Guest guest Posted March 28, 2005 Report Share Posted March 28, 2005 I'm very aware of it. It is not illegal in Ohio. In fact, it is virtually impossible to find rental housing here if you have a pet, and about 99.9% impossible to find housing that allows cats with claws. Our landlord did not allow pets, but agreed that we could adopt our cats if we got them fixed and declawed. We didn't want to do it, and I am sure we will always regret it, but we didn't want to give up our little ones or our home either.Mystic wrote: Did you know that a lot of states are trying to make it illegal tohave your cats declawed. Amy Swinderman Live aloha!__________________________________________________ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 28, 2005 Report Share Posted March 28, 2005 Hi all, I am wayyyyyyy behind on emails, but I have to stick my foot in my mouth and make a comment here, sorry. I have raised Boxers for several years and my show dogs were required to have their ears cropped and their tails docked. If that wasnt done, they couldnt go in the show ring, period. I have always encouraged people who bought pet quality Boxers to not do the ears, it is a hassle to deal with, although I really sincerely do not think that it is cruel. I also do not think that declawing cats is cruel. Cats can be very destructive when kept in a house and despite trying to train them not to claw, they are not dogs and have minds of their own, if they want to claw, then they are going to claw. However, if the cat is an outside cat, declawing them leaves them defenseless, so if they go outside, they should not be declawed. There are thousands of cats destroyed every day that owners no longer want because they claw up furniture, if declawing solves the problem, then wouldnt they be better off declawed than euthanized???????????? Personally I think the ASPCA needs to put their time, money, and energy into stopping the puppy mills, backyard breeders, dog fighters, etc, that is where the true cruelty is!! I have rescued dogs that were skin and bones, abused, bones broken, etc., and most of these came from the mills or backyard breeders. Just my 2 cents worth, sorry :-) Deb in CO. ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ " All we have to do is decide what to do with the time that is given us. " ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ > Did you know that a lot of states are trying to make it illegal to > have your cats declawed. If I remember correctly California has > already passed a law making it illegal to have your cat declawed and > to have your dog's ears and tails bobbed. From reading on the internet > many other states are considering making it illegal to have cats > declawed because the ASPCA considers it " maiming' of the animal. > > Just an interesting FYI > N. -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: 3/27/2005 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 28, 2005 Report Share Posted March 28, 2005 Hi all, I am wayyyyyyy behind on emails, but I have to stick my foot in my mouth and make a comment here, sorry. I have raised Boxers for several years and my show dogs were required to have their ears cropped and their tails docked. If that wasnt done, they couldnt go in the show ring, period. I have always encouraged people who bought pet quality Boxers to not do the ears, it is a hassle to deal with, although I really sincerely do not think that it is cruel. I also do not think that declawing cats is cruel. Cats can be very destructive when kept in a house and despite trying to train them not to claw, they are not dogs and have minds of their own, if they want to claw, then they are going to claw. However, if the cat is an outside cat, declawing them leaves them defenseless, so if they go outside, they should not be declawed. There are thousands of cats destroyed every day that owners no longer want because they claw up furniture, if declawing solves the problem, then wouldnt they be better off declawed than euthanized???????????? Personally I think the ASPCA needs to put their time, money, and energy into stopping the puppy mills, backyard breeders, dog fighters, etc, that is where the true cruelty is!! I have rescued dogs that were skin and bones, abused, bones broken, etc., and most of these came from the mills or backyard breeders. Just my 2 cents worth, sorry :-) Deb in CO. ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ " All we have to do is decide what to do with the time that is given us. " ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ > Did you know that a lot of states are trying to make it illegal to > have your cats declawed. If I remember correctly California has > already passed a law making it illegal to have your cat declawed and > to have your dog's ears and tails bobbed. From reading on the internet > many other states are considering making it illegal to have cats > declawed because the ASPCA considers it " maiming' of the animal. > > Just an interesting FYI > N. -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: 3/27/2005 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 28, 2005 Report Share Posted March 28, 2005 we have 5 kitties. one is front paws declawed. she came to us that way. she is so different from the other cats. easily intimidated, no confidence, she defends herself even when there is no real threat and she is the only one of the five that will bite. poor girl. i'd give anything to give her back what she lost. Tammie the N00B Re: Re: OT-declawing cats you raise good points Deb. We rescued our kittens from the local animal shelter and our landlord was kind enough to let us have them. I'd rather they be well fed, properly cared for and spoiled beyond belief (which they are!) than to have them still be at the shelter, or adopted by someone who isn't as loving to them as we are. I do think declawing is quite cruel and to some cats, psychologically damaging. We're giving our babies extra love so that they do not suffer as much. Amy Swinderman Live aloha! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 28, 2005 Report Share Posted March 28, 2005 we have 5 kitties. one is front paws declawed. she came to us that way. she is so different from the other cats. easily intimidated, no confidence, she defends herself even when there is no real threat and she is the only one of the five that will bite. poor girl. i'd give anything to give her back what she lost. Tammie the N00B Re: Re: OT-declawing cats you raise good points Deb. We rescued our kittens from the local animal shelter and our landlord was kind enough to let us have them. I'd rather they be well fed, properly cared for and spoiled beyond belief (which they are!) than to have them still be at the shelter, or adopted by someone who isn't as loving to them as we are. I do think declawing is quite cruel and to some cats, psychologically damaging. We're giving our babies extra love so that they do not suffer as much. Amy Swinderman Live aloha! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 28, 2005 Report Share Posted March 28, 2005 we have 5 kitties. one is front paws declawed. she came to us that way. she is so different from the other cats. easily intimidated, no confidence, she defends herself even when there is no real threat and she is the only one of the five that will bite. poor girl. i'd give anything to give her back what she lost. Tammie the N00B Re: Re: OT-declawing cats you raise good points Deb. We rescued our kittens from the local animal shelter and our landlord was kind enough to let us have them. I'd rather they be well fed, properly cared for and spoiled beyond belief (which they are!) than to have them still be at the shelter, or adopted by someone who isn't as loving to them as we are. I do think declawing is quite cruel and to some cats, psychologically damaging. We're giving our babies extra love so that they do not suffer as much. Amy Swinderman Live aloha! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 28, 2005 Report Share Posted March 28, 2005 I have mixed emotions about declawing cats. I have now two cats, as my Siamese had to be put down last November, at 13y/o Each of my cats are home cats, I had two girls and one boy - the boy was the only one fixed - the reason for my decision in this is simple - it is less traumatizing for a male cat to be fixed - less complicated procedure - overnight at the vet and less costly. Girl cats require several days in the vets, it is a more invasive procedure - pretty much equal to a hysterectomy and much more expensive - also there were two of them. With regards to declawing, I have considered having their front paws done, to save furniture damage - however, to keep things balanced, all three - now two - would have to be done so that none are at a disadvantage against another as cats do like to play fight. But I have a difficult time reconciling this in my mind - It is painful for them - granted to an overly painful procedure - but painful nonetheless. I concluded that since my cats Are part of my family and very much like my children, I found it to be selfish for my purposes to put them through that - just to save the couches. So in turn, I have just been more diligent about clipping the hooks off their claws every week and my couch is saved and they have their claws. A decision that I feel much more at ease about. Now if I could just figure out a way to stop them from shedding their fur all over my apartment - I would be a happy camper. During their weekly nail trimmings, I brush them down, but it seems that isnt enough. Karis Re: Re: OT-declawing cats you raise good points Deb. We rescued our kittens from the local animal shelter and our landlord was kind enough to let us have them. I'd rather they be well fed, properly cared for and spoiled beyond belief (which they are!) than to have them still be at the shelter, or adopted by someone who isn't as loving to them as we are. I do think declawing is quite cruel and to some cats, psychologically damaging. We're giving our babies extra love so that they do not suffer as much. Amy Swinderman Live aloha!1. While it is wonderful to share our experiences with everyone on the list as to what treatments do and don't work for us, pls always check with your dr. Some treatments are dangerous when given along with other meds as well as to certain health conditions or just dangerous in general.2. If you are in a difficult situation (doesn't matter what it is) pls don't be afraid to ask for help. It is the first step to trying to make that situation better.Have a nice day everyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 29, 2005 Report Share Posted March 29, 2005 http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?pcatid=2975 & Ntt=nail%20caps & Ntk=All & Ntx=mode+matchallpartial & Np=1 & N=2002 & Nty=1 Declawing Cats - Educate Before you Mutilate What could possibly be wrong with declawing a cat? So many people do it. You may have a declawed cat. You may know a declawed cat. It's never caused any harm for the felines you've been around. Well, think again. Choosing to have this procedure performed on a cat may not seem like a big deal, but you are playing Russian roulette with your animal's health. A cat's claws are used to capture prey, for climbing, and in self-defense. Claws are an integral part of a cat's life, but their use is commonly an annoyance for cats' human cohabitants. Declawing, however, is a painful and permanently crippling procedure that should not be practiced. There are effective and humane alternatives to declawing that can eliminate damage from a cat's scratching. Why do cats claw? Cats claw to maintain proper condition of the nails, for fun and exercise, and to mark territory visually as well as with scent. They stretch by digging their claws into something and pulling back against their own claw-hold. A cat's natural instinct to scratch serves both physical and psychological needs. Before domestication, cats satisfied these needs by clawing tree trunks. Domesticated cats can be trained to satisfy their desire to claw without damaging valuable property. What happens when a cat is declawed? When the end digit including the claw is removed, the sensory and motor nerves are cut, damaged and destroyed. They do not repair themselves or grow back for many months. There follows a wooden lack of feeling, then a tingling sensation during the long convalescence. The cat must walk on the stub end of the second digit. Sometimes a claw grows back, but not in the normal way. Rather, they grow up through the top of the paw creating a bloody sore. The physical effect of declawing is gradual weakening of the muscles of the legs, shoulders and back, impairing balance. Declawed cats show signs of feeling defenseless and certainly can live with more stress in their lives. Despite its grace, a cat is not sure-footed. Without the ability to grasp with its claws, it can easily be injured in a fall. Understanding declawing- THIS IS THE IMPORTANT PART Declawing involves several separate, painful amputations. It is a serious surgery, not just a manicure. The British Veterinary Associations calls declawing an "unnecessary mutilation." Indeed, it is illegal in most parts of Europe and has been recently been banned in the first U.S. city, West Hollywood , CA . Declawing a cat involves general anesthesia and amputation of the last joint of each toe, including the bones, not just the nail. Possible complications of this surgery include reaction to anesthetic, hemorrhage, bone chips which prevent healing, recurrent infections and damage to the radial nerve, pain, and possible abnormal regrowth of the nails. The nails may grow back inside the paw, causing pain but remaining invisible to the eye. Declawed cats need regular X-rays to monitor this problem. Declawing results in a gradual weakening of leg, shoulder, and back muscles, and, because of impaired balance, declawed cats have to relearn to walk much as would a person who lost his or her toes. Without claws, cats are virtually defenseless, and this often leads to neurosis and even skin and bladder problems. Many veterinarians have spoken out against declawing. Many vets refuse to perform the surgery, calling the operation cruel, and in most cases, unnecessary. Veterinarian Florence Barton says, "I won't perform this operation. The cat is missing [his or her] most important means of defense and feels very insecure." Without claws to mark their territory, even house-trained cats will often urinate and defecate outside the litter box in a desperate attempt to ward off intruders. In The Cat Care Question and Answer Book veterinarian Barry Bush concurs: "Veterinary removal of the claws (onychectomy) is a painful mutilation which cannot be recommended under any circumstances." Dr. Louis J. Camuti, a practicing vet for more than 58 years sums up his objections this way: "I wouldn't declaw a cat if you paid me $1,000 per nail!" Misconceptions about declawing There are several misconceptions about declawing. It does not make cats more "mellow." Declawed cats may be morose, reclusive, and withdrawn, or they may be irritable, aggressive, and unpredictable. Many people think declawing makes a cat safer around babies, but this is far from true, as the lack of claws turns many cats into biters. Declawed cats feel so insecure, lacking their first line of defense, that they tend to bite more often as a means of self-protection. People who have their cats declawed simply do not understand how important claws are to a cat and do not know how else to deal with the problem. With a little effort and commitment to your cat's welfare, you can eliminate the excuse to declaw your cat and make him or her a better companion as well. How to train your kitten or cat where to scratch 1. Regular nail trimmings. When the cat is relaxed and unafraid, gently press on the toes until the claws extend. Use a pair of nail trimmers and cut only the tip of the nail, taking care not to damage the vein or quick, which is very painful if cut. If you have never trimmed a cat's nails before, ask a vet or experienced cat person to show you how the first time. The nail "hook" is what tears up upholstery, so when it is removed, damage is greatly reduced. 2. Buy or build two or more scratching posts. Such posts must be sturdy, tall enough to allow the cat to completely stretch (3 feet or taller). A bark-covered log, a post covered with sisal, or a tightly woven burlap-covered post works well. Soft, fluffy, carpeted scratching posts don't work -- they are one of the greatest causes of declawing because cats often don't like the posts. If you use carpet, secure it to the posts with the rough backing on the outside; soft carpeting will not satisfy a cat's need to claw. Place one scratching post where the cat is already clawing, and another close to where he or she normally sleeps (cats like to stretch and scratch when they first wake up). Another option is the cardboard or sisal "scratching box," which lies flat on the floor. These are inexpensive and small enough to scatter around the house, allowing your cat easy access to an "approved" scratching spot at all times. They do wear out fairly quickly, however, and will need to be replaced every few months -- otherwise, cats may get frustrated and revert back to using furniture. 3. Give your cat specific instructions as to where to claw and where not to claw. Place your cat on the new scratching post and move his or her paws, or pretend to scratch it yourself. This will scent the posts and encourage exploratory clawing. Make the post a "fun" place to be. Play games with your cat on and around the post and attach hanging strings, balls and/or bouncy wire toys to it. Sprinkle catnip on the post, too. (A once-a- week or so "refresher" application will keep your cat interested.) When kitty uses the post, reinforce this behavior with praise, but be careful not to startle or frighten him or her. When the cat claws furniture, never discourage them with physical force. Lukewarm water from a squirt gun or spray bottle directed at the back of the animal is often successful. During the training period, you may need to cover upholstery with plastic or other protection (cats don't like the slippery feel and will quickly learn to stay away). Another option is Soft Paws Nail Caps for Cats. Soft Paws are soft, vinyl nail caps that are glued on over a cats' newly trimmed nails. They allow cats to scratch without harming anything - babies, people, or furniture. They come in nice colors or clear. One package (40 caps, a 3-4 month's supply) is only about $17.95 at www.softpaws.com and they are also available at most pet supply stores. An excellent book to help you understand your cat better is The New Natural Cat by Anitra Frazier, Campman and Co., Bridgeport , Conn. , 1981. By understanding cat behavior and by using common-sense precautions and behavior modification methods, you can prevent clawing damage without inflicting pain on your feline companion. References: 1.Townsend, B., "How to Deal With Your Cat's Claws," land Feline Society, Inc., 1982. 2.Marsden, Donna, "Cats With Claws: It's Only Natural," Washington Humane Society News, Spring 1995, p. 3. 3.Riddle, Roz, The City Cat, Scribner Sons, p. 40, 1984. 4.Place for Cats, New York , N.Y. , 1993. 5.Wilbourn, Carole C., Cats Prefer It This Way, Coward, McCann & Geoghegan, 1976. 6.Townsend, op. cit. 7.Barton, Florence , D.V.M., "Ask the Vet," Cat Fancy. 8."Declawing: Convenient But Cruel?," PAWS News, Feb. 1989. 9."Paws Come With Claws," Friends of Animals brochure. The American Veterinary Medical Association (AVMA) position statement on declawing claims that declawed and clawed cats have the same behavior. But evidence indicates otherwise. As you will see below, declawed cats are known suffer higher rates of abandonment, euthanasia and behavioral problems...all the problems that declawing was 'suppose' to stop: Published 2/1/03 on CourierPostOnline.com, "Eighty percent of the cats that are surrendered that are declawed are euthanized because they have a behavioral problem…. Declawed cats frequently become biters and also stop using litter boxes… One or the other…," said Lombardi shelter director, Gloucester County, New Jersey. A study of 163 cats that underwent onychectomy (declawing), published in the Jul/Aug 1994 Journal of Veterinary Surgery, showed that 50% suffered from immediate postoperative complications such as pain, hemorrhage, and lameness; and long-term complications, including prolonged lameness, were found in nearly 20% of the 121 cats who were followed up on in the study. In a study published in the January, 2001 JAVMA, 33% of 39 cats that underwent onychectomy developed "at least" one behavior problem immediately after surgery, with the most common problems being litter box problems and biting. In a recent study published October, 2001, JAVMA by Dr. J. Patronek, VMD, PhD., "… declawed cats were at an increased risk of relinquishment." A recent national survey of shelters from the Caddo Parrish Forgotten Felines and Friends indicates that approximately 70% of cats turned in to shelters for behavioral problems are declawed. From the Summer 2002 issue of PETA's Animal Times: "A survey by a Delaware animal shelter showed that more than 75% of the cats turned in for avoiding their litter boxes had been declawed." [emphasis added] In my own three-year experience, 95% of calls about declawed cats related to litter box problems, while only 46% of clawed cats had such problems—and most of those were older cats with physical ailments. Of my calls, only declawed cats have cost their owners security deposits, leather sofas and floorboards. And it's mostly declawed cats that have been prescribed pain killers, anti-depressants, tranquilizers and steroids. Two-thirds of my calls are about litter box problems. In 90% of those cases, the cat is declawed, sick or old. In 7 years, only 3 people have called about a "scratching-the-sofa problem" - yet countless of "healthy" declawed cats have peed on sofas. > > Did you know that a lot of states are trying to make it illegal to > have your cats declawed. If I remember correctly California has > already passed a law making it illegal to have your cat declawed and > to have your dog's ears and tails bobbed. From reading on the internet > many other states are considering making it illegal to have cats > declawed because the ASPCA considers it "maiming' of the animal. > > Just an interesting FYI > N. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 29, 2005 Report Share Posted March 29, 2005 Well those are bizarre! People would see your cat and think you were awfully bored, painting their nails and all...ROFL!!! Seriously, a good idea for those who disagree with de-clawing. Cheap too. http://www.geocities.com/vwjennifer/ Please spay/neuter your pets! -----Original Message-----From: sunflowergardens http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?pcatid=2975 & Ntt=nail%20caps & Ntk=All & Ntx=mode+matchallpartial & Np=1 & N=2002 & Nty=1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 29, 2005 Report Share Posted March 29, 2005 Crazy aren't they? You can get clear, if you don't care for the colors, lol ... Just thought it was an good alterative! Well those are bizarre! People would see your cat and think you were awfully bored, painting their nails and all...ROFL!!! Seriously, a good idea for those who disagree with de-clawing. Cheap too. http://www.geocities.com/vwjennifer/ Please spay/neuter your pets! -----Original Message-----From: sunflowergardens http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?pcatid=2975 & Ntt=nail%20caps & Ntk=All & Ntx=mode+matchallpartial & Np=1 & N=2002 & Nty=1 1. While it is wonderful to share our experiences with everyone on the list as to what treatments do and don't work for us, pls always check with your dr. Some treatments are dangerous when given along with other meds as well as to certain health conditions or just dangerous in general.2. If you are in a difficult situation (doesn't matter what it is) pls don't be afraid to ask for help. It is the first step to trying to make that situation better.Have a nice day everyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 29, 2005 Report Share Posted March 29, 2005 GREAT POINT!!! the only downfall with clear is that when it falls off you cannot find it as easily, and if they are indoor cats who cares what color thay are. when your living with fibro you need to smile, and having crazy colors on the pets feet would make me smile everyday!!!! > > > Crazy aren't they? You can get clear, if you don't care for the colors, lol > ... > > Just thought it was an good alterative! > > > > > > > > Well those are bizarre! People would see your cat and think you were > awfully bored, painting their nails and all...ROFL!!! > > Seriously, a good idea for those who disagree with de-clawing. Cheap too. > > > > > > > > http://www.geocities.com/vwjennifer/ > > Please spay/neuter your pets! > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: sunflowergardens [mailto:Sunflowergardens@a...] > > > > > > http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display > cfm? pcatid=2975 & Ntt=nail%20caps & Ntk=All & Ntx=mode+matchallpartial & Np=1 & N=2002 & > ty=1 > > > > > > > > 1. While it is wonderful to share our experiences with everyone on the list > as to what treatments do and don't work for us, pls always check with your > dr. Some treatments are dangerous when given along with other meds as well > as to certain health conditions or just dangerous in general. > > > > 2. If you are in a difficult situation (doesn't matter what it is) pls don't > be afraid to ask for help. It is the first step to trying to make that > situation better. > > > > > > Have a nice day everyone. > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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