Re: swinging question/vestibular system

March 3, 2008

I don't know. The milk of today, raw and pateurized, is different

from yesteryear. Not sure you will ever know for sure why. It may

just be that you had enough:)

>

> Speaking of milk intolerances--I was just thinking about

something.

>

> I know a few people have mentioned RAW milk as an alternative to

typical

> milk found in the stores. Growing up, I had SEVERE ear infections.

I always had

> one--- always! Now, keep in mind, in my other post I said that

I'm not much

> of a milk drinker. BACK THEN-- I WAS! As a child, I loved milk

and my

> mother got RAW MILK from a local farmer. Now-- out of 3 children

that she had,

> all of us were on raw milk growing up.

> Would you guess that ALL THREE of us now are not milk drinkers by

choice

> because of the effects that we feel on our digestive systems. I

believe that

> all of us are now milk intolerant-- if my own symptoms have much to

say about

> it.

> But my point is that personally speaking-- I don't believe it's a

case

> between raw or typical milk, but just milk in general.

>

> becky

>

> **************It's Tax Time! Get tips, forms, and advice on AOL

Money &

> Finance. (http://money.aol.com/tax?NCID=aolprf00030000000001)

>

March 3, 2008

We had to let go of it completely. My boys were drinking about 80 ounces

or more a day and were certainly addicted. We also got language shortly

after the removal of milk.

Here is a take on milk sensitivities.

http://www.stankurtz.com/biomedical/not-milk-medical-literature.html

We have issues with high calcium levels in our blood. ( so the calcium

was not being absorbed) We stayed away from calcium supplements too on the

advice of our doctor.

PS All our kids had troubles with milk. If my 13 year old consumes it,

he says it makes him feel really happy. He gets very silly when he

drinks it and hyper which he is far from. I can just imagine while all

the kids are out there having their first beer, mine will be in the

corner guzzling down a carton of milk.LOL

Sounds a little humourous, but it it quite disturbing to me, the ill

effects milk has on MY kids.

myra.bauza@... wrote:

> Does milk have to be gone entirely? I give my son Lactaid. I've been trying

> to wean him down but it's really difficult. I would say he is addicted to

> it.

>

March 3, 2008

Lactaid doesn't work for most of our kids.... [sigh]..... because it is not the

lactose in the milk that is giving them trouble but the casien in the milk that

is giving them trouble..... [sigh]....

I tried lactaid as well..... [sigh again].... no luck

What does seem to work and what is working for us is digestive enzymes to help

the child digest both casien and gluten in food. We use Huston Neutraceutical

enzymes called Peptzyde along with a ton of other moms but will soon be trying

their new product called TriEnza that is out. I know that there is a mom or two

on this board using TriEnza with great success. I give enzymes with all food,

not just milk products. It helps not just with casien and gluten but also with

phenols which also are problematic for many of our kids who have neurological

issues.

With enyzmes my son over the last 6 months has been able to slowly eat more and

more dairy products such as cheese, pizza, etc. Milk & ice-cream are still

absolutely out but I am hopeful that one day his system will repair itself and

he will be able to consume these foods. Now, I am discovering that MSG is just

an absolute nightmare as well. We just got back from Utah and 5 days of

restaurant eating..... the gas my son is expelling has him being nick-named

'Fart-Boy' by all and sundry!

WHEW! Yuck!

One day home and 'ta-da', he is better. I know that restaurant food is loaded

with MSG and so this is my assumption but it could be something else.

Janice

Mother of Mark, 13

[sPAM]Re: [ ] Re: swinging question/vestibular

system

Does milk have to be gone entirely? I give my son Lactaid. I've been trying

to wean him down but it's really difficult. I would say he is addicted to

it.

March 3, 2008

I have not seen research documenting a link between milk intolerance

and kids that don't have recurrent otitis media, drooling, congestion,

etc. Maybe I missed it? Is there research that points to dairy

intolerance for neurologically " fragile " or dyspraxic kids even if

they don't test allergic or have allergic symptoms/ear problems?

Trying not to enter in to the dispute....

>

> .... to be flip.... Sue me....

>

> I believe that the first study that I posted said 78% of normal

population with recurrent ear issues. For me, this qualifies as a

lot! If you were to look at the neurodevelopmentally compromised

population, I would guess that this number is much higher.

>

> IF YOU DON'T LIKE THE WAY I WRITE, DON'T READ OR RESPOND TO MY

POSTS. See? It's that easy! I don't claim to be an author but I am

confident that every mother will do her own research because I trust

that each mother will not " blindly " take the advice of a woman she has

never met over the internet without putting some thought and research

into it first!

>

> If you really want to spend your life picking apart others, go

ahead. It is obvious that you have no other productive hobbies. If

anyone who actually has a sick child wants clarification as to my

son's personal experience, I am happy to respond.

>

> But I will not respond to someone who is spending their time being

hurtful of others and purposefully SEEKING OUT contraversy. I am done

with this childish nonsense.

> The rest of us have enough issues to deal with..... don't we?

>

> You asked for proof with regards to milk being an issue, I gave it

to you (as I have done in the past) and I expect this to be the end of

the matter. I have honored your request, please honor mine.

>

> I am not going to spend my day looking through your quotes...... You

are obviously looking for someone to fight with.... you need to look

at your personal life and figure out why, day after day over the past

week, you spend your time ridiculing others on this board. This is

not like you .... again, I suggest that perhaps you need a break

to recharge your batteries..... I worry about your spirit. I have

been on this board since about June and yes, you have been the source

of a lot of contraversy and arguments but never like this..... Please

take a holiday from sick kids. We all need one once in a while.

>

> So please, , I beg of you.... stop!

>

> Janice

> Mother of Mark, 13

>

> [sPAM][ ] Re: swinging

question/vestibular system

>

> Actually you did said for a " lot " of our kids. Here's the exact

> quote from you that I answered:

>

> " For a lot of our kids, milk is a huge issue and really congests the

> ears and

> hearing, causes drooling, decreases sensation in the hands, the feet,

> the face

> esp the lips. Ever notice that your child doesn't feel the goop on

> his face

> when eating or the drool spilling out of his mouth? It is because he

> has lost

> sensation in his face as well as other extremities "

>

> Perhaps instead you could have written that we all know that children

> need to avoid anything they are allergic to prevent any serious

> complications -however for the 2% of the pediatric population under

> the age of 5, that " fill in above quote here " But even then I

> would start with " milk can be " and not " milk is "

> " Approximately 2% of the pediatric population is affected by cow's

> milk allergy. Moreover the condition tends to be outgrown by 5 years

> of age. "

>

http://www.nationaldairycouncil.org/NR/rdonlyres/69867157-06CD-41ED-98BC-8B45402\

03C4A/0/dcd773.pdf

>

> It's like if I wrote " If you drink water and you have symptoms like

> nausea and muscle cramps it means you can die " Instead of sharing

> information about a rare but possible complication from drinking too

> much water too quickly. That is what I mean by sharing credible

> links and not just my own opinion. And if it is just your opinion

> and your child's reaction -then state that.

>

> Symptoms of Hyponatremia

> The early warning signs are often subtle and may be similar to

> dehydration and include nausea, muscle cramps, disorientation,

> slurred speech, and confusion. At this point, many athletes drink

> more water because they think they are dehydrated. Unfortunately,

> water alone will increase the problem of hyponatremia. At the most

> extreme an athlete may experience seizures, coma, or death.

>

http://sportsmedicine.about.com/od/hydrationandfluid/a/Hyponatremia.htm

> http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/000394.htm

> http://www.yourmedicaldetective.com/public/446.cfm

>

> =====

>

March 3, 2008

Yeast is a thought. They talk about that connection at nacd.org

Also, with the milk, kids with casein issues tend to crave milk.

Could be both or neither. I am not an expert.

>

> In a message dated 3/3/2008 3:46:02 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,

> myra.bauza@... writes:

>

> Does milk have to be gone entirely? I give my son Lactaid. I've

been trying

> to wean him down but it's really difficult. I would say he is

addicted to

> it.

>

> It's interesting that you ask this and also that you said

something about

> thinking that he is addicted to milk. I've thought the SAME thing

with my NT

> kids these days! I've been trying to wean ALL of my kids from

milk in

> general, and I've noticed that at least one of them, if not two,

have shown some

> great resistance but it's almost as if they NEED those sugars

provided in the

> milk or something. It's odd really--- but like you said, an

addiction almost.

> With the one I've noticed it stronger than the others, and oddly

enough he is

> a MAJOR sugar addict as well. If I hide things with sugar, he will

scour the

> house looking for it to get a " fix " .

> As I typed that out-- I'm totally making the connection-- shoot, I

wonder if

> he's got a systemic yeast issue going on. Darn it-- why did THAT

take so long

> to wonder??? <sigh>

>

> Yet another thing to look into

>

> Becky

>

> **************It's Tax Time! Get tips, forms, and advice on AOL

Money &

> Finance. (http://money.aol.com/tax?NCID=aolprf00030000000001)

>

March 3, 2008

.... to be flip.... Sue me....

I believe that the first study that I posted said 78% of normal population with

recurrent ear issues. For me, this qualifies as a lot! If you were to look at

the neurodevelopmentally compromised population, I would guess that this number

is much higher.

IF YOU DON'T LIKE THE WAY I WRITE, DON'T READ OR RESPOND TO MY POSTS. See?

It's that easy! I don't claim to be an author but I am confident that every

mother will do her own research because I trust that each mother will not

" blindly " take the advice of a woman she has never met over the internet without

putting some thought and research into it first!

If you really want to spend your life picking apart others, go ahead. It is

obvious that you have no other productive hobbies. If anyone who actually has a

sick child wants clarification as to my son's personal experience, I am happy to

respond.

But I will not respond to someone who is spending their time being hurtful of

others and purposefully SEEKING OUT contraversy. I am done with this childish

nonsense.

The rest of us have enough issues to deal with..... don't we?

You asked for proof with regards to milk being an issue, I gave it to you (as I

have done in the past) and I expect this to be the end of the matter. I have

honored your request, please honor mine.

I am not going to spend my day looking through your quotes...... You are

obviously looking for someone to fight with.... you need to look at your

personal life and figure out why, day after day over the past week, you spend

your time ridiculing others on this board. This is not like you ....

again, I suggest that perhaps you need a break to recharge your batteries..... I

worry about your spirit. I have been on this board since about June and yes,

you have been the source of a lot of contraversy and arguments but never like

this..... Please take a holiday from sick kids. We all need one once in a

while.

So please, , I beg of you.... stop!

Janice

Mother of Mark, 13

[sPAM][ ] Re: swinging question/vestibular system

Actually you did said for a " lot " of our kids. Here's the exact

quote from you that I answered:

" For a lot of our kids, milk is a huge issue and really congests the

ears and

hearing, causes drooling, decreases sensation in the hands, the feet,

the face

esp the lips. Ever notice that your child doesn't feel the goop on

his face

when eating or the drool spilling out of his mouth? It is because he

has lost

sensation in his face as well as other extremities "

Perhaps instead you could have written that we all know that children

need to avoid anything they are allergic to prevent any serious

complications -however for the 2% of the pediatric population under

the age of 5, that " fill in above quote here " But even then I

would start with " milk can be " and not " milk is "

" Approximately 2% of the pediatric population is affected by cow's

milk allergy. Moreover the condition tends to be outgrown by 5 years

of age. "

http://www.nationaldairycouncil.org/NR/rdonlyres/69867157-06CD-41ED-98BC-8B45402\

03C4A/0/dcd773.pdf

It's like if I wrote " If you drink water and you have symptoms like

nausea and muscle cramps it means you can die " Instead of sharing

information about a rare but possible complication from drinking too

much water too quickly. That is what I mean by sharing credible

links and not just my own opinion. And if it is just your opinion

and your child's reaction -then state that.

Symptoms of Hyponatremia

The early warning signs are often subtle and may be similar to

dehydration and include nausea, muscle cramps, disorientation,

slurred speech, and confusion. At this point, many athletes drink

more water because they think they are dehydrated. Unfortunately,

water alone will increase the problem of hyponatremia. At the most

extreme an athlete may experience seizures, coma, or death.

http://sportsmedicine.about.com/od/hydrationandfluid/a/Hyponatremia.htm

http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/000394.htm

http://www.yourmedicaldetective.com/public/446.cfm

=====

March 3, 2008

We use TriEnza, and we thought it was helping with the occasional

dairy infraction until we went overboard. I am convinced that some

dairy is OK for , and some is definitely not. After the last

few weeks of behavior issues, I just don't have the energy to nail it

down right now. So even though we continue to use the enzymes with

every meal and snack, he is strictly dairy free. Today is the first

day of great behavior, so I think I'll just enjoy that for awhile.

In the summer, I'll be with him 24/7 and in total control of his

diet, so I may test certain dairy items at that time.

in NJ

>

> Lactaid doesn't work for most of our kids.... [sigh]..... because

it is not the lactose in the milk that is giving them trouble but the

casien in the milk that is giving them trouble..... [sigh]....

>

> I tried lactaid as well..... [sigh again].... no luck

>

> What does seem to work and what is working for us is digestive

enzymes to help the child digest both casien and gluten in food. We

use Huston Neutraceutical enzymes called Peptzyde along with a ton of

other moms but will soon be trying their new product called TriEnza

that is out. I know that there is a mom or two on this board using

TriEnza with great success. I give enzymes with all food, not just

milk products. It helps not just with casien and gluten but also

with phenols which also are problematic for many of our kids who have

neurological issues.

>

> With enyzmes my son over the last 6 months has been able to slowly

eat more and more dairy products such as cheese, pizza, etc. Milk &

ice-cream are still absolutely out but I am hopeful that one day his

system will repair itself and he will be able to consume these

foods. Now, I am discovering that MSG is just an absolute nightmare

as well. We just got back from Utah and 5 days of restaurant

eating..... the gas my son is expelling has him being nick-

named 'Fart-Boy' by all and sundry!

>

> WHEW! Yuck!

>

> One day home and 'ta-da', he is better. I know that restaurant

food is loaded with MSG and so this is my assumption but it could be

something else.

>

> Janice

> Mother of Mark, 13

>

> [sPAM]Re: [ ] Re: swinging

question/vestibular system

>

> Does milk have to be gone entirely? I give my son Lactaid. I've

been trying

> to wean him down but it's really difficult. I would say he is

addicted to

> it.

>

March 3, 2008

If they really seem addicted to milk, there is that whole opioid

effect thing. (Partially digested proteins " leak " out of the gut and

into the body, where they don't belong.) When my son was little, if

he had too much milk he was very spacey/foggy. That ended before we

gave up dairy entirely, probably due to gut healing from probiotics,

enzymes, and fish oil.

in NJ

>

> In a message dated 3/3/2008 3:46:02 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,

> myra.bauza@... writes:

>

> Does milk have to be gone entirely? I give my son Lactaid. I've

been trying

> to wean him down but it's really difficult. I would say he is

addicted to

> it.

>

> It's interesting that you ask this and also that you said

something about

> thinking that he is addicted to milk. I've thought the SAME thing

with my NT

> kids these days! I've been trying to wean ALL of my kids from

milk in

> general, and I've noticed that at least one of them, if not two,

have shown some

> great resistance but it's almost as if they NEED those sugars

provided in the

> milk or something. It's odd really--- but like you said, an

addiction almost.

> With the one I've noticed it stronger than the others, and oddly

enough he is

> a MAJOR sugar addict as well. If I hide things with sugar, he will

scour the

> house looking for it to get a " fix " .

> As I typed that out-- I'm totally making the connection-- shoot, I

wonder if

> he's got a systemic yeast issue going on. Darn it-- why did THAT

take so long

> to wonder??? <sigh>

>

> Yet another thing to look into

>

> Becky

>

> **************It's Tax Time! Get tips, forms, and advice on AOL

Money &

> Finance. (http://money.aol.com/tax?NCID=aolprf00030000000001)

>

March 3, 2008

I think this specific issue is covered in the intro to Special Diets

for Special Kids.

http://www.amazon.com/Special-Diets-Kids--/dp/1885477449

Dr. Bock covers it in the 4 As book.

http://www.amazon.com/Healing-New-Childhood-Epidemics-

Groundbreaking/dp/0345494512/ref=pd_bbs_1?

ie=UTF8 & s=books & qid=1204586139 & sr=1-1

I think it is covered though just in the sense that it can cause

neuro type issues, in Doris Rapp's Is this your Child.

http://www.amazon.com/This-Your-Child-Doris-

Rapp/dp/0688119077/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?

ie=UTF8 & s=books & qid=1204586079 & sr=1-1

Not trying to get into this either I promise. Solely trying to

respond to your specific question.

> >

> > .... to be flip.... Sue me....

> >

> > I believe that the first study that I posted said 78% of normal

> population with recurrent ear issues. For me, this qualifies as a

> lot! If you were to look at the neurodevelopmentally compromised

> population, I would guess that this number is much higher.

> >

> > IF YOU DON'T LIKE THE WAY I WRITE, DON'T READ OR RESPOND TO MY

> POSTS. See? It's that easy! I don't claim to be an author but I am

> confident that every mother will do her own research because I trust

> that each mother will not " blindly " take the advice of a woman she

has

> never met over the internet without putting some thought and

research

> into it first!

> >

> > If you really want to spend your life picking apart others, go

> ahead. It is obvious that you have no other productive hobbies. If

> anyone who actually has a sick child wants clarification as to my

> son's personal experience, I am happy to respond.

> >

> > But I will not respond to someone who is spending their time being

> hurtful of others and purposefully SEEKING OUT contraversy. I am

done

> with this childish nonsense.

> > The rest of us have enough issues to deal with..... don't we?

> >

> > You asked for proof with regards to milk being an issue, I gave it

> to you (as I have done in the past) and I expect this to be the end

of

> the matter. I have honored your request, please honor mine.

> >

> > I am not going to spend my day looking through your quotes......

You

> are obviously looking for someone to fight with.... you need to look

> at your personal life and figure out why, day after day over the

past

> week, you spend your time ridiculing others on this board. This is

> not like you .... again, I suggest that perhaps you need a break

> to recharge your batteries..... I worry about your spirit. I have

> been on this board since about June and yes, you have been the

source

> of a lot of contraversy and arguments but never like this.....

Please

> take a holiday from sick kids. We all need one once in a while.

> >

> > So please, , I beg of you.... stop!

> >

> > Janice

> > Mother of Mark, 13

> >

> > [sPAM][ ] Re: swinging

> question/vestibular system

> >

> > Actually you did said for a " lot " of our kids. Here's the exact

> > quote from you that I answered:

> >

> > " For a lot of our kids, milk is a huge issue and really

congests the

> > ears and

> > hearing, causes drooling, decreases sensation in the hands, the

feet,

> > the face

> > esp the lips. Ever notice that your child doesn't feel the goop

on

> > his face

> > when eating or the drool spilling out of his mouth? It is

because he

> > has lost

> > sensation in his face as well as other extremities "

> >

> > Perhaps instead you could have written that we all know that

children

> > need to avoid anything they are allergic to prevent any serious

> > complications -however for the 2% of the pediatric population

under

> > the age of 5, that " fill in above quote here " But even then I

> > would start with " milk can be " and not " milk is "

> > " Approximately 2% of the pediatric population is affected by

cow's

> > milk allergy. Moreover the condition tends to be outgrown by 5

years

> > of age. "

> >

> http://www.nationaldairycouncil.org/NR/rdonlyres/69867157-06CD-41ED-

98BC-8B4540203C4A/0/dcd773.pdf

>

> >

> > It's like if I wrote " If you drink water and you have symptoms

like

> > nausea and muscle cramps it means you can die " Instead of

sharing

> > information about a rare but possible complication from

drinking too

> > much water too quickly. That is what I mean by sharing credible

> > links and not just my own opinion. And if it is just your

opinion

> > and your child's reaction -then state that.

> >

> > Symptoms of Hyponatremia

> > The early warning signs are often subtle and may be similar to

> > dehydration and include nausea, muscle cramps, disorientation,

> > slurred speech, and confusion. At this point, many athletes

drink

> > more water because they think they are dehydrated.

Unfortunately,

> > water alone will increase the problem of hyponatremia. At the

most

> > extreme an athlete may experience seizures, coma, or death.

> >

>

http://sportsmedicine.about.com/od/hydrationandfluid/a/Hyponatremia.ht

m

> > http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/000394.htm

> > http://www.yourmedicaldetective.com/public/446.cfm

> >

> > =====

> >

March 3, 2008

It is impossible to put an absolute percentage on it, because it

varies widely by ethnicity:

" Lactose intolerance, due to genetic reasons, is more common among

certain racial groups. It appears to be more common among the racial

groups that had the least exposure to milk during the long

evolutionary process. Consider the following chart.

Lactose Intolerance Among American Racial Groups

Asian Americans, 95%

African Americans, 65%

Native Americans, 65%

Hispanics, 50%

Caucasians, 15%

Lactose intolerance can often be adequately remedied by taking

supplements that contain lactase enzymes. However, these enzymes

don't help kids whose problems are a result of a shortage of the DPP4

enzyme, or a result of an IgE allergy. "

--This is a direct quote from page 209 of " Healing the New Childhood

Epidemics: Autism, ADHD, Asthma, and Allergies; The Groundbreaking

Program for the 4-A Disorders. " written by Bock, M.D. and

Cameron Stauth

in NJ

>

> In a message dated 3/3/2008 3:22:05 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,

> kiddietalk@... writes:

>

> " Approximately 2% of the pediatric population is affected by cow's

> milk allergy. Moreover the condition tends to be outgrown by 5

years

> of age. "

>

> I'd have to totally disagree with this statement-- just in

speaking about

> personal experiences and people I know. I am POSITIVE that well

over 70% of my

> friends and their children experience milk intolerance or allergy.

Maybe we

> have to make the distinction between intolerance and allergry??? I

know that

> most people will SAY allergy but it really is an intolerance?

Maybe that's

> where the statement is askew-- because I know more than 2% that

have milk

> issues and they don't outgrow them, but the problems seem to WORSEN

throughout

> the years

> (almost 12 close friends of mine and I were recently out and we

talked about

> stomach issues, and it seems as though 10 of the 12 have dairy

issues and

> can no longer tolerate it, when they could as children, but it's

got

> increasingly worse as they get older)

> interesting things we've been talking about lately-- that's for

sure! LOL

>

> becky

>

> **************It's Tax Time! Get tips, forms, and advice on AOL

Money &

> Finance. (http://money.aol.com/tax?NCID=aolprf00030000000001)

>

March 4, 2008

Two anecdotal stories:

Cousins son, diagnosed with milk allery, neurotypical, never seemed

have the classic ear infection signs when he went back on milk after

age 2. He just would seem spacey and she would take him to the Dr.

and it would turn out he had double ear infections every time. He

remains on milk but momis considering removal as he seems to suffer

from stunted growth and now is failing hearing tests. She is seeking

allergy testing first.

Neither of my kids showed ear trouble signs but also seemed off. When

we would get to the doc either ear infection or uninfected fluid was

present. Because the fluid was often uninfected I did not suspect

milk as that is not how it was described in the reading. We did get

tubes due to the speech issue and after the fact removed milk. The

ENT said milk may have been the cause of the fluid in our case. This

story does apply to my speech kid.

> >

> > .... to be flip.... Sue me....

> >

> > I believe that the first study that I posted said 78% of normal

> population with recurrent ear issues. For me, this qualifies as a

> lot! If you were to look at the neurodevelopmentally compromised

> population, I would guess that this number is much higher.

> >

> > IF YOU DON'T LIKE THE WAY I WRITE, DON'T READ OR RESPOND TO MY

> POSTS. See? It's that easy! I don't claim to be an author but I am

> confident that every mother will do her own research because I

trust

> that each mother will not " blindly " take the advice of a woman

she has

> never met over the internet without putting some thought and

research

> into it first!

> >

> > If you really want to spend your life picking apart others, go

> ahead. It is obvious that you have no other productive hobbies. If

> anyone who actually has a sick child wants clarification as to my

> son's personal experience, I am happy to respond.

> >

> > But I will not respond to someone who is spending their time

being

> hurtful of others and purposefully SEEKING OUT contraversy. I am

done

> with this childish nonsense.

> > The rest of us have enough issues to deal with..... don't we?

> >

> > You asked for proof with regards to milk being an issue, I gave

it

> to you (as I have done in the past) and I expect this to be the

end of

> the matter. I have honored your request, please honor mine.

> >

> > I am not going to spend my day looking through your

quotes...... You

> are obviously looking for someone to fight with.... you need to

look

> at your personal life and figure out why, day after day over the

past

> week, you spend your time ridiculing others on this board. This is

> not like you .... again, I suggest that perhaps you need a

break

> to recharge your batteries..... I worry about your spirit. I have

> been on this board since about June and yes, you have been the

source

> of a lot of contraversy and arguments but never like this.....

Please

> take a holiday from sick kids. We all need one once in a while.

> >

> > So please, , I beg of you.... stop!

> >

> > Janice

> > Mother of Mark, 13

> >

> > [sPAM][ ] Re: swinging

> question/vestibular system

> >

> > Actually you did said for a " lot " of our kids. Here's the exact

> > quote from you that I answered:

> >

> > " For a lot of our kids, milk is a huge issue and really

congests the

> > ears and

> > hearing, causes drooling, decreases sensation in the hands, the

feet,

> > the face

> > esp the lips. Ever notice that your child doesn't feel the goop

on

> > his face

> > when eating or the drool spilling out of his mouth? It is

because he

> > has lost

> > sensation in his face as well as other extremities "

> >

> > Perhaps instead you could have written that we all know that

children

> > need to avoid anything they are allergic to prevent any serious

> > complications -however for the 2% of the pediatric population

under

> > the age of 5, that " fill in above quote here " But even then I

> > would start with " milk can be " and not " milk is "

> > " Approximately 2% of the pediatric population is affected by

cow's

> > milk allergy. Moreover the condition tends to be outgrown by 5

years

> > of age. "

> >

> http://www.nationaldairycouncil.org/NR/rdonlyres/69867157-06CD-

41ED-98BC-8B4540203C4A/0/dcd773.pdf

>

> >

> > It's like if I wrote " If you drink water and you have symptoms

like

> > nausea and muscle cramps it means you can die " Instead of

sharing

> > information about a rare but possible complication from

drinking too

> > much water too quickly. That is what I mean by sharing credible

> > links and not just my own opinion. And if it is just your

opinion

> > and your child's reaction -then state that.

> >

> > Symptoms of Hyponatremia

> > The early warning signs are often subtle and may be similar to

> > dehydration and include nausea, muscle cramps, disorientation,

> > slurred speech, and confusion. At this point, many athletes

drink

> > more water because they think they are dehydrated.

Unfortunately,

> > water alone will increase the problem of hyponatremia. At the

most

> > extreme an athlete may experience seizures, coma, or death.

> >

>

http://sportsmedicine.about.com/od/hydrationandfluid/a/Hyponatremia.ht

m

> > http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/000394.htm

> > http://www.yourmedicaldetective.com/public/446.cfm

> >

> > =====

> >

March 4, 2008

,

The link I supplied today was between Otis Media and kids with milk allergies.

If your kids don't have recurrent ear issues, then this would not necessarily be

an issue for you. Most DANS do advise experimenting with diet to ferret out

food allergens for our kids. In addition, they like to see our children eating

food that does not contain a lot of additives or preservatives since these items

are hard on the digestive system and also contribute to neurodevelopmental

issues.

In the past, I supplied a link newspaper article by the CBC and shall do so

again. In addition, there are thousands and thousands of kids who have positive

responses with special diets. For more information, query

GFCFKids to read their stories and watch their progress. This

is a huge world, this neurodevelopmental world..... it is easy to miss a lot of

things but special diets is one thing that a lot of parents are discovering

success with. Not all children are diet responders but some do amazingly well

on special diets. The Fengold Diet, for instance, really helps kids with ADHD

issues and has been known to help them for a long, long time.

In addition, people tend to use the word autism but all of these

neurodevelopmental disorders have commonalities and overlaps. I consider my

child's gut to be autistic in some senses but not quite as severe..... He

responds to a CF (casien free) diet but not a GF (gluten free) diet. He

responds to a Feingold Diet as well so we sort of use a hybrid of both and I

continuously search for items that hurt him. There are vitamin companies

devoted to the production of special enzymes for our kids who cannot tolerate

casien and/or gluten. I doubt they would do so without having some inkling of

the validity of the special diet for kids with NDD..... yet all of our kids are

individuals. For instance, I recently discovered that starchy foods are tough

for him to tolerate. He can do it but sometimes feels unwell afterwards so I

have begun to limit them in order to 'see' what is happening for my specific

child. This stuff is not cookie-cutter but highly specific and I have had to

read so much bio-chemistry that my head spins! It has been worth it for we have

chipped away at the disorder via both the vitamins and the diet. Our mainstay,

however, continues to be the therapy. The therapy is simply the most important

item for us...... for others it may be different as their children are younger

and less behind their peer group.

Below is the newspaper article that I have posted in past which links

neurodevelopmental issues with casein and gluten. Anecdotally, there are a lot

of success stories with special diets just as there are success stories with a

lot of items like different types of therapy and biomedical interventions like

vitamin E. Scientific proof is always a dogs-age behind the Moms proof! I

like to look at the consensus of the moms..... and see what " may " help my child.

It is amazing what you discover when you research the mothers that have come

before us. " Special Diets for Special Kids " written by is an

extremely well respected book on this subject.

Again..... our kids are all different with regards to their metabolism and what

works for one does not necessarily work for all. You need to play detective to

help your child and to discover the very specific things that may help him or

her. This is my own personal experience and do not expect a LASHING or FLAMING

if someone disagrees with me. This has been an important piece in MY CHILD'S

recovery.....

http://www.cbc.ca/health/story/2007/09/27/autism-study.html

Scientists make gut-brain connection to autism

Last Updated: Thursday, September 27, 2007 | 5:29 PM ET

CBC News

Compounds produced in the digestive system have been linked to autistic-type

behaviour in laboratory settings, potentially demonstrating that what autistic

children eat can alter their brain function, say scientists from the University

of Western Ontario.

They announced their findings Thursday in Ottawa.

Scientists are learning that the brain and body can influence each other, says

a Harvard researcher.

(CBC) UWO researchers investigated the " gut-brain " connection after many

parents of autistic children reported significant improvements in the behaviour

of their autistic children when they modified their diet, eliminating dairy and

wheat products, Dr. Derrick MacFabe, the director of a research group at UWO in

London, Ont., told CBC News Thursday.

Researchers were particularly interested in one dietary characteristic the

autistic children seemed to exhibit, he said.

" Certainly, a lot of these children had peculiar cravings for high-carbohydrate

foods that caused their behaviours, " he said.

" We were interested in finding a link between certain compounds that are

produced by bacteria in the digestive system - particularly those occurring with

early childhood infections. "

The bacteria produce propionic acid, a short chain fatty acid, which in addition

to existing in the gut, is commonly found in bread and dairy products, MacFabe

said.

To test their hypothesis that diet plays a part in generating autistic

behaviour, UWO scientists administered the compound to rats' brains.

" They immediately engaged in bouts of repetitive behaviour, hyperactivity and

impaired social behaviours which had close similarity to what parents are seeing

with autism, " MacFabe said.

When the rats' brains were examined later, they were found to have inflammatory

processes similar to those in the brains of autistic children, he said.

" We found, looking at the rats' brains under the microscope, changes that looked

a lot like what's occurred from autopsy cases of patients who had autism. "

It's remarkable that a simple compound like propionic acid would have such a

dramatic effect on " normal " animals, he said.

MacFabe said his research team, and scientists at Queen's University in

Kingston, Ont., and Harvard University, are now conducting screening studies

looking at effects of dietary changes in the general population.

New way of approaching autism

Dr. Martha Herbert, assistant professor in neurology at Harvard Medical School,

told CBC News that the study opens up a new way of thinking about the disorder.

" Now we're learning that the brain and body can influence each other, " she said.

Autistic children are increasingly being seen as " oversensitized, " meaning

" things may bother them that don't bother other people, " she said. " We need to

pay attention to this. "

Treating a child's health should be the first step in addressing autism, Herbert

said, rather than solely focusing on behavioural therapy, currently a mainline

approach.

" Behaviour therapy is certainly important. But the child's health controls the

bandwidth that the child has for being able to benefit from behavioural therapy.

If a child is sick, they won't be able to focus. "

Parents should watch their children closely to determine what foods trigger

reactions and to consider removing those triggers, she said.

Herbert strongly advocates a balanced diet, consisting of all food groups, not

just " bread and cheese. "

" If you have foods that child is sensitive to in their immune system, that can

set up processes that can impact brain function, and it can do so in a negative

way. And if you remove those foods, that negative impact can stop. "

[sPAM][ ] Re: swinging

question/vestibular system

>

> Actually you did said for a " lot " of our kids. Here's the exact

> quote from you that I answered:

>

> " For a lot of our kids, milk is a huge issue and really congests the

> ears and

> hearing, causes drooling, decreases sensation in the hands, the feet,

> the face

> esp the lips. Ever notice that your child doesn't feel the goop on

> his face

> when eating or the drool spilling out of his mouth? It is because he

> has lost

> sensation in his face as well as other extremities "

>

> Perhaps instead you could have written that we all know that children

> need to avoid anything they are allergic to prevent any serious

> complications -however for the 2% of the pediatric population under

> the age of 5, that " fill in above quote here " But even then I

> would start with " milk can be " and not " milk is "

> " Approximately 2% of the pediatric population is affected by cow's

> milk allergy. Moreover the condition tends to be outgrown by 5 years

> of age. "

>

http://www.nationaldairycouncil.org/NR/rdonlyres/69867157-06CD-41ED-98BC-8B45402\

03C4A/0/dcd773.pdf

>

> It's like if I wrote " If you drink water and you have symptoms like

> nausea and muscle cramps it means you can die " Instead of sharing

> information about a rare but possible complication from drinking too

> much water too quickly. That is what I mean by sharing credible

> links and not just my own opinion. And if it is just your opinion

> and your child's reaction -then state that.

>

> Symptoms of Hyponatremia

> The early warning signs are often subtle and may be similar to

> dehydration and include nausea, muscle cramps, disorientation,

> slurred speech, and confusion. At this point, many athletes drink

> more water because they think they are dehydrated. Unfortunately,

> water alone will increase the problem of hyponatremia. At the most

> extreme an athlete may experience seizures, coma, or death.

>

http://sportsmedicine.about.com/od/hydrationandfluid/a/Hyponatremia.htm

> http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/000394.htm

> http://www.yourmedicaldetective.com/public/446.cfm

>

> =====

>

March 4, 2008

I hate saying this, but before you got on this list Janice, there was

not a power struggle. I have been wondering for a couple of months why

you didn't start your own list since you have such a problem with this

one. I am truly wondering.

Pam in GA.

Janice wrote:

>

> .... to be flip.... Sue me....

>

> I believe that the first study that I posted said 78% of normal

> population with recurrent ear issues. For me, this qualifies as a lot!

> If you were to look at the neurodevelopmentally compromised

> population, I would guess that this number is much higher.

>

> IF YOU DON'T LIKE THE WAY I WRITE, DON'T READ OR RESPOND TO MY POSTS.

> See? It's that easy! I don't claim to be an author but I am confident

> that every mother will do her own research because I trust that each

> mother will not " blindly " take the advice of a woman she has never met

> over the internet without putting some thought and research into it first!

>

> If you really want to spend your life picking apart others, go ahead.

> It is obvious that you have no other productive hobbies. If anyone who

> actually has a sick child wants clarification as to my son's personal

> experience, I am happy to respond.

>

> But I will not respond to someone who is spending their time being

> hurtful of others and purposefully SEEKING OUT contraversy. I am done

> with this childish nonsense.

> The rest of us have enough issues to deal with..... don't we?

>

> You asked for proof with regards to milk being an issue, I gave it to

> you (as I have done in the past) and I expect this to be the end of

> the matter. I have honored your request, please honor mine.

>

> I am not going to spend my day looking through your quotes...... You

> are obviously looking for someone to fight with.... you need to look

> at your personal life and figure out why, day after day over the past

> week, you spend your time ridiculing others on this board. This is not

> like you .... again, I suggest that perhaps you need a break to

> recharge your batteries..... I worry about your spirit. I have been on

> this board since about June and yes, you have been the source of a lot

> of contraversy and arguments but never like this..... Please take a

> holiday from sick kids. We all need one once in a while.

>

> So please, , I beg of you.... stop!

>

> Janice

> Mother of Mark, 13

>

> [sPAM][ ] Re: swinging question/vestibular

> system

>

> Actually you did said for a " lot " of our kids. Here's the exact

> quote from you that I answered:

>

> " For a lot of our kids, milk is a huge issue and really congests the

> ears and

> hearing, causes drooling, decreases sensation in the hands, the feet,

> the face

> esp the lips. Ever notice that your child doesn't feel the goop on

> his face

> when eating or the drool spilling out of his mouth? It is because he

> has lost

> sensation in his face as well as other extremities "

>

> Perhaps instead you could have written that we all know that children

> need to avoid anything they are allergic to prevent any serious

> complications -however for the 2% of the pediatric population under

> the age of 5, that " fill in above quote here " But even then I

> would start with " milk can be " and not " milk is "

> " Approximately 2% of the pediatric population is affected by cow's

> milk allergy. Moreover the condition tends to be outgrown by 5 years

> of age. "

>

http://www.nationaldairycouncil.org/NR/rdonlyres/69867157-06CD-41ED-98BC-8B45402\

03C4A/0/dcd773.pdf

>

<http://www.nationaldairycouncil.org/NR/rdonlyres/69867157-06CD-41ED-98BC-8B4540\

203C4A/0/dcd773.pdf>

>

> It's like if I wrote " If you drink water and you have symptoms like

> nausea and muscle cramps it means you can die " Instead of sharing

> information about a rare but possible complication from drinking too

> much water too quickly. That is what I mean by sharing credible

> links and not just my own opinion. And if it is just your opinion

> and your child's reaction -then state that.

>

> Symptoms of Hyponatremia

> The early warning signs are often subtle and may be similar to

> dehydration and include nausea, muscle cramps, disorientation,

> slurred speech, and confusion. At this point, many athletes drink

> more water because they think they are dehydrated. Unfortunately,

> water alone will increase the problem of hyponatremia. At the most

> extreme an athlete may experience seizures, coma, or death.

> http://sportsmedicine.about.com/od/hydrationandfluid/a/Hyponatremia.htm

> <http://sportsmedicine.about.com/od/hydrationandfluid/a/Hyponatremia.htm>

> http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/000394.htm

> <http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/000394.htm>

> http://www.yourmedicaldetective.com/public/446.cfm

> <http://www.yourmedicaldetective.com/public/446.cfm>

>

> =====

>

March 4, 2008

My son has benefitted tremendously off of milk. Once again I will state that

my son's ped. was also in favor of taking him off of it after so many ear

infections. We have not had one ear infection since we took him off of milk

in August. He does not touch his ears like he did and I know for a fact he

hears better and is more alert. Life is good for my boy now and he is

speaking at or above level for his age. This is what has worked for us.

Please RESPECT my choice and my choice to share it with all of you.

Colleen

Mother of Charlie 2.5 years

Re: [ ] Re: swinging question/vestibular system

Milk was the culprit for us too. Once the milk was gone, the congestion

was gone, the drool was gone and the sensitivity to loud noises was gone.

Janice wrote:

> For a lot of our kids, milk is a huge issue and really congests the ears

and hearing, causes drooling, decreases sensation in the hands, the feet,

the face esp the lips. Ever notice that your child doesn't feel the goop on

his face when eating or the drool spilling out of his mouth? It is because

he has lost sensation in his face as well as other extremities..... this may

not be because of the milk for your child but for my child it was a huge

key. My son is not allergic to milk but most definately intol

> erant. In addition, if your ears are congested, your vestibular system is

compromised as well thus it leads to poor balance and coordination.

>

> Perhaps it is the globally dyspraxic children that are milk intolerant?

That would be a good poll...... Knowledge is power!

>

> Janice

> Mother of Mark, 13

>

> [sPAM]Re: [ ] Re: swinging question/vestibular

system

>

> Tara--the vestibule system controls the other systems--after I had tubes

put in my childs ears they made a lot of progress and made clearer sounds--

>

> mommyz7 <t_r_z (DOT) <mailto:t_r_z%40> com> wrote: My son was

like that - I used to laugh that he was the only baby

> 9+months old that would reach out and STOP the baby swing. If only I

> had known...

>

> I would recommend that you see an ENT for the persistent fluid in the

> ears. This is a very costly thing to fix later on. We are about 2

> yrs into it and still working hard. If you can't hear clearly, you

> can't speak clearly.

>

> BUT you also have to look at what is causing the fluid in the ears. I

> don't want to keep pushing dietary fixes - but try no MILK or MILK

> containing products.

>

> Turns out my son has a major dairy allergy and the other two boys have

> major dairy intolerances.

>

> >

> > Hello, I am looking for some guidance on this. Here is a typical

> scenario: My dd is excited to swing, we put her in the swing, she

> swings for about a minute or two and she cries and wants to get out.

> We just found out (through a typmanogram) that she has fluid in her

> ears. And now I am wondering if she has fluid in her ears often and

> that's causing her vestibular systemm to feel " funny " or

> " disorganized " .( which is why she wants to get outof the swing) I'm

> wondering if the two are related. Because sometimes, I would say

> about 20% of the time, she is fine on the swings and is able to swing

> for longer periods.( which may be when her ears are clear) She is

> almost 3 and is not walking and has no speech. Any thoughts on my

> theory? thanks. tara

> >

> > ---------------------------------

> > Never miss a thing. Make your homepage.

> >

March 4, 2008

,

Honestly, this is getting old and it is a shame that you continue to charge

and try and bulldoze over those of us who are sharing positive stores on our

journeys to recovery. It is amazing that Janice pulled me aside one day and

told me the fate of my son if I did not get to the ROOT of his problems. Who

knows how many others were helped who were just lurkers or too darn busy

with work, home and sick kids to inquire futher.

Janice, Liz, Stephanee and among others have helped my son here on

this board. My son is in recovery. He is at the top of his game and will

hopefully never have to endure all the hardship poor Mark has had to put up

with in his life time. It is inspiring how Mark changes and improves weekly.

As for you, I dont bother to read your posts because you are always

condeming someone. Use all the scientific data you want to your advantage. I

have ignored many a post from you, and it is a shame. I have never

reccommended to you that you test your children even at their late ages. I

personally believe you would see a difference.

Please chill out and do what you do best, helping children. Helping children

cannot take place if you continue to argue with parents. Perception is a

funny thing!

Colleen

Mother of Charlie 2.5 years

March 4, 2008

I completely disagree with Pam's comments here. Janice's information

has been a great asset to this group. I have learned so much from

her and I know so many others feel the same. We are very lucky to

have Janice here.

Becky

> >

> > .... to be flip.... Sue me....

> >

> > I believe that the first study that I posted said 78% of normal

> > population with recurrent ear issues. For me, this qualifies as

a lot!

> > If you were to look at the neurodevelopmentally compromised

> > population, I would guess that this number is much higher.

> >

> > IF YOU DON'T LIKE THE WAY I WRITE, DON'T READ OR RESPOND TO MY

POSTS.

> > See? It's that easy! I don't claim to be an author but I am

confident

> > that every mother will do her own research because I trust that

each

> > mother will not " blindly " take the advice of a woman she has

never met

> > over the internet without putting some thought and research into

it first!

> >

> > If you really want to spend your life picking apart others, go

ahead.

> > It is obvious that you have no other productive hobbies. If

anyone who

> > actually has a sick child wants clarification as to my son's

personal

> > experience, I am happy to respond.

> >

> > But I will not respond to someone who is spending their time

being

> > hurtful of others and purposefully SEEKING OUT contraversy. I am

done

> > with this childish nonsense.

> > The rest of us have enough issues to deal with..... don't we?

> >

> > You asked for proof with regards to milk being an issue, I gave

it to

> > you (as I have done in the past) and I expect this to be the end

of

> > the matter. I have honored your request, please honor mine.

> >

> > I am not going to spend my day looking through your quotes......

You

> > are obviously looking for someone to fight with.... you need to

look

> > at your personal life and figure out why, day after day over the

past

> > week, you spend your time ridiculing others on this board. This

is not

> > like you .... again, I suggest that perhaps you need a break

to

> > recharge your batteries..... I worry about your spirit. I have

been on

> > this board since about June and yes, you have been the source of

a lot

> > of contraversy and arguments but never like this..... Please

take a

> > holiday from sick kids. We all need one once in a while.

> >

> > So please, , I beg of you.... stop!

> >

> > Janice

> > Mother of Mark, 13

> >

> > [sPAM][ ] Re: swinging

question/vestibular

> > system

> >

> > Actually you did said for a " lot " of our kids. Here's the exact

> > quote from you that I answered:

> >

> > " For a lot of our kids, milk is a huge issue and really congests

the

> > ears and

> > hearing, causes drooling, decreases sensation in the hands, the

feet,

> > the face

> > esp the lips. Ever notice that your child doesn't feel the goop

on

> > his face

> > when eating or the drool spilling out of his mouth? It is

because he

> > has lost

> > sensation in his face as well as other extremities "

> >

> > Perhaps instead you could have written that we all know that

children

> > need to avoid anything they are allergic to prevent any serious

> > complications -however for the 2% of the pediatric population

under

> > the age of 5, that " fill in above quote here " But even then I

> > would start with " milk can be " and not " milk is "

> > " Approximately 2% of the pediatric population is affected by

cow's

> > milk allergy. Moreover the condition tends to be outgrown by 5

years

> > of age. "

> > http://www.nationaldairycouncil.org/NR/rdonlyres/69867157-06CD-

41ED-98BC-8B4540203C4A/0/dcd773.pdf

> > <http://www.nationaldairycouncil.org/NR/rdonlyres/69867157-06CD-

41ED-98BC-8B4540203C4A/0/dcd773.pdf>

> >

> > It's like if I wrote " If you drink water and you have symptoms

like

> > nausea and muscle cramps it means you can die " Instead of sharing

> > information about a rare but possible complication from drinking

too

> > much water too quickly. That is what I mean by sharing credible

> > links and not just my own opinion. And if it is just your opinion

> > and your child's reaction -then state that.

> >

> > Symptoms of Hyponatremia

> > The early warning signs are often subtle and may be similar to

> > dehydration and include nausea, muscle cramps, disorientation,

> > slurred speech, and confusion. At this point, many athletes drink

> > more water because they think they are dehydrated. Unfortunately,

> > water alone will increase the problem of hyponatremia. At the

most

> > extreme an athlete may experience seizures, coma, or death.

> >

http://sportsmedicine.about.com/od/hydrationandfluid/a/Hyponatremia.h

tm

> >

<http://sportsmedicine.about.com/od/hydrationandfluid/a/Hyponatremia.

htm>

> > http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/000394.htm

> > <http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/000394.htm>

> > http://www.yourmedicaldetective.com/public/446.cfm

> > <http://www.yourmedicaldetective.com/public/446.cfm>

> >

> > =====

> >

March 4, 2008

OT just told me that kids who have poor visual processing, appear to

benefit from a " spinning " protocol. Apparently new research indicates

that the vestibular development also triggers the OPTIC nerve

development. I will try and keep everyone posted as we just started a

spinning protocol for my apraxic child. If this is true, I am not

surprised as I know his vestibular sense never developed correctly.

---

March 4, 2008

Forgive me if this is a stupid question but does this idea sort of

coincide with the whole rollercoaster craving some of our kids have as

expressed here the other day?

>

> OT just told me that kids who have poor visual processing, appear to

> benefit from a " spinning " protocol. Apparently new research indicates

> that the vestibular development also triggers the OPTIC nerve

> development. I will try and keep everyone posted as we just started a

> spinning protocol for my apraxic child. If this is true, I am not

> surprised as I know his vestibular sense never developed correctly.

>

> ---

>

March 4, 2008

I like Janice's posts and have learned innumerable things from them.

I don't like 's posts.

Janice if you start your own list let me know so I can be there too.

> >

> > .... to be flip.... Sue me....

> >

> > I believe that the first study that I posted said 78% of normal

> > population with recurrent ear issues. For me, this qualifies as a

lot!

> > If you were to look at the neurodevelopmentally compromised

> > population, I would guess that this number is much higher.

> >

> > IF YOU DON'T LIKE THE WAY I WRITE, DON'T READ OR RESPOND TO MY POSTS.

> > See? It's that easy! I don't claim to be an author but I am confident

> > that every mother will do her own research because I trust that each

> > mother will not " blindly " take the advice of a woman she has never

met

> > over the internet without putting some thought and research into

it first!

> >

> > If you really want to spend your life picking apart others, go ahead.

> > It is obvious that you have no other productive hobbies. If anyone

who

> > actually has a sick child wants clarification as to my son's personal

> > experience, I am happy to respond.

> >

> > But I will not respond to someone who is spending their time being

> > hurtful of others and purposefully SEEKING OUT contraversy. I am done

> > with this childish nonsense.

> > The rest of us have enough issues to deal with..... don't we?

> >

> > You asked for proof with regards to milk being an issue, I gave it to

> > you (as I have done in the past) and I expect this to be the end of

> > the matter. I have honored your request, please honor mine.

> >

> > I am not going to spend my day looking through your quotes...... You

> > are obviously looking for someone to fight with.... you need to look

> > at your personal life and figure out why, day after day over the past

> > week, you spend your time ridiculing others on this board. This is

not

> > like you .... again, I suggest that perhaps you need a break to

> > recharge your batteries..... I worry about your spirit. I have

been on

> > this board since about June and yes, you have been the source of a

lot

> > of contraversy and arguments but never like this..... Please take a

> > holiday from sick kids. We all need one once in a while.

> >

> > So please, , I beg of you.... stop!

> >

> > Janice

> > Mother of Mark, 13

> >

> > [sPAM][ ] Re: swinging question/vestibular

> > system

> >

> > Actually you did said for a " lot " of our kids. Here's the exact

> > quote from you that I answered:

> >

> > " For a lot of our kids, milk is a huge issue and really congests the

> > ears and

> > hearing, causes drooling, decreases sensation in the hands, the feet,

> > the face

> > esp the lips. Ever notice that your child doesn't feel the goop on

> > his face

> > when eating or the drool spilling out of his mouth? It is because he

> > has lost

> > sensation in his face as well as other extremities "

> >

> > Perhaps instead you could have written that we all know that children

> > need to avoid anything they are allergic to prevent any serious

> > complications -however for the 2% of the pediatric population under

> > the age of 5, that " fill in above quote here " But even then I

> > would start with " milk can be " and not " milk is "

> > " Approximately 2% of the pediatric population is affected by cow's

> > milk allergy. Moreover the condition tends to be outgrown by 5 years

> > of age. "

> >

http://www.nationaldairycouncil.org/NR/rdonlyres/69867157-06CD-41ED-98BC-8B45402\

03C4A/0/dcd773.pdf

> >

<http://www.nationaldairycouncil.org/NR/rdonlyres/69867157-06CD-41ED-98BC-8B4540\

203C4A/0/dcd773.pdf>

> >

> > It's like if I wrote " If you drink water and you have symptoms like

> > nausea and muscle cramps it means you can die " Instead of sharing

> > information about a rare but possible complication from drinking too

> > much water too quickly. That is what I mean by sharing credible

> > links and not just my own opinion. And if it is just your opinion

> > and your child's reaction -then state that.

> >

> > Symptoms of Hyponatremia

> > The early warning signs are often subtle and may be similar to

> > dehydration and include nausea, muscle cramps, disorientation,

> > slurred speech, and confusion. At this point, many athletes drink

> > more water because they think they are dehydrated. Unfortunately,

> > water alone will increase the problem of hyponatremia. At the most

> > extreme an athlete may experience seizures, coma, or death.

> >

http://sportsmedicine.about.com/od/hydrationandfluid/a/Hyponatremia.htm

> >

<http://sportsmedicine.about.com/od/hydrationandfluid/a/Hyponatremia.htm>

> > http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/000394.htm

> > <http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/000394.htm>

> > http://www.yourmedicaldetective.com/public/446.cfm

> > <http://www.yourmedicaldetective.com/public/446.cfm>

> >

> > =====

> >

March 4, 2008

Janice,

I bought these enzymes ..perhaps on your suggestion (I can't remember) BUT

I could not sneak them in anything! He has sensory issues and eating

problems and he smells everything. He immediately knew something was not

right and refuse to eat the pureed fruit. I sneak every other supplement

in his pureed fruit. I will try to put it in other things; the problem is

he needs to eat the entire thing to get supplement in his system. That can

be a challenge as well. I'll keep on trying.

Interestingly enough, my son has been very gassy...I'm thinking he's been

eating too many chicken nuggets & fries..which is our on the go meal to

and/or from his therapies.

I'm one of those that appreciate your advice. And I do not take any advice

literally without researching it thoroughly. You put the thought in my head

and I can take it from there. :-)

Myra

March 4, 2008

Actually, that isn't completely true. For as long as I have read this

list (maybe 5 years?) there have been struggles over which approach is

best for kids. It seems that the struggles always arise when those

whose kids are purely verbally apraxic butt heads with those whose

kids struggle in multiple areas and who pursue methods that are, as of

yet, scientifically unproven. This is not to say that science won't

catch up, but that it hasn't yet. We also all know that for many

methods, it never will.

This group has gone off on many different paths since I have been

reading, and I go for MONTHS at a time without even checking in

because the in-fighting gets so tiresome. I remember the months that I

didn't read here because my son was not a responder to EFAs...or

Vitamin E. Then people talked about chelation...glutathione...cranial

sacral therapy...chiropractic/DAN...etc. All of these subjects

recycle, and have for years. Janice's posts about the intense home

occupational therapy advocated by NACD are one of the first " new "

topics I have seen here since Vit. E.

The controversies have been here all along. For better or for worse,

that comes from not screening the posts. On a positive note, it gives

people a chance to discuss what has worked for their child. On the

flip side, months and months might go by before a post is the least

bit applicable to your child. When the tone gets ugly, a lot of us

just check out.

>

> I hate saying this, but before you got on this list Janice, there was

> not a power struggle. I have been wondering for a couple of months

why

> you didn't start your own list since you have such a problem with this

> one. I am truly wondering.

>

> Pam in GA.

March 4, 2008

" You don't throw the baby out with the bathwater. " Thanks Janice for

the smile!

Being a child advocate I've always questioned even when others all

agree. 'I' actually got thrown off the other apraxia grouplist

because of all my posts about EFAs, neurodevelopmental medical

doctors and why it's probably good to see them (back just a few years

ago the attitude was that only SLPs knew anything) why schools for

the hearing impaired may be great for our children -and all about the

soft signs, oral apraxia etc. That's why this group was started -so

parents and professionals can share all views. And while it's OK to

question -there are right and wrong ways to debate.

I am so glad that you recognize that I don't censor this group and

allow everyone to express...even if the messages attack me in some

way. I have very tough skin and honestly doesn't bother me. I know

I'm not perfect just like anyone else. On the other hand I'm true to

who I am. I won't stop being the one that questions the things that

others accept at times without question. If someone follows advice

posted here that's fine and my conscience as list owner will be clear

as long as all sides pro and con are shared. While some post here-

many email me in private and are afraid to question or share their

views if they don't agree with what's posted and that's not good.

And actually I had not been here for awhile posting and made a

promise to those who were sad about the direction of the group that I

would start posting again. I assure you that I am happy -just came

in from a jog with my husband and dogs -and loving life. My both

boys are doing better than I could have dreamed- and want others to

have the same success. I 'would' however like to start talking more

about older kids in this group. That's something that you and I

share Janice.

And of course I know diets are important and special ones are needed

by those that have certain conditions. I myself was raised on one.

Perhaps that's also why I am so hard on those that " try " diets that

are not needed with their children. My family is not all organic -

but we eat pretty healthy -shop at Whole Foods -and if you check with

the pediatrician -I can't remember the last time our kids were sick.

And this may be gross to mention but I don't get yeast infections but

I knew about acidophilus yogurt since I was little since my aunt

has her PhD in nursing. Actually she's probably a great part of why

I question so much. (and also spending years in and out of the

hospital as an infant when I almost died a few times before the

diagnosis the celiac) So while I'm not " normal " that's normal for

me. I am going to continue to question -and be happy doing it. And

it's OK to not like me- even though most do! )

So do you also want to talk more about older kids in school? That's

a much needed topic for sure!

=====

March 4, 2008

My Dear Friends,

is a great person who moderates hundreds of posts a day when her own child

is better. She is in need of a rest from us crazy warriors. NEVER seems

to take a rest from moderation. She doesn't need to do further research while

we are feverishly seeking out the pieces of the puzzle we are missing. Thus far

she has not censored any of the posts but just lets them be. For that we need

to be grateful.

You don't throw the baby out with the bathwater.

I do hope that looks at all of the information out there these days that

suggests that dietary intervention is a necessity for 'SOME' kids to get better

and to thrive. This division on milk must end and we need to unite as a group

once more.

I know that my child could not have gotten better without eliminating milk and I

see this being reiterated time and again throughout the literature. Other moms

need to know this as well and while vitamins are great, food allergens and

intolerances really hurt the body of a child.

Sometimes when you are fighting with all and sundry around you, it simply means

that you need a break; a small rest to recharge and clear your head. I know

that I need breaks from dyspraxia..... or I would go absolutely insane.....

Janice

[sPAM][ ] Re: swinging question/vestibular

> > system

> >

> > Actually you did said for a " lot " of our kids. Here's the exact

> > quote from you that I answered:

> >

> > " For a lot of our kids, milk is a huge issue and really congests the

> > ears and

> > hearing, causes drooling, decreases sensation in the hands, the feet,

> > the face

> > esp the lips. Ever notice that your child doesn't feel the goop on

> > his face

> > when eating or the drool spilling out of his mouth? It is because he

> > has lost

> > sensation in his face as well as other extremities "

> >

> > Perhaps instead you could have written that we all know that children

> > need to avoid anything they are allergic to prevent any serious

> > complications -however for the 2% of the pediatric population under

> > the age of 5, that " fill in above quote here " But even then I

> > would start with " milk can be " and not " milk is "

> > " Approximately 2% of the pediatric population is affected by cow's

> > milk allergy. Moreover the condition tends to be outgrown by 5 years

> > of age. "

> >

http://www.nationaldairycouncil.org/NR/rdonlyres/69867157-06CD-41ED-98BC-8B45402\

03C4A/0/dcd773.pdf

> >

<http://www.nationaldairycouncil.org/NR/rdonlyres/69867157-06CD-41ED-98BC-8B4540\

203C4A/0/dcd773.pdf>

> >

> > It's like if I wrote " If you drink water and you have symptoms like

> > nausea and muscle cramps it means you can die " Instead of sharing

> > information about a rare but possible complication from drinking too

> > much water too quickly. That is what I mean by sharing credible

> > links and not just my own opinion. And if it is just your opinion

> > and your child's reaction -then state that.

> >

> > Symptoms of Hyponatremia

> > The early warning signs are often subtle and may be similar to

> > dehydration and include nausea, muscle cramps, disorientation,

> > slurred speech, and confusion. At this point, many athletes drink

> > more water because they think they are dehydrated. Unfortunately,

> > water alone will increase the problem of hyponatremia. At the most

> > extreme an athlete may experience seizures, coma, or death.

> >

http://sportsmedicine.about.com/od/hydrationandfluid/a/Hyponatremia.htm

> >

<http://sportsmedicine.about.com/od/hydrationandfluid/a/Hyponatremia.htm>

> > http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/000394.htm

> > <http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/000394.htm>

> > http://www.yourmedicaldetective.com/public/446.cfm

> > <http://www.yourmedicaldetective.com/public/446.cfm>

> >

> > =====

> >

March 4, 2008

Actually I'm even afraid to mention one of the worst debates here was

not over which therapy was best -but over wild Atlantic salmon.

were you here for that one? Me and some other even posted

links to how it's listed as an endangered species and one member was

so angry as she said there was no such thing. This debate became a

bit heated because in spite of links like this one

www.worldwildlife.org/oceans/pdfs/osloresprogress.pdf this one

member said it didn't exist -and she said she knew because she used

to be a chef or something.

One thing to point out. Here oral motor therapy is not a political

issue.

=====

March 4, 2008

It's posts like this one that discourage me as a new mom to this

group. I guess I just wonder where our hearts are at when we feel

the need to go to the ends of the earth to prove we are right, or

point out others' issues, or even just something like this..... go

back to who knows when? to discuss a silly issue like salmon and to

refer to that other person (and paint a picture of her/him almost as

though they are nuts.) Yes, it does sound nutty ....but do I need to

hear about it?

>

> Actually I'm even afraid to mention one of the worst debates here

was

> not over which therapy was best -but over wild Atlantic salmon.

> were you here for that one? Me and some other even posted

> links to how it's listed as an endangered species and one member

was

> so angry as she said there was no such thing. This debate became a

> bit heated because in spite of links like this one

> www.worldwildlife.org/oceans/pdfs/osloresprogress.pdf this one

> member said it didn't exist -and she said she knew because she used

> to be a chef or something.

>

> One thing to point out. Here oral motor therapy is not a political

> issue.

>

> =====

>

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