Re: New here.........please help!

[Guest guest]

And unless I'm mistaken Synthroid is used

by vastly greater numbers than Armour; however,

I think I know why .most Doc's will not subscribe Armour to their patients do

you know all the perks that Dr's get for prescribing Synthroid and other meds

LOTS . all kinds of Goodies ,and I bet lots of other perks to go along with it

JMOH I know ia got up the Guts to ask my Dr and he kinda said yes some Dr's do

Deborah

Re: New here.........please help!

>I don't have a problem with Armour; it's just that Synthroid seems to

> work fine for me so I've never really considered switching. I wouldn't

> hesitate to switch if I were having the problems some here report.

> Given that some people do have some kind of problem with T3 and that

> Armour [i think] has T3 while Synthroid does not there may well be a

> group of people for whom it should be the prescribed medication.

>

> But I think it's misleading to newbies to say that we all hate

> Synthroid, because we don't. And unless I'm mistaken Synthroid is used

> by vastly greater numbers than Armour; however, I'll admit I have no

> hard numbers. This list is not representative of those with

> hypothyroidism IMHO. I think I read somewhere that Synthroid is one of

> the most prescribed medications of all???

>

>

>

>>

>> Re: New here.........please help!

>>

<hypothyroidism/message/30172;_ylc=X3oDMTJxOWxhdXZ\

mBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzE0NTY2NARncnBzcElkAzE3MDkyNTEwODIEbXNnSWQDMzAxNzIEc2V\

jA2Rtc2cEc2xrA3Ztc2cEc3RpbWUDMTE4NTc2OTk3Mw-->

>>

>>

>>

>> Posted by: " sweetenloe1 " sweetnwright@...

>>

<mailto:sweetnwright@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20New%20here%2E%2E%2E%2E%2E%2E%2E%\

2E%2Eplease%20help%21>

>> sweetenloe1 <sweetenloe1>

>>

>>

>> Sun Jul 29, 2007 8:55 pm (PST)

>>

>> Maybe it wasn't enough, but I feel better on only 2and a half grains

>> of armour than i did on syncrap. unfortunately i cannot use the

>> excuse that my doc said my numbers were okay...i didn't know then what

>> i do now. i really wish you and james would try armour for 6 months!

>>

>>

>> > >

>> > > 125 was a decent dose. tok it for at least a year.

>> >

>> > Not if you still had hypoT symptoms. Women typically require about

>> > double (per unit body weight) what men require. My sister, niece, and

>> > mother have all required 200 mcg. None of them are overweight. That

>> > suggests to me that 125 mcg was probably not sufficient for you.

>> >

>> > Chuck

>> >

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

,

You wrote:

>

> does Synthyroid really make you gain weight? ... I thought i was gaining

weight BECAUSE

> i was hypo!

Depends on whom you want to believe. Weight gain is a symptom of hypoT,

and 100 mcg is a pretty minimal dose. None of the people I know on

Synthroid are overweight, except myself. Three of them are actually

underweight.

Chuck

[Guest guest]

Well you got the story straight. " Chuck you wrote: I'm not sure what

you mean by " most of us " since there are so many doing fine on

Synthroid. " I don't know for a fact that most people do well on

synthroid and neither do you. IMHO most people trust their docs and

those docs just so happen to prescribe synthroid. I was one of those

people. They just deal with the the side effects. and if my baby

werent crying id keep going.

> >

> >

> > There was no pause in between, but after my palps started, i decreased

> > my synthroid and the palps went away. that was in 2002. i just

> > started armour in may or april???....

>

> Let's see if can reconstruct what you are saying correctly. In 2002 you

> were taking 125 mcg of Synthroid but felt miserable with hypoT

symptoms,

> falling hair, and heart palpitations. You reduced the Synthroid dosage

> even lower, and the palps cleared up, but your hair continued to fall

> out for five years. Then in May or April of this year you switched to

> Armour, at the equivalent of more than double the (reduced) dose of

> Synthroid, at which time your hair stopped falling, and you began to

> feel much better?

>

> > ...the point is, taking more t4 in

> > armour than synthroid hasn't given me the problems like the synth.

> > Are you trying to deny the fact that armour makes most of us feel much

> > much better than the synth.?

>

> I'm not sure what you mean by " most of us " since there are so many

doing

> fine on Synthroid. I am sure some people have conversion problems on T4

> only, and others have reactions to extra ingredients. However, many

> people extolling the miracle powers of Armour don't seem to realize

that

> along with switching medications, they also greatly increased the

> dosage. Thus, they falsely attribute their improvement to something

> intrinsic to the medications, when it is really just the increased dose

> that helped.

>

> You may be one of these, but we really don't have enough details of

your

> history to tell.

>

> Chuck

>

[Guest guest]

nyuk nyuk nyuk back to you. LOL

don't forget T7, T0 and calcitonen.

Gracia

Armour and synthroid aren't even the same things.

Armour is crunched up dried thyroid glands and synthroid is a

depilatory/BoneReducer/HeartScrewerUpperer/WeightGain drug.

Do they get synthetic T4 from Barbie Doll thyroids?

Nyuk nyuk nyuk :-D

But seriously, is there " any " dose of synthetic T4 that is actually

equivalent to natural porcine T4/T3/T2/T1 ?

Sam

(back from BF vacation)

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[Guest guest]

I am becoming a conspiracy theorist.

1) tell ppl that iodine is dangerous and will kill us all aacchhh

2) we should be happy with Armour dosed 60-120mg

3) but $inthroid is better b/c it's " stable "

coincidence? I think not.

Gracia

Gracia wrote:

>

> this doesn't compute. 150mg Armour just can't equal 250mcg T4....

It may not compute for you, but that is what the manufacturer tells the

pharmacists and doctors based on longitudinal testing. However, this is

based on producing the equivalent effect on TSH, i.e. 60 mg of Armour

will lower your TSH by the same amount as 100 mcg of T4.

Since Armour is also known to suppress TSH to produce the same level of

relief, the spike in T3 is evidently important in making the comparison.

Still the published conversion, based on TSH, is a starting point. It is

doubtful that Armour is only HALF as potent as it own manufacturer says

it is, with 20-30% much more plausible.

Chuck

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[Guest guest]

I have a personal grudge against synthcrap.

When synthroid doesn't work for a hypO human, and that human remains

hypO, that human might gain weight. The hypO humans that I personally

know who are also on synthcrap are still hypO and remain quite

overweight.

Sam

Armour and synthroid aren't even

the same things.

> Armour is crunched up dried thyroid glands and synthroid is a

> depilatory/BoneReducer/HeartScrewerUpperer/WeightGain drug.

> Do they get synthetic T4 from Barbie Doll thyroids?

> Nyuk nyuk nyuk :-D

>

> But seriously, is there " any " dose of synthetic T4 that is actually

> equivalent to natural porcine T4/T3/T2/T1 ?

>

> Sam

[Guest guest]

Speaking of conspiracy theory, I have heard more than a few thyroidy

people say something to the effect that we're all kept sick and

drugged because we're all much more manageable that way. The other

theory they've thrown around is that it's all a plan to reduce over-

population...

eek

Sam

> >

> > this doesn't compute. 150mg Armour just can't equal 250mcg

T4....

>

> It may not compute for you, but that is what the manufacturer

tells the

> pharmacists and doctors based on longitudinal testing. However,

this is

> based on producing the equivalent effect on TSH,

[Guest guest]

I never had weight gain issues being on Synthroid for over a decade. Not sure I

believe this idea that the synthroid made the weight appear. Now with Armour

two doctors told me that was a possibility. I haven't researched the

manufacturer's information yet to see if this is true for whatever reason.

Anyone else have weight gain issues on Armour?

le

Sam <k9gang@...> wrote:

I have a personal grudge against synthcrap.

When synthroid doesn't work for a hypO human, and that human remains

hypO, that human might gain weight. The hypO humans that I personally

know who are also on synthcrap are still hypO and remain quite

overweight.

Sam

Armour and synthroid aren't even

the same things.

> Armour is crunched up dried thyroid glands and synthroid is a

> depilatory/BoneReducer/HeartScrewerUpperer/WeightGain drug.

> Do they get synthetic T4 from Barbie Doll thyroids?

> Nyuk nyuk nyuk :-D

>

> But seriously, is there " any " dose of synthetic T4 that is actually

> equivalent to natural porcine T4/T3/T2/T1 ?

>

> Sam

---------------------------------

Park yourself in front of a world of choices in alternative vehicles.

Visit the Auto Green Center.

[Guest guest]

Hum, here is one...my Russian relatives actually believe I made a concious

choice to have hypothyroidism and PCOS! Yep, they tell me I can to this world

healthy and some time along my way to adulthood I decided to let sickness enter

me. Got to love my relatives. They also think free market economies are the

anti-christ so what can you do?!

le

Sam <k9gang@...> wrote:

Speaking of conspiracy theory, I have heard more than a few thyroidy

people say something to the effect that we're all kept sick and

drugged because we're all much more manageable that way. The other

theory they've thrown around is that it's all a plan to reduce over-

population...

eek

Sam

> >

> > this doesn't compute. 150mg Armour just can't equal 250mcg

T4....

>

> It may not compute for you, but that is what the manufacturer

tells the

> pharmacists and doctors based on longitudinal testing. However,

this is

> based on producing the equivalent effect on TSH,

---------------------------------

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[Guest guest]

Weight issue on Armour? Yeh, I've lost 10# since being on it. That's a big

issue for me.

Since taking synthroid (from the 1980 " s) I always gained weight on it no

matter what

dosage I was on! Believe me, I tried many different dosages. I was driving my

doctors

crazy because I was NOT happy with all the weight gain and all the hypoT

symptoms.

Venizia

-- In hypothyroidism , le <danosova@...> wrote:

>

> I never had weight gain issues being on Synthroid for over a decade. Not sure

I believe

this idea that the synthroid made the weight appear. Now with Armour two

doctors told

me that was a possibility. I haven't researched the manufacturer's information

yet to see if

this is true for whatever reason. Anyone else have weight gain issues on

Armour?

>

> le

>

> Sam <k9gang@...> wrote:

> I have a personal grudge against synthcrap.

>

> When synthroid doesn't work for a hypO human, and that human remains

> hypO, that human might gain weight. The hypO humans that I personally

> know who are also on synthcrap are still hypO and remain quite

> overweight.

>

> Sam

>

> Armour and synthroid aren't even

> the same things.

> > Armour is crunched up dried thyroid glands and synthroid is a

> > depilatory/BoneReducer/HeartScrewerUpperer/WeightGain drug.

> > Do they get synthetic T4 from Barbie Doll thyroids?

> > Nyuk nyuk nyuk :-D

> >

> > But seriously, is there " any " dose of synthetic T4 that is actually

> > equivalent to natural porcine T4/T3/T2/T1 ?

> >

> > Sam

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> ---------------------------------

> Park yourself in front of a world of choices in alternative vehicles.

> Visit the Auto Green Center.

>

>

[Guest guest]

Yikes!!

Sam <k9gang@...> wrote: Speaking of conspiracy theory, I

have heard more than a few thyroidy

people say something to the effect that we're all kept sick and

drugged because we're all much more manageable that way. The other

theory they've thrown around is that it's all a plan to reduce over-

population...

eek

Sam

> >

> > this doesn't compute. 150mg Armour just can't equal 250mcg

T4....

>

> It may not compute for you, but that is what the manufacturer

tells the

> pharmacists and doctors based on longitudinal testing. However,

this is

> based on producing the equivalent effect on TSH,

[Guest guest]

I haven't had weight gain, I've lost 20 lbs. You shouldn't trust doctors

who tell you that a product that has been around since the 1800's would

cause you to gain weight. They get bonuses to push synthroid..so therefore

they do.

-- Re: Re: New here.........please help!

I never had weight gain issues being on Synthroid for over a decade. Not

sure I believe this idea that the synthroid made the weight appear. Now with

Armour two doctors told me that was a possibility. I haven't researched the

manufacturer's information yet to see if this is true for whatever reason.

Anyone else have weight gain issues on Armour?

le

Sam <k9gang@...> wrote:

I have a personal grudge against synthcrap.

When synthroid doesn't work for a hypO human, and that human remains

hypO, that human might gain weight. The hypO humans that I personally

know who are also on synthcrap are still hypO and remain quite

overweight.

Sam

Armour and synthroid aren't even

the same things.

> Armour is crunched up dried thyroid glands and synthroid is a

> depilatory/BoneReducer/HeartScrewerUpperer/WeightGain drug.

> Do they get synthetic T4 from Barbie Doll thyroids?

> Nyuk nyuk nyuk :-D

>

> But seriously, is there " any " dose of synthetic T4 that is actually

> equivalent to natural porcine T4/T3/T2/T1 ?

>

> Sam

---------------------------------

Park yourself in front of a world of choices in alternative vehicles.

Visit the Auto Green Center.

[Guest guest]

So, Forest Pharma doesn't woo the docs with goodies?

Dusty

Re: Re: New here.........please help!

I never had weight gain issues being on Synthroid for over a decade. Not

sure I believe this idea that the synthroid made the weight appear. Now with

Armour two doctors told me that was a possibility. I haven't researched the

manufacturer's information yet to see if this is true for whatever reason.

Anyone else have weight gain issues on Armour?

le

Sam <k9gangopenaccess (DOT) <mailto:k9gang%40openaccess.org> org> wrote:

I have a personal grudge against synthcrap.

When synthroid doesn't work for a hypO human, and that human remains

hypO, that human might gain weight. The hypO humans that I personally

know who are also on synthcrap are still hypO and remain quite

overweight.

Sam

Armour and synthroid aren't even

the same things.

> Armour is crunched up dried thyroid glands and synthroid is a

> depilatory/BoneReducer/HeartScrewerUpperer/WeightGain drug.

> Do they get synthetic T4 from Barbie Doll thyroids?

> Nyuk nyuk nyuk :-D

>

> But seriously, is there " any " dose of synthetic T4 that is actually

> equivalent to natural porcine T4/T3/T2/T1 ?

>

> Sam

---------------------------------

Park yourself in front of a world of choices in alternative vehicles.

Visit the Auto Green Center.

[Guest guest]

Sam-

I was just about to write a post saying " what happene to Sam? " lol. Nice hearing

from you again!

:-)

Armour and synthroid aren't even the same things.

Armour is crunched up dried thyroid glands and synthroid is a

depilatory/BoneReducer/HeartScrewerUpperer/WeightGain drug.

Do they get synthetic T4 from Barbie Doll thyroids?

Nyuk nyuk nyuk :-D

But seriously, is there " any " dose of synthetic T4 that is actually

equivalent to natural porcine T4/T3/T2/T1 ?

Sam

(back from BF vacation)

Re: New here.........please help!

Armour and synthroid aren't even the same things.

Armour is crunched up dried thyroid glands and synthroid is a

depilatory/BoneReducer/HeartScrewerUpperer/WeightGain drug.

Do they get synthetic T4 from Barbie Doll thyroids?

Nyuk nyuk nyuk :-D

But seriously, is there " any " dose of synthetic T4 that is actually

equivalent to natural porcine T4/T3/T2/T1 ?

Sam

(back from BF vacation)

> >

> > this doesn't compute. 150mg Armour just can't equal 250mcg T4....

>

> It may not compute for you, but that is what the manufacturer tells

the

> pharmacists and doctors based on longitudinal testing. However,

this is

> based on producing the equivalent effect on TSH, i.e. 60 mg of

Armour

> will lower your TSH by the same amount as 100 mcg of T4.

>

> Since Armour is also known to suppress TSH to produce the same

level of

> relief, the spike in T3 is evidently important in making the

comparison.

> Still the published conversion, based on TSH, is a starting point.

It is

> doubtful that Armour is only HALF as potent as it own manufacturer

says

> it is, with 20-30% much more plausible.

>

> Chuck

>

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[Guest guest]

Dusty,

You wrote:

>

> So, Forest Pharma doesn't woo the docs with goodies?

Technically, the pharmaceutical companies mostly give out free samples

of the drugs they are trying to promote and sometimes " educational "

models or gimmicks to explain how something works. It is quite illegal

for them to bribe doctors to push a particular product. Please post

examples of anyone going to jail over this recently.

The perks that ARE legal include things that are NOT tied to specific

products, such as hospitality suites at conferences (free drinks) or

lavish receptions. They also can sponsor workshops and training that can

come close to a specific product. I have enjoyed examples of all of

these, even though I am not an M.D., and never found a hint of promotion

for any one product. OTOH, I imagine you do tend to remember the company

the next time their sales rep shows up with free samples.

Forest has determined that the small gain in use of Armour that they

might obtain by such perks, or by going after people that malign the

product, would simply not be worth the cost. They do have a sales staff

and ongoing sales activities related to Armour, but the lavish promotion

is not there. Considering the drop in price that Synthroid has had over

the last decade, I doubt very much that it gets any promotion anymore,

either. The insurance companies all push the " generic. "

Chuck

[Guest guest]

Gracia-

You are so funny lol.

I am becoming a conspiracy theorist.

1) tell ppl that iodine is dangerous and will kill us all aacchhh

2) we should be happy with Armour dosed 60-120mg

3) but $inthroid is better b/c it's " stable "

coincidence? I think not.

Gracia

Gracia wrote:

>

> this doesn't compute. 150mg Armour just can't equal 250mcg T4....

It may not compute for you, but that is what the manufacturer tells the

pharmacists and doctors based on longitudinal testing. However, this is

based on producing the equivalent effect on TSH, i.e. 60 mg of Armour

will lower your TSH by the same amount as 100 mcg of T4.

Since Armour is also known to suppress TSH to produce the same level of

relief, the spike in T3 is evidently important in making the comparison.

Still the published conversion, based on TSH, is a starting point. It is

doubtful that Armour is only HALF as potent as it own manufacturer says

it is, with 20-30% much more plausible.

Chuck

Re: Re: New here.........please help!

I am becoming a conspiracy theorist.

1) tell ppl that iodine is dangerous and will kill us all aacchhh

2) we should be happy with Armour dosed 60-120mg

3) but $inthroid is better b/c it's " stable "

coincidence? I think not.

Gracia

Gracia wrote:

>

> this doesn't compute. 150mg Armour just can't equal 250mcg T4....

It may not compute for you, but that is what the manufacturer tells the

pharmacists and doctors based on longitudinal testing. However, this is

based on producing the equivalent effect on TSH, i.e. 60 mg of Armour

will lower your TSH by the same amount as 100 mcg of T4.

Since Armour is also known to suppress TSH to produce the same level of

relief, the spike in T3 is evidently important in making the comparison.

Still the published conversion, based on TSH, is a starting point. It is

doubtful that Armour is only HALF as potent as it own manufacturer says

it is, with 20-30% much more plausible.

Chuck

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