Guest guest Posted August 25, 2004 Report Posted August 25, 2004 Hello , Wednesday, August 25, 2004, 3:17:35 PM, you wrote: G> I have been on 1.5 grains of Armour now for 2 days, up from the 1 G> grain that was started 2 weeks ago. I seem to be able to tolerate it G> much better now that I am on DHEA. I started the DHEA at 25mgs two G> weeks ago and upped it to 37.5 mgs on Monday. The only problem I have G> now is insomnia. when are you taking the DHEA? Best regards, Alison http://www.alisonashwell.com mailto:alison.ashwell@... new work uploaded http://www.artwanted.com/alisonashwell Quote
Guest guest Posted August 25, 2004 Report Posted August 25, 2004 Hi Alison, I am taking the DHEA in the morning. By the way, my blood test prior to starting the Armour or DHEA showed that my DHEA levels were normal. However, about 2 months ago I tried to start the Armour for about 1 week for the first time and had a horrible reaction without the DHEA. My reactions then were heart palps, sweating, anxious, and insomnia. > > G> I have been on 1.5 grains of Armour now for 2 days, up from the 1 > G> grain that was started 2 weeks ago. I seem to be able to tolerate it > G> much better now that I am on DHEA. I started the DHEA at 25mgs two > G> weeks ago and upped it to 37.5 mgs on Monday. The only problem I have > G> now is insomnia. > > when are you taking the DHEA? > > > Best regards, > Alison > http://www.alisonashwell.com mailto:alison.ashwell@w... > new work uploaded > http://www.artwanted.com/alisonashwell Quote
Guest guest Posted August 25, 2004 Report Posted August 25, 2004 Hello , Wednesday, August 25, 2004, 3:38:52 PM, you wrote: G> Hi Alison, G> I am taking the DHEA in the morning. By the way, my blood test prior G> to starting the Armour or DHEA showed that my DHEA levels were G> normal. However, about 2 months ago I tried to start the Armour for G> about 1 week for the first time and had a horrible reaction without G> the DHEA. My reactions then were heart palps, sweating, anxious, and G> insomnia. dise-mayeb that sounds adrenal. i know i found that taking any adrenal meds after lunchtime caused me increased sleep problems maybe your DHEa is too high at night with this dose. you could try cutting back to the 25mg and see if that helps -- Best regards, Alison http://www.alisonashwell.com mailto:alison.ashwell@... new work uploaded http://www.artwanted.com/alisonashwell Quote
Guest guest Posted August 25, 2004 Report Posted August 25, 2004 Ok, I can do that tomorrow as I have already taken my 37.5 this morning. By the way, does a person need more DHEA supplimentation as one goes up in Armour dose until they reach the proper dose? Logic told me that that was so, but may I am wrong. > > G> Hi Alison, > > G> I am taking the DHEA in the morning. By the way, my blood test prior > G> to starting the Armour or DHEA showed that my DHEA levels were > G> normal. However, about 2 months ago I tried to start the Armour for > G> about 1 week for the first time and had a horrible reaction without > G> the DHEA. My reactions then were heart palps, sweating, anxious, and > G> insomnia. dise-mayeb > that sounds adrenal. i know i found that taking any adrenal meds after > lunchtime caused me increased sleep problems > maybe your DHEa is too high at night with this dose. you could try cutting back > to the 25mg and see if that helps > > -- > Best regards, > Alison > http://www.alisonashwell.com mailto:alison.ashwell@w... > new work uploaded > http://www.artwanted.com/alisonashwell Quote
Guest guest Posted August 25, 2004 Report Posted August 25, 2004 Hello , Wednesday, August 25, 2004, 3:47:17 PM, you wrote: G> Ok, I can do that tomorrow as I have already taken my 37.5 this G> morning. By the way, does a person need more DHEA supplimentation as G> one goes up in Armour dose until they reach the proper dose? Logic G> told me that that was so, but may I am wrong. Most people keep to the same dose of adrenal support unless they are having more stress. It is also possible that you need to drop down on the armour and allow your adrenals more time before increasing but i think you will know if the reduced dose of DHEA is the best option quite quickly -- Best regards, Alison http://www.alisonashwell.com mailto:alison.ashwell@... new work uploaded http://www.artwanted.com/alisonashwell Quote
Guest guest Posted August 25, 2004 Report Posted August 25, 2004 I think what is happening is related to adrenal here. I have this problem. Adrenal hormones are cyclic throughout the day and are highest in the morning when you get up and generally taper off throughout the day untill about 2:00 in the morning, where they reach their lowest point of the day. In adrenal fatigue, sometimes cortisol can go a bit too low at this time. When cortisol is too low, you can get uncomfortable and achy. Another thing that can happen in adrenal fatigue is that you get big spikes and valleys all day. This can sometimes result in a spike sometime in the night because you have lain down and given the adrenals a chance to rest a few hours and build up their stores. When they get enough built up, they will dump it because ACTH is elevated in adrenal fatigue and demanding more adrenal output. If they do this in the night, you can become wide awake. Another thing that happens in adrenal fatigue is that you can get hypotglycemia at night. This happened to me also. Then you get pangs of hunger and the body will often not let you sleep if blood sugar goes too low. Another thing that can happen is that growth hormone is going too low. This can happen when beginning thyroid treatment. Growth hormone is produced by the pituitary at night and like the adrenals, it can become fatigued by the increased demands of thyroid hormone. Restless sleep is a symptom of low growth hromne. Growth hormone is needed for repair of the body. Anyway, take heart that it will get better with time. It may take a year or so, but it will get better. I have had this problem to varying degrees for well over a year. In fact, when I first started thryoid treatment, I became an insomniac and could not sleep more than 1-2 hours a night. Things are much better now. I generally get through the whole night. Anyway, here are suggestions: -I have found that meditation helps. If it doesn't get you to sleep, it is still very good for you and can help with the overall sleep loss as it creates a brain pattern similar to sleep and that is healing and rejuvinating. -You can also experiment at that time in the morning with a tiny bit of hydrocortisone. I have found that 1-2mg will help me get back to sleep. If I take too much, it will energize me and I won't sleep for sure. It's a tricky balance. -I have also used herbs for sleep. I have made a tea of them before bedtime and keep it by my bedside for the times I wake up. -I have found that a tiny bit of a antihistamine based sleep aid works great for me. I have not figured out why. It must be one that contains Doxylamine Succinate. I just need 1/4 of a tablet and in 20 minutes I am out and relaxed. It does cause minor depletion of T3 from blood. -If you are having hypoglycemia at night, keep a healthy snack by your bedside to eat when you wake. -You can order Glycine powder from Life Extension Foundation and take about a teaspoon before bed. It is an amino acid and nervine that calms you and at the same time it is helpful for producing growth hormone. Melatonin also calms, but does not neccessarily cause sleep. It is also good for helping to increase growth hormone. Some people suggest glycine powder and GABA powder together before bed. GABA is also an amino acid that calms and it must normally rise in the brain for sleep. However GABA excess can cause oxidative stress to the brain, whereas Glycine is generally good for you and an antioxidant. It is the base material for the very important anti- oxidant glutathionine, essential for healing and health. I've used muscle relaxants and it has not been very helpful. Aspirine can help also, but it competes with and slows production of cortisol and you can wake in the morning with very low cortisol and not feeling great at all. Tish Quote
Guest guest Posted August 25, 2004 Report Posted August 25, 2004 Hi Tish, THanks for the advice. I really appreciate it. I know for sure that my cortisol is high, just above the normal range so I know at night I have an adequate amount in my system. As far as hypglycemia, I was just told by Dr. W that I have that. I never knew that. My fasting glucose was something like 45! He said that is from the insulin resistance. > I think what is happening is related to adrenal here. I have this > problem. Adrenal hormones are cyclic throughout the day and are > highest in the morning when you get up and generally taper off > throughout the day untill about 2:00 in the morning, where they > reach their lowest point of the day. In adrenal fatigue, sometimes > cortisol can go a bit too low at this time. When cortisol is too > low, you can get uncomfortable and achy. Another thing that can > happen in adrenal fatigue is that you get big spikes and valleys all > day. This can sometimes result in a spike sometime in the night > because you have lain down and given the adrenals a chance to rest a > few hours and build up their stores. When they get enough built up, > they will dump it because ACTH is elevated in adrenal fatigue and > demanding more adrenal output. If they do this in the night, you can > become wide awake. > > Another thing that happens in adrenal fatigue is that you can get > hypotglycemia at night. This happened to me also. Then you get pangs > of hunger and the body will often not let you sleep if blood sugar > goes too low. > > Another thing that can happen is that growth hormone is going too > low. This can happen when beginning thyroid treatment. Growth > hormone is produced by the pituitary at night and like the adrenals, > it can become fatigued by the increased demands of thyroid hormone. > Restless sleep is a symptom of low growth hromne. Growth hormone is > needed for repair of the body. > > Anyway, take heart that it will get better with time. It may take a > year or so, but it will get better. > > I have had this problem to varying degrees for well over a year. In > fact, when I first started thryoid treatment, I became an insomniac > and could not sleep more than 1-2 hours a night. Things are much > better now. I generally get through the whole night. > > Anyway, here are suggestions: > > -I have found that meditation helps. If it doesn't get you to sleep, > it is still very good for you and can help with the overall sleep > loss as it creates a brain pattern similar to sleep and that is > healing and rejuvinating. > > -You can also experiment at that time in the morning with a tiny bit > of hydrocortisone. I have found that 1-2mg will help me get back to > sleep. If I take too much, it will energize me and I won't sleep for > sure. It's a tricky balance. > > -I have also used herbs for sleep. I have made a tea of them before > bedtime and keep it by my bedside for the times I wake up. > > -I have found that a tiny bit of a antihistamine based sleep aid > works great for me. I have not figured out why. It must be one that > contains Doxylamine Succinate. I just need 1/4 of a tablet and in 20 > minutes I am out and relaxed. It does cause minor depletion of T3 > from blood. > > -If you are having hypoglycemia at night, keep a healthy snack by > your bedside to eat when you wake. > > -You can order Glycine powder from Life Extension Foundation and > take about a teaspoon before bed. It is an amino acid and nervine > that calms you and at the same time it is helpful for producing > growth hormone. Melatonin also calms, but does not neccessarily > cause sleep. It is also good for helping to increase growth hormone. > Some people suggest glycine powder and GABA powder together before > bed. GABA is also an amino acid that calms and it must normally rise > in the brain for sleep. However GABA excess can cause oxidative > stress to the brain, whereas Glycine is generally good for you and > an antioxidant. It is the base material for the very important anti- > oxidant glutathionine, essential for healing and health. > > I've used muscle relaxants and it has not been very helpful. > Aspirine can help also, but it competes with and slows production of > cortisol and you can wake in the morning with very low cortisol and > not feeling great at all. > > Tish Quote
Guest guest Posted August 25, 2004 Report Posted August 25, 2004 Hi Tish, THanks for the advice. I really appreciate it. I know for sure that my cortisol is high, just above the normal range so I know at night I have an adequate amount in my system. As far as hypglycemia, I was just told by Dr. W that I have that. I never knew that. My fasting glucose was something like 45! He said that is from the insulin resistance. > I think what is happening is related to adrenal here. I have this > problem. Adrenal hormones are cyclic throughout the day and are > highest in the morning when you get up and generally taper off > throughout the day untill about 2:00 in the morning, where they > reach their lowest point of the day. In adrenal fatigue, sometimes > cortisol can go a bit too low at this time. When cortisol is too > low, you can get uncomfortable and achy. Another thing that can > happen in adrenal fatigue is that you get big spikes and valleys all > day. This can sometimes result in a spike sometime in the night > because you have lain down and given the adrenals a chance to rest a > few hours and build up their stores. When they get enough built up, > they will dump it because ACTH is elevated in adrenal fatigue and > demanding more adrenal output. If they do this in the night, you can > become wide awake. > > Another thing that happens in adrenal fatigue is that you can get > hypotglycemia at night. This happened to me also. Then you get pangs > of hunger and the body will often not let you sleep if blood sugar > goes too low. > > Another thing that can happen is that growth hormone is going too > low. This can happen when beginning thyroid treatment. Growth > hormone is produced by the pituitary at night and like the adrenals, > it can become fatigued by the increased demands of thyroid hormone. > Restless sleep is a symptom of low growth hromne. Growth hormone is > needed for repair of the body. > > Anyway, take heart that it will get better with time. It may take a > year or so, but it will get better. > > I have had this problem to varying degrees for well over a year. In > fact, when I first started thryoid treatment, I became an insomniac > and could not sleep more than 1-2 hours a night. Things are much > better now. I generally get through the whole night. > > Anyway, here are suggestions: > > -I have found that meditation helps. If it doesn't get you to sleep, > it is still very good for you and can help with the overall sleep > loss as it creates a brain pattern similar to sleep and that is > healing and rejuvinating. > > -You can also experiment at that time in the morning with a tiny bit > of hydrocortisone. I have found that 1-2mg will help me get back to > sleep. If I take too much, it will energize me and I won't sleep for > sure. It's a tricky balance. > > -I have also used herbs for sleep. I have made a tea of them before > bedtime and keep it by my bedside for the times I wake up. > > -I have found that a tiny bit of a antihistamine based sleep aid > works great for me. I have not figured out why. It must be one that > contains Doxylamine Succinate. I just need 1/4 of a tablet and in 20 > minutes I am out and relaxed. It does cause minor depletion of T3 > from blood. > > -If you are having hypoglycemia at night, keep a healthy snack by > your bedside to eat when you wake. > > -You can order Glycine powder from Life Extension Foundation and > take about a teaspoon before bed. It is an amino acid and nervine > that calms you and at the same time it is helpful for producing > growth hormone. Melatonin also calms, but does not neccessarily > cause sleep. It is also good for helping to increase growth hormone. > Some people suggest glycine powder and GABA powder together before > bed. GABA is also an amino acid that calms and it must normally rise > in the brain for sleep. However GABA excess can cause oxidative > stress to the brain, whereas Glycine is generally good for you and > an antioxidant. It is the base material for the very important anti- > oxidant glutathionine, essential for healing and health. > > I've used muscle relaxants and it has not been very helpful. > Aspirine can help also, but it competes with and slows production of > cortisol and you can wake in the morning with very low cortisol and > not feeling great at all. > > Tish Quote
Guest guest Posted August 25, 2004 Report Posted August 25, 2004 Hi Tish, THanks for the advice. I really appreciate it. I know for sure that my cortisol is high, just above the normal range so I know at night I have an adequate amount in my system. As far as hypglycemia, I was just told by Dr. W that I have that. I never knew that. My fasting glucose was something like 45! He said that is from the insulin resistance. > I think what is happening is related to adrenal here. I have this > problem. Adrenal hormones are cyclic throughout the day and are > highest in the morning when you get up and generally taper off > throughout the day untill about 2:00 in the morning, where they > reach their lowest point of the day. In adrenal fatigue, sometimes > cortisol can go a bit too low at this time. When cortisol is too > low, you can get uncomfortable and achy. Another thing that can > happen in adrenal fatigue is that you get big spikes and valleys all > day. This can sometimes result in a spike sometime in the night > because you have lain down and given the adrenals a chance to rest a > few hours and build up their stores. When they get enough built up, > they will dump it because ACTH is elevated in adrenal fatigue and > demanding more adrenal output. If they do this in the night, you can > become wide awake. > > Another thing that happens in adrenal fatigue is that you can get > hypotglycemia at night. This happened to me also. Then you get pangs > of hunger and the body will often not let you sleep if blood sugar > goes too low. > > Another thing that can happen is that growth hormone is going too > low. This can happen when beginning thyroid treatment. Growth > hormone is produced by the pituitary at night and like the adrenals, > it can become fatigued by the increased demands of thyroid hormone. > Restless sleep is a symptom of low growth hromne. Growth hormone is > needed for repair of the body. > > Anyway, take heart that it will get better with time. It may take a > year or so, but it will get better. > > I have had this problem to varying degrees for well over a year. In > fact, when I first started thryoid treatment, I became an insomniac > and could not sleep more than 1-2 hours a night. Things are much > better now. I generally get through the whole night. > > Anyway, here are suggestions: > > -I have found that meditation helps. If it doesn't get you to sleep, > it is still very good for you and can help with the overall sleep > loss as it creates a brain pattern similar to sleep and that is > healing and rejuvinating. > > -You can also experiment at that time in the morning with a tiny bit > of hydrocortisone. I have found that 1-2mg will help me get back to > sleep. If I take too much, it will energize me and I won't sleep for > sure. It's a tricky balance. > > -I have also used herbs for sleep. I have made a tea of them before > bedtime and keep it by my bedside for the times I wake up. > > -I have found that a tiny bit of a antihistamine based sleep aid > works great for me. I have not figured out why. It must be one that > contains Doxylamine Succinate. I just need 1/4 of a tablet and in 20 > minutes I am out and relaxed. It does cause minor depletion of T3 > from blood. > > -If you are having hypoglycemia at night, keep a healthy snack by > your bedside to eat when you wake. > > -You can order Glycine powder from Life Extension Foundation and > take about a teaspoon before bed. It is an amino acid and nervine > that calms you and at the same time it is helpful for producing > growth hormone. Melatonin also calms, but does not neccessarily > cause sleep. It is also good for helping to increase growth hormone. > Some people suggest glycine powder and GABA powder together before > bed. GABA is also an amino acid that calms and it must normally rise > in the brain for sleep. However GABA excess can cause oxidative > stress to the brain, whereas Glycine is generally good for you and > an antioxidant. It is the base material for the very important anti- > oxidant glutathionine, essential for healing and health. > > I've used muscle relaxants and it has not been very helpful. > Aspirine can help also, but it competes with and slows production of > cortisol and you can wake in the morning with very low cortisol and > not feeling great at all. > > Tish Quote
Guest guest Posted August 26, 2004 Report Posted August 26, 2004 Before blaming it on your medical program in any way, could I ask, are your surroundings quiet, inviting, cool, and dark? My grown daughter and her 3 yr old are living with me for the last few yrs. I was used to being in the quiet of my OWN apt before that. It is getting very stressful for me, as I was on my own for several yrs before the advent of this situation. Also, financial problems can be a big bugar there too. All my children are grown, the youngest being 25, and there were six of them. Now I am no longer used to ANYone living with me. Could there be any influences out of your control or reach that would cause a constant low grade stress, as in " I can't get out of this! " ? Dr. Mercola has advised certain methods of being able to sleep better, it is somewhere on his site. I wouldn't want you to quit a program of health, if that's not what it is doing it. I don't want to stray into other sbjct matter, but I also went to a site about 2 yrs ago, that talked about electrical influences close by. Can't remember where that was though. Just a thought or two. I think that a stressed worrisome nature can burn out the adrenals faster than anything. Just Curious > I have been on 1.5 grains of Armour now for 2 days, up from the 1 > grain that was started 2 weeks ago. I seem to be able to tolerate it > much better now that I am on DHEA. I started the DHEA at 25mgs two > weeks ago and upped it to 37.5 mgs on Monday. The only problem I have > now is insomnia. I seem to sleep great from about 10:30pm to 2:30am > or 3am and then it is very spuratic from that point on. I usually > fall asleep within a half hour and sleep soundly for my first 4 hours > or so. ANY IDEAS? I don't know if it is the Armour or not. Dr. W has > told me to take my dose in the morning on an empty stomach, so I > really don't want to deviate from his prescribed routine. I am trying > to put all of my faith in him and want to do what he says. He has not > yet steered me wrong. > > Quote
Guest guest Posted August 26, 2004 Report Posted August 26, 2004 Hi , The house is a quiet as usual. I seem to sleep ok initially and then I am up the rest of the night. I hope the doc calls me soon. DHEA usually does not give a person insomnia if they have too much of it does it? > > > Before blaming it on your medical program in any way, could I ask, are your > surroundings quiet, inviting, cool, and dark? My grown daughter and her 3 > yr old are living with me for the last few yrs. I was used to being in the > quiet of my OWN apt before that. It is getting very stressful for me, as I > was on my own for several yrs before the advent of this situation. Also, > financial problems can be a big bugar there too. All my children are grown, > the youngest being 25, and there were six of them. Now I am no longer used > to ANYone living with me. Could there be any influences out of your control > or reach that would cause a constant low grade stress, as in " I can't get > out of this! " ? Dr. Mercola has advised certain methods of being able to > sleep better, it is somewhere on his site. I wouldn't want you to quit a > program of health, if that's not what it is doing it. I don't want to stray > into other sbjct matter, but I also went to a site about 2 yrs ago, that > talked about electrical influences close by. Can't remember where that was > though. Just a thought or two. I think that a stressed worrisome nature > can burn out the adrenals faster than anything. > > > > Just Curious > > > > I have been on 1.5 grains of Armour now for 2 days, up from the 1 > > grain that was started 2 weeks ago. I seem to be able to tolerate it > > much better now that I am on DHEA. I started the DHEA at 25mgs two > > weeks ago and upped it to 37.5 mgs on Monday. The only problem I have > > now is insomnia. I seem to sleep great from about 10:30pm to 2:30am > > or 3am and then it is very spuratic from that point on. I usually > > fall asleep within a half hour and sleep soundly for my first 4 hours > > or so. ANY IDEAS? I don't know if it is the Armour or not. Dr. W has > > told me to take my dose in the morning on an empty stomach, so I > > really don't want to deviate from his prescribed routine. I am trying > > to put all of my faith in him and want to do what he says. He has not > > yet steered me wrong. > > > > Quote
Guest guest Posted August 26, 2004 Report Posted August 26, 2004 > Hi , > > The house is a quiet as usual. I seem to sleep ok initially and then > I am up the rest of the night. I hope the doc calls me soon. DHEA > usually does not give a person insomnia if they have too much of it > does it? > > it should not. I was put on 50 mg daily by the doctor (by rx back when I started taking it ) and stayed on that dose for 9 years. Last Dec. I went down to 10 mg. It didn't give me more energy, but more muscle strength, as though they were finally beginning to get circulation and energy back into them...I found myself stretching more and my legs especially feeling more alive. It was a very subtle but profound feeling of inner strength I got from it...it also helped me get rid of my rheumatoid arthritis, although he also had me on a low dose daily of tetracycline for a year to rid me of the RA...after suffering with it for nearly 20 years, it is GONE for the last 9 years! The DHEA had a lot to do with it. The doctor told me it's great for normalizing blood sugar levels as well. Neither doctor I have had, although aware of the high dose I was on, was worried about my levels going above normal for some reason - I surpmised it's not such a bad thing to be high in DHEA. . Quote
Guest guest Posted August 27, 2004 Report Posted August 27, 2004 Two things ----As someone else said, you need to keep a snack by your bed, and the second thing is that I had forgotten that you said that your cortisol is high. Well, that may be the problem, if it's running high at night. In people with the low morning cortisol that works all day to get up there, then finally comes up at night, at an inappropriate time, the same problem is usually present. Wide awake, and can't sleep. If your cortisol is running high all day AND at night, it's the same result. I don't think that you need to cut your dose of Armour back. On the contrary, you have enough cortisol to " cover " it, if it is high. You may be at the very crucial point, " just in time " , with the Armour, to keep from having an adrenal crash, as long as you have the patience and fortitude to keep going and SLOWLY raise your Armour at the times that Dr. Woliner advises. This is what I'm thinking could be wrong. It just hit me in the face, when you reminded us that you are not in adrenal exhaustion, rather the opposite, which, if more time had gone by, without enough thyroid hormone, probably WOULD have crashed. It takes time, but actually, you are very fortunate not to be in adrenal exhaustion. Refresh my memory, was it a blood test or was it saliva tests for the cortisol? I believe more in the saliva tests reflectin the true status there. Re: Just Curious > Hi Tish, > > THanks for the advice. I really appreciate it. I know for sure that > my cortisol is high, just above the normal range so I know at night I > have an adequate amount in my system. As far as hypglycemia, I was > just told by Dr. W that I have that. I never knew that. My fasting > glucose was something like 45! He said that is from the insulin > resistance. > > Quote
Guest guest Posted August 27, 2004 Report Posted August 27, 2004 Two things ----As someone else said, you need to keep a snack by your bed, and the second thing is that I had forgotten that you said that your cortisol is high. Well, that may be the problem, if it's running high at night. In people with the low morning cortisol that works all day to get up there, then finally comes up at night, at an inappropriate time, the same problem is usually present. Wide awake, and can't sleep. If your cortisol is running high all day AND at night, it's the same result. I don't think that you need to cut your dose of Armour back. On the contrary, you have enough cortisol to " cover " it, if it is high. You may be at the very crucial point, " just in time " , with the Armour, to keep from having an adrenal crash, as long as you have the patience and fortitude to keep going and SLOWLY raise your Armour at the times that Dr. Woliner advises. This is what I'm thinking could be wrong. It just hit me in the face, when you reminded us that you are not in adrenal exhaustion, rather the opposite, which, if more time had gone by, without enough thyroid hormone, probably WOULD have crashed. It takes time, but actually, you are very fortunate not to be in adrenal exhaustion. Refresh my memory, was it a blood test or was it saliva tests for the cortisol? I believe more in the saliva tests reflectin the true status there. Re: Just Curious > Hi Tish, > > THanks for the advice. I really appreciate it. I know for sure that > my cortisol is high, just above the normal range so I know at night I > have an adequate amount in my system. As far as hypglycemia, I was > just told by Dr. W that I have that. I never knew that. My fasting > glucose was something like 45! He said that is from the insulin > resistance. > > Quote
Guest guest Posted August 27, 2004 Report Posted August 27, 2004 Hi , It was a blood test and 24 hour urine test that were both above the normal range. When I first started the Armour in the beginning of July, that doc told me to start at 1grain for one week and then 2 grains the second week and then 3 grains the third week. At that time I only went 6 days. I was sweating, heart palps, very little sleep. I was taking no adrenal support. So I made an appt with Dr. W and he said (this is now one month later)take 1grain for a two weeks, then 1 1 1/2 for another two weeks, and then 2 grains for another two weeks. So on last Monday I started the 1.5 grains and thought I should up the DHEA to 37.5mgs to work better with the higher armour. So since monday I have had little sleep and the VIBRATIONS at night of my face, head, shoulders, arms and hands. So I took 1grn yesterday and dropped the DHEA down to 25mgs and slept 8hours last night. Today I took 1grn. So I am confused also, my blood test DHEA was 300 before taking oral DHEA. The normal range is 20-413. Maybe I don't need any adrenal support but need to increase very slowly. My oral temps are still low. Usually 97.8 or 9 mid day. > Two things ----As someone else said, you need to keep a snack by your > bed, and the second thing is that I had forgotten that you said that your > cortisol is high. Well, that may be the problem, if it's running high at > night. In people with the low morning cortisol that works all day to get up > there, then finally comes up at night, at an inappropriate time, the same > problem is usually present. Wide awake, and can't sleep. If your cortisol > is running high all day AND at night, it's the same result. I don't think > that you need to cut your dose of Armour back. On the contrary, you have > enough cortisol to " cover " it, if it is high. You may be at the very > crucial point, " just in time " , with the Armour, to keep from having an > adrenal crash, as long as you have the patience and fortitude to keep going > and SLOWLY raise your Armour at the times that Dr. Woliner advises. This is > what I'm thinking could be wrong. It just hit me in the face, when you > reminded us that you are not in adrenal exhaustion, rather the opposite, > which, if more time had gone by, without enough thyroid hormone, probably > WOULD have crashed. It takes time, but actually, you are very fortunate not > to be in adrenal exhaustion. Refresh my memory, was it a blood test or was > it saliva tests for the cortisol? I believe more in the saliva tests > reflectin the true status there. > > > > Re: Just Curious > > > > Hi Tish, > > > > THanks for the advice. I really appreciate it. I know for sure that > > my cortisol is high, just above the normal range so I know at night I > > have an adequate amount in my system. As far as hypglycemia, I was > > just told by Dr. W that I have that. I never knew that. My fasting > > glucose was something like 45! He said that is from the insulin > > resistance. > > > > Quote
Guest guest Posted August 27, 2004 Report Posted August 27, 2004 Hi , It was a blood test and 24 hour urine test that were both above the normal range. When I first started the Armour in the beginning of July, that doc told me to start at 1grain for one week and then 2 grains the second week and then 3 grains the third week. At that time I only went 6 days. I was sweating, heart palps, very little sleep. I was taking no adrenal support. So I made an appt with Dr. W and he said (this is now one month later)take 1grain for a two weeks, then 1 1 1/2 for another two weeks, and then 2 grains for another two weeks. So on last Monday I started the 1.5 grains and thought I should up the DHEA to 37.5mgs to work better with the higher armour. So since monday I have had little sleep and the VIBRATIONS at night of my face, head, shoulders, arms and hands. So I took 1grn yesterday and dropped the DHEA down to 25mgs and slept 8hours last night. Today I took 1grn. So I am confused also, my blood test DHEA was 300 before taking oral DHEA. The normal range is 20-413. Maybe I don't need any adrenal support but need to increase very slowly. My oral temps are still low. Usually 97.8 or 9 mid day. > Two things ----As someone else said, you need to keep a snack by your > bed, and the second thing is that I had forgotten that you said that your > cortisol is high. Well, that may be the problem, if it's running high at > night. In people with the low morning cortisol that works all day to get up > there, then finally comes up at night, at an inappropriate time, the same > problem is usually present. Wide awake, and can't sleep. If your cortisol > is running high all day AND at night, it's the same result. I don't think > that you need to cut your dose of Armour back. On the contrary, you have > enough cortisol to " cover " it, if it is high. You may be at the very > crucial point, " just in time " , with the Armour, to keep from having an > adrenal crash, as long as you have the patience and fortitude to keep going > and SLOWLY raise your Armour at the times that Dr. Woliner advises. This is > what I'm thinking could be wrong. It just hit me in the face, when you > reminded us that you are not in adrenal exhaustion, rather the opposite, > which, if more time had gone by, without enough thyroid hormone, probably > WOULD have crashed. It takes time, but actually, you are very fortunate not > to be in adrenal exhaustion. Refresh my memory, was it a blood test or was > it saliva tests for the cortisol? I believe more in the saliva tests > reflectin the true status there. > > > > Re: Just Curious > > > > Hi Tish, > > > > THanks for the advice. I really appreciate it. I know for sure that > > my cortisol is high, just above the normal range so I know at night I > > have an adequate amount in my system. As far as hypglycemia, I was > > just told by Dr. W that I have that. I never knew that. My fasting > > glucose was something like 45! He said that is from the insulin > > resistance. > > > > Quote
Guest guest Posted September 4, 2004 Report Posted September 4, 2004 Hi, Tish, Thanks for this great info! In my case, my cortisol is lowest in the morning and high at night. Phosphatidylserine complex is good for this. I take that AND melatonin. (Also take siberian ginseng in the morning.) in Va. I think what is happening is related to adrenal here. I have this problem. Adrenal hormones are cyclic throughout the day and are highest in the morning when you get up and generally taper off throughout the day untill about 2:00 in the morning, where they reach their lowest point of the day. In adrenal fatigue, sometimes cortisol can go a bit too low at this time. When cortisol is too low, you can get uncomfortable and achy. Another thing that can happen in adrenal fatigue is that you get big spikes and valleys all day. This can sometimes result in a spike sometime in the night because you have lain down and given the adrenals a chance to rest a few hours and build up their stores. When they get enough built up, they will dump it because ACTH is elevated in adrenal fatigue and demanding more adrenal output. If they do this in the night, you can become wide awake. Another thing that happens in adrenal fatigue is that you can get hypotglycemia at night. This happened to me also. Then you get pangs of hunger and the body will often not let you sleep if blood sugar goes too low. Another thing that can happen is that growth hormone is going too low. This can happen when beginning thyroid treatment. Growth hormone is produced by the pituitary at night and like the adrenals, it can become fatigued by the increased demands of thyroid hormone. Restless sleep is a symptom of low growth hromne. Growth hormone is needed for repair of the body. Anyway, take heart that it will get better with time. It may take a year or so, but it will get better. I have had this problem to varying degrees for well over a year. In fact, when I first started thryoid treatment, I became an insomniac and could not sleep more than 1-2 hours a night. Things are much better now. I generally get through the whole night. Anyway, here are suggestions: -I have found that meditation helps. If it doesn't get you to sleep, it is still very good for you and can help with the overall sleep loss as it creates a brain pattern similar to sleep and that is healing and rejuvinating. -You can also experiment at that time in the morning with a tiny bit of hydrocortisone. I have found that 1-2mg will help me get back to sleep. If I take too much, it will energize me and I won't sleep for sure. It's a tricky balance. -I have also used herbs for sleep. I have made a tea of them before bedtime and keep it by my bedside for the times I wake up. -I have found that a tiny bit of a antihistamine based sleep aid works great for me. I have not figured out why. It must be one that contains Doxylamine Succinate. I just need 1/4 of a tablet and in 20 minutes I am out and relaxed. It does cause minor depletion of T3 from blood. -If you are having hypoglycemia at night, keep a healthy snack by your bedside to eat when you wake. -You can order Glycine powder from Life Extension Foundation and take about a teaspoon before bed. It is an amino acid and nervine that calms you and at the same time it is helpful for producing growth hormone. Melatonin also calms, but does not neccessarily cause sleep. It is also good for helping to increase growth hormone. Some people suggest glycine powder and GABA powder together before bed. GABA is also an amino acid that calms and it must normally rise in the brain for sleep. However GABA excess can cause oxidative stress to the brain, whereas Glycine is generally good for you and an antioxidant. It is the base material for the very important anti- oxidant glutathionine, essential for healing and health. I've used muscle relaxants and it has not been very helpful. Aspirine can help also, but it competes with and slows production of cortisol and you can wake in the morning with very low cortisol and not feeling great at all. Tish Quote
Guest guest Posted September 4, 2004 Report Posted September 4, 2004 Hi, Tish, Thanks for this great info! In my case, my cortisol is lowest in the morning and high at night. Phosphatidylserine complex is good for this. I take that AND melatonin. (Also take siberian ginseng in the morning.) in Va. I think what is happening is related to adrenal here. I have this problem. Adrenal hormones are cyclic throughout the day and are highest in the morning when you get up and generally taper off throughout the day untill about 2:00 in the morning, where they reach their lowest point of the day. In adrenal fatigue, sometimes cortisol can go a bit too low at this time. When cortisol is too low, you can get uncomfortable and achy. Another thing that can happen in adrenal fatigue is that you get big spikes and valleys all day. This can sometimes result in a spike sometime in the night because you have lain down and given the adrenals a chance to rest a few hours and build up their stores. When they get enough built up, they will dump it because ACTH is elevated in adrenal fatigue and demanding more adrenal output. If they do this in the night, you can become wide awake. Another thing that happens in adrenal fatigue is that you can get hypotglycemia at night. This happened to me also. Then you get pangs of hunger and the body will often not let you sleep if blood sugar goes too low. Another thing that can happen is that growth hormone is going too low. This can happen when beginning thyroid treatment. Growth hormone is produced by the pituitary at night and like the adrenals, it can become fatigued by the increased demands of thyroid hormone. Restless sleep is a symptom of low growth hromne. Growth hormone is needed for repair of the body. Anyway, take heart that it will get better with time. It may take a year or so, but it will get better. I have had this problem to varying degrees for well over a year. In fact, when I first started thryoid treatment, I became an insomniac and could not sleep more than 1-2 hours a night. Things are much better now. I generally get through the whole night. Anyway, here are suggestions: -I have found that meditation helps. If it doesn't get you to sleep, it is still very good for you and can help with the overall sleep loss as it creates a brain pattern similar to sleep and that is healing and rejuvinating. -You can also experiment at that time in the morning with a tiny bit of hydrocortisone. I have found that 1-2mg will help me get back to sleep. If I take too much, it will energize me and I won't sleep for sure. It's a tricky balance. -I have also used herbs for sleep. I have made a tea of them before bedtime and keep it by my bedside for the times I wake up. -I have found that a tiny bit of a antihistamine based sleep aid works great for me. I have not figured out why. It must be one that contains Doxylamine Succinate. I just need 1/4 of a tablet and in 20 minutes I am out and relaxed. It does cause minor depletion of T3 from blood. -If you are having hypoglycemia at night, keep a healthy snack by your bedside to eat when you wake. -You can order Glycine powder from Life Extension Foundation and take about a teaspoon before bed. It is an amino acid and nervine that calms you and at the same time it is helpful for producing growth hormone. Melatonin also calms, but does not neccessarily cause sleep. It is also good for helping to increase growth hormone. Some people suggest glycine powder and GABA powder together before bed. GABA is also an amino acid that calms and it must normally rise in the brain for sleep. However GABA excess can cause oxidative stress to the brain, whereas Glycine is generally good for you and an antioxidant. It is the base material for the very important anti- oxidant glutathionine, essential for healing and health. I've used muscle relaxants and it has not been very helpful. Aspirine can help also, but it competes with and slows production of cortisol and you can wake in the morning with very low cortisol and not feeling great at all. Tish Quote
Guest guest Posted March 18, 2005 Report Posted March 18, 2005 Tommie, Ron helps people out of the goodness of his heart and never claims to be infallible. He brings an engineer's eye and bent of mind to the control of diabetes. His knowledge comes from an exhaustive amount of research, most of which can be found on the files on the site. The research is only acceptable if it has been published in peer reviewed journals; Ron is not into hocus pocus. Aside: he would have eaten Duncan up alive! If you wish to contact S - just write her offlist. I have. As to insulin usage: most professionals now say there is no such thing as too much insulin, whatever you need, that is what you must use. Once S gets more control over her bgs, she may decide to change the amount of carbs in her WOE to lessen insulin usage. However that is her personal decision. And I say this as a person who does what she can to keep her own insulin usage down. This is my personal decision. Additionally, I have seen letters from others who have had the benefit of Ron's help and achieved much better control. You just need a lot of patience and even more strips. And yes, the list is very tightly moderated. TANSTAAFL - there ain't no such thing as a free lunch. R. Heinlein. Helen Quote
Guest guest Posted March 19, 2005 Report Posted March 19, 2005 It's a small, highly specialized diabetes list that Tommie and I belong to. He expressed a concern on d-i and I answered him. As it happens, I answered him on the other list too. We sort of met in the hall and chatted. Helen Quote
Guest guest Posted March 19, 2005 Report Posted March 19, 2005 It's a small, highly specialized diabetes list that Tommie and I belong to. He expressed a concern on d-i and I answered him. As it happens, I answered him on the other list too. We sort of met in the hall and chatted. Helen Quote
Guest guest Posted March 19, 2005 Report Posted March 19, 2005 It's a small, highly specialized diabetes list that Tommie and I belong to. He expressed a concern on d-i and I answered him. As it happens, I answered him on the other list too. We sort of met in the hall and chatted. Helen Quote
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