Re: links between mbti and AS

[Guest guest]

now that's a question i've been wanting to ask, the link between mbti and

autism. i'm an intj and i noticed a few years ago that intj matched a lot of my

quirks that i'm now blaming on autism. however, losing speech and walking into

doorjams and a lot of other stuff is NOT personality based.

so, i've been wondering how much of my stuff is personality, and how much autism

(or aspergers)... any more info on that stuff anywhere?

joanne

Re: Quiz

>

> Aspie score -- 177/200

>

> NT score - 21/200

>

> Result : " very likely an Aspie "

>

> Been " selected as a candidate for the stim-quiz " , but no time for at

> the moment

>

> kw

>

>

>> Here is a fairly comprehensive quiz for Asperger's if that's what

> people are looking for. I can't remember who it was. This one gives

> the stats on NT answers too, and breaks the questions down into

> categories.

>> http://www.rdos. net/eng/Aspie- quiz.php

>>

>> Joanne

>>

>>

[Guest guest]

I'm also INTJ

My wife who is also autistic, isn't INTJ, I forget what her's is... :/

>

> now that's a question i've been wanting to ask, the link between mbti

> and autism. i'm an intj and i noticed a few years ago that intj matched a

> lot of my quirks that i'm now blaming on autism. however, losing speech and

> walking into doorjams and a lot of other stuff is NOT personality based.

>

> so, i've been wondering how much of my stuff is personality, and how much

> autism (or aspergers)... any more info on that stuff anywhere?

>

> joanne

>

> Re: Quiz

> >

> > Aspie score -- 177/200

> >

> > NT score - 21/200

> >

> > Result : " very likely an Aspie "

> >

> > Been " selected as a candidate for the stim-quiz " , but no time for at

> > the moment

> >

> > kw

> >

> >

> >> Here is a fairly comprehensive quiz for Asperger's if that's what

> > people are looking for. I can't remember who it was. This one gives

> > the stats on NT answers too, and breaks the questions down into

> > categories.

> >> http://www.rdos. net/eng/Aspie- quiz.php

> >>

> >> Joanne

> >>

> >>

[Guest guest]

I'm INTJ too.

Don't know where you took the test, here maybe?

http://www.personalitypathways.com/MBTI_intro.html

a

> I'm also INTJ

>

> My wife who is also autistic, isn't INTJ, I forget what her's is... :/

>

>

> >

> > now that's a question i've been wanting to ask, the link between

> mbti

> > and autism. i'm an intj and i noticed a few years ago that intj

> matched a

> > lot of my quirks that i'm now blaming on autism. however, losing

> speech and

> > walking into doorjams and a lot of other stuff is NOT personality

> based.

> >

> > so, i've been wondering how much of my stuff is personality, and

> how much

> > autism (or aspergers)... any more info on that stuff anywhere?

> >

> > joanne

[Guest guest]

Most likely INTJ or INTP

I suspect that we are not quite that way but the AS changes it. Doubt

any work has been done on that.

The difference J/P

One way of putting it

We are going to drive from England to Italy on holiday. Between the two

are the Alps. You can drive around via France, through various tunnels

or go over major Alpine passes.

A J would want to decide the route before leaving.

A P would want to leave it open, decide at the time.

That is my description, gives one flavour.

I am INTP and that is pretty certain. (note the tendency to leave the

door open for it being wrong, not a cut and dried finalised issue)

A very good description of INTP written by one is here.

A lot of it fits well, but as ever not all. (caution again) :-)

Your understanding what is written will to a degree depend on your type!

http://www.intp.org/intprofile.html

joanne ford wrote:

> now that's a question i've been wanting to ask, the link between mbti and

autism. i'm an intj and i noticed a few years ago that intj matched a lot of my

quirks that i'm now blaming on autism. however, losing speech and walking into

doorjams and a lot of other stuff is NOT personality based.

>

> so, i've been wondering how much of my stuff is personality, and how much

autism (or aspergers)... any more info on that stuff anywhere?

>

> joanne

>

>

>

> Re: Quiz

>>

>> Aspie score -- 177/200

>>

>> NT score - 21/200

>>

>> Result : " very likely an Aspie "

>>

>> Been " selected as a candidate for the stim-quiz " , but no time for at

>> the moment

>>

>> kw

>>

>>

>>> Here is a fairly comprehensive quiz for Asperger's if that's what

>> people are looking for. I can't remember who it was. This one gives

>> the stats on NT answers too, and breaks the questions down into

>> categories.

>>> http://www.rdos. net/eng/Aspie- quiz.php

>>>

>>> Joanne

>>>

>>>

[Guest guest]

I have run small courses on the mbti just sort of using it to help people see

and understand differences between each other. Just never saw the connection to

autism although, for me, the 'weird thinking' of the intj was sounding an awful

lot like the weird thinking - or warped of the autistic. same wtih the social

issues and the chronic misunderstanding. also the creativity and the intellect.

I think that I am really an extrovert, but the autism changes me to seem as an

introvert. i've always wondered about that too, (before i got into the autism

stuff). becuase i always test introverted, and sometimes exactly even, but i

know that when i am out (if i can get out) i get energy from being around people

for the time that i am there, and for a certain lenght of time only.

but if i get energy from people, then that is more of an extrovert. so i think

i am an autistic extrovert who tests introvert perhaps.

now i'm wondering about the T/F as well. My T is right off to the side, and the

F is practically non existent (except in ministry where i test right down the

middle at work)

strange stuff. once you think you've discovered something that makes sense to

explain one's rather odd behavior, another thread can be found!

i got thrown out of an anglican church over this stuff. i thought it was

personality conflict, but hiding in closets at retreats when a friend has had ti

wtih my behaviour and decides to yell at me for 20 minutes straight doesnt sound

like a personality thing, it sounds far more like autism. i had no car, no way

of leaving, and didnt even think about what i was doing, - i was into that

closet and that was that.

essay over. i'm feeling rather ill today, was sick last night, sorry for the

difficiulty reading this

joanne

Re: Quiz

>>

>> Aspie score -- 177/200

>>

>> NT score - 21/200

>>

>> Result : " very likely an Aspie "

>>

>> Been " selected as a candidate for the stim-quiz " , but no time for at

>> the moment

>>

>> kw

>>

>>

>>> Here is a fairly comprehensive quiz for Asperger's if that's what

>> people are looking for. I can't remember who it was. This one gives

>> the stats on NT answers too, and breaks the questions down into

>> categories.

>>> http://www.rdos. net/eng/Aspie- quiz.php

>>>

>>> Joanne

>>>

>>>

[Guest guest]

Ok, what's mbti?

Re:

Re: links between mbti and AS Posted by: " joanne ford " joanneford@...

rochet24 Wed Mar 21, 2007 9:39 pm (PST) now that's a question i've been

wanting to ask, the link between mbti and autism. i'm an intj and i noticed a

few years ago that intj matched a lot of my quirks that i'm now blaming on

autism. however, losing speech and walking into doorjams and a lot of other

stuff is NOT personality based.

so, i've been wondering how much of my stuff is personality, and how much autism

(or aspergers).. . any more info on that stuff anywhere?

PASS IT ON!

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[Guest guest]

Myers Briggs Type Indicator

Re: links between mbti and AS

Ok, what's mbti?

Re:

Re: links between mbti and AS Posted by: " joanne ford " joannefordrogers (DOT) com

rochet24 Wed Mar 21, 2007 9:39 pm (PST) now that's a question i've been wanting

to ask, the link between mbti and autism. i'm an intj and i noticed a few years

ago that intj matched a lot of my quirks that i'm now blaming on autism.

however, losing speech and walking into doorjams and a lot of other stuff is NOT

personality based.

so, i've been wondering how much of my stuff is personality, and how much autism

(or aspergers).. . any more info on that stuff anywhere?

PASS IT ON!

Visit http://www.thehunge rsite.com to give food to the hungry with just

a click -- every day and at no cost to you.

HOW IT WORKS

When you click the " Give Free Food " button (once a day per person) at

http://www.thehunge rsite.com, this simple action gives over a cup of

fortified food to a hungry person.

It costs you nothing. Funding is paid by site sponsors and food is

distributed by two leading nonprofit hunger relief organizations: Mercy

Corps and America's Second Harvest. (A valid site -- I checked it out -- JP)

As Margaret Mead said, " Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful committed

citizens can change the world: Indeed it's the only thing that ever has. "

------------ --------- --------- ---

Expecting? Get great news right away with email Auto-Check.

Try the Yahoo! Mail Beta.

[Guest guest]

> Ok, what's mbti?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myers-Briggs_Type_Indicator

and on asperger's and mbti, a brief paragraph:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asperger_syndrome#Non-clinical_perspective

my scores on various mbti-like tests (all taken on the same day a month

ago) are below. i am a strong introvert and thinker, as opposed to

extrovert and feeler, which i suppose most asd people are. i think the

variety in my sensing vs intuition and judging vs perceiving is due to

some tests asking more behavioral-type questions, resulting more in

sensing or judging, and other tests asking more cognitive-type

questions, resulting more in intuition or perceiving. but this is just

my unresearched hypothesis. i will agree that i am somewhere close to

the midpoint between n/s and p/j. also, before knowing about asperger's,

the mbti was the best thing i ever found to help explain myself. i joked

i got out of the army early because i was an intp.

http://coldboot.no-ip.com/~mranostay/cgi-bin/keirsey.py

Keirsey Temperament Sorter Results

Your type is: INTJ - Mastermind Rational

Your 10.0% Extroverted and 90.0% Introverted

Your 35.0% Sensing and 65.0% Intuitive

Your 85.0% Thinking and 15.0% Feeling

Your 75.0% Judging and 25.0% Preceiving

http://www.humanmetrics.com/cgi-win/JTypes2.asp

HUMANMETRICS Jung Typology Test (0 being center between the two)

Your Type is INTJ

Introverted Intuitive Thinking Judging

89 25 50 11

http://similarminds.com/cgi-bin/newmb.pl

Jung Test Results

Introverted (I) 68.97% Extroverted (E) 31.03%

Sensing (S) 50% Intuitive (N) 50%

Thinking (T) 71.88% Feeling (F) 28.13%

Perceiving (P) 62.86% Judging (J) 37.14%

Your type is: INTP/ISTP

http://www.personalitytest.net/cgi-bin/q.pl

Personality type results (50% being center between the two)

EI: 14 out of 16 (87%)

SN: 9 out of 15 (60%)

TF: 3 out of 16 (18%)

JP: 9 out of 15 (60%)

Your Personality type is INTP

http://www.prelude-team.com/pca.php

Prelude Character Analysis Results

Your PCA Type: ISTJ

http://www.cognitiveprocesses.com/assessment/survey.html

InterStrength Cognitive Assessment

Cognitive Process Level of Development

(Preference, Skill and Frequency of Use)

extraverted Sensing (Se) = 24.4 average use

introverted Sensing (Si) = 32.2 good use

extraverted Intuiting (Ne) = 31.2 good use

introverted Intuiting (Ni) = 26.9 average use

extraverted Thinking (Te) = 33.3 good use

introverted Thinking (Ti) = 40.4 excellent use

extraverted Feeling (Fe) = 11.8 unused

introverted Feeling (Fi) = 39.2 excellent use

By focusing on the strongest configuration of cognitive processes, your

pattern of responses most closely matches individuals of this type: INTP

-dave

--

(intp) 55.22682% - Extreme Geek 114 of 159:

sometimes i wish i had a voodoo etch-a-sketch so i could draw the

people i am talking to and then turn it upside down and shake it.

[Guest guest]

----- Original Message -----

> I'm INTJ too.

Same here. It seems to be a pattern here...

D.

[Guest guest]

I'm finding another thing interesting. I've mentioned it before but I am able

to articulate it better now. I think that I am really extroverted, but because

of autism, I score introverted on the myers briggs testing. I also think that I

might be perceiving as well, but again, score judging on the myers briggs due to

the testing. I have more evidence to believe that i am extroverted than i have

to believe that i am percieving, but it is interesting none-the-less.

Joanne INTJ... or so I thought. It is very

Re: links between mbti and AS

----- Original Message -----

From: " P.C. MacNeil " <msp@.... ca>

> I'm INTJ too.

Same here. It seems to be a pattern here...

D.

[Guest guest]

rest of message:

it is very interesting that so many here are INT something and more J than P

....yes, a trend I believe. hmmm..

Re: links between mbti and AS

----- Original Message -----

From: " P.C. MacNeil " <msp@.... ca>

> I'm INTJ too.

Same here. It seems to be a pattern here...

D.

[Guest guest]

ISTJ here on the paper based test (done as part of an engineering course)

with the score (out of 70) being:

37 introversion

31 sensations

41 thinking

55 judgements

The only other test I took about this was an online test on www.okcupid.com

which resulted in INTJ (didn't gave any score)

Alain

--

No virus found in this outgoing message.

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07:44

[Guest guest]

Alain wrote:

>ISTJ here on the paper based test (done as part of an engineering course)

>with the score (out of 70) being:

>

>37 introversion

>31 sensations

>41 thinking

>55 judgements

>

>The only other test I took about this was an online test on www.okcupid.com

>which resulted in INTJ (didn't gave any score)

This topic came up on another group. I posted:

I took the test for which someone here posted a link. My " score " came

out ISTJ. There were some numbers, too, giving " strength of the

preferences " : introverted 89%, sensing 25%, thinking 100%, judging

56%.

I have no idea what any of that means.

Jane

[Guest guest]

> There were some numbers, too, giving " strength of the

> preferences " : introverted 89%, sensing 25%, thinking 100%, judging

> 56%.

>

> I have no idea what any of that means.

You know, I though I had an answer to that question but a little quick check

on my calculation (for the sensing percentage) show that I am wrong. I think

I can work it out but not tonight.

Alain

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07:44

[Guest guest]

I scored as an ISTJ, but had difficulty with the Thinking versus Feeling.

I am unsettled by disharmony and get very upset by it, and I do try to

take people's feelings and needs into account in everything I do (I

take care of my family of four, after all) -- but largely I am on the

Thinking side, which doesn't take those aspects into account.

So maybe I am an IST/FJ? :-)

kw

[Guest guest]

----- Original Message -----

>

>

> it is very interesting that so many here are INT something and more J than

> P ...yes, a trend I believe. hmmm..

Actually, I'm ISTJ. I wrote it wrong last night, as I was very tired.

D.

[Guest guest]

This topic came up on another group. I posted:

Jane wrote:

" I took the test for which someone here posted a link. My " score " came

out ISTJ. There were some numbers, too, giving " strength of the

preferences " : introverted 89%, sensing 25%, thinking 100%, judging

56%.

I have no idea what any of that means. "

It means that you draw energy from being alone, more than with others. (I)

It means that you interpret your world around you more through your 'senses'

than through your iNtuition (S) and you are likely quite a literal thinker

It means that you respond to your world around you primarily through your

thinking (T) and hardly ever through your feeling function.

It means that you like everything planned and in order (J) rather than to take

things as they come and 'go with the flow, leave the door open etc' (P)

There are lots of web sites that explain more fully each type. this really

helped me to understand myself better to use this tool. But that's what it is,

a tool, not a diagnosis, or a prescription for life.

Joanne

RE: links between mbti and AS

Alain wrote:

>ISTJ here on the paper based test (done as part of an engineering course)

>with the score (out of 70) being:

>

>37 introversion

>31 sensations

>41 thinking

>55 judgements

>

>The only other test I took about this was an online test on www.okcupid. com

>which resulted in INTJ (didn't gave any score)

This topic came up on another group. I posted:

I took the test for which someone here posted a link. My " score " came

out ISTJ. There were some numbers, too, giving " strength of the

preferences " : introverted 89%, sensing 25%, thinking 100%, judging

56%.

I have no idea what any of that means.

Jane

[Guest guest]

> I scored as an ISTJ, but had difficulty with the Thinking versus

> Feeling.

>

> I am unsettled by disharmony and get very upset by it, and I do try to

> take people's feelings and needs into account in everything I do (I

> take care of my family of four, after all) -- but largely I am on the

> Thinking side, which doesn't take those aspects into account.

>

> So maybe I am an IST/FJ? :-)

it sounds like perhaps you deliberately think about how others might

feel concerning what you do. i can do this, but i really *think* about

it, instead of just *feeling* it. it also sounds like you understand

your family responsibilities, so you wish to take care of them. you are

doing things that gender roles have said that the moms do, so it would

make sense to me that you would think more about these things than if

you were a father but otherwise the same (and not just because it was

your innate nature), especially since " ISTJs tend to believe in laws and

traditions. "

just something to think about.

-dave

--

(intp) 55.22682% - Extreme Geek 20 of 159:

computers let you take laziness to a whole new level. - mrak

[Guest guest]

As honest people the tricks in the MBTI tests are not needed. They are

there because some try to cheat.

The language, exact text matters too, making just one set of questions

inappropriate.

Try this it may start to make sense on why for us it is difficult to get

a definite answer, sorry about the screen colours.

http://www.my-pub.net/mbti/

joanne ford wrote:

> This topic came up on another group. I posted:

>

> Jane wrote:

>

> " I took the test for which someone here posted a link. My " score " came

> out ISTJ. There were some numbers, too, giving " strength of the

> preferences " : introverted 89%, sensing 25%, thinking 100%, judging

> 56%.

>

> I have no idea what any of that means. "

>

> It means that you draw energy from being alone, more than with others. (I)

> It means that you interpret your world around you more through your 'senses'

than through your iNtuition (S) and you are likely quite a literal thinker

> It means that you respond to your world around you primarily through your

thinking (T) and hardly ever through your feeling function.

> It means that you like everything planned and in order (J) rather than to take

things as they come and 'go with the flow, leave the door open etc' (P)

>

> There are lots of web sites that explain more fully each type. this really

helped me to understand myself better to use this tool. But that's what it is,

a tool, not a diagnosis, or a prescription for life.

>

[Guest guest]

hmmm yes, you are Thinking about how to feel... you are processing primarily

still through your thinking function!!

joanne

Re: links between mbti and AS

> I scored as an ISTJ, but had difficulty with the Thinking versus

> Feeling.

>

> I am unsettled by disharmony and get very upset by it, and I do try to

> take people's feelings and needs into account in everything I do (I

> take care of my family of four, after all) -- but largely I am on the

> Thinking side, which doesn't take those aspects into account.

>

> So maybe I am an IST/FJ? :-)

it sounds like perhaps you deliberately think about how others might

feel concerning what you do. i can do this, but i really *think* about

it, instead of just *feeling* it. it also sounds like you understand

your family responsibilities, so you wish to take care of them. you are

doing things that gender roles have said that the moms do, so it would

make sense to me that you would think more about these things than if

you were a father but otherwise the same (and not just because it was

your innate nature), especially since " ISTJs tend to believe in laws and

traditions. "

just something to think about.

-dave

--

(intp) 55.22682% - Extreme Geek 20 of 159:

computers let you take laziness to a whole new level. - mrak

[Guest guest]

----- Original Message -----

>

> ...especially since " ISTJs tend to believe in laws and

> traditions. "

Hmmm, I'm ISPJ and I'm not so much into traditions. I'd keep laws to a

minimum, like only common-sense laws, no silly, unenforcable laws or laws

that just beg to be broken.

D.

[Guest guest]

All valid points and, after giving it some time and thought (while

doing housework) - I think your reasoning here is correct, though I

never saw it that way before. I didn't used to be this way. I was very

different 10 years ago, when my mother died suddenly, and

circumstances in my family were such that it was necessary for me to

take on a " mother " type of role (versus career and school) ... then I

became a mother, and that was not an immediate instinctual bond, but

it took time, practice, and a lot of learning on my part. Same thing

with being married - it does not come naturally to me. It's taken a

lot of hard work, dedication, patience, observation, study, practice.

I have things in my home and in my family set up a certain way that

make sense to me, and I stick very closely to the basics, to what I

know that works, and to routines and schedules. Otherwise everything

falls apart and so do I. Pathetic, huh?

So in looking at your rationale here - yes, this would put me very

securely in Thinking, including my strict adherence to traditions,

rules, and having to think everything through.

As it is, I have agreed to attend a child's birthday party next

weekend at the home of a childhood friend that i have not seen in

years. My husband felt it would be good for me and the kids to go. I'd

rather not, but he does have a point (otherwise I'd just be a

recluse). But I have to prepare myself for it, rehearse some " normal "

responses, and remember social skills that my mother taught me that

are acceptable in nearly all festive gatherings.

My mother tried to get me help when I was a child, but no one ever

provided any. I was an early talker, a quiet daydreamer, imaginative

and bright, but lousy at paying attention and I couldn't make or keep

friends save for one or two in my neighborhood because our mothers

were friends. I spent much of my time alone, or with relatives. I

liked it that way. I think since my mother was unable to find any

professional help that worked, she took charge and figured things out

for me - structured routines, clear rules, and planned meals with a

focus on specific foods for certain times of the day. She studied all

of this stuff and had it down to a science with me. And this worked

well, for years. Her death tore all of that up and it took a few years

for me to get back on my feet and figure out how to do this on my own.

When I told a European friend who works with autistic children and

adults that i had tried two online screening tests for Asperger's, and

told him my high scores on both, his response was that he had always

known this about me, but does it matter to me? He feels it is not a

problem, only for those who refuse to consider neurological

differences and other ways of being and want everything to be " normal "

their way. I think he's an Aspie too, personally.

Thanks for your thoughts, D. - your views make sense to me, I enjoy

your posts.

kw

>

> > I scored as an ISTJ, but had difficulty with the Thinking versus

> > Feeling.

> >

> > I am unsettled by disharmony and get very upset by it, and I do

try to

> > take people's feelings and needs into account in everything I do (I

> > take care of my family of four, after all) -- but largely I am on the

> > Thinking side, which doesn't take those aspects into account.

> >

> > So maybe I am an IST/FJ? :-)

>

> it sounds like perhaps you deliberately think about how others might

> feel concerning what you do. i can do this, but i really *think* about

> it, instead of just *feeling* it. it also sounds like you understand

> your family responsibilities, so you wish to take care of them. you are

> doing things that gender roles have said that the moms do, so it would

> make sense to me that you would think more about these things than if

> you were a father but otherwise the same (and not just because it was

> your innate nature), especially since " ISTJs tend to believe in laws

and

> traditions. "

>

> just something to think about.

>

> -dave

> --

> (intp) 55.22682% - Extreme Geek 20 of 159:

> computers let you take laziness to a whole new level. - mrak

>

[Guest guest]

I use what works, what makes sense to me, and what keeps my life and

my family's life flowing as smoothly as possible. This is necessary

also for my children, especially for my toddler, as she does not react

to changes well, so I must try to keep things stable for her sake

also. And for me, if there is not an even flow in routine, I tend to

feel " lost " and adrift. This gives me an uncomfortable feeling of

agitation and makes me cranky.

(Summer is a challenge for me when my 8yo is home with no school

schedule to follow.)

Every so often, I do review present routines and schedules to see what

needs tweaking, and I make adjustments to things as needed, to what is

more time-efficient or cost-effective.

kw

>

>

> ----- Original Message -----

>

> >

> > ...especially since " ISTJs tend to believe in laws and

> > traditions. "

>

>

> Hmmm, I'm ISPJ and I'm not so much into traditions. I'd keep laws to a

> minimum, like only common-sense laws, no silly, unenforcable laws or

laws

> that just beg to be broken.

>

>

> D.

>

[Guest guest]

Yes, I agree with this -- only I didn't see that this is how I

actually function until D. pointed it out to me. Now it makes perfect

sense <g>

kw

>

> > I scored as an ISTJ, but had difficulty with the Thinking versus

> > Feeling.

> >

> > I am unsettled by disharmony and get very upset by it, and I do

try to

> > take people's feelings and needs into account in everything I do (I

> > take care of my family of four, after all) -- but largely I am on the

> > Thinking side, which doesn't take those aspects into account.

> >

> > So maybe I am an IST/FJ? :-)

>

> it sounds like perhaps you deliberately think about how others might

> feel concerning what you do. i can do this, but i really *think* about

> it, instead of just *feeling* it. it also sounds like you understand

> your family responsibilities, so you wish to take care of them. you are

> doing things that gender roles have said that the moms do, so it would

> make sense to me that you would think more about these things than if

> you were a father but otherwise the same (and not just because it was

> your innate nature), especially since " ISTJs tend to believe in laws

and

> traditions. "

>

> just something to think about.

>

> -dave

> --

> (intp) 55.22682% - Extreme Geek 20 of 159:

> computers let you take laziness to a whole new level. - mrak

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

but do you really like things like Thanksgiving and other holidays and are they

important to you? Laws - doesn't mean that you like them so much as you like to

see things regulated, in your life and to keep order (somehow) in the world

around you...

and then again, I could be mistaken.

Jo

Re: links between mbti and AS

----- Original Message -----

From: " dave willis " <crunchyvenamous (DOT) net>

>

> ...especially since " ISTJs tend to believe in laws and

> traditions. "

Hmmm, I'm ISPJ and I'm not so much into traditions. I'd keep laws to a

minimum, like only common-sense laws, no silly, unenforcable laws or laws

that just beg to be broken.

D.