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The question set me thinking. One thing I always felt about AA was

that it was very tailored to a (particular) male perspective e.g.

very hierarchical and supportive of a " great-war-story " , " pub-type "

of drinker etc. Although I was quite big on consumption(!) that model

wasn't me - I often felt a greater empathy with what was assumed to

be more a " female " type of drinking. I have heared this described

in derogatory way by (male) AA's as " lace curtain alcoholism " plus I

had a rather macho posturing sponsor who always got in his dig about

" Our stories being very different " , whenever I shared. lol

On searching the web for non 12-step organisations I have been rather

impressed by the ideas of " Women for Sobriety " . It seems to describe

a lot of *my* relation to acoholic drinking and now current thinking.

Anyone given WFS a try? I'm the wrong sex! - I think there is now an

MFS though?

Mack

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Hi Mack

When AA's go on about genetic theories of alcoholism, they neglect to

mention that one of its chief adherents Cloninger, posited two types

of alcoholism, a bvery severe " male-limited " that was primarily

genetic and only occurred in males, and " milieu-limited " that occurred

in both sexes and was primarily caused by environmental influences.

All women have the milieu-limited variety and jence are different from

male AA members who tend to be, or talk themselves into being, the

make-limited type.

Another way of looking at this is an obscure nosological system that I

draw attention to aoccasionally. That is addiction as " Hedomism " - to

get loaded - or as " Nurturance " - to soothe. Males tend to do the

former and females the latter. Alcohol can be used in either fashion.

The early AAs were almost certainly all the male-limited

" Hedonsitic " type and the 12-step program reflects this; something

like Kasl's 16s-tep program might be more appropriate for

" Nuurturants " .

P.

> The question set me thinking. One thing I always felt about AA was

> that it was very tailored to a (particular) male perspective e.g.

> very hierarchical and supportive of a " great-war-story " , " pub-type "

> of drinker etc. Although I was quite big on consumption(!) that

model

> wasn't me - I often felt a greater empathy with what was assumed to

> be more a " female " type of drinking. I have heared this described

> in derogatory way by (male) AA's as " lace curtain alcoholism " plus I

> had a rather macho posturing sponsor who always got in his dig about

> " Our stories being very different " , whenever I shared. lol

>

> On searching the web for non 12-step organisations I have been

rather

> impressed by the ideas of " Women for Sobriety " . It seems to describe

> a lot of *my* relation to acoholic drinking and now current

thinking.

> Anyone given WFS a try? I'm the wrong sex! - I think there is now an

> MFS though?

>

> Mack

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Hi Mack

When AA's go on about genetic theories of alcoholism, they neglect to

mention that one of its chief adherents Cloninger, posited two types

of alcoholism, a bvery severe " male-limited " that was primarily

genetic and only occurred in males, and " milieu-limited " that occurred

in both sexes and was primarily caused by environmental influences.

All women have the milieu-limited variety and jence are different from

male AA members who tend to be, or talk themselves into being, the

make-limited type.

Another way of looking at this is an obscure nosological system that I

draw attention to aoccasionally. That is addiction as " Hedomism " - to

get loaded - or as " Nurturance " - to soothe. Males tend to do the

former and females the latter. Alcohol can be used in either fashion.

The early AAs were almost certainly all the male-limited

" Hedonsitic " type and the 12-step program reflects this; something

like Kasl's 16s-tep program might be more appropriate for

" Nuurturants " .

P.

> The question set me thinking. One thing I always felt about AA was

> that it was very tailored to a (particular) male perspective e.g.

> very hierarchical and supportive of a " great-war-story " , " pub-type "

> of drinker etc. Although I was quite big on consumption(!) that

model

> wasn't me - I often felt a greater empathy with what was assumed to

> be more a " female " type of drinking. I have heared this described

> in derogatory way by (male) AA's as " lace curtain alcoholism " plus I

> had a rather macho posturing sponsor who always got in his dig about

> " Our stories being very different " , whenever I shared. lol

>

> On searching the web for non 12-step organisations I have been

rather

> impressed by the ideas of " Women for Sobriety " . It seems to describe

> a lot of *my* relation to acoholic drinking and now current

thinking.

> Anyone given WFS a try? I'm the wrong sex! - I think there is now an

> MFS though?

>

> Mack

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Mack,

Yes there is a " Men For Sobriety " but I think their contact info is the same

as WFS. I have not made a meeting yet, so I know little about it (I think I'm

a bit gunshy from those AA meetings!).Hope you can get more info from this:

Woman For Sobriety

Box 618

Quakertown, PA 18951

Phone:

Fax:

http://www.womenforsobriety.org/

Email: NewLife@... _Sam

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Mack,

Yes there is a " Men For Sobriety " but I think their contact info is the same

as WFS. I have not made a meeting yet, so I know little about it (I think I'm

a bit gunshy from those AA meetings!).Hope you can get more info from this:

Woman For Sobriety

Box 618

Quakertown, PA 18951

Phone:

Fax:

http://www.womenforsobriety.org/

Email: NewLife@... _Sam

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Thanks for posting the info, Sam. In the well-know European offshore

paradise we call the UK, out choices might be limited re. WFS or MFS.

Notwithstanding, they do seem to have some good ideas especially for

those with the required prerequisite! :-) Good luck with whatever you

choose to pursue.

Mack

> Mack,

> Yes there is a " Men For Sobriety " but I think their contact info is

the same

> as WFS. I have not made a meeting yet, so I know little about it (I

think I'm

> a bit gunshy from those AA meetings!).Hope you can get more info

from this:

>

> Woman For Sobriety

> Box 618

> Quakertown, PA 18951

> Phone:

> Fax:

> http://www.womenforsobriety.org/

> Email: NewLife@n... _Sam

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Share on other sites

Thanks for posting the info, Sam. In the well-know European offshore

paradise we call the UK, out choices might be limited re. WFS or MFS.

Notwithstanding, they do seem to have some good ideas especially for

those with the required prerequisite! :-) Good luck with whatever you

choose to pursue.

Mack

> Mack,

> Yes there is a " Men For Sobriety " but I think their contact info is

the same

> as WFS. I have not made a meeting yet, so I know little about it (I

think I'm

> a bit gunshy from those AA meetings!).Hope you can get more info

from this:

>

> Woman For Sobriety

> Box 618

> Quakertown, PA 18951

> Phone:

> Fax:

> http://www.womenforsobriety.org/

> Email: NewLife@n... _Sam

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Share on other sites

Thanks for posting the info, Sam. In the well-know European offshore

paradise we call the UK, out choices might be limited re. WFS or MFS.

Notwithstanding, they do seem to have some good ideas especially for

those with the required prerequisite! :-) Good luck with whatever you

choose to pursue.

Mack

> Mack,

> Yes there is a " Men For Sobriety " but I think their contact info is

the same

> as WFS. I have not made a meeting yet, so I know little about it (I

think I'm

> a bit gunshy from those AA meetings!).Hope you can get more info

from this:

>

> Woman For Sobriety

> Box 618

> Quakertown, PA 18951

> Phone:

> Fax:

> http://www.womenforsobriety.org/

> Email: NewLife@n... _Sam

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