Re: NEED help with my young husband and his LOW testosterone!!

[Guest guest]

Hi and welcome,

I did talk to one young man 2yrs. ago he has the same problem after a

vasectomy he was going to go on TRT and he posted at WebMD to the Uro there and

the Dr. told him men can get an infection after a vasedtomy that is dam hard to

find. And it takes a certain antiboytic to get rid of it. After he got rid of

the infection his testosterone levels come back up. Please do not let him take

T meds until every possable test is done to find out why he is low. If he does

not have this problem go to www.allthingsmale.com and read TRT: A Recipe for

success and in this are the tests he needs and why. If he goes on T meds it is

dam hard to find out why he is low. Doing T meds is for life and a lot of

things can cause his levels to go down and when it is fixed they come back up.

Here is a link to the webMD site you can try posting to the Dr. about this.

http://boards.webmd.com/webx?14488 (DOT) O4zka6MTdIA.0@.5987f442

If you need more help just ask.

Phil

<d_timmsjosey@...> wrote:

Hi y'all! New here!

My husband had a vasectomy 3.5 years ago. SInce then, his health has

declined (although I was told on the vasectomy board that this has

nothing to do with his isues). Finally I got some answers and it

appear that his

testosterone is at the very bottom of the range 6.65 (range 6.5 -

28.1). He is only 32. He has become crabby, snappy with the children

(has even cried to me because he says he is no longer the same

person). He is also tired (fatigued) and the sex drive is literally

gonzo. It has also been discovered that his estrogen is low as well as

his DHEA (approx. 140 and it should be around 400+), levels of a MUCH

older man.

Is there anyone out there that can relate to what we are going

through? I will do anything to get my husband back. He is way too

young to be having these hormonal issues. My doc (a hormones

specialist) tried to get his hormones up with supplemental DHEA and it

has done nothing, in fact his testosterone dipped even lower. She

today, prescribed testosterone. Thanks!!!!!

[Guest guest]

Thank you phil! Well my doc has run a CBc, thyroid (he does have lots

of thyroid problems on his mom'd side of the family, and his thyroid

levels are a little low, but his dhea is low and when he added in 50

mg/day, it increased the thyroid levels a tad). I don't think this is

where we need to concentrate (I have thyroid disease, so I am prety

well-versed there lol). The DHEA did not increase the testosterone nor

did it increase his estrogen levels. His blood sugar levels are good,

his BP is good (for now). His liver tests are good, iron good, no

other complaints except fatigue, memory loss, brain fog, zilch sex

drive and now he has a blad spot on the nape of his neck (not male

pattern baldness, but alopecia, which I REALLY think is related to all

these hormonal issues). I am very worried about his health. I would

rather him get on the T and get back to normal.

As for the vas infection, wouldn't he have symptoms? Thanks so much!!!

>

> Hi and welcome,

>

> I did talk to one young man 2yrs. ago he has the same problem

after a vasectomy he was going to go on TRT and he posted at WebMD to

the Uro there and the Dr. told him men can get an infection after a

vasedtomy that is dam hard to find. And it takes a certain antiboytic

to get rid of it. After he got rid of the infection his testosterone

levels come back up. Please do not let him take T meds until every

possable test is done to find out why he is low. If he does not have

this problem go to www.allthingsmale.com and read TRT: A Recipe for

success and in this are the tests he needs and why. If he goes on T

meds it is dam hard to find out why he is low. Doing T meds is for

life and a lot of things can cause his levels to go down and when it

is fixed they come back up. Here is a link to the webMD site you can

try posting to the Dr. about this.

> http://boards.webmd.com/webx?14@...@.5987f442

> If you need more help just ask.

> Phil

>

> <d_timmsjosey@...> wrote:

> Hi y'all! New here!

>

> My husband had a vasectomy 3.5 years ago. SInce then, his health has

> declined (although I was told on the vasectomy board that this has

> nothing to do with his isues). Finally I got some answers and it

> appear that his

> testosterone is at the very bottom of the range 6.65 (range 6.5 -

> 28.1). He is only 32. He has become crabby, snappy with the children

> (has even cried to me because he says he is no longer the same

> person). He is also tired (fatigued) and the sex drive is literally

> gonzo. It has also been discovered that his estrogen is low as well as

> his DHEA (approx. 140 and it should be around 400+), levels of a MUCH

> older man.

>

> Is there anyone out there that can relate to what we are going

> through? I will do anything to get my husband back. He is way too

> young to be having these hormonal issues. My doc (a hormones

> specialist) tried to get his hormones up with supplemental DHEA and it

> has done nothing, in fact his testosterone dipped even lower. She

> today, prescribed testosterone. Thanks!!!!!

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I've a question or two.

Has hubby been on any meds prescription,

gray market, or OTC?

How much DHEA did he try? I had an alternative

Doc who told me to take DHEA on the basis of

a low test and then he doubled the dose which

didn't raise my levels much according to the next

test by much. So I try adding another 25 milligrams

which seemed to increase my estrogen levels.

Not a good thing as that suppresses the HPT axis.

It made my breasts itch (at least they didn't grow)

and my prostate started to swell and it felt

a little sore. In my case, my estrogen levels

were also low when I was tested before I started on

the DHEA. It wasn't tested during the use of PPI meds.

And I'd been off of the PPI meds for awhile.

Years before I'd taken it with

good results at rate of 25 milligrams per day.

But I was having acid reflux and the Docs

had me on rabeprazole and later omeprazole.

These PPI meds cause a slowing of the metabolization of

estrogen and thus cause endocrine disruption.

As the DHEA quit helping back when I was taking the PPI meds,

I had stopped them some years before.

Hopefully he can get checked out before going on

testosterone replacement to see what the underlying

problem is. Hopefully she is not pushing monthly or shots

every two weeks? These guys here know more on the

topic than the majority of Docs. Prolactin level...

was it high? Primary or secondary?

Anyway, DHEA tends to raise estrogen levels in males due to

as I recall the " first pass effect " thru the liver.

>

> Hi y'all! New here!

>

> My husband had a vasectomy 3.5 years ago. SInce then, his health has

> declined (although I was told on the vasectomy board that this has

> nothing to do with his isues). Finally I got some answers and it

> appear that his

> testosterone is at the very bottom of the range 6.65 (range 6.5 -

> 28.1). He is only 32. He has become crabby, snappy with the children

> (has even cried to me because he says he is no longer the same

> person). He is also tired (fatigued) and the sex drive is literally

> gonzo. It has also been discovered that his estrogen is low as well

as

> his DHEA (approx. 140 and it should be around 400+), levels of a

MUCH

> older man.

>

> Is there anyone out there that can relate to what we are going

> through? I will do anything to get my husband back. He is way too

> young to be having these hormonal issues. My doc (a hormones

> specialist) tried to get his hormones up with supplemental DHEA and

it

> has done nothing, in fact his testosterone dipped even lower. She

> today, prescribed testosterone. Thanks!!!!!

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi,

He is curretnly on 50mg of DHEA. His labs revealed that the estrogen

is still low even on that. He was told to double the dose to 100mg

because even with 50mg, his DHEA is still in the pits. Other than

that, he is not taking anything else except multivitamins.

I am not sure if she checked prolactin levels the first round.

WOuldn't he have leaking nipples if it was elevated? I don't know. Us

women have that with elevated prolactin.

I think the doc feels that the dhea is not going to do the trick, but

she wants his levels up. I told her the sex drive thing is too unreal

to deal with anymore. SHe told me she was not going to do shots, but

wanted to put him on a compounded (bioidentical) gel. I think its

100mg or 1ml/day. I will recheck. Thanks!

> Has hubby been on any meds prescription,

> gray market, or OTC?

>

> How much DHEA did he try? I had an alternative

> Doc who told me to take DHEA on the basis of

> a low test and then he doubled the dose which

> didn't raise my levels much according to the next

> test by much. So I try adding another 25 milligrams

> which seemed to increase my estrogen levels.

> Not a good thing as that suppresses the HPT axis.

> It made my breasts itch (at least they didn't grow)

> and my prostate started to swell and it felt

> a little sore. In my case, my estrogen levels

> were also low when I was tested before I started on

> the DHEA. It wasn't tested during the use of PPI meds.

> And I'd been off of the PPI meds for awhile.

> Years before I'd taken it with

> good results at rate of 25 milligrams per day.

> But I was having acid reflux and the Docs

> had me on rabeprazole and later omeprazole.

> These PPI meds cause a slowing of the metabolization of

> estrogen and thus cause endocrine disruption.

> As the DHEA quit helping back when I was taking the PPI meds,

> I had stopped them some years before.

>

> Hopefully he can get checked out before going on

> testosterone replacement to see what the underlying

> problem is. Hopefully she is not pushing monthly or shots

> every two weeks? These guys here know more on the

> topic than the majority of Docs. Prolactin level...

> was it high? Primary or secondary?

>

> Anyway, DHEA tends to raise estrogen levels in males due to

> as I recall the " first pass effect " thru the liver.

>

>

>

>

> >

> > Hi y'all! New here!

> >

> > My husband had a vasectomy 3.5 years ago. SInce then, his health has

> > declined (although I was told on the vasectomy board that this has

> > nothing to do with his isues). Finally I got some answers and it

> > appear that his

> > testosterone is at the very bottom of the range 6.65 (range 6.5 -

> > 28.1). He is only 32. He has become crabby, snappy with the children

> > (has even cried to me because he says he is no longer the same

> > person). He is also tired (fatigued) and the sex drive is literally

> > gonzo. It has also been discovered that his estrogen is low as well

> as

> > his DHEA (approx. 140 and it should be around 400+), levels of a

> MUCH

> > older man.

> >

> > Is there anyone out there that can relate to what we are going

> > through? I will do anything to get my husband back. He is way too

> > young to be having these hormonal issues. My doc (a hormones

> > specialist) tried to get his hormones up with supplemental DHEA and

> it

> > has done nothing, in fact his testosterone dipped even lower. She

> > today, prescribed testosterone. Thanks!!!!!

> >

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

>

> Hi y'all! New here!

>

> My husband had a vasectomy 3.5 years ago. SInce then, his health has

> declined (although I was told on the vasectomy board that this has

> nothing to do with his isues). Finally I got some answers and it

> appear that his

> testosterone is at the very bottom of the range 6.65 (range 6.5 -

> 28.1). He is only 32. He has become crabby, snappy with the children

> (has even cried to me because he says he is no longer the same

> person). He is also tired (fatigued) and the sex drive is literally

> gonzo. It has also been discovered that his estrogen is low

Not that surprising that estrogen is low when test is low.

> as well as

> his DHEA (approx. 140 and it should be around 400+), levels of a MUCH

> older man.

>

> Is there anyone out there that can relate to what we are going

> through?

Pretty much all of us. Except you're lucky to have a doc that will

prescribe testosterone without alot of arm-twisting.

> I will do anything to get my husband back. He is way too

> young to be having these hormonal issues.

You can have problems at any age.

> My doc (a hormones

> specialist) tried to get his hormones up with supplemental DHEA

Trying to boost low testosterone with DHEA seems very unrealistic to me.

> and it has done nothing,

I find it effective for boosting DHEA-S but not testosterone.

> in fact his testosterone dipped even lower. She

> today, prescribed testosterone. Thanks!!!!!

>

It would have been nice to have determined whether he has primary or

secondary hypogonadism before starting testosterone. I understand

that fertility isn't an issue but some men who are able like to use

hcg for other reasons.

Brad

[Guest guest]

Hi -

Betaine, brad and Phil have already given you good

advice and I would agree with all that they said. Let

me just add -

1. I would be very concerned about your " hormone

specialist " doc. To me, prescribing DHEA to correct

low testosterone is voodoo medicine. If you do the

research, you will find that, in males, DHEA can

convert to either testosterone or estrogen. I don't

know of any doctor who knows what they are doing who

would prescribe DHEA to treat a testosterone

deficiency. Which is not to say that the low DHEA

should not be treated with a supplement.

2. What testosterone has been prescribed? Be aware

that exogenous testosterone will shut down your

husband's own production and the exogenous

testosterone may not be enough to bring him back to

where he was. He may wind up with lower levels and

feeling worse as a result of this prescription. This

has happened to many of us.

3. Be nice to your husband. He is having to deal with

a very tough issue. I know from experience.

Jim

--- <d_timmsjosey@...> wrote:

> Hi y'all! New here!

>

> My husband had a vasectomy 3.5 years ago. SInce

> then, his health has

> declined (although I was told on the vasectomy board

> that this has

> nothing to do with his isues). Finally I got some

> answers and it

> appear that his

> testosterone is at the very bottom of the range 6.65

> (range 6.5 -

> 28.1). He is only 32. He has become crabby, snappy

> with the children

> (has even cried to me because he says he is no

> longer the same

> person). He is also tired (fatigued) and the sex

> drive is literally

> gonzo. It has also been discovered that his estrogen

> is low as well as

> his DHEA (approx. 140 and it should be around 400+),

> levels of a MUCH

> older man.

>

> Is there anyone out there that can relate to what we

> are going

> through? I will do anything to get my husband back.

> He is way too

> young to be having these hormonal issues. My doc (a

> hormones

> specialist) tried to get his hormones up with

> supplemental DHEA and it

> has done nothing, in fact his testosterone dipped

> even lower. She

> today, prescribed testosterone. Thanks!!!!!

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

On Thu, 10 Aug 2006 00:18:58 -0000, you wrote:

>Hi y'all! New here!

>

>My husband had a vasectomy 3.5 years ago. SInce then, his health has

>declined (although I was told on the vasectomy board that this has

>nothing to do with his isues). Finally I got some answers and it

>appear that his

>testosterone is at the very bottom of the range 6.65 (range 6.5 -

>28.1). He is only 32. He has become crabby, snappy with the children

>(has even cried to me because he says he is no longer the same

>person). He is also tired (fatigued) and the sex drive is literally

>gonzo. It has also been discovered that his estrogen is low as well as

>his DHEA (approx. 140 and it should be around 400+), levels of a MUCH

>older man.

>

>Is there anyone out there that can relate to what we are going

>through? I will do anything to get my husband back. He is way too

>young to be having these hormonal issues. My doc (a hormones

>specialist) tried to get his hormones up with supplemental DHEA and it

>has done nothing, in fact his testosterone dipped even lower. She

>today, prescribed testosterone. Thanks!!!!!

>

>

You'll need to begin reading:

Start with this:

http://www.aace.com/pub/pdf/guidelines/hypogonadism.pdf

Guidelines by the AMERICAN ASSOCIATION OF CLINICAL ENDOCRINOLOGISTS

Also look at:

http://www.endo-society.org/quickcontent/clinicalpractice/clinical-guidelines/up\

load/AndrogensMenGuideline053006.pdf

But the best read for understanding will be Dr. Shippen's book

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/087131858X/sr=1-1/qid=1155184828/ref=sr_1_1/103\

-3971708-8545445?ie=UTF8 & s=books

The Testosterone Syndrome. It will get you a good understanding. Order

a copy right away or check your library. (It' s about $6 used)

The other two links you can read on line while you wait for the book.

________________

I am human; nothing in humanity is alien to me.

Terence

[Guest guest]

that infection is so low it is dam hard to find men can have it for a

long time and as they get older there body can fight it off any more and things

like low T happen.

The reasion I say do everything possabe to find out what is wrong before doing

TRT is if he had a low infection or a liver problem the T will not make him feel

better it is a band-aid. He can also be suffering from Adrenal Fatigue have his

morning Cortisol levels checked. If this is low it will drive down T levels.

Better to be safe then sorry once he starts on T meds a lot of test will not

find other problems. We have found here that Dr.'s will not put men that need

to be on TRT and Dr.'s that are to fast to put men on TRT. A good Dr. on low T

is dam hard to find and you just can't look in a book or do what the drug reps

say.

Phil

<d_timmsjosey@...> wrote:

Thank you phil! Well my doc has run a CBc, thyroid (he does have lots

of thyroid problems on his mom'd side of the family, and his thyroid

levels are a little low, but his dhea is low and when he added in 50

mg/day, it increased the thyroid levels a tad). I don't think this is

where we need to concentrate (I have thyroid disease, so I am prety

well-versed there lol). The DHEA did not increase the testosterone nor

did it increase his estrogen levels. His blood sugar levels are good,

his BP is good (for now). His liver tests are good, iron good, no

other complaints except fatigue, memory loss, brain fog, zilch sex

drive and now he has a blad spot on the nape of his neck (not male

pattern baldness, but alopecia, which I REALLY think is related to all

these hormonal issues). I am very worried about his health. I would

rather him get on the T and get back to normal.

As for the vas infection, wouldn't he have symptoms? Thanks so much!!!

>

> Hi and welcome,

>

> I did talk to one young man 2yrs. ago he has the same problem

after a vasectomy he was going to go on TRT and he posted at WebMD to

the Uro there and the Dr. told him men can get an infection after a

vasedtomy that is dam hard to find. And it takes a certain antiboytic

to get rid of it. After he got rid of the infection his testosterone

levels come back up. Please do not let him take T meds until every

possable test is done to find out why he is low. If he does not have

this problem go to www.allthingsmale.com and read TRT: A Recipe for

success and in this are the tests he needs and why. If he goes on T

meds it is dam hard to find out why he is low. Doing T meds is for

life and a lot of things can cause his levels to go down and when it

is fixed they come back up. Here is a link to the webMD site you can

try posting to the Dr. about this.

> http://boards.webmd.com/webx?14@...@.5987f442

> If you need more help just ask.

> Phil

>

> wrote:

> Hi y'all! New here!

>

> My husband had a vasectomy 3.5 years ago. SInce then, his health has

> declined (although I was told on the vasectomy board that this has

> nothing to do with his isues). Finally I got some answers and it

> appear that his

> testosterone is at the very bottom of the range 6.65 (range 6.5 -

> 28.1). He is only 32. He has become crabby, snappy with the children

> (has even cried to me because he says he is no longer the same

> person). He is also tired (fatigued) and the sex drive is literally

> gonzo. It has also been discovered that his estrogen is low as well as

> his DHEA (approx. 140 and it should be around 400+), levels of a MUCH

> older man.

>

> Is there anyone out there that can relate to what we are going

> through? I will do anything to get my husband back. He is way too

> young to be having these hormonal issues. My doc (a hormones

> specialist) tried to get his hormones up with supplemental DHEA and it

> has done nothing, in fact his testosterone dipped even lower. She

> today, prescribed testosterone. Thanks!!!!!

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

here is some input on Estrogen in men it is not the Estrogen that is the

bad guy here but his Estradiol a lot of men lose there sex drive and have bad ED

when Estradiol is high and it can drive down his T levels. The brain can't tell

the difference between Testosterone and Estradiol in the cells if Estradiol is

high the brain will think it is Testosterone and stop sending the LH and FSH

messages to his testis to make Testosterone. Men that have this problem if they

treat the high Estradiol first there T levels can come up some 200 to 300 points

on a blood test. He needs a test like this.

http://www.labcorp.com/datasets/labcorp/html/chapter/mono/sr012000.htm

This is a study on getting E2 down and bring up T levels.

http://www.medibolics.com/ArimidexBoostsTestosterone.htm

This link is dam good full of info.

http://www.smart-drugs.com/ias-estrogen.htm

Also get the book by Dr. Shippen called " The Testosterone Syndorme " it is a

little dated but still a big help.

And last by not least the AACE Guildlines a must read.

http://www.aace.com/pub/pdf/guidelines/hypogonadism.pdf

Phil

<d_timmsjosey@...> wrote:

Hi,

He is curretnly on 50mg of DHEA. His labs revealed that the estrogen

is still low even on that. He was told to double the dose to 100mg

because even with 50mg, his DHEA is still in the pits. Other than

that, he is not taking anything else except multivitamins.

I am not sure if she checked prolactin levels the first round.

WOuldn't he have leaking nipples if it was elevated? I don't know. Us

women have that with elevated prolactin.

I think the doc feels that the dhea is not going to do the trick, but

she wants his levels up. I told her the sex drive thing is too unreal

to deal with anymore. SHe told me she was not going to do shots, but

wanted to put him on a compounded (bioidentical) gel. I think its

100mg or 1ml/day. I will recheck. Thanks!

> Has hubby been on any meds prescription,

> gray market, or OTC?

>

> How much DHEA did he try? I had an alternative

> Doc who told me to take DHEA on the basis of

> a low test and then he doubled the dose which

> didn't raise my levels much according to the next

> test by much. So I try adding another 25 milligrams

> which seemed to increase my estrogen levels.

> Not a good thing as that suppresses the HPT axis.

> It made my breasts itch (at least they didn't grow)

> and my prostate started to swell and it felt

> a little sore. In my case, my estrogen levels

> were also low when I was tested before I started on

> the DHEA. It wasn't tested during the use of PPI meds.

> And I'd been off of the PPI meds for awhile.

> Years before I'd taken it with

> good results at rate of 25 milligrams per day.

> But I was having acid reflux and the Docs

> had me on rabeprazole and later omeprazole.

> These PPI meds cause a slowing of the metabolization of

> estrogen and thus cause endocrine disruption.

> As the DHEA quit helping back when I was taking the PPI meds,

> I had stopped them some years before.

>

> Hopefully he can get checked out before going on

> testosterone replacement to see what the underlying

> problem is. Hopefully she is not pushing monthly or shots

> every two weeks? These guys here know more on the

> topic than the majority of Docs. Prolactin level...

> was it high? Primary or secondary?

>

> Anyway, DHEA tends to raise estrogen levels in males due to

> as I recall the " first pass effect " thru the liver.

>

>

>

>

> >

> > Hi y'all! New here!

> >

> > My husband had a vasectomy 3.5 years ago. SInce then, his health has

> > declined (although I was told on the vasectomy board that this has

> > nothing to do with his isues). Finally I got some answers and it

> > appear that his

> > testosterone is at the very bottom of the range 6.65 (range 6.5 -

> > 28.1). He is only 32. He has become crabby, snappy with the children

> > (has even cried to me because he says he is no longer the same

> > person). He is also tired (fatigued) and the sex drive is literally

> > gonzo. It has also been discovered that his estrogen is low as well

> as

> > his DHEA (approx. 140 and it should be around 400+), levels of a

> MUCH

> > older man.

> >

> > Is there anyone out there that can relate to what we are going

> > through? I will do anything to get my husband back. He is way too

> > young to be having these hormonal issues. My doc (a hormones

> > specialist) tried to get his hormones up with supplemental DHEA and

> it

> > has done nothing, in fact his testosterone dipped even lower. She

> > today, prescribed testosterone. Thanks!!!!!

> >

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

,

You have found a good Doc for hubby. Looks as though she's thinking

adrenal fatigue as one reason his T level has dropped. Keep her!

I might suggest the DHEA be kept to 50mg or less however. More than

50mg for an elderly man is far more likely to elevate his T level.

In young men all higher doses might do is give him zits and make him

mean....and raise his estrodiol to a not so fun level. Even the

most published experts will say that much. I will note that some

people do have adrenal fatigue and do well on DHEA at higher doses.

DHEA is one of those levels that will show up grossly different from

one test to another. One month it might be 400, the next 180. That's

considered a normal fluxuation. I saw your hub's level dipped way

below, under 150. That's why she's thinking what she is. Now that

the Doc has prescribed a T gel, he should do fine on no more than

50mg of DHEA. I'd even go so far as to say that within a month he'll

be dropping his DHEA down to a maintainence of 10mg per day. If he

notices his skin has gotten too oily, acne, appetite increases too

much and/ or any kind of anxiety, heart palpitations, restlessness

or carpal tunnel symptoms, please stop the DHEA. Don't add it again

until talking to the Doc and plan on using far less. T gel can cause

some of the mentioned side effects in some men but, it isn't the

norm. DHEA however, has them as common side effects. I suspect they

are common because mamy people who use DHEA do not need it.

Be well, Swim

In , " JimS. " <jms_in_fairfax@...> wrote:

>

> Hi -

>

> Betaine, brad and Phil have already given you good

> advice and I would agree with all that they said. Let

> me just add -

>

> 1. I would be very concerned about your " hormone

> specialist " doc. To me, prescribing DHEA to correct

> low testosterone is voodoo medicine. If you do the

> research, you will find that, in males, DHEA can

> convert to either testosterone or estrogen. I don't

> know of any doctor who knows what they are doing who

> would prescribe DHEA to treat a testosterone

> deficiency. Which is not to say that the low DHEA

> should not be treated with a supplement.

>

> 2. What testosterone has been prescribed? Be aware

> that exogenous testosterone will shut down your

> husband's own production and the exogenous

> testosterone may not be enough to bring him back to

> where he was. He may wind up with lower levels and

> feeling worse as a result of this prescription. This

> has happened to many of us.

>

>

> 3. Be nice to your husband. He is having to deal with

> a very tough issue. I know from experience.

>

> Jim

>

>

> --- <d_timmsjosey@...> wrote:

>

> > Hi y'all! New here!

> >

> > My husband had a vasectomy 3.5 years ago. SInce

> > then, his health has

> > declined (although I was told on the vasectomy board

> > that this has

> > nothing to do with his isues). Finally I got some

> > answers and it

> > appear that his

> > testosterone is at the very bottom of the range 6.65

> > (range 6.5 -

> > 28.1). He is only 32. He has become crabby, snappy

> > with the children

> > (has even cried to me because he says he is no

> > longer the same

> > person). He is also tired (fatigued) and the sex

> > drive is literally

> > gonzo. It has also been discovered that his estrogen

> > is low as well as

> > his DHEA (approx. 140 and it should be around 400+),

> > levels of a MUCH

> > older man.

> >

> > Is there anyone out there that can relate to what we

> > are going

> > through? I will do anything to get my husband back.

> > He is way too

> > young to be having these hormonal issues. My doc (a

> > hormones

> > specialist) tried to get his hormones up with

> > supplemental DHEA and it

> > has done nothing, in fact his testosterone dipped

> > even lower. She

> > today, prescribed testosterone. Thanks!!!!!

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

HI JIm,

My doc wanted to just " try " the dhea to see if it would budge his

hormones because it is like a master hormone to all the other

hormones. Also, he needs it anyway since his dhea is 140 and the range

is 80-450 and he should be somewhere near the upper end of the range

at his age. He has the DHEA of an elderly man and of course with low

levels of DHEA, it opens a pandora's box to age related illness,

autoimmune disease and even cancer. He already has alopecia. It's a

bald spot that has grown from 1 quarter in size to about 6 in 5 months

(not a fun thing to have on top of all this hormonal crap). Anyway,

She thought it was worth a try because she seemed hesitant to start

him off with testosterone. The testosterone she prescribed is called

chrysin. It is totally bioidentical (same thing his body already

produces, nothing synthetic whatsoever).

As for being understanding, trust me, if it wasn't for me, he would

not be even getting help. I have been the one to research and do all

the appointment setting etc... I myself have an autoimmune disease -

hashimoto's - and hormonal problems too. I can TOTALLY empathize. I

have been dealing with undiagnosed hashi's since i was at least 15 and

finally got diagnosed almost 3 years ago. I just don't understand how

the both of us could be so unlucky. Now I need to worry about my children.

> Hi -

>

> Betaine, brad and Phil have already given you good

> advice and I would agree with all that they said. Let

> me just add -

>

> 1. I would be very concerned about your " hormone

> specialist " doc. To me, prescribing DHEA to correct

> low testosterone is voodoo medicine. If you do the

> research, you will find that, in males, DHEA can

> convert to either testosterone or estrogen. I don't

> know of any doctor who knows what they are doing who

> would prescribe DHEA to treat a testosterone

> deficiency. Which is not to say that the low DHEA

> should not be treated with a supplement.

>

> 2. What testosterone has been prescribed? Be aware

> that exogenous testosterone will shut down your

> husband's own production and the exogenous

> testosterone may not be enough to bring him back to

> where he was. He may wind up with lower levels and

> feeling worse as a result of this prescription. This

> has happened to many of us.

>

>

> 3. Be nice to your husband. He is having to deal with

> a very tough issue. I know from experience.

>

> Jim

>

>

> --- <d_timmsjosey@...> wrote:

>

> > Hi y'all! New here!

> >

> > My husband had a vasectomy 3.5 years ago. SInce

> > then, his health has

> > declined (although I was told on the vasectomy board

> > that this has

> > nothing to do with his isues). Finally I got some

> > answers and it

> > appear that his

> > testosterone is at the very bottom of the range 6.65

> > (range 6.5 -

> > 28.1). He is only 32. He has become crabby, snappy

> > with the children

> > (has even cried to me because he says he is no

> > longer the same

> > person). He is also tired (fatigued) and the sex

> > drive is literally

> > gonzo. It has also been discovered that his estrogen

> > is low as well as

> > his DHEA (approx. 140 and it should be around 400+),

> > levels of a MUCH

> > older man.

> >

> > Is there anyone out there that can relate to what we

> > are going

> > through? I will do anything to get my husband back.

> > He is way too

> > young to be having these hormonal issues. My doc (a

> > hormones

> > specialist) tried to get his hormones up with

> > supplemental DHEA and it

> > has done nothing, in fact his testosterone dipped

> > even lower. She

> > today, prescribed testosterone. Thanks!!!!!

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Phil,

Liver levels look really good. Cortisol is pretty good, maybe a tiny

smidge low 20 in the am and the range is 5-25 (he should be closer to

the top of the range). He is a work-a-holic though and I am sure this

does not help matters or cortisol. I can add in a supplement for him

on that, but I really don't feel that that is his real issue. What do

you think? Thanks for trying to help .

> that infection is so low it is dam hard to find men can have

it for a long time and as they get older there body can fight it off

any more and things like low T happen.

> The reasion I say do everything possabe to find out what is wrong

before doing TRT is if he had a low infection or a liver problem the T

will not make him feel better it is a band-aid. He can also be

suffering from Adrenal Fatigue have his morning Cortisol levels

checked. If this is low it will drive down T levels. Better to be

safe then sorry once he starts on T meds a lot of test will not find

other problems. We have found here that Dr.'s will not put men that

need to be on TRT and Dr.'s that are to fast to put men on TRT. A

good Dr. on low T is dam hard to find and you just can't look in a

book or do what the drug reps say.

> Phil

>

> <d_timmsjosey@...> wrote:

> Thank you phil! Well my doc has run a CBc, thyroid (he does have lots

> of thyroid problems on his mom'd side of the family, and his thyroid

> levels are a little low, but his dhea is low and when he added in 50

> mg/day, it increased the thyroid levels a tad). I don't think this is

> where we need to concentrate (I have thyroid disease, so I am prety

> well-versed there lol). The DHEA did not increase the testosterone nor

> did it increase his estrogen levels. His blood sugar levels are good,

> his BP is good (for now). His liver tests are good, iron good, no

> other complaints except fatigue, memory loss, brain fog, zilch sex

> drive and now he has a blad spot on the nape of his neck (not male

> pattern baldness, but alopecia, which I REALLY think is related to all

> these hormonal issues). I am very worried about his health. I would

> rather him get on the T and get back to normal.

>

> As for the vas infection, wouldn't he have symptoms? Thanks so much!!!

>

>

> >

> > Hi and welcome,

> >

> > I did talk to one young man 2yrs. ago he has the same problem

> after a vasectomy he was going to go on TRT and he posted at WebMD to

> the Uro there and the Dr. told him men can get an infection after a

> vasedtomy that is dam hard to find. And it takes a certain antiboytic

> to get rid of it. After he got rid of the infection his testosterone

> levels come back up. Please do not let him take T meds until every

> possable test is done to find out why he is low. If he does not have

> this problem go to www.allthingsmale.com and read TRT: A Recipe for

> success and in this are the tests he needs and why. If he goes on T

> meds it is dam hard to find out why he is low. Doing T meds is for

> life and a lot of things can cause his levels to go down and when it

> is fixed they come back up. Here is a link to the webMD site you can

> try posting to the Dr. about this.

> > http://boards.webmd.com/webx?14@@.5987f442

> > If you need more help just ask.

> > Phil

> >

> > wrote:

> > Hi y'all! New here!

> >

> > My husband had a vasectomy 3.5 years ago. SInce then, his health has

> > declined (although I was told on the vasectomy board that this has

> > nothing to do with his isues). Finally I got some answers and it

> > appear that his

> > testosterone is at the very bottom of the range 6.65 (range 6.5 -

> > 28.1). He is only 32. He has become crabby, snappy with the children

> > (has even cried to me because he says he is no longer the same

> > person). He is also tired (fatigued) and the sex drive is literally

> > gonzo. It has also been discovered that his estrogen is low as well as

> > his DHEA (approx. 140 and it should be around 400+), levels of a MUCH

> > older man.

> >

> > Is there anyone out there that can relate to what we are going

> > through? I will do anything to get my husband back. He is way too

> > young to be having these hormonal issues. My doc (a hormones

> > specialist) tried to get his hormones up with supplemental DHEA and it

> > has done nothing, in fact his testosterone dipped even lower. She

> > today, prescribed testosterone. Thanks!!!!!

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

>

Thank you! I will get that book!!!!!

>

> You'll need to begin reading:

>

> Start with this:

> http://www.aace.com/pub/pdf/guidelines/hypogonadism.pdf

> Guidelines by the AMERICAN ASSOCIATION OF CLINICAL ENDOCRINOLOGISTS

>

> Also look at:

>

http://www.endo-society.org/quickcontent/clinicalpractice/clinical-guidelines/up\

load/AndrogensMenGuideline053006.pdf

>

> But the best read for understanding will be Dr. Shippen's book

>

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/087131858X/sr=1-1/qid=1155184828/ref=sr_1_1/103\

-3971708-8545445?ie=UTF8 & s=books

>

> The Testosterone Syndrome. It will get you a good understanding. Order

> a copy right away or check your library. (It' s about $6 used)

>

> The other two links you can read on line while you wait for the book.

>

>

> ________________

> I am human; nothing in humanity is alien to me.

> Terence

>

[Guest guest]

my wife has hashimoto's they did radioactive iodine to kill her thyroid

and put her on Synthroid she went from Endo to Endo telling them she does not

feel good always cold and sleep day and night alway tired. Finely I got her to

see a Dr. that does Armour he did a mess of tests and found her DHEA-S low very

low and she has Adrenal Fatigue. She is doing better now for the first time in

15yrs. This site helped us a lot.

http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/

As for you husband try getting him to take his Temp. 3 times a day like this

site.

http://www.drrind.com/tempgraph.asp#directions

If his Adrenals are back it will show up if you print out the chart and keep

track of his Temp on the chart. I have been doing this for the last 3 months

and it works. I am doing Adrenal supplements to bring my Cortisol levels up.

After 22 yrs on T meds I found out just 2 months ago that my problem is not that

I am Primary or my testis don't work but I am Hypopituitary from a head injury

some 23 yrs. ago. If the dam Dr.'s would have done there jobs 23 yrs. ago I

would have had a much healther life.

If your Dr. is going to start him on meds for low T and you have a drug plain

that pays for his meds then start out with Androgel or Testim I don't have any

problem with compounds but some times they don't get mix right.

Phil

<d_timmsjosey@...> wrote:

HI JIm,

My doc wanted to just " try " the dhea to see if it would budge his

hormones because it is like a master hormone to all the other

hormones. Also, he needs it anyway since his dhea is 140 and the range

is 80-450 and he should be somewhere near the upper end of the range

at his age. He has the DHEA of an elderly man and of course with low

levels of DHEA, it opens a pandora's box to age related illness,

autoimmune disease and even cancer. He already has alopecia. It's a

bald spot that has grown from 1 quarter in size to about 6 in 5 months

(not a fun thing to have on top of all this hormonal crap). Anyway,

She thought it was worth a try because she seemed hesitant to start

him off with testosterone. The testosterone she prescribed is called

chrysin. It is totally bioidentical (same thing his body already

produces, nothing synthetic whatsoever).

As for being understanding, trust me, if it wasn't for me, he would

not be even getting help. I have been the one to research and do all

the appointment setting etc... I myself have an autoimmune disease -

hashimoto's - and hormonal problems too. I can TOTALLY empathize. I

have been dealing with undiagnosed hashi's since i was at least 15 and

finally got diagnosed almost 3 years ago. I just don't understand how

the both of us could be so unlucky. Now I need to worry about my children.

> Hi -

>

> Betaine, brad and Phil have already given you good

> advice and I would agree with all that they said. Let

> me just add -

>

> 1. I would be very concerned about your " hormone

> specialist " doc. To me, prescribing DHEA to correct

> low testosterone is voodoo medicine. If you do the

> research, you will find that, in males, DHEA can

> convert to either testosterone or estrogen. I don't

> know of any doctor who knows what they are doing who

> would prescribe DHEA to treat a testosterone

> deficiency. Which is not to say that the low DHEA

> should not be treated with a supplement.

>

> 2. What testosterone has been prescribed? Be aware

> that exogenous testosterone will shut down your

> husband's own production and the exogenous

> testosterone may not be enough to bring him back to

> where he was. He may wind up with lower levels and

> feeling worse as a result of this prescription. This

> has happened to many of us.

>

>

> 3. Be nice to your husband. He is having to deal with

> a very tough issue. I know from experience.

>

> Jim

>

>

> --- wrote:

>

> > Hi y'all! New here!

> >

> > My husband had a vasectomy 3.5 years ago. SInce

> > then, his health has

> > declined (although I was told on the vasectomy board

> > that this has

> > nothing to do with his isues). Finally I got some

> > answers and it

> > appear that his

> > testosterone is at the very bottom of the range 6.65

> > (range 6.5 -

> > 28.1). He is only 32. He has become crabby, snappy

> > with the children

> > (has even cried to me because he says he is no

> > longer the same

> > person). He is also tired (fatigued) and the sex

> > drive is literally

> > gonzo. It has also been discovered that his estrogen

> > is low as well as

> > his DHEA (approx. 140 and it should be around 400+),

> > levels of a MUCH

> > older man.

> >

> > Is there anyone out there that can relate to what we

> > are going

> > through? I will do anything to get my husband back.

> > He is way too

> > young to be having these hormonal issues. My doc (a

> > hormones

> > specialist) tried to get his hormones up with

> > supplemental DHEA and it

> > has done nothing, in fact his testosterone dipped

> > even lower. She

> > today, prescribed testosterone. Thanks!!!!!

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

-

Chrysin is not testosterone. See

http://www.pdrhealth.com/drug_info/nmdrugprofiles/nutsupdrugs/chr_0076.shtml

Chrysin is a substance which may inhibit the

conversion of testosterone to estrogen. It is also

available over the counter. Both chrysin and DHEA may

have a very minor effect of raising testosterone

levels, but I have never heard of either being used as

the main method of testosterone replacement therapy.

BTW, I am not opposed to DHEA supplementation. I take

it myself.

Is your doctor an MD or DO? I ask because all she

seems to be " prescribing " are over the counter

remedies.

Jim

--- <d_timmsjosey@...> wrote:

> HI JIm,

>

> My doc wanted to just " try " the dhea to see if it

> would budge his

> hormones because it is like a master hormone to all

> the other

> hormones. Also, he needs it anyway since his dhea is

> 140 and the range

> is 80-450 and he should be somewhere near the upper

> end of the range

> at his age. He has the DHEA of an elderly man and of

> course with low

> levels of DHEA, it opens a pandora's box to age

> related illness,

> autoimmune disease and even cancer. He already has

> alopecia. It's a

> bald spot that has grown from 1 quarter in size to

> about 6 in 5 months

> (not a fun thing to have on top of all this hormonal

> crap). Anyway,

> She thought it was worth a try because she seemed

> hesitant to start

> him off with testosterone. The testosterone she

> prescribed is called

> chrysin. It is totally bioidentical (same thing his

> body already

> produces, nothing synthetic whatsoever).

>

> As for being understanding, trust me, if it wasn't

> for me, he would

> not be even getting help. I have been the one to

> research and do all

> the appointment setting etc... I myself have an

> autoimmune disease -

> hashimoto's - and hormonal problems too. I can

> TOTALLY empathize. I

> have been dealing with undiagnosed hashi's since i

> was at least 15 and

> finally got diagnosed almost 3 years ago. I just

> don't understand how

> the both of us could be so unlucky. Now I need to

> worry about my children.

>

>

>

>

> > Hi -

> >

> > Betaine, brad and Phil have already given you good

> > advice and I would agree with all that they said.

> Let

> > me just add -

> >

> > 1. I would be very concerned about your " hormone

> > specialist " doc. To me, prescribing DHEA to

> correct

> > low testosterone is voodoo medicine. If you do the

> > research, you will find that, in males, DHEA can

> > convert to either testosterone or estrogen. I

> don't

> > know of any doctor who knows what they are doing

> who

> > would prescribe DHEA to treat a testosterone

> > deficiency. Which is not to say that the low DHEA

> > should not be treated with a supplement.

> >

> > 2. What testosterone has been prescribed? Be aware

> > that exogenous testosterone will shut down your

> > husband's own production and the exogenous

> > testosterone may not be enough to bring him back

> to

> > where he was. He may wind up with lower levels and

> > feeling worse as a result of this prescription.

> This

> > has happened to many of us.

> >

> >

> > 3. Be nice to your husband. He is having to deal

> with

> > a very tough issue. I know from experience.

> >

> > Jim

> >

> >

> > --- <d_timmsjosey@...> wrote:

> >

> > > Hi y'all! New here!

> > >

> > > My husband had a vasectomy 3.5 years ago. SInce

> > > then, his health has

> > > declined (although I was told on the vasectomy

> board

> > > that this has

> > > nothing to do with his isues). Finally I got

> some

> > > answers and it

> > > appear that his

> > > testosterone is at the very bottom of the range

> 6.65

> > > (range 6.5 -

> > > 28.1). He is only 32. He has become crabby,

> snappy

> > > with the children

> > > (has even cried to me because he says he is no

> > > longer the same

> > > person). He is also tired (fatigued) and the sex

> > > drive is literally

> > > gonzo. It has also been discovered that his

> estrogen

> > > is low as well as

> > > his DHEA (approx. 140 and it should be around

> 400+),

> > > levels of a MUCH

> > > older man.

> > >

> > > Is there anyone out there that can relate to

> what we

> > > are going

> > > through? I will do anything to get my husband

> back.

> > > He is way too

> > > young to be having these hormonal issues. My doc

> (a

> > > hormones

> > > specialist) tried to get his hormones up with

> > > supplemental DHEA and it

> > > has done nothing, in fact his testosterone

> dipped

> > > even lower. She

> > > today, prescribed testosterone. Thanks!!!!!

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

> >

> > __________________________________________________

> >

[Guest guest]

Thanks Phil!! You know, my husband used to be a hockey player. He was

slammed into the boards really hard one time and lost consciousness.

Very interesting. SO what tests do I need to have him get to test for

a pituitary issue?

Thanks for the info on Hashi's. I am very familiar with the ladies on

that site and they actually inspired me a few years ago to research

harder. I have my own hashi's board:

Hashimotos_help/

Your wife might even already be a member .

I am an Armour advocate. I believe there is a place for t4, but most

often in combination with Armour. I also believe I have adrenal issues

and my DHEA is not optimal. It's very common with thyroid disease.

Have your wife join us if she wants .

P.S. I think my hubby is hesitant to start the T, so maybe we will run

a few more tests. He has an appointment with the uroligist next

Wednesday. Can this guy help or are we looking in the wrong pot?

> my wife has hashimoto's they did radioactive iodine to kill

her thyroid and put her on Synthroid she went from Endo to Endo

telling them she does not feel good always cold and sleep day and

night alway tired. Finely I got her to see a Dr. that does Armour he

did a mess of tests and found her DHEA-S low very low and she has

Adrenal Fatigue. She is doing better now for the first time in 15yrs.

This site helped us a lot.

> http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/

> As for you husband try getting him to take his Temp. 3 times a day

like this site.

> http://www.drrind.com/tempgraph.asp#directions

> If his Adrenals are back it will show up if you print out the

chart and keep track of his Temp on the chart. I have been doing this

for the last 3 months and it works. I am doing Adrenal supplements to

bring my Cortisol levels up. After 22 yrs on T meds I found out just

2 months ago that my problem is not that I am Primary or my testis

don't work but I am Hypopituitary from a head injury some 23 yrs. ago.

If the dam Dr.'s would have done there jobs 23 yrs. ago I would have

had a much healther life.

> If your Dr. is going to start him on meds for low T and you have a

drug plain that pays for his meds then start out with Androgel or

Testim I don't have any problem with compounds but some times they

don't get mix right.

> Phil

>

> <d_timmsjosey@...> wrote:

> HI JIm,

>

> My doc wanted to just " try " the dhea to see if it would budge his

> hormones because it is like a master hormone to all the other

> hormones. Also, he needs it anyway since his dhea is 140 and the range

> is 80-450 and he should be somewhere near the upper end of the range

> at his age. He has the DHEA of an elderly man and of course with low

> levels of DHEA, it opens a pandora's box to age related illness,

> autoimmune disease and even cancer. He already has alopecia. It's a

> bald spot that has grown from 1 quarter in size to about 6 in 5 months

> (not a fun thing to have on top of all this hormonal crap). Anyway,

> She thought it was worth a try because she seemed hesitant to start

> him off with testosterone. The testosterone she prescribed is called

> chrysin. It is totally bioidentical (same thing his body already

> produces, nothing synthetic whatsoever).

>

> As for being understanding, trust me, if it wasn't for me, he would

> not be even getting help. I have been the one to research and do all

> the appointment setting etc... I myself have an autoimmune disease -

> hashimoto's - and hormonal problems too. I can TOTALLY empathize. I

> have been dealing with undiagnosed hashi's since i was at least 15 and

> finally got diagnosed almost 3 years ago. I just don't understand how

> the both of us could be so unlucky. Now I need to worry about my

children.

>

>

>

>

> > Hi -

> >

> > Betaine, brad and Phil have already given you good

> > advice and I would agree with all that they said. Let

> > me just add -

> >

> > 1. I would be very concerned about your " hormone

> > specialist " doc. To me, prescribing DHEA to correct

> > low testosterone is voodoo medicine. If you do the

> > research, you will find that, in males, DHEA can

> > convert to either testosterone or estrogen. I don't

> > know of any doctor who knows what they are doing who

> > would prescribe DHEA to treat a testosterone

> > deficiency. Which is not to say that the low DHEA

> > should not be treated with a supplement.

> >

> > 2. What testosterone has been prescribed? Be aware

> > that exogenous testosterone will shut down your

> > husband's own production and the exogenous

> > testosterone may not be enough to bring him back to

> > where he was. He may wind up with lower levels and

> > feeling worse as a result of this prescription. This

> > has happened to many of us.

> >

> >

> > 3. Be nice to your husband. He is having to deal with

> > a very tough issue. I know from experience.

> >

> > Jim

> >

> >

> > --- wrote:

> >

> > > Hi y'all! New here!

> > >

> > > My husband had a vasectomy 3.5 years ago. SInce

> > > then, his health has

> > > declined (although I was told on the vasectomy board

> > > that this has

> > > nothing to do with his isues). Finally I got some

> > > answers and it

> > > appear that his

> > > testosterone is at the very bottom of the range 6.65

> > > (range 6.5 -

> > > 28.1). He is only 32. He has become crabby, snappy

> > > with the children

> > > (has even cried to me because he says he is no

> > > longer the same

> > > person). He is also tired (fatigued) and the sex

> > > drive is literally

> > > gonzo. It has also been discovered that his estrogen

> > > is low as well as

> > > his DHEA (approx. 140 and it should be around 400+),

> > > levels of a MUCH

> > > older man.

> > >

> > > Is there anyone out there that can relate to what we

> > > are going

> > > through? I will do anything to get my husband back.

> > > He is way too

> > > young to be having these hormonal issues. My doc (a

> > > hormones

> > > specialist) tried to get his hormones up with

> > > supplemental DHEA and it

> > > has done nothing, in fact his testosterone dipped

> > > even lower. She

> > > today, prescribed testosterone. Thanks!!!!!

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

> >

> > __________________________________________________

> >

[Guest guest]

Sorry, sorry, sorry! I am reading this wrong. It is compounded with this:

testosterone micronized USP (class 111)

ethyl alcohol

lethicin oranogel liquid

pluronic gel 20% liquid

chrysin

Strength is 100mg/5% PLO gel

Hope that helps.

> -

>

> Chrysin is not testosterone. See

>

>

http://www.pdrhealth.com/drug_info/nmdrugprofiles/nutsupdrugs/chr_0076.shtml

>

> Chrysin is a substance which may inhibit the

> conversion of testosterone to estrogen. It is also

> available over the counter. Both chrysin and DHEA may

> have a very minor effect of raising testosterone

> levels, but I have never heard of either being used as

> the main method of testosterone replacement therapy.

>

> BTW, I am not opposed to DHEA supplementation. I take

> it myself.

>

> Is your doctor an MD or DO? I ask because all she

> seems to be " prescribing " are over the counter

> remedies.

>

> Jim

>

> --- <d_timmsjosey@...> wrote:

>

> > HI JIm,

> >

> > My doc wanted to just " try " the dhea to see if it

> > would budge his

> > hormones because it is like a master hormone to all

> > the other

> > hormones. Also, he needs it anyway since his dhea is

> > 140 and the range

> > is 80-450 and he should be somewhere near the upper

> > end of the range

> > at his age. He has the DHEA of an elderly man and of

> > course with low

> > levels of DHEA, it opens a pandora's box to age

> > related illness,

> > autoimmune disease and even cancer. He already has

> > alopecia. It's a

> > bald spot that has grown from 1 quarter in size to

> > about 6 in 5 months

> > (not a fun thing to have on top of all this hormonal

> > crap). Anyway,

> > She thought it was worth a try because she seemed

> > hesitant to start

> > him off with testosterone. The testosterone she

> > prescribed is called

> > chrysin. It is totally bioidentical (same thing his

> > body already

> > produces, nothing synthetic whatsoever).

> >

> > As for being understanding, trust me, if it wasn't

> > for me, he would

> > not be even getting help. I have been the one to

> > research and do all

> > the appointment setting etc... I myself have an

> > autoimmune disease -

> > hashimoto's - and hormonal problems too. I can

> > TOTALLY empathize. I

> > have been dealing with undiagnosed hashi's since i

> > was at least 15 and

> > finally got diagnosed almost 3 years ago. I just

> > don't understand how

> > the both of us could be so unlucky. Now I need to

> > worry about my children.

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > > Hi -

> > >

> > > Betaine, brad and Phil have already given you good

> > > advice and I would agree with all that they said.

> > Let

> > > me just add -

> > >

> > > 1. I would be very concerned about your " hormone

> > > specialist " doc. To me, prescribing DHEA to

> > correct

> > > low testosterone is voodoo medicine. If you do the

> > > research, you will find that, in males, DHEA can

> > > convert to either testosterone or estrogen. I

> > don't

> > > know of any doctor who knows what they are doing

> > who

> > > would prescribe DHEA to treat a testosterone

> > > deficiency. Which is not to say that the low DHEA

> > > should not be treated with a supplement.

> > >

> > > 2. What testosterone has been prescribed? Be aware

> > > that exogenous testosterone will shut down your

> > > husband's own production and the exogenous

> > > testosterone may not be enough to bring him back

> > to

> > > where he was. He may wind up with lower levels and

> > > feeling worse as a result of this prescription.

> > This

> > > has happened to many of us.

> > >

> > >

> > > 3. Be nice to your husband. He is having to deal

> > with

> > > a very tough issue. I know from experience.

> > >

> > > Jim

> > >

> > >

> > > --- <d_timmsjosey@> wrote:

> > >

> > > > Hi y'all! New here!

> > > >

> > > > My husband had a vasectomy 3.5 years ago. SInce

> > > > then, his health has

> > > > declined (although I was told on the vasectomy

> > board

> > > > that this has

> > > > nothing to do with his isues). Finally I got

> > some

> > > > answers and it

> > > > appear that his

> > > > testosterone is at the very bottom of the range

> > 6.65

> > > > (range 6.5 -

> > > > 28.1). He is only 32. He has become crabby,

> > snappy

> > > > with the children

> > > > (has even cried to me because he says he is no

> > > > longer the same

> > > > person). He is also tired (fatigued) and the sex

> > > > drive is literally

> > > > gonzo. It has also been discovered that his

> > estrogen

> > > > is low as well as

> > > > his DHEA (approx. 140 and it should be around

> > 400+),

> > > > levels of a MUCH

> > > > older man.

> > > >

> > > > Is there anyone out there that can relate to

> > what we

> > > > are going

> > > > through? I will do anything to get my husband

> > back.

> > > > He is way too

> > > > young to be having these hormonal issues. My doc

> > (a

> > > > hormones

> > > > specialist) tried to get his hormones up with

> > > > supplemental DHEA and it

> > > > has done nothing, in fact his testosterone

> > dipped

> > > > even lower. She

> > > > today, prescribed testosterone. Thanks!!!!!

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > > __________________________________________________

> > >

[Guest guest]

Hi

I am looking at the boards for my husband. We are in almost the same

boat. His sex drive died, he put on a lot of weight, snaps at the kids, I was

ready to ask for a divorce as he would not do anything. Finally, he went into

the dr who found a non-existant testosterone level.

The dr started him on this cream and he stated that he is feeling better

but when he went in for blood work, they found his level 2x higher than it

should have been. We have not been referred anywhere and the dr is not looking

for the primary cause of the problem.

My husband is going in for a second blood draw next week. That will tell

us something.

<d_timmsjosey@...> wrote:

Thanks Phil!! You know, my husband used to be a hockey player. He was

slammed into the boards really hard one time and lost consciousness.

Very interesting. SO what tests do I need to have him get to test for

a pituitary issue?

Thanks for the info on Hashi's. I am very familiar with the ladies on

that site and they actually inspired me a few years ago to research

harder. I have my own hashi's board:

Hashimotos_help/

Your wife might even already be a member .

I am an Armour advocate. I believe there is a place for t4, but most

often in combination with Armour. I also believe I have adrenal issues

and my DHEA is not optimal. It's very common with thyroid disease.

Have your wife join us if she wants .

P.S. I think my hubby is hesitant to start the T, so maybe we will run

a few more tests. He has an appointment with the uroligist next

Wednesday. Can this guy help or are we looking in the wrong pot?

> my wife has hashimoto's they did radioactive iodine to kill

her thyroid and put her on Synthroid she went from Endo to Endo

telling them she does not feel good always cold and sleep day and

night alway tired. Finely I got her to see a Dr. that does Armour he

did a mess of tests and found her DHEA-S low very low and she has

Adrenal Fatigue. She is doing better now for the first time in 15yrs.

This site helped us a lot.

> http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/

> As for you husband try getting him to take his Temp. 3 times a day

like this site.

> http://www.drrind.com/tempgraph.asp#directions

> If his Adrenals are back it will show up if you print out the

chart and keep track of his Temp on the chart. I have been doing this

for the last 3 months and it works. I am doing Adrenal supplements to

bring my Cortisol levels up. After 22 yrs on T meds I found out just

2 months ago that my problem is not that I am Primary or my testis

don't work but I am Hypopituitary from a head injury some 23 yrs. ago.

If the dam Dr.'s would have done there jobs 23 yrs. ago I would have

had a much healther life.

> If your Dr. is going to start him on meds for low T and you have a

drug plain that pays for his meds then start out with Androgel or

Testim I don't have any problem with compounds but some times they

don't get mix right.

> Phil

>

> <d_timmsjosey@...> wrote:

> HI JIm,

>

> My doc wanted to just " try " the dhea to see if it would budge his

> hormones because it is like a master hormone to all the other

> hormones. Also, he needs it anyway since his dhea is 140 and the range

> is 80-450 and he should be somewhere near the upper end of the range

> at his age. He has the DHEA of an elderly man and of course with low

> levels of DHEA, it opens a pandora's box to age related illness,

> autoimmune disease and even cancer. He already has alopecia. It's a

> bald spot that has grown from 1 quarter in size to about 6 in 5 months

> (not a fun thing to have on top of all this hormonal crap). Anyway,

> She thought it was worth a try because she seemed hesitant to start

> him off with testosterone. The testosterone she prescribed is called

> chrysin. It is totally bioidentical (same thing his body already

> produces, nothing synthetic whatsoever).

>

> As for being understanding, trust me, if it wasn't for me, he would

> not be even getting help. I have been the one to research and do all

> the appointment setting etc... I myself have an autoimmune disease -

> hashimoto's - and hormonal problems too. I can TOTALLY empathize. I

> have been dealing with undiagnosed hashi's since i was at least 15 and

> finally got diagnosed almost 3 years ago. I just don't understand how

> the both of us could be so unlucky. Now I need to worry about my

children.

>

>

>

>

> > Hi -

> >

> > Betaine, brad and Phil have already given you good

> > advice and I would agree with all that they said. Let

> > me just add -

> >

> > 1. I would be very concerned about your " hormone

> > specialist " doc. To me, prescribing DHEA to correct

> > low testosterone is voodoo medicine. If you do the

> > research, you will find that, in males, DHEA can

> > convert to either testosterone or estrogen. I don't

> > know of any doctor who knows what they are doing who

> > would prescribe DHEA to treat a testosterone

> > deficiency. Which is not to say that the low DHEA

> > should not be treated with a supplement.

> >

> > 2. What testosterone has been prescribed? Be aware

> > that exogenous testosterone will shut down your

> > husband's own production and the exogenous

> > testosterone may not be enough to bring him back to

> > where he was. He may wind up with lower levels and

> > feeling worse as a result of this prescription. This

> > has happened to many of us.

> >

> >

> > 3. Be nice to your husband. He is having to deal with

> > a very tough issue. I know from experience.

> >

> > Jim

> >

> >

> > --- wrote:

> >

> > > Hi y'all! New here!

> > >

> > > My husband had a vasectomy 3.5 years ago. SInce

> > > then, his health has

> > > declined (although I was told on the vasectomy board

> > > that this has

> > > nothing to do with his isues). Finally I got some

> > > answers and it

> > > appear that his

> > > testosterone is at the very bottom of the range 6.65

> > > (range 6.5 -

> > > 28.1). He is only 32. He has become crabby, snappy

> > > with the children

> > > (has even cried to me because he says he is no

> > > longer the same

> > > person). He is also tired (fatigued) and the sex

> > > drive is literally

> > > gonzo. It has also been discovered that his estrogen

> > > is low as well as

> > > his DHEA (approx. 140 and it should be around 400+),

> > > levels of a MUCH

> > > older man.

> > >

> > > Is there anyone out there that can relate to what we

> > > are going

> > > through? I will do anything to get my husband back.

> > > He is way too

> > > young to be having these hormonal issues. My doc (a

> > > hormones

> > > specialist) tried to get his hormones up with

> > > supplemental DHEA and it

> > > has done nothing, in fact his testosterone dipped

> > > even lower. She

> > > today, prescribed testosterone. Thanks!!!!!

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

> >

> > __________________________________________________

> >

[Guest guest]

>

> Sorry, sorry, sorry! I am reading this wrong. It is compounded with

this:

>

> testosterone micronized USP (class 111)

> ethyl alcohol

> lethicin oranogel liquid

> pluronic gel 20% liquid

> chrysin

>

> Strength is 100mg/5% PLO gel

>

> Hope that helps.

> > -

> >

I have no particular objection to compounded testosterone products but

I would note that Androgel and Testim are also " bioidentical "

testosterone products.

Note every patient does well/absorbs transdermal products so you'll

need followup to make sure the product is working.

Brad

[Guest guest]

you just can't go to a Dr. and find he knows nothing you need to screen

them call and ask how many men does the Dr. treat for low T and ask if he test

to see why he is low like is he primary his testis don't work or if they test

for seconday he has a pituitary problem. If you go to Dr. site and read

his TRT: A Recipe of Success in this are tests he needs and why. The Dr. he

sees now ask if this Dr. will work with Dr. over the phone to test and

treat your husband Dr. does this. He also trains other Dr.'s on testing

and treating men with all kinds of low T problems to me he is one of the best

and he has all this info Free on his site at www.allthingsmale.com Send him an

Email and ask if he knows a Dr. that will work with him in your area. Tell him

I or Phil sent you. We have a file in the files section on finding a Dr. It is

called Finding a Male Hormone Dr. go to the home page and the files section is

on the left side of the screen. For me my

being Hypopituitary I am low normal on DHEA, IGF-1, Cortisol, Thyroid, Sugar is

low in the morning and God knows what I will find out as I get into this.

Phil

<d_timmsjosey@...> wrote:

Thanks Phil!! You know, my husband used to be a hockey player. He was

slammed into the boards really hard one time and lost consciousness.

Very interesting. SO what tests do I need to have him get to test for

a pituitary issue?

Thanks for the info on Hashi's. I am very familiar with the ladies on

that site and they actually inspired me a few years ago to research

harder. I have my own hashi's board:

Hashimotos_help/

Your wife might even already be a member .

I am an Armour advocate. I believe there is a place for t4, but most

often in combination with Armour. I also believe I have adrenal issues

and my DHEA is not optimal. It's very common with thyroid disease.

Have your wife join us if she wants .

P.S. I think my hubby is hesitant to start the T, so maybe we will run

a few more tests. He has an appointment with the uroligist next

Wednesday. Can this guy help or are we looking in the wrong pot?

> my wife has hashimoto's they did radioactive iodine to kill

her thyroid and put her on Synthroid she went from Endo to Endo

telling them she does not feel good always cold and sleep day and

night alway tired. Finely I got her to see a Dr. that does Armour he

did a mess of tests and found her DHEA-S low very low and she has

Adrenal Fatigue. She is doing better now for the first time in 15yrs.

This site helped us a lot.

> http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/

> As for you husband try getting him to take his Temp. 3 times a day

like this site.

> http://www.drrind.com/tempgraph.asp#directions

> If his Adrenals are back it will show up if you print out the

chart and keep track of his Temp on the chart. I have been doing this

for the last 3 months and it works. I am doing Adrenal supplements to

bring my Cortisol levels up. After 22 yrs on T meds I found out just

2 months ago that my problem is not that I am Primary or my testis

don't work but I am Hypopituitary from a head injury some 23 yrs. ago.

If the dam Dr.'s would have done there jobs 23 yrs. ago I would have

had a much healther life.

> If your Dr. is going to start him on meds for low T and you have a

drug plain that pays for his meds then start out with Androgel or

Testim I don't have any problem with compounds but some times they

don't get mix right.

> Phil

>

> wrote:

> HI JIm,

>

> My doc wanted to just " try " the dhea to see if it would budge his

> hormones because it is like a master hormone to all the other

> hormones. Also, he needs it anyway since his dhea is 140 and the range

> is 80-450 and he should be somewhere near the upper end of the range

> at his age. He has the DHEA of an elderly man and of course with low

> levels of DHEA, it opens a pandora's box to age related illness,

> autoimmune disease and even cancer. He already has alopecia. It's a

> bald spot that has grown from 1 quarter in size to about 6 in 5 months

> (not a fun thing to have on top of all this hormonal crap). Anyway,

> She thought it was worth a try because she seemed hesitant to start

> him off with testosterone. The testosterone she prescribed is called

> chrysin. It is totally bioidentical (same thing his body already

> produces, nothing synthetic whatsoever).

>

> As for being understanding, trust me, if it wasn't for me, he would

> not be even getting help. I have been the one to research and do all

> the appointment setting etc... I myself have an autoimmune disease -

> hashimoto's - and hormonal problems too. I can TOTALLY empathize. I

> have been dealing with undiagnosed hashi's since i was at least 15 and

> finally got diagnosed almost 3 years ago. I just don't understand how

> the both of us could be so unlucky. Now I need to worry about my

children.

>

>

>

>

> > Hi -

> >

> > Betaine, brad and Phil have already given you good

> > advice and I would agree with all that they said. Let

> > me just add -

> >

> > 1. I would be very concerned about your " hormone

> > specialist " doc. To me, prescribing DHEA to correct

> > low testosterone is voodoo medicine. If you do the

> > research, you will find that, in males, DHEA can

> > convert to either testosterone or estrogen. I don't

> > know of any doctor who knows what they are doing who

> > would prescribe DHEA to treat a testosterone

> > deficiency. Which is not to say that the low DHEA

> > should not be treated with a supplement.

> >

> > 2. What testosterone has been prescribed? Be aware

> > that exogenous testosterone will shut down your

> > husband's own production and the exogenous

> > testosterone may not be enough to bring him back to

> > where he was. He may wind up with lower levels and

> > feeling worse as a result of this prescription. This

> > has happened to many of us.

> >

> >

> > 3. Be nice to your husband. He is having to deal with

> > a very tough issue. I know from experience.

> >

> > Jim

> >

> >

> > --- wrote:

> >

> > > Hi y'all! New here!

> > >

> > > My husband had a vasectomy 3.5 years ago. SInce

> > > then, his health has

> > > declined (although I was told on the vasectomy board

> > > that this has

> > > nothing to do with his isues). Finally I got some

> > > answers and it

> > > appear that his

> > > testosterone is at the very bottom of the range 6.65

> > > (range 6.5 -

> > > 28.1). He is only 32. He has become crabby, snappy

> > > with the children

> > > (has even cried to me because he says he is no

> > > longer the same

> > > person). He is also tired (fatigued) and the sex

> > > drive is literally

> > > gonzo. It has also been discovered that his estrogen

> > > is low as well as

> > > his DHEA (approx. 140 and it should be around 400+),

> > > levels of a MUCH

> > > older man.

> > >

> > > Is there anyone out there that can relate to what we

> > > are going

> > > through? I will do anything to get my husband back.

> > > He is way too

> > > young to be having these hormonal issues. My doc (a

> > > hormones

> > > specialist) tried to get his hormones up with

> > > supplemental DHEA and it

> > > has done nothing, in fact his testosterone dipped

> > > even lower. She

> > > today, prescribed testosterone. Thanks!!!!!

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

> >

> > __________________________________________________

> >

[Guest guest]

Well, , that is more like it. I take back all I

said about your doc. If she is prescribing this she is

more savvy than most.

The thing your husband will want to be careful of now,

when he gets his blood tested, that he does not pick

up the spike right after application. This will make

him think his levels are fine when they might continue

to be low.

I don't know how this compounded gel behaves, but

Androgel spikes in the first four hours or so. I have

given up on Androgel because it wouldn't raise my

levels high enough. But if I were on a gel, I would

want to get my blood levels tested something like 18 -

20 hours after the application.

Good luck and stay in touch.

Jim

--- <d_timmsjosey@...> wrote:

> Sorry, sorry, sorry! I am reading this wrong. It is

> compounded with this:

>

> testosterone micronized USP (class 111)

> ethyl alcohol

> lethicin oranogel liquid

> pluronic gel 20% liquid

> chrysin

>

> Strength is 100mg/5% PLO gel

>

> Hope that helps.

> > -

> >

> > Chrysin is not testosterone. See

> >

> >

>

http://www.pdrhealth.com/drug_info/nmdrugprofiles/nutsupdrugs/chr_0076.shtml

> >

> > Chrysin is a substance which may inhibit the

> > conversion of testosterone to estrogen. It is also

> > available over the counter. Both chrysin and DHEA

> may

> > have a very minor effect of raising testosterone

> > levels, but I have never heard of either being

> used as

> > the main method of testosterone replacement

> therapy.

> >

> > BTW, I am not opposed to DHEA supplementation. I

> take

> > it myself.

> >

> > Is your doctor an MD or DO? I ask because all she

> > seems to be " prescribing " are over the counter

> > remedies.

> >

> > Jim

> >

> > --- <d_timmsjosey@...> wrote:

> >

> > > HI JIm,

> > >

> > > My doc wanted to just " try " the dhea to see if

> it

> > > would budge his

> > > hormones because it is like a master hormone to

> all

> > > the other

> > > hormones. Also, he needs it anyway since his

> dhea is

> > > 140 and the range

> > > is 80-450 and he should be somewhere near the

> upper

> > > end of the range

> > > at his age. He has the DHEA of an elderly man

> and of

> > > course with low

> > > levels of DHEA, it opens a pandora's box to age

> > > related illness,

> > > autoimmune disease and even cancer. He already

> has

> > > alopecia. It's a

> > > bald spot that has grown from 1 quarter in size

> to

> > > about 6 in 5 months

> > > (not a fun thing to have on top of all this

> hormonal

> > > crap). Anyway,

> > > She thought it was worth a try because she

> seemed

> > > hesitant to start

> > > him off with testosterone. The testosterone she

> > > prescribed is called

> > > chrysin. It is totally bioidentical (same thing

> his

> > > body already

> > > produces, nothing synthetic whatsoever).

> > >

> > > As for being understanding, trust me, if it

> wasn't

> > > for me, he would

> > > not be even getting help. I have been the one to

> > > research and do all

> > > the appointment setting etc... I myself have an

> > > autoimmune disease -

> > > hashimoto's - and hormonal problems too. I can

> > > TOTALLY empathize. I

> > > have been dealing with undiagnosed hashi's since

> i

> > > was at least 15 and

> > > finally got diagnosed almost 3 years ago. I just

> > > don't understand how

> > > the both of us could be so unlucky. Now I need

> to

> > > worry about my children.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > > Hi -

> > > >

> > > > Betaine, brad and Phil have already given you

> good

> > > > advice and I would agree with all that they

> said.

> > > Let

> > > > me just add -

> > > >

> > > > 1. I would be very concerned about your

> " hormone

> > > > specialist " doc. To me, prescribing DHEA to

> > > correct

> > > > low testosterone is voodoo medicine. If you do

> the

> > > > research, you will find that, in males, DHEA

> can

> > > > convert to either testosterone or estrogen. I

> > > don't

> > > > know of any doctor who knows what they are

> doing

> > > who

> > > > would prescribe DHEA to treat a testosterone

> > > > deficiency. Which is not to say that the low

> DHEA

> > > > should not be treated with a supplement.

> > > >

> > > > 2. What testosterone has been prescribed? Be

> aware

> > > > that exogenous testosterone will shut down

> your

> > > > husband's own production and the exogenous

> > > > testosterone may not be enough to bring him

> back

> > > to

> > > > where he was. He may wind up with lower levels

> and

> > > > feeling worse as a result of this

> prescription.

> > > This

> > > > has happened to many of us.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > 3. Be nice to your husband. He is having to

> deal

> > > with

> > > > a very tough issue. I know from experience.

> > > >

> > > > Jim

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > --- <d_timmsjosey@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > > Hi y'all! New here!

> > > > >

> > > > > My husband had a vasectomy 3.5 years ago.

> SInce

> > > > > then, his health has

> > > > > declined (although I was told on the

> vasectomy

> > > board

> > > > > that this has

> > > > > nothing to do with his isues). Finally I got

> > > some

> > > > > answers and it

> > > > > appear that his

> > > > > testosterone is at the very bottom of the

> range

> > > 6.65

> > > > > (range 6.5 -

> > > > > 28.1). He is only 32. He has become crabby,

> > > snappy

> > > > > with the children

> > > > > (has even cried to me because he says he is

> no

> > > > > longer the same

> > > > > person). He is also tired (fatigued) and the

> sex

> > > > > drive is literally

> > > > > gonzo. It has also been discovered that his

> > > estrogen

> > > > > is low as well as

> > > > > his DHEA (approx. 140 and it should be

> around

> > > 400+),

> > > > > levels of a MUCH

> > > > > older man.

> > > > >

> > > > > Is there anyone out there that can relate to

> > > what we

> > > > > are going

> > > > > through? I will do anything to get my

> husband

> > > back.

> > > > > He is way too

> > > > > young to be having these hormonal issues. My

> doc

> > > (a

> > > > > hormones

> > > > > specialist) tried to get his hormones up

> with

>

=== message truncated ===

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Has anyone seen a normal ranges chart (by age) for DHEA. I'd like to see where

I'm supposed to fit at age 41. My DHEA is at the low end of normal 17 points

from the cliff. I have a lot of other related lows simular to Phil - low T, high

E2, borderline low T3 and T4, low phosphorus and calcium, and a few other odd

readings. Have a new doc appointment on the 29th, this will be number 6.

L

<d_timmsjosey@...> wrote:

HI JIm,

My doc wanted to just " try " the dhea to see if it would budge his

hormones because it is like a master hormone to all the other

hormones. Also, he needs it anyway since his dhea is 140 and the range

is 80-450 and he should be somewhere near the upper end of the range

at his age. He has the DHEA of an elderly man and of course with low

levels of DHEA, it opens a pandora's box to age related illness,

autoimmune disease and even cancer. He already has alopecia. It's a

bald spot that has grown from 1 quarter in size to about 6 in 5 months

(not a fun thing to have on top of all this hormonal crap). Anyway,

She thought it was worth a try because she seemed hesitant to start

him off with testosterone. The testosterone she prescribed is called

chrysin. It is totally bioidentical (same thing his body already

produces, nothing synthetic whatsoever).

As for being understanding, trust me, if it wasn't for me, he would

not be even getting help. I have been the one to research and do all

the appointment setting etc... I myself have an autoimmune disease -

hashimoto's - and hormonal problems too. I can TOTALLY empathize. I

have been dealing with undiagnosed hashi's since i was at least 15 and

finally got diagnosed almost 3 years ago. I just don't understand how

the both of us could be so unlucky. Now I need to worry about my children.

> Hi -

>

> Betaine, brad and Phil have already given you good

> advice and I would agree with all that they said. Let

> me just add -

>

> 1. I would be very concerned about your " hormone

> specialist " doc. To me, prescribing DHEA to correct

> low testosterone is voodoo medicine. If you do the

> research, you will find that, in males, DHEA can

> convert to either testosterone or estrogen. I don't

> know of any doctor who knows what they are doing who

> would prescribe DHEA to treat a testosterone

> deficiency. Which is not to say that the low DHEA

> should not be treated with a supplement.

>

> 2. What testosterone has been prescribed? Be aware

> that exogenous testosterone will shut down your

> husband's own production and the exogenous

> testosterone may not be enough to bring him back to

> where he was. He may wind up with lower levels and

> feeling worse as a result of this prescription. This

> has happened to many of us.

>

>

> 3. Be nice to your husband. He is having to deal with

> a very tough issue. I know from experience.

>

> Jim

>

>

> --- wrote:

>

> > Hi y'all! New here!

> >

> > My husband had a vasectomy 3.5 years ago. SInce

> > then, his health has

> > declined (although I was told on the vasectomy board

> > that this has

> > nothing to do with his isues). Finally I got some

> > answers and it

> > appear that his

> > testosterone is at the very bottom of the range 6.65

> > (range 6.5 -

> > 28.1). He is only 32. He has become crabby, snappy

> > with the children

> > (has even cried to me because he says he is no

> > longer the same

> > person). He is also tired (fatigued) and the sex

> > drive is literally

> > gonzo. It has also been discovered that his estrogen

> > is low as well as

> > his DHEA (approx. 140 and it should be around 400+),

> > levels of a MUCH

> > older man.

> >

> > Is there anyone out there that can relate to what we

> > are going

> > through? I will do anything to get my husband back.

> > He is way too

> > young to be having these hormonal issues. My doc (a

> > hormones

> > specialist) tried to get his hormones up with

> > supplemental DHEA and it

> > has done nothing, in fact his testosterone dipped

> > even lower. She

> > today, prescribed testosterone. Thanks!!!!!

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

Dhea declines after 35, but 17 points from the edge is very very low

for someone your age. If your free t's are borderline low, do you mean

in the bottom of the range (ie. range is .8 - 1.9 and you are .8 or

..9)? If so, this would indicate a need for possible thyroid hormones.

Have you ever had your thyroid antibodies tested? What's your TSH. The

New TSH range was narrowed down to .3 - 3.0, and anything over 2.0

should be monitored very closely. WHere are you at. It is not at all

uncommon for those with failing thyroids from thyroid disease to have

low DHEA, hormonal issues etc...

> Has anyone seen a normal ranges chart (by age) for DHEA. I'd like to

see where I'm supposed to fit at age 41. My DHEA is at the low end of

normal 17 points from the cliff. I have a lot of other related lows

simular to Phil - low T, high E2, borderline low T3 and T4, low

phosphorus and calcium, and a few other odd readings. Have a new doc

appointment on the 29th, this will be number 6.

>

> L

>

> <d_timmsjosey@...> wrote:

> HI JIm,

>

> My doc wanted to just " try " the dhea to see if it would budge his

> hormones because it is like a master hormone to all the other

> hormones. Also, he needs it anyway since his dhea is 140 and the range

> is 80-450 and he should be somewhere near the upper end of the range

> at his age. He has the DHEA of an elderly man and of course with low

> levels of DHEA, it opens a pandora's box to age related illness,

> autoimmune disease and even cancer. He already has alopecia. It's a

> bald spot that has grown from 1 quarter in size to about 6 in 5 months

> (not a fun thing to have on top of all this hormonal crap). Anyway,

> She thought it was worth a try because she seemed hesitant to start

> him off with testosterone. The testosterone she prescribed is called

> chrysin. It is totally bioidentical (same thing his body already

> produces, nothing synthetic whatsoever).

>

> As for being understanding, trust me, if it wasn't for me, he would

> not be even getting help. I have been the one to research and do all

> the appointment setting etc... I myself have an autoimmune disease -

> hashimoto's - and hormonal problems too. I can TOTALLY empathize. I

> have been dealing with undiagnosed hashi's since i was at least 15 and

> finally got diagnosed almost 3 years ago. I just don't understand how

> the both of us could be so unlucky. Now I need to worry about my

children.

>

>

>

>

> > Hi -

> >

> > Betaine, brad and Phil have already given you good

> > advice and I would agree with all that they said. Let

> > me just add -

> >

> > 1. I would be very concerned about your " hormone

> > specialist " doc. To me, prescribing DHEA to correct

> > low testosterone is voodoo medicine. If you do the

> > research, you will find that, in males, DHEA can

> > convert to either testosterone or estrogen. I don't

> > know of any doctor who knows what they are doing who

> > would prescribe DHEA to treat a testosterone

> > deficiency. Which is not to say that the low DHEA

> > should not be treated with a supplement.

> >

> > 2. What testosterone has been prescribed? Be aware

> > that exogenous testosterone will shut down your

> > husband's own production and the exogenous

> > testosterone may not be enough to bring him back to

> > where he was. He may wind up with lower levels and

> > feeling worse as a result of this prescription. This

> > has happened to many of us.

> >

> >

> > 3. Be nice to your husband. He is having to deal with

> > a very tough issue. I know from experience.

> >

> > Jim

> >

> >

> > --- wrote:

> >

> > > Hi y'all! New here!

> > >

> > > My husband had a vasectomy 3.5 years ago. SInce

> > > then, his health has

> > > declined (although I was told on the vasectomy board

> > > that this has

> > > nothing to do with his isues). Finally I got some

> > > answers and it

> > > appear that his

> > > testosterone is at the very bottom of the range 6.65

> > > (range 6.5 -

> > > 28.1). He is only 32. He has become crabby, snappy

> > > with the children

> > > (has even cried to me because he says he is no

> > > longer the same

> > > person). He is also tired (fatigued) and the sex

> > > drive is literally

> > > gonzo. It has also been discovered that his estrogen

> > > is low as well as

> > > his DHEA (approx. 140 and it should be around 400+),

> > > levels of a MUCH

> > > older man.

> > >

> > > Is there anyone out there that can relate to what we

> > > are going

> > > through? I will do anything to get my husband back.

> > > He is way too

> > > young to be having these hormonal issues. My doc (a

> > > hormones

> > > specialist) tried to get his hormones up with

> > > supplemental DHEA and it

> > > has done nothing, in fact his testosterone dipped

> > > even lower. She

> > > today, prescribed testosterone. Thanks!!!!!

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

> >

> > __________________________________________________

> >

[Guest guest]

DHEA levels have large swings depending on stress levels and

exertion levels from day to day. Day to day fluctuations can be

hundreds of points where as T levels are 10's, not 100's.

LifeExtention has many complicated but very useful articles and

research data on the use of supplements, alternatives, health and

hormones. Happy reading, Swim

, " " <d_timmsjosey@...> wrote:

>

> Dhea declines after 35, but 17 points from the edge is very very

low

> for someone your age. If your free t's are borderline low, do you

mean

> in the bottom of the range (ie. range is .8 - 1.9 and you are .8 or

> .9)? If so, this would indicate a need for possible thyroid

hormones.

> Have you ever had your thyroid antibodies tested? What's your TSH.

The

> New TSH range was narrowed down to .3 - 3.0, and anything over 2.0

> should be monitored very closely. WHere are you at. It is not at

all

> uncommon for those with failing thyroids from thyroid disease to

have

> low DHEA, hormonal issues etc...

>

>

> > Has anyone seen a normal ranges chart (by age) for DHEA. I'd

like to

> see where I'm supposed to fit at age 41. My DHEA is at the low end

of

> normal 17 points from the cliff. I have a lot of other related lows

> simular to Phil - low T, high E2, borderline low T3 and T4, low

> phosphorus and calcium, and a few other odd readings. Have a new

doc

> appointment on the 29th, this will be number 6.

> >

> > L

> >

> > <d_timmsjosey@> wrote:

> > HI JIm,

> >

> > My doc wanted to just " try " the dhea to see if it would budge his

> > hormones because it is like a master hormone to all the other

> > hormones. Also, he needs it anyway since his dhea is 140 and the

range

> > is 80-450 and he should be somewhere near the upper end of the

range

> > at his age. He has the DHEA of an elderly man and of course with

low

> > levels of DHEA, it opens a pandora's box to age related illness,

> > autoimmune disease and even cancer. He already has alopecia.

It's a

> > bald spot that has grown from 1 quarter in size to about 6 in 5

months

> > (not a fun thing to have on top of all this hormonal crap).

Anyway,

> > She thought it was worth a try because she seemed hesitant to

start

> > him off with testosterone. The testosterone she prescribed is

called

> > chrysin. It is totally bioidentical (same thing his body already

> > produces, nothing synthetic whatsoever).

> >

> > As for being understanding, trust me, if it wasn't for me, he

would

> > not be even getting help. I have been the one to research and do

all

> > the appointment setting etc... I myself have an autoimmune

disease -

> > hashimoto's - and hormonal problems too. I can TOTALLY

empathize. I

> > have been dealing with undiagnosed hashi's since i was at least

15 and

> > finally got diagnosed almost 3 years ago. I just don't

understand how

> > the both of us could be so unlucky. Now I need to worry about my

> children.

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > > Hi -

> > >

> > > Betaine, brad and Phil have already given you good

> > > advice and I would agree with all that they said. Let

> > > me just add -

> > >

> > > 1. I would be very concerned about your " hormone

> > > specialist " doc. To me, prescribing DHEA to correct

> > > low testosterone is voodoo medicine. If you do the

> > > research, you will find that, in males, DHEA can

> > > convert to either testosterone or estrogen. I don't

> > > know of any doctor who knows what they are doing who

> > > would prescribe DHEA to treat a testosterone

> > > deficiency. Which is not to say that the low DHEA

> > > should not be treated with a supplement.

> > >

> > > 2. What testosterone has been prescribed? Be aware

> > > that exogenous testosterone will shut down your

> > > husband's own production and the exogenous

> > > testosterone may not be enough to bring him back to

> > > where he was. He may wind up with lower levels and

> > > feeling worse as a result of this prescription. This

> > > has happened to many of us.

> > >

> > >

> > > 3. Be nice to your husband. He is having to deal with

> > > a very tough issue. I know from experience.

> > >

> > > Jim

> > >

> > >

> > > --- wrote:

> > >

> > > > Hi y'all! New here!

> > > >

> > > > My husband had a vasectomy 3.5 years ago. SInce

> > > > then, his health has

> > > > declined (although I was told on the vasectomy board

> > > > that this has

> > > > nothing to do with his isues). Finally I got some

> > > > answers and it

> > > > appear that his

> > > > testosterone is at the very bottom of the range 6.65

> > > > (range 6.5 -

> > > > 28.1). He is only 32. He has become crabby, snappy

> > > > with the children

> > > > (has even cried to me because he says he is no

> > > > longer the same

> > > > person). He is also tired (fatigued) and the sex

> > > > drive is literally

> > > > gonzo. It has also been discovered that his estrogen

> > > > is low as well as

> > > > his DHEA (approx. 140 and it should be around 400+),

> > > > levels of a MUCH

> > > > older man.

> > > >

> > > > Is there anyone out there that can relate to what we

> > > > are going

> > > > through? I will do anything to get my husband back.

> > > > He is way too

> > > > young to be having these hormonal issues. My doc (a

> > > > hormones

> > > > specialist) tried to get his hormones up with

> > > > supplemental DHEA and it

> > > > has done nothing, in fact his testosterone dipped

> > > > even lower. She

> > > > today, prescribed testosterone. Thanks!!!!!

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > > __________________________________________________

> > >

[Guest guest]

Liam Lef.had a chart and when I linked to it they changed it and the chart is

gone. But in the chart they said men any age need DHEA at 400

Phil

Liam <patrolbase19@...> wrote:

Has anyone seen a normal ranges chart (by age) for DHEA. I'd like to see where

I'm supposed to fit at age 41. My DHEA is at the low end of normal 17 points

from the cliff. I have a lot of other related lows simular to Phil - low T, high

E2, borderline low T3 and T4, low phosphorus and calcium, and a few other odd

readings. Have a new doc appointment on the 29th, this will be number 6.

L

wrote:

HI JIm,

My doc wanted to just " try " the dhea to see if it would budge his

hormones because it is like a master hormone to all the other

hormones. Also, he needs it anyway since his dhea is 140 and the range

is 80-450 and he should be somewhere near the upper end of the range

at his age. He has the DHEA of an elderly man and of course with low

levels of DHEA, it opens a pandora's box to age related illness,

autoimmune disease and even cancer. He already has alopecia. It's a

bald spot that has grown from 1 quarter in size to about 6 in 5 months

(not a fun thing to have on top of all this hormonal crap). Anyway,

She thought it was worth a try because she seemed hesitant to start

him off with testosterone. The testosterone she prescribed is called

chrysin. It is totally bioidentical (same thing his body already

produces, nothing synthetic whatsoever).

As for being understanding, trust me, if it wasn't for me, he would

not be even getting help. I have been the one to research and do all

the appointment setting etc... I myself have an autoimmune disease -

hashimoto's - and hormonal problems too. I can TOTALLY empathize. I

have been dealing with undiagnosed hashi's since i was at least 15 and

finally got diagnosed almost 3 years ago. I just don't understand how

the both of us could be so unlucky. Now I need to worry about my children.

> Hi -

>

> Betaine, brad and Phil have already given you good

> advice and I would agree with all that they said. Let

> me just add -

>

> 1. I would be very concerned about your " hormone

> specialist " doc. To me, prescribing DHEA to correct

> low testosterone is voodoo medicine. If you do the

> research, you will find that, in males, DHEA can

> convert to either testosterone or estrogen. I don't

> know of any doctor who knows what they are doing who

> would prescribe DHEA to treat a testosterone

> deficiency. Which is not to say that the low DHEA

> should not be treated with a supplement.

>

> 2. What testosterone has been prescribed? Be aware

> that exogenous testosterone will shut down your

> husband's own production and the exogenous

> testosterone may not be enough to bring him back to

> where he was. He may wind up with lower levels and

> feeling worse as a result of this prescription. This

> has happened to many of us.

>

>

> 3. Be nice to your husband. He is having to deal with

> a very tough issue. I know from experience.

>

> Jim

>

>

> --- wrote:

>

> > Hi y'all! New here!

> >

> > My husband had a vasectomy 3.5 years ago. SInce

> > then, his health has

> > declined (although I was told on the vasectomy board

> > that this has

> > nothing to do with his isues). Finally I got some

> > answers and it

> > appear that his

> > testosterone is at the very bottom of the range 6.65

> > (range 6.5 -

> > 28.1). He is only 32. He has become crabby, snappy

> > with the children

> > (has even cried to me because he says he is no

> > longer the same

> > person). He is also tired (fatigued) and the sex

> > drive is literally

> > gonzo. It has also been discovered that his estrogen

> > is low as well as

> > his DHEA (approx. 140 and it should be around 400+),

> > levels of a MUCH

> > older man.

> >

> > Is there anyone out there that can relate to what we

> > are going

> > through? I will do anything to get my husband back.

> > He is way too

> > young to be having these hormonal issues. My doc (a

> > hormones

> > specialist) tried to get his hormones up with

> > supplemental DHEA and it

> > has done nothing, in fact his testosterone dipped

> > even lower. She

> > today, prescribed testosterone. Thanks!!!!!

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

>

> __________________________________________________

>