Re: Speaking of blood sugar...

[Guest guest]

> I've been searching mercola's site and the article's not there

anymore

> (( I emailed mercola.com and they gave me a brush-off. (btw it

was

> NOT this article " Insulin and Its Metabolic Effects " - it was very

> scientific but graphic in its description of what actually happens

to

> the body when the sugar remains in the bloodstream because it isn't

> taken up by the cells.) I can't believe it's not there anymore.

This article on Mercola.com:

" Learn Why High Insulin is the Largest Physical Factor for Most

Diseases "

<http://www.mercola.com/2003/oct/22/high_insulin.htm>

has a link to a much longer scientific article entitled:

" Hyperinsulinemic diseases of civilization: more than just Syndrome

X " :

<http://thepaleodiet.com/articles/Hyperinsulinemic%

20Diseases%20Final.pdf>

(You can click on the link named " 18-page study (PDF) " in the Mercola

article too.) Maybe that link is what you're looking for?

This Mercola article is good too (easier to read), but probably not

the one you're looking for:

http://www.mercola.com/article/carbohydrates/lower_your_grains.htm

Hope you find it!

Jan

[Guest guest]

I haven't been following this thread so I'm not such which Mercola report

seems to be missing, but here is what I think was Mercola's first

publication on the subject in 2001, in four parts, of which he said: " This

article is essentially a transcription of a lecture given by Dr. Rosedale at

BoulderFest back in 1999 "

http://www.mercola.com/2001/jul/14/insulin.htm# " Insulin and Its

Metabolic Effects "

http://www.taichi4seniors.com

[Guest guest]

Jan, thank you for the links. They do contain a lot of good info and

I'll print them out and highlight stuff for my hubbie.

However none of those is the article I remember, directly making the

connection between hyperinsulemia and heart disease. And there is

inconsistency / mixed messages throughout mercola.com on sat fat good

or bad. (That wouldn't matter much for me -- I know what I think --

but my SO doesn't spend hours synthesizing nutritional info like we do

here.)

Does anyone have his book, Dr. Mercola's Total Health Program? How do

you like it?

>

> This article on Mercola.com:

> " Learn Why High Insulin is the Largest Physical Factor for Most

> Diseases "

> <http://www.mercola.com/2003/oct/22/high_insulin.htm>

>

> has a link to a much longer scientific article entitled:

> " Hyperinsulinemic diseases of civilization: more than just Syndrome

> X " :

> <http://thepaleodiet.com/articles/Hyperinsulinemic%

> 20Diseases%20Final.pdf>

>

> (You can click on the link named " 18-page study (PDF) " in the Mercola

> article too.) Maybe that link is what you're looking for?

>

> This Mercola article is good too (easier to read), but probably not

> the one you're looking for:

> http://www.mercola.com/article/carbohydrates/lower_your_grains.htm

>

> Hope you find it!

> Jan

[Guest guest]

Hi,

i have the book...he hypes it as the best book ever written but to me

it's just like all the other health/nutrition books, good information

but with the author's own spin.

they're all the same...except NT, LOL.

i'd said you can have it for half price...if i can find it. i don't

know where it is. we moved in sept. and i can't remember if i ordered

it before or after; i think before. it should be with my other books.

but if i look today, maybe i'll find it, and if you're serious, i'll

send it to you and you can send me a check for half of what he's

selling it for and that should more than cover shipping.

laura

--- In , " daphneb10 " <biophile410@y...>

wrote:

> Jan, thank you for the links. They do contain a lot of good info and

> I'll print them out and highlight stuff for my hubbie.

>

> However none of those is the article I remember, directly making the

> connection between hyperinsulemia and heart disease. And there is

> inconsistency / mixed messages throughout mercola.com on sat fat good

> or bad. (That wouldn't matter much for me -- I know what I think --

> but my SO doesn't spend hours synthesizing nutritional info like we do

> here.)

>

> Does anyone have his book, Dr. Mercola's Total Health Program? How do

> you like it?

[Guest guest]

, thank you for the offer but I just got the book from amazon

for $13 with free shipping (vs. around $20 on the mercola site!).

Along with the mercola book i got dangerous grains; three schwarzbein

books (i found that tom cowan recommends schwarzbein in an article on

the wapf site!); eat fat lose fat by sally f. and mary e.; and the

whole soy story by kaayla daniel (that one's for my friend whose 2-yo

gets soy milk).

i already have life without bread. i don't have the atkins books

though and would like to actually read them at some point... but i've

got enough for now.

there will be things in the books i don't agree with... like

schwarzbein, i believe, recommends soy protein bars. my approach to

nutritional information: filter, filter, filter and synthesize!

one thing i really like -- from the reviews on the schwarzbein books

-- is she's not a huge fan of cardiovascular training but emphasizes

weight training and flexiblity/relaxation. that's huge b/c my hubbie

was on track team in hs -- and sometimes talks about taking up running

again. he's 40 and has a congenital heart problem (svt, and the

heart's also in the wrong placement) and running worries me. strength

and flexibility are the way to go for many people.

so what i'm creating is a personal library to address

heart/weight/insulin/metabolic syndrome. i will also print/highlight

relevant mercola articles and put them in a looseleaf binder.

and i cook appropriately for him as much as i can. (tricky b/c my

needs are different from his -- i need more carbs -- as does our

little boy)

and i will have to insinuate that if he doesn't maintain healthy

eating habits he'll need to increase the life insurance policy. grim,

but realistic. the good news is he is already very open to low carb,

theoretically. the bad news is he periodically goes on 'atkins' for a

week or two, then binges on carbs most of the time. and as i

mentioned, i can totally hear the difference in his heartbeat. it

thumps and is irregular when he's on high carb.

> Hi,

>

> i have the book...he hypes it as the best book ever written but to me

> it's just like all the other health/nutrition books, good information

> but with the author's own spin.

>

> they're all the same...except NT, LOL.

>

> i'd said you can have it for half price...if i can find it. i don't

> know where it is. we moved in sept. and i can't remember if i ordered

> it before or after; i think before. it should be with my other books.

>

[Guest guest]

Regarding Atkins....I would be careful...

www.atkinsexposed.org has some good information. My mom put my dad on atkins for

a while and he did lose some wait, but he couldn't stay on the diet and gained

it all back anyway. I'm not sure if losing weight that way is worth the health

risks.

Running is good exercise, but it can kill you. There was this running guru,

forget his name right now, who went out running one day and died of a heart

attack. This was about a decade ago or more and he was 50 at the time. Then

again I know several 70+ people who run 5 miles every other day.

Re: Speaking of blood sugar...

, thank you for the offer but I just got the book from amazon

for $13 with free shipping (vs. around $20 on the mercola site!).

Along with the mercola book i got dangerous grains; three schwarzbein

books (i found that tom cowan recommends schwarzbein in an article on

the wapf site!); eat fat lose fat by sally f. and mary e.; and the

whole soy story by kaayla daniel (that one's for my friend whose 2-yo

gets soy milk).

i already have life without bread. i don't have the atkins books

though and would like to actually read them at some point... but i've

got enough for now.

there will be things in the books i don't agree with... like

schwarzbein, i believe, recommends soy protein bars. my approach to

nutritional information: filter, filter, filter and synthesize!

one thing i really like -- from the reviews on the schwarzbein books

-- is she's not a huge fan of cardiovascular training but emphasizes

weight training and flexiblity/relaxation. that's huge b/c my hubbie

was on track team in hs -- and sometimes talks about taking up running

again. he's 40 and has a congenital heart problem (svt, and the

heart's also in the wrong placement) and running worries me. strength

and flexibility are the way to go for many people.

so what i'm creating is a personal library to address

heart/weight/insulin/metabolic syndrome. i will also print/highlight

relevant mercola articles and put them in a looseleaf binder.

and i cook appropriately for him as much as i can. (tricky b/c my

needs are different from his -- i need more carbs -- as does our

little boy)

and i will have to insinuate that if he doesn't maintain healthy

eating habits he'll need to increase the life insurance policy. grim,

but realistic. the good news is he is already very open to low carb,

theoretically. the bad news is he periodically goes on 'atkins' for a

week or two, then binges on carbs most of the time. and as i

mentioned, i can totally hear the difference in his heartbeat. it

thumps and is irregular when he's on high carb.

> Hi,

>

> i have the book...he hypes it as the best book ever written but to me

> it's just like all the other health/nutrition books, good information

> but with the author's own spin.

>

> they're all the same...except NT, LOL.

>

> i'd said you can have it for half price...if i can find it. i don't

> know where it is. we moved in sept. and i can't remember if i ordered

> it before or after; i think before. it should be with my other books.

>

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[Guest guest]

>> Regarding Atkins....I would be careful...

www.atkinsexposed.org has some good information. My mom put my dad on atkins

for a while and he did lose some wait, but he couldn't stay on the diet and

gained it all back anyway. I'm not sure if losing weight that way is worth

the health risks. <<

I am so frigging sick of this half-assed " debunking Atkins " crap. I really

am. And in case you're wondering why, it's because it set me free from a

lifetime of obesity and eating disorders, and enabled me to painlessly and

happily lose 127 pounds in the last two years.

Are you actually saying ATKINS failed because the guy didn't stay on the

diet and regained his weight? Grow up. Yes, if a person can't comply with a

diet that diet has failed them, but that doesn't mean the DIET is a failure,

only that it either was not right for that individual or because they were

not compliant, for reasons that may be emotional or physical or both.

Or maybe he was on " Fake Atkins " .... you know the one where you can eat all

the steak, eggs, and bacon you can cram down your gullet and still lose

weight?

Here is my commentary on " Fake Atkins " :

http://www.doggedblog.com/doggedblog/2005/05/fake_atkins.html

Since I am starting to feel like I'm blogwhoring, I'll just post an excerpt

here:

The imaginary Atkins plan is where all that bacon and eggs and steak comes

in. It's the one where there's no limit on how much you can eat, as long as

you don't eat bread or pasta, and you don't even have to exercise or eat any

vegetables or fruit at all. And that's the plan that our good friends, the

Watchdogs of Health, get their knickers in a twist about so often.

It's actually kind of funny, in a strange and sick way, to watch their heads

spin around and around debunking things that Dr. Atkins never said, but it's

also pretty sad, because there are people like me who might be helped by

Atkins, who read these diatribes and think they contain an accurate

description of the plan.

There are hundreds, maybe thousands, of sites like this one, posted recently

to a list I'm on. They're all hyperventilating little exercises in debunkery

(competing for Google space, it must be admitted, with the breathless

testimonials of people like me who think Atkins is the greatest thing since,

well, sliced bread). This site is not the worst I've seen, but it's pretty

representative of the piss-poor quality of the critique most of these sites

specialize in.

That's primarily because they can't be bothered to read Dr. Atkins' book or

talk to people who've actually done the plan as it was written. They reserve

their outrage for second hand sources and media rehashes of what Dr. Atkins

supposedly wrote.

I really do have to go now, but if you think I'm mad, I am. I do think there

are things to critique in Dr. Atkins plan as it was written, but 99 percent

of the critiques I read are just unmitigated crap. Including this site you

have linked to.

Christie

Caber Feidh ish Deerhounds

Holistically Raising Our Dogs Since 1986

http://www.caberfeidh.com

http://doggedblog.com

[Guest guest]

Christie...forgive but...i've been on atkins and i thought the atkins

plan WAS eating all the steak, eggs and bacon you wanted!! (i'm

serious.)

did he change it?? am i remembering it wrong?

or do you mean you can eat that stuff, just at meals and a limited

amount?

because that's the impression i got when i read his last book

(limited amount and at meals only).

but wasn't it from the beginning, eat all the butter, steak, eggs and

bacon you wanted? that's how i remember it...and did he change it

later to limit it?

sorry if i'm remembering wrong, or if i did the plan wrong and that's

why i didn't lose the wt.

laura

>

> Or maybe he was on " Fake Atkins " .... you know the one where you can

eat all

> the steak, eggs, and bacon you can cram down your gullet and still

lose

> weight?

>

>

>

> The imaginary Atkins plan is where all that bacon and eggs and

steak comes

> in. It's the one where there's no limit on how much you can eat, as

long as

> you don't eat bread or pasta, and you don't even have to exercise

or eat any

> vegetables or fruit at all.

[Guest guest]

> sorry if i'm remembering wrong, or if i did the plan wrong and that's

> why i didn't lose the wt.

>

I don't know. I can only comment on his current book, which came out in

2002.

There are NO foods you eat in unlimited amounts. There are no " free foods "

on Atkins. You don't have to count calories at first, but you do have limits

on the amounts of certain things, and you add foods in a very controlled way

to determine if they cause you problems. Some people can't eat certain

foods, but because he has you add them in a certain order and in limited

amounts, you can easily find out what those foods are and eliminate them.

I don't think older versions of the book actually said you can eat all you

want of anything, but if they did, that's not what the plan says now. Dr.

Atkins is quite clear that we have to learn what it feels like to be

satisfied but not stuffed, and not eat more than that. He also says that if

you don't lose weight without counting calories, one of the things he has us

do is look at our caloric intake. He suggests we start at 10-12 times our

body weight in calories, and work adjust from there. That has always been

the exactly correct range for me to lose weight, and as I do lose, I just

adjust downward to match my new, lower weight.

If Atkins isn't the cure for what ails you, or you just don't like it, by

all means try something else. But if Atkins appeals to you and you think

maybe you just " did it wrong " in the past, why not use the current version

of the book and try it and see? What's the harm?

Or try the Warrior Diet if that appeals to you. It does not appeal to me,

because like someone else said earlier, I really like to eat in the morning.

Breakfast is my favorite meal of the day. I love to cook and prepare foods,

and the whole idea of the WD is the opposite of how I live. I'd much rather

eat a huge breakfast, moderate lunch, and almost nothing for dinner.

Someone... maybe Heidi or Chris... called it the Warrior Diet in reverse.

<G>

I think we should eat in a way that is natural for us and our lifestyle,

because if we use a way of eating that is alien to our natures, we won't

stick with it. But on the other hand, sometimes the very thing we are most

loathe to let go of is the very thing standing between us and health,

clarity, and success. For instance, if you REALLY love milk, it may be that

will be the one thing you can't tolerate. I myself really like cheese and

cream, and am very glad they don't seem to cause me problems, because I'd

hate like hell to do Atkins without dairy!

Also, you don't give up milk on Atkins. You just eliminate it in the early

stages, because a cup of full fat milk has 11 grams of carbs and that's just

too much for the induction and early OWL segments of the plan. But if you

have a fairly high carb level for weight loss, or when you get to or near

maintenance, there's no reason you can't consume milk as long as you count

the carbs and it doesn't cause you any problems.

I think you sometimes get into some pretty extreme black and white thinking,

and take all ideas out to a scary extreme. Like you can't imagine living

without milk, so you invent a world where, in order to be at a healthy

weight, you can never have milk again. I'm not saying you will or won't be

able to tolerate milk, I'm just saying... did you notice how your mind raced

there so fast? And when you were speculating on doing Atkins, you

immediately spun off to how you would one day go off it and regain all your

weight. It's like you just get way ahead of yourself. We used to call it

" future tripping. " I hate to sound like a self-help kook, but you might want

to try a bit of " one day at a time " here, and see if you can't release a bit

of the emotional charge on these issues.

Christie

Caber Feidh ish Deerhounds

Holistically Raising Our Dogs Since 1986

http://www.caberfeidh.com

http://doggedblog.com

[Guest guest]

> I think you sometimes get into some pretty extreme black and white

thinking,

> and take all ideas out to a scary extreme. Like you can't imagine

living

> without milk, so you invent a world where, in order to be at a

healthy

> weight, you can never have milk again. I'm not saying you will or

won't be

> able to tolerate milk, I'm just saying... did you notice how your

mind raced

> there so fast?

no, i didn't notice. i've always been called a person

of 'extremes'. and i was worse before i got off sugar (bipolar).

i've leveled out but i apparently not enough.

And when you were speculating on doing Atkins, you

> immediately spun off to how you would one day go off it and regain

all your

> weight.

christie that's because that's what i've ALWAYS done. i've probably

tried atkins 3 or 4 times in the last 30 years. i always gave up

after a few weeks, months cuz i couldn't stand it anymore. but not

just atkins...every eating plan i've ever tried. every single one.

It's like you just get way ahead of yourself. We used to call it

> " future tripping. " I hate to sound like a self-help kook, but you

might want

> to try a bit of " one day at a time " here, and see if you can't

release a bit

> of the emotional charge on these issues.

i don't know. i'm worn down at this point. totally discouraged. i

almost wish i'd never found this list. this is not a result of what

you've said here christie; i was feeling this way before i just read

this post by you. it's been cumulative the last few days. my head

is spinning.

i'm just more confused than ever as to how to eat.

i just need to take some time and chill.

maybe i'll take a break from NN here and come back after a rest.

this has been really intense.

thanks, Christie. i always appreciate what you have to say. :-)

laura

[Guest guest]

I hope you haven't gone yet, , cos I wanted to suggest something that

might help you soothe your head. I just read The Yoga of Eating by

Eisenstein and I think you could find it really helpful for untangling all

the conflicting diet advice.

Best of luck, and maybe see you back here sometime, Deb

-----Original Message-----

i don't know. i'm worn down at this point. totally discouraged. i

almost wish i'd never found this list. this is not a result of what

you've said here christie; i was feeling this way before i just read

this post by you. it's been cumulative the last few days. my head

is spinning.

i'm just more confused than ever as to how to eat.

i just need to take some time and chill.

maybe i'll take a break from NN here and come back after a rest.

this has been really intense.

thanks, Christie. i always appreciate what you have to say. :-)

laura