Re: Another question, I am still confused

[Guest guest]

Hi Mandy,

What did his hair test show? What's his diet like? What dose and dosing

schedule are you using for chelation? What chelator? How much does he weigh?

What supplements?

What did they clean, remodel, paint, spray the school with over the summer?

Does the school have fluorescent lighting? Sounds like he has at least auditory

hypersensitivity, perhaps olfactory and others. Are you/they giving him some

other options for communication like PECS or sign? That gives him a better

chance to " tell " you what's going on/bothering him.

I presume he has NO mercury amalgam dental fillings.

S S

<p>Hi<br>

I do appreciate all of you so much.<br>

We are on Week 14 of chelation, and I am at a loss as to whether to <br>

continue. We have yeast under control, we have found the combination <br>

of supplements that seem to work, but I see no improvements. My son <br>

is hyper as all get out, and there is no way to redirect. He is not <br>

doing well in school, he is stimming and being very loud with noises <br>

(he is nonverbal). He cant sit still.<br>

I dont know if this is the chelation or if this change would have come <br>

about on its own. <br>

Should I have seen at least some improvments? Should I just stop? He <br>

was so calm and sweet until we started this even with the yeast.<br>

When or if should I throw in the towell? His hyper activity is <br>

wearing on me.<br>

Thanks all<br>

Mandy<br>

_______________________________________________

Join Excite! - http://www.excite.com

The most personalized portal on the Web!

[Guest guest]

That your son is " hyper " suggests to me

that yeast is not under control at all.

The primary indicator of yeast is hyperactivity!

What are you chelating with and what is your

dose and frequency?

We had great success in controlling hyper-activity

(yeast) with extreme dietary interventions and

nystatin 3xday.

> Hi

> I do appreciate all of you so much.

> We are on Week 14 of chelation, and I am at a loss

> as to whether to

> continue. We have yeast under control, we have

> found the combination

> of supplements that seem to work, but I see no

> improvements. My son

> is hyper as all get out, and there is no way to

> redirect. He is not

> doing well in school, he is stimming and being very

> loud with noises

> (he is nonverbal). He cant sit still.

> I dont know if this is the chelation or if this

> change would have come

> about on its own.

> Should I have seen at least some improvments?

> Should I just stop? He

> was so calm and sweet until we started this even

> with the yeast.

> When or if should I throw in the towell? His hyper

> activity is

> wearing on me.

> Thanks all

> Mandy

>

>

>

>

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Mandy,

Can you give us a little more information regarding your chelation

protocal. It will help us to trouble shoot for you. What chelator

are you using? How often are you giving it? How much are you

giving? How old is your son and how much does he weigh? Are you

positive your supplements are in order? Can you list the

supplements? Are you dosing minerals throughout chelation?

This information will help us to determine if possibly there is a

better way to chelate. Also, I know that I have heard that some

parents haven't seen improvements until 20 rounds so that's a

possibility.

>

> Hi

> I do appreciate all of you so much.

> We are on Week 14 of chelation, and I am at a loss as to whether

to

> continue. We have yeast under control, we have found the

combination

> of supplements that seem to work, but I see no improvements. My

son

> is hyper as all get out, and there is no way to redirect. He is

not

> doing well in school, he is stimming and being very loud with

noises

> (he is nonverbal). He cant sit still.

> I dont know if this is the chelation or if this change would have

come

> about on its own.

> Should I have seen at least some improvments? Should I just

stop? He

> was so calm and sweet until we started this even with the yeast.

> When or if should I throw in the towell? His hyper activity is

> wearing on me.

> Thanks all

> Mandy

>

[Guest guest]

> We are on Week 14 of chelation, and I am at a loss as to whether to

> continue. We have yeast under control, we have found the combination

> of supplements that seem to work, but I see no improvements.

For my son, chelation allowed him to tolerate foods and supplements,

and eliminated gut yeast issues, but all other improvements came from

supplements, not from chelation.

>>My son

> is hyper as all get out, and there is no way to redirect. He is not

> doing well in school, he is stimming and being very loud with noises

> (he is nonverbal). He cant sit still.

This can be related to yeast overgrowth. Why do you say yeast is

under control? You might try increasing your yeast protocol, see if

you notice any improvement.

Are you giving minerals? Minerals made my son wildly hyper, because

he was mineral toxic.

Dana

[Guest guest]

I am glad for all the replies.

He was on nystatin for 3 months w/o any great success. I am using

GSE now and his bms are back to normal from being runny and

inconsistant.

We are using oral dmsa 25 mg about every 3 hours with ala (this is

not what doctor rec). He is 6 yo and 65 lb. We are putting

supplements in his drinks. If we dont have yeast under control than

I have no idea how to get it under control. Nystatin did not work

very well.

Here is his protocol from doctor

First Phase

Sugar substitutes: stevia and xylitol to sweeten drinks, disguise

supplements etc.

Kirkman numbers in parentheses.

No dairy; minimize wheat and gluten.

Supplements

(Kirkman) DPPIV. One capsule with each meal or snack that has gluten

or wheat (or milk). Don't use with food heated over 130 deg.

Houston Enzyme

(345/60) Super Pro-Bio - One at bedtime for 4 weeks. May be added to

drink if not hot. If necessary, may mix with a little food, if not

hot. Store in refrigerator.

Nystatin – 1/8 teaspoon four times a day. Finish.

Tenex 1 mg – ½ tablet at bedtime for a week, then add ½ tablet in

the morning additional if needed. Check the blood pressure twice a

week for two weeks. Continue on this medicine if it helps with

calming.

(After a week, add these every other day in order to watch for

reactions; record reactions on follow up sheet. Once added, continue

to take daily):

Vibe multivitamin

(Kirkman) Coromega packets – one packet twice a day.

Vitamin C - ½ teaspoon twice a day.

TMG with folic acid –1/6 teaspoon twice a day.

L-carnitine – 1 and ½ teaspoons twice a day.

GABA 500 mg – one to three capsules daily (for calming)

Finish Phenol enzyme

Calcium/Magnesium every day (see below)

After Colton is stable: restart chelation protocol.

Cilantro tincture (www.dragonriverherbals.com). One dropper applied

to wrist twice a day on days that DMSA is not given. (You may

instead give in a little water or juice.)

DMSA 25 mg – 2 capsule every 4 hours (three times a day) for 4 days,

then none for 3 days, for three weeks. None the fourth week each

month. Repeat for three more weeks.

Calcium/Magnesium – Obtain calcium citrate capsules (250 to 500 mg)

and magnesium citrate capsules (250 to 500 mg) and give about a gram

of each daily. Magnesium is given without a fatty meal (bedtime

works well). May need magnesium oxide if stools get too soft. Give

these during the days the DMSA is not given. (When chelation is

through you will give these every day.)

Alpha Lipoic Acid (ALA) (may take with meals) – one capsule on days

that DMSA is given.

Molybdenum– 1000 mcg. One capsule two times a day with meals daily

during the three weeks that DMSA is used.

Urine heavy metal test week number 7, during a day that DMSA is given

>

> > Hi

> > I do appreciate all of you so much.

> > We are on Week 14 of chelation, and I am at a loss

> > as to whether to

> > continue. We have yeast under control, we have

> > found the combination

> > of supplements that seem to work, but I see no

> > improvements. My son

> > is hyper as all get out, and there is no way to

> > redirect. He is not

> > doing well in school, he is stimming and being very

> > loud with noises

> > (he is nonverbal). He cant sit still.

> > I dont know if this is the chelation or if this

> > change would have come

> > about on its own.

> > Should I have seen at least some improvments?

> > Should I just stop? He

> > was so calm and sweet until we started this even

> > with the yeast.

> > When or if should I throw in the towell? His hyper

> > activity is

> > wearing on me.

> > Thanks all

> > Mandy

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

>

> >

> (Kirkman) DPPIV. One capsule with each meal or snack that has gluten

> or wheat (or milk). Don't use with food heated over 130 deg.

>

>

Just a thought, but this particular enzyme made my daughter VERY hyper

because she did not tolerate the papain/bromelain it contains. We

switched to Houston's AFP Peptizide with good results.

Sheresa

[Guest guest]

I thought his yeast was under control because his bms have been

normal and his have never been normal. I have been using GSE for

about 3 weeks along with a probiotic. Before that nystatin for 3

months. So maybe I dont have his yeast taken care of? what else

should I try?

> > We are on Week 14 of chelation, and I am at a loss as to whether

to

> > continue. We have yeast under control, we have found the

combination

> > of supplements that seem to work, but I see no improvements.

>

>

> For my son, chelation allowed him to tolerate foods and

supplements,

> and eliminated gut yeast issues, but all other improvements came

from

> supplements, not from chelation.

>

>

> >>My son

> > is hyper as all get out, and there is no way to redirect. He is

not

> > doing well in school, he is stimming and being very loud with

noises

> > (he is nonverbal). He cant sit still.

>

>

> This can be related to yeast overgrowth. Why do you say yeast is

> under control? You might try increasing your yeast protocol, see

if

> you notice any improvement.

>

> Are you giving minerals? Minerals made my son wildly hyper,

because

> he was mineral toxic.

>

> Dana

>

[Guest guest]

GSE is highly phenoic, and phonel intolerance symptoms are similar

to yeast. DO you give GSE with no-fenol enzyme? Also, while

chelating early on, my son's BM's were finally good, yet he was SO

hyper. It really was yeast even though the BM's were fine. You may

want to rotate yeast killers.

> > > We are on Week 14 of chelation, and I am at a loss as to

whether

> to

> > > continue. We have yeast under control, we have found the

> combination

> > > of supplements that seem to work, but I see no improvements.

> >

> >

> > For my son, chelation allowed him to tolerate foods and

> supplements,

> > and eliminated gut yeast issues, but all other improvements came

> from

> > supplements, not from chelation.

> >

> >

> > >>My son

> > > is hyper as all get out, and there is no way to redirect. He

is

> not

> > > doing well in school, he is stimming and being very loud with

> noises

> > > (he is nonverbal). He cant sit still.

> >

> >

> > This can be related to yeast overgrowth. Why do you say yeast is

> > under control? You might try increasing your yeast protocol,

see

> if

> > you notice any improvement.

> >

> > Are you giving minerals? Minerals made my son wildly hyper,

> because

> > he was mineral toxic.

> >

> > Dana

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Consider lowering the DMSA dose a little. How much ALA? Glad to hear you are

not following the doc's recommendations for chelation.

S S

<p>I am glad for all the replies.<br>

He was on nystatin for 3 months w/o any great success. I am using <br>

GSE now and his bms are back to normal from being runny and <br>

inconsistant.<br>

We are using oral dmsa 25 mg about every 3 hours with ala (this is <br>

not what doctor rec). He is 6 yo and 65 lb. We are putting <br>

supplements in his drinks. If we dont have yeast under control than <br>

I have no idea how to get it under control. Nystatin did not work <br>

very well. <br>

<br>

Here is his protocol from doctor<br>

<br>

First Phase<br>

<br>

Sugar substitutes: stevia and xylitol to sweeten drinks, disguise <br>

supplements etc. <br>

Kirkman numbers in parentheses. <br>

No dairy; minimize wheat and gluten. <br>

Supplements <br>

<br>

(Kirkman) DPPIV. One capsule with each meal or snack that has gluten <br>

or wheat (or milk). Don't use with food heated over 130 deg. <br>

<br>

Houston Enzyme <br>

<br>

(345/60) Super Pro-Bio - One at bedtime for 4 weeks. May be added to <br>

drink if not hot. If necessary, may mix with a little food, if not <br>

hot. Store in refrigerator.<br>

<br>

Nystatin – 1/8 teaspoon four times a day. Finish. <br>

<br>

Tenex 1 mg – ½ tablet at bedtime for a week, then add ½ tablet in <br>

the morning additional if needed. Check the blood pressure twice a <br>

week for two weeks. Continue on this medicine if it helps with <br>

calming. <br>

(After a week, add these every other day in order to watch for <br>

reactions; record reactions on follow up sheet. Once added, continue <br>

to take daily):<br>

<br>

Vibe multivitamin <br>

(Kirkman) Coromega packets – one packet twice a day. <br>

Vitamin C - ½ teaspoon twice a day. <br>

TMG with folic acid –1/6 teaspoon twice a day. <br>

L-carnitine – 1 and ½ teaspoons twice a day. <br>

GABA 500 mg – one to three capsules daily (for calming) <br>

Finish Phenol enzyme <br>

Calcium/Magnesium every day (see below) <br>

After Colton is stable: restart chelation protocol. <br>

<br>

Cilantro tincture (www.dragonriverher<wbr>bals.com)<wbr>. One dropper applied

<br>

to wrist twice a day on days that DMSA is not given. (You may <br>

instead give in a little water or juice.) <br>

<br>

DMSA 25 mg – 2 capsule every 4 hours (three times a day) for 4 days, <br>

then none for 3 days, for three weeks. None the fourth week each <br>

month. Repeat for three more weeks. <br>

<br>

Calcium/Magnesium – Obtain calcium citrate capsules (250 to 500 mg) <br>

and magnesium citrate capsules (250 to 500 mg) and give about a gram <br>

of each daily. Magnesium is given without a fatty meal (bedtime <br>

works well). May need magnesium oxide if stools get too soft. Give <br>

these during the days the DMSA is not given. (When chelation is <br>

through you will give these every day.) <br>

<br>

Alpha Lipoic Acid (ALA) (may take with meals) – one capsule on days <br>

that DMSA is given. <br>

<br>

Molybdenum– 1000 mcg. One capsule two times a day with meals daily <br>

during the three weeks that DMSA is used. <br>

Urine heavy metal test week number 7, during a day that DMSA is given<br>

_______________________________________________

Join Excite! - http://www.excite.com

The most personalized portal on the Web!

[Guest guest]

What chelators and doses are you using? What diet is he on? My son

does get a bit hyper during a round, but most of his hyperness is

related to what he eats. He is on an all natural diet now which has

curbed a lot of that. What is school feeding him? What are you doing

for yeast to keep it under control? I find that when I think yeast

is under control but my son is acting horrible, the yeast is still

there just acting in not so obvious ways.

>

> Hi

> I do appreciate all of you so much.

> We are on Week 14 of chelation, and I am at a loss as to whether

to

> continue. We have yeast under control, we have found the

combination

> of supplements that seem to work, but I see no improvements. My

son

> is hyper as all get out, and there is no way to redirect. He is

not

> doing well in school, he is stimming and being very loud with

noises

> (he is nonverbal). He cant sit still.

> I dont know if this is the chelation or if this change would have

come

> about on its own.

> Should I have seen at least some improvments? Should I just

stop? He

> was so calm and sweet until we started this even with the yeast.

> When or if should I throw in the towell? His hyper activity is

> wearing on me.

> Thanks all

> Mandy

>

[Guest guest]

> >

> > > Hi

> > > I do appreciate all of you so much.

> > > We are on Week 14 of chelation, and I am at a loss

> > > as to whether to

> > > continue. We have yeast under control, we have

> > > found the combination

> > > of supplements that seem to work, but I see no

> > > improvements. My son

> > > is hyper as all get out, and there is no way to

> > > redirect. He is not

> > > doing well in school, he is stimming and being very

> > > loud with noises

> > > (he is nonverbal). He cant sit still.

> > > I dont know if this is the chelation or if this

> > > change would have come

> > > about on its own.

> > > Should I have seen at least some improvments?

> > > Should I just stop? He

> > > was so calm and sweet until we started this even

> > > with the yeast.

> > > When or if should I throw in the towell? His hyper

> > > activity is

> > > wearing on me.

> > > Thanks all

> > > Mandy

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

> >

> > __________________________________________________

> >

[Guest guest]

Hi Mandy,

It is my opinion that if you do the Chelation per AC Protocol and you are

handling the yeast effectively then most likely this behavior is due to some

supplement that he isn't handling well.

There are plenty of supps that can make kids hyper. Depending on the kid

and if they already have enough or too much of some thing.

My advice is to take a good look at what he is eating and what supps he is

taking.

If it were me I would completely DROP all supps for a while and see if he

mellows out a bit. Ours does after about 1 week when this happens.

Continue with proper diet and enzymes and probiotics but the rest is

probably not critical and a week off won't hurt him any.

As for stopping the chelation, if you are doing low and slow, I would not

stop.

Good luck !

Neil

_____

From: [mailto: ]

On Behalf Of incoehoots

Sent: Wednesday, September 20, 2006 6:53 AM

Subject: [ ] Another question, I am still confused

Hi

I do appreciate all of you so much.

We are on Week 14 of chelation, and I am at a loss as to whether to

continue. We have yeast under control, we have found the combination

of supplements that seem to work, but I see no improvements. My son

is hyper as all get out, and there is no way to redirect. He is not

doing well in school, he is stimming and being very loud with noises

(he is nonverbal). He cant sit still.

I dont know if this is the chelation or if this change would have come

about on its own.

Should I have seen at least some improvments? Should I just stop? He

was so calm and sweet until we started this even with the yeast.

When or if should I throw in the towell? His hyper activity is

wearing on me.

Thanks all

Mandy

[Guest guest]

Now that I read your complete post here is what I think.

Firstly, sounds like you have a pretty good DAN! doctor in regards to

recommended supplements.

I am wondering if you are giving the DMSA/ALA overnight as well, if not that

would explain a lot.

The DMSA is a tad high, but I doubt that it would explain things except

again you must continue around the clock.

4 days on and 3 days off with a break every 3 weeks is a bit odd, but better

than what other DAN! docs have prescribed.

If you just recently cut off Gluten and Dairy, you can expect some

aggressive behavior, similar to cutting off a junkie’s drugs.

I stand by my first guess that he may be getting too much of some things and

there are plenty of candidates on your list, since most of this stuff is new

for him then you might want to stop all supps, regroup for a week and then

re-introduce the most important ones first and go from there.

Good luck !

Neil

_____

From: [mailto: ]

On Behalf Of incoehoots

Sent: Wednesday, September 20, 2006 9:07 AM

Subject: [ ] Re: Another question, I am still confused

I am glad for all the replies.

He was on nystatin for 3 months w/o any great success. I am using

GSE now and his bms are back to normal from being runny and

inconsistant.

We are using oral dmsa 25 mg about every 3 hours with ala (this is

not what doctor rec). He is 6 yo and 65 lb. We are putting

supplements in his drinks. If we dont have yeast under control than

I have no idea how to get it under control. Nystatin did not work

very well.

Here is his protocol from doctor

First Phase

Sugar substitutes: stevia and xylitol to sweeten drinks, disguise

supplements etc.

Kirkman numbers in parentheses.

No dairy; minimize wheat and gluten.

Supplements

(Kirkman) DPPIV. One capsule with each meal or snack that has gluten

or wheat (or milk). Don't use with food heated over 130 deg.

Houston Enzyme

(345/60) Super Pro-Bio - One at bedtime for 4 weeks. May be added to

drink if not hot. If necessary, may mix with a little food, if not

hot. Store in refrigerator.

Nystatin – 1/8 teaspoon four times a day. Finish.

Tenex 1 mg – ½ tablet at bedtime for a week, then add ½ tablet in

the morning additional if needed. Check the blood pressure twice a

week for two weeks. Continue on this medicine if it helps with

calming.

(After a week, add these every other day in order to watch for

reactions; record reactions on follow up sheet. Once added, continue

to take daily):

Vibe multivitamin

(Kirkman) Coromega packets – one packet twice a day.

Vitamin C - ½ teaspoon twice a day.

TMG with folic acid –1/6 teaspoon twice a day.

L-carnitine – 1 and ½ teaspoons twice a day.

GABA 500 mg – one to three capsules daily (for calming)

Finish Phenol enzyme

Calcium/Magnesium every day (see below)

After Colton is stable: restart chelation protocol.

Cilantro tincture (www.dragonriverherbals.com). One dropper applied

to wrist twice a day on days that DMSA is not given. (You may

instead give in a little water or juice.)

DMSA 25 mg – 2 capsule every 4 hours (three times a day) for 4 days,

then none for 3 days, for three weeks. None the fourth week each

month. Repeat for three more weeks.

Calcium/Magnesium – Obtain calcium citrate capsules (250 to 500 mg)

and magnesium citrate capsules (250 to 500 mg) and give about a gram

of each daily. Magnesium is given without a fatty meal (bedtime

works well). May need magnesium oxide if stools get too soft. Give

these during the days the DMSA is not given. (When chelation is

through you will give these every day.)

Alpha Lipoic Acid (ALA) (may take with meals) – one capsule on days

that DMSA is given.

Molybdenum– 1000 mcg. One capsule two times a day with meals daily

during the three weeks that DMSA is used.

Urine heavy metal test week number 7, during a day that DMSA is given

>

> > Hi

> > I do appreciate all of you so much.

> > We are on Week 14 of chelation, and I am at a loss

> > as to whether to

> > continue. We have yeast under control, we have

> > found the combination

> > of supplements that seem to work, but I see no

> > improvements. My son

> > is hyper as all get out, and there is no way to

> > redirect. He is not

> > doing well in school, he is stimming and being very

> > loud with noises

> > (he is nonverbal). He cant sit still.

> > I dont know if this is the chelation or if this

> > change would have come

> > about on its own.

> > Should I have seen at least some improvments?

> > Should I just stop? He

> > was so calm and sweet until we started this even

> > with the yeast.

> > When or if should I throw in the towell? His hyper

> > activity is

> > wearing on me.

> > Thanks all

> > Mandy

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

If you all don't mind me asking, how expensive are all of these treatments? I

have been looking to see what some of you all have been doing and recommending,

and it sounds great. We are so pinched for money, it's hard to spend any extras

on anything but daily living. How do you guys do it? Any advice? Thanks!!

> >

> > > Hi

> > > I do appreciate all of you so much.

> > > We are on Week 14 of chelation, and I am at a loss

> > > as to whether to

> > > continue. We have yeast under control, we have

> > > found the combination

> > > of supplements that seem to work, but I see no

> > > improvements. My son

> > > is hyper as all get out, and there is no way to

> > > redirect. He is not

> > > doing well in school, he is stimming and being very

> > > loud with noises

> > > (he is nonverbal). He cant sit still.

> > > I dont know if this is the chelation or if this

> > > change would have come

> > > about on its own.

> > > Should I have seen at least some improvments?

> > > Should I just stop? He

> > > was so calm and sweet until we started this even

> > > with the yeast.

> > > When or if should I throw in the towell? His hyper

> > > activity is

> > > wearing on me.

> > > Thanks all

> > > Mandy

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

> >

> > __________________________________________________

> >

[Guest guest]

>

> I thought his yeast was under control because his bms have been

> normal and his have never been normal.

When my son had yeast in his head, his bms were normal but he still

have massive amounts of yeast.

>>I have been using GSE for

> about 3 weeks along with a probiotic. Before that nystatin for 3

> months. So maybe I dont have his yeast taken care of? what else

> should I try?

Try dropping the GSE for a few days, see if the behaviors get better

or worse. If they get worst, try giving the GSE with No-Fenol enzyme,

see if that helps.

Dana

[Guest guest]

>

> If you all don't mind me asking, how expensive are all of these

treatments?

For my family, not very much. I don't use a doctor, and I bought all

supplements thru a local buying group or at my local health food store.

Dana