New member and need direction

[Guest guest]

Hi, there...

I have a soon to be 18 year old daughter that has atypical autism and a

niece that has confirmed Celiac Disease. We have had our daughter gluten

free ever since our young niece's diagnosis. Jackie, my daughter, doesn't

have Celiac but does have the sister disease of Dermatitis Herpetiformes

which is the stubborn skin rash. It did get much better once we went gluten

free but I am wondering if the enzymes might not give us even better

results. How do I start, what do I look for, and where do I buy what I

need?

Thanks!

Diane of Kansas

[Guest guest]

Hi Diane and welcome.

There are a few people with celiac on this board and I hope they pop

by to provide some personal perspectives. We do not have that in my

family, but I will provide some suggestions and hope you get some

guidance from them.

We have been tracking trends on this board for about 8 1/2 months

now...and unfortunately, none of the enzymes currently out help a

person with celiac to resume eating gluten.

Below is an excerpt from the 7 month report that explains this. I

now have reports from 12 people with celiac and the results are very

consistent. I have since run across some research that shows that

the enzymes amylase and glucoamylase together have been shown to

render gluten non-harmful to celiacs. The part of the gluten that is

harmful to some people with autistic conditions is the protein

(broken down by proteases), but the part of the gluten that is

harmful to celiacs is the carbohydrate (broken down by a mixture of

amylase, glucoamylase, maybe xylanase or hemicelluase too). This is

not to say enzymes may not help overall because many here have found

them beneficial. However, it appears that when a person with celiac

consumes gluten with just proteases the reaction may be worse than

when gluten is consumed without protease enzymes.

As far as products, I use the enzymes Peptizyde and Zyme Prime from

www.houstonni.com. In your particular case, I would encourage you to

look at the EnzymAid Complete from www.kirkman.com and consider that

product first. Ask for the trial size, runs about $3. The reason is

that you can start with a little bit and see if enzymes will even

help in meeting your goals. Also, it is a balanced product with both

the proteases and carbohydrate enzymes in one capsule. Is dairy a

problem for your daughter? The Complete will have some proteases in

it for dairy as well. The Zyme Prime has proteases and the enzymes

for the carbohydrates but not for the dairy. If you find that your

daughter can tolerate the enzymes, then you consider other products

or a larger size. Just trying to save you some money right off. I

will also send you a file on what the different enzymes in each

product are for, some inital possible effects and mixing

suggestions. Ask away if you have any more questions. I would be

very interested in hearing how your daughter responses.

.

------------------------------------

At this time, Peptizyde/proteases do not appear to allow a person

with celiac to return to eating gluten. Based on 7 cases where the

person either knew they were celiac or suspected it. Celiac is a

very serious condition, which often goes undiagnosed. So if someone

sees regression with gluten + enzymes, particularly strong proteases

such as Peptizyde, they are advised to consider celiac as a

possibility. One mother knew her children reacted to gluten among

many, many other foods. She started giving Peptizyde and Zyme Prime

and carefully re-introducing foods one at a time and noted the

reactions. For a few weeks, her children were doing well with 1

slice of gluten bread once each day. About the third week, her

children started to regress and developed a noticeable rash. She

withdrew the gluten and compared her children's rash to those of

photos of the type of rash that often accompanies celiac, and

concluded that her children were celiac. She has re-introduced many

other foods, but remains gluten-free with the enzymes. She considers

the enzymes to be very successful overall for her family. Two other

mothers saw increased diarrhea with gluten + Peptizyde, but success

with all other foods. One knew their child was celiac before and the

other is now testing for it.

It was found, in general, people with celiac reacted worse when

taking gluten + Peptizyde than when consuming small amounts of

gluten with no enzymes. Celiac is an autoimmune disease/condition

with a genetic basis. There are certain sequences of peptides which

cause a reaction in the small intestine of individuals with celiac

disease. The peptides can be as small as 12 amino acids long (that's

pretty small). These peptides are different than the peptides that

get absorbed into the bloodstream and cause the opiate problem which

are called gliadiomorphs. When the peptides get to the small

intestine, the celiac's body registers these peptides as The Enemy.

A non-celiac's body would just see the peptide as from gluten and

let it pass. Once the celiac's body detects The Enemy, certain

antigens are produced which increase T-cell production in the small

intestine villi. This causes the villi to breakdown. There are three

common theories being discussed as the cause for celiac and the

specific amino acid sequences have not been identified. It is an

autoimmune reaction with a genetic basis.

Trying to get the enzymes to break down the proteins sufficiently so

these peptides would not be produced was experimental. There is a

certain structure in the gliadin that the small intestine sees as

toxic in celiac individuals. The enzymes are not breaking this down

in a way so that it does not cause a reaction in celiacs. So, in

fact, taking a protease such as Peptizyde may be just making more of

these little peptides (or whatever) available to the small

intestine, and perhaps increasing the number of chances to provoke a

reaction. There was some research on the www.celiac.com site which

proposed this same thing with the use of barley enzymes although it

also said this was just a working theory and there was no evidence

to back it up. No two celiacs are alike in their dietary tolerances

for gluten - some are very sensitive, some can tolerate a little at

a time, some can't take oats or spelt or kamut, some can. So if a

person suspects celiac, takes Peptizyde and gluten and doesn't do

well, that person should avoid gluten under all circumstances.

This is a different situation from the peptide/opiate problem which

is caused by large, insufficiently broken down molecules and leaky

gut. Those peptides have a certain structure that attaches to

specific receptors in the brain. Celiac reactions are triggered by

different tiny peptides which attach to receptors in the small

intestine. Only celiacs will have intestines that react in this way.