Guest guest Posted November 15, 2004 Report Share Posted November 15, 2004 Welcome, B.N.... Glad to see you've 'unlurked'!!! heheehheehehe I tend to be a lurker when joining a group too... so you're not the only one. I'm not familiar with 's.. perhaps someone else is and can answer your questions. I'm afraid I'm not gonna be of much help at all.... I'm not familiar with the last four items on your list.... Topper () On Mon, 15 Nov 2004 12:42:41 -0600 "B.N.Texas" writes: Hello everyone, Been lurking and reading for several months now on this list and also the NaturalThyroidHormones list. (I cross posted to the NTH list also... No comment by the way... not even a "welcome".) Anyway, I'd like to first thank the owners of this list for sharing your time and your knowledge. You've helped more than I can say..... Is there anyone here that is currently or that has in the past used the 's Therapy? If so I'd love to hear your experiences pro or con. I've had two sets of labs done in the last couple of months. My doctor is certified for 's and I started the first round of meds yesterday. He's treating me for adrenal fatigue, HypoT, and he put me on a progesterone cream. He is willing to prescribe Armour also, but he wants to go the "'s" route first. I go back for labs in 4 weeks. I feel very lucky to have found this doctor. We'll see how it goes I guess. I've posted my labs. Any comments suggestions are encouraged and welcomed. Can anybody tell me what the last four items on my labs mean???? Warmly, B.N.Texas Na - Sodium 141 136 -145 K - Potassium 4.3 3.5 - 5.1 C1 - Chloride 104 99 - 109 CO2 - Carbon Dioxide 27 25 - 33 BUN - Blood Urea Nitrogen 11 7 - 24 Crea - Creatinine 0.9 .05 - 1.5 Glu - Glucose 71 70 - 110 CA - Calcium 9.3 8.5 - 10.1 T. bili - Total Bilirubin 0.22 0.00 - 1.00 T. Prot - Total Protein 7.0 6.4 - 8.2 Alb - Albumin 4.0 3.2 - 5.0 ALP - Alkaline Protease 17(L) 50 - 136 SGOT - (now called AST) 16 15 - 37 SGPT - (now called ALT) 36 30 - 65 T3 - 32 30 - 40 Free T3 - 3.0 2.3 - 4.2 T4 - 7.7 4.7 -13.3 Free T4 - 1.10 0.81 -1.61 T7 - Free Thyroxine Factor 2.5 1.0 - 4.4 TSH - Thyroid Stimulating Hormone 2.81 0.34 - 4.82 WBC - White Blood Count 8.54 4.30 - 11.00 RBC - Red Blood Cell Count 5.11 3.80 - 5.20 Hgb - Hemoglobin 15.4 12.0 - 16.0 Hct - Hematocrit 46.8 36.0 - 47.0 MCV - Mean Corpuscular Volume 91.6 79.0 - 98.0 MCH - Mean Cell Hemoglobin 30.1 26.0 - 34.0 MCHC - Mean Cell Hemoglobin Concentration 32.9 30.0 - 36.0 RDW - Red Blood Cell Distribution Width 15.7 12.3 - 16.8 MPV - Mean Platelet Volume 12.30 (H) 7.40 - 10.40 Platelet - 190 150 - 450 Neutro% - 52.1 50.0 - 75.0 Lymphs% - 37.0 20.0 - 40.0 Momos% 6.6 0.0 - 15.0 Eosins% 2.8 0.0 - 10.0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 15, 2004 Report Share Posted November 15, 2004 I understand why your doc wants to try the 's on you. It is because your numbers are kind of on the borderline. However something is definitely going on because your TSH is high. Are your symptoms bad? If your symptoms are bad, it could be 's or you could have a type of auto-immune thyroid condition where thyroid hormone is being attacked and removed in the blood. In this case you won't always have stong hypo numbers on tests but may feel very hypothyroid. Auto-immune antibody tests do not pick up everything by any means. The thyroid fathers (endos) have recently changed the TSH ranges but the majority of labs in the US have not. The new TSH ranges are 0.5 to 3.0. you are quite close to 3.0. Anything above 2.0 is impaired thyroid function and studies on people like you have found that the majority will go on to develop overt hypothyroidism within the next 10 to 20 years. They also have higher rate of cardiovascular disease and other conditions related to hypothyroidism. The best TSH numbers for health are around 1.0 and less. Your Free T3 and free T4s are actually a bit low. The ranges for both these tests are skewed toward hypothyroidism due the the fact that these test ranges are determined by who has the tests. The majority of people who have thyroid tests have low thyroid function to some extent. They are either older or sick. Both these things lower thyroid function and so skew test ranges. Even though your numbers seem just pegged near the middle, you really need to be in the upper half of the range and it would be perfect if you were in the upper 1/3. The midle of the free T3 range is 3.25 and you are below that. Your Free T4 is also below the midline. Really your labs show something is going on. In thyroid failure, typically T4 goes near the bottom of the range or below it and T3 just barely brushes up against the middle of the range. This is because as the thyroid is less and less able to make enough hormone, it begins to make more and more T3 in order to try and give more energy for the body with less hormone. But, both your Ts are equally low, which is interesting. I would say that it's a pituitary problem, but your pituitary is registering that something is wrong with elevated TSH. Then my next guess is that you have a health, nutritional or emotional issue pulling your down. This could lead to s. It could be that you are in the very early stages of thyroid failure and it could be that your thyroid function is impaired by poor diet and nutrition or you have had a major stress of some kind. This would also raise reverse T3. Low adrenal function also slows thyroid function down because cortisol and other corticosteroids are needed for thryoid hormone to get into tissues and for proper blood sugar levels which are important for thyroid to be able to work. Your blood sugar is on the low end and this sort of bears out that you have adrenal fatigue or maybe have been overly restricting carbohydrates. Cortisol from the adrenals is needed to maintain proper glucose levels. Adrenal issues themselves can impair thryoid function. I am wondering whether you are getting enough good quality protien, selenium, chromium and maybe Iodine and other nutrition. All these are needed for proper thyroid function. Typically in hypothyroidism Iron and blood protien goes low. You will get low blood cell levels and low but large red blood cells. Yours all look ok. But, you show some signs of an infection. Also, I am wondering if you diet a lot or have dieted a lot or maybe don't eat regularly or restrict carbohydrates too much. If you don't get at least some carbohydrates, thyroid function slows down. This is why people can't stay on extreem low carb diets. Also, do you eat a lot of cruciferous vegetables, beans (soy) and nuts. All these will slow thyroid function and are goitergens. It's also possible that you have a digestive system problem. The body reuptakes huge amounts of thyroid hormone from the small intestines. It is eleminated there by the liver and then much of it is reabsorbed. So, if you have a digestive system problem like celiac disease, parasites or something, this can make a lot of work for the thyroid to make up for thyroid hormone that being lost and can't be taken back up for reuse in the intestines. Anyway, I really think you need to take a look at your nutrition and general health if you haven't already, just to be sure something isn't dragging you down. The way women are taught to eat today - low fat, meager meals, no meat is not good for thyroid function. I have been on the 's program and have to say it was a failure. If you have a real thyroid problem such as low level antibody destruction of the gland or antibody removal of thyroid hormone from the blood, 's will never cure you. Your numbers do not prove anything eather way right now. They just show that your function is impaired. I talked to several 's specialists when I was doing the program and was told that only about 5% ever are able to totally go off thyroid hormone. I have seen only two cases of people having success with it in my lifetime. 's does not address the underlying cause of too much reverse T3 prduction, which is usually some type of body stress. A damaged underfunctioning thyroid itself can cause the body to make too much reverse T3 because it is a stress on the body to not have enough thyroid hormone. Reverse T3 is the body's way of slowing down the person so that they will recover from too much of something. The body makes it for a reason. If you have nutritional problem or emotional stress or some type of infection that doesn't get taken care of, the program cannot often fix it and the thyroid problems will just come back when you stop. You have to fix the cause, too. I also found that all T3 therapy was very hard on my adrenals. Believe it or not T4 has important functions even though it is not very active. It works to regulate the heart and it is like a bank account for a rainy day. If you are running on all T3 and you have a stressful or active day and use it up, then the adrenals have to kick in with cortisol and adrenalin to give you energy because there is no T4 to convert to T3. Also, the adrenals have to try and regulate the heart when there is no T4 and so it just makes more work for them. Though I felt ok on it, I was severly limited in how much activity I could do or I would crash. I did much better on Armour, energy wise. I think most T3 docs are good ones and it is worth a try just in case you might be lucky. Tish > > Na - Sodium 141 136 -145 > K - Potassium 4.3 3.5 - 5.1 > C1 - Chloride 104 99 - 109 > CO2 - Carbon Dioxide 27 25 - 33 > BUN - Blood Urea Nitrogen 11 7 - 24 > Crea - Creatinine 0.9 .05 - 1.5 > Glu - Glucose 71 70 - 110 > CA - Calcium 9.3 8.5 - 10.1 > T. bili - Total Bilirubin 0.22 0.00 - 1.00 > T. Prot - Total Protein 7.0 6.4 - 8.2 > Alb - Albumin 4.0 3.2 - 5.0 > ALP - Alkaline Protease 17 (L) 50 - 136 > > SGOT - (now called AST) 16 15 - 37 > SGPT - (now called ALT) 36 30 - 65 > T3 - 32 30 - 40 > Free T3 - 3.0 2.3 - 4.2 > T4 - 7.7 4.7 -13.3 > Free T4 - 1.10 0.81 -1.61 > T7 - Free Thyroxine Factor 2.5 1.0 - 4.4 > TSH - Thyroid Stimulating Hormone 2.81 0.34 - 4.82 > > WBC - White Blood Count 8.54 4.30 - 11.00 > RBC - Red Blood Cell Count 5.11 3.80 - 5.20 > Hgb - Hemoglobin 15.4 12.0 - 16.0 > Hct - Hematocrit 46.8 36.0 - 47.0 > MCV - Mean Corpuscular Volume 91.6 79.0 - 98.0 > MCH - Mean Cell Hemoglobin 30.1 26.0 - 34.0 > MCHC - Mean Cell Hemoglobin Concentration 32.9 30.0 - 36.0 > RDW - Red Blood Cell Distribution Width 15.7 12.3 - 16.8 > MPV - Mean Platelet Volume 12.30 (H) 7.40 - 10.40 > Platelet - 190 150 - 450 > Neutro% - 52.1 50.0 - 75.0 > Lymphs% - 37.0 20.0 - 40.0 > Momos% 6.6 0.0 - 15.0 > Eosins% 2.8 0.0 - 10.0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 15, 2004 Report Share Posted November 15, 2004 I understand why your doc wants to try the 's on you. It is because your numbers are kind of on the borderline. However something is definitely going on because your TSH is high. Are your symptoms bad? If your symptoms are bad, it could be 's or you could have a type of auto-immune thyroid condition where thyroid hormone is being attacked and removed in the blood. In this case you won't always have stong hypo numbers on tests but may feel very hypothyroid. Auto-immune antibody tests do not pick up everything by any means. The thyroid fathers (endos) have recently changed the TSH ranges but the majority of labs in the US have not. The new TSH ranges are 0.5 to 3.0. you are quite close to 3.0. Anything above 2.0 is impaired thyroid function and studies on people like you have found that the majority will go on to develop overt hypothyroidism within the next 10 to 20 years. They also have higher rate of cardiovascular disease and other conditions related to hypothyroidism. The best TSH numbers for health are around 1.0 and less. Your Free T3 and free T4s are actually a bit low. The ranges for both these tests are skewed toward hypothyroidism due the the fact that these test ranges are determined by who has the tests. The majority of people who have thyroid tests have low thyroid function to some extent. They are either older or sick. Both these things lower thyroid function and so skew test ranges. Even though your numbers seem just pegged near the middle, you really need to be in the upper half of the range and it would be perfect if you were in the upper 1/3. The midle of the free T3 range is 3.25 and you are below that. Your Free T4 is also below the midline. Really your labs show something is going on. In thyroid failure, typically T4 goes near the bottom of the range or below it and T3 just barely brushes up against the middle of the range. This is because as the thyroid is less and less able to make enough hormone, it begins to make more and more T3 in order to try and give more energy for the body with less hormone. But, both your Ts are equally low, which is interesting. I would say that it's a pituitary problem, but your pituitary is registering that something is wrong with elevated TSH. Then my next guess is that you have a health, nutritional or emotional issue pulling your down. This could lead to s. It could be that you are in the very early stages of thyroid failure and it could be that your thyroid function is impaired by poor diet and nutrition or you have had a major stress of some kind. This would also raise reverse T3. Low adrenal function also slows thyroid function down because cortisol and other corticosteroids are needed for thryoid hormone to get into tissues and for proper blood sugar levels which are important for thyroid to be able to work. Your blood sugar is on the low end and this sort of bears out that you have adrenal fatigue or maybe have been overly restricting carbohydrates. Cortisol from the adrenals is needed to maintain proper glucose levels. Adrenal issues themselves can impair thryoid function. I am wondering whether you are getting enough good quality protien, selenium, chromium and maybe Iodine and other nutrition. All these are needed for proper thyroid function. Typically in hypothyroidism Iron and blood protien goes low. You will get low blood cell levels and low but large red blood cells. Yours all look ok. But, you show some signs of an infection. Also, I am wondering if you diet a lot or have dieted a lot or maybe don't eat regularly or restrict carbohydrates too much. If you don't get at least some carbohydrates, thyroid function slows down. This is why people can't stay on extreem low carb diets. Also, do you eat a lot of cruciferous vegetables, beans (soy) and nuts. All these will slow thyroid function and are goitergens. It's also possible that you have a digestive system problem. The body reuptakes huge amounts of thyroid hormone from the small intestines. It is eleminated there by the liver and then much of it is reabsorbed. So, if you have a digestive system problem like celiac disease, parasites or something, this can make a lot of work for the thyroid to make up for thyroid hormone that being lost and can't be taken back up for reuse in the intestines. Anyway, I really think you need to take a look at your nutrition and general health if you haven't already, just to be sure something isn't dragging you down. The way women are taught to eat today - low fat, meager meals, no meat is not good for thyroid function. I have been on the 's program and have to say it was a failure. If you have a real thyroid problem such as low level antibody destruction of the gland or antibody removal of thyroid hormone from the blood, 's will never cure you. Your numbers do not prove anything eather way right now. They just show that your function is impaired. I talked to several 's specialists when I was doing the program and was told that only about 5% ever are able to totally go off thyroid hormone. I have seen only two cases of people having success with it in my lifetime. 's does not address the underlying cause of too much reverse T3 prduction, which is usually some type of body stress. A damaged underfunctioning thyroid itself can cause the body to make too much reverse T3 because it is a stress on the body to not have enough thyroid hormone. Reverse T3 is the body's way of slowing down the person so that they will recover from too much of something. The body makes it for a reason. If you have nutritional problem or emotional stress or some type of infection that doesn't get taken care of, the program cannot often fix it and the thyroid problems will just come back when you stop. You have to fix the cause, too. I also found that all T3 therapy was very hard on my adrenals. Believe it or not T4 has important functions even though it is not very active. It works to regulate the heart and it is like a bank account for a rainy day. If you are running on all T3 and you have a stressful or active day and use it up, then the adrenals have to kick in with cortisol and adrenalin to give you energy because there is no T4 to convert to T3. Also, the adrenals have to try and regulate the heart when there is no T4 and so it just makes more work for them. Though I felt ok on it, I was severly limited in how much activity I could do or I would crash. I did much better on Armour, energy wise. I think most T3 docs are good ones and it is worth a try just in case you might be lucky. Tish > > Na - Sodium 141 136 -145 > K - Potassium 4.3 3.5 - 5.1 > C1 - Chloride 104 99 - 109 > CO2 - Carbon Dioxide 27 25 - 33 > BUN - Blood Urea Nitrogen 11 7 - 24 > Crea - Creatinine 0.9 .05 - 1.5 > Glu - Glucose 71 70 - 110 > CA - Calcium 9.3 8.5 - 10.1 > T. bili - Total Bilirubin 0.22 0.00 - 1.00 > T. Prot - Total Protein 7.0 6.4 - 8.2 > Alb - Albumin 4.0 3.2 - 5.0 > ALP - Alkaline Protease 17 (L) 50 - 136 > > SGOT - (now called AST) 16 15 - 37 > SGPT - (now called ALT) 36 30 - 65 > T3 - 32 30 - 40 > Free T3 - 3.0 2.3 - 4.2 > T4 - 7.7 4.7 -13.3 > Free T4 - 1.10 0.81 -1.61 > T7 - Free Thyroxine Factor 2.5 1.0 - 4.4 > TSH - Thyroid Stimulating Hormone 2.81 0.34 - 4.82 > > WBC - White Blood Count 8.54 4.30 - 11.00 > RBC - Red Blood Cell Count 5.11 3.80 - 5.20 > Hgb - Hemoglobin 15.4 12.0 - 16.0 > Hct - Hematocrit 46.8 36.0 - 47.0 > MCV - Mean Corpuscular Volume 91.6 79.0 - 98.0 > MCH - Mean Cell Hemoglobin 30.1 26.0 - 34.0 > MCHC - Mean Cell Hemoglobin Concentration 32.9 30.0 - 36.0 > RDW - Red Blood Cell Distribution Width 15.7 12.3 - 16.8 > MPV - Mean Platelet Volume 12.30 (H) 7.40 - 10.40 > Platelet - 190 150 - 450 > Neutro% - 52.1 50.0 - 75.0 > Lymphs% - 37.0 20.0 - 40.0 > Momos% 6.6 0.0 - 15.0 > Eosins% 2.8 0.0 - 10.0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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