Re: FW: Ground ambulance accident data

September 19, 2002

During the same period in Texas, the following air medical helicopter

accidents occurred in Texas:

1999 2 accidents, 3 fatalities

1998 2 accidents, 3 fatalities

1997 0 accidents, 0 fatalities

It would be nice to compare the incidence per helicopter transport and per

ground transport.

BEB

E. Bledsoe, DO, FACEP

Midlothian, Texas

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RE: Ambulance accident data

> Donn,

> The most current motor vehicle traffic accident information I can

> furnish to you at this time is through 1999. The following is from our

> finalized reports for 3 years involving ambulances:

>

> Calendar

> Year Fatal Injury Non-Injury

Total

>

> 1997 1 134 54

> 189

>

> 1998 2 131 50

> 183

>

> 1999 3 153 31

> 187

>

September 19, 2002

Indeed, it would, but it appears that those statistics are not reported or

recorded anywhere except by the individual provider services. I can just

imagine the resistance we would meet if we asked the providers to start

reporting patient transports for statistical tracking purposes, but I would

certainly like to give it a try. There is a research position available at

TDH. I wonder if the person taking that position could be convinced to

undertake such a survey. Might be worth a shot. Job doesn't pay much, but

I'm totally out of work right now anyway. Hmmm...

Donn

Re: FW: Ground ambulance accident data

During the same period in Texas, the following air medical helicopter

accidents occurred in Texas:

1999 2 accidents, 3 fatalities

1998 2 accidents, 3 fatalities

1997 0 accidents, 0 fatalities

It would be nice to compare the incidence per helicopter transport and per

ground transport.

BEB

E. Bledsoe, DO, FACEP

Midlothian, Texas

All outgoing email scanned by Norton Antivirus and guaranteed " virus free "

or your money back.

RE: Ambulance accident data

> Donn,

> The most current motor vehicle traffic accident information I can

> furnish to you at this time is through 1999. The following is from our

> finalized reports for 3 years involving ambulances:

>

> Calendar

> Year Fatal Injury Non-Injury

Total

>

> 1997 1 134 54

> 189

>

> 1998 2 131 50

> 183

>

> 1999 3 153 31

> 187

>

September 20, 2002

Donn,

According to TRAC-IT, all licensed EMS providers were supposed to start

reporting data on ALL EMS runs to TDH on January 1, 2002. Of course, the

database was not ready to accept calls on that date....but nonetheless, the plan

is " in-place " to collect data on ALL EMS runs for Texas....now compliance will

be another issue.

Dudley

PS: This is the 3rd time in 2 states I have been a part of " send us all your

data " ....and all three times there has been no data to show because the actual

scope of the project and the unfunded mandate collaborated to make an issue that

is much larger than any one ever anticipated. All the ambulance runs in the

state....anyone even wanna try guessing what that would be???

September 20, 2002

In a message dated 9/20/2002 10:41:57 AM Central Standard Time,

THEDUDMAN@... writes:

> Donn,

>

> According to TRAC-IT, all licensed EMS providers were supposed to start

> reporting data on ALL EMS runs to TDH on January 1, 2002. Of course, the

> database was not ready to accept calls on that date....but nonetheless, the

> plan is " in-place " to collect data on ALL EMS runs for Texas....now

> compliance will be another issue.

>

> Dudley

>

> PS: This is the 3rd time in 2 states I have been a part of " send us all

> your data " ....and all three times there has been no data to show because

> the actual scope of the project and the unfunded mandate collaborated to

> make an issue that is much larger than any one ever anticipated. All the

> ambulance runs in the state....anyone even wanna try guessing what that

> would be???

>

I want to know who is going to budget me the money to hire someone to do all

of data storing. I bet it isnt TDH.

Andy

>

September 20, 2002

Dudley,

Yes, that is supposed to have started the first of this year, and it has

apparently started badly. In addition, TRAC-IT obviously applies only to

Texas. Historical data for all states seems to be something that has never

been recorded.

Regards,

Donn

Re: FW: Ground ambulance accident data

Donn,

According to TRAC-IT, all licensed EMS providers were supposed to start

reporting data on ALL EMS runs to TDH on January 1, 2002. Of course, the

database was not ready to accept calls on that date....but nonetheless, the

plan is " in-place " to collect data on ALL EMS runs for Texas....now

compliance will be another issue.

Dudley

PS: This is the 3rd time in 2 states I have been a part of " send us all your

data " ....and all three times there has been no data to show because the

actual scope of the project and the unfunded mandate collaborated to make an

issue that is much larger than any one ever anticipated. All the ambulance

runs in the state....anyone even wanna try guessing what that would be???

September 21, 2002

The sad thing that I have been told over and over by other ambulance services

that many are having to try and find money in the budget to hire extra staff

members to enter the required data because of the VOLUME of data. I talked to

our new billing agent the other day, and he implied that he will be forced to

raise what he charges to accomodate the MANY extra key strokes that he will now

be forced to do - he will be submitting our data. I have always told my

students that on any intervention that they perform, they must balance the

potential adverse effects versus the benefit. Which is better? The disease or

the cure? Can we also apply that to this subject? I realize that

epidemiological studies are necessary sometimes to help us improve what we do

by identifying problems etc. But when the route to doing that study incurs

more expense and problems for an already overburdened and overwhelmed system, I

am not sure that the benefit outweighs the adverse effects. Can somebody help

me out with this?

Jane Hill

September 21, 2002

If you find a solution, or someone else has one, let us all know. I bill

for a small third city service on a part-time basis (all I am contracted

for) and I am wondering if I am going to be able to get all the extra

information entered without falling further behind on the all-important job

of keeping revenue coming in to keep the ambulance running.

Jo Bell

At 11:05 AM 9/21/2002, you wrote:

>The sad thing that I have been told over and over by other ambulance

>services

>that many are having to try and find money in the budget to hire extra staff

>members to enter the required data because of the VOLUME of data. I

>talked to

>our new billing agent the other day, and he implied that he will be forced to

>raise what he charges to accomodate the MANY extra key strokes that he

>will now

>be forced to do - he will be submitting our data. I have always told my

>students that on any intervention that they perform, they must balance the

>potential adverse effects versus the benefit. Which is better? The

>disease or

>the cure? Can we also apply that to this subject? I realize that

>epidemiological studies are necessary sometimes to help us improve what we do

>by identifying problems etc. But when the route to doing that study incurs

>more expense and problems for an already overburdened and overwhelmed

>system, I

>am not sure that the benefit outweighs the adverse effects. Can somebody

>help

>me out with this?

>

>Jane Hill

>

September 21, 2002

Jane,

You're exactly right. Many states collect run data, but few provide any

meaningful outcomes. In other words, the collection of data becomes the

" end " , rather than the " means " to an identified end.

What can we expect to change as a result of collecting and reporting

these data? What will be the frequency and reliability of the state-wide

reports? Will they be statistically valid? What elements are marked for

trend analysis? How will these data specifically influence rule making?

Can uniform comparisons be made: by population? - by setting? - by

outcomes? Is there a provision for dropping this requirement if the data

proves unusable, unreliable or invalid? Or will it just go on forever,

regardless of utility or practicality? Was the fiscal impact on EMS

providers ever considered? These are just a few of my questions.

Bob Kellow

je.hill@... wrote:

> The sad thing that I have been told over and over by other ambulance

> services

> that many are having to try and find money in the budget to hire extra

> staff

> members to enter the required data because of the VOLUME of data. I

> talked to

> our new billing agent the other day, and he implied that he will be

> forced to

> raise what he charges to accomodate the MANY extra key strokes that he

> will now

> be forced to do - he will be submitting our data. I have always told

> my

> students that on any intervention that they perform, they must balance

> the

> potential adverse effects versus the benefit. Which is better? The

> disease or

> the cure? Can we also apply that to this subject? I realize that

> epidemiological studies are necessary sometimes to help us improve

> what we do

> by identifying problems etc. But when the route to doing that study

> incurs

> more expense and problems for an already overburdened and overwhelmed

> system, I

> am not sure that the benefit outweighs the adverse effects. Can

> somebody help

> me out with this?

>

> Jane Hill

>

September 21, 2002

Hopefully whomever has good ideas about how or WHY on this new Trac-It info,

they'll post to the list.

Jane Hill

September 21, 2002

Maybe if someone from that section of the department would answer these

questions you raised and shed a little light on the " why's " of all this extra

information gathering that is mandated, we could palate it a little better. Of

course, that STILL wouldn't help us with the expense of having someone enter

all this stuff.

Jane Hill

September 21, 2002

Simple answer. Data collection makes jobs. Good paying jobs. The more data

you manage to get collected, the more people it takes to deal with it. When

you're the first person hired, the best way to move up is to build an empire.

Hire others to be under you. The more people you manage the higher your

budget. The higher your budget the better it looks on your resume`.

Data collection is a particularly good place to " hide " the fact that you

can't really do anything also. Nobody else understands what you do, so there

is that mystery that surrounds you. You MUST be important. And nobody wants

to challenge you. Because in order to challenge you, they have to bother to

learn what you do.

See, it's the perfect job. And it's very easy to hide the fact that you're

not doing anything meaningful with the data because it's so easy to create

charts and reports that nobody understands but are afraid to question because

they're afraid they'll look stupid.

Higher education is the hands down leader in this charade. No wonder ny

can't read. All the money that ought to be spent teaching ny to read

goes to the Office for Mental Masturbation.

When I was at TJC I saw, in 12 years, data collection mushroom. We were

constantly being required to report all kinds of stuff with names like

Outcomes Verification and so forth. As the demands on me as an administrator

to provide more and more mindless drivel to faceless offices increased, I got

more and more bitter about having to do it, and finally it virtually killed

my enthusiasm for being an administrator.

I often spoke out about that, which didn't exactly endear me to the BIG

Kahunas, the ones making big money for doing nothing much meaningful. One of

my colleagues who was particularly prone to announce that The Emperor Has No

Clothes finally got the ax because he wasn't a " team player. "

Much data collection is utter hogwash because it doesn't lead to any changes

in the way we do things. It is data collection for its ownself, and it

supports meaningless jobs.

Now, before you roast me, think about what I've said. Can any of you name a

single benefit that you've ever seen from the data that you have been sending

in for years?

I'm not talking about legitimate research to see what works and what doesn't.

We need more of that.

But every time a new PhD is looking for a topic for a dissertation, we run

the risk of having more data collection rammed down our throats.

Me, I'm going to gather data on the mating habits of Two Headed Dutch

Orphans in Brazil. That should get me a nice grant.

Cynically yours,

Gene Gandy

Gene Gandy, JD, LP

4250 East Aquarius Drive

Tucson, AZ 85718

home and fax

cell

wegandy@...

September 21, 2002