Guest guest Posted December 13, 2004 Report Share Posted December 13, 2004 Dear fellows, I know most of you are in quite bad shape and suffering, so I apologize if I am causing you trouble with my writing ... I hope will help us all somehow ... Unfortunately my situation is a such that I really am in need of URGENT Help, and cant help it ... ! I have a suggested diagnostic of 1. Enthesitis /Periostitis in the sitting ischio-pubian area (exact etiologic cause is not quite clear). This condition caused me to stop working 3 years ago, financially I cannot last much longer unless I do something quick ...! A Dr suggested Seronegative Spondyloarthropathy subdivision Reactive Arthritis. Have taken oral Clindamycin 300mg 3 x day for 3 days, 2 x day for another 7 days (10 days in total) once in Sept 2004, second time in Nov 2004. Cannot say it did help, except I felt better the first time only (in Sept) for the first 4 days with nose, mouth, teeth, tongue, upper respiratory tract, slept better. After the first 4 days, nose and throat became more dry then before, tongue is more white, and the POSITIVE effect did not repeat in Nov, but the tongue became more white and all more dry. Lab test says is NOT Candida - A good question what is it? I am awaiting new Lab Tests results in days ... Is it all related to autoimmune disorders (Sjogren /Sicca Syndrome?) I do not know enough ! A Bone Scan shows a point of inflammation in the under-pubic area, and in fact it may be more then just this ... 2. Myofasciitis (which is very similar or related to Fibromyalgia ...?). I do have a history of overuse through sitting in 2000, which triggered my currently chronic sitting pain . 3. Chronic Fatigue Syndrome (I recently realized I had it in various degrees for about 20 years, between the age of 20 to current - I am now 41 (in 2004)). 4. Irritable Bowel Syndrome the Dr says, (for me the primary manifestation is abnormal soft to diarrheic stool, no abdominal pain at least as of yet). Clindamycin regulated the stool, but effects are not lasting more then 1.5 months. The side effects of Clindamycin seem to great to continue ... == As an additional symptom I get lots of rectal itching and occasional degenerates to what I believe is like Hemorrhoidal Pain, was to 5 Proctologist, they say beside a bit of cream is nothing major there. On the other hand I read on http://www.drmirkin.com/morehealth/g144.htm MYCOPLASMA, CHLAMYDIA AND UREAPLASMA (pathogens without cell wall - or something to that effect ...) == A. I learned of Dr Browns Protocol http://www.rheumatic.org/ , B. More recently I learned of Marshall Protocol http://www.sarcinfo.com/ , http://www.marshallprotocol.com/ , other related sites. To me it seems that Marshal Protocol is an updated version, new, complete of Dr Brown's Protocol. I will keep looking for information, but I feel weaker and weaker as time goes on, I MUST DO something PRACTICAL. I WORK TO SEND A LAB TEST FOR VITAMIN D (as per Marshal Protocol), to be my Christmas Gift ... Any thoughts? Is quite expensive for me here (from Romania). Is there a good reason why some people still do Dr Brown, as opposite to Marshall? Can anybody post picture and practical advice regarding frozen shipment with dry ice (if I am not mistaken ?). Where to typically get Dry Ice from? I asked several Medical Labs, but they tell me they only ship National, by refrigerated truck, no experience with Dry Ice. Entertainment Industry? DO YOU KNOW ANY OTHER GREAT DIAGNOSTIC AND TREATMENTS LIKE Dr Brown and Marshall , or is that all? Doctors give me NSAID, Anti-depressives, Sulfasazaline, but I am not taking them because I know this are symptomatic treatments, at best stopping the pathology (Sulfasazaline), but not etiologic. NSAID and Cortisone failed to provide any relief of the sitting pain, and not even remotely are they addressing the Chronic Fatigue component. I am trying to post on a Web Site my Lab Tests and All Symptoms, but I see that days and even weeks went by without me succeeding to accomplish the " perfect " posting, so today I put together this present posting to just MOVE FORWARDS, AWAITING with much interest your reactions... THANK YOU IN ADVANCE ! Some of the Other Topics and approaches that I plan to investigate: 1. Visit more Chronic Fatigue Syndrome (CFS), Chronic Fatigue Immune Deficiency Syndrome (CFIDS), Fibromyalgia (FM), Rheumatic sites to see if I can find more ETIOLOGIC, ground braking treatments like Dr Brown's and Marshall ... cause I do not like the NSAID, Corticosteroid, Sulfasazaline, Methotrexate, etc path ... 2. Post a picture of my white tongue (primarily was the back of it, after recent Clindamycin is a bit more ...)and understand why for 20 years doctors were unable to tell me what it was, and it does not come back as Candida form Lab Test, but they are unable to tell me what it is. Might be Sjogren Syndrome (Sicca Syndrome), BUT I must say that I have a Metallic Taste and teethe get a white deposit which I clean al least daily (this disappeared in Sept for 4 days with Clindamycin). I have saliva on the tongue, is not entirely dry, for the time being it only feels like dry, but is actually not dry as of yet, I should probably call it Metallic Taste (?). 3. A doctor told me to investigate Hepatitis C (in 2003 I vaccinated for Hepatitis A and B - even though now I learn that this kind of vaccine as well may cause problems http://www.immunesupport.com/library/showarticle.cfm/ID/4448/e/1/T/CF IDS_FM/ Until now I cannot say I have pain at the place of vaccine in muscles of the upper arm, in fact was subcutaneous - or am I mistaken ? I may have to ask the place ... !). Reading on the Internet I found that indeed Hepatitis C typically evolves quietly for 20 years, and patients only learn about it when liver is already damaged ... , so I though to investigate it out. This coming Fr I get back the Lab Test Results ... 4. I already initiated contact with Labs for Marshall Vitamin D Tests (not progressing very well, as of yet ...), I REALLY WANT TO TRY THIS, IT LOOKS LIKE THE ONLY GOOD OPTION, UNLESS YOU TELL ME DIFFERENT ... ! 5. I tried and tried to find a Dr. to understand Marshall or at least Dr Brown, here in Bucharest /Romania where I live in exile. I found one nice Dr but 500km away (he did a Dr Degree in this direction, and was the first to indicate Dr Brown's Protocol to me ...). I keep a bit longer in trying to find one in Bucharest. Probably if I am lucky Marshall Group already has one, I must contact them a.s.a.p. Otherwise I will travel to the one I have at 500 Km's. We are " pen palls " anyway. 6. The recent posting POTASSIUM DEFICIENCY AS A CAUSE OF RHEUMATOID ARTHRITIS puzzled me, happy to find one more cause, but does not seem a treatment plan does exist as it is the case with Marshall, what would Marshal think of that, I plan to submit question. ... , hope I get to do it ... ! Well, I guess this is enough, if I forgot something I will get back later, better one day I will revise it and post it on a Web THANK YOU ALL ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 13, 2004 Report Share Posted December 13, 2004 rheumatic 2004-12-13 A Honest Request for Help Dear fellows, I know most of you are in quite bad shape and suffering, so I apologize if I am causing you trouble with my writing ... I hope will help us all somehow ... Unfortunately my situation is a such that I really am in need of URGENT Help, and cant help it ... ! I have a suggested diagnostic of 1. Enthesitis /Periostitis in the sitting ischio-pubian area (exact etiologic cause is not quite clear). This condition caused me to stop working 3 years ago, financially I cannot last much longer unless I do something quick ...! A Dr suggested Seronegative Spondyloarthropathy subdivision Reactive Arthritis. Have taken oral Clindamycin 300mg 3 x day for 3 days, 2 x day for another 7 days (10 days in total) once in Sept 2004, second time in Nov 2004. Cannot say it did help, except I felt better the first time only (in Sept) for the first 4 days with nose, mouth, teeth, tongue, upper respiratory tract, slept better. After the first 4 days, nose and throat became more dry then before, tongue is more white, and the POSITIVE effect did not repeat in Nov, but the tongue became more white and all more dry. Lab test says is NOT Candida - A good question what is it? Candida is Candida albicans, a fungus that can cause LGS (leaky gut syndrome) and thereby lead to AS. Anal itching is one of many obvious signs of candidiasis. It is usually involved in CFS (chronic fatigue syndrome). I am awaiting new Lab Tests results in days ... Is it all related to autoimmune disorders (Sjogren /Sicca Syndrome?) I do not know enough ! A Bone Scan shows a point of inflammation in the under-pubic area, and in fact it may be more then just this ... 2. Myofasciitis (which is very similar or related to Fibromyalgia ...?). I do have a history of overuse through sitting in 2000, which triggered my currently chronic sitting pain . 3. Chronic Fatigue Syndrome (I recently realized I had it in various degrees for about 20 years, between the age of 20 to current - I am now 41 (in 2004)). 4. Irritable Bowel Syndrome the Dr says, (for me the primary manifestation is abnormal soft to diarrheic stool, no abdominal pain at least as of yet). Clindamycin regulated the stool, but effects are not lasting more then 1.5 months. The side effects of Clindamycin seem to great to continue ... == As an additional symptom I get lots of rectal itching and occasional degenerates to what I believe is like Hemorrhoidal Pain, was to 5 Proctologist, they say beside a bit of cream is nothing major there. On the other hand I read on http://www.drmirkin.com/morehealth/g144.htm MYCOPLASMA, CHLAMYDIA AND UREAPLASMA (pathogens without cell wall - or something to that effect ...) == A. I learned of Dr Browns Protocol http://www.rheumatic.org/ , B. More recently I learned of Marshall Protocol http://www.sarcinfo.com/ , http://www.marshallprotocol.com/ , other related sites. To me it seems that Marshal Protocol is an updated version, new, complete of Dr Brown's Protocol. I will keep looking for information, but I feel weaker and weaker as time goes on, I MUST DO something PRACTICAL. I WORK TO SEND A LAB TEST FOR VITAMIN D (as per Marshal Protocol), to be my Christmas Gift ... Any thoughts? Is quite expensive for me here (from Romania). Is there a good reason why some people still do Dr Brown, as opposite to Marshall? FORGET vitD testing! Just eat plenty of eggs and get some extra sunlight daily. Take cod liver oil every night before retiring, and if you can find flaxseed oil, borage seed oil (or evening primrose oil), salmon oil take these also, along with vitE (1400IU) and cold-pressed extra-virgin olive oil: 5-10 grams every evening before retiring. INSTEAD of this test, the HLA B27 test could be performed--but I would not even do this...since I am convinced you do have AS; don't wait for MORE DAMAGE before you eliminate starches (especially refined) and all fried foods and certainly soluble starch (potatoes) from your diet. Begin today. Can anybody post picture and practical advice regarding frozen shipment with dry ice (if I am not mistaken ?). Where to typically get Dry Ice from? I asked several Medical Labs, but they tell me they only ship National, by refrigerated truck, no experience with Dry Ice. Entertainment Industry? DO YOU KNOW ANY OTHER GREAT DIAGNOSTIC AND TREATMENTS LIKE Dr Brown and Marshall , or is that all? Doctors give me NSAID, Anti-depressives, Sulfasazaline, If you could find ENTERIC-COATED sulfasalazine, it would be many times more effective in treating your condition. but I am not taking them because I know this are symptomatic treatments, at best stopping the pathology (Sulfasazaline), but not etiologic. NSAID and Cortisone failed to provide any relief of the sitting pain, and not even remotely are they addressing the Chronic Fatigue component. I am trying to post on a Web Site my Lab Tests and All Symptoms, but I see that days and even weeks went by without me succeeding to accomplish the " perfect " posting, so today I put together this present posting to just MOVE FORWARDS, AWAITING with much interest your reactions... THANK YOU IN ADVANCE ! Some of the Other Topics and approaches that I plan to investigate: 1. Visit more Chronic Fatigue Syndrome (CFS), Chronic Fatigue Immune Deficiency Syndrome (CFIDS), Fibromyalgia (FM), Rheumatic sites to see if I can find more ETIOLOGIC, ground braking treatments like Dr Brown's and Marshall ... cause I do not like the NSAID, Corticosteroid, Sulfasazaline, Methotrexate, etc path ... 2. Post a picture of my white tongue (primarily was the back of it, after recent Clindamycin is a bit more ...)and understand why for 20 years doctors were unable to tell me what it was, and it does not come back as Candida form Lab Test, but they are unable to tell me what it is. Might be Sjogren Syndrome (Sicca Syndrome), BUT I must say that I have a Metallic Taste and teethe get a white deposit which I clean al least daily (this disappeared in Sept for 4 days with Clindamycin). I have saliva on the tongue, is not entirely dry, for the time being it only feels like dry, but is actually not dry as of yet, I should probably call it Metallic Taste (?). Get a glass of water to spit into upon arising first thing in morning. The spittle might have little filaments which go down to the bottom of the glass--that is a sign of candidiasis (everyone has C. albicans, but OVERGROWTH will affect the entire alimentary tract). If you do have candidiasis, you will have to eat a high-protein diet that excludes all sugar (even from fruit!)--and treat this aggressively with caprylic acid (2500mg/day for no more than six weeks), colloidal silver, and garlic. No alcohol in any form! 3. A doctor told me to investigate Hepatitis C (in 2003 I vaccinated for Hepatitis A and B - even though now I learn that this kind of vaccine as well may cause problems http://www.immunesupport.com/library/showarticle.cfm/ID/4448/e/1/T/CF IDS_FM/ Until now I cannot say I have pain at the place of vaccine in muscles of the upper arm, in fact was subcutaneous - or am I mistaken ? I may have to ask the place ... !). Reading on the Internet I found that indeed Hepatitis C typically evolves quietly for 20 years, and patients only learn about it when liver is already damaged ... , so I though to investigate it out. This coming Fr I get back the Lab Test Results ... 4. I already initiated contact with Labs for Marshall Vitamin D Tests (not progressing very well, as of yet ...), I REALLY WANT TO TRY THIS, IT LOOKS LIKE THE ONLY GOOD OPTION, UNLESS YOU TELL ME DIFFERENT ... ! 5. I tried and tried to find a Dr. to understand Marshall or at least Dr Brown, here in Bucharest /Romania where I live in exile. I found one nice Dr but 500km away (he did a Dr Degree in this direction, and was the first to indicate Dr Brown's Protocol to me ...). I keep a bit longer in trying to find one in Bucharest. Probably if I am lucky Marshall Group already has one, I must contact them a.s.a.p. Otherwise I will travel to the one I have at 500 Km's. We are " pen palls " anyway. 6. The recent posting POTASSIUM DEFICIENCY AS A CAUSE OF RHEUMATOID ARTHRITIS puzzled me, happy to find one more cause, but does not seem a treatment plan does exist as it is the case with Marshall, what would Marshal think of that, I plan to submit question. ... , hope I get to do it ... ! Well, I guess this is enough, if I forgot something I will get back later, better one day I will revise it and post it on a Web THANK YOU ALL ! To unsubscribe, email: rheumatic-unsubscribeegroups Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 14, 2004 Report Share Posted December 14, 2004 Dear , Thank You SO MUCH for your swift reply! Starting from your past posting(s) I educated myself about Ankylosing Spondylitis (AS) and recommended ALL that to a friend who has a " certified " diagnostic with this condition. He has visible markings on the Sacroiliac joint, and indeed cannot bend and has pain when trying to do so. As of yet he does not have the " bamboo " lower back imaging (if I am not mistaken - I do not recall if this IS or OS NOT specific for this condition ...). I DO NOT HAVE LOWER BACK PAIN (as of yet at least - I have other pains as described instead ...) ... ALL my Lab Tests and Imaging for Rheumatic Conditions are NEGATIVE (unlike my friend ...) (hence my Seronegative Spondyloarthropathy suggested diagnostic ... ?!). I believe he has a Positive C- Reactive Protein, and perhaps more, I will add to my page his exact condition. Can you please indicate how is your case vis a vis such Lab Tests? IN NO WAY I expect you to write them up for me now, but you can indicate a personal page you might have, or paste existing info. I WILL DO MY BEST TO POST ALL MY INFO IN A DEDICATED WEB PAGE SOON ! Honestly I do not think I can withstand so many Antibiotics, as my recent experience with Clindamycin was not that great, I tend to get more Metallic Taste in my moth and dry nose, etc ... Then the financial aspect on the long run, remember I am off work going on three years by now ... ! In my page I will state that in several occasions I experienced great relief with antibiotics (in 1994 was a fantastic event based upon Tri-Sulfametoxazol (?) which I understand is sold /known as Biseptol (one commercial name ...?), but even though FANTASTIC, they all were SHORT LIVED, and when repeated months or years later with the same antibiotic the positive reactions unfortunately did NOT REPEAT. This caused most of my doctors to tell me it was the Placebo effect. I DOUBT IT! ... but fact remains they tend to not work the second time. I look forwards to stay in touch with you, as I noted you are a knowledgeable fellow and YOUR SHARED EXPERIENCE MAKES ALL THE DIFFERENCE TO ME AND US. You mention several viruses, but how are we going to test for them and antibiotics do not work on them. Candida, yes it can be a problem, even though in my case ALL attempts to date came back NEGATIVE on Candida, and the people from the lab start telling me about refluxes from stomach, etc which I cannot confirm ... PLEASE, when possible post your valuable knowledge on a web page (on Geocities ?), question by question and topic by topic, so that you can educate us with your valuable knowledge and experience without causing a burden to yourself. I noticed I can build a web in MS FrontPage (for example), and then load each page and picture to (FrontPage extensions do not work for free accounts ...). By the way WHO in this group has or knows a place /server where we can post personal pages with FrontPage Extensions (so that update of the page can be automated ...) for free (due to my unstable financial condition I feel reluctant to pay 5$/month, even though ultimately I will probably have to choose to do so ...). What do you actually believe of Marshall Protocol? Would not work for you? I believe AS is as well an autoimmune condition, perhaps as well involving Th1 (I believe this means T Cells , Helper, type 1 etc ...) > > rheumatic 2004-12-13 A Honest Request for Help > > > > Dear fellows, > > I know most of you are in quite bad shape and suffering, so I > apologize if I am causing you trouble with my writing ... I hope > will help us all somehow ... > > > Unfortunately my situation is a such that I really am in need of > URGENT Help, and cant help it ... ! > I have a suggested diagnostic of > > 1. Enthesitis /Periostitis in the sitting ischio-pubian area (exact > etiologic cause is not quite clear). This condition caused me to > stop working 3 years ago, financially I cannot last much longer > unless I do something quick ...! > > A Dr suggested Seronegative Spondyloarthropathy subdivision Reactive > Arthritis. Have taken oral Clindamycin 300mg 3 x day for 3 days, 2 > x day for another 7 days (10 days in total) once in Sept 2004, > second time in Nov 2004. > Cannot say it did help, except I felt better the first time only (in > Sept) for the first 4 days with nose, mouth, teeth, tongue, upper > respiratory tract, slept better. After the first 4 days, nose and > throat became more dry then before, tongue is more white, and the > POSITIVE effect did not repeat in Nov, but the tongue became more > white and all more dry. > Lab test says is NOT Candida - A good question what is it? > > Candida is Candida albicans, a fungus that can cause LGS (leaky gut syndrome) and thereby lead to AS. Anal itching is one of many obvious signs of candidiasis. It is usually involved in CFS (chronic fatigue syndrome). > > > I am > awaiting new Lab Tests results in days ... Is it all related to > autoimmune disorders (Sjogren /Sicca Syndrome?) I do not know > enough ! > > A Bone Scan shows a point of inflammation in the under-pubic area, > and in fact it may be more then just this ... > > > 2. Myofasciitis (which is very similar or related to > Fibromyalgia ...?). I do have a history of overuse through sitting > in 2000, which triggered my currently chronic sitting pain . > > 3. Chronic Fatigue Syndrome (I recently realized I had it in various > degrees for about 20 years, between the age of 20 to current - I am > now 41 (in 2004)). > > 4. Irritable Bowel Syndrome the Dr says, (for me the primary > manifestation is abnormal soft to diarrheic stool, no abdominal pain > at least as of yet). > Clindamycin regulated the stool, but effects are not lasting more > then 1.5 months. The side effects of Clindamycin seem to great to > continue ... > > > == > As an additional symptom I get lots of rectal itching and occasional > degenerates to what I believe is like Hemorrhoidal Pain, was to 5 > Proctologist, they say beside a bit of cream is nothing major there. > On the other hand I read on > http://www.drmirkin.com/morehealth/g144.htm MYCOPLASMA, CHLAMYDIA > AND UREAPLASMA (pathogens without cell wall - or something to that > effect ...) > == > > > A. I learned of Dr Browns Protocol http://www.rheumatic.org/ , > > B. More recently I learned of Marshall Protocol > http://www.sarcinfo.com/ , http://www.marshallprotocol.com/ , other > related sites. > > To me it seems that Marshal Protocol is an updated version, new, > complete of Dr Brown's Protocol. > I will keep looking for information, but I feel weaker and weaker as > time goes on, I MUST DO something PRACTICAL. > > I WORK TO SEND A LAB TEST FOR VITAMIN D (as per Marshal Protocol), > to be my Christmas Gift ... Any thoughts? Is quite expensive for me > here (from Romania). Is there a good reason why some people still do > Dr Brown, as opposite to Marshall? > > FORGET vitD testing! Just eat plenty of eggs and get some extra sunlight daily. Take cod liver oil every night before retiring, and if you can find flaxseed oil, borage seed oil (or evening primrose oil), salmon oil take these also, along with vitE (1400IU) and cold- pressed extra-virgin olive oil: 5-10 grams every evening before retiring. > INSTEAD of this test, the HLA B27 test could be performed--but I would not even do this...since I am convinced you do have AS; don't wait for MORE DAMAGE before you eliminate starches (especially refined) and all fried foods and certainly soluble starch (potatoes) from your diet. Begin today. > > > Can anybody post picture and practical advice regarding frozen > shipment with dry ice (if I am not mistaken ?). Where to typically > get Dry Ice from? I asked several Medical Labs, but they tell me > they only ship National, by refrigerated truck, no experience with > Dry Ice. Entertainment Industry? > > DO YOU KNOW ANY OTHER GREAT DIAGNOSTIC AND TREATMENTS LIKE Dr Brown > and Marshall , or is that all? > Doctors give me NSAID, Anti-depressives, Sulfasazaline, > > If you could find ENTERIC-COATED sulfasalazine, it would be many times more effective in treating your condition. > > > but I am not > taking them because I know this are symptomatic treatments, at best > stopping the pathology (Sulfasazaline), but not etiologic. NSAID and > Cortisone failed to provide any relief of the sitting pain, and not > even remotely are they addressing the Chronic Fatigue component. > > I am trying to post on a Web Site my Lab Tests and All Symptoms, but > I see that days and even weeks went by without me succeeding to > accomplish the " perfect " posting, so today I put together this > present posting to just MOVE FORWARDS, AWAITING with much interest > your reactions... THANK YOU IN ADVANCE ! > > > > Some of the Other Topics and approaches that I plan to investigate: > 1. Visit more Chronic Fatigue Syndrome (CFS), Chronic Fatigue Immune > Deficiency Syndrome (CFIDS), Fibromyalgia (FM), Rheumatic sites to > see if I can find more ETIOLOGIC, ground braking treatments like Dr > Brown's and Marshall ... cause I do not like the NSAID, > Corticosteroid, Sulfasazaline, Methotrexate, etc path ... > > 2. Post a picture of my white tongue (primarily was the back of it, > after recent Clindamycin is a bit more ...)and understand why for > 20 years doctors were unable to tell me what it was, and it does not > come back as Candida form Lab Test, but they are unable to tell me > what it is. Might be Sjogren Syndrome (Sicca Syndrome), BUT I must > say that I have a Metallic Taste and teethe get a white deposit > which I clean al least daily (this disappeared in Sept for 4 days > with Clindamycin). I have saliva on the tongue, is not entirely dry, > for the time being it only feels like dry, but is actually not dry > as of yet, I should probably call it Metallic Taste (?). > > Get a glass of water to spit into upon arising first thing in morning. The spittle might have little filaments which go down to the bottom of the glass--that is a sign of candidiasis (everyone has C. albicans, but OVERGROWTH will affect the entire alimentary tract). If you do have candidiasis, you will have to eat a high- protein diet that excludes all sugar (even from fruit!)--and treat this aggressively with caprylic acid (2500mg/day for no more than six weeks), colloidal silver, and garlic. No alcohol in any form! > > > > > 3. A doctor told me to investigate Hepatitis C (in 2003 I vaccinated > for Hepatitis A and B - even though now I learn that this kind of > vaccine as well may cause problems > http://www.immunesupport.com/library/showarticle.cfm/ID/4448/e/1/T/CF > IDS_FM/ Until now I cannot say I have pain at the place of vaccine > in muscles of the upper arm, in fact was subcutaneous - or am I > mistaken ? I may have to ask the place ... !). Reading on the > Internet I found that indeed Hepatitis C typically evolves quietly > for 20 years, and patients only learn about it when liver is already > damaged ... , so I though to investigate it out. This coming Fr I > get back the Lab Test Results ... > > 4. I already initiated contact with Labs for Marshall Vitamin D > Tests (not progressing very well, as of yet ...), I REALLY WANT TO > TRY THIS, IT LOOKS LIKE THE ONLY GOOD OPTION, UNLESS YOU TELL ME > DIFFERENT ... ! > > 5. I tried and tried to find a Dr. to understand Marshall or at > least Dr Brown, here in Bucharest /Romania where I live in exile. I > found one nice Dr but 500km away (he did a Dr Degree in this > direction, and was the first to indicate Dr Brown's Protocol to > me ...). I keep a bit longer in trying to find one in Bucharest. > Probably if I am lucky Marshall Group already has one, I must > contact them a.s.a.p. Otherwise I will travel to the one I have at > 500 Km's. We are " pen palls " anyway. > > 6. The recent posting POTASSIUM DEFICIENCY AS A CAUSE OF RHEUMATOID > ARTHRITIS puzzled me, happy to find one more cause, but does not > seem a treatment plan does exist as it is the case with Marshall, > what would Marshal think of that, I plan to submit question. ... , > hope I get to do it ... ! > > Well, I guess this is enough, if I forgot something I will get back > later, better one day I will revise it and post it on a Web THANK > YOU ALL ! > > > > > > To unsubscribe, email: rheumatic-unsubscribeegroups > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 14, 2004 Report Share Posted December 14, 2004 Dear , We have a Romanian doctor who uses antibiotic therapy and who has helped us here in our group. You might like to contact him about your condition. Dr. Markus Sorin, Str. Prof. , Nr 3, home – Apelor Str, Bl325, scB, et1, ap5 B1337, ScA, Et3, AP13, IASI, 6600, jud Iasi IASI 6600, ROMANIA Romania. markus@... markus@... drmarkuss2@... drmarkuss1@... or 'phone Romania 0040/745/631438. Dr. Sorin's protocol is in Romanian on our web page and I have copied it here. Chris. PROTOCOL FOR USING ANTIBIOTICS IN THE TREATMENT OF RHEUMATIC DISEASES Principalul mecanism patogenic consta intr-o hipersensibilizare mediata celular si persistenta creata prin expunerea indelungata la antigene erivate dintr-o sursa microbiana invizibila, obscura, si anume mycoplasme si forme L bacteriene. Mycoplasmele isi produc efectele patogenice la om nu prin metoda clasica a invaziei si distructiei tisulare extinse, ci printr-un raspuns mediat celular determina un parazitism intracelular de lunga durata, cu eliberare intermitenta de antigene din celula, care produce sensibilizarea graduala a gazdei. Progresia acestor boli se produce prin hiperreactivitatea tesuturilor gazda cu ajungerea la stari perimune si autoimune ( prin dezvoltarea de reactii incrucisate prin asemanare moleculara).Aceasta etapa hiperimuna e expresia celei de-a doua linii de aparare a sistemului imun, si era tinta tratamentului conventional. Focusul terapeutic trebuie insa sa ie eliminarea micoplasmelor ca sursa antigenica principala. Citeva proprietati biologice ale mycoplasmelor trebuie precizate aici pentru a intelege mai bine virulenta acestor infectii lente: rezidenta intracelulara care protejeaza mycoplasmele de mecani smele de aparare si de tratamentele mycoplasmicide, permitind un parazitism de lunga durata cu eliberare intermitenta de antigene, ceea ce duce la boli cronice generare de radicali liberi de oxigen prin distrugerea membranei celulelor invadate a unei structuri asemanatoare unei capsule bacteriene, ce protejeaza mycoplasmele de actiunea mecanismelor locale de aparare- variabilitate antigenica, ce permite pacalirea mecanismelor imunologice ale gazdei enzime mycoplasmice in interiorul celulelor gazda cu distrugerea unor celule sau cu producerea de aberatii cromosomiale la nivelul lor. Intrarea mycoplasmelor in organism se produce probabil devreme in cursul vietii, in perioada de sugar, cand mecanismele imunitatii celulare sunt inca sla be, iar mycoplasmele ramin cantonate intracelular multi ani. Anticorpii antimycoplasmici secretati de plasmocite cresc in concentratie pe masura trecerii timpului in tesuturile invecinate celulelor infectate, fiind in echilibru cu mycoplasmele intracelul re si impiedicind raspindirea lor sau eliberarea de antigene. Cu alte cuvinte, raspunsul hiperimun antimycoplasmic e raspunzator el insusi de oprirea replicarii bacteriene si de marele grad de localizare a mycoplasmelor la locul infectiei. Ori de cate o i organismul trece printr-o perioada de impas imunologic(stres, infectie, modificari ale presiunii atmosferice,medicatii imunosupresoare sau orice alta injurie) balanta dintre mycoplasmele intracelulare si anticorpii pericelulari se inclina, permitind el berarea de mycoplasme-deci raspindirea infectiei, sau eliberarea de antigene mycoplasmice ce autointretin procesul hiperimun. Caracteristicile clinice ale acestor boli se explica prin tercerea intermitenta de antigene si toxine bacteriene in circulatia si stemica cu acumularea lor in urmatoarele sedii mai importante: maduva hematogena, cu producere de citopenii, in special anemie, frecvent intilnita in conectivite SNC, cu producere de depresie, inabilitate de concentrare, pierderea interesului pt activit atile cotidiene, iritabilitate Sistemul muscular- producind astenie si oboseala musculara Sistem endocrin- producind disfunctii endocrine. Toate aparatele si sistemele pot fi afectate. Pentru inducerea unei remisiuni complete e necesara suprimarea producerii de antigene bacteriene, care nu se poate face decat prin tratament antibiotic, deci indepartind sursa antigenica. Obiectivele terapiei trebuie deci sa fie 1)impiedicarea producerii de antigene mycoplasmice, 2)evitarea eliberarii masive de antigene infectioase si 3)evitarea eliberarii de antigene prin hipersensibilitate la medicamente care s-ar putea produce la o supramedicatie Aceste obiective sunt obtinute prin folosirea de antibiotice in (in opozitie fata de dozele mari folosite conventional in terapia antiinfectioasa), cu administrare intermitenta fata de tratamentul antibiotic clasic care trebuie sa fie sustinut si nicidecum intermitent, si in tratament de foarte lunga durata -3-5ani (fata de tratamentul conventional care dureaza cit eva zile- saptamini). Daca doza de antibiotic e prea mare, sau I se asociaza prea multe alte medicamente, organismul pus intr-un status hiperimun de catre boala in sine, reactioneaza impotriva medicamentului, si scopul nu este atins( hipersensibilitate int irziata la antibiotic), sau dimpotriva se elibereaza masiv antigene bacteriene. Aceasta reactie produsa prin supramedicatie se numeste reactie Herxheimer iar clinic se manifesta prin simptome identice cu cele ale unui puseu de evolutivitate al bolii. Di acest motiv, dozele de antibiotic trebuie sa fie reduse la minimum, in special la inceputul tratamentului cu minociclin, putindu-se creste treptat doza in functie de toleranta individuala. Toate statusurile hiperimune provocate de bacterii necesita tratament intermitent (ex:tb, bruceloza si RAA). O atentie deosebita e atribuita in protocol infectiilor de focar(in special infectii rinosinusale, genitourinare, pelvine, intestinale si dentare)- surse de antigene in fluidele intra- si extravasculare, care ar a duce un nou set de variabile in ecuatia balantei dintre mycoplasme si mecanismele de aparare ale organismului. De aceea, ele trebuie cautate si tratate prompt inaintea inceperii terapiei antimicoplasmice si pe parcurs de cate ori e nevoie.In special antic rpii antistreptococici, dar nu numai, reactioneaza incrucisat cu proteine micoplasmice, si de aceea in special infectiile streptococice trebuie tratate prompt. Daca pacientul are un titru ASLO crescut si o istorie de infectie streptococica, va terbui sa fa ca tratament cu 250 mg ampicilina pe zi zilnic-dar nu luat concomitent cu minociclinul, pina ce titrul ASLO se normalizeaza. III TRATAMENT Vom discuta separat formele severe vechi si pe de alta parte formele recente si incipiente de boala. 1) Formele sever e si vechi de boala Tratamentul e directionat pe 2 fronturi: cauza infectioasa si raspunsul hiperimun. Pentru a atinge cele 2 tinte se vor folosi pe de o parte doze constante de antiinflamatoare nesteroidiene si pe de alta parte doze mici, intermitente de antibiotice. Primele vor fi administrate pe perioade scurte, iar ultimele- pe perioade de ani neincetat. Daca pacientul a urmat sau inca urmeaza tratament cu medicatie clasica imunosupresiva si/sau corticoterapie la doze mari e obligatorie o perioada de ashout(spalare) de 4-6 saptamini pentru a elimina aceste surse antigenice din organism. In acest interval se pot administra doze mici de PDN- sub 10 mg pe zi. Medicatia antiinflamatoare are drept scop reducerea inflamatiei si inlesnirea caii de acces a antibioticelor in tesuturile inflamate. Datorita raspunsului si tolerantei individuale, alegerea AINS folosit sau a PDN la doze mici neimunosupresive va fi individuala. La inceput pacientul va fi avertizat ca tratamentul e extrem de lent si gradualiar primele imbunatatiri semnificative apar dupa 6 luni-1 an, sau chiar mai mult. Bolnavii cu forme severe vor urma o serie de perfuzii iv cu clindamicina(lincomicina), cu scopul de a era dica formele L persistente in intestin, tract respiratorsi genitourinar , dar si de a creste absorbtia intestinal a tetraciclinelor. Clindamicina se concentreaza in fagosomi si deci ajunge foarte bine la locul inflamatiei. Dozele sunt de 300 mg la inceput 2 zile, apoi 600, apoi 900 mg, doza care e mentinuta citeva zile daca nu apar eactii adverse. Dozele vor fi spatiate luni, miercuri si vineri, iar apoi, si pe perioada de intretinere se mai pot face cite o cura de perfuzii cu lincocin la intervale alese individual. In loc de administrarea iv se poate administra si im, dar atunci administrarea va fi zilnica pe o perioada de 2 saptamini, cu 300 mg, repetat la 3 sau 6 luni. Unii autori pledeaza pentru administrare orala a clindamicinei 1200mg odata pe saptamina. Dupa perioada de atac cu lincomicin, se administreaza minociclin sau doxiciclin, continuind intermitent cu lincomicin.In formele severe si vechi doza de minociclin sau doxiciclin va fi foarte mica la inceput- 50-100 mg/zi odata sau de 2 ori pe saptamina, pentru a creste trepat la dozele standard de 100 mg/zi luni-miercuri-vi eri. 2) Forme usoare si recente Aceste forme vor fi tratate de la inceput cu terapie orala cu minociclin sau doxiciclin, in dozele standard prezentate mai sus, in general nefiind nevoie de tratament iv. Administrarea de doze mai mari, sau administrarea la intervale mai mici d e timp nu e indicata, si e chiar nociva. Trebuie cunoscute 2 elemente de farmacocinetica:Absorbtia tetraciclinelor e predominanta in mediul acid din stomac, si mai mica in intestin, iar absorbtia e diminuata de metale divalente, in special de calciu. Cresterea dozelor In ciuda senzatiei ca doze mai mari ar fi si doze mai eficiente, in primele 3-6 luni nu e permisa o crestere a dozelor.Dupa acest interval, dozele pot fi crescute usor daca nu exista semne de reactie Herx. La intervale de 1-3 luni se face un bilant clinic si bioumoral si daca imbunatatirea e evidenta nu se cresc dozele. Daca nu exista imbunatatire evidenta ci datele bioumorale se stabilizeaza la un nivel patologic dar fara sa fie reactie Herx, se vor creste dozele, dar itervalul dintre doze nu se modifica.Se revine la doza anterioara daca apare reactie Herx. Cand statusul inflamator articular e foarte intens, se pot practica injectii intraarticulare cu clindamicina 300 mg in articulatiile mari +4mg dexametasona.lDozele vor fi mai mici pt articulatiile mici. Reactia Herxheimer E o reactie ce apare de obicei in primele saptamini de la inceperea terapiei, dar poate aparea oricand prin eliberare masiva de antigene bacteriene, si e mai frecventa cand boala e mai severa. Cand tratamentul a fost deja foarte eficient si s-au eradicat majoritatea mycoplasmelor din organism, riscul de reactie Herx e foarte mic.E in acelasi timp o dovada ca tratamentul e eficient, deci e un semn bun. Dg diferential intre reactia Herx, puseul de actiitate al bolii si reactie alergica se face folosind VSH, Albuminemia si globulinemia, Numarul GA si numarul eozinofilelor:GA cresc pe parcursul tratamentului in reactia Herx si scad in puseul d eevolutivitate al bolii(in mod paradoxal- spre deosebire de p cientii fara tratament anibiotic, unde GA cresc in puseul de activitate).In reactia Herx VSH,globulinemia si - globulinemia cresc, pe cand serinemia si albuminemia scad, evidentiind un raspuns imunologic crescut la antigenele bacteriene.O eozinofilie marcata e evidenta unei reactii alergice la tratament. Pe parcursul terapiei, toate probele bioumorale trebuie sa revina la valorile normale sub actiunea antibioticului. Dupa o perioada lunga de tratament, Dr Brown recomanda o rotire a antibioticului folosit, chiar daca se va folosi tot un antibiotic din aceiasi clasa. Efecte adverse. La dozele si intervalele recomandate, efectele adverse(cu exceptia reactiei Herx) sunt foarte reduse.Terapia indelungata nu e urmata la tetracicline de rezistenta bacteriana, ca la alte antibiotice. In ce priveste infectiile fungice, riscul lor e foarte mic la aceasta schema de administrare, si ar fi abuziva terapia antifungica rpeventiva. E suficienta doar prescrierea de lactobacilus acidophilus, care readucind flora normala intetinala, previne candidozele. Daca candidoza apare totusi, ea trebuie tratata prompt cu antifungice. Dr. Markus Sorin can be contacted at drmarkuss2@... or drmarkuss1@... or 'phone Romania 0040/745/631438. On 14/12/2004, at 6:33 AM, wrote: > > > Dear fellows, > > I know most of you are in quite bad shape and suffering, so I > apologize if I am causing you trouble with my writing ... I hope > will help us all somehow ... > > > Unfortunately my situation is a such that I really am in need of > URGENT Help, and cant help it ... ! > I have a suggested diagnostic of > > 1. Enthesitis /Periostitis in the sitting ischio-pubian area (exact > etiologic cause is not quite clear). This condition caused me to > stop working 3 years ago, financially I cannot last much longer > unless I do something quick ...! > > A Dr suggested Seronegative Spondyloarthropathy subdivision Reactive > Arthritis. Have taken oral Clindamycin 300mg 3 x day for 3 days, 2 > x day for another 7 days (10 days in total) once in Sept 2004, > second time in Nov 2004. > Cannot say it did help, except I felt better the first time only (in > Sept) for the first 4 days with nose, mouth, teeth, tongue, upper > respiratory tract, slept better. After the first 4 days, nose and > throat became more dry then before, tongue is more white, and the > POSITIVE effect did not repeat in Nov, but the tongue became more > white and all more dry. > Lab test says is NOT Candida - A good question what is it? I am > awaiting new Lab Tests results in days ... Is it all related to > autoimmune disorders (Sjogren /Sicca Syndrome?) I do not know > enough ! > > A Bone Scan shows a point of inflammation in the under-pubic area, > and in fact it may be more then just this ... > > > 2. Myofasciitis (which is very similar or related to > Fibromyalgia ...?). I do have a history of overuse through sitting > in 2000, which triggered my currently chronic sitting pain . > > 3. Chronic Fatigue Syndrome (I recently realized I had it in various > degrees for about 20 years, between the age of 20 to current - I am > now 41 (in 2004)). > > 4. Irritable Bowel Syndrome the Dr says, (for me the primary > manifestation is abnormal soft to diarrheic stool, no abdominal pain > at least as of yet). > Clindamycin regulated the stool, but effects are not lasting more > then 1.5 months. The side effects of Clindamycin seem to great to > continue ... > > > == > As an additional symptom I get lots of rectal itching and occasional > degenerates to what I believe is like Hemorrhoidal Pain, was to 5 > Proctologist, they say beside a bit of cream is nothing major there. > On the other hand I read on > http://www.drmirkin.com/morehealth/g144.htm MYCOPLASMA, CHLAMYDIA > AND UREAPLASMA (pathogens without cell wall - or something to that > effect ...) > == > > > A. I learned of Dr Browns Protocol http://www.rheumatic.org/ , > > B. More recently I learned of Marshall Protocol > http://www.sarcinfo.com/ , http://www.marshallprotocol.com/ , other > related sites. > > To me it seems that Marshal Protocol is an updated version, new, > complete of Dr Brown's Protocol. > I will keep looking for information, but I feel weaker and weaker as > time goes on, I MUST DO something PRACTICAL. > > I WORK TO SEND A LAB TEST FOR VITAMIN D (as per Marshal Protocol), > to be my Christmas Gift ... Any thoughts? Is quite expensive for me > here (from Romania). Is there a good reason why some people still do > Dr Brown, as opposite to Marshall? > > Can anybody post picture and practical advice regarding frozen > shipment with dry ice (if I am not mistaken ?). Where to typically > get Dry Ice from? I asked several Medical Labs, but they tell me > they only ship National, by refrigerated truck, no experience with > Dry Ice. Entertainment Industry? > > DO YOU KNOW ANY OTHER GREAT DIAGNOSTIC AND TREATMENTS LIKE Dr Brown > and Marshall , or is that all? > Doctors give me NSAID, Anti-depressives, Sulfasazaline, but I am not > taking them because I know this are symptomatic treatments, at best > stopping the pathology (Sulfasazaline), but not etiologic. NSAID and > Cortisone failed to provide any relief of the sitting pain, and not > even remotely are they addressing the Chronic Fatigue component. > > I am trying to post on a Web Site my Lab Tests and All Symptoms, but > I see that days and even weeks went by without me succeeding to > accomplish the " perfect " posting, so today I put together this > present posting to just MOVE FORWARDS, AWAITING with much interest > your reactions... THANK YOU IN ADVANCE ! > > > > Some of the Other Topics and approaches that I plan to investigate: > 1. Visit more Chronic Fatigue Syndrome (CFS), Chronic Fatigue Immune > Deficiency Syndrome (CFIDS), Fibromyalgia (FM), Rheumatic sites to > see if I can find more ETIOLOGIC, ground braking treatments like Dr > Brown's and Marshall ... cause I do not like the NSAID, > Corticosteroid, Sulfasazaline, Methotrexate, etc path ... > > 2. Post a picture of my white tongue (primarily was the back of it, > after recent Clindamycin is a bit more ...)and understand why for > 20 years doctors were unable to tell me what it was, and it does not > come back as Candida form Lab Test, but they are unable to tell me > what it is. Might be Sjogren Syndrome (Sicca Syndrome), BUT I must > say that I have a Metallic Taste and teethe get a white deposit > which I clean al least daily (this disappeared in Sept for 4 days > with Clindamycin). I have saliva on the tongue, is not entirely dry, > for the time being it only feels like dry, but is actually not dry > as of yet, I should probably call it Metallic Taste (?). > > 3. A doctor told me to investigate Hepatitis C (in 2003 I vaccinated > for Hepatitis A and B - even though now I learn that this kind of > vaccine as well may cause problems > http://www.immunesupport.com/library/showarticle.cfm/ID/4448/e/1/T/CF > IDS_FM/ Until now I cannot say I have pain at the place of vaccine > in muscles of the upper arm, in fact was subcutaneous - or am I > mistaken ? I may have to ask the place ... !). Reading on the > Internet I found that indeed Hepatitis C typically evolves quietly > for 20 years, and patients only learn about it when liver is already > damaged ... , so I though to investigate it out. This coming Fr I > get back the Lab Test Results ... > > 4. I already initiated contact with Labs for Marshall Vitamin D > Tests (not progressing very well, as of yet ...), I REALLY WANT TO > TRY THIS, IT LOOKS LIKE THE ONLY GOOD OPTION, UNLESS YOU TELL ME > DIFFERENT ... ! > > 5. I tried and tried to find a Dr. to understand Marshall or at > least Dr Brown, here in Bucharest /Romania where I live in exile. I > found one nice Dr but 500km away (he did a Dr Degree in this > direction, and was the first to indicate Dr Brown's Protocol to > me ...). I keep a bit longer in trying to find one in Bucharest. > Probably if I am lucky Marshall Group already has one, I must > contact them a.s.a.p. Otherwise I will travel to the one I have at > 500 Km's. We are " pen palls " anyway. > > 6. The recent posting POTASSIUM DEFICIENCY AS A CAUSE OF RHEUMATOID > ARTHRITIS puzzled me, happy to find one more cause, but does not > seem a treatment plan does exist as it is the case with Marshall, > what would Marshal think of that, I plan to submit question. ... , > hope I get to do it ... ! > > Well, I guess this is enough, if I forgot something I will get back > later, better one day I will revise it and post it on a Web THANK > YOU ALL ! > > > > > > > To unsubscribe, email: rheumatic-unsubscribeegroups > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 15, 2004 Report Share Posted December 15, 2004 Hi ! Geoff here. I'm sure you'll get or have already gotten quite a lot of help on this. Two things I noted in your symptom list and have not seen a response to were: > As an additional symptom I get lots of rectal itching and occasional > degenerates to what I believe is like Hemorrhoidal Pain, was to 5 You might want to stop eating sweets, especially simple sugars but for a couple of weeks anything sweet to the taste, including fruits, juice drinks, smoothies, etc. This symptom can be indicative of developing diabetes-related problems. If you stop the sugars and the itching and pain are relieved, you know two things: 1. You have a problem if you ingest excess sugar 2. You can control the problem by diet and maybe avoid serious consequences You will also be able to easily prove this by simply overindulging again, which may also make you feel sluggish and give you some mild stomach upset. This " test " may also lead you to consider giving a little extra attention to things that can bolster your pancreas, etc., like Vitamin C. You may also want to check out a book entitled " Everybody's Guide to Homeopathic Medicines: Safe and Effective Remedies for You and Your Family by Cummings, Dana Ullman " ISBN 0874778433 (Used from $5.70 at Amazon) And in regard to: > Post a picture of my white tongue (primarily was the back of it, [snip] > say that I have a Metallic Taste and teethe get a white deposit > which I clean al least daily (this disappeared in Sept for 4 days > with Clindamycin). I have saliva on the tongue, is not entirely dry, > for the time being it only feels like dry, but is actually not dry > as of yet, I should probably call it Metallic Taste (?). You will find specifically the symptoms you describe for your tongue and taste, perhaps under mercurius. If you decide to use homeopathics, you must pay extremely close attention to taking them properly. Ullman does an excellent job of describing the issues in his book. HTH Geoff soli Deo gloria www.HealingYou.org Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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