Guest guest Posted May 7, 2001 Report Share Posted May 7, 2001 Nick Im sorry I got my knickers in a twist ! I have to attend a doctors and dentists meeting every month. One doctor who is in early recovery said that he was drunk in the surgery , but he thought it was not a big problem because no patients had ever made a complaint ! I too have had to listen to these drunkalogues /drugalogues, and I have heard many of them and it makes me very nervous when I have to go to the doctor myself ! I think that they all know they have put patients at risk , but they are only human and denial is more comfortable Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 7, 2001 Report Share Posted May 7, 2001 Very interesting...I enjoyed the JRR issue covering Kishline et al., even though Jack seems to take more flack than probably anyone. The unfortunate problem is that, because (as an example) it's natural for someone to think the " Beast " concept is nuts until they make a minimal effort to understand it or use it, Jack's great insights into aspects of AA (like the " foremost moderation program " ) get dismissed, and because those who leave AA have become habituated to the purely AA-based concept of social cohesion, they are offended by his " we can't help you " premise. On top of that, people make hollow statements like " the Beast must be a disease concept if it's part of the person, rather than a maladaptive coping skill that one matures out of by increasing his/her frustration tolerance, peer group, and occupation, identifying the maladaptive ideas reinforced during their upbringing which result in irrational thoughts and musterbation resulting in drinking which causes more irrational beliefs and a lack of universal self-acceptance............ " You also touched on the subjectivity of the addiction experience, which is presumed to be " cult logic " when really it's an obvious phenomenon. Schaler's book really struck me in that regard; he completely failed to address many points and just used others' clinical terminology. " Maturing out " is mentioned about twenty times, yet he does not give one single bit of information on what he means by that term. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 7, 2001 Report Share Posted May 7, 2001 Very interesting...I enjoyed the JRR issue covering Kishline et al., even though Jack seems to take more flack than probably anyone. The unfortunate problem is that, because (as an example) it's natural for someone to think the " Beast " concept is nuts until they make a minimal effort to understand it or use it, Jack's great insights into aspects of AA (like the " foremost moderation program " ) get dismissed, and because those who leave AA have become habituated to the purely AA-based concept of social cohesion, they are offended by his " we can't help you " premise. On top of that, people make hollow statements like " the Beast must be a disease concept if it's part of the person, rather than a maladaptive coping skill that one matures out of by increasing his/her frustration tolerance, peer group, and occupation, identifying the maladaptive ideas reinforced during their upbringing which result in irrational thoughts and musterbation resulting in drinking which causes more irrational beliefs and a lack of universal self-acceptance............ " You also touched on the subjectivity of the addiction experience, which is presumed to be " cult logic " when really it's an obvious phenomenon. Schaler's book really struck me in that regard; he completely failed to address many points and just used others' clinical terminology. " Maturing out " is mentioned about twenty times, yet he does not give one single bit of information on what he means by that term. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 7, 2001 Report Share Posted May 7, 2001 Very interesting...I enjoyed the JRR issue covering Kishline et al., even though Jack seems to take more flack than probably anyone. The unfortunate problem is that, because (as an example) it's natural for someone to think the " Beast " concept is nuts until they make a minimal effort to understand it or use it, Jack's great insights into aspects of AA (like the " foremost moderation program " ) get dismissed, and because those who leave AA have become habituated to the purely AA-based concept of social cohesion, they are offended by his " we can't help you " premise. On top of that, people make hollow statements like " the Beast must be a disease concept if it's part of the person, rather than a maladaptive coping skill that one matures out of by increasing his/her frustration tolerance, peer group, and occupation, identifying the maladaptive ideas reinforced during their upbringing which result in irrational thoughts and musterbation resulting in drinking which causes more irrational beliefs and a lack of universal self-acceptance............ " You also touched on the subjectivity of the addiction experience, which is presumed to be " cult logic " when really it's an obvious phenomenon. Schaler's book really struck me in that regard; he completely failed to address many points and just used others' clinical terminology. " Maturing out " is mentioned about twenty times, yet he does not give one single bit of information on what he means by that term. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 7, 2001 Report Share Posted May 7, 2001 Moderation certainly isnt for me . I cant imagine just having one or two drinks . I think my particular unrealistic fantasy is that every once in a while I could have a binge . I wont risk it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 7, 2001 Report Share Posted May 7, 2001 Moderation certainly isnt for me . I cant imagine just having one or two drinks . I think my particular unrealistic fantasy is that every once in a while I could have a binge . I wont risk it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 11, 2001 Report Share Posted May 11, 2001 > Good to hear that Peele is willing to state that Schaler is a loony. Hey Nick! Peele didnt say that! A lawyer knows better than to say something actionable of another lawyer, particularly a psychologist of a shrink, where professional status is at stake! If anything, Schaler hinted it of Peele! P. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 11, 2001 Report Share Posted May 11, 2001 > Good to hear that Peele is willing to state that Schaler is a loony. Hey Nick! Peele didnt say that! A lawyer knows better than to say something actionable of another lawyer, particularly a psychologist of a shrink, where professional status is at stake! If anything, Schaler hinted it of Peele! P. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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