Re: ID's

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 11/22/00 8:30:09 AM Pacific Standard Time,

rfrederi@... writes:

<< I have been told that begining next June all certified persons on an EMS

scene are to have their name and certification level on visiable on their

shirts. Can anyone let me know if this is a rule from TDH and of so where.

Thanks

Frederick EMT-B

>>

I talked with TDH this past week about this. What you are saying is correct.

If I understood correctly, the new requirement went into effect on September

1, 2000. Also, I was told that any First Responder agency would be allowed

to wait on implementing this until their next renewal of their First

Responder License.

Personally, I believe that any EMS provider, i.e., First Provider, etc.,

should implement this immediately. The Fire Dept. I am with, which also a

First Responder organization, implemented this about 2 weeks ago even though

their renewal does not come up until 2002.

Hope this helps you.

, BS, LP

[Guest guest]

Is that like a name plate or a picture ID?

jay

Re: [texasems-L] ID's

In a message dated 11/22/00 8:30:09 AM Pacific Standard Time,

rfrederi@... writes:

<< I have been told that begining next June all certified persons on an EMS

scene are to have their name and certification level on visiable on their

shirts. Can anyone let me know if this is a rule from TDH and of so where.

Thanks

Frederick EMT-B

>>

I talked with TDH this past week about this. What you are saying is correct.

If I understood correctly, the new requirement went into effect on September

1, 2000. Also, I was told that any First Responder agency would be allowed

to wait on implementing this until their next renewal of their First

Responder License.

Personally, I believe that any EMS provider, i.e., First Provider, etc.,

should implement this immediately. The Fire Dept. I am with, which also a

First Responder organization, implemented this about 2 weeks ago even though

their renewal does not come up until 2002.

Hope this helps you.

, BS, LP

eGroups Sponsor

[Guest guest]

I have not heard anything about it. No one at the EMS Conference said

anything about it. You might check with your regional office.

Wayne

[texasems-L] ID's

> I have been told that begining next June all certified persons on an EMS

scene are to have their name and certification level on visiable on their

shirts. Can anyone let me know if this is a rule from TDH and of so where.

>

> Thanks

> Frederick EMT-B

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

The new rule is for First Responder Organizations;Rule

157.14 As for requirements, it states

157.14 (d)(2) assuring that all personnel, when on

scene, are prominently identified by name, certification

level, and organization.

Hope this helps to answer your question.

> I have not heard anything about it. No one at the EMS Conference said

> anything about it. You might check with your regional office.

>

> Wayne

> [texasems-L] ID's

>

>

> > I have been told that begining next June all certified persons on an EMS

> scene are to have their name and certification level on visiable on their

> shirts. Can anyone let me know if this is a rule from TDH and of so where.

> >

> > Thanks

> > Frederick EMT-B

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 11/22/00 4:34:54 PM Central Standard Time,

jhoskins@... writes:

> Is that like a name plate or a picture ID?

>

> jay

The rule doesn't specify what form it has to be in--it can be a name tag, on

your shirt, or whatever meets the requirements. The rule says that, if you

are on scene or on an in-service vehicle, you have to be prominently

identified by name, level of certification or license, and department.

Maxine

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 11/22/00 7:16:49 PM Central Standard Time,

kenffemt@... writes:

> The new rule is for First Responder Organizations;Rule

> 157.14 As for requirements, it states

>

> 157.14 (d)(2) assuring that all personnel, when on

> scene, are prominently identified by name, certification

> level, and organization.

It also applies to licensed providers. Rule 157.11(l)(5).

Maxine

[Guest guest]

The rule doesn't affect many EMS agencies that have uniform requirements,

but it is another one of those rules that forget about the volunteer

agencies that have responders that may be answering calls dressed in many

different ways.

What about the dangers of revealing your full name to the bad guys we

sometimes see???

Any interpretations of the name requirement, i.e. First and Last or First

or Last name only???

Steve

Re: [texasems-L] ID's

> Isn't this pretty much already done? I mean, the services I've seen wear

> their patch showing their level of certification and usually a patch

showing..<snip>

[Guest guest]

Steve,

I agree with you in that we should not display our full names for

security purposes. We had an incident at the ER where I used to work where

one of the female techs was stalked. We did not put the last names on our

badge and I agree that in the field, it should not be necessary for security

reasons.

I did not think about the volunteers, you're right and I apologize, but

would it be too difficult to keep a name tag in your vehicle or on your

person so that if you do respond you can place it on your shirt?

Just my thoughts!

Take care, stay safe, and practice mercy, ya'll!!

Jana

FW,TX

Re: [texasems-L] ID's

>

>

> > Isn't this pretty much already done? I mean, the services I've seen

wear

> > their patch showing their level of certification and usually a patch

> showing..<snip>

>

>

>

>

>

>

_________________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 11/25/00 2:56:39 AM Pacific Standard Time,

medicgirl@... writes:

<< Steve,

I agree with you in that we should not display our full names for

security purposes. We had an incident at the ER where I used to work where

one of the female techs was stalked. We did not put the last names on our

badge and I agree that in the field, it should not be necessary for security

reasons.

I did not think about the volunteers, you're right and I apologize, but

would it be too difficult to keep a name tag in your vehicle or on your

person so that if you do respond you can place it on your shirt?

Just my thoughts!

Take care, stay safe, and practice mercy, ya'll!!

Jana

FW,TX

>>

I wore a name badge for 23 years with my full name on it and never gave it a

thought. I never had any problem with displaying my full name. Just my

opinion but I believe the public has the right to know your full name.

[Guest guest]

Jana,

No apology needed. The exchange of viewpoints is the redeeming quality of

this listserver for me and I was just pointing out a different view of the

subject.

Yes, we will use some sort of id badge like you proposed and it will not be

too hard to meet the requirement, so no real complaint here.

I guess my real gripe is when a rule is put in place that I don't/can't

understand the reasoning or importance behind it, especially when it has the

word " shall " placed with it. Example....I am on my way home from church

dressed in a suit and tie. I see the medic unit a few houses up the street

from my home. I stop to see if I can help the team. It is a cardiac

arrest call! I take over compressions and with an extra set of hands the

level of care is improved, the patient has a return of spontaneous

respirations and perfusion.....and I have just violated the rule because my

id tag is somewhere else.

I know the rules are formulated to protect the public and I guess there is a

great problem somewhere with bad medics getting away with bad stuff, because

J.Q. Public can't identify the medic that came to their aid by name, hence

the i.d. rule.

I don't see this rule as a solution, but I will not resist the efforts to

solve the problem, except to point out that EMS currently exists in several

different forms and a rule that is easily applied in some places, is an

extra burden with little reward in others.

Thanks,

Steve

Re: [texasems-L] ID's

> Steve,

> I agree with you in that we should not display our full names for

> security purposes. We had an incident at the ER where I used to work

where

> one of the female techs was stalked. We did not put the last names on our

> badge and I agree that in the field, it should not be necessary for

security

> reasons.

> I did not think about the volunteers, you're right and I apologize,

...<snip>

[Guest guest]

Sounds like we are entering the prison system now. Known as a number :-) At

least we don't have cards that are about the size of a drivers license with a

blue border, with EMT or Paramedic stamped across it in red letters. Then we

would look like TDCJ inmates lol.

Seriously, I had rather either have first & last name, and level of

certification; or first/or last name & level of certification. No numbers for

the public to know us by. After all, we arent inmates (yet). " yes sir, I had

paramedic 7875613 working on me, or was it 7875618? (sorry if this is your

number... i just picked it at random). The TDH numbers may not be too long now

(mine is 6 digits), but eventually they will be. Names are easier to remember

than numbers, I think.

Just my opinion.

Jay Hoskins

EMT

EMS Instructor

Texas Peace Officer

[texasems-L] ID's

Hello all... I have a name badge with my full name also, but I'm a fairly

big guy and pretty arrogant. :-) I don't have a wife and kids to worry about

if some bad guy should find out my name, and later my address, after not

being able to " save " one of his buddies or " saving " someone he wanted out of

the way.... Basically, I don't feel in the high risk category... However,

I have several female EMT and paramedic friends that I do worry about (sounds

chauvinistic, oh well...). I think the concern for personal security is

always a reasonable one. Isn't that one of the first rules of EMTing,

scene/personal safety? Well, that and " If it's wet and not yours, don't

touch it... "

As an alternative, what about first names and TDH ID numbers? Just a

thought..

Have a great day and be careful out there......

Joe Kiff, EMT-I

[Guest guest]

I keep a nametag in my car to put on when I first respond. Has a copy of my

license laminated, but the writing is too small for anybody to read easily.

On top of it is my TJC ID with my pic. Works well. Got them laminated at

Kinkos for $5.

Gene G.

[Guest guest]

Joe,

I don't think you're chauvinistic at all. I do think that the females

have a little more to worry about than the guys, sometimes. Yes, the public

has a right to know that they are cared for by trained professionals, but it

is not their job to see that we are trained! They don't know the details

anyway, and could not tell whether an EMT is supposed to start an IV anyway.

Besides, it if is necessary (and I mean really necessary) that they have our

full names and certifications, it is too simple to obtain that from either

my hospital administration or the ambulance company's administration. And,

if we have our TDH number on our badge, then they have our social security

number, right?

I'll abide by the rules, but I don't have to agree with them. It's just

like the rule at my hospital that anyone in pt care not wear sculptured

nails. I see the point, but when I don't have sculptures on, my nails are

more likely to harbor bacteria, etc., but I don't wear sculptures because

that's the rule.

Anyway, just my opinion!

Take care, stay safe, and practice mercy, ya'll!!

Jana

FW,TX

[texasems-L] ID's

> Hello all... I have a name badge with my full name also, but I'm a

fairly

> big guy and pretty arrogant. :-) I don't have a wife and kids to worry

about

> if some bad guy should find out my name, and later my address, after not

> being able to " save " one of his buddies or " saving " someone he wanted out

of

> the way.... Basically, I don't feel in the high risk category...

However,

> I have several female EMT and paramedic friends that I do worry about

(sounds

> chauvinistic, oh well...). I think the concern for personal security is

> always a reasonable one. Isn't that one of the first rules of EMTing,

> scene/personal safety? Well, that and " If it's wet and not yours, don't

> touch it... "

>

> As an alternative, what about first names and TDH ID numbers? Just a

> thought..

>

> Have a great day and be careful out there......

>

> Joe Kiff, EMT-I

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Here in the UK, we tend to have out First names embroidered on our outfits

(which vary from county to county), I think it can help build a much needed

rapport between patient and medic if they can see we have names, just like

everyone else. It sounds simple but it works. Again, for security reasons,

we never give our full names to a patient. If they wish to complain, then we

give them our first names and the vehicle fleet number. That way, any crew

can be traced at any time. When we are in the field at, say, an RTA ( an

MVA), then our county ID badges with Photo, Skill level etc, are displayed

in a pocket on our Hi-Vis jackets.

Hope you all had a wonderful Thanksgiving,

Guy

[Guest guest]

,

You don't have to give TDH the right to sell your name and ID. It is public

record, and anybody can find it out.

Why don't cops wear their full names? Many do. Not to do so inflames those

who are offended by their conduct and causes them to make calls to the FBI,

Civil Rights Commission, lawyers, and so forth. You can't hide, my friend.

You're responsible for who you are and what you do. Only the dumb cannot

find out who you are. Best not to give anyone a reason for wanting to find

out who you are.

What do we have to hide? Why this stuff about hiding our identities? The

implication is that we're doing something wrong that we want to hide from.

Gene G.

In a message dated 11/26/2000 11:38:26 AM US Mountain Standard Time,

water13985@... writes:

<< Subj: [texasems-L] ID's

Date: 11/26/2000 11:38:26 AM US Mountain Standard Time

From: water13985@...

Reply-to: egroups

To: egroups

With today's technology, and the availability of personal information is it

truly Wise to post Your full name On your ID badge? If it is so safe then

why

don't our brothers in Blue (cops) have their full name on their ID badge?

Also, I do not recall giving TDH permission to sell my Name and address to

ANYONE. (i.e., have received multiple cards for employment in the Dallas

area).

LP

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>>

[Guest guest]

Since this topic was getting into full swing, I decided to review the Patient's

Bill of Rights, in regards to identity and etc..... According to the Patient's

Bill of Rights, the patient has the right to know the identity of physicians,

nurses, and others involved in their care and to know when those involved are

students, residents, or other trainees.

This is almost a direct quote from the the above mentioned bill. This means to

me the patient has a right to know your full name, organization and level of

certification, license, education, etc.... The cases in which patients come

looking for medical personnel seeking " revenge " for alleged misdoings is highly

overrated. If a patient asks me my information, I tell them, I don't worry

about

it and yes, I have a family. Just thought I would add what I've been able to

find out.

water13985@... wrote:

> With today's technology, and the availability of personal information is it

> truly Wise to post Your full name On your ID badge? If it is so safe then why

> don't our brothers in Blue (cops) have their full name on their ID badge?

> Also, I do not recall giving TDH permission to sell my Name and address to

> ANYONE. (i.e., have received multiple cards for employment in the Dallas

> area).

>

> LP

>

[Guest guest]

Is my address public record on the TDH site? I am

personally tired of the snail spam, concerning EMS.

I'm also concerned about these arguments about

privacy. Some people are more private than others.

I've had my home phone number given by my old

employer, to someone claiming to be an old friend. Do

people have the right to that kind of info? If they

have an address, it's very easy to do a cross search

and get a phone number.

Also, about the debate about signing one's posts here.

Some people may not wish to sign a post if their

opinion clashes with their employer. I always sign my

posts, but many times I've had to bite my tongue

because what I wanted to say could get me in trouble

at work. People ought to be free to post here,

without fear of it being read by a boss and used

against them. I just saw a post where someone asked a

poster what agency they worked for. Is that really

necessary? Let's just try to respect people's right

to privacy, and allow them to feel comfortable in the

conversation.

Just so no one asks...

Connie Mundell EMT-P (7 years)

Rural Metro-Arlington

mother of one son (11 years)

owner of a rescued cat

daughter

sister

smoker

hockey fan

eBay seller

....did I forget anything?

--- wegandy@... wrote:

> ,

>

> You don't have to give TDH the right to sell your

> name and ID. It is public

> record, and anybody can find it out.

>

> Why don't cops wear their full names? Many do. Not

> to do so inflames those

> who are offended by their conduct and causes them to

> make calls to the FBI,

> Civil Rights Commission, lawyers, and so forth. You

> can't hide, my friend.

> You're responsible for who you are and what you do.

> Only the dumb cannot

> find out who you are. Best not to give anyone a

> reason for wanting to find

> out who you are.

>

> What do we have to hide? Why this stuff about

> hiding our identities? The

> implication is that we're doing something wrong that

> we want to hide from.

>

> Gene G.

>

> In a message dated 11/26/2000 11:38:26 AM US

> Mountain Standard Time,

> water13985@... writes:

>

> << Subj: [texasems-L] ID's

> Date: 11/26/2000 11:38:26 AM US Mountain Standard

> Time

> From: water13985@...

> Reply-to: egroups

> To: egroups

>

> With today's technology, and the availability of

> personal information is it

> truly Wise to post Your full name On your ID badge?

> If it is so safe then

> why

> don't our brothers in Blue (cops) have their full

> name on their ID badge?

> Also, I do not recall giving TDH permission to sell

> my Name and address to

> ANYONE. (i.e., have received multiple cards for

> employment in the Dallas

> area).

>

> LP

>

>

>

>

>

>

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__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Yes Connie, it is. They even have it broke down by regions.

Jay Hoskins

EMT/EMS Instr.

Re: [texasems-L] ID's

Is my address public record on the TDH site

[Guest guest]

May I weigh in?

First, I have nothing to hide, nor does many people on here and

elsewhere in EMS. I don't think that those who are concerned with

full disclosure are trying to hide anything, nor are advocating

anonimity. I think the underlying thought is to prevent making it

easy for those with less-than-honorable intentions to have

information that those specific individuals have no need for.

A few thoughts: Yes, almost all of our personal information is

available through TDH, if not our public service employers (not

trying to slight privates here). Yes, there are circumstances where

there is legitimate need/desire for identifying information. I choose

to look at it this way: If someone wants to complain or praise, they

will actively seek out the necessary information. If it not available

by ID, badge, nameplate, they (with the right amount of motivation)

will seek it out by one of the following:

-asking the individual

-calling the employer

-finding someone who does know the requisite information

-writing to the local paper editorial staff

I do not have a problem with someone having my full name, medic

number, run number, supervisor, etc.- I just do not volunteer these

items during routine contact.

" Hi, I'm Randy, from BFD Medic 1, your service number is 00-5991.

My supervisor's name is Tim Hardy, and my shoe size is 8-1/2.

What seems to be bothering you today? " -hehe, sorry, just doesn't

flow well

My plan is to identify by first name (more informal, builds rapport)

and go from there. If they want my full name or more, I'll give it to

them. If they want to file a complaint, I'll tell them my name is Ron

Haussecker.

Just kidding, Ron.

I hope all had a wonderful Thanksgiving!

God Bless,

R

---------------------------------------------------

Randy Pitts, LP/NREMT-P

EMS Coordinator, C-Shift

Fire Department

------------------------------------------------------

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 11/26/00 11:45:02 PM Central Standard Time,

traumasnob@... writes:

> Just so no one asks...

> Connie Mundell EMT-P (7 years)

> Rural Metro-Arlington

> mother of one son (11 years)

> owner of a rescued cat

> daughter

> sister

> smoker

> hockey fan

> eBay seller

> ...did I forget anything?

>

>

I think you covered it all except the cats name (LOL)

[Guest guest]

I tend to agree. Most paramedics and Firefighters

hate to play what if. But what if the bad guy does

get your name and begins harrasment? Why not take

steps to prevent that from happening. Should we be

anonymous? No. However we should be judicious about

how much information is given out. We have families

to take care of as well as our selves, and their

safety is my concern. I never hesitate to introduce

myself by first name. They want, need, desire more

info; they can ask. I will decide then what they need

to know. My employer can all ways deal with requests

for more information if they desire. However, they

should be careful in how much they give out.

These are my own opinions.

Tom LeNeveu

LP FTO Lt

Newark Fire Department

=====

Tom LeNeveu

Be Safe Out There

www.dreamwater.net/leneveu3

www.dreamwater.net/tccrfa

www.dreamwater.net/newarkfire

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

AMEN

In a message dated 11/28/00 5:15:48 AM Central Standard Time,

psfamily@... writes:

> I have watched this for a couple of days now and I figured I would weight in

> now. Yes, the public has a right to know who I am that is why I put my

last

> name on my shirt. If they have a need to know my first name, they can ask

> me and I will choose at that time to inform them. If they cannot ask and

> family member needs to know they can ask me, again it is my choice or they

> can call my service. People, remember we live in a cruel and dangerous

> world. At some point, we will treat someone who is hostile or their buddy

> is and if you have a family, you need to consider their safety and well

> being. Some will say, you can't run around paranoid, worrying about what

> might happen. True but a little common sense and precaution can make your

> days longer on this earth. You may not worry about yourself, but you

should

> consider your loved ones. You do have to leave home and it is usually for

> an extended period. It is too easy to locate someone and if you develope a

> beef with pt who is mentally off and vindictive, who will bear the brunt of

> this idiot's wrath? Same reason, as a police officer, I put my first

> initial and last name on my uniform. We as public servants have seen what

> man can inflict upon each other, we should make it difficult for the bad

guy

> in order to protect the ones we love.

>

> P. Sloan ()

> Paramedic student

> Police officer

>

>

> _______