Re: Looking for advice/ guidance/ perspective/ help!

[Guest guest]

most mentally ill people will never admit to being mentally ill, or even

having a problem of any kind. It's always someone ELSE who is the problem

and they rarely ever seek/get help. Many people who are kids of BPD go NC

( no contact) BPD are toxic and will always try to suck you back into their

insane world.

Jackie

I am a young adult and about a year ago I have started seeing a therapist to

get a better understanding of myself and my emotions. One of the specifics

being the strained relationship with my mother. She is a recovering (a term

i use loosely) alcoholic and is also diagnosed with depression. However,

her symptoms go much further beyond that and my therapist has suggested that

she is BPD and from what I have read i agree. The problem is my mother does

not recognize it and I highly doubt she will entertain even the idea. Also,

I am so hurt by her that I just do my best to avoid her and any type of

conversation. I was wondering your thoughts on it and if anyone had any

ideas how or if to approach it with her.

Thanks!

[Guest guest]

Hi and welcome! A few questions if you don't mind to get context.. Do you still

live at home? Are you self-supporting financially? If I were to advise myself

back in a time machine as a young adult, say 18, the most important thing is

ensuring your successful launch into life away from your mother. So finding

real family level support from non-family, building a true support network,

getting away from being dependent financially or otherwise on your mother is Job

One. It is too easy to focus on her, how to talk to her, should you confront

her - all valid questions but it's only by successfully separating from her that

you'll have the best shot at taking the stands you need to and finding your

happiness. But to directly address your question, I would not bring up BPD to

her unless you intend to make requiring her going to therapy a condition of

staying in her life. It generally goes very badly based on all the posts I've

read here.

>

> I am a young adult and about a year ago I have started seeing a therapist to

get a better understanding of myself and my emotions. One of the specifics

being the strained relationship with my mother. She is a recovering (a term i

use loosely) alcoholic and is also diagnosed with depression. However, her

symptoms go much further beyond that and my therapist has suggested that she is

BPD and from what I have read i agree. The problem is my mother does not

recognize it and I highly doubt she will entertain even the idea. Also, I am so

hurt by her that I just do my best to avoid her and any type of conversation. I

was wondering your thoughts on it and if anyone had any ideas how or if to

approach it with her.

>

> Thanks!

>

[Guest guest]

I would advise against approaching her about having BPD at all.

The results of suggesting that she's mentally ill are likely to

be explosive. BPs would much rather believe that everyone else

has a problem rather than even considering that the problem

might be them. That's a pretty consistent result of their mental

illness.

What I would advise is simply reacting to her as if she has BPD

if that's what you think her problem is. Set appropriate

boundaries for your relationship with her and try to enforce

them. You didn't mention whether you're still dependent on her

and/or living with her or not. If you are still dependent on

her, that limits how far you can go but you can still try to

control how you react to the things she does. You probably can't

change her but you can change your reactions. One of the things

that I find most important is not engaging in my nada's attempts

at drama. ( " Nada " is what we call are BP mothers who don't act

like mothers.) If she wants to have a fit over some perceived

slight or bad-mouth someone I care about, I don't argue with her

about it. I just refuse to participate in the discussion at all.

I tell her that I'm not going to talk about that subject and

leave if she continues to try to talk about it. If she's nasty

to me I leave. If she insists that I come to her house to deal

with whatever " emergency " she is having, I don't come running

right away. Sometimes I help her when it is convenient for me to

do so, sometimes I tell her that I really can't help her this

time, especially if the supposed emergency isn't going to harm

anyone. After several years of this treatment, she is getting

trained to behave better if she wants to see me. (I don't for a

minute believe that she has seen the error of her ways. She's

just learned that some behaviors are more likely to get the

results she wants.)

At 11:52 PM 04/19/2009 alyson.ledder wrote:

>I am a young adult and about a year ago I have started seeing a

>therapist to get a better understanding of myself and my

>emotions. One of the specifics being the strained relationship

>with my mother. She is a recovering (a term i use loosely)

>alcoholic and is also diagnosed with depression. However, her

>symptoms go much further beyond that and my therapist has

>suggested that she is BPD and from what I have read i

>agree. The problem is my mother does not recognize it and I

>highly doubt she will entertain even the idea. Also, I am so

>hurt by her that I just do my best to avoid her and any type of

>conversation. I was wondering your thoughts on it and if

>anyone had any ideas how or if to approach it with her.

--

Katrina

[Guest guest]

Alyson, Welcome to the club no one really wants to belong to!

Unfortunately, the bad news is that I haven't seen anyone post that

they've been successful with that - though many have asked the

question. Although BP's do end up getting diagnosed after some major

crisis or being in therapy for some other " complaint, " it seems that

there are a multitude more who are never diagnosed and would refuse any

hint of there being anything " wrong with their mind. " That's the case

with my nada (how we refer to BP mothers).

And given the fact that so many of us are well beyond " young " adulthood

shows that dealing with a BP parent can be a lifelong struggle,

especially if you come upon the diagnosis much later and continue to

maintain contact with your parent. I left home at 19, married young and

moved thousands of miles away (still am), but my nada still kept her

hooks in me for a very long time.

The good news is that you've realized something was needed for your own

sake and are getting help. That's a good place to start - understanding

yourself and why you feel the ways that you do. If you can, try to take

whatever actions you need, including lesser or no contact with her until

you can heal yourself. Then, you can decide where your " relationship "

with your nada can go from there, if you want one, although

" relationship " in the true sense of the word implies a two-way exchange

and that is rarely the case with BPs. The additional good news, is that

you have a recognition of the BP at an early age - and there are so many

resources available now to help cope with this. Unfortunately, there

are no magic answers offered for answering the one question you asked.

Your nada has to want answers for herself and seek help in getting them.

The only suggestion I've ever heard offered is for family to speak to an

undiagnosed BP's doctor or therapist to provide context and history in

order for them to make an " informed " diagnosis. But, that implies

receptivity on the part of the patient, and the right doctor/therapist

to start with. Even trained therapists/psychiatrists get fooled. So,

if your mother is seeing a therapist/counselor to deal with her issues

related to alcoholism, and you have any access to that person, there's

the tiniest foot in the door, but I would not invest a whole lot of hope

in that direction. Better to invest in making yourself whole instead.

Suzy

alyson.ledder wrote:

>

>

> I am a young adult and about a year ago I have started seeing a

> therapist to get a better understanding of myself and my emotions. One

> of the specifics being the strained relationship with my mother. She

> is a recovering (a term i use loosely) alcoholic and is also diagnosed

> with depression. However, her symptoms go much further beyond that and

> my therapist has suggested that she is BPD and from what I have read i

> agree. The problem is my mother does not recognize it and I highly

> doubt she will entertain even the idea. Also, I am so hurt by her that

> I just do my best to avoid her and any type of conversation. I was

> wondering your thoughts on it and if anyone had any ideas how or if to

> approach it with her.

>

> Thanks!

>

> .

>

>

[Guest guest]

Alyson - Suzy and Katrina have posted excellent advice, and I think you'll get

lots of agreement from many of us here -

If your mom really has BPD, she probably won't want to hear about it - and if

she devalues you the way many of our BPD moms do, she DEFINITELY won't believe

it if you tell her yourself. Trying to talk with her doctors or therapists can

help, as long as they aren't snowed by BPD manipulation so it backfires on you.

I would NOT bring this up in a " family therapy " setting where your mom is

present, or where other family members can get back to her. BPD's tend to focus

on one or a few close family members - your experience may be very different

from that of siblings or other extended family.

However - if she ACTS like she has BPD, you can REACT to her in the way we KO's

(Kids Of...BPD's) have to learn to do. It won't hurt her, and it will help you

to live your own life.

Figuring all of this out early in your life is a great boon to you. Keep

reading - you'll find a group of smart people who will provide emotional

support, humor, and tips for dealing with your difficult mom.

[Guest guest]

Hi there. Regarding boundaries, if you set a limit, such as not wanting to have

that conversation now, then you need to have a pre-planned response, such as

saying, " I'm sorry, I can't talk now. I'll call you later, " and then hanging up.

Randi Kreger

Randi @BPDCentral.com

Author, " The Essential Family Guide to Borderline Personality Disorder "

(Available at www.BPDCentral.com)

Thanks everyone! Sorry for the delay in getting back/ answering questions...my

internet decided to disappear. I am in college now so I dont live with my

parents but I dont go to school all that far away from their place. I have

kinda grown up making decisions on my own (my parents were absent) so I am

relatively independent but I still rely on them financially as they are paying

for school and my rent. I would love to cut my nada out of my life completely

but they still support me financially and I dont want to cut my father out of

the picture (they are still married). I attempt to set boundaries with her

saying that I dont want to have this conversation right now. Saying that I am

going to hang up the phone now when she continues having the conversation. I

tell her we can talk when she is truly ready to listen to me. The last

conversation we had only ended when she hung up on me mid sentence. Also, I am

to hurt by her to stomach having some fake and phoney relationship where we talk

about shoes and shopping and all those other trivial topics. Am I just not

enforcing the boundaries hard enough? And I hate the feeling that after being

involved with her that somehow I am guilty or a horrible person.

Thanks! I am glad I found this group!!

Alyson

[Guest guest]

Hi Alyson,

Welcome.

I feel the same about not wanting to have a fake and distant relationship where

we only talk trivial chit chat (the weather, her pets) instead of eg how I

really feel. However I also don't want her to know much about me (which just

gives her ammunition to hurt me with later) so I stick to the trivial chit chat.

(I'm very low contact though, I hardly ever call my parents anymore, and they

rarely call me.)

I too felt/feel that I am a horrible person. I'm slowly starting to believe

that that's her, not me. She's the one who was abusive to her kids (in my

opinion), insults, blames, is negative, etc. Sometimes I do these things too (I

guess I learned from her), but most of the time I am really considerate of the

other person's feelings. I remind myself that I rarely do the things above, and

that I'm a good person.

I hope that helps!

P.Bear

Also, I am to hurt by her to stomach having some fake and phoney relationship

where we talk about shoes and shopping and all those other trivial topics. Am I

just not enforcing the boundaries hard enough? And I hate the feeling that

after being involved with her that somehow I am guilty or a horrible person.

>

> Thanks! I am glad I found this group!!

>

> Alyson

>

[Guest guest]

Alyson,

Good luck on this journey.  You may find it easier as you get older to maintain

a relationship with your father in spite of your mom.  It takes stepping outside

of your usual role in the family (which is usually not healthy), setting lots of

boundaries with your mother, and seeing your relationship with your dad as

separate from that with your mom.  It's hard.  Families are systems, and when

one member is very ill and dysfunctional, usually the whole system is designed

to keep that person together--at a very high cost to the other members.  There

are a lot of skills involved in managing all of this and it can take some time

to learn them.

Save the money you are earning that you can.  You may need it.  I was

financially independent from my parents in college, and found the money I had

earned in high school very helpful.  I also had a stipend when I went abroad

because I normally had work-study as part of my financial aid package and I was

able to save about half of that and not use it.  It all helped.  If you have

something to fall back on, it saves a lot of anxiety and keeps you from having

to run to your parents in an emergency--and I'm sure if your nada is anything

like mine, everything you have ever taken from her (whether or not you wanted

it) is saved up and used against you later as a reason to do what she wants or

to just feel generally guilty.  I found it kept my life on a more even keel not

to have to worry so much about that.

Best,

Ashana

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