Guest guest Posted November 20, 2008 Report Share Posted November 20, 2008 Sol, I guess I was wrong about Ezekiel bread. My apologies ... nevertheless, it sits like lead in my intestines. It's been years since I touched it. You are right, I follow the macrobiotic tradition, by and large. Macrobiotics is a system of energetics, not of particles and components, as is Western nutrition. This means, among other things, that the way a food is prepared is as important as, if not more important than, its molecular components. For example, a baked flour product has a dramatically different effect on the body than, say, boiled pasta or noodles. They are both very different from dry crackers or dry breakfast cereal. Fermented soy is radically different from unfermented soy, and hydrogenated coconut oil is radically different from virgin coconut oil. Whole dry nuts are very different from ground nut butter. Whole grains are totally different from ground flour products, which digest quickly and are assimilated rapidly. Whole grains have to be broken up in the digestive tract, and that takes time, leading to a slow release. And so forth. How many times have I challenged doctors about the tests on coconut oil and they replied that it didn't make any difference whether it was hydrogenated or not? For grains, I usually use long grain Basmati rice or another kind of brown rice, soaked and then cooked with coarse grey sea salt, tamari, ginger, and VCO, for several hours. I also eat barley, buckwheat, quinoa, sweet rice, cooked the same way - all whole, never ground into flour. I used to pressure cook them, but no more. I do pressure cook beans, though. Flour acts like sugar in the body. It is very addictive. Triglycerides are 45, HDL 88-118, blood sugar within perfect range for the last 20 years or so. I am very blessed. And then there's my poops ... Hope this helps, Nina Re: Soy So how do you prepare/eat your grains, and which grains do you eat? Can I take it you are macrobiotic in your eating habits? It would be better if you describe your own way with grains, and I can tell you if I have ever eaten anything like it. I don't really see what you are trying to get at by saying some things are flours. A whole grain ground into flour is still a whole grain, and a whole bean ground into flour is still a bean. FWIW, ezekial bread does have sea salt, and IS cooked. I just contacted the Food for Life company and their breads are baked. Not raw. I have no trouble digesting it, I just have to be careful because it IS still carbs. sol Nina Moliver wrote: > Sol, you have mentioned " the whole gamut, " and that doesn't help me. The > specifics I have seen from you and others so far include: > > - Sourdough bread. This is a flour product. > - Bean flours. This is a flour product. > - Ezekiel bread. This is *extremely* difficult to digest. It consists of > raw, sprouted grains. It's like lead in the intestines. It is not even > salted, much less cooked. > ------------------------------------ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 20, 2008 Report Share Posted November 20, 2008 Nina Moliver wrote: > Fermented soy is radically > different from unfermented soy, and hydrogenated coconut oil is radically > different from virgin coconut oil. We can agree on those. > For grains, I usually use long grain Basmati rice or another kind of brown > rice, soaked and then cooked with coarse grey sea salt, tamari, ginger, and > VCO, for several hours. How do you cook rice for several hours? FWIW, my diet produces the same excretory results in me that your diet does in you. LOL. sol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 20, 2008 Report Share Posted November 20, 2008 > You might want to look into Leptin resistance and carb diets. > > Alobar I'm a 'walking expert' on low carbing. The Leptin book is here, as yet unread. Thanks, Alobar Sharon > > On 11/19/08, Starshar <starshar@...> wrote: > >> I'm in the same catagory as Sol. If I tried to follow your diet I'd be hungry all the time. Beans really do not agree with me, even experimenting with Beano. It's not a gas factor, they just make me feel awful. >> >> I " know " I probably shouldn't eat grains at all, but in this household, and this society I am not able to drum up enough self-discipline to put myself on a rigorous diet. It would be really tough, since I have to cook for " the man " ! >> >> I am 100% from northern European extraction and I'm Type O blood. Even though the blood typing is questionable at best, if D'Adamo has any of it right, it would be the O blood types. We are carnivores, and without enough meat we tend not to do very well. >> >> People whose ancestors hail from the Meditteranean areas probably would thrive on the diet you describe. >> >> If/when I get myself disciplined I stay away from grains with the exception of an occasional piece of Ezekial bread. In addition to meats, fish, eggs, etc, I eat green veggies though I keep the leafy ones low, and if my weight is not a problem, I'll also eat root veggies. >> I could happily live the rest of my life without ever eating a piece of fruit! >> >> It also really helps to get to know one's metabolic picture, and that is not easy for many people to do. >> >> It sounds as though you've got yourself on the right track--for you, and I envy you for that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 20, 2008 Report Share Posted November 20, 2008 Hi Sol, I actually lasted 9 whole weeks without eating sugar in any form, while on Atkins. This was back in '98. After a few weeks, I found myself in total exhaustion (I already have fibromyalgia with the awful fatigue). This exhaustion was beyond belief. Eventually I succombed to sugar. It was only later that I realized that I had foolishly forgotten Atkin's constant admission to supplement with potassium! I was only getting what was in my multivit and the veggies at dinner. That 9 weeks was the longest period of my life of avoiding sugar and I wasn't *craving* it at all. What I did do, which was another mistake, was stay on the induction level. I just wasn't needing any carbs. I figure that all the supplemental nutrients kept the cravings away, until finally the lack of potassium may have tipped me over that edge. I'm wondering if you were really in need of some missing nutrient and that gave you the cravings? How about a lot of chromium---especially the form with the glucose tolerance factor, rather than the picolinate? there's got to be a clue somewhere! Sharon >I have read parts of Rosedale's book, but his diet is too low in animal > fat and protein for me. And too high in fruits as I recall. I should > read it again. > But doesn't he say leptin resistance and cravings leave in a short time > if you are on his diet? > In the low carb diet world this is such a common assumption, I hear it > constantly that cravings leave in a couple weeks if one is strict with > staying off the carbs on whatever eating plan is being touted. But my > carb cravings have never left, ever. > I have to assume that people just don't believe I've been strict and > have not cheated at all. Two and a half months Atkins induction, 100% > strict compliance did not reduce or eliminate carb cravings for me. I > have found that as long as I have these strong cravings I will > eventually slip. > Metabolic typing says that carb cravings can come from not having enough > of the right carbs, as well as from eating too much, but that is a very > slippery slope for me, and so far I keep losing my footing on it and > sliding right back down into eating not only carbs, but sugar. > So far I've not slipped deeply enough, long enough to go back to the > very high triglycerides I used to have, so I take small comfort in that. > My fasting blood sugar is ok and my hypoglycemia is also mostly under > control. By definitions I've read I am " pre-diabetic " , so this isn't > just a preference for me, I NEED to be high protein, high fat, and low > carb (Dr. Bernstein's diet for diabetes). I believe I read that Dr. > Bernstein himself hasn't eaten fruit for several decades. > oops, I've gone on too long, again, > sol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 20, 2008 Report Share Posted November 20, 2008 > Very interesting to me. How old are you Sharon? > > chatnelle ooof!--Sore subject! Let's just say I have the dubious distinction of having birthdays that now start with a 6. Never in my whole life has any of the other milestones (30, 40, 50) caused me any grief. But this '6' is giving me fits Don't anybody dare tell me to consider the alternative! ;-) Sharon > > > On 11/19/08 9:44 AM, " Starshar " <starshar@...> wrote: > >> >> >> >> Just looked 'em up; not as great as I thought. >> >> Total Chol=238 >> HDL=66 (very good) >> LDL=148 (should be less than 130, and ideally around 100) >> but >> Chol/HDLC ratio= 3.6 and the recommendation is " less than 5 " >> Trig=113 >> >> This was from last March, and my diet had " gone to hell " with far more carbs >> than I've been eating in a long time (and the scale is registering that, too) >> >> About 8 months earlier my chol was 198, so those carbs/grains make a BIG >> difference----for me. I'm also a self-described " sugarholic " and even though I >> sometimes get the upper hand, it's not often enough. (some nutritionist I am!) >> >> BTW, folks, anyone using lecithin in any form should be aware that it is high >> in phosphorus. That's a necessary mineral, and is wonderful for those with >> " itis " problems stemming from calcium deposits, as well as being " brain food " . >> However, it's possible that over consumption could lead to a lower than normal >> calcium. >> >> When you get a blood test these days you must ASK for a phosphorus to be done >> as well. Up to the early 90s, a phos level was routine. Then Medicare decided >> it was not necessary, and all the insurance companies followed suit. It will >> be covered under your insurance, but you must ask for it. >> >> The ideal CA/P ratio is for CA to be 2.5 x the P. Ideal would be CA=10, P=4.5. >> >> Off and running, >> >> Sharon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 20, 2008 Report Share Posted November 20, 2008 Aha------Alobar, you have provided me with one possible 'weapon' here. The Life Insurance gambit! Other than that, I'd rather turn 5 chimps loose in my kitchen than let DH do anything in that room! Not to mention what happens to the budget if he gets into a supermarket.......... There are guys who care a lot about taking responsibility for their own health, and then there are all the rest. Sigh..... Sharon From: " Alobar " <Alobar@...> > To me, my life and health take far greater priority than what someone > else wants to eat. If I had a mate who insisted on a starchy diet, I > would inform her that I won't cook or buy the carbs. I will cook > food which is good for me and if she does not like it, she is free to > make her own meals and shop for the food. I'd also be sure my mate's > life insurance policy was paid up, and I'd tell her why I wanted the > life insurance policy paid up. > > In all the relationships I have been in since ~1980, I prepared my own > food and my girlfriend or wife prepared her own food. We would sample > each others food, sometimes, and learn to prepare foods we normally > did not eat. We went shopping together so neither one of us had to > buy things they did not use (one of my girlfriends could not pick out > a decent tomato, ear of corn, or apple because she never grew crops at > home). > > Back then, I ate a bad diet, but it was the bad diet I chose, not one > which was foisted upon me. My bad diets improved over the years, but > I was still addicted to sugary snacks. > > I cook food the way I like it. I'd much rather make my own meals > than eat in most restaurants, unless I am getting some foods which are > difficult to prepare at home, like sushi. > > Even before I developed a good diet, I was strongly urging all my > friends to do all their own meal prep. I feel that people can teach > themselves how to cook and what to cook thru practice, mistakes, and > learning what foods are most suitable for each person, rather than > eating food which another prepares. > > Alobar > > On 11/20/08, sol <solbun@...> wrote: >> Starshar wrote: >> > I " know " I probably shouldn't eat grains at all, but in this household, and this society I am not able to drum up enough self-discipline to put myself on a rigorous diet. It would be really tough, since I have to cook for " the man " ! >> > >> >> I'm in the same boat. My DH is a big carb eater, and all white stuff >> too. He also has reactions to many of the ingredients in commercial >> bread and baked goods so I bake for him. It is difficult to keep out of >> " his " food. >> >> > I am 100% from northern European extraction and I'm Type O blood. Even though the blood typing is questionable at best, if D'Adamo has any of it right, it would be the O blood types. We are carnivores, and without enough meat we tend not to do very well. >> > >> >> Same here, we are very similar. >> >> > If/when I get myself disciplined I stay away from grains with the exception of an occasional piece of Ezekial bread. In addition to meats, fish, eggs, etc, I eat green veggies though I keep the leafy ones low, and if my weight is not a problem, I'll also eat root veggies. >> > I could happily live the rest of my life without ever eating a piece of fruit! >> > >> >> I'm exactly the same. But I can really overdo the ezekial (I only eat >> the one without soy). >> >> > It also really helps to get to know one's metabolic picture, and that is not easy for many people to do. >> > >> >> It takes some work to find one's metabolic type, some reading and >> research and experimentation. I find the great majority of people just >> want somebody to tell them what to do. So they choose a diet opinion and >> go with it, without finding out if it suits them. And since the wrong >> diet for one's metabolic type can take years to have its damage atart >> becoming obvious, it isn't that easy to connect the dots so long after >> the fact. >> >> People think I'm rude, but it is just that I really have been there done >> that with vegetarian and grain based diets, and I'm not interested in >> re-visiting it. I'm facing a different direction now, and don't want to >> turn and look backwards, and certainly don't want to go backwards. It >> is hard enough to undo almost 30 years of wrong diet, particularly when >> I don't have one single person in my life or in my aquaintance anymore >> who eats the way I need to. I'm surrounded by carb eaters and carbs. It >> is a battle for me to resist them. Particularly when I have to make >> them for my husband. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 20, 2008 Report Share Posted November 20, 2008 Is that Ron Rosedale's book? If yes, I would be very interested to hear your comments on it when you've read it. thanks, sol > > I'm a 'walking expert' on low carbing. The Leptin book is here, as yet unread. Thanks, Alobar > > Sharon > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 21, 2008 Report Share Posted November 21, 2008 I have a " clue " which might be the cause for sugar cravings but I am refusing to post my thoughts to this group. Some people have seen fit to complain to the moderator when I mention the products I sell. These same complainers post other websites that sell products. They don't deserve my posts of any kind ...which often do not mention of any products I sell. So if anyone is interested in my thoughts, please contact me privately EVEN if you disagree. There are those who can attest to the fact that I give interesting and informative information which does not necessarily always include the products I sell but when it does, I don't pull any punches; I am open and upfront about it because I sell among the best products on the 'net and I don't have to hide or sneak around about anything. Warning: The " clue " I am willing to give about sugar cravings will probably include a discussion of one or more products I sell because they may be the answer. If that bothers you, please don't write me. Helen ________________________________ From: Starshar <starshar@...> Coconut Oil Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2008 6:44:48 PM Subject: Re: Soy Hi Sol, I actually lasted 9 whole weeks without eating sugar in any form, while on Atkins. This was back in '98. After a few weeks, I found myself in total exhaustion (I already have fibromyalgia with the awful fatigue). This exhaustion was beyond belief. Eventually I succombed to sugar. It was only later that I realized that I had foolishly forgotten Atkin's constant admission to supplement with potassium! I was only getting what was in my multivit and the veggies at dinner. That 9 weeks was the longest period of my life of avoiding sugar and I wasn't *craving* it at all. What I did do, which was another mistake, was stay on the induction level. I just wasn't needing any carbs. I figure that all the supplemental nutrients kept the cravings away, until finally the lack of potassium may have tipped me over that edge. I'm wondering if you were really in need of some missing nutrient and that gave you the cravings? How about a lot of chromium---especial ly the form with the glucose tolerance factor, rather than the picolinate? there's got to be a clue somewhere! Sharon >I have read parts of Rosedale's book, but his diet is too low in animal > fat and protein for me. And too high in fruits as I recall. I should > read it again. > But doesn't he say leptin resistance and cravings leave in a short time > if you are on his diet? > In the low carb diet world this is such a common assumption, I hear it > constantly that cravings leave in a couple weeks if one is strict with > staying off the carbs on whatever eating plan is being touted. But my > carb cravings have never left, ever. > I have to assume that people just don't believe I've been strict and > have not cheated at all. Two and a half months Atkins induction, 100% > strict compliance did not reduce or eliminate carb cravings for me. I > have found that as long as I have these strong cravings I will > eventually slip. > Metabolic typing says that carb cravings can come from not having enough > of the right carbs, as well as from eating too much, but that is a very > slippery slope for me, and so far I keep losing my footing on it and > sliding right back down into eating not only carbs, but sugar. > So far I've not slipped deeply enough, long enough to go back to the > very high triglycerides I used to have, so I take small comfort in that. > My fasting blood sugar is ok and my hypoglycemia is also mostly under > control. By definitions I've read I am " pre-diabetic " , so this isn't > just a preference for me, I NEED to be high protein, high fat, and low > carb (Dr. Bernstein's diet for diabetes). I believe I read that Dr. > Bernstein himself hasn't eaten fruit for several decades. > oops, I've gone on too long, again, > sol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 21, 2008 Report Share Posted November 21, 2008 With enough water, on a low flame, and with a flame tamer underneath. Nina Re: Soy Nina Moliver wrote: > Fermented soy is radically > different from unfermented soy, and hydrogenated coconut oil is radically > different from virgin coconut oil. We can agree on those. > For grains, I usually use long grain Basmati rice or another kind of brown > rice, soaked and then cooked with coarse grey sea salt, tamari, ginger, and > VCO, for several hours. How do you cook rice for several hours? FWIW, my diet produces the same excretory results in me that your diet does in you. LOL. sol ------------------------------------ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 21, 2008 Report Share Posted November 21, 2008 Just wanted to add that even though I love it, I only eat soy moderately. I get protein from a variety of sources and all organic: chicken, turkey, fish, eggs, occasional light cheeses, and tofu and soymilk. So I'm not all-soy-all-the-time. My experience with it over the past 30+ years, since my oldest child was born, has all been good. My daughter, on the other hand, practically lived on soy and did develop thyroid problems, which seem resolved now that she seldom eats it. Now, soy flour...ugh...I'm with ya on that. It just smells bad. And texturized vegetable protein sits in my stomach like a rock. I make a tofu-rice casserole that my grown children invariably request for their birthdays, and I also have an angel-hair tofu dish that we all love. Those are for special occasions, though. nah > As to soy, it may do well for you, but down the road long years from > now, you may find yourself suffering from a thyroid problem or female > hormone imbalances. It takes many YEARS for the damage to build up. > However you may also get by with it for your entire life. > I ate soy for 30 years thinking it was healthy, used soymilk for > longer than that because my son was allergic to cow and goat milk and > soy formula is what he got (if I knew then what I know now about soy, I > would have found another alternative, believe me). I never liked soy > except for one or two things I made with tofu. I despise soy milk and > always have. And no soy product agrees with me, even in my 20s they gave > me terrible gas. But by god the " experts " all said it was healthy and so > I ate it. Even put soy flour in all baked goods. Now, I have a thyroid > problem, and Hashimoto's. Did soy alone cause it, no. Did soy have a > huge part in it, absolutely. FWIW, I used to make my own soy milk and > tofu from dried soybeans. Not fermented but the real deal, not the crap > from hydrolysed soy and isolated soy proteins that I switched to when > soy became popular. That was likely a huge mistake, but I'm not going to > go back to making my own soy stuff, as I never liked it and as I say, it > never agreed with my guts. And to use such a strong goitrogen now, as > well as its other detriments to ME, nope. > I learned a great lesson though. NOTHING I do now is because some > authority or expert told me to, or I read it in a respected author's > book or in a medical article, or because " they allow it to be sold, so > it must be safe-good for me. I started looking beyond soy and > vegetarianism/veganism because severely deteriorating healh forced me to > look beyond the " experts " I had believed in for decades. My body forced > me into it. Now, I read and research, and if I find something that seems > like it is worth a try, I try it. If it works for me, I keep on with it, > if it doesn't work or makes me feel worse, I abandon it. Soy is one > thing I've abandoned. And I believe most of the bad stuff I read about > it because it fits my personal experience and my body's reactions to a > T. I don't believe it just because I read it, but because what I read > tracks with my experience and explains a lot of experience that was > formerly unexplainable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 22, 2008 Report Share Posted November 22, 2008 A couple of clues about sugar cavings have been researched: malnutrition, particularly mineral deficiency, and of the minerals, low chromium seems to produce the srtrongest craving. The other one is the famed " glucose roller coaster " that makes one crave sugar as blood glucose levels fall. In my experience with non-diabetics and the non-obese, cravings usually disappear once sometone has been on a better diet including taking a good mineral supplement like Kona Gold (montmorillonite) plus chromium (in Canada we use chromium polynicotinate) for around 3 weeks. I think cutting habits such as the bedtime snack or sugar in the coffee or pop is good too. all good Duncan > > > I have a " clue " which might be the cause for sugar cravings > but I am refusing to post my thoughts to this group. > > Some people have seen fit to complain to the moderator > when I mention the products I sell. These same complainers > post other websites that sell products. They don't deserve > my posts of any kind ...which often do not mention of any > products I sell. > > So if anyone is interested in my thoughts, please contact > me privately EVEN if you disagree. There are those who > can attest to the fact that I give interesting and informative > information which does not necessarily always include the > products I sell but when it does, I don't pull any punches; > I am open and upfront about it because I sell among the > best products on the 'net and I don't have to hide or > sneak around about anything. > > Warning: The " clue " I am willing to give about sugar > cravings will probably include a discussion of one or > more products I sell because they may be the answer. > If that bothers you, please don't write me. > > Helen > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > From: Starshar <starshar@...> > Coconut Oil > Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2008 6:44:48 PM > Subject: Re: Soy > > > Hi Sol, > > I actually lasted 9 whole weeks without eating sugar in any form, while on Atkins. This was back in '98. > After a few weeks, I found myself in total exhaustion (I already have fibromyalgia with the awful fatigue). This exhaustion was beyond belief. Eventually I succombed to sugar. It was only later that I realized that I had foolishly forgotten Atkin's constant admission to supplement with potassium! I was only getting what was in my multivit and the veggies at dinner. > > That 9 weeks was the longest period of my life of avoiding sugar and I wasn't *craving* it at all. What I did do, which was another mistake, was stay on the induction level. I just wasn't needing any carbs. I figure that all the supplemental nutrients kept the cravings away, until finally the lack of potassium may have tipped me over that edge. > > I'm wondering if you were really in need of some missing nutrient and that gave you the cravings? How about a lot of chromium---especial ly the form with the glucose tolerance factor, rather than the picolinate? > > there's got to be a clue somewhere! > > Sharon > > >I have read parts of Rosedale's book, but his diet is too low in animal > > fat and protein for me. And too high in fruits as I recall. I should > > read it again. > > But doesn't he say leptin resistance and cravings leave in a short time > > if you are on his diet? > > In the low carb diet world this is such a common assumption, I hear it > > constantly that cravings leave in a couple weeks if one is strict with > > staying off the carbs on whatever eating plan is being touted. But my > > carb cravings have never left, ever. > > I have to assume that people just don't believe I've been strict and > > have not cheated at all. Two and a half months Atkins induction, 100% > > strict compliance did not reduce or eliminate carb cravings for me. I > > have found that as long as I have these strong cravings I will > > eventually slip. > > Metabolic typing says that carb cravings can come from not having enough > > of the right carbs, as well as from eating too much, but that is a very > > slippery slope for me, and so far I keep losing my footing on it and > > sliding right back down into eating not only carbs, but sugar. > > So far I've not slipped deeply enough, long enough to go back to the > > very high triglycerides I used to have, so I take small comfort in that. > > My fasting blood sugar is ok and my hypoglycemia is also mostly under > > control. By definitions I've read I am " pre-diabetic " , so this isn't > > just a preference for me, I NEED to be high protein, high fat, and low > > carb (Dr. Bernstein's diet for diabetes). I believe I read that Dr. > > Bernstein himself hasn't eaten fruit for several decades. > > oops, I've gone on too long, again, > > sol > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 10, 2008 Report Share Posted December 10, 2008 So there was so much upset around the whole soy thing that I said about soy that I wrote my doctor. I asked her if she had any articles that she had access to that she could send me. This was her reply. Brief because she is so busy and does not have much time. I did send the Weston Price site article in my last email.SueFrom: Tristin Wallace, ND <dr.tee.nd@...>Subject: Re: SoyTo: featherednst@...Date: Wednesday, December 10, 2008, 3:15 PMMy own undergraduate research, for one thing. Thousands of articleson PubMed, for another, which they won't know how to access.WestonAPrice.org has a blurb called The Truth About Soy.Anybody who disses the meticulous and empirical work of Weston A Priceis not paying attention to reality.>>-- Tristin WallaceNaturopath, Applied KinesiologistStamford Center for Natural Health111 High Ridge RoadStamford, CT 06905203-325-3535203-504-5020 faxwww.stamfordnaturalhealth.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 26, 2008 Report Share Posted December 26, 2008 I was under the imprtession that soy is an avoid for type O. And since almost 100% of soy in the US is now GMO, I won't go near it. " enfood " is not on my menu... Merrill > > I am confused, can someone clear this up for me. I receive > newsletters from Dr. Mercola and he states soy is a no no, yet we on > the BTD are reommended to use soy products (but not fermented ??). > > Any one shed some light on my confusion and enlighten me? > > Thank you to and happy Holidays. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 26, 2008 Report Share Posted December 26, 2008 That is the impression I am under. Yet, as I was reading some info on the BTD just now, to wean off dairy to soy. Again so confused. " Merrill " wrote: > > I was under the imprtession that soy is an avoid for type O. > And since almost 100% of soy in the US is now GMO, I won't go near it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 28, 2008 Report Share Posted December 28, 2008 Are you reading about O's? On Fri, Dec 26, 2008 at 4:03 PM, virgomoongddss <vanillawolf@...>wrote: > That is the impression I am under. Yet, as I was reading some info on > the BTD just now, to wean off dairy to soy. Again so confused. > > " Merrill " wrote: > > > > I was under the imprtession that soy is an avoid for type O. > > And since almost 100% of soy in the US is now GMO, I won't go near it. > > > -- Cheers, Kathy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 28, 2008 Report Share Posted December 28, 2008 Yes , I am referring to O's. Soy alternative are recommended on the O lists and in the Blood Type O Food & Beverage & Supplement List under 'eggs & dairy' section that dairy should be restricted but in moderation (depending on ethnicity). Next paragraph states soy milk & soy cheese are excellent, hi protein alternatives vs dairy protein for O's. So, my question again is the concern with soy (there is chock of info on the Mercola site re soy not being the health food you would think). So, does Dr. D know something we don't or even Dr. Mercola? That between dairy & soy, soy is the lesser evil? Unless I read this all wrong, I am most anxious to hear other peoples thoughts on this particular subject. I am using the BTD for my health & well being due to a dx (boy, last year doing vegetarian might have been my culprit due to my blood type O! Who knew. Glad I learned of the BTD.) Dorte The Evidence Against Soy-Articles http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2008/10/07/the-evidence-again\ st-soy.aspx " s " wrote: > > Are you reading about O's? > > > > .... That is the impression I am under. Yet, as I was reading some info on the BTD just now, to wean off dairy to soy. > > -- > Cheers, > Kathy > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 28, 2008 Report Share Posted December 28, 2008 Where are you reading that Dr D is advocating soy for Os? I do not have my blood type encyclopedia with me but seem to recall that it does NOT suggest soy.... I just checked on web and SOY is listed as " occasional " for type O and and " avoid " for type B. The url is: http://curezone.com/ER4YT/beans.asp A more complete list may be this one, done by steve shapiro: http://www.uoregon.edu/~sshapiro/ER4YT/Type_O_Caucasian_Page_3.html Good luck! Merrill > > > > Are you reading about O's? > > > > > > > > > > ... That is the impression I am under. Yet, as I was reading some > info on the BTD just now, to wean off dairy to soy. > > > > > -- > > Cheers, > > Kathy > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 29, 2008 Report Share Posted December 29, 2008 Don't feel bad...at least one website on " O foods " the says it is passing on d'adamo info suggest soy as being ok for O's. Laure > > Sorry, I guess it's been too long ago that I read thru O info. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 29, 2008 Report Share Posted December 29, 2008 " Merrill " wrote: " Where are you reading that Dr D is advocating soy for Os? " My previous post (quoted from this particular list): ..... Soy alternative are recommended on the O lists and in the Blood Type O Food & Beverage & Supplement List under 'eggs & dairy' section that dairy should be restricted but in moderation (depending on ethnicity). Next paragraph states soy milk & soy cheese are excellent hi protein alternatives vs dairy protein for O's. (Thanks for sharing those links & info Merrill & to all the other insights shared. Guess there is not a cut & dry answer. So much disclosed about soy being a no no, yet .... oh well, will continue to scratch my head on this on. *grins*) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 30, 2008 Report Share Posted December 30, 2008 " Laure Haro " wrote: Because there are well-meaning " experts " on both sides of the soy question, I think it behooves us all to look further at this topic.... ---Wow, what data on soy! Yes, soy has had it attacks. I had written a post yesterday & waiting on it to post here on the group, once that is done will share what I have since learned or at least share links so we can make our own determination. Feeling a bit better about this soy issue. :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 30, 2008 Report Share Posted December 30, 2008 The general consensus in the group so far appears to be: AVOID SOY...no matter which blood type you happen to belong. Ironically, soy milk, soy cheese, soy flakes, soy beans, tofu, etc. are all listed as " NEUTRAL " for Type O secretors. And I agree with Irene, the research overwhelmingly demonstrates that soy " causes a skewed immune system " response and then some. However, for blood type A, D'Adamo clearly states that soy is " BENEFICIAL: Contains an agglutinin that modifies disease susceptibility " . I must also join the ranks of the confused here. How can anyone possibly trust the dietary recommendations, or more importantly- the credibility, of a man (D'Adamo) who clearly makes such reckless and irresponsible errors in judgement? It makes no sense that blood Type- O's purposely " AVOID " nutrient dense foods like raw dairy, avocados, etc. based on the recommendations of the same man that condones and encourages eating soy. Folks, ER4YT is nothing more than a set of delusions that currently reside somewhere out in the realm of psuedo-science & fantasy-land. If ER4YT were actually legitimate, why did D'Adamo not bother to conduct, or at least wait for one peer reviewed, controlled study that lends legitimate scientific credence to this alleged harmful dietary lectin connection (in othwerwise healthful foods)...especially as dietary lectins relate to complex living systems like us human beings? The answer is obvious: outside of people suffering from intenstinal permeability or " Leaky Gut Syndrome " - A CONNECTION BETWEEN DEGENERATIVE DISEASE, HUMAN HEALTH & FOOD LECTINS DOES NOT EXIST. More importantly, can any Type O that has ever declared dietary success on ER4YT really attribute their benefits to ER4YT? For example, Dr. Atkins successfully told everyone to cut carbs (corn, wheat, etc.), while recommending meat on a high protein diet...long before anyone ever heard of D'Adamo or ? And, just about any high protein, low carb diet that detours us away from the Standard American Diet(whether Atkins, Healthy for Life, Paleolithic, Metabolic Typing, Mercola's " No Grain " , etc.) will yield positive results completely unrelated to ER4YT or the action of these naughty little lectins. While I have found Mercola to be generally annoying at times, at least his work is credible and predominatly based on solid science. Although Mercola may not formulate many original ideas or research of his own, at least his associates (especially his colleagues on the board of the Westin Price Foundation, that regularly serve as his principle reference sources) represent some of the most credible minds and researchers in nutrition today. At a miniumum, Mercola has been a lightning rod in a growing health movement and has exposed a myriad of health conspiracy's. Is anyone noteworthy or credible supporting D'Adamo or ER4YT? Just curious, because all I've seen is condemnation of the diet (although he is getting rich writing fiction). Also, out of curiosity Irene, and I mean no disrespect here, which " incorrect " aspect(s) of Mercola's website are you referring? > > I'm not Mercola's greatest fan because he will not correct things on > his website that he KNOWS are proven incorrect. issue I do agree it is a no-no, because research > shows soy to be bad for us. > But research shows tht soy caasues a skewed immune system in the saem > direction as doesw vaccine damage - namely to excessive H-2 cytokine > production (leading to Th-2 skewed illness such as asthma, allergies, > cancer, diabetes, auto-immune diseases and a host of others) and a > reduction in Thytmus activity which is our defenc e against chronic > diseaSE. > > SO FOR THAT REASON ALONE (AND THERE ARE OTHERS) I WILL NOT TOUCH SOY > WITH BARGEPOLE. > Oops sorry re the caploc, my typing skills are non-est. > > Namaste, > Irene Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 31, 2008 Report Share Posted December 31, 2008 The general consensus in the group so far appears to be: AVOID SOY...no matter which blood type you happen to belong. Ironically, soy milk, soy cheese, soy flakes, soy beans, tofu, etc. are all listed as " NEUTRAL " for Type O secretors. And I agree with Irene, the research overwhelmingly demonstrates that soy " causes a skewed immune system " response and then some. However, for blood type A, D'Adamo clearly states that soy is " BENEFICIAL: Contains an agglutinin that modifies disease susceptibility " . I am also confused. How can anyone possibly trust the dietary recommendations, or more importantly- the credibility, of a man (D'Adamo) who clearly makes such reckless and irresponsible errors in judgement? It makes no sense that blood Type-O's purposely " AVOID " nutrient dense foods like raw dairy, avocados, etc. based on the recommendations of the same man that condones and encourages eating soy. Folks, ER4YT is nothing more than a set of delusions that currently reside somewhere out in the realm of psuedo-science & fantasy-land. If ER4YT were actually legitimate, why did D'Adamo not bother to conduct, or at least wait for one peer reviewed, controlled study that lends legitimate scientific credence to this alleged harmful dietary lectin connection (in othwerwise healthful foods)...especially as dietary lectins relate to complex living systems like us human beings? The answer is obvious: outside of people suffering from intenstinal permeability or " Leaky Gut Syndrome " - A CONNECTION BETWEEN DEGENERATIVE DISEASE, HUMAN HEALTH & FOOD LECTINS DOES NOT EXIST. More importantly, can any Type O that has ever declared dietary success on ER4YT really attribute their benefits to ER4YT? For example, Dr. Atkins successfully told everyone to cut carbs (corn, wheat, etc.), while recommending meat on a high protein diet...long before . And, just about any high protein, low carb diet that detours us away from the Standard American Diet(whether Atkins, Healthy for Life, Paleolithic, Metabolic Typing, Mercola's " No Grain " , etc.) will yield positive results completely unrelated to ER4YT or dietary lectins. While I have found Mercola to be generally annoying at times, at least his work is credible and predominatly based on solid science. Although Mercola may not formulate many original ideas or research of his own, at least his associates (especially his colleagues on the board of the Westin Price Foundation, that regularly serve as his principle reference sources) represent some of the most credible minds and researchers in nutrition today. At a miniumum, Mercola has been a lightning rod in a growing health movement that has exposed a myriad of health conspiracy's. Also, out of curiosity Irene, and I mean no disrespect here, which " incorrect " aspect(s) of Mercola's website are you referring? > > > I am confused, can someone clear this up for me. I receive > > newsletters from Dr. Mercola and he states soy is a no no, yet we on > > the BTD are reommended to use soy products (but not fermented ??). > > > > Any one shed some light on my confusion and enlighten me? > > > I'm not Mercola's greatest fan because he will not correct things on > his website that he KNOWS are proven incorrect. > To me this makes his site worthless. > > However on the soy issue I do agree it is a no-no, because research > shows soy to be bad for us. > Soy is after all an agricultural by-product that the industry wanted > to find a way to get rid of - why not find a way to make it sound > good and mak money .... > > But research shows tht soy caasues a skewed immune system in the saem > direction as doesw vaccine damage - namely to excessive H-2 cytokine > production (leading to Th-2 skewed illness such as asthma, allergies, > cancer, diabetes, auto-immune diseases and a host of others) and a > reduction in Thytmus activity which is our defenc e against chronic > diseaSE. > > SO FOR THAT REASON ALONE (AND THERE ARE OTHERS) I WILL NOT TOUCH SOY > WITH BARGEPOLE. > Oops sorry re the caploc, my typing skills are non-est. > > Namaste, > Irene > -- > Irene de Villiers, B.Sc AASCA MCSSA D.I.Hom/D.Vet.Hom. > P.O. Box 4703 Spokane WA 99220. > www.angelfire.com/fl/furryboots/clickhere.html (Veterinary Homeopath.) > " Man who say it cannot be done should not interrupt one doing it. " > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 3, 2009 Report Share Posted January 3, 2009 >>The answer is obvious: outside of people suffering from intenstinal permeability or " Leaky Gut Syndrome " - A CONNECTION BETWEEN DEGENERATIVE DISEASE, HUMAN HEALTH & FOOD LECTINS DOES NOT EXIST. << Isn't that a pretty big exception? Marie -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- http://lift-up-your-hearts.blogspot.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 4, 2009 Report Share Posted January 4, 2009 Please explain...exception to what? b/c my understanding of " Leaky Gut Syndrome " is that just about every beneficial component of otherwise nutirious foods could potentially prove toxic. > >>The answer is obvious: outside of > people suffering from intenstinal permeability or " Leaky Gut > Syndrome " - A CONNECTION BETWEEN DEGENERATIVE DISEASE, HUMAN HEALTH & > FOOD LECTINS DOES NOT EXIST. << > > Isn't that a pretty big exception? > > > Marie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 4, 2009 Report Share Posted January 4, 2009 I wanted to weigh in on this with my two cents. When I follow the ER4YT diet, I avoid dairy products and purchase dairy-free alternative products that almost always are soy- based (i.e. Sour cream, ice cream, cream cheese). I want to engage in the pleasure of eating these types of foods and still remaining dairy-free, therefore I happily will consume large quantities. Thank you soy! . > > >>The answer is obvious: outside of > people suffering from intenstinal permeability or " Leaky Gut > Syndrome " - A CONNECTION BETWEEN DEGENERATIVE DISEASE, HUMAN HEALTH & > FOOD LECTINS DOES NOT EXIST. << > > Isn't that a pretty big exception? > > > Marie > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > http://lift-up-your-hearts.blogspot.com/ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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