Guest guest Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 I also order my own blood tests. It's cheap enough, I get what I want checked, and it's less time consuming than doctor shopping. It's frustrating, but even living in Los Angeles, I can't find a decent doc. I know he/she's out there, but there are too damn many to sift through, and the only referral I can find from anyone that's promising is the the tuneupyourtestosterone website. I'll get around to checking one of those guys, although I'd almost rather go in now saying " This is what I'm on, it's working, verify with your own tests, then keep me on the regimen. " I've learned with my thyroid that sometimes you have to be your own doc. > Re: E2 economics > > > The problem with going off on your own and getting Arimidex > (I've considered this myself), is you really need to have E2 > checked frequently when you're on it in order to gauge what > the proper dosage should be, and ultimately what the best > " maintenance " dose should be to maintain a reasonable level. > I would try another doctor. > > I have my doubts on how much these herbal remedies and/or > zinc work. Especially if your levels are really high. > > Dave K. > > > > > > Zinc hasn't been working for me to lower E2, my PCP won't prescribe > > Arimidex, and it's months before I can see the Endo he referred me > too, who > > I've seen before for thyroid, and I just KNOW she won't prescribe > it either > > (she's enough behind the times on thyroid that there's no way > she'll be up > > to speed on testosterone therapy). > > > > I haven't reached full blown ED yet, but erections have been > getting softer > > and harder to maintain as my time on TRT continues. > > > > Anyways, desperate to get this E2 down, I bought a bottle of 6-OXO > > (Ergopharm), which is supposed to lower E2 by permanently bonding > to > > aromatase enzymes. It may be psychological, but I think it has > some effect, > > erections have been slightly firmer and easier to maintain the > last few > > days. > > > > Here's the downside, though, economics: > > > > 1 bottle of the stuff (60 capsules), costs $35. Daily dose is 3 > to 6 > > capsules per day depending on if you're body builder coming off a > > Testosterone cycle, or just someone trying to increase T without > steroids. > > So, figure 3 caps per day, one bottle is a 20 day supply, but I'm > on TRT, so > > 6 is probably more likely. Either way, I'm looking at $50 to $100 > per month > > to use this stuff, if it even really works. > > > > Arimidex, on the other hand, without insurance, can be bought in > Mexico > > without a prescription, or from Dr. , for about $9 per 1gm > pill. It > > seems the typical dose peopel on Arimidex in this group are taking > is > > somewhere around 0.5g every 5 to 10 days. Depending on what > actually works > > for me, I can get something that is sure to work, much more > effective, and > > at a cost of somewhere between $15 and $30 per month. > > > > Zinc, if it works, is obviously the best choice, but between the > other two > > choices it seems like a no brainer. > > > > With the availability of cheap real pharmacueticals, I wonder how > these > > supplement, pro-hormone, whatever manufacturers stay in business. > > > > Any comments? > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 Dave, where do you order your own blood tests in California? I thought we couldn't do that here. Thanks. _____ From: Dave [mailto:daultman@...] Sent: Saturday, August 21, 2004 9:37 AM Subject: RE: Re: E2 economics I also order my own blood tests. It's cheap enough, I get what I want checked, and it's less time consuming than doctor shopping. It's frustrating, but even living in Los Angeles, I can't find a decent doc. I know he/she's out there, but there are too damn many to sift through, and the only referral I can find from anyone that's promising is the the tuneupyourtestosterone website. I'll get around to checking one of those guys, although I'd almost rather go in now saying " This is what I'm on, it's working, verify with your own tests, then keep me on the regimen. " I've learned with my thyroid that sometimes you have to be your own doc. > Re: E2 economics > > > The problem with going off on your own and getting Arimidex > (I've considered this myself), is you really need to have E2 > checked frequently when you're on it in order to gauge what > the proper dosage should be, and ultimately what the best > " maintenance " dose should be to maintain a reasonable level. > I would try another doctor. > > I have my doubts on how much these herbal remedies and/or > zinc work. Especially if your levels are really high. > > Dave K. > > > > > > Zinc hasn't been working for me to lower E2, my PCP won't prescribe > > Arimidex, and it's months before I can see the Endo he referred me > too, who > > I've seen before for thyroid, and I just KNOW she won't prescribe > it either > > (she's enough behind the times on thyroid that there's no way > she'll be up > > to speed on testosterone therapy). > > > > I haven't reached full blown ED yet, but erections have been > getting softer > > and harder to maintain as my time on TRT continues. > > > > Anyways, desperate to get this E2 down, I bought a bottle of 6-OXO > > (Ergopharm), which is supposed to lower E2 by permanently bonding > to > > aromatase enzymes. It may be psychological, but I think it has > some effect, > > erections have been slightly firmer and easier to maintain the > last few > > days. > > > > Here's the downside, though, economics: > > > > 1 bottle of the stuff (60 capsules), costs $35. Daily dose is 3 > to 6 > > capsules per day depending on if you're body builder coming off a > > Testosterone cycle, or just someone trying to increase T without > steroids. > > So, figure 3 caps per day, one bottle is a 20 day supply, but I'm > on TRT, so > > 6 is probably more likely. Either way, I'm looking at $50 to $100 > per month > > to use this stuff, if it even really works. > > > > Arimidex, on the other hand, without insurance, can be bought in > Mexico > > without a prescription, or from Dr. , for about $9 per 1gm > pill. It > > seems the typical dose peopel on Arimidex in this group are taking > is > > somewhere around 0.5g every 5 to 10 days. Depending on what > actually works > > for me, I can get something that is sure to work, much more > effective, and > > at a cost of somewhere between $15 and $30 per month. > > > > Zinc, if it works, is obviously the best choice, but between the > other two > > choices it seems like a no brainer. > > > > With the availability of cheap real pharmacueticals, I wonder how > these > > supplement, pro-hormone, whatever manufacturers stay in business. > > > > Any comments? > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 Thanks for the links. I've posted my labs recently - E2 was about twice what I think it should be based on everyone's postings here. Total estrogens are through the roof, which can't be good. Actually my T and Free T were very high also. Estradiol, Sensitive = 80 pg/ml (range 3 - 70) Estrogens, Total = 385 pg/ml (range 40 - 115) If one dose of 1mg is supposed to cut E2 by 70% (that was in a link posted here this week), I'm going to be very conservative and test often. > Re: E2 economics > > First have your blood levels checked while not taking any > anti-e products for a week or two to find out if it is high E > in the first place. > > The least expensive way to get anti-e is through the liquid > chemical research site. > > You can get 30ml of Anastrozole for $30.00 @1mg/ml is $1.00 a > mg, @ .5mg a week that is a years supply for $30.00. > > Also Tamoxifen/Clomiphene Citrate 10mg/50mg mix in a 60 mil > bottle for $40.00, that is a one to two year supply. > > I will post one site here, although there are many others out > there, i have made a purchase from this site and did get my > bottles in a few days. They are oral, do not inject. > > http://www.ibelabs.net/ > > Go to the Aqueous Solutions link. > > > > > > > > > Zinc hasn't been working for me to lower E2, my PCP won't prescribe > > Arimidex, and it's months before I can see the Endo he referred me > > too, who I've seen before for thyroid, and I just KNOW she won't > > prescribe it either (she's enough behind the times on thyroid that > > there's no way she'll be up to speed on testosterone therapy). > > > > I haven't reached full blown ED yet, but erections have > been getting > > softer and harder to maintain as my time on TRT continues. > > > > Anyways, desperate to get this E2 down, I bought a bottle of 6-OXO > > (Ergopharm), which is supposed to lower E2 by permanently > bonding to > > aromatase enzymes. It may be psychological, but I think it > has some > > effect, erections have been slightly firmer and easier to > maintain the > > last few days. > > > > Here's the downside, though, economics: > > > > 1 bottle of the stuff (60 capsules), costs $35. Daily dose > is 3 to 6 > > capsules per day depending on if you're body builder coming off a > > Testosterone cycle, or just someone trying to increase T > without steroids. > > So, figure 3 caps per day, one bottle is a 20 day supply, > but I'm on > > TRT, so > > 6 is probably more likely. Either way, I'm looking at $50 > to $100 per > > month to use this stuff, if it even really works. > > > > Arimidex, on the other hand, without insurance, can be bought in > > Mexico without a prescription, or from Dr. , for about > $9 per 1gm > > pill. It seems the typical dose peopel on Arimidex in this > group are > > taking is somewhere around 0.5g every 5 to 10 days. > Depending on what > > actually works for me, I can get something that is sure to > work, much > > more effective, and at a cost of somewhere between $15 and > $30 per month. > > > > Zinc, if it works, is obviously the best choice, but > between the other > > two choices it seems like a no brainer. > > > > With the availability of cheap real pharmacueticals, I wonder how > > these supplement, pro-hormone, whatever manufacturers stay > in business. > > > > Any comments? > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 I'm familiar with 's protocol for thyroid, I actually underwent a cycle of it about 5 years ago. The guy you heard about body temperature from wasn't named Steve, was he? He trolled the alt.support.thyroid group a while back. His " theory " was that if you were hypothyroid you could cure your thyroid problems by taking hot baths and wearing sweaters all the time to artificially raise your body temp, which would somehow magically reset your thermostat and make the thyroid produce more. The guy was either a troll or just plain nuts. Low body temperature seems to be a symptom of hypothyroid conditions, but not the cure. What was really amusing was Steve tried to tell me that even though 90% of my gland was removed surgically, I could still cure myself with the hot baths and sweaters...kind of like telling someone who's had their testicles removed that they could produce testosterone by having sex. > Re: E2 economics > > Hi Dave, > > You might want to look into this site for thyroid conditions. > > http://www.wilsonsthyroidsyndrome.com/ > > I heard about it from another group, and how thyroids mess > with body temperatures, and the writer stated that sometimes > getting the body temperature under control helps with the thyroid. > > I think he got his information from the link above. > > > > > > Zinc hasn't been working for me to lower E2, my PCP won't > prescribe > > > > Arimidex, and it's months before I can see the Endo he referred > me > > > too, who > > > > I've seen before for thyroid, and I just KNOW she won't > prescribe > > > it either > > > > (she's enough behind the times on thyroid that there's no way > > > she'll be up > > > > to speed on testosterone therapy). > > > > > > > > I haven't reached full blown ED yet, but erections have been > > > getting softer > > > > and harder to maintain as my time on TRT continues. > > > > > > > > Anyways, desperate to get this E2 down, I bought a bottle of 6- > OXO > > > > (Ergopharm), which is supposed to lower E2 by permanently > bonding > > > to > > > > aromatase enzymes. It may be psychological, but I think it has > > > some effect, > > > > erections have been slightly firmer and easier to maintain the > > > last few > > > > days. > > > > > > > > Here's the downside, though, economics: > > > > > > > > 1 bottle of the stuff (60 capsules), costs $35. Daily dose is 3 > > > to 6 > > > > capsules per day depending on if you're body builder coming off > a > > > > Testosterone cycle, or just someone trying to increase T without > > > steroids. > > > > So, figure 3 caps per day, one bottle is a 20 day supply, but > I'm > > > on TRT, so > > > > 6 is probably more likely. Either way, I'm looking at $50 to > $100 > > > per month > > > > to use this stuff, if it even really works. > > > > > > > > Arimidex, on the other hand, without insurance, can be bought in > > > Mexico > > > > without a prescription, or from Dr. , for about $9 per 1gm > > > pill. It > > > > seems the typical dose peopel on Arimidex in this group are > taking > > > is > > > > somewhere around 0.5g every 5 to 10 days. Depending on what > > > actually works > > > > for me, I can get something that is sure to work, much more > > > effective, and > > > > at a cost of somewhere between $15 and $30 per month. > > > > > > > > Zinc, if it works, is obviously the best choice, but between the > > > other two > > > > choices it seems like a no brainer. > > > > > > > > With the availability of cheap real pharmacueticals, I wonder > how > > > these > > > > supplement, pro-hormone, whatever manufacturers stay in > business. > > > > > > > > Any comments? > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 It's legal again. I use one of two places on the internet: www.healthcheckusa.com or www.preventivelabs.com Both have their ups and downs, but overall I'd say preventivelabs has the edge in my book right now. Pluses and minuses: Preventivelabs - less hassle at the actuallab getting the blood drawn - they send you straight to a labcorp lab no appointment needed, results are mailed or faxed to you, prices a little higher, better " panels " available, slower in processing orders and results. Healthcheck - they send you to a random doctors office, where they want all the new patient paperwork, hassle you over not having an Rx for the blood draw, and want an appointment. Better prices, fewer panels and tests available online (maybe you can get through phone order, paperwork sent to you much quicker, lab results posted on the web (secure site) in a couple of days. > Re: E2 economics > > > > > > The problem with going off on your own and getting Arimidex (I've > > considered this myself), is you really need to have E2 checked > > frequently when you're on it in order to gauge what the > proper dosage > > should be, and ultimately what the best " maintenance " dose > should be > > to maintain a reasonable level. > > I would try another doctor. > > > > I have my doubts on how much these herbal remedies and/or > zinc work. > > Especially if your levels are really high. > > > > Dave K. > > > > > > > > > > > Zinc hasn't been working for me to lower E2, my PCP won't > prescribe > > > Arimidex, and it's months before I can see the Endo he referred me > > too, who > > > I've seen before for thyroid, and I just KNOW she won't prescribe > > it either > > > (she's enough behind the times on thyroid that there's no way > > she'll be up > > > to speed on testosterone therapy). > > > > > > I haven't reached full blown ED yet, but erections have been > > getting softer > > > and harder to maintain as my time on TRT continues. > > > > > > Anyways, desperate to get this E2 down, I bought a bottle > of 6-OXO > > > (Ergopharm), which is supposed to lower E2 by permanently bonding > > to > > > aromatase enzymes. It may be psychological, but I think it has > > some effect, > > > erections have been slightly firmer and easier to maintain the > > last few > > > days. > > > > > > Here's the downside, though, economics: > > > > > > 1 bottle of the stuff (60 capsules), costs $35. Daily dose is 3 > > to 6 > > > capsules per day depending on if you're body builder coming off a > > > Testosterone cycle, or just someone trying to increase T without > > steroids. > > > So, figure 3 caps per day, one bottle is a 20 day supply, but I'm > > on TRT, so > > > 6 is probably more likely. Either way, I'm looking at $50 to $100 > > per month > > > to use this stuff, if it even really works. > > > > > > Arimidex, on the other hand, without insurance, can be bought in > > Mexico > > > without a prescription, or from Dr. , for about $9 per 1gm > > pill. It > > > seems the typical dose peopel on Arimidex in this group are taking > > is > > > somewhere around 0.5g every 5 to 10 days. Depending on what > > actually works > > > for me, I can get something that is sure to work, much more > > effective, and > > > at a cost of somewhere between $15 and $30 per month. > > > > > > Zinc, if it works, is obviously the best choice, but between the > > other two > > > choices it seems like a no brainer. > > > > > > With the availability of cheap real pharmacueticals, I wonder how > > these > > > supplement, pro-hormone, whatever manufacturers stay in business. > > > > > > Any comments? > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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