Re: IEP's again

[Guest guest]

To a point some IEPs are pre-prepared. But during the IEP you certainly

have the right to add or delete information. To my knowledge, and Celeste

or someone else is more of an expert on this - they are not breaking the

law. There is Parent Training in each state now so that you can learn how

to advocate for your child. Send them another request for IEP - that they

have to do per your request within a number of days (15).

Good Luck,

>From: StormyWen@...

>Reply-To: Listen-Upegroups

>To: Listen-Upegroups

>Subject: IEP's again

>Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 12:41:19 EDT

>

>Hi everyone!

> I'm trying to get an IEP meeting set up to add the FM System so my

>daughter could have one for use in preschool. Her teacher and speech

>therapist both agreed that it would be a great thing and are trying to

> " repair " the broken system they currently have.

> The first IEP that was done was prepared without my knowledge of it.

>I

>arrived at my daughter's first speech session and was handed a pre-printed

>IEP. The SLP went over the goals with me and asked if they were alright

>and

>I said sure. Then she said I had to sign it or they couldn't do speech for

>my daughter, so I signed it. At this point in time I didn't even know what

>an IEP was other than what I'd skimmed through on this list.

> I talked to the SLP on Monday and asked what I needed to do to get a

>new

>IEP done because I wanted to change and add some things. She started

>asking

>what I wanted so I told her about the FM System and the fact that my

>daughter's IEP doesn't even say she wears hearing aids. Doesn't say she's

>in

>preschool, just in pull-out speech therapy. She agreed with what I was

>saying but didn't set up a time to meet with me. I'm afraid she's going to

>have this all pre-done again and hand it to me next time I see her. I

>admit

>I am not a very bold person, but I can't believe that a school district

>would

>do this twice. Is it possible that they don't know that they're breaking

>the

>law by doing this? Any ideas on how I can push to be involved in the

>planning of the IEP meeting (taking into consideration that I'm VERY

>non-confrontational)? Geez, I wish I weren't such a wuss. I need to make

>my

>husband call them!! :-)

> R.

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[Guest guest]

,

I too am a " wuss " as you put it. But, you are not doing this for yourself,

you are doing it for your daughter!!!!!! That is a very very good

reason!!!!!! You want the best for her and let that guide(help) you be

brave. They must notify of an I.E.P. meeting, they tried that with my son

when he was only in speech and I told them I wanted to talk with the speech

teacher. Also she reccommended he be taken out of speech, and I said NO

WAY!!!!! Well, that was the end of that!!!!!! But as I think now I don't

think they had a formal IEP with this teacher...geez, what I didn't know

back then....Anyway, you have the utmost support from this group, even

though we can't be there physically!!! Please call an IEP, call the (what

we call Intermediate School District in our area they take care of all this

stuff), find out who's in charge and put a little " bug " in their ear. They

may just call you back and they know you have the right to call an IEP.

Also, have meeting with them or the head of the preschool(if any) make sure

these ppl know you are a concerned parent...and that's not being a wuss

either. I don't like confrontation, I try to avoid it, but don't think of

it as that, you are standing up for the rights of your daughter and that is

the best and only thing, next to loving her, that you have CONTROL

over...don't give up that control, it will shape her life!!!

Good Luck and Prayers for strength sent to you

Tracey

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[Guest guest]

In a message dated 4/26/2000 3:58:49 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

maryemapa@... writes:

<< To a point some IEPs are pre-prepared. >>

The teacher and SLP have always made goals that I read BEFORE the IEP meeting

so that I can plan what I want to ask for or dispute. Esp. with the little

ones when you are using the auditory learning guide to plan the IEP.........

it is great to have them on paper to review ahead of time.

Elaine

Cueing Mom to Jake/auditory neuropathy/6yrs/Clarion CI/2-99

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 4/26/2000 7:56:42 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

pmzf@... writes:

<< what is the auditory learning guide?

Phyllis >>

It is a guide to language development used in the oral programs here in North

Carolina. It tells at what age a hearing child does language things to help

keep you on top of the language acquisition goals. It is adapted from the

auditory skills program, New South Wales Dept. of Education and has

information from Judy Simser's Volta Review article Summer 1993 (Vol.95

Number 3).

Levels of the chart are

Sound Awareness

Phoneme Level

Discourse Level

Sentence Level

Word Level

Elaine

Cueing Mom to Jake/6yrs/Clarion CI/2-99

[Guest guest]

Hi Kay,

Hayley's are handwritten and we of course have the option of adding or

taking it home and not signing it. Hers are pretty long and I don't want to

take up my valuable time watching them write when lots of it can be taken

care of before hand with phone calls and the back and forth book.

Take care,

mary

>

>Reply-To: Listen-Upegroups

>To: <Listen-Upegroups>

>Subject: Re: IEP's again

>Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 18:29:53 -0500

>

> > To a point some IEPs are pre-prepared. But during the IEP you certainly

> > have the right to add or delete information. To my knowledge, and

>Celeste

> > or someone else is more of an expert on this - they are not breaking the

> > law. There is Parent Training in each state now so that you can learn

>how

> > to advocate for your child. Send them another request for IEP - that

>they

> > have to do per your request within a number of days (15).

>

>Hi . I think it depends on the state regulations. During the last IEP

>we

>had, somehow during the course of the IEP the subject came up about why

>they

>didn't do the notes and IEP by computer (it wasn't my question). They said

>it was because by law everything had to be handwritten to show that the IEP

>wasn't developed prior to the meeting and that the parents truly had an

>opportunity for input during the meeting. Since I haven't heard of a

>federal

>law such as this I'm assuming it's a state law.

>

>Hugs,

>Kay

>

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[Guest guest]

In a message dated 4/26/2000 9:27:00 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

beat4girl@... writes:

<< It tells at what age a hearing child does language things to help

keep you on top of the language acquisition goals. >>

Wrong paper.....the Bloom and Lahey scale does this

The ALG goes in levels and steps. Starts with sound awareness and does speech

babble goals etc..... I will see if I can scan it and send it to you Phyllis.

Elaine

Cueing Mom to Jake/6yrs/Clarion CI/2-99

[Guest guest]

what is the auditory learning guide?

Phyllis

[Guest guest]

> To a point some IEPs are pre-prepared. But during the IEP you certainly

> have the right to add or delete information. To my knowledge, and

Celeste

> or someone else is more of an expert on this - they are not breaking the

> law. There is Parent Training in each state now so that you can learn how

> to advocate for your child. Send them another request for IEP - that they

> have to do per your request within a number of days (15).

Hi . I think it depends on the state regulations. During the last IEP we

had, somehow during the course of the IEP the subject came up about why they

didn't do the notes and IEP by computer (it wasn't my question). They said

it was because by law everything had to be handwritten to show that the IEP

wasn't developed prior to the meeting and that the parents truly had an

opportunity for input during the meeting. Since I haven't heard of a federal

law such as this I'm assuming it's a state law.

Hugs,

Kay

[Guest guest]

>Hayley's are handwritten and we of course have the option of adding or

>taking it home and not signing it.

Good strategy! I always advise my clients who are ambivalent about

some provisions of the IEP, but who don't want to contest, for any

number of reasons, simply not to sign it; or alternatively, to sign it

in disagreement, but not contest it. One is NOT required to sign the

IEP. If one does sign it in agreement, it takes effect anyway, but it

spares one from a future happenstance of getting into a real major

battle with the district, and having their attorney wave all those

prior IEPs in your face, saying, " But you signed that you AGREED with

these! "

When in doubt, just don't sign it. It will take effect anyway if you

don't contest it.

Celeste

[Guest guest]

>If one does sign it in agreement, it takes effect anyway,

ERROR! ERROR! That should have read, " If one does not sign it, it

takes effect anyway, " .

I'd best get some sleep.

Celeste

[Guest guest]

Thanks Elaine! Phyllis

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 4/27/2000 7:02:48 AM Eastern Daylight Time,

gprogers@... writes:

<< I ask that the school send home a " draft " copy of the

IEP prior to the meeting. Then I can read the " proposed " IEP at home with

no pressure. I can write in my changes and suggestion, and make notes of my

questions. Then we hold what we call a pre-IEP meeting. >>

This is what I meant as well...NO they don't have the IEP written out and

ready to go, just have the draft goals from the Bloom and Lahey and the ALG

then we add or delete. The IEP team here is wonderful and does things like

they are supposed to.

Elaine

Cueing Mom to Jake/6yrs/Clarion CI/2-99

[Guest guest]

,

Here's how I do it. I ask that the school send home a " draft " copy of the

IEP prior to the meeting. Then I can read the " proposed " IEP at home with

no pressure. I can write in my changes and suggestion, and make notes of my

questions. Then we hold what we call a pre-IEP meeting. At this meeting

any of my questions are answered, my suggestions are added or discussed. IF

(which is ususally) I ask for something out of the ordinary the school

personel must check with someone at the district office, the IEP will be

sent home again a few days later. Then I again have time to go over it at

home. We come back again for the actual IEP meeting. I will often request

that a district office person attend. (you must have someone there that can

allocate services.) By this time normally we are all agreed on what the IEP

should say and the meeting is pretty much a formality.

However, I will not sign the IEP at this meeting. I take it home once

again, and review it one more time. When I am SURE it is what I want I will

sign it. I have had too many times when I have felt pressured into signing

something (the school can be very good at making you feel that you HAVE to

sign it) so now I have a rule that I never sign anything at the meeting

except the attendence sheet.

You must however, raise any objections with the IEP in writing and within

seven days or the IEP will be implemented as written, even without your

signature.

Put your request for a new IEP in writing so that the school will be forced

to follow the time line. I think some people at the school don't know

federal law, and others don't care. I think the school counts on parents

not knowing what the law is.

Your request for a new IEP should go to the principal of the school. Is the

speech therapist your daughter's case manager? If you don't put it in

writing, the request didn't happen.

You don't have to be confrontational to do any of this. Just be

professional.

Barb

[Guest guest]

I actually like that my district pre-prepares my son's

IEP. I view it as a good starting point, rather than

to have to sit for hours as someone writes everything

down. What I also do is come to the IEP meeting with

a type-written list of items that I want to IEP team

to consider for inclusion in the IEP and the exact

wording I'd like included in the IEP. Nine out of ten

times the case manager just copies the words exactly.

It's been a fairly effective strategy.

Judy

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 4/27/2000 11:29:45 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

bartnick@... writes:

<< Elaine, could I get a copy of this as well? Thanks! Deb >>

Sure, I just have to find a copy that doesn't have highlighter all over it so

that it will scan good!

Elaine

Cueing Mom to Jake/6yrs/Clarion CI/2-99

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 4/28/2000 12:17:32 AM Eastern Daylight Time,

listenup@... writes:

<< If it's a yellow highlighter and you're scanning in black and white, the

highlighter won't show up >>

Unfortunately they highlighted each quarters goals in a different

color...blue, green, pink, and yellow....the yellow is okay but the others

are hard to read

Elaine

Cueing Mom to Jake/6yrs/Clarion CI/2-99

[Guest guest]

Elaine, could I get a copy of this as well? Thanks! Deb

Deb Bartnick

bartnick@...

beat4girl@... wrote:

> In a message dated 4/26/2000 9:27:00 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

> beat4girl@... writes:

>

> << It tells at what age a hearing child does language things to help

> keep you on top of the language acquisition goals. >>

> Wrong paper.....the Bloom and Lahey scale does this

>

> The ALG goes in levels and steps. Starts with sound awareness and does speech

> babble goals etc..... I will see if I can scan it and send it to you Phyllis.

> Elaine

>

> Cueing Mom to Jake/6yrs/Clarion CI/2-99

>

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[Guest guest]

> Sure, I just have to find a copy that doesn't have highlighter all over it

so

> that it will scan good!

If it's a yellow highlighter and you're scanning in black and white, the

highlighter won't show up. Same with Xeroxing it.

Just a little trick I learned many years ago.

Hugs,

Kay

[Guest guest]

I was just looking on Jakes IEP with all this discussion and there isn't a

block or line that says anything about agree/disagree. All the blanks say

either " meeting participants/position " or " IEP team: The following were

present and participated in the development and writing of the IEP " But in

the minutes it is written that the team discussed blah, blah, blah, revisions

were made and the team is in agreement on the IEP.

Elaine B

Cueing Mom to Jake/6yrs/Clarion CI/2-99

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 5/2/2000 11:12:19 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

celestej@... writes:

<< Doesn't your form have a place for the resident school district and the

operating school district to sign whether they disagree or agree and

commmit to implement? It is usually the last page.

If, truly, your IEP form has no signature pages for

agreement/disagreement/commitment to implement, I would file a

complaint with the state. >>

I don't see that anywhere on the mounds of paperwork I have. I never really

looked because as I have said here before we have been really fortunate to

NOT have to battle the county we are in. (crossing fingers that we don't)

The form with minutes was done by the LEA each meeting and says:

The name of the school system....

COMMITTEE MEETING MINUTES

then the regular school, date, student info...

Meeting participants/positions. and signature lines.......

PURPOSE OF MEETING...........

DISCUSSION AND RECOMMENDATIONS

In his old IEP's from preschool through the school for the deaf many of the

same state forms are used but the printed minutes sheet is a Wake County

thing. However, there were always written minutes done by the LEA at those

meetings as well. Could this be a state issue since they did it at the deaf

school IEP's too? Maybe a " cover your booty by having it in writing what was

discussed " . I also tape the meetings. The LEA we have this year is VERY

particular about the paperwork and all the things being properly done and

documented so I have to think that they are allowed to do it here?!?!

Actually, I like having them because I can always look back and see what was

said if I forgot later on what was said if I can't understand something on

the tape. It has always been good documentation of the meetings, and

thorough note taking.

I will see an IEP advocate at cue camp this month. I will talk to her about

it and see what she has to say.

Thanks Celeste you are great!

Elaine

Cueing Mom to Jake/6yrs/Clarion CI/2-99

[Guest guest]

>I was just looking on Jakes IEP with all this discussion and there isn't a

>block or line that says anything about agree/disagree. All the blanks say

>either " meeting participants/position " or " IEP team: The following were

>present and participated in the development and writing of the IEP " But in

>the minutes it is written that the team discussed blah, blah, blah, revisions

>were made and the team is in agreement on the IEP.

IEP forms should not contain any minutes. The implementing regulations

state:

" Part 300.347 Content of IEP.

(a) General. The IEP for each child with a disability must include-

(1) A statement of the child's present levels of educational

performance, including -

(i) How the child's disability affects the child's involvement

and progress in the general curriculum (i.e., the same curriculum as

for nondisabled children); or

(ii) For preschool children, as appropriate, how the disability

affects the child's participation in appropriate activities;

(2) A statement of measurable annual goals, including benchmarks or

short-term objectives, related to -

(i) Meeting the child's needs that result from the child's

disability to enable the child to be involved in and progress in the

general curriculum (i.e., the same curriculum as for nondisabled

children), or for preschool children, as appropriate, to participate in

appropriate activities; and

(ii) Meeting each of the child's other educational needs that

result from the child's disability;

(3) A statement of the special education and related services and

supplementary aids and services to be provided to the child, or on

behalf of the child, and a statement of the program modifications or

supports for school personnel that will be provided for the child-

(i) To advance appropriately toward attaining the annual goals;

(ii) To be involved and progress in the general curriculum in

accordance with paragraph (a)(1) of this section and to participate in

extracurricular and other nonacademic activities; and

(iii) To be educated and participate with other children with

disabilities and nondisabled children in the activities described in

this section;

(4) An explanation of the extent, if any, to which the child will

not participate with nondisabled children in the regular class and in

the activities described in paragraph (a)(3) of this section;

(5)

(i) A statement of any individual modifications in the

administration of State or district-wide assessments of student

achievement that are needed in order for the child to participate in

the assessment; and

(ii) If the IEP team determines that the child will not

participate in a particular State or district-wide assessment of

student achievement (or part of an assessment), a statement of -

(A) Why that assessment is not appropriate for the child;

and

( How the child will be assessed;

(6) The projected date for the beginning of the services and

modifications described in paragraph (a)(3) of this section, and the

anticipated frequency, location, and duration of those services and

modifications; and

(7) A statement of -

(i) How the child's progress toward the annual goals described

in paragraph (a)(2) of this section will be measured; and

(ii) How the child's parents will be regularly informed

(through such means as periodic report cards), at least as often as

parents are informed of their nondisabled children's progress, of -

(A) Their child's progress toward the annual goals; and

( The extent to which that progress is sufficient to

enable the child to achieve the goals by the end of the year.

( Transition services. The IEP must include-

(1) For each student with a disability beginning at age 14 (or

younger, if determined appropriate by the IEP team), and updated

annually, a statement of the transition service needs of the student

under the applicable components of the student's IEP that focuses on

the student's courses of study (such as participation in

advanced-placement courses or a vocational education program); and

(2) For each student beginning at age 16 (or younger, if determined

appropriate by the IEP team), a statement of needed transition services

for the student, including, if appropriate, a statement of the

interagency responsibilities or any needed linkages.

© Transfer of rights. In a State that transfers rights at the age

majority, beginning at least one year before a student reaches the age

of majority under State law, the student's IEP must include a statement

that the student has been informed of his or her rights under Part B of

the Act, if any, that will transfer to the student on reaching the age

of majority, consistent with Part 300.517.

(d) Students with disabilities convicted as adults and incarcerated in

adult prisons. Special rules concerning the content of IEPs for

students with disabilities convicted as adults and incarcerated in

adult prisons are contained in Part 300.311( and ©.

(Authority: 20 U.S.C. 1414(d)(1)(A) and (d)(6)(A)(ii)) "

While this part does not explicitly state that there must be place to

agree/disagree on the form, most state rules do state it explicitly,

because of the procedureal safeguard requirements, particularly (9) and

(10):

" Part 300.504 Procedural safeguards notice.

(a) General. A copy of the procedural safeguards available to the

parents of a child with a disability must be given to the parents, at a

minimum-

(1) Upon initial referral for evaluation;

(2) Upon each notification of an IEP meeting;

(3) Upon reevaluation of the child; and

(4) Upon receipt of a request for due process under Part 300.507.

( Contents. The procedural safeguards notice must include a full

explanation of all of the procedural safeguards available under Parts

300.403, 300.500-300.529, and 300.560-300.577, and the State complaint

procedures available under Parts 300.660-300.662 relating to-

(1) Independent educational evaluation;

(2) Prior written notice;

(3) Parental consent;

(4) Access to educational records;

(5) Opportunity to present complaints to initiate due process

hearings;

(6) The child's placement during pendency of due process

proceedings;

(7) Procedures for students who are subject to placement in an

interim alternative educational setting;

(8) Requirements for unilateral placement by parents of children in

private schools at public expense;

(9) Mediation;

(10) Due process hearings, including requirements for disclosure of

evaluation results and recommendations;

(11) State-level appeals (if applicable in that State);

(12) Civil actions;

(13) Attorneys' fees; and

(14) The State complaint procedures under Parts 300.660- 300.662,

including a description of how to file a complaint and the timelines

under those procedures.

© Notice in understandable language. The notice required under

paragraph (a) of this section must meet the requirements of Part

300.503©.

(Authority: 20 U.S.C. 1415(d)) "

Additionally, Part 300.507 Impartial due process hearing; parent

notice, provides:

(a) General.

(1) A parent or a public agency may initiate a hearing on any of

the matters described in Part 300.503(a)(1) and

(2) (relating to the identification, evaluation or educational

placement of a child with a disability, or the provision of FAPE to the

child).

(2) When a hearing is initiated under paragraph (a)(1) of this

section, the public agency shall inform the parents of the availability

of mediation described in Part 300.506.

(3) The public agency shall inform the parent of any free or

low-cost legal and other relevant services available in the area if-

(i) The parent requests the information; or

(ii) The parent or the agency initiates a hearing under this

section. "

Doesn't your form have a place for the resident school district and the

operating school district to sign whether they disagree or agree and

commmit to implement? It is usually the last page.

If, truly, your IEP form has no signature pages for

agreement/disagreement/commitment to implement, I would file a

complaint with the state.

Celeste