes

> Betagen. This program really works for us, and I've lost almost 10

> pounds of fat doing it this way, he's lost lots of fat, too...both

of

> us have gained muscle mass. We don't have a whole free day, tried

> that and felt awful, and it slowed our weight loss. I have a day

> where I have a free treat of some kind, usually ice cream!

>

> A great shake we make is Myoplex chocolate, peanut or almond

butter,

> coffee, yogurt, and lots of ice, It is great.

>

> We're not officially in the contest, because we both take

supplements

> that are not EAS, too, and are not willing to give them up, so

we're

> doing this just for us!

>

> Another thing that works for me is that I don't eat very much later

> in the evening. If I am consistent with this, I really lose more

> fat.

>

> We are looking forward to reading and posting!

June 15, 2000

The only rule is that you don't take any ephedra based products.

R.

June 15, 2000

Hi ,

Welcome to our group.

~Laury

July 26, 2000

Hi Marie, I'm Peggikaye. I have a medically challenged family too. Here is

the " short list " of my families problems :

Peggikaye: myasthenia gravis and osteoarthritis migraines, asthma,

wife to Don: post polio syndrome and barrettes esophagus

Mom to AKA Bug: IgG subclass 2 deficient; OCD; trichotillomania: mild

hearing loss;

Mom to AKA Taz: IgG deficient; dyspraxia; PDD- NOS; Tourettes

Syndrome; sensory integration dysfunction; mild OCD; asthma; auditory

processing disorder; esophageal reflux; pyloric spasm; visual motor delays

and astigmatism; Arnold Chiari malformation type 1; bifrontal lobe atrophy,

and migraine syndrome

so I get medically challenged LOL

Welcome to the list, this is a great group filled with lots of information.

Peggikaye ... Oklahoma

July 26, 2000

Hi Marie! My 10yr old daughter has OCD and was diag. 2yrs ago this

month. She does not have an IEP the school pyschologist tested her and met

with her several times and feels that she is doing very well in a reg ed

program. But we are supposed to work on a 504 plan when school resumes I

think it is going to exemplefy her from the time restraints of the

standardized testing. has issues with time like she has no consept of

time like if you say be home a 4:00 your lucky if she shows up at 4:30 and

she also has a hard time figuring out word problems involving time and when

it comes to the testing she is obsessing over how much time she has left that

she cannot work to the best of her abilities. Anyway Im not quite sure how

the 504 plan works but I soon will see. If you know please let me know. What

are the issues that your daughter has been dealing with as far as her ocd? Is

she on meds and in cbt? I look forward to writing to you? My daughter longs

to meet another child with ocd we live in Orlando, Fl. are you anywhere

close? Have a great day and God bless you and your family I know how tuff

this is. Nikki

July 26, 2000

Hi Marie and welcome!!

If you go to our website - enter your email and

password and go to , click on the FILES or LINKS you will

find lots of info on 504's and IEP's. There are also links to school

resources for teachers.

There is a video from the Obsessive-Compulsive Foundation specifically for

teachers... books, etc.

I'll give you a chance to catch your breath with these things and then you

can ask as many questions as you want!! Btw, you can also write long posts -

that's one of the luxeries of this list = we can vent to each other and know

that someone is listening!

When you get the chance, can you tell us where you live, what kind of

therapy your daughter is accessing, etc.? What diagnosis does your son have?

remember to take care of yourself! wendy, in canada

(married to 1 & mom of 3 kids with ocd/depression; social worker trained in

cbt for ocd, and one of the monitors of this

list!)==============================

>From: " Marie Rublee " <parent@...>

>

>Hello All,

>I have a 10 year old daughter who was recently diagnosed

>with OCD.Thank you, , for directing me to this list!

>We are a medically challenged family with multiple issues

>and it looks like there are lots of others here in the same boat.

>Our daughter is having a tough time right now and I'm concerned

>about how she's going to handle school. Do many of you

>have a 504 IEP for your child? Are there any resources you could

>recommend to give me ideas about what accomodations to ask for?

>We've been dealing with special ed with our boys for 12 years and

>the thought of another IEP makes me shudder :-)

>Also, does anyone have a good resource for providing info to the

>teachers about OCD? I'd really appreciate hearing about your

>experiences. Well, this post is getting too long so I'll close for

>now. I'm looking forward to getting to know some of you.

>Thanks! Marie

________________________________________________________________________

Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com

July 26, 2000

Welcome Rublee!

I have several book marks that I will gladly

forward to you.

My son is 13 and has ocd as well as aspergers.

He was first in a 504 program, but he needed

more so he now has an IEP.

I know you will be so glad that you joined this

list! the people here are absolutely wonderful!

Take care!

mary from La.

Marie Rublee wrote:

>

> Hello All,

> I have a 10 year old daughter who was recently diagnosed

> with OCD.Thank you, , for directing me to this list!

> We are a medically challenged family with multiple issues

> and it looks like there are lots of others here in the same boat.

> Our daughter is having a tough time right now and I'm concerned

> about how she's going to handle school. Do many of you

> have a 504 IEP for your child? Are there any resources you could

> recommend to give me ideas about what accomodations to ask for?

> We've been dealing with special ed with our boys for 12 years and

> the thought of another IEP makes me shudder :-)

> Also, does anyone have a good resource for providing info to the

> teachers about OCD? I'd really appreciate hearing about your

> experiences. Well, this post is getting too long so I'll close for

> now. I'm looking forward to getting to know some of you.

> Thanks! Marie

>

> You may subscribe to the OCD-L by emailing listserv@... . In the

body of your message write: subscribe OCD-L your name. The Archives, Files,

and Features List for the may be accessed by going to

, enter your email address and password, then point and

click. Subscription issues, problems, or suggestions may be addressed to Louis

Harkins, list owner, at harkins@... .

July 26, 2000

Hi ,

Nice to meet you. I have a 16 year old son with asperges, adhd,

epilepsy, tic disorder and now probable bipolar. I would love

to have the bookmarks, if you don't mind.

Thanks!

Marie

> Welcome Rublee!

>

> I have several book marks that I will gladly

> forward to you.

>

> My son is 13 and has ocd as well as aspergers.

> He was first in a 504 program, but he needed

> more so he now has an IEP.

>

> I know you will be so glad that you joined this

> list! the people here are absolutely wonderful!

>

> Take care!

> mary from La.

July 26, 2000

HI Marie:

Welcome (again) to our list! There are many other parents on this list who

can share their experiences with you. Our son, Steve, was also 10 when he

was diagnosed with OCD.

We also noticed his symptoms got worse when treatment was started. SOme of

this was paradoxical effects from the medication. Often SSRI can cause a

worsening of OCD symptoms as they begin working on their neurotransmitters

and this is actually a good sign that the medication is going to be helpful

against OCD. It is hard to do but the best thing is to hang in there and

let your daughter's body adjust to the medication. Starting low and going

slow with dosage increases is the way to go with OCD medications. I am not

a doc, just another parent who has had to learn about these meds for Steve.

OCD symptoms can also get worse initially when doing CBT as a lot of

anxiety comes up for our kids. This means also that treatment is doing

what it is supposed to do, teaching them how to live with anxiety. If it

is causing an excessive amount of anxiety you may want to discuss with your

daughter's therapist about where on her hierarchy of OCD symptoms they are

working and it that is too high up. Behavior therapy teaches our kids how

to manage their anxiety. At first Steve would get quite verbally abusive

as his anxiety spiked and I could tell he was very irritable from doing

E & RP. Now he has learned to do exposures by self-initiation or when

directed by his therapist and also control his response. He is stressed

but knows not to get into " verbal diarrhea " and uses humor often to assuage

his anxiety. It has taken a lot of work for him to get himself to this

stage.

Please know there is a lot of hope for our kids living with OCD. At first

we only met doctors unfamiliar with OCD and they gave us little hope he

could get his life back from severe OCD and major depressive disorder. Now

he still has to cope with his disorder, however, he has the tools and

understands what he is up against. It can still get the better of him but

he is no longer despairing that he has lost his life to OCD. Like many of

the other kids with parents on this list he has enjoyed remarkable personal

successes since his diagnosis and is developing the skills necessary to

live his life as smoothly and enjoyably as possible with these disorders.

Good luck, take care, aloha, Kathy (H)

kathyh@...

YOu wrote:

Hi,

>>I'm new to the list. I have a 10 year old daughter who was recently

>diagnosed with OCD and her symptoms just keep getting worse.We're working

>with meds and behavioral therapy and it all seems so overwhelming right

>now. Are there other parents on the list? If so, I'd love to hear from you.

>I want to learn all I can to help my daughter.

>>Thanks!

>>Marie

July 26, 2000

HI Marie:

Steve does have a 504 MP (modification plan is what they call it in our

State) for school. It is best to set up the MP to meet the needs of each

child. At first we set up the MP to make sure that his teachers were aware

of the problems he was facing and did not discipline him for OCD behaviors

that he was only just learning to try to control.

Now he is much further along in his recovery we continue with the plan so

we have a system of getting feedback about his progress. He is on a

dog-tag system where every day he has to write down his homework

assignments and get the teachers' initials it is correct. Then he does the

work and we initial that he has done it. There is also a place for us to

write back and forth to the teachers about issues, questions, problems. We

also have a section in the MP about meeting the teachers to explain OCD to

them and how it might affect Steve in school.

Here in Hawai`i the state lost a class action suit about children's mental

health services. They are under a federal mandate to provide needed mental

health services to kids who qualify. Having a 504 for Steve means he

qualifies and is eligible for financial assistance with his mental health

treatment expenses. That is also written in his plan. It has goals and

measurable objectives, re: his mental health progress, social skills, and

his academic progress.

This system helped us to work with the school recently when Steve suffered

Paxil poop-out and his MDD started to worsen markedly. He became very down

and started to write suicide poetry at school. The teachers faxed it to me

at work and the counselor met with him right away to assess his mood and

potential for self harm. I have found it necessary to stay in close

communication with the school in other ways too, e.g. telephone counselor

when I see things going downhill, get his CBT therapist to talk to the

school about her concerns, participate in parent/school activities

regarding mental health services as an advocate, to improve the

understanding and responsiveness of the system to Steve's needs.

We have used various resources in providing information to teachers and

administrators. One of the best has been to bring Steve's CBT therapist to

his MP meetings and she explains the situation. THe next best way to

educate the school personnel has been to talk to them about OCD. We have

given them a one pager on OCD but, due to brevity, it is rather a

superficial treatment. I have found the interested ones will surf the

Internet to find out more. ALso we lent them our videos from the OCF on

Children with OCD and the associated materials on kids' meds for OCD,

living with kids with OCD, and Dr. booklet on OCD for School

Personnel.

The feedback I got at one school was that the video was way over their

heads. I have also lent the schools books aimed at kids and teens on OCD

for them to share with the other students who might tease Steve but I doubt

they used them.

What symptoms does your daughter have and how do you worry they will affect

her schoolwork? I probably can make some specific suggestions about

particular accommodations based on this information. The MP needs to

change as they recover from OCD so you get the help of the school in not

reinforcing OCD. Typical accommodations include things like more time to

do assignments and tests, a safe place/person they can go to when having a

meltdown or anxiety spike at school, using a computer instead of

handwriting assignments, getting oral tests rather than written, less

homework, etc.

Steve decided not to do his schoolwork in class so the teachers would make

him stay in during recess and complete his work. He wanted to avoid the

contaminated kids in the playground during recess. So we had to explain

that Steve needs to practice his social skills and boss back his

contamination fears more than he needs to worry about learning concepts or

doing drills to reinforce learning. He needed to be out during recess and

not doing the undone work. We promised them if they sent the undone work

home we would see he did it before computer time, TV time, reading time, or

recreation. Pretty soon Steve was finishing his work in class and going

out to recess so he could be on the computer more at home. It is hard

because the teachers generally do not like accommodations which they feel

interfere with discipline in the classroom. If your daughter attends a

school where they are not too aware of their legal obligations you may need

to remind them of these.

If you have experience with IEPs I think you will find MPs a snap as they

are generally much less detailed, especially regarding academics. Some

kids with OCD have MPs and some have IEPs under IDEA, it depends on their

needs and what comorbid disorders they have.

Good luck, take care, aloha, Kathy (H)

kathyh@...

At 12:11 PM 07/26/2000 +0000, you wrote:

>Hello All,

>I have a 10 year old daughter who was recently diagnosed

>with OCD.Thank you, , for directing me to this list!

>We are a medically challenged family with multiple issues

>and it looks like there are lots of others here in the same boat.

>Our daughter is having a tough time right now and I'm concerned

>about how she's going to handle school. Do many of you

>have a 504 IEP for your child? Are there any resources you could

>recommend to give me ideas about what accomodations to ask for?

>We've been dealing with special ed with our boys for 12 years and

>the thought of another IEP makes me shudder :-)

>Also, does anyone have a good resource for providing info to the

>teachers about OCD? I'd really appreciate hearing about your

>experiences. Well, this post is getting too long so I'll close for

>now. I'm looking forward to getting to know some of you.

>Thanks! Marie

July 28, 2000

does the town you live in have a name? why does every " intro " I read

always exclude geography?!

On Mon, 24 Jul 2000 18:40:46 GMT " Katrina Cloud " <katrinaj@...>

writes:

> Hello Everyone,

> I have been so busy reading all of your email that I am just now

> able to

> take the time to write my " hello, this is me " letter.

> So here it is. I have three children, ages 8 1/2, 6 1/2 and 1 1/2.

> They were

> all born at home, vegetarians (except for my older daughter, who, if

> left

> alone, would eat an entire chicken), homeschooled, and raised as

> much as

> possible by attachment parenting.(Isn't it sad that they have to

> make up a

> special term for a special type of parenting that just comes

> naturally?)

> None of them are vaccinated. Excepting that my son DID receive a

> tetanus

> shot in an emergency room visit following an accident. He was hit by

> a young

> man on a bicycle and dragged down a paved and graveled road. The

> doctors

> thought it best that he receive the shot and as they were getting

> ready to

> give it to him, I happened to glance at the bottle on the tray and

> noticed

> that it was the combination shot. I pointed this out to the nurse

> who jumped

> back with her needle and asked, " Why, has he had a reaction to this

> shot

> before? " I explained the situation and she went off to discuss it

> with the

> doctor. He came and, in a nasty tone, began lecturing me and told me

> I was

> wrong, that it was NOT manufactured as a separate shot. Another

> nurse (bless

> her) came storming over, threw the fridge open, grabbed the SINGLE

> SHOT

> (that they don't make) and slammed it down in front of him. I didn't

> hear

> another word from him and he avoided me the rest of our visit.

> Illness is

> very uncommon in our house. All three of my little ones were (the

> youngest

> still is) breastfed, beeing self weaned (so far at around age two).

> My son

> had his first solid food on his first birthday, my daughter, at 8

> months and

> my little one, at around 5 months, my son being the healthiest of

> them all.

> We were told that my son had a double ear infection during his

> chicken pox

> episode but it was never tested so I don't know for sure if it

> really was,

> or just inflamation from the sores. I stopped his medication after

> one or

> two doses and later got the comment from the doctor, " Well, I see

> that the

> antibiotics cleared this right up. " Never told him that we used the

> garlic

> oil Herbs For Kids remedy. That was our only incidence of ear

> infections. I

> made my no-vax decision when my son was born. At the time of his

> appointment, there was a problem with another child getting his

> shots in

> that office and they had to cancel my appointment. What a blessing!

> After

> that, each time I reluctantly made appointments for his shots,

> something

> would happen that would cancel it. I started reading every book on

> the

> subject I could get my hands on and started going to lectures and

> hearing

> panels of doctors speak on the pro's and con's. Even the pro doctors

> said

> that there was a risk and that it was not right for everyone. That

> was

> enough for me. Then stories started coming at me, the young boy in

> our town

> who developed polio from the shot (permanently in a wheelchair), the

> infant

> son of the General on our base who got all of his shots to go

> overseas and

> died and few hours later from complications, the " outbreak " of

> whooping

> cough in the next county where those who were immunized became much,

> much

> sicker and took so much longer to recover (for some, it was a year

> compared

> to the month or two months for the unvaccinated ones) than those who

> were

> not vaccinated. And it just went on and on. Even my mother now

> regularly

> sends me articles about the latest bad reactions. Beeing seen by

>

> military doctors, you get to be exposed to a whole different world

> of guilt

> tactics, propoganda and pressure. If nothing else, it has given me a

>

> wonderful opportuniy to exercise my brain. Now we are back in the

> civilian

> world and still dealing with the doctors. In general, we give them

> the " I am

> looking into that, will get back to you " statement. I have been

> threatened

> with being turned into the state if I did not comply, but they never

>

> followed up on it. I have also been told that the doctors would not

> see me

> until I had the kid's shot records up to date. My son DID attend K

> and first

> grade in a public school. The health office asked me a million and

> one

> questions about my decision and said they were just so curious, they

> had

> never personally had contact with someone who did not vaccinate.

> They

> advised me to sign the religious exemption part of the form, saying

> that it

> was just easier than the medical choice because I would have to show

> proof

> and they followed up on it AND the medical reason would have to

> continue.

> If, for some reson, the medical threat passed, I would then have to

>

> immunize him. I am considered the stupid black sheep of the

> family for

> not getting my kids vaxed. My favourite is my husband's cousin, a

> military

> pediatrician, who he and his wife just had a baby. We were told,

> through

> family members, that we were not to have contact with them because

> of the

> threat our children posed to his daughter. ???!!!??? Just the

> other day, I

> got the story of how proud everyone was of the newest baby in our

> family,

> that she didn't even cry during her shots. I think they think that

> that is

> why I have made this decision, that I don't want them to cry over a

> shot.

> After all, that is the worst thing that could happen, right??? All

> those

> crazies who don't vaccinate, they just make that stuff up, right???

> Well, have I rambled enough? Plus, my little alarm is going off. I

> guess she

> feels that my time on the computer is up.

> Thank you all for being and for the wonderful information you pass

> on.

> Katrina

>

> By the way, I happened to grab an old issue of Mothering magazine

> yesterday

> that happened to have an article on Neonatal Jaundice. It mentions

> everything I have been reading on this list regarding jaundice from

> the

> different types and the treatments to Rh and ABO incompatibilities

> to cord

> clamping. It is found in issue number 24, summer 1982. This is an

> older

> issue, out of print so if anyone is interested and cannot get a

> copy, I

> would be happy to pass it along.

>

________________________________________________________________________

> Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at

> http://www.hotmail.com

>

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July 28, 2000

HiNikki,

W're in Virginia and Jessie is also longing for a friend with OCD.

Perhaps the girls could be e-pals or maybe set up a time to chat

together. Jessie has a hard time following through on things so

keeping up with e-mail is tough for her. I'm going to do a general

post to the group and explain more of her issues. Thanks so much for

your support, Nikki.

Marie

HiMarie! My 10yr old daughter has OCD and was diag. 2yrs ago

this month.

Have a great day and God bless you and your family I know how tuff

> this is. Nikki

July 28, 2000

Hi Kathy,

Just wanted to thank you for your kindness and insight. You've given me hope

for Jessie. I read about the class action suit in Hawaii when I was doing

research to battle the schools for a program for our son with Aspergers.

What a big step in the right direction for kids struggling with mental

illness!

Last year we were fortunate to have have a wonderful teacher who worked with

Jessie in providing shorter assignments, more time for completion of long

projects, etc. This was before the OCD diagnosis, and was done for medical

issues. I guess it really depends on the teacher whether or not documented

504 accomodations must be written.

Thanks again for the resources - it will be a big help.

Bless you!

Marie

>

July 28, 2000

Hi ,

At the time, I live in Denver, CO. We just moved here. (Planning on

staying). I guess my posts sound all over the place because we were! Having

been military, I have covered a lot of ground. I have dealt with a number of

people (doctors, school health officials, etc.) in a number of states and

often the issues were never resolved because we left the area. I guess I am

lucky that I never had to deal with any one doctor for too long (in military

health care, you don't get a choice of doctor and the majority of them are

very pushy, and sometimes rather threatening, about their beleifs over

mine).

Sorry for any confusion. I am still new here and learning the ropes of how

to post. It seems like everyone here already knows each other pretty well. I

guess it will just take me a while.

Katrina

By the way, it was in land that my son attended school.

>From: Krasner <gk-cfic@...>

>Reply-Vaccinationsegroups

>Vaccinationsegroups

>Subject: Re: New to the List

>Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 03:42:43 -0400

>

>does the town you live in have a name? why does every " intro " I read

>always exclude geography?!

>

>On Mon, 24 Jul 2000 18:40:46 GMT " Katrina Cloud " <katrinaj@...>

>writes:

> > Hello Everyone,

> > I have been so busy reading all of your email that I am just now

> > able to

> > take the time to write my " hello, this is me " letter.

> > So here it is. I have three children, ages 8 1/2, 6 1/2 and 1 1/2.

> > They were

> > all born at home, vegetarians (except for my older daughter, who, if

> > left

> > alone, would eat an entire chicken), homeschooled, and raised as

> > much as

> > possible by attachment parenting.(Isn't it sad that they have to

> > make up a

> > special term for a special type of parenting that just comes

> > naturally?)

> > None of them are vaccinated. Excepting that my son DID receive a

> > tetanus

> > shot in an emergency room visit following an accident. He was hit by

> > a young

> > man on a bicycle and dragged down a paved and graveled road. The

> > doctors

> > thought it best that he receive the shot and as they were getting

> > ready to

> > give it to him, I happened to glance at the bottle on the tray and

> > noticed

> > that it was the combination shot. I pointed this out to the nurse

> > who jumped

> > back with her needle and asked, " Why, has he had a reaction to this

> > shot

> > before? " I explained the situation and she went off to discuss it

> > with the

> > doctor. He came and, in a nasty tone, began lecturing me and told me

> > I was

> > wrong, that it was NOT manufactured as a separate shot. Another

> > nurse (bless

> > her) came storming over, threw the fridge open, grabbed the SINGLE

> > SHOT

> > (that they don't make) and slammed it down in front of him. I didn't

> > hear

> > another word from him and he avoided me the rest of our visit.

> > Illness is

> > very uncommon in our house. All three of my little ones were (the

> > youngest

> > still is) breastfed, beeing self weaned (so far at around age two).

> > My son

> > had his first solid food on his first birthday, my daughter, at 8

> > months and

> > my little one, at around 5 months, my son being the healthiest of

> > them all.

> > We were told that my son had a double ear infection during his

> > chicken pox

> > episode but it was never tested so I don't know for sure if it

> > really was,

> > or just inflamation from the sores. I stopped his medication after

> > one or

> > two doses and later got the comment from the doctor, " Well, I see

> > that the

> > antibiotics cleared this right up. " Never told him that we used the

> > garlic

> > oil Herbs For Kids remedy. That was our only incidence of ear

> > infections. I

> > made my no-vax decision when my son was born. At the time of his

> > appointment, there was a problem with another child getting his

> > shots in

> > that office and they had to cancel my appointment. What a blessing!

> > After

> > that, each time I reluctantly made appointments for his shots,

> > something

> > would happen that would cancel it. I started reading every book on

> > the

> > subject I could get my hands on and started going to lectures and

> > hearing

> > panels of doctors speak on the pro's and con's. Even the pro doctors

> > said

> > that there was a risk and that it was not right for everyone. That

> > was

> > enough for me. Then stories started coming at me, the young boy in

> > our town

> > who developed polio from the shot (permanently in a wheelchair), the

> > infant

> > son of the General on our base who got all of his shots to go

> > overseas and

> > died and few hours later from complications, the " outbreak " of

> > whooping

> > cough in the next county where those who were immunized became much,

> > much

> > sicker and took so much longer to recover (for some, it was a year

> > compared

> > to the month or two months for the unvaccinated ones) than those who

> > were

> > not vaccinated. And it just went on and on. Even my mother now

> > regularly

> > sends me articles about the latest bad reactions. Beeing seen by

> >

> > military doctors, you get to be exposed to a whole different world

> > of guilt

> > tactics, propoganda and pressure. If nothing else, it has given me a

> >

> > wonderful opportuniy to exercise my brain. Now we are back in the

> > civilian

> > world and still dealing with the doctors. In general, we give them

> > the " I am

> > looking into that, will get back to you " statement. I have been

> > threatened

> > with being turned into the state if I did not comply, but they never

> >

> > followed up on it. I have also been told that the doctors would not

> > see me

> > until I had the kid's shot records up to date. My son DID attend K

> > and first

> > grade in a public school. The health office asked me a million and

> > one

> > questions about my decision and said they were just so curious, they

> > had

> > never personally had contact with someone who did not vaccinate.

> > They

> > advised me to sign the religious exemption part of the form, saying

> > that it

> > was just easier than the medical choice because I would have to show

> > proof

> > and they followed up on it AND the medical reason would have to

> > continue.

> > If, for some reson, the medical threat passed, I would then have to

> >

> > immunize him. I am considered the stupid black sheep of the

> > family for

> > not getting my kids vaxed. My favourite is my husband's cousin, a

> > military

> > pediatrician, who he and his wife just had a baby. We were told,

> > through

> > family members, that we were not to have contact with them because

> > of the

> > threat our children posed to his daughter. ???!!!??? Just the

> > other day, I

> > got the story of how proud everyone was of the newest baby in our

> > family,

> > that she didn't even cry during her shots. I think they think that

> > that is

> > why I have made this decision, that I don't want them to cry over a

> > shot.

> > After all, that is the worst thing that could happen, right??? All

> > those

> > crazies who don't vaccinate, they just make that stuff up, right???

> > Well, have I rambled enough? Plus, my little alarm is going off. I

> > guess she

> > feels that my time on the computer is up.

> > Thank you all for being and for the wonderful information you pass

> > on.

> > Katrina

> >

> > By the way, I happened to grab an old issue of Mothering magazine

> > yesterday

> > that happened to have an article on Neonatal Jaundice. It mentions

> > everything I have been reading on this list regarding jaundice from

> > the

> > different types and the treatments to Rh and ABO incompatibilities

> > to cord

> > clamping. It is found in issue number 24, summer 1982. This is an

> > older

> > issue, out of print so if anyone is interested and cannot get a

> > copy, I

> > would be happy to pass it along.

> >

>________________________________________________________________________

> > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at

> > http://www.hotmail.com

> >

>------------------------------------------------------------------------

> > @Backup- Protect and Access your data any time, any where on the

> > net.

> > Try @Backup FREE and receive 300 points from mypoints.com Install

> > now:

> > 1/6346/10/_/489317/_/964464047/

> >

>------------------------------------------------------------------------

> >

>

>________________________________________________________________

>YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!

>Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!

>Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit:

>http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.

________________________________________________________________________

Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com

July 28, 2000

OMG katrina! i live in arvada! just a few minutes from denver! i've

got THE BEST family doctor too! yay, now maybe i have someone i can

hang out with one of these days! *lol* i have noone around here to

talk to about parenting styles like this to with. ooohhh, i'm all

excited now! feel free to e-mail me off the list.

*smile*

chris

> Hi ,

> At the time, I live in Denver, CO. We just moved here. (Planning on

> staying). I guess my posts sound all over the place because we

were! Having

> been military, I have covered a lot of ground. I have dealt with a

number of

> people (doctors, school health officials, etc.) in a number of

states and

> often the issues were never resolved because we left the area. I

guess I am

> lucky that I never had to deal with any one doctor for too long (in

military

> health care, you don't get a choice of doctor and the majority of

them are

> very pushy, and sometimes rather threatening, about their beleifs

over

> mine).

> Sorry for any confusion. I am still new here and learning the ropes

of how

> to post. It seems like everyone here already knows each other

pretty well. I

> guess it will just take me a while.

> Katrina

> By the way, it was in land that my son attended school.

>

> >From: Krasner <gk-cfic@j...>

> >Reply-Vaccinationsegroups

> >Vaccinationsegroups

> >Subject: Re: New to the List

> >Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 03:42:43 -0400

> >

> >does the town you live in have a name? why does every " intro " I

read

> >always exclude geography?!

> >

> >On Mon, 24 Jul 2000 18:40:46 GMT " Katrina Cloud " <katrinaj@h...>

> >writes:

> > > Hello Everyone,

> > > I have been so busy reading all of your email that I am just now

> > > able to

> > > take the time to write my " hello, this is me " letter.

> > > So here it is. I have three children, ages 8 1/2, 6 1/2 and 1

1/2.

> > > They were

> > > all born at home, vegetarians (except for my older daughter,

who, if

> > > left

> > > alone, would eat an entire chicken), homeschooled, and raised as

> > > much as

> > > possible by attachment parenting.(Isn't it sad that they have to

> > > make up a

> > > special term for a special type of parenting that just comes

> > > naturally?)

> > > None of them are vaccinated. Excepting that my son DID receive a

> > > tetanus

> > > shot in an emergency room visit following an accident. He was

hit by

> > > a young

> > > man on a bicycle and dragged down a paved and graveled road. The

> > > doctors

> > > thought it best that he receive the shot and as they were

getting

> > > ready to

> > > give it to him, I happened to glance at the bottle on the tray

and

> > > noticed

> > > that it was the combination shot. I pointed this out to the

nurse

> > > who jumped

> > > back with her needle and asked, " Why, has he had a reaction to

this

> > > shot

> > > before? " I explained the situation and she went off to discuss

it

> > > with the

> > > doctor. He came and, in a nasty tone, began lecturing me and

told me

> > > I was

> > > wrong, that it was NOT manufactured as a separate shot. Another

> > > nurse (bless

> > > her) came storming over, threw the fridge open, grabbed the

SINGLE

> > > SHOT

> > > (that they don't make) and slammed it down in front of him. I

didn't

> > > hear

> > > another word from him and he avoided me the rest of our visit.

> > > Illness is

> > > very uncommon in our house. All three of my little ones were

(the

> > > youngest

> > > still is) breastfed, beeing self weaned (so far at around age

two).

> > > My son

> > > had his first solid food on his first birthday, my daughter, at

8

> > > months and

> > > my little one, at around 5 months, my son being the healthiest

of

> > > them all.

> > > We were told that my son had a double ear infection during his

> > > chicken pox

> > > episode but it was never tested so I don't know for sure if it

> > > really was,

> > > or just inflamation from the sores. I stopped his medication

after

> > > one or

> > > two doses and later got the comment from the doctor, " Well, I

see

> > > that the

> > > antibiotics cleared this right up. " Never told him that we used

the

> > > garlic

> > > oil Herbs For Kids remedy. That was our only incidence of ear

> > > infections. I

> > > made my no-vax decision when my son was born. At the time of his

> > > appointment, there was a problem with another child getting his

> > > shots in

> > > that office and they had to cancel my appointment. What a

blessing!

> > > After

> > > that, each time I reluctantly made appointments for his shots,

> > > something

> > > would happen that would cancel it. I started reading every book

on

> > > the

> > > subject I could get my hands on and started going to lectures

and

> > > hearing

> > > panels of doctors speak on the pro's and con's. Even the pro

doctors

> > > said

> > > that there was a risk and that it was not right for everyone.

That

> > > was

> > > enough for me. Then stories started coming at me, the young boy

in

> > > our town

> > > who developed polio from the shot (permanently in a

wheelchair), the

> > > infant

> > > son of the General on our base who got all of his shots to go

> > > overseas and

> > > died and few hours later from complications, the " outbreak " of

> > > whooping

> > > cough in the next county where those who were immunized became

much,

> > > much

> > > sicker and took so much longer to recover (for some, it was a

year

> > > compared

> > > to the month or two months for the unvaccinated ones) than

those who

> > > were

> > > not vaccinated. And it just went on and on. Even my mother now

> > > regularly

> > > sends me articles about the latest bad reactions. Beeing

seen by

> > >

> > > military doctors, you get to be exposed to a whole different

world

> > > of guilt

> > > tactics, propoganda and pressure. If nothing else, it has given

me a

> > >

> > > wonderful opportuniy to exercise my brain. Now we are back in

the

> > > civilian

> > > world and still dealing with the doctors. In general, we give

them

> > > the " I am

> > > looking into that, will get back to you " statement. I have been

> > > threatened

> > > with being turned into the state if I did not comply, but they

never

> > >

> > > followed up on it. I have also been told that the doctors would

not

> > > see me

> > > until I had the kid's shot records up to date. My son DID

attend K

> > > and first

> > > grade in a public school. The health office asked me a million

and

> > > one

> > > questions about my decision and said they were just so curious,

they

> > > had

> > > never personally had contact with someone who did not vaccinate.

> > > They

> > > advised me to sign the religious exemption part of the form,

saying

> > > that it

> > > was just easier than the medical choice because I would have to

show

> > > proof

> > > and they followed up on it AND the medical reason would have to

> > > continue.

> > > If, for some reson, the medical threat passed, I would then

have to

> > >

> > > immunize him. I am considered the stupid black sheep of the

> > > family for

> > > not getting my kids vaxed. My favourite is my husband's cousin,

a

> > > military

> > > pediatrician, who he and his wife just had a baby. We were told,

> > > through

> > > family members, that we were not to have contact with them

because

> > > of the

> > > threat our children posed to his daughter. ???!!!??? Just the

> > > other day, I

> > > got the story of how proud everyone was of the newest baby in

our

> > > family,

> > > that she didn't even cry during her shots. I think they think

that

> > > that is

> > > why I have made this decision, that I don't want them to cry

over a

> > > shot.

> > > After all, that is the worst thing that could happen, right???

All

> > > those

> > > crazies who don't vaccinate, they just make that stuff up,

right???

> > > Well, have I rambled enough? Plus, my little alarm is going

off. I

> > > guess she

> > > feels that my time on the computer is up.

> > > Thank you all for being and for the wonderful information you

pass

> > > on.

> > > Katrina

> > >

> > > By the way, I happened to grab an old issue of Mothering

magazine

> > > yesterday

> > > that happened to have an article on Neonatal Jaundice. It

mentions

> > > everything I have been reading on this list regarding jaundice

from

> > > the

> > > different types and the treatments to Rh and ABO

incompatibilities

> > > to cord

> > > clamping. It is found in issue number 24, summer 1982. This is

an

> > > older

> > > issue, out of print so if anyone is interested and cannot get a

> > > copy, I

> > > would be happy to pass it along.

> > >

>

>_____________________________________________________________________

___

> > > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at

> > > http://www.hotmail.com

> > >

> >-------------------------------------------------------------------

-----

> > > @Backup- Protect and Access your data any time, any where on the

> > > net.

> > > Try @Backup FREE and receive 300 points from mypoints.com

Install

> > > now:

> > > 1/6346/10/_/489317/_/964464047/

> > >

> >-------------------------------------------------------------------

-----

> > >

> >

> >________________________________________________________________

> >YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!

> >Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!

> >Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit:

> >http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.

>

______________________________________________________________________

__

> Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at

http://www.hotmail.com

July 28, 2000

I was hoping you'd write to Katrina about YOUR doctor!

Sheri

At 01:58 PM 07/28/2000 -0000, you wrote:

>OMG katrina! i live in arvada! just a few minutes from denver! i've

>got THE BEST family doctor too! yay, now maybe i have someone i can

>hang out with one of these days! *lol* i have noone around here to

>talk to about parenting styles like this to with. ooohhh, i'm all

>excited now! feel free to e-mail me off the list.

>*smile*

>chris

>

>> Hi ,

>> At the time, I live in Denver, CO. We just moved here. (Planning on

>> staying). I guess my posts sound all over the place because we

>were! Having

>> been military, I have covered a lot of ground. I have dealt with a

>number of

>> people (doctors, school health officials, etc.) in a number of

>states and

>> often the issues were never resolved because we left the area. I

>guess I am

>> lucky that I never had to deal with any one doctor for too long (in

>military

>> health care, you don't get a choice of doctor and the majority of

>them are

>> very pushy, and sometimes rather threatening, about their beleifs

>over

>> mine).

>> Sorry for any confusion. I am still new here and learning the ropes

>of how

>> to post. It seems like everyone here already knows each other

>pretty well. I

>> guess it will just take me a while.

>> Katrina

>> By the way, it was in land that my son attended school.

>>

>> >From: Krasner <gk-cfic@j...>

>> >Reply-Vaccinationsegroups

>> >Vaccinationsegroups

>> >Subject: Re: New to the List

>> >Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 03:42:43 -0400

>> >

>> >does the town you live in have a name? why does every " intro " I

>read

>> >always exclude geography?!

>> >

>> >On Mon, 24 Jul 2000 18:40:46 GMT " Katrina Cloud " <katrinaj@h...>

>> >writes:

>> > > Hello Everyone,

>> > > I have been so busy reading all of your email that I am just now

>> > > able to

>> > > take the time to write my " hello, this is me " letter.

>> > > So here it is. I have three children, ages 8 1/2, 6 1/2 and 1

>1/2.

>> > > They were

>> > > all born at home, vegetarians (except for my older daughter,

>who, if

>> > > left

>> > > alone, would eat an entire chicken), homeschooled, and raised as

>> > > much as

>> > > possible by attachment parenting.(Isn't it sad that they have to

>> > > make up a

>> > > special term for a special type of parenting that just comes

>> > > naturally?)

>> > > None of them are vaccinated. Excepting that my son DID receive a

>> > > tetanus

>> > > shot in an emergency room visit following an accident. He was

>hit by

>> > > a young

>> > > man on a bicycle and dragged down a paved and graveled road. The

>> > > doctors

>> > > thought it best that he receive the shot and as they were

>getting

>> > > ready to

>> > > give it to him, I happened to glance at the bottle on the tray

>and

>> > > noticed

>> > > that it was the combination shot. I pointed this out to the

>nurse

>> > > who jumped

>> > > back with her needle and asked, " Why, has he had a reaction to

>this

>> > > shot

>> > > before? " I explained the situation and she went off to discuss

>it

>> > > with the

>> > > doctor. He came and, in a nasty tone, began lecturing me and

>told me

>> > > I was

>> > > wrong, that it was NOT manufactured as a separate shot. Another

>> > > nurse (bless

>> > > her) came storming over, threw the fridge open, grabbed the

>SINGLE

>> > > SHOT

>> > > (that they don't make) and slammed it down in front of him. I

>didn't

>> > > hear

>> > > another word from him and he avoided me the rest of our visit.

>> > > Illness is

>> > > very uncommon in our house. All three of my little ones were

>(the

>> > > youngest

>> > > still is) breastfed, beeing self weaned (so far at around age

>two).

>> > > My son

>> > > had his first solid food on his first birthday, my daughter, at

>8

>> > > months and

>> > > my little one, at around 5 months, my son being the healthiest

>of

>> > > them all.

>> > > We were told that my son had a double ear infection during his

>> > > chicken pox

>> > > episode but it was never tested so I don't know for sure if it

>> > > really was,

>> > > or just inflamation from the sores. I stopped his medication

>after

>> > > one or

>> > > two doses and later got the comment from the doctor, " Well, I

>see

>> > > that the

>> > > antibiotics cleared this right up. " Never told him that we used

>the

>> > > garlic

>> > > oil Herbs For Kids remedy. That was our only incidence of ear

>> > > infections. I

>> > > made my no-vax decision when my son was born. At the time of his

>> > > appointment, there was a problem with another child getting his

>> > > shots in

>> > > that office and they had to cancel my appointment. What a

>blessing!

>> > > After

>> > > that, each time I reluctantly made appointments for his shots,

>> > > something

>> > > would happen that would cancel it. I started reading every book

>on

>> > > the

>> > > subject I could get my hands on and started going to lectures

>and

>> > > hearing

>> > > panels of doctors speak on the pro's and con's. Even the pro

>doctors

>> > > said

>> > > that there was a risk and that it was not right for everyone.

>That

>> > > was

>> > > enough for me. Then stories started coming at me, the young boy

>in

>> > > our town

>> > > who developed polio from the shot (permanently in a

>wheelchair), the

>> > > infant

>> > > son of the General on our base who got all of his shots to go

>> > > overseas and

>> > > died and few hours later from complications, the " outbreak " of

>> > > whooping

>> > > cough in the next county where those who were immunized became

>much,

>> > > much

>> > > sicker and took so much longer to recover (for some, it was a

>year

>> > > compared

>> > > to the month or two months for the unvaccinated ones) than

>those who

>> > > were

>> > > not vaccinated. And it just went on and on. Even my mother now

>> > > regularly

>> > > sends me articles about the latest bad reactions. Beeing

>seen by

>> > >

>> > > military doctors, you get to be exposed to a whole different

>world

>> > > of guilt

>> > > tactics, propoganda and pressure. If nothing else, it has given

>me a

>> > >

>> > > wonderful opportuniy to exercise my brain. Now we are back in

>the

>> > > civilian

>> > > world and still dealing with the doctors. In general, we give

>them

>> > > the " I am

>> > > looking into that, will get back to you " statement. I have been

>> > > threatened

>> > > with being turned into the state if I did not comply, but they

>never

>> > >

>> > > followed up on it. I have also been told that the doctors would

>not

>> > > see me

>> > > until I had the kid's shot records up to date. My son DID

>attend K

>> > > and first

>> > > grade in a public school. The health office asked me a million

>and

>> > > one

>> > > questions about my decision and said they were just so curious,

>they

>> > > had

>> > > never personally had contact with someone who did not vaccinate.

>> > > They

>> > > advised me to sign the religious exemption part of the form,

>saying

>> > > that it

>> > > was just easier than the medical choice because I would have to

>show

>> > > proof

>> > > and they followed up on it AND the medical reason would have to

>> > > continue.

>> > > If, for some reson, the medical threat passed, I would then

>have to

>> > >

>> > > immunize him. I am considered the stupid black sheep of the

>> > > family for

>> > > not getting my kids vaxed. My favourite is my husband's cousin,

>a

>> > > military

>> > > pediatrician, who he and his wife just had a baby. We were told,

>> > > through

>> > > family members, that we were not to have contact with them

>because

>> > > of the

>> > > threat our children posed to his daughter. ???!!!??? Just the

>> > > other day, I

>> > > got the story of how proud everyone was of the newest baby in

>our

>> > > family,

>> > > that she didn't even cry during her shots. I think they think

>that

>> > > that is

>> > > why I have made this decision, that I don't want them to cry

>over a

>> > > shot.

>> > > After all, that is the worst thing that could happen, right???

>All

>> > > those

>> > > crazies who don't vaccinate, they just make that stuff up,

>right???

>> > > Well, have I rambled enough? Plus, my little alarm is going

>off. I

>> > > guess she

>> > > feels that my time on the computer is up.

>> > > Thank you all for being and for the wonderful information you

>pass

>> > > on.

>> > > Katrina

>> > >

>> > > By the way, I happened to grab an old issue of Mothering

>magazine

>> > > yesterday

>> > > that happened to have an article on Neonatal Jaundice. It

>mentions

>> > > everything I have been reading on this list regarding jaundice

>from

>> > > the

>> > > different types and the treatments to Rh and ABO

>incompatibilities

>> > > to cord

>> > > clamping. It is found in issue number 24, summer 1982. This is

>an

>> > > older

>> > > issue, out of print so if anyone is interested and cannot get a

>> > > copy, I

>> > > would be happy to pass it along.

>> > >

>>

>>_____________________________________________________________________

>___

>> > > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at

>> > > http://www.hotmail.com

>> > >

>> >-------------------------------------------------------------------

>-----

>> > > @Backup- Protect and Access your data any time, any where on the

>> > > net.

>> > > Try @Backup FREE and receive 300 points from mypoints.com

>Install

>> > > now:

>> > > 1/6346/10/_/489317/_/964464047/

>> > >

>> >-------------------------------------------------------------------

>-----

>> > >

>> >

>> >________________________________________________________________

>> >YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!

>> >Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!

>> >Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit:

>> >http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.

>>

>______________________________________________________________________

>__

>> Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at

>http://www.hotmail.com

>

--------------------------------------------------------

Sheri Nakken, R.N., MA

Vaccination Information & Choice Network, Nevada City CA

http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/vaccine.htm

ANY INFO OBTAINED HERE NOT TO BE CONSTRUED AS MEDICAL OR LEGAL ADVICE. THE

DECISION TO VACCINATE IS YOURS AND YOURS ALONE.

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July 29, 2000

Katrina,

Pardon my tone. It was sort of rhetorical. I was just wondering why every

" new member intro " always seems to exclude where the people actually

live. I think it's important most of the time.

On Fri, 28 Jul 2000 13:52:30 GMT " Katrina Cloud " <katrinaj@...>

writes:

> Hi ,

> At the time, I live in Denver, CO. We just moved here. (Planning on

> staying). I guess my posts sound all over the place because we were!

> Having

> been military, I have covered a lot of ground. I have dealt with a

> number of

> people (doctors, school health officials, etc.) in a number of

> states and

> often the issues were never resolved because we left the area. I

> guess I am

> lucky that I never had to deal with any one doctor for too long (in

> military

> health care, you don't get a choice of doctor and the majority of

> them are

> very pushy, and sometimes rather threatening, about their beleifs

> over

> mine).

> Sorry for any confusion. I am still new here and learning the ropes

> of how

> to post. It seems like everyone here already knows each other pretty

> well. I

> guess it will just take me a while.

> Katrina

> By the way, it was in land that my son attended school.

>

> >From: Krasner <gk-cfic@...>

> >Reply-Vaccinationsegroups

> >Vaccinationsegroups

> >Subject: Re: New to the List

> >Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 03:42:43 -0400

> >

> >does the town you live in have a name? why does every " intro " I

> read

> >always exclude geography?!

> >

> >On Mon, 24 Jul 2000 18:40:46 GMT " Katrina Cloud "

> <katrinaj@...>

> >writes:

> > > Hello Everyone,

> > > I have been so busy reading all of your email that I am just now

> > > able to

> > > take the time to write my " hello, this is me " letter.

> > > So here it is. I have three children, ages 8 1/2, 6 1/2 and 1

> 1/2.

> > > They were

> > > all born at home, vegetarians (except for my older daughter,

> who, if

> > > left

> > > alone, would eat an entire chicken), homeschooled, and raised as

> > > much as

> > > possible by attachment parenting.(Isn't it sad that they have to

> > > make up a

> > > special term for a special type of parenting that just comes

> > > naturally?)

> > > None of them are vaccinated. Excepting that my son DID receive a

> > > tetanus

> > > shot in an emergency room visit following an accident. He was

> hit by

> > > a young

> > > man on a bicycle and dragged down a paved and graveled road. The

> > > doctors

> > > thought it best that he receive the shot and as they were

> getting

> > > ready to

> > > give it to him, I happened to glance at the bottle on the tray

> and

> > > noticed

> > > that it was the combination shot. I pointed this out to the

> nurse

> > > who jumped

> > > back with her needle and asked, " Why, has he had a reaction to

> this

> > > shot

> > > before? " I explained the situation and she went off to discuss

> it

> > > with the

> > > doctor. He came and, in a nasty tone, began lecturing me and

> told me

> > > I was

> > > wrong, that it was NOT manufactured as a separate shot. Another

> > > nurse (bless

> > > her) came storming over, threw the fridge open, grabbed the

> SINGLE

> > > SHOT

> > > (that they don't make) and slammed it down in front of him. I

> didn't

> > > hear

> > > another word from him and he avoided me the rest of our visit.

> > > Illness is

> > > very uncommon in our house. All three of my little ones were

> (the

> > > youngest

> > > still is) breastfed, beeing self weaned (so far at around age

> two).

> > > My son

> > > had his first solid food on his first birthday, my daughter, at

> 8

> > > months and

> > > my little one, at around 5 months, my son being the healthiest

> of

> > > them all.

> > > We were told that my son had a double ear infection during his

> > > chicken pox

> > > episode but it was never tested so I don't know for sure if it

> > > really was,

> > > or just inflamation from the sores. I stopped his medication

> after

> > > one or

> > > two doses and later got the comment from the doctor, " Well, I

> see

> > > that the

> > > antibiotics cleared this right up. " Never told him that we used

> the

> > > garlic

> > > oil Herbs For Kids remedy. That was our only incidence of ear

> > > infections. I

> > > made my no-vax decision when my son was born. At the time of his

> > > appointment, there was a problem with another child getting his

> > > shots in

> > > that office and they had to cancel my appointment. What a

> blessing!

> > > After

> > > that, each time I reluctantly made appointments for his shots,

> > > something

> > > would happen that would cancel it. I started reading every book

> on

> > > the

> > > subject I could get my hands on and started going to lectures

> and

> > > hearing

> > > panels of doctors speak on the pro's and con's. Even the pro

> doctors

> > > said

> > > that there was a risk and that it was not right for everyone.

> That

> > > was

> > > enough for me. Then stories started coming at me, the young boy

> in

> > > our town

> > > who developed polio from the shot (permanently in a wheelchair),

> the

> > > infant

> > > son of the General on our base who got all of his shots to go

> > > overseas and

> > > died and few hours later from complications, the " outbreak " of

> > > whooping

> > > cough in the next county where those who were immunized became

> much,

> > > much

> > > sicker and took so much longer to recover (for some, it was a

> year

> > > compared

> > > to the month or two months for the unvaccinated ones) than those

> who

> > > were

> > > not vaccinated. And it just went on and on. Even my mother now

> > > regularly

> > > sends me articles about the latest bad reactions. Beeing

> seen by

> > >

> > > military doctors, you get to be exposed to a whole different

> world

> > > of guilt

> > > tactics, propoganda and pressure. If nothing else, it has given

> me a

> > >

> > > wonderful opportuniy to exercise my brain. Now we are back in

> the

> > > civilian

> > > world and still dealing with the doctors. In general, we give

> them

> > > the " I am

> > > looking into that, will get back to you " statement. I have been

> > > threatened

> > > with being turned into the state if I did not comply, but they

> never

> > >

> > > followed up on it. I have also been told that the doctors would

> not

> > > see me

> > > until I had the kid's shot records up to date. My son DID attend

> K

> > > and first

> > > grade in a public school. The health office asked me a million

> and

> > > one

> > > questions about my decision and said they were just so curious,

> they

> > > had

> > > never personally had contact with someone who did not vaccinate.

> > > They

> > > advised me to sign the religious exemption part of the form,

> saying

> > > that it

> > > was just easier than the medical choice because I would have to

> show

> > > proof

> > > and they followed up on it AND the medical reason would have to

> > > continue.

> > > If, for some reson, the medical threat passed, I would then have

> to

> > >

> > > immunize him. I am considered the stupid black sheep of the

> > > family for

> > > not getting my kids vaxed. My favourite is my husband's cousin,

> a

> > > military

> > > pediatrician, who he and his wife just had a baby. We were told,

> > > through

> > > family members, that we were not to have contact with them

> because

> > > of the

> > > threat our children posed to his daughter. ???!!!??? Just the

> > > other day, I

> > > got the story of how proud everyone was of the newest baby in

> our

> > > family,

> > > that she didn't even cry during her shots. I think they think

> that

> > > that is

> > > why I have made this decision, that I don't want them to cry

> over a

> > > shot.

> > > After all, that is the worst thing that could happen, right???

> All

> > > those

> > > crazies who don't vaccinate, they just make that stuff up,

> right???

> > > Well, have I rambled enough? Plus, my little alarm is going off.

> I

> > > guess she

> > > feels that my time on the computer is up.

> > > Thank you all for being and for the wonderful information you

> pass

> > > on.

> > > Katrina

> > >

> > > By the way, I happened to grab an old issue of Mothering

> magazine

> > > yesterday

> > > that happened to have an article on Neonatal Jaundice. It

> mentions

> > > everything I have been reading on this list regarding jaundice

> from

> > > the

> > > different types and the treatments to Rh and ABO

> incompatibilities

> > > to cord

> > > clamping. It is found in issue number 24, summer 1982. This is

> an

> > > older

> > > issue, out of print so if anyone is interested and cannot get a

> > > copy, I

> > > would be happy to pass it along.

> > >

>

>________________________________________________________________________

> > > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at

> > > http://www.hotmail.com

> > >

>

>------------------------------------------------------------------------

> > > @Backup- Protect and Access your data any time, any where on the

> > > net.

> > > Try @Backup FREE and receive 300 points from mypoints.com

> Install

> > > now:

> > > 1/6346/10/_/489317/_/964464047/

> > >

>

>------------------------------------------------------------------------

> > >

> >

> >________________________________________________________________

> >YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!

> >Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!

> >Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit:

> >http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.

>

________________________________________________________________________

> Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at

> http://www.hotmail.com

>

________________________________________________________________

YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!

Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!

Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit:

http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.

July 29, 2000

There! Ya see?!!

Location, Location, Location, as they say.

gary

On Fri, 28 Jul 2000 13:58:21 -0000 cl-chrisziggy@... writes:

> OMG katrina! i live in arvada! just a few minutes from denver! i've

> got THE BEST family doctor too! yay, now maybe i have someone i can

> hang out with one of these days! *lol* i have noone around here to

> talk to about parenting styles like this to with. ooohhh, i'm all

> excited now! feel free to e-mail me off the list.

> *smile*

> chris

>

> > Hi ,

> > At the time, I live in Denver, CO. We just moved here. (Planning

> on

> > staying). I guess my posts sound all over the place because we

> were! Having

> > been military, I have covered a lot of ground. I have dealt with a

>

> number of

> > people (doctors, school health officials, etc.) in a number of

> states and

> > often the issues were never resolved because we left the area. I

> guess I am

> > lucky that I never had to deal with any one doctor for too long

> (in

> military

> > health care, you don't get a choice of doctor and the majority of

> them are

> > very pushy, and sometimes rather threatening, about their beleifs

> over

> > mine).

> > Sorry for any confusion. I am still new here and learning the

> ropes

> of how

> > to post. It seems like everyone here already knows each other

> pretty well. I

> > guess it will just take me a while.

> > Katrina

> > By the way, it was in land that my son attended school.

> >

> > >From: Krasner <gk-cfic@j...>

> > >Reply-Vaccinationsegroups

> > >Vaccinationsegroups

> > >Subject: Re: New to the List

> > >Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 03:42:43 -0400

> > >

> > >does the town you live in have a name? why does every " intro " I

> read

> > >always exclude geography?!

> > >

> > >On Mon, 24 Jul 2000 18:40:46 GMT " Katrina Cloud " <katrinaj@h...>

> > >writes:

> > > > Hello Everyone,

> > > > I have been so busy reading all of your email that I am just

> now

> > > > able to

> > > > take the time to write my " hello, this is me " letter.

> > > > So here it is. I have three children, ages 8 1/2, 6 1/2 and 1

> 1/2.

> > > > They were

> > > > all born at home, vegetarians (except for my older daughter,

> who, if

> > > > left

> > > > alone, would eat an entire chicken), homeschooled, and raised

> as

> > > > much as

> > > > possible by attachment parenting.(Isn't it sad that they have

> to

> > > > make up a

> > > > special term for a special type of parenting that just comes

> > > > naturally?)

> > > > None of them are vaccinated. Excepting that my son DID receive

> a

> > > > tetanus

> > > > shot in an emergency room visit following an accident. He was

> hit by

> > > > a young

> > > > man on a bicycle and dragged down a paved and graveled road.

> The

> > > > doctors

> > > > thought it best that he receive the shot and as they were

> getting

> > > > ready to

> > > > give it to him, I happened to glance at the bottle on the tray

>

> and

> > > > noticed

> > > > that it was the combination shot. I pointed this out to the

> nurse

> > > > who jumped

> > > > back with her needle and asked, " Why, has he had a reaction to

>

> this

> > > > shot

> > > > before? " I explained the situation and she went off to discuss

>

> it

> > > > with the

> > > > doctor. He came and, in a nasty tone, began lecturing me and

> told me

> > > > I was

> > > > wrong, that it was NOT manufactured as a separate shot.

> Another

> > > > nurse (bless

> > > > her) came storming over, threw the fridge open, grabbed the

> SINGLE

> > > > SHOT

> > > > (that they don't make) and slammed it down in front of him. I

> didn't

> > > > hear

> > > > another word from him and he avoided me the rest of our visit.

> > > > Illness is

> > > > very uncommon in our house. All three of my little ones were

> (the

> > > > youngest

> > > > still is) breastfed, beeing self weaned (so far at around age

> two).

> > > > My son

> > > > had his first solid food on his first birthday, my daughter,

> at

> 8

> > > > months and

> > > > my little one, at around 5 months, my son being the healthiest

>

> of

> > > > them all.

> > > > We were told that my son had a double ear infection during his

> > > > chicken pox

> > > > episode but it was never tested so I don't know for sure if it

> > > > really was,

> > > > or just inflamation from the sores. I stopped his medication

> after

> > > > one or

> > > > two doses and later got the comment from the doctor, " Well, I

> see

> > > > that the

> > > > antibiotics cleared this right up. " Never told him that we

> used

> the

> > > > garlic

> > > > oil Herbs For Kids remedy. That was our only incidence of ear

> > > > infections. I

> > > > made my no-vax decision when my son was born. At the time of

> his

> > > > appointment, there was a problem with another child getting

> his

> > > > shots in

> > > > that office and they had to cancel my appointment. What a

> blessing!

> > > > After

> > > > that, each time I reluctantly made appointments for his shots,

> > > > something

> > > > would happen that would cancel it. I started reading every

> book

> on

> > > > the

> > > > subject I could get my hands on and started going to lectures

> and

> > > > hearing

> > > > panels of doctors speak on the pro's and con's. Even the pro

> doctors

> > > > said

> > > > that there was a risk and that it was not right for everyone.

> That

> > > > was

> > > > enough for me. Then stories started coming at me, the young

> boy

> in

> > > > our town

> > > > who developed polio from the shot (permanently in a

> wheelchair), the

> > > > infant

> > > > son of the General on our base who got all of his shots to go

> > > > overseas and

> > > > died and few hours later from complications, the " outbreak " of

> > > > whooping

> > > > cough in the next county where those who were immunized became

>

> much,

> > > > much

> > > > sicker and took so much longer to recover (for some, it was a

> year

> > > > compared

> > > > to the month or two months for the unvaccinated ones) than

> those who

> > > > were

> > > > not vaccinated. And it just went on and on. Even my mother now

> > > > regularly

> > > > sends me articles about the latest bad reactions. Beeing

> seen by

> > > >

> > > > military doctors, you get to be exposed to a whole different

> world

> > > > of guilt

> > > > tactics, propoganda and pressure. If nothing else, it has

> given

> me a

> > > >

> > > > wonderful opportuniy to exercise my brain. Now we are back in

> the

> > > > civilian

> > > > world and still dealing with the doctors. In general, we give

> them

> > > > the " I am

> > > > looking into that, will get back to you " statement. I have

> been

> > > > threatened

> > > > with being turned into the state if I did not comply, but they

>

> never

> > > >

> > > > followed up on it. I have also been told that the doctors

> would

> not

> > > > see me

> > > > until I had the kid's shot records up to date. My son DID

> attend K

> > > > and first

> > > > grade in a public school. The health office asked me a million

>

> and

> > > > one

> > > > questions about my decision and said they were just so

> curious,

> they

> > > > had

> > > > never personally had contact with someone who did not

> vaccinate.

> > > > They

> > > > advised me to sign the religious exemption part of the form,

> saying

> > > > that it

> > > > was just easier than the medical choice because I would have

> to

> show

> > > > proof

> > > > and they followed up on it AND the medical reason would have

> to

> > > > continue.

> > > > If, for some reson, the medical threat passed, I would then

> have to

> > > >

> > > > immunize him. I am considered the stupid black sheep of the

> > > > family for

> > > > not getting my kids vaxed. My favourite is my husband's

> cousin,

> a

> > > > military

> > > > pediatrician, who he and his wife just had a baby. We were

> told,

> > > > through

> > > > family members, that we were not to have contact with them

> because

> > > > of the

> > > > threat our children posed to his daughter. ???!!!??? Just

> the

> > > > other day, I

> > > > got the story of how proud everyone was of the newest baby in

> our

> > > > family,

> > > > that she didn't even cry during her shots. I think they think

> that

> > > > that is

> > > > why I have made this decision, that I don't want them to cry

> over a

> > > > shot.

> > > > After all, that is the worst thing that could happen, right???

>

> All

> > > > those

> > > > crazies who don't vaccinate, they just make that stuff up,

> right???

> > > > Well, have I rambled enough? Plus, my little alarm is going

> off. I

> > > > guess she

> > > > feels that my time on the computer is up.

> > > > Thank you all for being and for the wonderful information you

> pass

> > > > on.

> > > > Katrina

> > > >

> > > > By the way, I happened to grab an old issue of Mothering

> magazine

> > > > yesterday

> > > > that happened to have an article on Neonatal Jaundice. It

> mentions

> > > > everything I have been reading on this list regarding jaundice

>

> from

> > > > the

> > > > different types and the treatments to Rh and ABO

> incompatibilities

> > > > to cord

> > > > clamping. It is found in issue number 24, summer 1982. This is

>

> an

> > > > older

> > > > issue, out of print so if anyone is interested and cannot get

> a

> > > > copy, I

> > > > would be happy to pass it along.

> > > >

> >

> >_____________________________________________________________________

> ___

> > > > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at

> > > > http://www.hotmail.com

> > > >

> >

> >-------------------------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > > > @Backup- Protect and Access your data any time, any where on

> the

> > > > net.

> > > > Try @Backup FREE and receive 300 points from mypoints.com

> Install

> > > > now:

> > > > 1/6346/10/_/489317/_/964464047/

> > > >

> >

> >-------------------------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > > >

> > >

> > >________________________________________________________________

> > >YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!

> > >Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!

> > >Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit:

> > >http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.

> >

> ______________________________________________________________________

> __

> > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at

> http://www.hotmail.com

>

________________________________________________________________

YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!

Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!

Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit:

http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.

July 30, 2000

Perhaps just stating country or even region (West coast, East coast,

prairies, etc) would be helpful.

Krasner wrote:

> Katrina,

>

> Pardon my tone. It was sort of rhetorical. I was just wondering why every

> " new member intro " always seems to exclude where the people actually

> live. I think it's important most of the time.

>

> On Fri, 28 Jul 2000 13:52:30 GMT " Katrina Cloud " <katrinaj@...>

> writes:

> > Hi ,

> > At the time, I live in Denver, CO. We just moved here. (Planning on

> > staying). I guess my posts sound all over the place because we were!

> > Having

> > been military, I have covered a lot of ground. I have dealt with a

> > number of

> > people (doctors, school health officials, etc.) in a number of

> > states and

> > often the issues were never resolved because we left the area. I

> > guess I am

> > lucky that I never had to deal with any one doctor for too long (in

> > military

> > health care, you don't get a choice of doctor and the majority of

> > them are

> > very pushy, and sometimes rather threatening, about their beleifs

> > over

> > mine).

> > Sorry for any confusion. I am still new here and learning the ropes

> > of how

> > to post. It seems like everyone here already knows each other pretty

> > well. I

> > guess it will just take me a while.

> > Katrina

> > By the way, it was in land that my son attended school.

> >

> > >From: Krasner <gk-cfic@...>

> > >Reply-Vaccinationsegroups

> > >Vaccinationsegroups

> > >Subject: Re: New to the List

> > >Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 03:42:43 -0400

> > >

> > >does the town you live in have a name? why does every " intro " I

> > read

> > >always exclude geography?!

> > >

> > >On Mon, 24 Jul 2000 18:40:46 GMT " Katrina Cloud "

> > <katrinaj@...>

> > >writes:

> > > > Hello Everyone,

> > > > I have been so busy reading all of your email that I am just now

> > > > able to

> > > > take the time to write my " hello, this is me " letter.

> > > > So here it is. I have three children, ages 8 1/2, 6 1/2 and 1

> > 1/2.

> > > > They were

> > > > all born at home, vegetarians (except for my older daughter,

> > who, if

> > > > left

> > > > alone, would eat an entire chicken), homeschooled, and raised as

> > > > much as

> > > > possible by attachment parenting.(Isn't it sad that they have to

> > > > make up a

> > > > special term for a special type of parenting that just comes

> > > > naturally?)

> > > > None of them are vaccinated. Excepting that my son DID receive a

> > > > tetanus

> > > > shot in an emergency room visit following an accident. He was

> > hit by

> > > > a young

> > > > man on a bicycle and dragged down a paved and graveled road. The

> > > > doctors

> > > > thought it best that he receive the shot and as they were

> > getting

> > > > ready to

> > > > give it to him, I happened to glance at the bottle on the tray

> > and

> > > > noticed

> > > > that it was the combination shot. I pointed this out to the

> > nurse

> > > > who jumped

> > > > back with her needle and asked, " Why, has he had a reaction to

> > this

> > > > shot

> > > > before? " I explained the situation and she went off to discuss

> > it

> > > > with the

> > > > doctor. He came and, in a nasty tone, began lecturing me and

> > told me

> > > > I was

> > > > wrong, that it was NOT manufactured as a separate shot. Another

> > > > nurse (bless

> > > > her) came storming over, threw the fridge open, grabbed the

> > SINGLE

> > > > SHOT

> > > > (that they don't make) and slammed it down in front of him. I

> > didn't

> > > > hear

> > > > another word from him and he avoided me the rest of our visit.

> > > > Illness is

> > > > very uncommon in our house. All three of my little ones were

> > (the

> > > > youngest

> > > > still is) breastfed, beeing self weaned (so far at around age

> > two).

> > > > My son

> > > > had his first solid food on his first birthday, my daughter, at

> > 8

> > > > months and

> > > > my little one, at around 5 months, my son being the healthiest

> > of

> > > > them all.

> > > > We were told that my son had a double ear infection during his

> > > > chicken pox

> > > > episode but it was never tested so I don't know for sure if it

> > > > really was,

> > > > or just inflamation from the sores. I stopped his medication

> > after

> > > > one or

> > > > two doses and later got the comment from the doctor, " Well, I

> > see

> > > > that the

> > > > antibiotics cleared this right up. " Never told him that we used

> > the

> > > > garlic

> > > > oil Herbs For Kids remedy. That was our only incidence of ear

> > > > infections. I

> > > > made my no-vax decision when my son was born. At the time of his

> > > > appointment, there was a problem with another child getting his

> > > > shots in

> > > > that office and they had to cancel my appointment. What a

> > blessing!

> > > > After

> > > > that, each time I reluctantly made appointments for his shots,

> > > > something

> > > > would happen that would cancel it. I started reading every book

> > on

> > > > the

> > > > subject I could get my hands on and started going to lectures

> > and

> > > > hearing

> > > > panels of doctors speak on the pro's and con's. Even the pro

> > doctors

> > > > said

> > > > that there was a risk and that it was not right for everyone.

> > That

> > > > was

> > > > enough for me. Then stories started coming at me, the young boy

> > in

> > > > our town

> > > > who developed polio from the shot (permanently in a wheelchair),

> > the

> > > > infant

> > > > son of the General on our base who got all of his shots to go

> > > > overseas and

> > > > died and few hours later from complications, the " outbreak " of

> > > > whooping

> > > > cough in the next county where those who were immunized became

> > much,

> > > > much

> > > > sicker and took so much longer to recover (for some, it was a

> > year

> > > > compared

> > > > to the month or two months for the unvaccinated ones) than those

> > who

> > > > were

> > > > not vaccinated. And it just went on and on. Even my mother now

> > > > regularly

> > > > sends me articles about the latest bad reactions. Beeing

> > seen by

> > > >

> > > > military doctors, you get to be exposed to a whole different

> > world

> > > > of guilt

> > > > tactics, propoganda and pressure. If nothing else, it has given

> > me a

> > > >

> > > > wonderful opportuniy to exercise my brain. Now we are back in

> > the

> > > > civilian

> > > > world and still dealing with the doctors. In general, we give

> > them

> > > > the " I am

> > > > looking into that, will get back to you " statement. I have been

> > > > threatened

> > > > with being turned into the state if I did not comply, but they

> > never

> > > >

> > > > followed up on it. I have also been told that the doctors would

> > not

> > > > see me

> > > > until I had the kid's shot records up to date. My son DID attend

> > K

> > > > and first

> > > > grade in a public school. The health office asked me a million

> > and

> > > > one

> > > > questions about my decision and said they were just so curious,

> > they

> > > > had

> > > > never personally had contact with someone who did not vaccinate.

> > > > They

> > > > advised me to sign the religious exemption part of the form,

> > saying

> > > > that it

> > > > was just easier than the medical choice because I would have to

> > show

> > > > proof

> > > > and they followed up on it AND the medical reason would have to

> > > > continue.

> > > > If, for some reson, the medical threat passed, I would then have

> > to

> > > >

> > > > immunize him. I am considered the stupid black sheep of the

> > > > family for

> > > > not getting my kids vaxed. My favourite is my husband's cousin,

> > a

> > > > military

> > > > pediatrician, who he and his wife just had a baby. We were told,

> > > > through

> > > > family members, that we were not to have contact with them

> > because

> > > > of the

> > > > threat our children posed to his daughter. ???!!!??? Just the

> > > > other day, I

> > > > got the story of how proud everyone was of the newest baby in

> > our

> > > > family,

> > > > that she didn't even cry during her shots. I think they think

> > that

> > > > that is

> > > > why I have made this decision, that I don't want them to cry

> > over a

> > > > shot.

> > > > After all, that is the worst thing that could happen, right???

> > All

> > > > those

> > > > crazies who don't vaccinate, they just make that stuff up,

> > right???

> > > > Well, have I rambled enough? Plus, my little alarm is going off.

> > I

> > > > guess she

> > > > feels that my time on the computer is up.

> > > > Thank you all for being and for the wonderful information you

> > pass

> > > > on.

> > > > Katrina

> > > >

> > > > By the way, I happened to grab an old issue of Mothering

> > magazine

> > > > yesterday

> > > > that happened to have an article on Neonatal Jaundice. It

> > mentions

> > > > everything I have been reading on this list regarding jaundice

> > from

> > > > the

> > > > different types and the treatments to Rh and ABO

> > incompatibilities

> > > > to cord

> > > > clamping. It is found in issue number 24, summer 1982. This is

> > an

> > > > older

> > > > issue, out of print so if anyone is interested and cannot get a

> > > > copy, I

> > > > would be happy to pass it along.

> > > >

> >

> >________________________________________________________________________

> > > > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at

> > > > http://www.hotmail.com

> > > >

> >

> >------------------------------------------------------------------------

> > > > @Backup- Protect and Access your data any time, any where on the

> > > > net.

> > > > Try @Backup FREE and receive 300 points from mypoints.com

> > Install

> > > > now:

> > > > 1/6346/10/_/489317/_/964464047/

> > > >

> >

> >------------------------------------------------------------------------

> > > >

> > >

> > >________________________________________________________________

> > >YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!

> > >Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!

> > >Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit:

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> >

> ________________________________________________________________________

> > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at

> > http://www.hotmail.com

> >

>

> >

>

> ________________________________________________________________

> YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!

> Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!

> Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit:

> http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.

>

July 30, 2000

Well, I recently introduced my Self to this list, and I don't know if I said

where we live now, so in case I didn't we live in

ville, NC, USA. The law I've seen regarding vaccinations here is that

children must Be immunised to enter school, but what

I'd like to know and haven't yet Been able to find out is whether home-schooling

our children (provided we ever actually get any)

will make it less of a hassle not to have them vaccinated. We intend to

home-school regardless, but I want to Be prepared when the

arguments start cropping up. I know a lot can change in six years (which is of

course the absolute earliest we'd have to worry about

that since I'm not even pregnant yet), and I want to know what I can do to help

facilitate changes in that time as well. Thanks

muchly for Bein' here!

Be...

Peace........................ :->

July 31, 2000

In a message dated 7/31/00 7:01:25 AM Eastern Daylight Time, gk-cfic@...

writes:

<< Instead, you have

laws requiring vaccination only for school enrollment. Homeschooled kids

don't have to be vaccinated by any law. >>

ACtually, here in PA, homeschoolers have to turn in the same vaccination

forms to the state as those with children enrolled in school. I assume many

other states have the same policy.

www.diapers.bizland.com

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