Guest guest Posted September 18, 2008 Report Share Posted September 18, 2008 Hey guys, First of all, I'm new here. Second, I've had secondary hypogondism since I hit puberty. It was first officially diagnosed at 19. One issue that doctors seem to ignore is that my SHBG is also low, which means I always have way more free testosterone than I should. This has interfered GREATLY with getting any sort of positive results from testosterone replacement therapy. Low T and low SHBG in combination are highly correlated with metabolic syndrome/type 2 diabetes. I was pretty sure that I must have these things -- but after a fasting insulin and glucose test -- it appears that I do not have any obvious problems with insulin resistance. Does anyone else here have SHBG that is in the lower end of the range, or perhaps outside of the normal range? Any ideas as to why my SHBG might be so low, if the cause /isn't/ insulin resistance? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 19, 2008 Report Share Posted September 19, 2008 You did not say how low your SHBG is but mine stays at about 22 and this is good. Having higher levels of Free T is not so bad yet Free T is only about 2% of all the testosterone in your body. Here is a cut and paste from Dr. nco his posts are in the files section he was helping men at Meso with low T doing research on his new book. Because the guys helped him with his research he tried his best to help answer there questions. You can find his posts in the files section under marianco7 zip. ================================ SHBG low ; what can it indicate ? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Quote: Originally Posted by chip douglas My latest SHBG was : SHBG 17 ( 10 - 73 ) But I have low Total T, therefore what can this low SHBG can reveal in terms of relationship to other hormones such as Estrogens and insulin ? SHBG is reduced by: high insulin (insulin resistance/diabetes), low thyroid, high testosterone, high DHEA, high growth hormone, low estrogens, low progesterone, high dihydrotestosterone SHBG is increased by: low insulin, high thyroid, high estrogens, high progesterone, low testosterone, low DHEA, low growth hormone, low Dihydrotestosterone. Low SHBG increases Free Testosterone. High SHBG reduces Fress Testosterone The hormone with the strongest effect on SHBG is insulin. Low SHBG is most often strongly correlated with diabetes or insulin resistance. High androgen levels such as the use of supraphysiologic doses of testosterone can also drive SHBG down. Most cases of insulin resistance/type II diabetes start with hypothyrodism (low thyroid hormone levels). Treating thyroid hormone deficiency can prevent the development of insulin resistance and diabetes. Once the horse is out of the barn - and diabetes type II is present, increasing thyroid hormone alone may not always reverse insulin resistance since other hormone imbalances may occur to perpetuate insulin resistance (e.g. testosterone deficiency or adrenal fatigue - which in turn worsens conversion of T4 to T3, etc.) or end-organ damage may occur which may be irreversible. Insulin resistance itself can worsen thyroid function - thus causing a positive feedback loop or death spiral - by causing loss of zinc and iodine and by causing nervous system damage. This is where the relationships between hormone systems and nutrition become highly intricate and undoing problems can become complex. ================================================================================\ =============================================== You can also go to Meso's Men's Health it was started by Dr. at www.allthingsmale.com and just click on his nick and then click on read all his posts. http://forum.mesomorphosis.com/men-s-health-forum/ Or do a search on low SHBG. Co-Moderator Phil > From: jamie.vegas <no_reply > > Subject: Anyone with Low SHBG as well as T? > > Date: Thursday, September 18, 2008, 9:24 PM > Hey guys, > > First of all, I'm new here. Second, I've had > secondary hypogondism > since I hit puberty. It was first officially diagnosed at > 19. > > One issue that doctors seem to ignore is that my SHBG is > also low, > which means I always have way more free testosterone than I > should. > This has interfered GREATLY with getting any sort of > positive results > from testosterone replacement therapy. > > Low T and low SHBG in combination are highly correlated > with metabolic > syndrome/type 2 diabetes. I was pretty sure that I must > have these > things -- but after a fasting insulin and glucose test -- > it appears > that I do not have any obvious problems with insulin > resistance. > > Does anyone else here have SHBG that is in the lower end of > the range, > or perhaps outside of the normal range? > > Any ideas as to why my SHBG might be so low, if the cause > /isn't/ > insulin resistance? > > > ------------------------------------ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 19, 2008 Report Share Posted September 19, 2008 my last blood tests showed: SHBG of 8 with a reference range of 9-45 nmol/L total T 585 with a range of 250-1100 ng/dl free T 194.2 with a range of 46-224 pg/ml bioavailable T 399.3 with a range of 110-575 ng/dl fasting glucose was 95 with a range of 65-99 mg/dl Dr. Crisler never mentioned anything about insulin and no one has ever tested it. I am about 50 lbs overweight. So now what? Jim From: pmgamer18@... Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2008 07:10:07 -0700 Subject: Re: Anyone with Low SHBG as well as T? You did not say how low your SHBG is but mine stays at about 22 and this is good. Having higher levels of Free T is not so bad yet Free T is only about 2% of all the testosterone in your body. Here is a cut and paste from Dr. nco his posts are in the files section he was helping men at Meso with low T doing research on his new book. Because the guys helped him with his research he tried his best to help answer there questions. You can find his posts in the files section under marianco7 zip. ================================ SHBG low ; what can it indicate ? ---------------------------------------------------------- Quote: Originally Posted by chip douglas My latest SHBG was : SHBG 17 ( 10 - 73 ) But I have low Total T, therefore what can this low SHBG can reveal in terms of relationship to other hormones such as Estrogens and insulin ? SHBG is reduced by: high insulin (insulin resistance/diabetes), low thyroid, high testosterone, high DHEA, high growth hormone, low estrogens, low progesterone, high dihydrotestosterone SHBG is increased by: low insulin, high thyroid, high estrogens, high progesterone, low testosterone, low DHEA, low growth hormone, low Dihydrotestosterone. Low SHBG increases Free Testosterone. High SHBG reduces Fress Testosterone The hormone with the strongest effect on SHBG is insulin. Low SHBG is most often strongly correlated with diabetes or insulin resistance. High androgen levels such as the use of supraphysiologic doses of testosterone can also drive SHBG down. Most cases of insulin resistance/type II diabetes start with hypothyrodism (low thyroid hormone levels). Treating thyroid hormone deficiency can prevent the development of insulin resistance and diabetes. Once the horse is out of the barn - and diabetes type II is present, increasing thyroid hormone alone may not always reverse insulin resistance since other hormone imbalances may occur to perpetuate insulin resistance (e.g. testosterone deficiency or adrenal fatigue - which in turn worsens conversion of T4 to T3, etc.) or end-organ damage may occur which may be irreversible. Insulin resistance itself can worsen thyroid function - thus causing a positive feedback loop or death spiral - by causing loss of zinc and iodine and by causing nervous system damage. This is where the relationships between hormone systems and nutrition become highly intricate and undoing problems can become complex. ================================================================================\ =============================================== You can also go to Meso's Men's Health it was started by Dr. at www.allthingsmale.com and just click on his nick and then click on read all his posts. http://forum.mesomorphosis.com/men-s-health-forum/ Or do a search on low SHBG. Co-Moderator Phil > From: jamie.vegas <no_reply > > Subject: Anyone with Low SHBG as well as T? > > Date: Thursday, September 18, 2008, 9:24 PM > Hey guys, > > First of all, I'm new here. Second, I've had > secondary hypogondism > since I hit puberty. It was first officially diagnosed at > 19. > > One issue that doctors seem to ignore is that my SHBG is > also low, > which means I always have way more free testosterone than I > should. > This has interfered GREATLY with getting any sort of > positive results > from testosterone replacement therapy. > > Low T and low SHBG in combination are highly correlated > with metabolic > syndrome/type 2 diabetes. I was pretty sure that I must > have these > things -- but after a fasting insulin and glucose test -- > it appears > that I do not have any obvious problems with insulin > resistance. > > Does anyone else here have SHBG that is in the lower end of > the range, > or perhaps outside of the normal range? > > Any ideas as to why my SHBG might be so low, if the cause > /isn't/ > insulin resistance? > > > ------------------------------------ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 19, 2008 Report Share Posted September 19, 2008 In the files containing Dr. no's posts (bundled in the " Files " section of the group as marianco7.zip), Dr. no interacts with folks concerning free T & SHBG. He confirmed many of the causes already listed for low SHBG, but named a few more: " SHBG is reduced by: high insulin (insulin resistance/diabetes), low thyroid, high testosterone, high DHEA, high growth hormone, low estrogens, low progesterone, high dihydrotestosterone SHBG is increased by: low insulin, high thyroid, high estrogens, high progesterone, low testosterone, low DHEA, low growth hormone, low Dihydrotestosterone. Low SHBG increases Free Testosterone. High SHBG reduces Free Testosterone The hormone with the strongest effect on SHBG is insulin. Low SHBG is most often strongly correlated with diabetes or insulin resistance. High androgen levels such as the use of supraphysiologic doses of testosterone can also drive SHBG down. " He mentioned insulin specifically as one thing that lowers SHBG (since people with higher insulin levels [ & body fat] have lower SHBG, & their SHBG levels increase following weight loss & insulin decrease): " Thus without these other measurements (of the other hormones listed above), SHBG may tell very little. A low SHBG may correlate best with insulin levels - i.e. diabetes or insulin resistance - and is thus most useful for screening for diabetes. " However, checking out the references of Wikipedia's SHBG page adds another factor which makes sense: liver function. Since SHBG is produced by the liver, things that affect the liver's lipid production, such as dietary intake of simple sugars, can affect SHBG. http://www.physorg.com/news113902673.html The article states, " Glucose and fructose are metabolized in the liver. When there's too much sugar in the diet, the liver converts it to lipid. Using a mouse model and human liver cell cultures, the scientists discovered that the increased production of lipid shut down a gene called SHBG (sex hormone binding globulin), reducing the amount of SHBG protein in the blood. SHBG protein plays a key role in controlling the amount of testosterone and estrogen that's available throughout the body. " ... " 'We discovered that low levels of SHBG in a person's blood means the liver's metabolic state is out of wack – because of inappropriate diet or something that's inherently wrong with the liver – long before there are any disease symptoms,' says Dr. Geoffrey Hammond, the study's principal investigator, scientific director of the Child & Family Research Institute in Vancouver, Canada, and professor in the Department of Obstetrics & Gynecology at the University of British Columbia. " This article echoes the previous one: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17992261 I remember Dr. no stating that both SHBG & free Testosterone tend to be influenced by so many other hormones & factors that it really isn't worthwhile to focus upon them, but rather to look at other imbalances that may have caused irregular readings of those two. If someone has symptoms AND irregularities of SHBG/free Testosterone, it's worth checking other hormones & treating; however, if a person is asymptomatic & has low SHBG- in spite of good health habits- it probably isn't something worth worrying about. ~Xian > > > > > From: jamie.vegas <no_reply > > > > Subject: Anyone with Low SHBG as well as T? > > > > > > Date: Thursday, September 18, 2008, 9:24 PM > > > Hey guys, > > > > > > First of all, I'm new here. Second, I've had > > > secondary hypogondism > > > since I hit puberty. It was first officially diagnosed at > > > 19. > > > > > > One issue that doctors seem to ignore is that my SHBG is > > > also low, > > > which means I always have way more free testosterone than I > > > should. > > > This has interfered GREATLY with getting any sort of > > > positive results > > > from testosterone replacement therapy. > > > > > > Low T and low SHBG in combination are highly correlated > > > with metabolic > > > syndrome/type 2 diabetes. I was pretty sure that I must > > > have these > > > things -- but after a fasting insulin and glucose test -- > > > it appears > > > that I do not have any obvious problems with insulin > > > resistance. > > > > > > Does anyone else here have SHBG that is in the lower end of > > > the range, > > > or perhaps outside of the normal range? > > > > > > Any ideas as to why my SHBG might be so low, if the cause > > > /isn't/ > > > insulin resistance? > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 19, 2008 Report Share Posted September 19, 2008 Hi I have low T & SHBG My results were; Total T: 10.4 nmol/L (or 300 ng/dL) (ref range 10-36) SHBG : 19 nmol/L (ref range 13-70) LH :4.5 U/l FSH : 4.7 U/l estrodiol : 4.90 pg/ml (ref range 0-50) I need to now get diagnosis for whats causing this - like you had this since puberty (29 now) but did not go to doctor as symptoms mild and would not have know what to ask basically What was reason (diagnosis) for you being secondary? I am really worried I am primary but LH & FSH would maybe indicate something different. Cheers Chris > > Hey guys, > > First of all, I'm new here. Second, I've had secondary hypogondism > since I hit puberty. It was first officially diagnosed at 19. > > One issue that doctors seem to ignore is that my SHBG is also low, > which means I always have way more free testosterone than I should. > This has interfered GREATLY with getting any sort of positive results > from testosterone replacement therapy. > > Low T and low SHBG in combination are highly correlated with metabolic > syndrome/type 2 diabetes. I was pretty sure that I must have these > things -- but after a fasting insulin and glucose test -- it appears > that I do not have any obvious problems with insulin resistance. > > Does anyone else here have SHBG that is in the lower end of the range, > or perhaps outside of the normal range? > > Any ideas as to why my SHBG might be so low, if the cause /isn't/ > insulin resistance? > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 19, 2008 Report Share Posted September 19, 2008 He may not have said anything because there is not a problem. I know Dr. tests everything and remembers older labs. So if this problems has to do with just getting your levels up and keeping them there the old saying the rest will follow should apply here. But it never hurts to question low labs. I do this with my Dr. all the time hell he would not test my Ferritin levels and when I pressed to do them and they come back below normal he never said a thing to me about it. I went home with my copy of labs I always get a copy and when I seen this I called him and said WTF don't you feel I need some Iron to treat this. Yep he missed it but we are only human. Co-Moderator Phil > > > > > From: jamie.vegas <no_reply > > > > Subject: Anyone with Low SHBG as well > as T? > > > > > > Date: Thursday, September 18, 2008, 9:24 PM > > > Hey guys, > > > > > > First of all, I'm new here. Second, I've had > > > secondary hypogondism > > > since I hit puberty. It was first officially > diagnosed at > > > 19. > > > > > > One issue that doctors seem to ignore is that my SHBG > is > > > also low, > > > which means I always have way more free testosterone > than I > > > should. > > > This has interfered GREATLY with getting any sort of > > > positive results > > > from testosterone replacement therapy. > > > > > > Low T and low SHBG in combination are highly > correlated > > > with metabolic > > > syndrome/type 2 diabetes. I was pretty sure that I > must > > > have these > > > things -- but after a fasting insulin and glucose test > -- > > > it appears > > > that I do not have any obvious problems with insulin > > > resistance. > > > > > > Does anyone else here have SHBG that is in the lower > end of > > > the range, > > > or perhaps outside of the normal range? > > > > > > Any ideas as to why my SHBG might be so low, if the > cause > > > /isn't/ > > > insulin resistance? > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 19, 2008 Report Share Posted September 19, 2008 Chirs the lower your Estradiol the lower your SHBG. You need to figure out why your T levels are so low. If it's a fatty liver or something like this fixing it will bring levels back up some are like your labs do to high Iron levels. You just need more tests. Co-Moderator Phil > From: chrisdl2008 <chrisdl2008@...> > Subject: Re: Anyone with Low SHBG as well as T? > > Date: Friday, September 19, 2008, 3:12 PM > Hi > > I have low T & SHBG > > My results were; > > Total T: 10.4 nmol/L (or 300 ng/dL) (ref range 10-36) > SHBG : 19 nmol/L (ref range 13-70) > LH :4.5 U/l > FSH : 4.7 U/l > estrodiol : 4.90 pg/ml (ref range 0-50) > > I need to now get diagnosis for whats causing this - like > you had > this since puberty (29 now) but did not go to doctor as > symptoms mild > and would not have know what to ask basically > > What was reason (diagnosis) for you being secondary? > > I am really worried I am primary but LH & FSH would > maybe indicate > something different. > > Cheers > > Chris > > > > > > > > > Hey guys, > > > > First of all, I'm new here. Second, I've had > secondary hypogondism > > since I hit puberty. It was first officially > diagnosed at 19. > > > > One issue that doctors seem to ignore is that my SHBG > is also low, > > which means I always have way more free testosterone > than I > should. > > This has interfered GREATLY with getting any sort of > positive > results > > from testosterone replacement therapy. > > > > Low T and low SHBG in combination are highly > correlated with > metabolic > > syndrome/type 2 diabetes. I was pretty sure that I > must have these > > things -- but after a fasting insulin and glucose test > -- it > appears > > that I do not have any obvious problems with insulin > resistance. > > > > Does anyone else here have SHBG that is in the lower > end of the > range, > > or perhaps outside of the normal range? > > > > Any ideas as to why my SHBG might be so low, if the > cause /isn't/ > > insulin resistance? > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 20, 2008 Report Share Posted September 20, 2008 Cheers Phil I'm aware I need more tests to find problem - I'm just trying to figure out all things I need tested for now so I'm not going to doctor on loads of visits which will result in me be labelled as a hyochondriac which the doctor as already hinted at even though Ive only been to doctors 3 times in my life (all this year) for IBS and lot T symptoms - probably inter-related no doubt > > > > > > Hey guys, > > > > > > First of all, I'm new here. Second, I've had > > secondary hypogondism > > > since I hit puberty. It was first officially > > diagnosed at 19. > > > > > > One issue that doctors seem to ignore is that my SHBG > > is also low, > > > which means I always have way more free testosterone > > than I > > should. > > > This has interfered GREATLY with getting any sort of > > positive > > results > > > from testosterone replacement therapy. > > > > > > Low T and low SHBG in combination are highly > > correlated with > > metabolic > > > syndrome/type 2 diabetes. I was pretty sure that I > > must have these > > > things -- but after a fasting insulin and glucose test > > -- it > > appears > > > that I do not have any obvious problems with insulin > > resistance. > > > > > > Does anyone else here have SHBG that is in the lower > > end of the > > range, > > > or perhaps outside of the normal range? > > > > > > Any ideas as to why my SHBG might be so low, if the > > cause /isn't/ > > > insulin resistance? > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 20, 2008 Report Share Posted September 20, 2008 Here is a link to test I tell men to get at my Thyroid forum this should help you figure out what labs you might need and if you go to Dr. 's site Reat TRT: A Recipe for Success in this are the labs and why. http://forums.realthyroidhelp.com/viewtopic.php?f=5 & t=7059 Co-Moderator Phil > From: chrisdl2008 <chrisdl2008@...> > Subject: Re: Anyone with Low SHBG as well as T? > > Date: Saturday, September 20, 2008, 4:53 AM > Cheers Phil > > I'm aware I need more tests to find problem - I'm > just trying to > figure out all things I need tested for now so I'm not > going to > doctor on loads of visits which will result in me be > labelled as a > hyochondriac which the doctor as already hinted at even > though Ive > only been to doctors 3 times in my life (all this year) for > IBS and > lot T symptoms - probably inter-related no doubt > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hey guys, > > > > > > > > First of all, I'm new here. Second, > I've had > > > secondary hypogondism > > > > since I hit puberty. It was first > officially > > > diagnosed at 19. > > > > > > > > One issue that doctors seem to ignore is > that my SHBG > > > is also low, > > > > which means I always have way more free > testosterone > > > than I > > > should. > > > > This has interfered GREATLY with getting any > sort of > > > positive > > > results > > > > from testosterone replacement therapy. > > > > > > > > Low T and low SHBG in combination are highly > > > correlated with > > > metabolic > > > > syndrome/type 2 diabetes. I was pretty sure > that I > > > must have these > > > > things -- but after a fasting insulin and > glucose test > > > -- it > > > appears > > > > that I do not have any obvious problems with > insulin > > > resistance. > > > > > > > > Does anyone else here have SHBG that is in > the lower > > > end of the > > > range, > > > > or perhaps outside of the normal range? > > > > > > > > Any ideas as to why my SHBG might be so low, > if the > > > cause /isn't/ > > > > insulin resistance? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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