Guest guest Posted November 15, 2002 Report Share Posted November 15, 2002 P.s. What is a post-gastrectomy? Vicki A. > Hi Vicki, > When I became protein deficient, it wasn't necessarily because I wasn't eating enough protein, but the fact that I wasn't ABSORBING the protein due to the bypass - we don't break down the proteins from food because of the bypassing of the duodenum. I was " blind " to this fact, and so I was trying to eat protein first. However, as I became more and more protein deficient, and more and more dedicated (stupidly) to my work and the demands that it entailed at the time, I ate less and less. I found that I started hitting the crackers more, as they seemed to give me more energy, or I just ate a few here and there, and then by dinner time, I really didn't eat much, as my pouch shrank more and more. I did this unconsciously, not realizing it, and the longer I did this, the more it became " normal " for me to do. It was acceptable. However, I soon crashed, and had to restart the protein supplements, and that, and ONLY that is what brought my protein levels back up. > > Now, however, due to the long-term malnutrition, and the post- gastrectomy, I have become severely hypoglycemic, and have severe problems - almost leading to passing out, except I have been able to either " talk myself " out of it, or stop what I'm doing and chug protein or something to counteract it. I will be going to an endocrinologist next week to see what can be done about it. > > Take care, > B > Distal RNY 12/27/95 > 275/155 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 15, 2002 Report Share Posted November 15, 2002 Vicki wrote:........... Thanks so much for your answer. So , how did you know you were getting protein deficient? Was it the dizziness? Were there other warning signs? And are there some proteins which are more readily absorbed than others? Is this absorption problem something everyone has, or is it a case by case thing? My surgeon has a set of routine labs he orders on a regular schedule. However, since I had moved away to California (from Washington), I hadn't had any labs done for more than a year. I was feeling so crappy - would go to the store and not have the energy to get out of the car, and end up turning around and going back home, that I called up to the surgeon's office and they faxed me the labs. Found a local doc, and went to the lab and got them drawn. Afterwards, I went to Florida for a meeting, and while there, my new PCP was calling (four times) to tell me about the seriousness of my labs. I was so weak I couldn't carry a gallon of milk up the stairs (we have 19 stairs up to the front door of our house). But, I was in denial - thinking " why should I HAVE to carry groceries up, I have a big strong husband! " . However, that was just more denial in feeling so crappy. My preop protein level was 7.2, and my crash and burn level was 5.4 with a low albumin. You need to have a CMP (complete metabolic profile) lab test done to check your potassium, protein, liver tests, albumin, etc. This test checks all of your kidney functions, etc. I am not sure if any food protein is more readily absorbed than others, but I do know that the protein shakes are more readily absorbed as they have all the branch chain amino acids broken down for us so they are immediately absorbed. My muscles STILL hurt, and carrying my brief case can at times send me into muscle spasms and am still so weak I cannot exercise yet. I worked at a job fair for my company a few weeks ago, and had to take muscle relaxers for a few days afterwards as my muscles and my body is so deconditioned due to the lack of protein, that any thing different I do to it, causes pain. The absorbtion " problem " I believe is a problem with RNY's, but that is exactly what we PAY for - malabsorption to lose weight. Some surgeons bypass more, to create more malabsorption - others are more conservative. I am a " distal " which means I have more malabsorption of vitamins, proteins, iron, calories, etc. Probably why I still have been able to maintain my WL. I thought I was " invincible " , however, I learned the hard way that I wasn't - no body is. B Distal RNY 12/27/95 275/155 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 15, 2002 Report Share Posted November 15, 2002 Vicki wrote:........... Thanks so much for your answer. So , how did you know you were getting protein deficient? Was it the dizziness? Were there other warning signs? And are there some proteins which are more readily absorbed than others? Is this absorption problem something everyone has, or is it a case by case thing? My surgeon has a set of routine labs he orders on a regular schedule. However, since I had moved away to California (from Washington), I hadn't had any labs done for more than a year. I was feeling so crappy - would go to the store and not have the energy to get out of the car, and end up turning around and going back home, that I called up to the surgeon's office and they faxed me the labs. Found a local doc, and went to the lab and got them drawn. Afterwards, I went to Florida for a meeting, and while there, my new PCP was calling (four times) to tell me about the seriousness of my labs. I was so weak I couldn't carry a gallon of milk up the stairs (we have 19 stairs up to the front door of our house). But, I was in denial - thinking " why should I HAVE to carry groceries up, I have a big strong husband! " . However, that was just more denial in feeling so crappy. My preop protein level was 7.2, and my crash and burn level was 5.4 with a low albumin. You need to have a CMP (complete metabolic profile) lab test done to check your potassium, protein, liver tests, albumin, etc. This test checks all of your kidney functions, etc. I am not sure if any food protein is more readily absorbed than others, but I do know that the protein shakes are more readily absorbed as they have all the branch chain amino acids broken down for us so they are immediately absorbed. My muscles STILL hurt, and carrying my brief case can at times send me into muscle spasms and am still so weak I cannot exercise yet. I worked at a job fair for my company a few weeks ago, and had to take muscle relaxers for a few days afterwards as my muscles and my body is so deconditioned due to the lack of protein, that any thing different I do to it, causes pain. The absorbtion " problem " I believe is a problem with RNY's, but that is exactly what we PAY for - malabsorption to lose weight. Some surgeons bypass more, to create more malabsorption - others are more conservative. I am a " distal " which means I have more malabsorption of vitamins, proteins, iron, calories, etc. Probably why I still have been able to maintain my WL. I thought I was " invincible " , however, I learned the hard way that I wasn't - no body is. B Distal RNY 12/27/95 275/155 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 15, 2002 Report Share Posted November 15, 2002 Vicki wrote:........... Thanks so much for your answer. So , how did you know you were getting protein deficient? Was it the dizziness? Were there other warning signs? And are there some proteins which are more readily absorbed than others? Is this absorption problem something everyone has, or is it a case by case thing? My surgeon has a set of routine labs he orders on a regular schedule. However, since I had moved away to California (from Washington), I hadn't had any labs done for more than a year. I was feeling so crappy - would go to the store and not have the energy to get out of the car, and end up turning around and going back home, that I called up to the surgeon's office and they faxed me the labs. Found a local doc, and went to the lab and got them drawn. Afterwards, I went to Florida for a meeting, and while there, my new PCP was calling (four times) to tell me about the seriousness of my labs. I was so weak I couldn't carry a gallon of milk up the stairs (we have 19 stairs up to the front door of our house). But, I was in denial - thinking " why should I HAVE to carry groceries up, I have a big strong husband! " . However, that was just more denial in feeling so crappy. My preop protein level was 7.2, and my crash and burn level was 5.4 with a low albumin. You need to have a CMP (complete metabolic profile) lab test done to check your potassium, protein, liver tests, albumin, etc. This test checks all of your kidney functions, etc. I am not sure if any food protein is more readily absorbed than others, but I do know that the protein shakes are more readily absorbed as they have all the branch chain amino acids broken down for us so they are immediately absorbed. My muscles STILL hurt, and carrying my brief case can at times send me into muscle spasms and am still so weak I cannot exercise yet. I worked at a job fair for my company a few weeks ago, and had to take muscle relaxers for a few days afterwards as my muscles and my body is so deconditioned due to the lack of protein, that any thing different I do to it, causes pain. The absorbtion " problem " I believe is a problem with RNY's, but that is exactly what we PAY for - malabsorption to lose weight. Some surgeons bypass more, to create more malabsorption - others are more conservative. I am a " distal " which means I have more malabsorption of vitamins, proteins, iron, calories, etc. Probably why I still have been able to maintain my WL. I thought I was " invincible " , however, I learned the hard way that I wasn't - no body is. B Distal RNY 12/27/95 275/155 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 15, 2002 Report Share Posted November 15, 2002 Vicki wrote: P.s. What is a post-gastrectomy? I had a revision done for a staple line disruption. I had gotten several ulcers, and had developed free-flowing bile reflux gastritis. Because of the constant damage to my stomach from the reflux, when they did the revision and repaired the staple line disruption, they transsected AND REMOVED the remainder of my stomach. This is called a " subtotal gastrectomy " . Thus, I don't have a big stomach to absorb either which causes malnutrition. B Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 15, 2002 Report Share Posted November 15, 2002 Vicki wrote: P.s. What is a post-gastrectomy? I had a revision done for a staple line disruption. I had gotten several ulcers, and had developed free-flowing bile reflux gastritis. Because of the constant damage to my stomach from the reflux, when they did the revision and repaired the staple line disruption, they transsected AND REMOVED the remainder of my stomach. This is called a " subtotal gastrectomy " . Thus, I don't have a big stomach to absorb either which causes malnutrition. B Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 15, 2002 Report Share Posted November 15, 2002 Vicki wrote: P.s. What is a post-gastrectomy? I had a revision done for a staple line disruption. I had gotten several ulcers, and had developed free-flowing bile reflux gastritis. Because of the constant damage to my stomach from the reflux, when they did the revision and repaired the staple line disruption, they transsected AND REMOVED the remainder of my stomach. This is called a " subtotal gastrectomy " . Thus, I don't have a big stomach to absorb either which causes malnutrition. B Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 15, 2002 Report Share Posted November 15, 2002 Yep, that's me. I can follow the rules that *I* make because I know I'm only out for my own benefit. m RE: Told You So!! > > Moral~~~ " no one is immune to poor health if they abuse the rules! > > Okay, everyone can tell me " I told you so " I deserve it! > > KJ, > No one deserves to be beat up -- getting into the habit of all this new > stuff is hard and some times takes a 2x4 for us to " GET IT " -- I have > trouble " remembering " all the stuff all the time so I made it " simple " for > me -- protein shake and pills and/or pills with protein shake -- if I drink > a shake and don't take pills it's against the rules and vice versa (this > doesn't count for iron since I don't take iron... you'll have to get that > one in some how differently.) > I drink a shake, pop my pills and I wait at least 20 minutes so they all > dissolve (hopefully) -- it is really the ONLY way I can remember right > now... > > I think has the same rule only she uses food -- pills with food / > food with pills -- kind of rule. > > I also have a something in every three hours rule (so I don't get over > hungry or under hungry) and 3 hours is enough spread time between pills -- > > You can make up your own rules that apply well for your life style -- > sounds silly but it works for me. > > hugz, > ~denise > > > Homepage: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Graduate-OSSG > > Unsubscribe: mailto:Graduate-OSSG-unsubscribe > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 15, 2002 Report Share Posted November 15, 2002 Yep, that's me. I can follow the rules that *I* make because I know I'm only out for my own benefit. m RE: Told You So!! > > Moral~~~ " no one is immune to poor health if they abuse the rules! > > Okay, everyone can tell me " I told you so " I deserve it! > > KJ, > No one deserves to be beat up -- getting into the habit of all this new > stuff is hard and some times takes a 2x4 for us to " GET IT " -- I have > trouble " remembering " all the stuff all the time so I made it " simple " for > me -- protein shake and pills and/or pills with protein shake -- if I drink > a shake and don't take pills it's against the rules and vice versa (this > doesn't count for iron since I don't take iron... you'll have to get that > one in some how differently.) > I drink a shake, pop my pills and I wait at least 20 minutes so they all > dissolve (hopefully) -- it is really the ONLY way I can remember right > now... > > I think has the same rule only she uses food -- pills with food / > food with pills -- kind of rule. > > I also have a something in every three hours rule (so I don't get over > hungry or under hungry) and 3 hours is enough spread time between pills -- > > You can make up your own rules that apply well for your life style -- > sounds silly but it works for me. > > hugz, > ~denise > > > Homepage: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Graduate-OSSG > > Unsubscribe: mailto:Graduate-OSSG-unsubscribe > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 15, 2002 Report Share Posted November 15, 2002 Yep, that's me. I can follow the rules that *I* make because I know I'm only out for my own benefit. m RE: Told You So!! > > Moral~~~ " no one is immune to poor health if they abuse the rules! > > Okay, everyone can tell me " I told you so " I deserve it! > > KJ, > No one deserves to be beat up -- getting into the habit of all this new > stuff is hard and some times takes a 2x4 for us to " GET IT " -- I have > trouble " remembering " all the stuff all the time so I made it " simple " for > me -- protein shake and pills and/or pills with protein shake -- if I drink > a shake and don't take pills it's against the rules and vice versa (this > doesn't count for iron since I don't take iron... you'll have to get that > one in some how differently.) > I drink a shake, pop my pills and I wait at least 20 minutes so they all > dissolve (hopefully) -- it is really the ONLY way I can remember right > now... > > I think has the same rule only she uses food -- pills with food / > food with pills -- kind of rule. > > I also have a something in every three hours rule (so I don't get over > hungry or under hungry) and 3 hours is enough spread time between pills -- > > You can make up your own rules that apply well for your life style -- > sounds silly but it works for me. > > hugz, > ~denise > > > Homepage: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Graduate-OSSG > > Unsubscribe: mailto:Graduate-OSSG-unsubscribe > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 15, 2002 Report Share Posted November 15, 2002 < > I was not deficient - barely (I was at the lowest end of normal). I got that way drinking 35 grams of protein a day, and eating another 100+ grams a day. When my levels kept dropping, I switched to drinking 70 - 90 grams, and eating 50, and the levels have come back up. Kate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 15, 2002 Report Share Posted November 15, 2002 < > I was not deficient - barely (I was at the lowest end of normal). I got that way drinking 35 grams of protein a day, and eating another 100+ grams a day. When my levels kept dropping, I switched to drinking 70 - 90 grams, and eating 50, and the levels have come back up. Kate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 15, 2002 Report Share Posted November 15, 2002 > Vitalady wrote:Ohhhhh, that's why it's dropping so badly. We don't absorb Fe sulfate at all. The new Rx one, is it Chromagen Forte? Or Trinsicon? Niferex Forte? Those are known to absorb well for us. But of course, not everything works for everyone. Once you get an absorbable iron, you shouldn't have all the side effects of the FS. It's the worse thing on the market. I hear the word & my guts cramp up! Former Anemia Victim, ----- ******************** Oh boy, can I ever attest to that! Can you say curl up in a ball on your bed pain??? Now I do the Niferex which, btw, also has folic acid and B12 in it, and no side effects at all. in NJ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 15, 2002 Report Share Posted November 15, 2002 > Vitalady wrote:Ohhhhh, that's why it's dropping so badly. We don't absorb Fe sulfate at all. The new Rx one, is it Chromagen Forte? Or Trinsicon? Niferex Forte? Those are known to absorb well for us. But of course, not everything works for everyone. Once you get an absorbable iron, you shouldn't have all the side effects of the FS. It's the worse thing on the market. I hear the word & my guts cramp up! Former Anemia Victim, ----- ******************** Oh boy, can I ever attest to that! Can you say curl up in a ball on your bed pain??? Now I do the Niferex which, btw, also has folic acid and B12 in it, and no side effects at all. in NJ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 15, 2002 Report Share Posted November 15, 2002 > Vitalady wrote:Ohhhhh, that's why it's dropping so badly. We don't absorb Fe sulfate at all. The new Rx one, is it Chromagen Forte? Or Trinsicon? Niferex Forte? Those are known to absorb well for us. But of course, not everything works for everyone. Once you get an absorbable iron, you shouldn't have all the side effects of the FS. It's the worse thing on the market. I hear the word & my guts cramp up! Former Anemia Victim, ----- ******************** Oh boy, can I ever attest to that! Can you say curl up in a ball on your bed pain??? Now I do the Niferex which, btw, also has folic acid and B12 in it, and no side effects at all. in NJ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 16, 2002 Report Share Posted November 16, 2002 In a message dated 11/16/2002 4:22:48 AM Pacific Standard Time, YahooDave@... writes: > But I've got to point out that > not everyone thinks it's a " fact " that all gastric bypass patients can't > use > any of the protein they eat. It has to vary from individual to individual > or I and many others would be " goners. You misread and/or misunderstood. I in no way was saying that everyone doesn't use any of the protein they eat, I said " I " didn't absorb what I was eating, thus I needed supplements and had crashed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 16, 2002 Report Share Posted November 16, 2002 In a message dated 11/16/2002 4:22:48 AM Pacific Standard Time, YahooDave@... writes: > But I've got to point out that > not everyone thinks it's a " fact " that all gastric bypass patients can't > use > any of the protein they eat. It has to vary from individual to individual > or I and many others would be " goners. You misread and/or misunderstood. I in no way was saying that everyone doesn't use any of the protein they eat, I said " I " didn't absorb what I was eating, thus I needed supplements and had crashed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 16, 2002 Report Share Posted November 16, 2002 : I'm truly sorry for the problems you've had. But I've got to point out that not everyone thinks it's a " fact " that all gastric bypass patients can't use any of the protein they eat. It has to vary from individual to individual or I and many others would be " goners. " I didn't supplement for a long time and only when I started lifting weights. My doctor says that it's not necessary to supplement at all and I think we've seen mileage varies greatly. Respectfully, in Austin RNY April 1998 Re: Re: Told You So!! > Hi Vicki, > When I became protein deficient, it wasn't necessarily because I wasn't eating enough protein, but the fact that I wasn't ABSORBING the protein due to the bypass - we don't break down the proteins from food because of the bypassing of the duodenum. I was " blind " to this fact, and so I was trying to eat protein first. > Take care, > B > Distal RNY 12/27/95 > 275/155 > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 16, 2002 Report Share Posted November 16, 2002 : I'm truly sorry for the problems you've had. But I've got to point out that not everyone thinks it's a " fact " that all gastric bypass patients can't use any of the protein they eat. It has to vary from individual to individual or I and many others would be " goners. " I didn't supplement for a long time and only when I started lifting weights. My doctor says that it's not necessary to supplement at all and I think we've seen mileage varies greatly. Respectfully, in Austin RNY April 1998 Re: Re: Told You So!! > Hi Vicki, > When I became protein deficient, it wasn't necessarily because I wasn't eating enough protein, but the fact that I wasn't ABSORBING the protein due to the bypass - we don't break down the proteins from food because of the bypassing of the duodenum. I was " blind " to this fact, and so I was trying to eat protein first. > Take care, > B > Distal RNY 12/27/95 > 275/155 > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 16, 2002 Report Share Posted November 16, 2002 In a message dated 11/15/02 3:20:47 PM Central Standard Time, lgallagher95830@... writes: << And stress? LOL There's not enough room in your inbox for the post it would take for me to tell you about the stress in my life. >> ---------------------------------- Stress. The number one killer of human beings. Find ways to kill IT and you will be healthier all the way around. It makes us overeat, develop all kinds of addictions (from food to drugs, alcohol, exercising compulsively, gambling, shopping. Anybody out there a workaholic? That's an addiction too. It will compromise your immune system, give you high blood pressure, heart disease, stroke, and just about any other disease or sickness known to man. If we'd known how to cope with stress at an early age, probably none of us would have eaten ourselves into the need for WLS. Carol A Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 16, 2002 Report Share Posted November 16, 2002 In a message dated 11/15/02 5:32:36 PM Central Standard Time, watnext@... writes: << Oh boy, can I ever attest to that! Can you say curl up in a ball on your bed pain??? Now I do the Niferex which, btw, also has folic acid and B12 in it, and no side effects at all. >> ------------------------------ The Trinsicon (I use the foltrin generic instead) also has folic acid and B12; also vit C and intrinsic factor. No side effects from that for me. My iron has been going UP (never low to begin with) since WLS, but I'm post-men so maybe I'll be able to quit taking it one of these days. Carol A Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 16, 2002 Report Share Posted November 16, 2002 In a message dated 11/15/02 5:32:36 PM Central Standard Time, watnext@... writes: << Oh boy, can I ever attest to that! Can you say curl up in a ball on your bed pain??? Now I do the Niferex which, btw, also has folic acid and B12 in it, and no side effects at all. >> ------------------------------ The Trinsicon (I use the foltrin generic instead) also has folic acid and B12; also vit C and intrinsic factor. No side effects from that for me. My iron has been going UP (never low to begin with) since WLS, but I'm post-men so maybe I'll be able to quit taking it one of these days. Carol A Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 16, 2002 Report Share Posted November 16, 2002 In a message dated 11/16/2002 4:16:00 PM Eastern Standard Time, Tuesdynite writes: > The Trinsicon (I use the foltrin generic instead) also has folic acid and > B12; also vit C and intrinsic factor. No side effects from that for me. My > iron has been going UP (never low to begin with) since WLS, but I'm > post-men so maybe I'll be able to quit taking it one of these days. ******************** Is that a scrip, too? The Niferex is. I'm peri-men, so I look forward to the day I can stop, too. in NJ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 16, 2002 Report Share Posted November 16, 2002 >> Stress. The number one killer of human beings. Find ways to kill IT and you will be healthier all the way around. Yesterday when I was at the treadmill, a lady got on the machine next to mine, and just as she was getting started, her cell phone rang. She missed the call trying to dig it out of her workout bag, but immediately called for the message and called the person back. In the next 5 minutes, her phone rang 3 more times. I was thinking to myself, Lady, you have too much stress in your life, and way too much to do, if you can't be on the treadmill for 5 minutes without having your phone ring again and again. I didn't say anything to her, just continued my walk, grateful that no one thinks I'm important enough to need a cell phone for work. I don't have one, but if I did, it would be OFF during my workout time -- that is MY time. ~~ Lyn G Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 16, 2002 Report Share Posted November 16, 2002 >> Stress. The number one killer of human beings. Find ways to kill IT and you will be healthier all the way around. Yesterday when I was at the treadmill, a lady got on the machine next to mine, and just as she was getting started, her cell phone rang. She missed the call trying to dig it out of her workout bag, but immediately called for the message and called the person back. In the next 5 minutes, her phone rang 3 more times. I was thinking to myself, Lady, you have too much stress in your life, and way too much to do, if you can't be on the treadmill for 5 minutes without having your phone ring again and again. I didn't say anything to her, just continued my walk, grateful that no one thinks I'm important enough to need a cell phone for work. I don't have one, but if I did, it would be OFF during my workout time -- that is MY time. ~~ Lyn G Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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