L-Carnosine

[Guest guest]

My son is five years old and weighs 40 pounds. He takes two 500mg

capsules twice a day.

[Guest guest]

> I was wondering if anyone had any thoughts on this, particularly dosage if

> you happen to be using L-Carnosine.

I used Carnosine from my local health food store. It helped one of my kids with

behavior issues for about 3-4 months. Did nothing for

the other 2 kids I tried it with. As I remember it, it came as 500 mg capsules

and I gave my son 1/2 capsule either 1 or 2 times per

day.

Dana

[Guest guest]

,

I am including some links at the end that pretty much sum up what is

out there about L Carnosine.

Carnosine is a 100 % natural substance, a so-called dipeptide, formed

of two amino acids (ß-alanyl-L-histidine). It is often called a

neuropeptide due to its brainprotective properties.

Carnosine is found naturally in healthy muscles, hearth, brain,

liver, kidneys and other tissues. The muscles contain about 20 µmol/g

dry weight. (The more meat contains carnosine, the longer is its

shelf life, as carnosine - a superb antioxidant - prevents it from

going rancid.)

Carnosine acts together with other biological antioxidants, e.g.,

vitamin E and vitamin C, zinc and selenium, and it spares their

consumption in the tissues. Persons with latent vitamin E deficiency

consume carnosine more than normally. [it is stressed that the intake

of vitamin E is deficient in a major part of the general population,

as suggested by epidemiological studies world wide.]

In the human body, the enzyme carnosine synthetase, forms carnosine

from the amino acids alanine and histidine. This reaction occurs

mainly in the brain and in the musclulature. Another group of

enzymes, called dipeptidases or carnosinases, in turn inactivate

carnosine in the blood and other tissues.

Meat is the main dietary source of carnosine. High doses of carnosine

are necessary for therapeutic effect because the body naturally

degrades carnosine with the enzyme carnosinase. Absorption of

carnosine from food is 30 to 70 % (depending on the amount of various

amino acids in the meal) and that of pure L-carnosine greater than

70%. A greater part of the absorption occurs in the small intestine

(jejunum, but not in the ileum). From the blood carnosine moves into

the muscles, brain and other tissues. The human plasma does not

contain measurable quantities of carnosine, in other words a blood

test does not detect a possible deficiensy state.

Austism patients have been shown to have higher levels of free oxygen

radicals like Nitric Oxide (NO) than healthy individuals. Individuals

with Autism have also been found to have lower blood levels of

antioxidants, which can reduce the damaging effects of free radicals.

As antioxidants help protect cells against damage from free radicals,

a diet that is high in antioxidant rich foods, as well as antioxidant

supplements, may be sensible for Austism patients.

L-Carnosine, a dipeptide, can enhance frontal lobe function or be

neuroprotective. It can also correlate with gamma-aminobutyric acid

(GABA)-homocarnosine interaction, with possible anticonvulsive

effects. In the first study, 31 children with autistic spectrum

disorders were investigated in an 8-week, double-blinded study to

determine if 800 mg L-carnosine daily would result in observable

changes versus placebo.

Outcome measures were the Childhood Autism Rating Scale, the Gilliam

Autism Rating Scale, the Expressive and Receptive One-Word Picture

Vocabulary tests, and Clinical Global Impressions of Change.

Children on placebo did not show statistically significant changes.

After 8 weeks on L-carnosine, children showed statistically

significant improvements on the Gilliam Autism Rating Scale (total

score and the Behavior, Socialization, and Communication subscales)

and the Receptive One-Word Picture Vocabulary test (all P < .05).

Improved trends were noted on other outcome measures. Although the

mechanism of action of L-carnosine is not well understood, it may

enhance neurologic function, perhaps in the enterorhinal or temporal

cortex.

L Carnosine has been around for a number of years and has been

studied and used for a variety of problems:

Carnosine therapy: Year:

Polyarthritis 1935

Gastric and duodenal ulcer 1936

Wound healing 1940

Hypertension 1941

Antibiotic 1969

Anti-inflammatory 1971, 1986

Adrenal cortex effect 1976

Sleep apnea 1977

Trauma 1980

Immunologic effects 1986,1989

Seizures 1989

Coronary heart disease 1989

Cataract 1989

Anti-carcinogenic 1989

Prevention of radiation damage 1990

ADHD, Autistic Spectrum Disorder, epilepsy, other neurological &

psychiatric 2001

Since excess is excreted from the body and it is a naturally occuring

enzyme in the body, there have not been reports of side effects and

there are no long term health side effects. Though the studies to

date on treating autism with L Carnosine are fairly small, the

funding has come through for larger studies over longer periods of

time. In the mean time, many doctors have determined that it is safe

(as the body does not retain more than it needs and it is naturally

occuring within the body) and have encouraged patients and parents of

patients dealing with autism/autistic spectrum disorders to try it.

We did, and it has made a difference. Some that I know did, and have

also reported a notable difference. The worst that can happen is that

someone tries it and it doesn't work!

Anyway, I have rambled long enough... Here are some links!!!

http://www.carn-aware.com/aarticle.pdf (found one!)

http://www.carn-aware.com/aarticle.html (same thing, different format)

http://www.1stvitality.co.uk/az/carnosine/carnosine_neurological_brain

..htm

(towards the end)

http://www.1stvitality.co.uk/health/autism/250301_carnosine_supplement

ation_children_autistic_spectrum_.htm

http://www.1stvitality.co.uk/az/carnosine/l-carnosine_pharmacology.htm

http://www.enzymestuff.com/rtcarnosine.htm

http://autismcoach.com/Carnosine%20Study.htm

http://www.wizardofeyez.com/carnosine.html

http://www.geocities.com/fishstep/carnosine.html

http://www.autismhelpforyou.com/New%20Options%20For%20The%

20Autistic.htm

http://www.carn-aware.com/faq.html (Q & A put out by one particular

pharmaceutical company... Tyler currently takes 800 mg of L-Carnosine

a day

with a multivitamin rather than taking this one that has it all

combined. He

started with 400 mg and we noted quite a difference prior to his last

13

inches and 60 pounds of growth... Now he just needs more due to

size!!!)

http://www.kirkmanlabs.com/products/amino_acids/l_carnosine/l_carnosin

e277_90.html (a children's multivitamin works!)

http://www.greatvistachemicals.com/amino_acids/l-carnosine.html (an

explanation of what it is)

http://groups.msn.com/AUTISMCHATANDSHARE/lcarnosine.msnw

http://www.speech-express.com/alternative-therapy/carnosine.html

http://www.lef.org/protocols/abstracts/abstr-124.html

http://www.cerebra.org.uk/CD%20Project/autismcontempbib.html

http://remedyfind.com/rem.asp?ID=7186

http://www.althealth.co.uk/services/info/ailments/autism1.php

I hope each link fits on one line. If not, you may have to cut and

paste both " lines of the link " to get it to take you to the site!!!

Good luck!

~hugs~

Rabecca

PS... We get ours from GNC. Tyler takes a children's chewable

multivitamin with it to increase absorption. It can be taken with or

without food. If your child has trouble swollowing capsiles, they can

be opened and the contents sprinkled on food or as Tyler used to do

it, put in a medicine cup with a teaspoon of water. He notices the

difference even more than we do and won't go without!

[Guest guest]

,

I thought you might also be interested in seeing this!

Rabecca

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Taken from Autism Awakening Newsletter - October 9, 2002

http://autismawakeninginia.bizland.com/autismworldnewspaper/id16.html

Part of the article is reproduced below:

Natural protein called l-carnosine. Dr. Chez of Lake Bluff,

Ill., has recently completed the first study of the substance.

" It affected language, receptive language, eye contact,

communication, all of which are things which children with autism

have big gaps with, " Chez said.

Over an eight-week period, Chez's study showed that carnosine

improved behavior and communication by 16 percent. Social interaction

improved by 27 percent and, in just four weeks, parents reported an

overall improvement that more than doubled

through the length of the study.

More and more research shows that the frontal lobes and the temporal

lobes in the brain control emotion, epileptic activity, cognitive,

expressive speech, and abstract thinking.

Chez said I-carnozine apparently works in the front part of the

brain. So far, he said he's used it on about 1,000 children, with a

90 percent success rate.

On some children, the change has been dramatic.

More studies will be needed to confirm the results of Chez's study.

For more information contact Dr. Chez at (847) 735-0901.

[Guest guest]

How exactly would L carnosine do this?

Sounds Bizzarre to me

better to have good stores of Vitamin C & E and Selenium on board IMHO

Mandi in Dorset

I have been advised to use some to prevent the redistribution of metals after the three day stint on ALA.

[Guest guest]

Joy,

We use carn-aware, which is L-carnosine with a bit of zinc. I think it

helped kick start my son's verbalising. Initially I think he went a tad

hyper on it, so we've left it at half dose - we need to up it to 400mg next.

I tried it out following a recommendation and researching the Dr.Chez study.

I haven't ever heard about it stopping metal distribution though - do you

have any info on how this occurs or reference studies?

Stuart

>From: joymroscoe@...

>Reply-Desperate4DMPSEurope

>Desperate4DMPSEurope

>Subject: L-Carnosine

>Date: Mon, 16 May 2005 07:07:47 EDT

>

>Hi all

>Does anyone have experience of L-Carnosine??

>I have been advised to use some to prevent the redistribution of metals

>after the three day stint on ALA.

>I have found an article by someone called Dr Chez who claims it enhances

>social skills in autistic children.

>Thanks,

>Joy

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[Guest guest]

Redistribution is redistribution and the end result of starting anything LOL. I think the antoxodinats help the process whats left, Seleni8um helps to bind it. We haven;t really had big ssues. Usually a bit tired first day off and can be hyper with over-tiredness but nothing bad.

If you see worrying issues on stopping a round I would try going for longer. I only ever got up to 6 days with the orals before faiting from my own tiredness. It didn;t seem to make any difference in Sams case but I have efriend whose child also had CP and his cramps got worse coming off 3 days I think, she used to do 7 on and 7 off and he got better and better. He uses FC and typed out I want more chelation - bless him!

As the ALA dose got bigger than the DMSA - at around 50 rounds we were doing 50mg ALA/25mg DMSA per dose and he didn't get tired. He was very switched on this weekend with ALA and today had brilliant day at school (again!)

Mandi

I thought redistribution was a major issue whatever you do - do c & e reduce it? Any ideas on sources of E? (vitamin e, i should clarify - don' t want to get picked up by the drug squad)ALso, I've got some selennium in the cupboard - have you found it's made real dfiference?

[Guest guest]

Hi Mandi,

I thought redistribution was a major issue whatever you do - do c & e reduce

it? Any ideas on sources of E? (vitamin e, i should clarify - don' t want to

get picked up by the drug squad)

ALso, I've got some selennium in the cupboard - have you found it's made

real dfiference?

>From: Mum231ASD@...

>Reply-Desperate4DMPSEurope

>Desperate4DMPSEurope

>Subject: Re: L-Carnosine

>Date: Mon, 16 May 2005 12:17:34 EDT

>

>How exactly would L carnosine do this?

>

>Sounds Bizzarre to me

>

>better to have good stores of Vitamin C & E and Selenium on board IMHO

>

>Mandi in Dorset

>

>

>I have been advised to use some to prevent the redistribution of metals

>after the three day stint on ALA.

>

>

>

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[Guest guest]

Hi ,

We tried this and I'd recommend it as worth a go. Around 8 - 12 weeks

after we started giving it (which is when it's supposed to take

effect) we started to see the first vebalisations from my son. I

can't say it was all due to the carnosine, but I believe it was a

factor.

I've also heard that it's good at mopping up mobilised metals after a

round of chelation - I've nothing to support this - it was third hand

from someone else who was interested in carnosine.

Stuart

> Has anyone tried l-carnosine? Can you share your experience? Any

side effects?

>

> Thanks.

> -

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

> Has anyone tried l-carnosine? Can you share your experience? Any

side effects?

Very helpful for language and behaviors for my kids. It does tend to

increase copper levels tho, so I give it with a sprinkle of zinc.

Dana

[Guest guest]

If I had a dime for everytime I purchased something AFTER doing the research,

then found something else negative, I would be rich.

I still have the carnosine I purchased as I read an article right after the

purchase that talked about producing brain trauma in the very area of the brain

that carnosine was supposed to help. I could never find the article again. The

article's logic appeared plausible to me and I have found when searching onibasu

that some kids did not do well on it, specifically causing OCD and hyperactivity

symptoms to worsen. According to some of the parents' reports, once the

carnosine was discontinued, the troublesome symptoms remained for quite a while,

which I found particularly concerning.

Andy, however, thinks it is okay. I have never given it. Dr. Chez himself says

carnosine is only good for receptive language, not expressive and many of these

kids already have receptive language, expressive language is the problem.

Interestingly, my husband, Mr. ADD himself, took it as we take many of the

supplements ourself before we give them, and it caused a great deal of

gastrointestinal problems, which carnosine is supposed to help. Count these as

one of the many things we have purchased, and will not try.

[ ] L-Carnosine

Many on this forum and have heard about the study performed by

Dr. Chez, indicating that l-carnosine can enhance receptive

language.

I decided to purchase the supplement, Carn-aware, the same one

used in the study and then found this disturbing group google post:

http://groups-

beta.google.com/group/alt.support.autism/browse_th

read/thread/f36c72578

e72e015/d8a0c920626098fa?lnk=st & q=l-

carnosine+may+not+be+good & rnum=1 & hl=en#d8a0c920626098fa

Has anyone tried l-carnosine and what was the outcome? Are there

conceivably negative long-term effects with this supplement.

Thanks for sharing any feedback.

=======================================================

[Guest guest]

> Has anyone tried l-carnosine and what was the outcome? Are there

> conceivably negative long-term effects with this supplement.

I used it for my kids for about 3-4 months. It was very helpful for

receptive language, and visual stims for my #2. It did tend to

increase copper levels, so I had to give it with zinc. I removed it

after several months when it started causing problems.

Dana

[Guest guest]

Please remove me from the email list.

[ ] Re: L-Carnosine

> Has anyone tried l-carnosine and what was the outcome? Are there

> conceivably negative long-term effects with this supplement.

I used it for my kids for about 3-4 months. It was very helpful for

receptive language, and visual stims for my #2. It did tend to

increase copper levels, so I had to give it with zinc. I removed it

after several months when it started causing problems.

Dana

=======================================================

[Guest guest]

>

> Hi

> This is my first posting. I am just wondering whether it is okay

> to open the carnosine capsule and sprinkle on toast as this is what

> I usually have to do to get supplements down my little girl, she has

> asd and candida.

I opened Carnosine capsules and mixed them into peanut butter and

honey. Your method sounds fine. It did tend to increase copper

levels for my son, so I had to give it with some zinc.

Dana

[Guest guest]

> >

> > Hi

> > This is my first posting. I am just wondering whether it is okay

> > to open the carnosine capsule and sprinkle on toast as this is

what

> > I usually have to do to get supplements down my little girl, she

has

> > asd and candida.

>

>

> I opened Carnosine capsules and mixed them into peanut butter and

> honey. Your method sounds fine. It did tend to increase copper

> levels for my son, so I had to give it with some zinc.

>

> Dana

>

Thanks Dana, I will get some zinc to go with it.

BW Sue

[Guest guest]

Okay... i was looking up the Carnaware website and I was wondering if

L-Carnosine tablets would work just as well??? I could probably get those at

GNC or some other vitamin store. ANY thoughts????

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[Guest guest]

The dose that has been used in most of the studies I've read was 400

mg twice a day. That is the dose we use. I've never seen a liquid

l-carnosine supplement, though if you get the carnaware brand, it has

no taste - you can easily mix it in a bite of soy ice cream (that's

what we used until my 4 year old started swallowing pills) and it adds

no taste to the ice cream. You only need a rather small amount of both

vitamin E and zinc, which are included in the carnaware caps. As long

as you aren't giving more than the RDA for vit E, I don't think you

should worry about it too much.

> > >

> > > Okay... i was looking up the Carnaware website and I was wondering

> >if L-Carnosine tablets would work just as well??? I could probably

> >get those at GNC or some other vitamin store. ANY thoughts????

> > >

> > > ---------------------------------

> > > Talk is cheap. Use Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls.

> >Great rates starting at 1¢/min.

> > >

> > >