pain

[Guest guest]

I do. I don't know if it is caused by anything else, either. Mine is getting

better as I chelate.

Carmen

chantal wrote:

> I was wondring how many mercury toxic people have been diagnosed with

Fibromyalgia or have Fibro symptoms?

> Chantal

[Guest guest]

Since I have increased thyroid meds I am not in pain very often but if I do too

much of anything I end up feeling very sore and aching all over.There has been a

connection established between thyroid and Fibor but the other connection is the

mercury thyroid.So if mercury is detoxed then the thyroid might be able to

function normally again and the clear up the Fibro.

Chantal

Re: Re: Pain

I also have fibro and it can be there one day and the next it is not

bothering me. I am also stiff, one day very, next day not too. It is often

dependent on how much I did the day before. SJ

[Guest guest]

I am locked out of my personal mailbox and I don't remember if I mentioned it,

but your post about thyroid, I experienced the same thing with low thyroid

level. Muscel cramping and pain as well as fatique.

What I wanted to mention, was an experience with bone

pain. I am a female and found my progesterone was very low compared to my

estrogen. My doctor put me on

natural progesterone cream. If anyone is getting bone

pain it can be a symptom of calcium being leached from

the bone making up for the lack of supply to the other

parts of the body. Leads to ostheoporosis. Progesteron helps put calcium back

into your bones.

You can supplement your calcium but this doesn't mean

your body can put it where it needs it. Progesterone

is a big help here.

It is making me think though, does this imbalance have

anything to do with having a toxic metal in my system? I bet it is a very good

chain reaction.

Calcium and magnesium balance is important for ridding

of muscle pain/burning symptoms. But anyone having

bone pain, take it serious.

Liz D

Re: Pain

>

> I think the burning is mercury but the other pain I don't know unless it is

just muscle pain which I have also ,although this is much better since

increasing my thyroid dose.

> Chantal

--

[Guest guest]

Hi Liz

I believe I had bone pain also, especially in the hips.This is the first place I

start to hurt. I also had a bone resorption test done....tells you how fast you

are peeing out your bones and I was loosing fast.Part of this may have been

menopause but I read that oxidative stress which would be caused by metal(I

believe) causes osteoporosis. I have been using progesterone cream for a long

time and I'm hoping it will help rebuild any bone loss.

Chantal

Re: Pain

>

> I think the burning is mercury but the other pain I don't know unless it is

just muscle pain which I have also ,although this is much better since

increasing my thyroid dose.

> Chantal

--

[Guest guest]

> Since I have increased thyroid meds I am not in pain very often but

if I do too much of anything I end up feeling very sore and aching all

over.There has been a connection established between thyroid and Fibor

but the other connection is the mercury thyroid.So if mercury is

detoxed then the thyroid might be able to function normally again and

the clear up the Fibro.

> Chantal

Hi Chantal, I believe that BOTH fibro and thyroid malfunctioning

can be related (in many cases) to mercury poisoning.

You might find a post of Andy's on the topic of interest---

look for one from Andy about an adult:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Autism-Mercury/files/LOVE_LETTERS

oh-- the one I'm thinking of it this one:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Autism-Mercury/message/30131

Also, in this file:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Autism-Mercury/files/ANDY_INDEX

there is an item about bad reactions to hydrogenated fats--

inducing fibro reactions in a (specific) adult (Andy, I think).

Look in the section about " food " issues, if you are interested.

Moria

[Guest guest]

Hi Liz,

> What I wanted to mention, was an experience with bone

> pain. I am a female and found my progesterone was very low compared

to my estrogen. My doctor put me on

> natural progesterone cream. If anyone is getting bone

> pain it can be a symptom of calcium being leached from

> the bone making up for the lack of supply to the other

> parts of the body. Leads to ostheoporosis. Progesteron helps put

calcium back into your bones.

> You can supplement your calcium but this doesn't mean

> your body can put it where it needs it. Progesterone

> is a big help here.

>

> It is making me think though, does this imbalance have

> anything to do with having a toxic metal in my system? I bet it is

a very good chain reaction.

Mercury toxicity causes an inability to process minerals

well, in most people. You can read more about this, here:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Autism-Mercury/files/Counting%2BRules

It is called " impaired mineral transport " .

I had a hair test done in about Jan 2000 (when I had just

started chelating), which showed I had VERY high calcium,

in my hair. (I think over twice the high end of the ref

range, but I don't have the test results with me right now.)

I had another hair test done after several months of

chelation. It shows a NORMAL level for calcium, and

ALL minerals are now in the " normal " ref range, except

for EXTREMELY low lithium. In other words, I now have

" very normal " mineral transport.

I believe the EXTREME high calcium is very common for merc

toxic people. I take it to mean my body was not absorbing

it -- which was already my theory. (Long story!)

best,

Moria

[Guest guest]

>

> It is making me think though, does this imbalance have

> anything to do with having a toxic metal in my system? I bet it is a very

good chain reaction.

> Calcium and magnesium balance is important for ridding

> of muscle pain/burning symptoms. But anyone having

> bone pain, take it serious.

Liz,

Mercury in the body causes disruptions in mineral transport. If a mercury toxic

person has a hair test done, it will usually show the essential minerals to be

high or low. I have

had hair tests done for about 6 years and all of them showed very high calcium,

low lithium, and only one or two of the other minerals even close to normal. It

is also interesting

that none of the tests showed mercury. I used to think I was not having a

problem with my amalgams for this reason.

It is actually more than calcium and magnesium that need to be in balance.

Sodium and potassium are related to the necessary balance of these minerals.

Not only does progesterone

cream help, but pretty high doses of vitamin D can help, too. I think that

boron helps to keep calcium in the bones.

Carmen

[Guest guest]

One other comment. I read that osteoporosis cna be caused by oxidative stress.I

think mercury can cause oxidative stress.Any thought on this?

Chantal

Re: Pain

>

> It is making me think though, does this imbalance have

> anything to do with having a toxic metal in my system? I bet it is a very

good chain reaction.

> Calcium and magnesium balance is important for ridding

> of muscle pain/burning symptoms. But anyone having

> bone pain, take it serious.

Liz,

Mercury in the body causes disruptions in mineral transport. If a mercury

toxic person has a hair test done, it will usually show the essential minerals

to be high or low. I have

had hair tests done for about 6 years and all of them showed very high

calcium, low lithium, and only one or two of the other minerals even close to

normal. It is also interesting

that none of the tests showed mercury. I used to think I was not having a

problem with my amalgams for this reason.

It is actually more than calcium and magnesium that need to be in balance.

Sodium and potassium are related to the necessary balance of these minerals.

Not only does progesterone

cream help, but pretty high doses of vitamin D can help, too. I think that

boron helps to keep calcium in the bones.

Carmen

[Guest guest]

I also have fibro and it can be there one day and the next it is not

bothering me. I am also stiff, one day very, next day not too. It is often

dependent on how much I did the day before. SJ

[i am stiff every other day too! For me, it is not related to food.

exercise, sleep.....I cannot figure out what in the hell drives the

pattern...when I first got my amalgams out, I was *stiff* EVERY day, then it

gradually went to every other day - what makes me stiff sometimes is sulfur

methionine foods which all seems to be wrapped up in histamine somehow

(methionine lowers histamine)...I am on histamine supplementation in the

form of Prokarin - when I eat sulfur, my guts flip out and all the histamine

disappears. When I did DMSA, I thought it would rip my guts out...a friend

with MS is having the same gut reaction to sulfur too and she too responds

to histamine.....I also cannot tolerate methy donors, they make me feel like

I am going crazy.

[Guest guest]

I'm stiffest when I eat too many carbs. They also cause anxiety and

depression. It's night and day when I eat them. Salicylates and

" sulfur " foods make me itch.

>I also have fibro and it can be there one day and the next it is not

>bothering me. I am also stiff, one day very, next day not too. It is often

>dependent on how much I did the day before. SJ

>

>

>[i am stiff every other day too! For me, it is not related to food.

>exercise, sleep.....I cannot figure out what in the hell drives the

>pattern...when I first got my amalgams out, I was *stiff* EVERY day, then it

>gradually went to every other day - what makes me stiff sometimes is sulfur

>methionine foods which all seems to be wrapped up in histamine somehow

>(methionine lowers histamine)...I am on histamine supplementation in the

>form of Prokarin - when I eat sulfur, my guts flip out and all the histamine

>disappears. When I did DMSA, I thought it would rip my guts out...a friend

>with MS is having the same gut reaction to sulfur too and she too responds

>to histamine.....I also cannot tolerate methy donors, they make me feel like

>I am going crazy.

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks for filling in with the additional important information. My hair

test showed most all of my

minerals very low and I don't relate it to my progesterone level, that is doing

ok. I still suspect

a metal problem, I suppose I will look into the urin

testing. I don't know if this doctor will be conserned to do one or not. The

fact of the matter is

that I taste metal in my mouth during the two weeks

before my period. This suggests something, doesn't

it? Anyone else like this?

Liz D

Re: Pain

>

> Mercury in the body causes disruptions in mineral transport. If a mercury

toxic person has a hair test done, it will usually show the essential minerals

to be high or low. I have

> had hair tests done for about 6 years and all of them showed very high

calcium, low lithium, and only one or two of the other minerals even close to

normal. It is also interesting

> that none of the tests showed mercury. I used to think I was not having a

problem with my amalgams for this reason.

>

> It is actually more than calcium and magnesium that need to be in balance.

Sodium and potassium are related to the necessary balance of these minerals.

Not only does progesterone

> cream help, but pretty high doses of vitamin D can help, too. I think that

boron helps to keep calcium in the bones.

>

> Carmen

--

[Guest guest]

Speaking of itching....I'm about to go crazy with this rash type itching over my

chest arms and shoulders.Anyone else have this type of itching?

Chantal

RE: Re: Pain

I'm stiffest when I eat too many carbs. They also cause anxiety and

depression. It's night and day when I eat them. Salicylates and

" sulfur " foods make me itch.

>I also have fibro and it can be there one day and the next it is not

>bothering me. I am also stiff, one day very, next day not too. It is often

>dependent on how much I did the day before. SJ

>

>

>[i am stiff every other day too! For me, it is not related to food.

>exercise, sleep.....I cannot figure out what in the hell drives the

>pattern...when I first got my amalgams out, I was *stiff* EVERY day, then it

>gradually went to every other day - what makes me stiff sometimes is sulfur

>methionine foods which all seems to be wrapped up in histamine somehow

>(methionine lowers histamine)...I am on histamine supplementation in the

>form of Prokarin - when I eat sulfur, my guts flip out and all the histamine

>disappears. When I did DMSA, I thought it would rip my guts out...a friend

>with MS is having the same gut reaction to sulfur too and she too responds

>to histamine.....I also cannot tolerate methy donors, they make me feel like

>I am going crazy.

>

[Guest guest]

Chantal, mercury does cause oxidative stress. I don't know if oxidative stress

causes osteoporosis or not. Have you read any of Bernard Windham's stuff? It

is a bit technical, but he

did a lot of research. This is his website.

http://www.home.earthlink.net/~berniew1/

The last I looked, he has stuff on other toxics, too.

Carmen

chantal wrote:

> One other comment. I read that osteoporosis cna be caused by oxidative

stress.I think mercury can cause oxidative stress.Any thought on this?

> Chantal

[Guest guest]

> Thanks for filling in with the additional important

information. My hair test showed most all of my minerals very low

and I don't relate it to my progesterone level, that is doing ok. I

still suspect a metal problem, I suppose I will look into the urin

testing. I don't know if this doctor will be conserned to do one or

not. The fact of the matter is that I taste metal in my mouth during

the two weeks before my period. This suggests something, doesn't

it? Anyone else like this?

>

> Liz D

Dear Liz,

I started tasting metal when one type of metal was put over another

type of metal. A crown that probably had nickel in it was put over a

silver filling which had mercury, zinc and other metals. There was

decay under the mercury filling. When the crown was put on top of the

silver filling, it caused the mercury to start leaching out of the

filling even faster and caused my tooth to decay faster. My bilogical

dentist told me that after 5 years that mercury fillings start having

decay under them. He has taken out 6 fillings so far and many of them

have decay underneath.

When I experienced this tating of metal again right before

Thanksgiving, I took off to find a dentist and drove several hours

before I even knew a dentist would see me. I had just been reading in

Andy Cutler's book, that when you are tasing metal you need to do

something as soon as possible. I almost lost the tooth, because the

decay was getting close to the root of that tooth. As far as WHEN I

tasted metal, it would just come and go. If you are tasting metal you

are having a chemical and electrical reaction in your mouth that is

destroying your teeth and the rest of your body.

You do not have to have a positive test for mercury in order to have

amalgam or harmful metals removed. My test did not show mercury, but

I am having analgam removed anyway because of the symptoms and the

tasting of metal making me sick. My biological dentist told me that

if I would do a challenge test with DMPS that it would definitely

show mercury in my urine. But I don't think I am going to do it

because I am afraid of DMPS and what it might do to my body.

In one post you were talking about your spine burning. Well my brain

burned.

After exposure to mercury vapor after a dentist drilled into my

filling without protecting me from the vapors, I had symptoms of low

thyroid even though TSH test showed borderline high thyroid. (Thyroid

tests are not accurate when mercury is in the body.) I was very

spacey and my alternative doctor told me the mercury had messed up my

hormones and my thyroid. After he put me on both estriol and

prosterone, some of my spaciness left. So the symptoms you are

listing indicate to me that you have a problem with metals in your

mouth. Get it out!

Just concentrate now on finding a good competent dentist who will do

a good job. Pray and have others pray for you that you will find the

right dentist. Get a compatibility test to ensure that you put the

right material for your body back in your mouth. Read Hal Huggins

book IT'S ALL IN YOUR HEAD to make sure you do the procedure right.

You can order it from www.addall.com or Hal Huggins' website

www.hugnet.com. Huggins will also send you a list of dentists if you

will call his office.

Marie Flowers

> Re: Pain

>

>

> >

> > Mercury in the body causes disruptions in mineral transport. If

a mercury toxic person has a hair test done, it will usually show the

essential minerals to be high or low. I have

> > had hair tests done for about 6 years and all of them showed very

high calcium, low lithium, and only one or two of the other minerals

even close to normal. It is also interesting

> > that none of the tests showed mercury. I used to think I was not

having a problem with my amalgams for this reason.

> >

> > It is actually more than calcium and magnesium that need to be in

balance. Sodium and potassium are related to the necessary balance

of these minerals. Not only does progesterone

> > cream help, but pretty high doses of vitamin D can help, too. I

think that boron helps to keep calcium in the bones.

> >

> > Carmen

>

> --

[Guest guest]

Tasting metal is something that I also experience. If you taste metal, it can

mean heavy metal toxicity. That is mainstream (whatever that is)

symptomology. I also tasted metal, also have sometimes 2 periods per month,

or just have had continuous period for up to 2 months or more.

Cytochrome P450 detoxes most xenobiotics and that is usually compromised in

CFS/MCS and we do also have to remember we are a group found to have stealth

adapted viruses, upon which hormone receptors have been found. Although this

is rather off the topic, I doubt anyone has metal problems without

compounding problems such as stealth adapted viruses. SJ

[Guest guest]

> Speaking of itching....I'm about to go crazy with this rash type

itching over my chest arms and shoulders.Anyone else have this type of

itching?

> Chantal

Hi Chantal--

You are chelating, right?

I had skin allergies BEFORE I started chelating, but it only

caused problems very infrequently. After I started chelating

I had nearly-continuous problems with it. I eventually heard

(on autism-mercury list) that mercury can cause skin to be

hyper-sensitive. This made sense to me!

I also think it MAY be related to yeast--- but I'm not sure.

I have been treating myself for yeast much of the time for

past couple of months. The skin stuff seems to have been

LARGELY better (not completely) for longer than that.

I thought it was because I am not as toxic or not detoxing

as much. Or it could be the yeast treatments. Or it could

be something else entirely.

I've tried a lot of different rememdies for skin allergies.

The ones that work best for me are:

1. Chinese herbal formula from my accupuncturist

2. running very hot (but not burining) water over the

itchy areas. Alternate with cold so as not to overhead.

Repeat. I have taken 2 or 3 alternating hot and cold

showers a day at times just to be able to " cope " .

best,

Moria

[Guest guest]

More than just viruses. We are probably hoarding bacteria, mycoplasmas, and

parasites. When the immune system gets put down with the mercury, all of these

things have a good time setting up house.

Carmen

jannarone@... wrote:

> Tasting metal is something that I also experience. If you taste metal, it can

> mean heavy metal toxicity. That is mainstream (whatever that is)

> symptomology. I also tasted metal, also have sometimes 2 periods per month,

> or just have had continuous period for up to 2 months or more.

>

> Cytochrome P450 detoxes most xenobiotics and that is usually compromised in

> CFS/MCS and we do also have to remember we are a group found to have stealth

> adapted viruses, upon which hormone receptors have been found. Although this

> is rather off the topic, I doubt anyone has metal problems without

> compounding problems such as stealth adapted viruses. SJ

>

>

[Guest guest]

Can you send me some links on the information you just mentioned? I never

hear of it and would like to know more. Thanks

Liz D

>

> Cytochrome P450 detoxes most xenobiotics and that is usually compromised

in

> CFS/MCS and we do also have to remember we are a group found to have

stealth

> adapted viruses, upon which hormone receptors have been found. Although

this

> is rather off the topic, I doubt anyone has metal problems without

> compounding problems such as stealth adapted viruses. SJ

>

>

[Guest guest]

Can you send me some links on the information you just mentioned? I never

hear of it and would like to know more. Thanks

Liz D

>

> Cytochrome P450 detoxes most xenobiotics and that is usually compromised

in

> CFS/MCS and we do also have to remember we are a group found to have

stealth

> adapted viruses, upon which hormone receptors have been found. Although

this

> is rather off the topic, I doubt anyone has metal problems without

> compounding problems such as stealth adapted viruses. SJ

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi,

Just wondering if the progestron creme you use is

water based? If so what is the brand and is it over

the counter? I heard that the fat soluable type gets

stored in body fat and that may not be such a good

thing.

so I would like to know if anyone knows of an over

the counter water soluable brand.

Thanks,

Beason

--- chantal chantalh@...> wrote:

> Hi Liz

> I believe I had bone pain also, especially in the

> hips.This is the first place I start to hurt. I also

> had a bone resorption test done....tells you how

> fast you are peeing out your bones and I was loosing

> fast.Part of this may have been menopause but I read

> that oxidative stress which would be caused by

> metal(I believe) causes osteoporosis. I have been

> using progesterone cream for a long time and I'm

> hoping it will help rebuild any bone loss.

> Chantal

> Re: Pain

>

>

> >

> > I think the burning is mercury but the other

> pain I don't know unless it is just muscle pain

> which I have also ,although this is much better

> since increasing my thyroid dose.

> > Chantal

>

> --

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi

The one I use is ProGest and it is made with:

aloe vera gel in distilled water

d-alpha tocopherol

Mixed tocophelols

Cetyl alcohol

almond oil

Octyl palmitate

Panthenol

Peg8

Stearate

Glycerin

Progesterone

Polysorbate 60

Hyaluronic acid

Oil of Lemon

Keratin

Carbomer940

Grapefruit seed extract.

Where did you hear about it being stored in fat tissue?

Chantal

Re: Pain

>

>

> >

> > I think the burning is mercury but the other

> pain I don't know unless it is just muscle pain

> which I have also ,although this is much better

> since increasing my thyroid dose.

> > Chantal

>

> --

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

The one I use is Pro-Gest by Emerita. Doctor doesn't

want me to try any other brand because they put additional

herbs in it. Can become confusing if you begin filling

not good, is it the dosage from the cream or the herbs in it.

I get mine at the heath food store and it is available on the

web as well.

Ingredients. Aloe Vera Gel in Distilled water,

d-alpha Tocopherol and mixed tocopherols,

Cetyl Alcohol, Almond oil, Octyl Palmitate,

Panthenol, Peg 8 Stearate, Glycerin,

USP Progesterone, Polysorbate 60,

Hyaluronic acid, Oil of Lemon, Keratin,

Carbomer 940, Grapefruit Seed Extract.

LIZ D

> [Original Message]

>

> To: adult-metal-chelation >

> Date: 12/11/01 3:06:22 PM

> Subject: Re: Pain

>

> Hi,

>

> Just wondering if the progestron creme you use is

> water based? If so what is the brand and is it over

> the counter? I heard that the fat soluable type gets

> stored in body fat and that may not be such a good

> thing.

> so I would like to know if anyone knows of an over

> the counter water soluable brand.

>

> Thanks,

>

> Beason

> --- chantal chantalh@...> wrote:

> > Hi Liz

> > I believe I had bone pain also, especially in the

> > hips.This is the first place I start to hurt. I also

> > had a bone resorption test done....tells you how

> > fast you are peeing out your bones and I was loosing

> > fast.Part of this may have been menopause but I read

> > that oxidative stress which would be caused by

> > metal(I believe) causes osteoporosis. I have been

> > using progesterone cream for a long time and I'm

> > hoping it will help rebuild any bone loss.

> > Chantal

> > Re: Pain