Re: HELP.......IEP Planning

[Guest guest]

How much time do you have before the IEP? If you have some time I would

submit, in writing, a request for the interpretations of the results. The

reports should have a raw score and the age equivalency of the tests I

would think! Any report we have had listed those. I would also request to

see the school(s) and classrooms that are placement options for your child.

As for asking you what he needs I wish I had that kind of an IEP team! If

you son is apraxia (which I'm assuming since you are here) I suggest you

ask for at least two hours of one-on-one speech therapy. In most

situations the individual therapy really is key for an apraxic child. Do

you feel he needs help with language as well? How about gross and fine

motor skills? Does he have sensory issues? Does he need help with

personal care and other life skills? How is his imaginary play? Does he

need extra help learning to play cooperatively? With turn taking? Why did

you seek help in the first place? Has EI helped in those areas? If so

then ask for similar therapies to what he is getting now. If not then

bring up why you think it hasn't helped. If you have no idea why not say

you need the help of the team to figure out another approach.

Do you have a chance to talk to his EI therapists? They are in the best

position to give feedback on what he needs as he transitions.

Miche

At 09:58 AM 5/10/2006, you wrote:

>Hi all -

>

>I just recieved the psychological report from the school district

>(done as placement testing for the transition from EI infant/toddler

>to preschool). It is full of scores but I have no idea what they mean.

>I have done several Google searches but can't some up with any site

>that will help me. The tests were the Battelle Developmental

>Inventory, Second Edition and the Vineland Adaptve Behavior Scales-II.

>

>Does anyone know where I can get help interpreting these scores before

>the IEP and they interpret them for me?

>

>I am just about at my wits end with ths process. The infant/toddler

>program here is county based and then at age 3 they transition to

>school based preschool programs. So of course we live in suburbia and

>after 6 mo of getting nowhere with the todddler home based program we

>get to start all over again with our local school district. UGGGGGHHH.

>

>I keep reading and being told, " You are the best advocate " blah blah

>blah........How in the hell (sorry, very mad today) can I do that when

>I don't know what he needs. I am not the professional here - they are.

>And they keep asking me " What do you want for Will, What are your

>concerns? " Shouldn't they be telling me what is best for him based on

>the evaluations? Or at least heading in that directon? Whatever

>happened to scientific process?

>So....I am trying to get as much info as possible so I can advocate

>for my son. Seems like I need degrees in psych, medicine, pediatric

>development and speech therapy!!

>

>Any tips are greatly appreciated.

>

>Martha

>momma to Will 33mo - " likely apraxia " and Isabelle 3mo.

>

>PS - I am a nurse with a background in several developmental psych

>courses so I am able to wade through the technical jargon.

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

The assessment team will probably be looking at the standard

scores. Standard scores can be placed on the bell shaped curve

(with 100 being the center of average.) Then the scores are looked

at in terms of standard deviations from that mean score. So,

typically, 85-115 is the standard score range for " average " . From

that, mild delay is typically 78-84, moderate delay is 70-77, 55-69

is a severe delay, and below 55 is profound. If it is converted to

standard deviations (SD), then the range of -1.0 SD to +1.0 SD is

equal to 85-115 standard score, -1.0 SD to -1.5 SD is equal to 78-84

(mild), -1.5 SD to -2.0 SD is 70-77 (moderate), and less than -2.0

SD is less than 70 (severe to profound).

Usually, for a child to qualify for services the scores must be at

least -1.5 standard deviations below the mean which translates to at

least a moderate delay. (Some times there have to be below -1.5 SD

in 2 areas or below -2.0 in one area.) The areas can be fine motor,

gross motor, cognitive, communication, adaptive skills or behavior.

It all really depends on your state laws. The laws between states

are usually similar because they are driven by federal laws;

however, slight variations can mean the difference between being

eligible for services in one state and not in another state even

with the same assessment scores. Since I am coming from Washington

state and Texas state laws, and I do not know where you are, I am

unable to tell you for certain about eligibility for special

services. Being in the field for 10 years, I can say that there

have been many law changes, and it can be confusing for the school

professionals, as well. So, it is no wonder that the parents are

confused, too.

Hang in there, and if your school professionals have not answered

all of your questions or you are still confused, be sure to ask them

to explain the results even further. It is your right to leave your

meeting with a complete understanding. Be sure to get contact

information on how to reach all members of the team because you may

leave the meeting with understanding, but get home and become

confused. That is common, and I always encourage the parents to

contact me at any time that they have questions. I encourage you to

be sure to ask questions, it is your child.

The team may ask you to sign some papers at the end. In the states

that I have experience, we need parents' signatures as proof that

they attended the meeting (an attendance form), then signatures for

agreement or disagreement with the assessment findings, signatures

for agreement or disagreement with the IEP (the actual educational

plan), and there may even be a signature for consent to provide the

services. So, be prepared to sign, sign, sign. Be aware that you

have the right to disagree. The procedures for what happens if you

disagree should have been given to you in a notice of your rights

and responsibility as the parent. This is required by federal law

to be given to you pretty much every time that you receive a paper

from the district regarding your child's special program.

Remember, you can call meetings for review or changes at anytime.

An IEP is a " working " document, so the initial plan is not set in

stone. It can be changed whenever needed.

The school team will ask you what your concerns are for your son,

and what you want for your son. These are routine questions,

required by federal law, which are designed to give the parent input

into the child's educational plan. The parent is a team member, and

your input is important. In the past, the IEP team meetings were

run by the school employees with little to no input from the

parents. This is one of the legal changes which was made in the

best interest of the families. I have seen IEP teams actually

document the parents' concerns and then brush right over the

concerns, never even addressing the concerns. I get frustrated when

I see this, so please, make sure that you reiterate your concerns if

the team doesn't address them. I really like to hear the parents'

concerns because the child is usually different at home than at

school (or what was seen in the assessment.) The parents' concerns

give the school professional some insigt into the child that they

may never see, otherwise.

I hope this helps you to better understand. I applaud you for

making your best effort to be prepared for your child's meeting!

Best wishes!

Tara

SLP and mom to 5 year old verbally apraxic, and 3 year old, and 16

month old (all boys!!!)

>

> Hi all -

>

> I just recieved the psychological report from the school district

> (done as placement testing for the transition from EI

infant/toddler

> to preschool). It is full of scores but I have no idea what they

mean.

> I have done several Google searches but can't some up with any

site

> that will help me. The tests were the Battelle Developmental

> Inventory, Second Edition and the Vineland Adaptve Behavior Scales-

II.

>

> Does anyone know where I can get help interpreting these scores

before

> the IEP and they interpret them for me?

>

> I am just about at my wits end with ths process. The

infant/toddler

> program here is county based and then at age 3 they transition to

> school based preschool programs. So of course we live in suburbia

and

> after 6 mo of getting nowhere with the todddler home based program

we

> get to start all over again with our local school district.

UGGGGGHHH.

>

> I keep reading and being told, " You are the best advocate " blah

blah

> blah........How in the hell (sorry, very mad today) can I do that

when

> I don't know what he needs. I am not the professional here - they

are.

> And they keep asking me " What do you want for Will, What are your

> concerns? " Shouldn't they be telling me what is best for him based

on

> the evaluations? Or at least heading in that directon? Whatever

> happened to scientific process?

> So....I am trying to get as much info as possible so I can

advocate

> for my son. Seems like I need degrees in psych, medicine,

pediatric

> development and speech therapy!!

>

> Any tips are greatly appreciated.

>

> Martha

> momma to Will 33mo - " likely apraxia " and Isabelle 3mo.

>

> PS - I am a nurse with a background in several developmental psych

> courses so I am able to wade through the technical jargon.

>

[Guest guest]

Grassia <miche@...> wrote: I would also request to

see the school(s) and classrooms that are placement options for your child.

That is what we are most concerned with now - we are looking at two preschool

classrooms - one more structured (the autistic base class) and another that is

more play based (also w/some higher functioning autistic kids). Both could

potentially be good for Will, each for different reasons. I am most concerned

with placing him in a class where he is either the best or worst in the class.

In general don't think either is good for a child. I would like him to be

somewhere in the middle developentally so he can learn from those ahead and

behind him. Both classes have peer models with about a 50/50 mix. I just don't

know what those other kids will be like.

Do you feel he needs help with language as well?

Maybe....having a hard time deciphering between stubborn and

receptive language delays. He doesn't always do what he is asked or mimic - but

he can, if he wants to. Eg: When we started the PECS system we tried and tried

to get him to use it - no luck. Then a couple of days later, on his terms, he

went to the board, picked the picture, brought it to dad and said ssssss for

starburst! So he understood all along, just wasn't ready to be forced.

How about gross and fine motor skills?

No - ahead of the curve on those.

Does he have sensory issues?

Kinda - we call hm sensory seeking with limits !?!? He is a seeker but

he overloads, I am reading up on SDI and it doesn't really describe Will.

Does he need help with personal care and other life skills?

Yes - don't most 2yr olds?

How is his imaginary play?

Seems on track

Does he need extra help learning to play cooperatively? With turn taking?

Yes and Yes, he is our first child and is still mostly into parallel

play.

Why did you seek help in the first place?

No talking - only making sound aproxamations by 2yrs.

Has EI helped in those areas?

NO!

If you have no idea why not say/ you need the help of the team to figure out

another approach.

I talked to the OT that was part of the eval team and finally have

a bright spot in an otherwise crummy week. She is the first to see that Will

does not test well because it is difficult to see what he can't vs won't do. She

is the first to have seen what we see, that he has a lot of idiosyncracies -

very strong in some areas and weak in others. Gross and fine motor are very

advanced but communication is at a 10-12 mo level. His testing is all over the

map - from 9-36 months depending on the area!!

Do you have a chance to talk to his EI therapists? They are in the best

position to give feedback on what he needs as he transitions.

Hopefully more, the OT was great - she felt like the info she

recieved from the infant toddler program was totally off the mark (they say

sensory avoiding, autism spectrum) from what she saw when she interacted with

Will (she saw good social interaction, eye contact, sensory seeking). I totally

agree. I am not afraid of labels like autism if they are the right labels - but

it seems like we cannot see the forest for the tree here. The EI has not been

able to get past test scores that indicate a problem - never mind that his

behavior does not meet the criteria.

Martha

---------------------------------

goes everywhere you do. Get it on your phone.

[Guest guest]

I know quite a bit about Apraxia. I worked for 3 years in a birth

to 3 program in Washington state. At this program it seemed like I

was the one guiding the physicians and the B-3 team in the direction

of Apraxia, when their preference was to call the problem a speech

delay. In the school system, I have worked with the full range of

Apraxic kids, from mild and working on one or two last speech sounds

(which many SLPs would call articulation disorder, missing the motor

planning difficulties and other contributing factors) to severe

apraxia still only about 30-40% intelligible by the teenage years.

So, after 10 years of a career with this particular speech

difficulty dispursed throughout, I really can't just tell you

eveything I know. I know a good deal of the literature, and I have

my own experiences with therapy techniques unique to what has worked

for my kids. I have a few PROMPT techniques passed to me from 2 co-

workers who have been able to get PROMPT training. In one of my

previous postings, I mentioned how expensive it is to get that

training. I am trained in visual phonic and I use a modified

version of visual phonics which has been a good therapy technique

with apraxic kids. I believe that you must use a variety of

techniques, as one is never the complete answer for all kids. And,

all therapies are trial and error. If it works, continue, if it

doesn't then find something else.

As a mom of 3 boys, I can hear your struggles. I can't imagine life

with another boy, especially having 2 with apraxia. Although, my 16

month old is struggling to make sounds and connect them, so I have

my suspicions that he, too, will have apraxia.

In my experiences with school districts, I must say, the schools I

have worked for would fight you, even if requiring a legal hearing,

on paying $130,000 per year for your apraxic children to attend a

special school. The district would take the stance that they can

provide an adequate program within the district for your child's

education. The law, basically, says that " adequate " is good enough.

To give you some perspective, school teachers typically live below

the poverty line. And, teachers tend to spend around 20% of their

take home salary on providing supplies for their classrooms. So, if

a school district is not able to pay $65,000 for 2-3 school

teachers, then why would that district pay that much for one year of

schooling for one of your children? That's $130,000 for your 2

boys' schooling for one year. It would be cheaper for the school

district to take you through the legal channels and incur all of the

lawyer and judicial fees, than to pay for your 2 kids' schooling.

This could be a community uprising! I would speak out against that

kind of expenditure if it happened in my community. My property

taxes, designated as school taxes are so high, that I would be

furious if all of that money was spent on just 2 children in my

community. What about the other kids in the community? Also, the

districts have federal mandates to educate all children, without

funding.

Have you heard that the burden of proof is now on the parents? This

ruling came about, basically, because of the rising number of school

district law suits over these kinds of issues. These law suits are

costing the school districts, our public tax dollars, millions of

dollars.

Good luck to you. The school sounds like the " ideal " placement for

your child. If you are able to get your school district to pay for

it, then you and your advocate need to write a " how to ... " book.

FYI, my experience has also been that the parents who bring their

advocates, actually get less. Using an advocate in the meetings is

viewed as a " scare tactic. " When those parents who talk

respectfully, and frequently, with the school staff, often get

more. The school district people will bend over backwards to get

the most services for the kids with parents who show great concerns

shared by the kids' teachers. When you have other staff members,

who see your child the way you see your child and his needs, then

the staff members will go behind the scenes to advocate on your

behalf, going to the administration and pushing for you. It is

frustrating because there is only so much that a district is

required to do, but what they are willing to do has more to do with

the relationship they have with the family.

In my experience, meetings to discuss program placements, when a

vocal advocate is present, has left the family/district relationship

damaged. I think consulting with an advocate before the meeting is

helpful. An advocate who attends as a support and witness, but lets

the family do the talking, is the best kind, in the district's

eyes. If the family and district cannot work out their differences,

then a vocal advocate is important, at that time. I recommend

carefully choosing an advocate, because I have seen advocates make a

child's school program worse.

I share my experiences, as my experiences only. I hope that my

perspectives can help other parents to better understand the other

side, because knowledge is power. As both the school SLP and mom of

my apraxic boy, I get to be on both sides of the table! Best of

luck! Tara

> >

> > Hi all -

> >

> > I just recieved the psychological report from the school

district

> > (done as placement testing for the transition from EI

> infant/toddler

> > to preschool). It is full of scores but I have no idea what they

> mean.

> > I have done several Google searches but can't some up with any

> site

> > that will help me. The tests were the Battelle Developmental

> > Inventory, Second Edition and the Vineland Adaptve Behavior

Scales-

> II.

> >

> > Does anyone know where I can get help interpreting these scores

> before

> > the IEP and they interpret them for me?

> >

> > I am just about at my wits end with ths process. The

> infant/toddler

> > program here is county based and then at age 3 they transition

to

> > school based preschool programs. So of course we live in

suburbia

> and

> > after 6 mo of getting nowhere with the todddler home based

program

> we

> > get to start all over again with our local school district.

> UGGGGGHHH.

> >

> > I keep reading and being told, " You are the best advocate " blah

> blah

> > blah........How in the hell (sorry, very mad today) can I do

that

> when

> > I don't know what he needs. I am not the professional here -

they

> are.

> > And they keep asking me " What do you want for Will, What are

your

> > concerns? " Shouldn't they be telling me what is best for him

based

> on

> > the evaluations? Or at least heading in that directon? Whatever

> > happened to scientific process?

> > So....I am trying to get as much info as possible so I can

> advocate

> > for my son. Seems like I need degrees in psych, medicine,

> pediatric

> > development and speech therapy!!

> >

> > Any tips are greatly appreciated.

> >

> > Martha

> > momma to Will 33mo - " likely apraxia " and Isabelle 3mo.

> >

> > PS - I am a nurse with a background in several developmental

psych

> > courses so I am able to wade through the technical jargon.

>