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Hi Freda,

I'm fairly new here too; 53 and grateful to have found this list. My mother

is 71, has all of my life been devastatingly cruel to her children, even to my

father. She is as you describe, typically BPD: manipulative/cunning/bright,

controlling, blaming, resentful, jealous, and charming to people outside the

family. I have been in and out of various therapies since my early twenties.

You will be believed here, and supported. Your story left me trembling and

in tears. I believe your suspicions about your mother's attempts to kill you.

Have you any living relatives who might recall (or be willing to talk about)

your having had frequent accidents/falls/accidental poisonings as a small

child?

My youngest brother is 13 years my junior; 9 years between him and the next

child. I am the oldest. Both of my parents were quite cruel to my brother,

and neglectful; he was born at a time when I believe they probably would have

divorced had there not been a 4th child.

When my youngest brother was 2 he drank turpentine from a mason jar and

nearly died; was hospitalized for weeks with kidney and liver failure and

pneumonia. I was blamed for his 'accidental poisoning' as I had an oil paint

set. Our

mother accused me of leaving turpentine where he could reach it. However, as

I was always berated about the smell when I was painting, my jar of

turpentine was always closed unless I was actually sitting at my desk painting;

and my

turpentine would have been used/cloudy. I distinctly, chillingly, remember

through her screaming at me as she held up that the jar of clear, clean/new

turpentine as proof - my tiny brother lay choking and gasping on the floor.

This

happened on a Saturday morning; my brother was taken to a doctor/hospitolized

when my father came home that evening.

I'm so glad you are here, we are all starting from the same place. I hope

you will keep posting. Carol

Had a mother who was maybe BP. She was manipulative, cunning, very

bright, very charming to folks outside of the family. I was born

last of 4 children, 10 years after the one before me. I am almost

certain that my mother tried to kill me at one point for a period

when I was around 4 or 5 (with a yucky variety of poisoning... over

a period of time)and she had just divorced my dad and the other kids

were gone (one grown and moved out, 2 younger...both boys...went to

live with my dad) So I was alone with her ...

I have now relationship with my siblings anymore. The fastest way

to explain that is say if my mother was the witch in the Wizard of

Oz, my brothers and my sister were her monkeys.

My mother is now dead, she died at the age of 96...I am now 64...AND

STILL TRYING to leave this all behind. Such grief.

Your posts reveal a lot of knowledge on the subject of BPD. So I

guess my request is this: from what you know , and what I've said,

does this exceed the parameters of BPD?

She was never diagnosed with anything...everyone thought she was

just great...once I was trying to explain to an old friend just a

little of what she was like...he said " Look...I've met your

mother...it's hard to believe these things about such a sweet old

lady " Very typical response.

I've been in therapy a lot in my time...but in my many attempts,

didn't find a person that really could deal with BPD or whatever

this was.

Freda

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Hi Freda & Carol -- thanks for sharing your experiences. Isn't it

interesting how much violence pervades our lives till we " escape " --

even then may haunt us for who knows how long? We KO's are

perceptive. After reading your stories I wanted to add that I had to

leave " home " at 16 after nearly *successfully* killing nada. By some

miracle, after being dragged up on the streets of nyc and new

orleans for years, I was accepted into Columbia University and there

excelled. The FOO were (are) so " out to lunch " they couldn't even

manage my graduation in a meaningful way -- even after everything

I'd gone through to achieve that...(prison, etc).

Enough bitching I think I've been ranting too much lately. Hopefully

this will pass....this list is a good thing and and the 'reality

check' aspect helps me through the toughest coping. thanks

everyone :) esp. for listening

> Hi Freda,

>

> I'm fairly new here too; 53 and grateful to have found this list.

My mother

> is 71, has all of my life been devastatingly cruel to her

children, even to my

> father. She is as you describe, typically BPD:

manipulative/cunning/bright,

> controlling, blaming, resentful, jealous, and charming to people

outside the

> family. I have been in and out of various therapies since my

early twenties.

>

> You will be believed here, and supported. Your story left me

trembling and

> in tears. I believe your suspicions about your mother's attempts

to kill you.

> Have you any living relatives who might recall (or be willing to

talk about)

> your having had frequent accidents/falls/accidental poisonings as

a small

> child?

>

> My youngest brother is 13 years my junior; 9 years between him and

the next

> child. I am the oldest. Both of my parents were quite cruel to

my brother,

> and neglectful; he was born at a time when I believe they probably

would have

> divorced had there not been a 4th child.

>

> When my youngest brother was 2 he drank turpentine from a mason

jar and

> nearly died; was hospitalized for weeks with kidney and liver

failure and

> pneumonia. I was blamed for his 'accidental poisoning' as I had

an oil paint set. Our

> mother accused me of leaving turpentine where he could reach it.

However, as

> I was always berated about the smell when I was painting, my jar

of

> turpentine was always closed unless I was actually sitting at my

desk painting; and my

> turpentine would have been used/cloudy. I distinctly, chillingly,

remember

> through her screaming at me as she held up that the jar of clear,

clean/new

> turpentine as proof - my tiny brother lay choking and gasping on

the floor. This

> happened on a Saturday morning; my brother was taken to a

doctor/hospitolized

> when my father came home that evening.

>

> I'm so glad you are here, we are all starting from the same

place. I hope

> you will keep posting. Carol

>

>

>

>

> Had a mother who was maybe BP. She was manipulative, cunning,

very

> bright, very charming to folks outside of the family. I was born

> last of 4 children, 10 years after the one before me. I am almost

> certain that my mother tried to kill me at one point for a period

> when I was around 4 or 5 (with a yucky variety of poisoning...

over

> a period of time)and she had just divorced my dad and the other

kids

> were gone (one grown and moved out, 2 younger...both boys...went

to

> live with my dad) So I was alone with her ...

>

> I have now relationship with my siblings anymore. The fastest way

> to explain that is say if my mother was the witch in the Wizard of

> Oz, my brothers and my sister were her monkeys.

>

> My mother is now dead, she died at the age of 96...I am now

64...AND

> STILL TRYING to leave this all behind. Such grief.

>

> Your posts reveal a lot of knowledge on the subject of BPD. So I

> guess my request is this: from what you know , and what I've

said,

> does this exceed the parameters of BPD?

>

>

> She was never diagnosed with anything...everyone thought she was

> just great...once I was trying to explain to an old friend just a

> little of what she was like...he said " Look...I've met your

> mother...it's hard to believe these things about such a sweet old

> lady " Very typical response.

>

> I've been in therapy a lot in my time...but in my many attempts,

> didn't find a person that really could deal with BPD or whatever

> this was.

>

>

> Freda

>

>

>

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Hi Persevere;

Thank you. Thank you so much. Now I'm in tears.

No adults from that period. So alienated. My Dad also is dead. He

kept me alive I think.

But I remember. Accidents all the time. I noticed that especially

when my daughter was small...she almost never fell down. I did

constantly. I was always getting hit in the stomach at school and

having the breath knocked out of me. Horrible experience. And i

had asthma...only as a child. Almost died. Have a memory of a near

death experience. I remember a flouroscope or upper gi when I was a

kid...because I was always throwing up.

There was a doctor and a few years ago, I found her and called her.

She was in a nursing home. Amazing. I just said my name and asked

if she remembered me. She said yes. That's all. But it was

remarkable because the time that had passed at that point was

probably 50 years. !!! I never could find the medical records.

Tried but they're not there.

Is this too much? Sometimes I think I should write this up as a

horror story, but who would want to read it?

Well forgive me, it is just an amazing thing to find people who

understand. Such a cliche, but it's true.

Freda

-

-- In ModOasis , getevenpersevere@a... wrote:

> Hi Freda,

>

> I'm fairly new here too; 53 and grateful to have found this list.

My mother

> is 71, has all of my life been devastatingly cruel to her

children, even to my

> father. She is as you describe, typically BPD:

manipulative/cunning/bright,

> controlling, blaming, resentful, jealous, and charming to people

outside the

> family. I have been in and out of various therapies since my

early twenties.

>

> You will be believed here, and supported. Your story left me

trembling and

> in tears. I believe your suspicions about your mother's attempts

to kill you.

> Have you any living relatives who might recall (or be willing to

talk about)

> your having had frequent accidents/falls/accidental poisonings as

a small

> child?

>

> My youngest brother is 13 years my junior; 9 years between him and

the next

> child. I am the oldest. Both of my parents were quite cruel to

my brother,

> and neglectful; he was born at a time when I believe they probably

would have

> divorced had there not been a 4th child.

>

> When my youngest brother was 2 he drank turpentine from a mason

jar and

> nearly died; was hospitalized for weeks with kidney and liver

failure and

> pneumonia. I was blamed for his 'accidental poisoning' as I had

an oil paint set. Our

> mother accused me of leaving turpentine where he could reach it.

However, as

> I was always berated about the smell when I was painting, my jar

of

> turpentine was always closed unless I was actually sitting at my

desk painting; and my

> turpentine would have been used/cloudy. I distinctly, chillingly,

remember

> through her screaming at me as she held up that the jar of clear,

clean/new

> turpentine as proof - my tiny brother lay choking and gasping on

the floor. This

> happened on a Saturday morning; my brother was taken to a

doctor/hospitolized

> when my father came home that evening.

>

> I'm so glad you are here, we are all starting from the same

place. I hope

> you will keep posting. Carol

>

>

>

>

> Had a mother who was maybe BP. She was manipulative, cunning,

very

> bright, very charming to folks outside of the family. I was born

> last of 4 children, 10 years after the one before me. I am almost

> certain that my mother tried to kill me at one point for a period

> when I was around 4 or 5 (with a yucky variety of poisoning...

over

> a period of time)and she had just divorced my dad and the other

kids

> were gone (one grown and moved out, 2 younger...both boys...went

to

> live with my dad) So I was alone with her ...

>

> I have now relationship with my siblings anymore. The fastest way

> to explain that is say if my mother was the witch in the Wizard of

> Oz, my brothers and my sister were her monkeys.

>

> My mother is now dead, she died at the age of 96...I am now

64...AND

> STILL TRYING to leave this all behind. Such grief.

>

> Your posts reveal a lot of knowledge on the subject of BPD. So I

> guess my request is this: from what you know , and what I've

said,

> does this exceed the parameters of BPD?

>

>

> She was never diagnosed with anything...everyone thought she was

> just great...once I was trying to explain to an old friend just a

> little of what she was like...he said " Look...I've met your

> mother...it's hard to believe these things about such a sweet old

> lady " Very typical response.

>

> I've been in therapy a lot in my time...but in my many attempts,

> didn't find a person that really could deal with BPD or whatever

> this was.

>

>

> Freda

>

>

>

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Just that she

> remembered you sets off bells and sirens; there are so many

questions she could

> answer for you!

My theory is that she figured out what my mother was doing and told

her to quit it...in exchange, the doc expunged the records. That's

what I think.

Maybe I will try to reach the doctor again, but think she may have

passed on because it's a long long time ago.

>

> You cannot write, or exorcise 'too much' of these persistent

demons/the

> memories that defy logic. We (me) write our hearts out

here...pages and pages of

> stuffed pain getting out, denied for so many years. The blessing

of our

> finding one another via this list, I think, is that we all feel

the 'nods' of

> understanding and compassion for what we lived through; the first

time in my life I

> have not been called a liar/mentally ill/evil in how I feel toward

my mother.

>

> In writing, sharing, and reading others experiences so similar to

mine I feel

> 'validated'...now there's a cliche for you...weren't we all

seeking

> 'validation' even back in the 70s. lol

>

> Alienation is par for the course, I think. But recognizing

alienation for

> what it really is helps me sloth off a lot of the guilt/shame I

feel for even

> being alienated from my FOO, for not being a 'good daughter'. I

choose (or

> would choose if given a choice) alienation rather than remain

enmeshed with them.

> My self esteem is too fragile, my defenses too shaky - I can't

possibly have

> any sort of relationship with the people who refuse to be truthful

about what

> happened, refuse to believe what they already know, who ridicule

and admonish

> me for being hurt (my siblings are angry, resentful and generally

baffled by

> my refusal today to take the verbal abuse from our mother that

they take).

>

> For many years I wrestled with the feeling that it must surely be

ME who is

> defective/flawed/mentally ill...as my mother portrays me. But

Freda, I am just

> now beginning to understand what actually happened to me, why I

was the 'bad

> child'...I rejected my mother, and/or she rejected me at a very

early age. I

> don't ever remember a good experience with her, ever.

>

> You're right; kids don't have catastrophic injuries and illnesses,

in a

> caring home. Have you considered that your mother may have

attracted a great deal

> of attention for HERSELF with your 'illnesses'? Did your asthma

and vomiting

> disappear when you became old enough to know/remember/tell what

was going on?

Yes...it stopped all of it. The very last time she tried one of her

incredibly disgusting rituals with me, from somewhere came a

guardian angel who spoke through my mouth and said, " No. And if you

do that again, I'll tell someone. " She just sat there staring at

the wall. No reply. Never mentioned it again.

The asthma stopped (this is how I remember it) when I got angry.

Screamed at her... " you are a mean mommy "

>

> You didn't die, but very nearly. My brother didn't die either,

and my mother

> got to be a hero, and a 'good mother' for quite a long time when

these things

> happened to her children.

My god. I had to read your post several times to begin to get it.

Does your brother remember it? Do you think your mom arranged for

him to drink the stuff?

>

> Hugs, Carol

>

>Thank you Carol and hugs right back. Thank you everyone here.

Freda

>

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