Re: More info on why TSH testing alone is inadequate.

[Guest guest]

Good question.. My immediate answer was Yes.. but then... what about someone like me? I have defective TSH receptors... so the TSH released by my pituitary had no where to go... it would have been free floating until filtered out of my body.... So I could have had high TSH readings... even though I was hyper thyroid.... and later went into thyroid storm....

My understanding is that for someone that has no way of reacting to the TSH the pituitary pretty much just keeps producing in an attempt to get a reaction.. I may be wrong with that.. I'm having trouble finding research on that.

I keep looking though, cause I am wondering what affect TSH has, and what value it has for folks that have had partial or total thyroidectomies. If the thyroid is not there, or dead, like mine, and not responding to the changing TSH values, is the Pituitary's reaction to that to continue to release TSH at the level that SHOULD provide the correct reaction from the gland or does it go into over production... or stop producing.. cause it's getting no reaction from it's attempts???

The chart I references yesterday gives the TSH values and ranges of a NORMAL body. But if the body is no longer normal..... how accurate is that TSH value for us?

This discussion actually had me wondering even more about all of this.

Before the synthetics and testing... they treated by symptoms... and folks did great. It was only after testing and putting every one into this mandatory 'normal' range that Fibromyalgia and Chronic Fatigue Syndrome even came into being. Maybe it is better to treat to symptoms, adjust as the body needs adjusting.

We had someone post earlier this spring about a study concerning individuals and geographic locations... Cold climates having higher hormone levels - increased metabolic rate to maintain adequate body temperatures.. Warm climates having lower hormone levels - decreasing metabolic rates to allow the body to function better with higher air temperatures...

The discussion at that time then became whether or not it might be wise for those of us with distinct seasons to add a bit of extra hormone during the colder winter months to compensate for the colder weather.

So that had me wondering too.... a person with a really good conversion function would be able to kick up the T3 high enough to accommodate changing temperatures... those with poor conversion rates, like me, wouldn't be able to... I think that is why I have to multi-dose the way I do... that my conversion just flat out sucks.

I am doing better now, with adding the selenium and doing the mini meals.. both aiding in conversion....

I still dont' know if this is:

* just me, the individual

* damage to my system from the long term hyper or the thyroid storm

* damage from the long term underdosing on synthetics. (I base my statement of being underdosed on Synthroid dosing being based on body weight for total replacement (my gland was killed by RAI) and the fact that even though my weight shot up more than 150 pounds in two years I was kept at the same 'optimum' dose that my endo had prescribed... So I was underdosed by 150 to 200 mcg per day. For more than 8 years.....

So confusing, because there are so many variables, even within the same individual.

I think that is why it's so important for each of us to understand how our bodies are affected and be aware of what we need to watch for. Cause there is a fair chance that an individual is not going to fit into the 'norm' and will pay for that with an increase in the number and the severity of symptoms.

IMHO, of course

Topper () *always the curious one*

On Mon, 6 Sep 2004 07:34:09 -0700 (PDT) edumom writes:

The big myth that persists regarding thyroid diagnosis is that an elevated TSH (thyroid stimulating hormone) level is always required before a diagnosis of hypothyroidism can be made. Normally, the pituitary gland will secrete TSH in response to a low thyroid hormone level. Thus an elevated TSH level would typically suggest an underactive thyroid.

Okay, so a good tsh test would imply that the pituitary is working properly [at least as pertains to the thyroid]. am I right?

sincerely, edumom

[Guest guest]

Good question.. My immediate answer was Yes.. but then... what about someone like me? I have defective TSH receptors... so the TSH released by my pituitary had no where to go... it would have been free floating until filtered out of my body.... So I could have had high TSH readings... even though I was hyper thyroid.... and later went into thyroid storm....

My understanding is that for someone that has no way of reacting to the TSH the pituitary pretty much just keeps producing in an attempt to get a reaction.. I may be wrong with that.. I'm having trouble finding research on that.

I keep looking though, cause I am wondering what affect TSH has, and what value it has for folks that have had partial or total thyroidectomies. If the thyroid is not there, or dead, like mine, and not responding to the changing TSH values, is the Pituitary's reaction to that to continue to release TSH at the level that SHOULD provide the correct reaction from the gland or does it go into over production... or stop producing.. cause it's getting no reaction from it's attempts???

The chart I references yesterday gives the TSH values and ranges of a NORMAL body. But if the body is no longer normal..... how accurate is that TSH value for us?

This discussion actually had me wondering even more about all of this.

Before the synthetics and testing... they treated by symptoms... and folks did great. It was only after testing and putting every one into this mandatory 'normal' range that Fibromyalgia and Chronic Fatigue Syndrome even came into being. Maybe it is better to treat to symptoms, adjust as the body needs adjusting.

We had someone post earlier this spring about a study concerning individuals and geographic locations... Cold climates having higher hormone levels - increased metabolic rate to maintain adequate body temperatures.. Warm climates having lower hormone levels - decreasing metabolic rates to allow the body to function better with higher air temperatures...

The discussion at that time then became whether or not it might be wise for those of us with distinct seasons to add a bit of extra hormone during the colder winter months to compensate for the colder weather.

So that had me wondering too.... a person with a really good conversion function would be able to kick up the T3 high enough to accommodate changing temperatures... those with poor conversion rates, like me, wouldn't be able to... I think that is why I have to multi-dose the way I do... that my conversion just flat out sucks.

I am doing better now, with adding the selenium and doing the mini meals.. both aiding in conversion....

I still dont' know if this is:

* just me, the individual

* damage to my system from the long term hyper or the thyroid storm

* damage from the long term underdosing on synthetics. (I base my statement of being underdosed on Synthroid dosing being based on body weight for total replacement (my gland was killed by RAI) and the fact that even though my weight shot up more than 150 pounds in two years I was kept at the same 'optimum' dose that my endo had prescribed... So I was underdosed by 150 to 200 mcg per day. For more than 8 years.....

So confusing, because there are so many variables, even within the same individual.

I think that is why it's so important for each of us to understand how our bodies are affected and be aware of what we need to watch for. Cause there is a fair chance that an individual is not going to fit into the 'norm' and will pay for that with an increase in the number and the severity of symptoms.

IMHO, of course

Topper () *always the curious one*

On Mon, 6 Sep 2004 07:34:09 -0700 (PDT) edumom writes:

The big myth that persists regarding thyroid diagnosis is that an elevated TSH (thyroid stimulating hormone) level is always required before a diagnosis of hypothyroidism can be made. Normally, the pituitary gland will secrete TSH in response to a low thyroid hormone level. Thus an elevated TSH level would typically suggest an underactive thyroid.

Okay, so a good tsh test would imply that the pituitary is working properly [at least as pertains to the thyroid]. am I right?

sincerely, edumom

[Guest guest]

Here's another can of worms to open----It has been a well known fact in medical journals for the last 25 yrs or more that people who get MS 9 times out of 10, were raised in a cold climate, regardless of where they lived when it was discovered in them. Since, slowly, it's looking like so many autoimmune diseases are going to be tied together in some way, doesn't that sound strange to you? Why would that be? I've looked around for the explanation of why they have all come from cold climates, but haven't found one yet. I had even suspected this disease in myself up until around 10 yrs ago, and we all know that where one autoimmune disease exists, often others co-exist. This was even before I was diagnosed with thyroid disease. Does anyone know anything about the cold climate thing and MS that might also tie it to thyroid disease? I TOLD you I was opening up another can of worms. MS's main thing is to demyelinate the myelin sheath or covering over nerves. It is the protectory cover that is the last, closest layer over the nerves on the brain and spinal cord. What is it that demyelinates this sheath? They've found extensive antibodies in this.

Re: More info on why TSH testing alone is inadequate.

Good question.. My immediate answer was Yes.. but then... what about someone like me? I have defective TSH receptors... so the TSH released by my pituitary had no where to go... it would have been free floating until filtered out of my body.... So I could have had high TSH readings... even though I was hyper thyroid.... and later went into thyroid storm....

My understanding is that for someone that has no way of reacting to the TSH the pituitary pretty much just keeps producing in an attempt to get a reaction.. I may be wrong with that.. I'm having trouble finding research on that.

I keep looking though, cause I am wondering what affect TSH has, and what value it has for folks that have had partial or total thyroidectomies. If the thyroid is not there, or dead, like mine, and not responding to the changing TSH values, is the Pituitary's reaction to that to continue to release TSH at the level that SHOULD provide the correct reaction from the gland or does it go into over production... or stop producing.. cause it's getting no reaction from it's attempts???

The chart I references yesterday gives the TSH values and ranges of a NORMAL body. But if the body is no longer normal..... how accurate is that TSH value for us?

This discussion actually had me wondering even more about all of this.

Before the synthetics and testing... they treated by symptoms... and folks did great. It was only after testing and putting every one into this mandatory 'normal' range that Fibromyalgia and Chronic Fatigue Syndrome even came into being. Maybe it is better to treat to symptoms, adjust as the body needs adjusting.

We had someone post earlier this spring about a study concerning individuals and geographic locations... Cold climates having higher hormone levels - increased metabolic rate to maintain adequate body temperatures.. Warm climates having lower hormone levels - decreasing metabolic rates to allow the body to function better with higher air temperatures...

The discussion at that time then became whether or not it might be wise for those of us with distinct seasons to add a bit of extra hormone during the colder winter months to compensate for the colder weather.

So that had me wondering too.... a person with a really good conversion function would be able to kick up the T3 high enough to accommodate changing temperatures... those with poor conversion rates, like me, wouldn't be able to... I think that is why I have to multi-dose the way I do... that my conversion just flat out sucks.

I am doing better now, with adding the selenium and doing the mini meals.. both aiding in conversion....

I still dont' know if this is:

* just me, the individual

* damage to my system from the long term hyper or the thyroid storm

* damage from the long term underdosing on synthetics. (I base my statement of being underdosed on Synthroid dosing being based on body weight for total replacement (my gland was killed by RAI) and the fact that even though my weight shot up more than 150 pounds in two years I was kept at the same 'optimum' dose that my endo had prescribed... So I was underdosed by 150 to 200 mcg per day. For more than 8 years.....

So confusing, because there are so many variables, even within the same individual.

I think that is why it's so important for each of us to understand how our bodies are affected and be aware of what we need to watch for. Cause there is a fair chance that an individual is not going to fit into the 'norm' and will pay for that with an increase in the number and the severity of symptoms.

IMHO, of course

Topper () *always the curious one*

[Guest guest]

Here's another can of worms to open----It has been a well known fact in medical journals for the last 25 yrs or more that people who get MS 9 times out of 10, were raised in a cold climate, regardless of where they lived when it was discovered in them. Since, slowly, it's looking like so many autoimmune diseases are going to be tied together in some way, doesn't that sound strange to you? Why would that be? I've looked around for the explanation of why they have all come from cold climates, but haven't found one yet. I had even suspected this disease in myself up until around 10 yrs ago, and we all know that where one autoimmune disease exists, often others co-exist. This was even before I was diagnosed with thyroid disease. Does anyone know anything about the cold climate thing and MS that might also tie it to thyroid disease? I TOLD you I was opening up another can of worms. MS's main thing is to demyelinate the myelin sheath or covering over nerves. It is the protectory cover that is the last, closest layer over the nerves on the brain and spinal cord. What is it that demyelinates this sheath? They've found extensive antibodies in this.

Re: More info on why TSH testing alone is inadequate.

Good question.. My immediate answer was Yes.. but then... what about someone like me? I have defective TSH receptors... so the TSH released by my pituitary had no where to go... it would have been free floating until filtered out of my body.... So I could have had high TSH readings... even though I was hyper thyroid.... and later went into thyroid storm....

My understanding is that for someone that has no way of reacting to the TSH the pituitary pretty much just keeps producing in an attempt to get a reaction.. I may be wrong with that.. I'm having trouble finding research on that.

I keep looking though, cause I am wondering what affect TSH has, and what value it has for folks that have had partial or total thyroidectomies. If the thyroid is not there, or dead, like mine, and not responding to the changing TSH values, is the Pituitary's reaction to that to continue to release TSH at the level that SHOULD provide the correct reaction from the gland or does it go into over production... or stop producing.. cause it's getting no reaction from it's attempts???

The chart I references yesterday gives the TSH values and ranges of a NORMAL body. But if the body is no longer normal..... how accurate is that TSH value for us?

This discussion actually had me wondering even more about all of this.

Before the synthetics and testing... they treated by symptoms... and folks did great. It was only after testing and putting every one into this mandatory 'normal' range that Fibromyalgia and Chronic Fatigue Syndrome even came into being. Maybe it is better to treat to symptoms, adjust as the body needs adjusting.

We had someone post earlier this spring about a study concerning individuals and geographic locations... Cold climates having higher hormone levels - increased metabolic rate to maintain adequate body temperatures.. Warm climates having lower hormone levels - decreasing metabolic rates to allow the body to function better with higher air temperatures...

The discussion at that time then became whether or not it might be wise for those of us with distinct seasons to add a bit of extra hormone during the colder winter months to compensate for the colder weather.

So that had me wondering too.... a person with a really good conversion function would be able to kick up the T3 high enough to accommodate changing temperatures... those with poor conversion rates, like me, wouldn't be able to... I think that is why I have to multi-dose the way I do... that my conversion just flat out sucks.

I am doing better now, with adding the selenium and doing the mini meals.. both aiding in conversion....

I still dont' know if this is:

* just me, the individual

* damage to my system from the long term hyper or the thyroid storm

* damage from the long term underdosing on synthetics. (I base my statement of being underdosed on Synthroid dosing being based on body weight for total replacement (my gland was killed by RAI) and the fact that even though my weight shot up more than 150 pounds in two years I was kept at the same 'optimum' dose that my endo had prescribed... So I was underdosed by 150 to 200 mcg per day. For more than 8 years.....

So confusing, because there are so many variables, even within the same individual.

I think that is why it's so important for each of us to understand how our bodies are affected and be aware of what we need to watch for. Cause there is a fair chance that an individual is not going to fit into the 'norm' and will pay for that with an increase in the number and the severity of symptoms.

IMHO, of course

Topper () *always the curious one*