OT: cost of raw pet food

[Guest guest]

Re: OT: cost of raw pet food

I finally made the leap and got my cats on raw pet food. The kitten went nuts

for it. The overweight adult male protested at first but learned to like it

pretty quickly.

I confess i took the easy route and bought some that is pre-cut into little

medallions. comes in a plastic bag for $10. They're eating a lot more than i

thought they would. this is costing too much money. I think the brand is called

Nature's Variety.

I " m not sure but i've been told i can buy some at the hfs in a big log. How do i

prepare for it my cats? Thaw it all, separate into little pieces, then freeze

again?

It's all so foreign to me still. I " m hoping my adult male cat will lose some

weight.

thanks, Elaine

====================

Elaine,

As someone who has been feeding my dogs raw for years, I have a fairly simple

approach.

First, I buy hormone-free, antibiotic-free organ meats (heart, kidney, liver)

from the local supermarket. Sometimes I can get grass-fed organ and other meats,

so I use that. I chunk all the meats and weigh it into single-day servings, then

freeze it to use as needed.

Each day, I grind veggies (broccoli, carrots, bok choy, fresh peas, zucchini,

etc.) in a food processor and then add the thawed raw meat to it, along with

SuperGreens powder, some Transfer Factor, and other supplements (sometimes

enzymes). I do lightly steam the carrots and broccoli to break down the

cellulose so the dogs can digest it more easily. And I lightly cook the kidneys

and liver, since they are very rich organ meats and the dogs don't like them and

cannot digest them unless they are somewhat cooked. But I keep the heart, and

the occasional beef and lamb that I feed them, raw.

A few times a week I add a free-range raw egg to the other food.

If I go away and someone is taking care of them, I pre-chop all the meats and

veggies together (lightly cooked if necessary) and then freeze them into

individual packets. In that case, it's a good idea to lightly steam the frozen

stuff so the dogs are not shocked with freezing cold stuff in their stomach.

The dogs love this food and do well on it.

As for cats: I have two friends who feed their cats raw -- a similar formula --

and those cats have the shiniest coats I ever saw! I am allergic to many cats.

However, I was able to pick up these animals without any ill effects. I suspect

that the allergic reactions many people have to cats is due to the excessive

amount of dander and junk that comes out of the cat's skin from the junky food

that the *cats* eat.

Regards,

Nenah

Nenah Sylver, PhD

http://www.nenahsylver.com

* The Handbook of Rife Frequency Healing

* The Holistic Handbook of Sauna Therapy

* products and services for wellness

[Guest guest]

> Re: OT: cost of raw pet food

>

>

>I " m not sure but i've been told i can buy some at the hfs in a big log. How

>do i prepare for it my cats? Thaw it all, separate into little pieces, then

>freeze again?

Elaine,

My dogs are cat-sized and this is what I do for them. I buy frozen ground

raw meat/organs/bone, thaw it, and divide into small ball jars, which I

re-freeze. You can get much better prices if you buy in bulk (just like NT

food!) from suppliers such as bravo (http://www.bravorawdiet.com/) or

mOrigins (http://www.morigins.com). I feed both of these. mOrigins is

range-fed (no grain, no hormones, no antibiotics) and Bravo offers several

grass-fed products. I order mOrigins from the main office in Cleveland, and

get bravo from a local distributor. Once you get used to feeding them raw,

it's really not hard at all.

Suze Fisher

Lapdog Design, Inc.

Web Design & Development

http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze3shjg

Weston A. Price Foundation Chapter Leader, Mid Coast Maine

http://www.westonaprice.org

----------------------------

" The diet-heart idea (the idea that saturated fats and cholesterol cause

heart disease) is the greatest scientific deception of our times. " --

Mann, MD, former Professor of Medicine and Biochemistry at Vanderbilt

University, Tennessee; heart disease researcher.

The International Network of Cholesterol Skeptics

<http://www.thincs.org>

----------------------------

[Guest guest]

Re: OT: cost of raw pet food

>Elaine,

>

>As someone who has been feeding my dogs raw for years, I have a

>fairly simple approach.

>

>First, I buy hormone-free, antibiotic-free organ meats (heart,

>kidney, liver) from the local supermarket. Sometimes I can get

>grass-fed organ and other meats, so I use that. I chunk all the

>meats and weigh it into single-day servings, then freeze it to use

>as needed.

Nenah,

You don't feed any muscle meat regularly? I've never heard of this before.

Is there adequate protein in kidney and liver? just wondering if anything

might be missing if only organ meats are fed. I'm sure heart is probably be

adequate muscle tissue if fed regularly?

Suze Fisher

Lapdog Design, Inc.

Web Design & Development

http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze3shjg

Weston A. Price Foundation Chapter Leader, Mid Coast Maine

http://www.westonaprice.org

----------------------------

" The diet-heart idea (the idea that saturated fats and cholesterol cause

heart disease) is the greatest scientific deception of our times. " --

Mann, MD, former Professor of Medicine and Biochemistry at Vanderbilt

University, Tennessee; heart disease researcher.

The International Network of Cholesterol Skeptics

<http://www.thincs.org>

----------------------------

[Guest guest]

RE: OT: cost of raw pet food

Nenah,

You don't feed any muscle meat regularly? I've never heard of this before.

Is there adequate protein in kidney and liver? just wondering if anything

might be missing if only organ meats are fed. I'm sure heart is probably be

adequate muscle tissue if fed regularly?

Suze Fisher

===========

Thanks for asking. Heart is the muscle meat of choice. Sometimes they get

leftover chicken, sometimes lamb scraps...and sometimes hamburger meat.

I've been wondering about the protein issue, though, from another angle:

they are older dogs. This summer Tali will be 15, and Zumi will be 13. I

know that older dogs (and humans) need less protein as they get older. Tali

weighs 23 pounds and Zumi weighs 13-1/2 pounds. How much protein do you

suggest for each?

Nenah

[Guest guest]

> My dogs are cat-sized and this is what I do for them. I buy frozen ground

> raw meat/organs/bone, thaw it, and divide into small ball jars, which I

> re-freeze. You can get much better prices if you buy in bulk (just like NT

> food!) from suppliers such as bravo (http://www.bravorawdiet.com/) or

> mOrigins (http://www.morigins.com). I feed both of these. mOrigins is

> range-fed (no grain, no hormones, no antibiotics) and Bravo offers several

> grass-fed products. I order mOrigins from the main office in Cleveland, and

> get bravo from a local distributor. Once you get used to feeding them raw,

> it's really not hard at all.

thanks suze, i was hoping it would be this easy but according to a quick

search on the internet, it is crucial to get the ratios of muscle meats and

organ meats as well as bone meal and some other vitamins perfect, otherwise

my cats could sick. It all looked a lot more complicated than i had

anticipated. I thought i just needed the meats and bone meal, but it looks

like i have to put in a lot of other supplements. Another thing to add to my

long list of food experiments...

Elaine

[Guest guest]

> Re: OT: cost of raw pet food

>

>

>

>> My dogs are cat-sized and this is what I do for them. I buy frozen ground

>> raw meat/organs/bone, thaw it, and divide into small ball jars, which I

>> re-freeze. You can get much better prices if you buy in bulk

>(just like NT

>> food!) from suppliers such as bravo (http://www.bravorawdiet.com/) or

>> mOrigins (http://www.morigins.com). I feed both of these. mOrigins is

>> range-fed (no grain, no hormones, no antibiotics) and Bravo

>offers several

>> grass-fed products. I order mOrigins from the main office in

>Cleveland, and

>> get bravo from a local distributor. Once you get used to feeding

>them raw,

>> it's really not hard at all.

>

>thanks suze, i was hoping it would be this easy but according to a quick

>search on the internet, it is crucial to get the ratios of muscle meats and

>organ meats as well as bone meal and some other vitamins perfect, otherwise

>my cats could sick.

Weeeellllll....I'm not so sure they have to be " perfect " , but then cats are

a bit trickier than dogs. These ratios do not have to be perfect for dogs,

in fact, no one knows what the " perfect " ratios are for dogs to begin with,

and I doubt they do for cats either. Although some websites will try to

scare newbies into thinking so. Having said that, you can buy a raw food mix

that is specifically made with cats in mind (or is used by other cat owners

with success) so you won't have to worry about the ratios. I don't have cats

so I don't know if such a thing exists, but there are cat lists out there

where you could get some ideas.

It all looked a lot more complicated than i had

>anticipated. I thought i just needed the meats and bone meal, but it looks

>like i have to put in a lot of other supplements. Another thing to

>add to my

>long list of food experiments...

>Elaine

Well, certainly meat and bone meal would be inadequate. Remember to always

think *whole prey* (for *us* as well as for them!). That's really the trick.

So you would have to include organ meats. From what I understand cats

require dietary taurine, and I think it degrades with freezing (but am not

sure) so that might be something that should be supplemented. But, I dunno,

I think one base raw food like mOrigins (yes, cats are fed this too) and

some additional stuff here and there (liver, fish, etc) and a few

supplements, would be EONS better than any commercial kibble or canned food.

Suze Fisher

Lapdog Design, Inc.

Web Design & Development

http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze3shjg

Weston A. Price Foundation Chapter Leader, Mid Coast Maine

http://www.westonaprice.org

----------------------------

" The diet-heart idea (the idea that saturated fats and cholesterol cause

heart disease) is the greatest scientific deception of our times. " --

Mann, MD, former Professor of Medicine and Biochemistry at Vanderbilt

University, Tennessee; heart disease researcher.

The International Network of Cholesterol Skeptics

<http://www.thincs.org>

----------------------------

[Guest guest]

Feeding a cat a raw diet does not have to be difficult, time-consuming, or

costly. Nor does it require supplements which are more apt to burden the

liver and create imbalances in the body. Try the rawpaws group at .

It's a great list for feeding and also for medical problems, behavior

problems, etc. Plus, the people are very friendly and supportive.

My Hugo is a handsome, healthy tabby with a lovely coat. He lives mostly on

chunks of beef heart (a muscle and organ meat which is less than $1 a pound

around here), as well as some bone (turkey neck) and occasional treats such

as egg yolk or liver.

http://www.taichi4seniors.com

[Guest guest]

> Feeding a cat a raw diet does not have to be difficult, time-

consuming, or

> costly. Nor does it require supplements which are more apt to

burden the

> liver and create imbalances in the body. Try the rawpaws group at

.

> It's a great list for feeding and also for medical problems,

behavior

> problems, etc. Plus, the people are very friendly and supportive.

>

> My Hugo is a handsome, healthy tabby with a lovely coat. He lives

mostly on

> chunks of beef heart (a muscle and organ meat which is less than $1

a pound

> around here), as well as some bone (turkey neck) and occasional

treats such

> as egg yolk or liver.

Hi, we have 3 cats and only one of them LOVES the raw grass fed

ground beef i buy...and so that takes care of him. the other male

will eat the beef from time to time but likes his canned moist food

too. and the female...well...she only seems to like cooked chicken.

which i give her on an irregular basis.

sometimes the cats will eat the raw cream i put down for them,

sometimes not. sometimes i mix the raw cream with an egg yolk and

they'll eat that, sometimes not and it just sits there and i end up

throwing it away.

my girl kittie who loves cooked chicken also loves to lick raw

butter. and sometimes cod liver oil if i put it on my hand for her

to lick. but she won't lick it from a plate. shpoiled kitty.

if anyone has any advice for me i'd love to hear it.

laura in nj

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

Re: beef, a lot of cats don't like beef muscle meat at all, or they like it

but can't handle it and then puke it up. It seems, though, that beef heart

may be a different story. From what I've read over the years on the rawpaws

list, beef heart is very much liked and well tolerated by cats. It is

Hugo's favorite, unless I have some trimmings from my own pastured bison

heart to give him, in which case he snubs the beef. <g>

Having said that, it is true that different cats have very different and

decided tastes (Hugo won't go near chicken), and the whole question of

feeding becomes less easy when you have more than one.

You didn't mention any bone in your post, so I'd just like to say here that

if you don't feed bone, some powdered egg shell will supply calcium, but the

bones (like chunks of meat) are better because the gnawing your cat does

keeps his teeth clean. You should never have to brush a cat's teeth or

bring him to a vet for dental work.

http://www.taichi4seniors.com

[Guest guest]

> Hi ,

>

> Re: beef, a lot of cats don't like beef muscle meat at all, or they

like it

> but can't handle it and then puke it up.

claire, this one cat that just loves the beef? he's an odd one and

acts more like a puppy than a kitten in many ways (our cat sitter

told me that too even tho i never said that to her!!) and so it

appears this is just another way!!

i know it's too bizarre to say that my cat has some dog genes; that

can't happen.

It seems, though, that beef heart

> may be a different story. From what I've read over the years on

the rawpaws

> list, beef heart is very much liked and well tolerated by cats.

i'll try the beef heart; i'll order some. should i chop it up and

give it to him raw?

Having said that, it is true that different cats have very different

and

> decided tastes

you can say THAT again.

and the whole question of

> feeding becomes less easy when you have more than one.

I'll say.

> You didn't mention any bone in your post,

i never heard of feeding bone to cats...

so I'd just like to say here that

> if you don't feed bone, some powdered egg shell will supply

calcium, but the

> bones (like chunks of meat) are better because the gnawing your cat

does

> keeps his teeth clean. You should never have to brush a cat's

teeth or

> bring him to a vet for dental work.

very interesting, claire; i never heard of cats gnawing bones like

dogs do.

what kind of bone should i get them started on? i never have beef

bones in the house as i used ground beef 99% of the time i make

beef. but i'll get some for the cats. i just want healthy cats.

i've seen too many have to be put down in old age from cancer, etc.

claire, thanks so much.

laura in nj

[Guest guest]

,

<i'll try the beef heart; i'll order some. should i chop it up and

give it to him raw?

Definitely raw for all meat for cats! Some cats need a slow introduction to

new foods, so maybe a few very small pieces along with other food is the

best way to start. If they like it, try to graduate then to larger chunks,

again, for the sake of their teeth. My Stater Bros. supermarket usually has

beef heart in strips, but I order 9 pounds at a time and ask them the cut it

up into chunks, stew style. At home, I often have to cut (kitchen shears)

some of the larger chunks. I freeze the stuff in glass jars and defrost as

needed.

<i never heard of feeding bone to cats...

Bone is a big part of what they eat in the wild and they need it for

calcium, and to clean their teeth. The bone MUST be raw--which means it is

spongy and relatively soft for chewing. Cooked bone is hard and will

splinter and be dangerous for them to eat. Small bones are best (think mice

<g>. But if they like chicken, they will be able to eat the neck bones

easily.

<very interesting, claire; i never heard of cats gnawing bones like

dogs do.

Some will tear the meat from a large knuckle bone (not Hugo), but most just

break down (shearing with their teeth) the small bones and swallow them.

Their stomachs have the hydrochloric acid to manage bones very well.

http://www.taichi4seniors.com

[Guest guest]

OK, you're making it sound a lot easier. Yes, those sites are scaring me. My

cats are not show cats, just mutts. I was looking for rawpaws and forgot it

was a group. I hope there will be recipes there.

Do you mind telling me how much heart and liver your cat goes through in a

month? I have to order some from my local pasture farmer. It's a few dollars

a pound sadly. Also, do you grind the bone?

Elaine

> From: " West " <clairewest@...>

> Reply-

> Date: Mon, 23 May 2005 08:25:36 -0700

> < >

> Subject: Re: OT: cost of raw pet food

>

> Feeding a cat a raw diet does not have to be difficult, time-consuming, or

> costly. Nor does it require supplements which are more apt to burden the

> liver and create imbalances in the body. Try the rawpaws group at .

> It's a great list for feeding and also for medical problems, behavior

> problems, etc. Plus, the people are very friendly and supportive.

>

> My Hugo is a handsome, healthy tabby with a lovely coat. He lives mostly on

> chunks of beef heart (a muscle and organ meat which is less than $1 a pound

> around here), as well as some bone (turkey neck) and occasional treats such

> as egg yolk or liver.

>

>

> http://www.taichi4seniors.com

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

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[Guest guest]

I just looked at the mOrigins site. I noticed they add thiamine, niacine,

riboflavin, etc. Isn't this what they add to enrich white flour? My ND is

vehemently opposed to these supplements -- says they are toxic to our

bodies. He's done all sorts of reading on it. Don't know if they are the

same though. Does mOrigins use naturally whole food supplements, or are they

synthetic (as i'm assuming they are in white flour)? I couldn't find info on

their site.

Elaine

>>> food!) from suppliers such as bravo (http://www.bravorawdiet.com/) or

>>> mOrigins (http://www.morigins.com). I feed both of these. mOrigins is

>>> range-fed (no grain, no hormones, no antibiotics) and Bravo

>> offers several

>>> grass-fed products. I order mOrigins from the main office in

>> Cleveland, and

>>> get bravo from a local distributor. Once you get used to feeding

>> them raw,

>>> it's really not hard at all.

[Guest guest]

Elaine,

<I was looking for rawpaws and forgot it

was a group. I hope there will be recipes there.

They have a " quick start " recipe that folks seem to like, especially to get

started. But I've never wanted to spend all that time grinding and mixing.

I trust my cat to know what's good for him (as long as he's not offered

addicting commerical food) in the amounts that he needs it--so I mostly

offer one thing at a time, in chunks. (Hiding things in a mix may mean he

winds up eating foods that he would otherwise know enough to reject. Ditto

unnecessary and harmful supplements.) I do give him a teaspoon of cooked

zucchini with bonito flakes daily because they do need some vegetation and I

also carry in a handful of lawn grass now and then. The zucchini is also

prepared in advanced, in a big quantity, and kept in the freezer, in small

glass jars.

<Do you mind telling me how much heart and liver your cat goes through in a

month? I have to order some from my local pasture farmer. It's a few dollars

a pound sadly. Also, do you grind the bone?

Hugo is a little over two years old and weighs about 12 lbs. He goes

through the nine pounds about every month or so. The liver is once a month

or so, chicken liver, which I get fresh when I pick up my beef heart and

it's about a pound, though spread over several meals.

I don't grind anything. Esp. the bone, which is good for cleaning his

teeth. Cats don't have molars, so once they use their teeth to shear (which

cleans the teeth) and then they swallow in chunks. Their high stomach acid

deals easily with the chunks of meat or bone.

[Guest guest]

Thank you for your great info . I will probably start with a recipe

and graduate to a more intuitive feeding style as you are doing (it sounds

easier!). One last question, my cats are indoor/outdoor and seem to eat

plenty of grasses as well as some cat mint. Do you think i still need to

feed them veggies? I wonder if they wouldn't normally get veggies in their

diet by eating the contents of stomachs in wild animals. Which makes me

wonder if i shouldn't be giving them fermented veggies then!

Elaine

> They have a " quick start " recipe that folks seem to like, especially to get

> started. But I've never wanted to spend all that time grinding and mixing.

> I trust my cat to know what's good for him (as long as he's not offered

> addicting commerical food) in the amounts that he needs it--so I mostly

> offer one thing at a time, in chunks. (Hiding things in a mix may mean he

> winds up eating foods that he would otherwise know enough to reject. Ditto

> unnecessary and harmful supplements.) I do give him a teaspoon of cooked

> zucchini with bonito flakes daily because they do need some vegetation and I

> also carry in a handful of lawn grass now and then. The zucchini is also

> prepared in advanced, in a big quantity, and kept in the freezer, in small

> glass jars.

>

> <Do you mind telling me how much heart and liver your cat goes through in a

> month? I have to order some from my local pasture farmer. It's a few dollars

> a pound sadly. Also, do you grind the bone?

>

> Hugo is a little over two years old and weighs about 12 lbs. He goes

> through the nine pounds about every month or so. The liver is once a month

> or so, chicken liver, which I get fresh when I pick up my beef heart and

> it's about a pound, though spread over several meals.

>

> I don't grind anything. Esp. the bone, which is good for cleaning his

> teeth. Cats don't have molars, so once they use their teeth to shear (which

> cleans the teeth) and then they swallow in chunks. Their high stomach acid

> deals easily with the chunks of meat or bone.

>

>

>

>

>

>

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> <UL>

> <LI><B><A HREF= " / " >NATIVE

> NUTRITION</A></B> online</LI>

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> HREF= " mailto: -owner " >LIST OWNER:</A></B>

> Idol

> <B>MODERATORS:</B> Heidi Schuppenhauer

> Wanita Sears

> </FONT></PRE>

> </BODY>

> </HTML>

>

[Guest guest]

<Elaine,

One last question, my cats are indoor/outdoor and seem to eat

plenty of grasses as well as some cat mint. Do you think i still need to

feed them veggies? I wonder if they wouldn't normally get veggies in their

diet by eating the contents of stomachs in wild animals. Which makes me

wonder if i shouldn't be giving them fermented veggies then!

If you have fermented veggies, definitely try those and see if your cats eat

them. You're right in thinking that they would more closely mimic the

stomach contents. But if your cats aren't interested, then I would assume

they are eating enough prey with stomach contents and don't need anything

further.

I give the zucchini because it's a squash (but easier to cook up than the

hard winter varieties)and any form of squash seems to facilitate

elimination. Most cats on raw go every second day (with smaller, darker

stools that don't smell much) but Hugo was going every three or four days

and because his stools looked so hard, I felt I should be helping him out

with the squash--as well as the lawn grass I carry into the house.

Another thing to alert you to is that raw fed cats drink little or no water.

Hugo drinks none at all--probably because the beef heart is so filled with

blood. (Water is needed of course to help kibble-fed cats deal with their

dry food.)

http://www.taichi4seniors.com

[Guest guest]

Whoops. It just hit me that most the fermentation I see on this list seems

to depend on salt--and that would, I think, be a big no-no for cats.

But that's something you can ask about on Raw Paws. The list owner, Marnie,

is a treasure-trove of info (actually on many different species of animals

and birds) and there are others as well who know exactly which things we eat

(garlic, for instance) that are poisonous for our pets.

http://www.taichi4seniors.com

[Guest guest]

>> Most cats on raw go every second day <<

Hmmmm, I've been feeding cats raw for over 19 years now and have never

observed this. My cats have all always gone daily.

Christie

Caber Feidh ish Deerhounds

Holistically Raising Our Dogs Since 1986

http://www.caberfeidh.com

http://doggedblog.com

[Guest guest]

Christie,

<Hmmmm, I've been feeding cats raw for over 19 years now and have never

observed this. My cats have all always gone daily.

>

I was reporting what seemed to be the average from posts on rawpaws, but I

could be wrong.

I wonder, would you be able to estimate the amount of fat your cats get a

day? Lately I've been wondering if that could be a factor in the softness

and frequency of a cat's stools.

http://www.taichi4seniors.com

[Guest guest]

>> I wonder, would you be able to estimate the amount of fat your cats get a

day? Lately I've been wondering if that could be a factor in the softness

and frequency of a cat's stools. <<

In the range of 30-35 percent.

Christie

Caber Feidh ish Deerhounds

Holistically Raising Our Dogs Since 1986

http://www.caberfeidh.com

http://doggedblog.com

[Guest guest]

All animals, including humans need some fat in their diet. But, an over

abundance can be detrimental if not balanced with other foods that break down

the fats.

I would think one would have to look at each individual animal and evaluate what

they are eating, how much and where the adjustment needs to be made.

K.C.

Re: OT: cost of raw pet food

Christie,

<Hmmmm, I've been feeding cats raw for over 19 years now and have never

observed this. My cats have all always gone daily.

>

I was reporting what seemed to be the average from posts on rawpaws, but I

could be wrong.

I wonder, would you be able to estimate the amount of fat your cats get a

day? Lately I've been wondering if that could be a factor in the softness

and frequency of a cat's stools.

http://www.taichi4seniors.com

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" http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/DTD/xhtml1-transitional.dtd " ><BODY><FONT

FACE= " monospace " SIZE= " 3 " >

<B>IMPORTANT ADDRESSES</B>

<UL>

<LI><B><A

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[Guest guest]

> Re: OT: cost of raw pet food

>

>

>I just looked at the mOrigins site. I noticed they add thiamine, niacine,

>riboflavin, etc. Isn't this what they add to enrich white flour?

Those are B vitamins. I think they do add them to white flour since these

vitamins are stripped from the flour when it's processed.

My ND is

>vehemently opposed to these supplements -- says they are toxic to our

>bodies. He's done all sorts of reading on it. Don't know if they are the

>same though. Does mOrigins use naturally whole food supplements,

>or are they

>synthetic (as i'm assuming they are in white flour)? I couldn't

>find info on

>their site.

>Elaine

I dunno, but as far as I understand it they would be molecularly identical

regardless of the source (synthetic or natural).

Having said that, I always special order mOrigins without any

vitamins/minerals added. So it's just the meat/organ/bone mix. I believe

there's a 50 lb. minimum, although it could be 25. If you want to try your

cats on it, I imagine Laurie (the proprietor) might send a sample.

Suze Fisher

Lapdog Design, Inc.

Web Design & Development

http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze3shjg

Weston A. Price Foundation Chapter Leader, Mid Coast Maine

http://www.westonaprice.org

----------------------------

" The diet-heart idea (the idea that saturated fats and cholesterol cause

heart disease) is the greatest scientific deception of our times. " --

Mann, MD, former Professor of Medicine and Biochemistry at Vanderbilt

University, Tennessee; heart disease researcher.

The International Network of Cholesterol Skeptics

<http://www.thincs.org>

----------------------------

[Guest guest]

Hi Elaine,

This is a great site you should find very helpful -

http://www.catfood.catnutrition.org/

Jo

Message: 6

Date: Mon, 23 May 2005 11:53:55 -0700

From: Elaine <itchyink@...>

Subject: Re: OT: cost of raw pet food

OK, you're making it sound a lot easier. Yes, those sites are scaring

me. My cats are not show cats, just mutts. I was looking for rawpaws and

forgot it was a group. I hope there will be recipes there.

Do you mind telling me how much heart and liver your cat goes through in

a month? I have to order some from my local pasture farmer. It's a few

dollars a pound sadly. Also, do you grind the bone?

Elaine

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[Guest guest]

Thanks Jo, that is actually the site that freaked me out a little. But i'm

getting more used to the concept and will just take it one step at a time. I

don't think my cats will die if something is missing temporarily while i

figure it out.

I bought several pounds of raw food from my hfs. They basically take a whole

chicken and grind it, bones and all. One book says i need to add cod liver

oil, fish oil and vitamin C to this. How the heck do i add vitamin C? Kelp

too. Just need to figure out ratios. Wondering if i need to add a taurine

supplement. The good news is they made the transition pretty easily and

quite like the raw food.

Elaine

> This is a great site you should find very helpful -

> http://www.catfood.catnutrition.org/

[Guest guest]

One of my favorite sites on the subject:

http://www.catinfo.org/

Take care,

Alice - HSing mom to Alice (DS) born Thanksgiving Day 1995 :-)

Hopewell Junction, NY

http://users.bestweb.net/~castella