- sleep stuff; Janice - have you checked?

[Guest guest]

Date: Sat, 1 Dec 2001 12:07:59 -0500

Subject: RE: My brief bit; Sleepless; shrink/neuro x-treme newbie

Greetings Aletta!

My apologies on the delay in the reply to your request for my thoughts.

Things have been very interesting round these parts.

A well considered answer is always worth waiting for.

Anyway, you wondered:

> : Rather than redo the research you have obviously

> done, , help me with this. One year ago (+-) I

> ceased being able to sleep at all, never sleepy, drowsy

> or sedated, endlessly wakeful (technicians did spot and

> unceasing Beta wave in my EEG), until I take sleeping

> medication, then I stay drowsy to asleep until I've had

> enough CNS stimulant to return to wakefulness, what is

> at work/or not here?

Okay, let's do some vocabulary building to answer your question.

First, we all go through 4 stages of sleep - ranging from light to deep,

where alpha, beta, gamma, and delta brain waves are present. This is also

referred to as four stages of sleep (Stage I, II, III, and IV). At least we

should cycle through these stages of sleep. The following diagram provides

a good example of the cycling through the various stages of sleep:

http://www.talkaboutsleep.com/basics/images/diagram1.gif

The following site (from which the previous page comes) provides a great

introduction to sleep information.

http://www.talkaboutsleep.com/basics/sleep_intro.htm

http://www.talkaboutsleep.com/basics/Sleep_Understanding_NINDS.htm

Sometimes we fail to cycle through sleep properly. For example, persistent

alpha wave intrusion into slow delta wave sleep results in feeling sore all

over and sometimes feeling more tired than when going to bed.

However, in your case, you seem to have beta wave intrusion throughout your

sleep. Not sure if this is linked to any specific problem, but clearly

shows the mechanism the body uses to cycle through sleep stages is not

working properly. (Duh!) Also note, some older terms refer to beta rhythms

as a part of wakefulness, which also seems to be an issue for you, wouldn't

you agree?

But more important for you is the question: " what is at work/or not here? "

That is, in regards to your inability to fall asleep normally. The section

titled " What Determines When We Sleep? " from the above site provides a good

overview of this.

http://www.talkaboutsleep.com/disorders/insomnia/unwanted_wakefulness6.htm

Normally, our sleep cycle is part of our body's circadian rhythm. This is

the process of biological variations over 24 hours, coordinated by the

suprachiasmatic nuclei in the brain, which regulate body temperature,

hormone secretions, and other physiological functions .. including body

temperature.

Might I suggest two different tools to help with your sleep.

First use of hypnotics (drugs to knock you out) generally are not encouraged

over a long term .. but may be necessary. Instead you may want to try

Trazodone (now in generic format .. cheaper). This is an anti-depressant,

which in less than clinical dosages (not enough to act as an

anti-depressant) causes a deeper and more restful sleep. Most doctors start

with 50mg or so, about an hour before bedtime. It works for many different

people. Other anti-depressants can also help. Also, be certain to review

your other medications with your doctors, since timing of those medications

can interfere with your normal sleep cycle.

The Trazodone has been tried, did not work.

Second, there has been some research that indicates the temperature of the

hands (of all things) is important for the sleep cycle. Since MSA

interferes with body temperature, this can play havoc on the sleep cycle.

I've learned that tucking my hands under the covers before trying to sleep

tends to help me fall asleep more readily. However, you may also want to

try placing some light gloves. Place them on your hands fifteen to thirty

minutes before trying to sleep. Again, this is just based on some reading

I've done of some current research.

That's fascinating. When I stayed at my daughter's, her Living room where

I slept was very cold. So I wore my Little stretch gloves witht the tips

cut off (I always wear them typing, seems to help), and I did sleep better.

Some nights I wrap my wrists in tensor bandages and noted improvement then

also. Just something I did, not sure why, perhaps because the gloves

proved helpful. I'll now do it religiously.

Third, if you have problems with orthostatic hypotension (OH), then you

probably should consider raising the head of your bed for sleep. This may

be a factor that impacts your sleep.

That's something I have now done for the last two years, it stopped my

waking with a gasp and my heart pounds less, than whenever I lie flat.

However, to get to the bottom of your issue, my guess ... and it is just

that ... is that the same degenerative process that impacts movement,

balance, and autonomic functions also impacts our ability to sleep. At the

very least, our circadian rhythm helps govern various autonomic cycles (body

temperature as an example). Failure in the autonomic nervous system may

disrupt the circadian rhythm. This is just speculation, but I think a

reasonable hypothesis.

Anyway, hope this helps.

Regards,

=jbf=

B. Fisher

Thanks, I will check out the sites you listed. If we could only find

the reset button in out brains. SDS is a lot like your brain on " Windows " .

My OT is bringing some foam wedges for my couch to keep me from slipping

down on the sheets while asleep.

___________________________________

Date: Sat, 1 Dec 2001 16:56:12 -0800 (PST)

Subject: Re: I just wonder?

hello i was wondering,you were saying that warren

feels like that his head is going toexplode.is it

hearting him.i know to day when i was out with my

daughter i was telling her that my head feels so

weird,i told her that it feel like thatb it alsofeels

like that it is going to explode also,but it doesn,t

hurt.i told her that sometimes it feels like something

is moving in theren everytime that i move my

neck,isn,t that weird.does he have that are is it just

me.

Janice, have you had your C1 and C2 vertebrae checked by a specialist, if

the pain changes when you move this can be much of all your problems?

There are several spinal abnormalities that have symptoms very similar to

MSA, and it is affected by movement.

______________________________

aletta mes, vancouver, bc canada

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Site: http://wwwaletta.0catch.com